Abu Dhabi Islamic Bank PJSC (ADIB) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

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Thank you, operator. We will begin this call. It is our pleasure and honor to host today Abu Dhabi Islamic Bank to present second quarter financial results. From the company, we have Mohamed Abdelbary, Group CEO; Ahsan Akhtar, Acting Group CFO; and Lamia Hariz, the Head of Corporate -- Communications, Marketing, ESG and Investor Relations. My name is Olga Veselova. I am the Head of EEMEA financials team, and I'm the lead analyst on [ UNA ] banks from Bank of America Equity Research. So I pass the word to Abu Dhabi Islamic team to present the results, and then we'll hold a Q&A session. Thank you.

Thank you, Olga. Good afternoon to everyone on this call, and thank you for joining us. I would like to welcome you all to ADIB's Quarter 2 2026 Financial Results. Before we get started, just a quick reminder that all our financial presentation, financial statements are already disclosed on the website and on ADIB IR app. With me on the call, we have Mr. Mohamed Abdelbary and Mr. Ahsan Akhtar. Today, like every quarter, we will start by the key highlights that Mr. Abdelbary will present, including the guidance for the rest of the year. And this will be followed by a deep dive on the financial performance that Ahsan will take us through. And as always, we will end the session with a Q&A. I'll hand over now to our Group CEO, Mr. Mohamed Abdelbary.

Yes. Okay. Thank you, Lamia, and good morning, good afternoon, everyone, and thank you for joining us on today's call. I hope the overview is good. And if not, please do alert to that. So let us start as usual going through the slides. So ADIB delivered another strong set of results in the first half of 2026. It demonstrates the strength of the franchise, the quality of our earnings and our ability to continue growing across all our key areas of the business. We achieved record profit before tax of AED 4.3 billion, which is up 9% year-on-year, which was supported by strong financing growth, continued customer acquisition and healthy business activity across both our retail and wholesale banking franchise. Importantly, momentum remains strong in the second quarter with profit before tax increasing by 6% compared to the first quarter of the year, reflecting continued growth in customer activity and business volumes. Revenue increased 9% to AED 6.5 billion, supported by both funded and nonfunded income. Funded income increased 14%, while our nonfunded income continued to contribute around 37% of our total income, demonstrating the strength and diversification of our business model. Customer acquisition remains a key strength with more than 125,000 new customers joining ADIB during the first half, supporting continued market share gains and reinforcing the strength of our proposition. We also delivered strong balance sheet growth with customer financing increasing by approximately AED 25 billion year-to-date and customer deposits growing by AED 17 billion, enabling ADIB to surpass for the first time -- AED 300 billion in total assets for the first time. Asset quality continued to improve with the nonperforming asset ratio declining to a record low of 2.2%, while coverage levels strengthened further. Cost of risk remained in line with our risk appetite, reflecting disciplined underwriting and prudent risk management. At the same time, we maintained strong profitability with return on equity of 28.2%, a cost-to-income ratio of 29%, and strong liquidity and capital position that continues to support future growth. If you move to Slide 5. Okay. Now let's talk about our outlook and guidance. The strength of our half 1 performance supports an updated outlook for 2026. So what are we changing basically from the last time? So we -- the decision to upgrade guidance reflects both the strength of our half 1 performance and our confidence and ability of what we've seen, particularly in the second quarter of this year. Financing growth continues to track ahead of our original expectations, reflecting a healthy demand across both wholesale bank and retail bank. And the growth continues to be supported by a healthy pipeline across all our businesses. At the same time, our core fundamentals remain strong. Cost of risk is tracking comfortably, and we're going to talk about it in more detail, especially when it comes to the Q&A session, and our return on equity remains to be robust. So the main change you would see from last time is that we are adjusting our targets for gross financing to land anywhere between 18% to 20% on a year-on-year basis, especially that on the year-to-date basis, we're already at 13% and year-on-year, we were up 26%. So that's one of the major changes we are talking about. The second change is that regarding net profit margins, we are also adjusting the guidance slightly. So we're currently at 3.78%. We are keeping the outlook within that band. So talking about 3.7% to 3.8%. And the reason is, and we'll talk about it, I'm sure, in more details later in the slide, it's predominantly the cost of funding, which is a market-wide phenomenon. It's not any specific -- it's not specific to any specific segment. It's just the fact that the liquidity, which was originated has become more expensive because afterwards we will see that the gross yield on assets have actually held up quite nicely and have exactly performed as expected when we were looking at changes in the future outlook for rates. So it's a matter of cost of funding and our ability to ensure that the bank remains liquid and it's going to come with a bit of a cost, I think, for the next few quarters. Cost of risk has remained unchanged. Cost-to-income ratio also unchanged below 30%. And our return on equity above 25%. We are tracking at 28.2%. I think this number is comfortably also within reach. Yes. So moving to Slide 6, that brings together the core strengths that define ADIB and explains the consistency of our financial performance. First, we have a unique market position. ADIB has a large and loyal customer franchise. We have now approximately 2.7 million customers across the group, and we are the leading -- we are still remaining having the leading position when it comes to UAE national client. Second, our growth is supported by strong fundamentals. Our CET1 and our capital adequacy ratios are still trending way above regulatory requirements and even without looking at the financial package or support package, which has been provided by the Central Bank. Our CASA has remained healthy at 64%. So there is no decline from previous quarters, which is, I think, also a testament to the fact that this is trending very well. Yes. Finally, asset quality remains a key strength, and this is reflected in the quality of the portfolio. And when we look at ADIB today, the invest interest is very clear. Our franchise is well diversified, well defined. And more importantly, it's now being tested in what we call a very unusual situation, and we talk about it more is that actually the business model, it has been designed and is fit for weathering situations like we are seeing in these days. Moving forward to Slide 7. Our strong financial performance is accompanied by continued execution of our Vision 2035 and our 2030 corporate plan. Across customer experience, digital transformation, sustainability, wholesale banking and new growth engines, we continue to make tangible progress against our strategic priorities. And these initiatives are strengthening our franchise, creating new opportunities for growth, and supporting the long-term sustainability of our performance. So, in the midst of all this, our Vision 2035 remains to be our North Star and our well-defined corporate plan is on track and is well within execution. So with that, I will now hand over to Ahsan to take us through the remaining slides.

Thank you, Mohamed, and good morning, good afternoon to everybody on the call. I'll take you through the key financial highlights, first for the first half of the year and then for the second quarter. The financial performance in the first half of 2026 has been very strong across all the key metrics. As we have explained just now, profit before tax increased 9% year-on-year to reach a record AED 4.3 billion. This has been supported by growth in revenues, which were higher by 9% and increase in funded income by 14%. We have continued to maintain strong cost discipline as cost-to-income ratio has now reached 29%, while we have continued to invest in the business. Impairments remained broadly stable, while cost of risk was 33 basis points, in line with our risk appetite. In terms of our balance sheet, we've continued to grow strongly with total assets crossing a new milestone of AED 300 billion, reaching AED 304 billion by the end of June, while customer financing was up 26% and deposits higher than last year at the same time by 15%. Importantly, this growth has been delivered alongside improving asset quality with nonperforming asset ratio now further improving to reach 2.2% while the coverage ratio has now increased to reach 108%. So from a financial perspective, half 1 has demonstrated strong earning quality, disciplined execution and continued balance sheet growth. Let me briefly comment on the second quarter performance. Quarter 2 has seen further improvement in profitability with profit before tax increasing 6% quarter-on-quarter...

Can you hear me? [ Aley Patrou, Berings ]

Yes, we can hear you Aley. Hi.

Quarter 2 has seen further improvement in profitability with profit before tax increasing 6% quarter-on-quarter to reach a record AED 2.2 billion. Revenue has inched up sequentially by 3%, supported by both funded and nonfunded income, while operating expenses have continued to decline by a further 2% compared to quarter 1, driving further improvement in our cost-to-income ratio to reach 28%. The balance sheet has continued to expand during the quarter with financing assets increasing by AED 12 billion, deposits of further AED 6 billion, supporting further growth while maintaining strong funding profile. As we move along towards the income statement, we've delivered the highest quarterly performance in our history in the second quarter. As you can see on the chart from the left-hand side, net income has continued to grow quarter-on-quarter, reflecting sustained business momentum across ADIB. Revenue growth has been broad-based with every business segment, retail, wholesale, private banking, treasury contributing positively during this period. The diversification is very important for ADIB as it's one of our key strengths and the growth we are seeing now is supported by healthy customer activity across retail, wholesale, private banking and transaction-led businesses. Moving on to Slide 12, which is our funded income. We can see here that total funded income increased by 14% year-on-year, one of the highest, to reach AED 4.1 billion. This momentum was driven by a combination of resilient margins, higher business volumes across both financing and deposits, and continued optimization of our cost of funds. Our net profit margin stood at 3.78%, a marginal sequential decline compared to the previous quarter. And this decline, as we mentioned a little while back, this is primarily driven by the higher cost of fund that we are seeing across the franchise and in the UAE amongst different banks. The funded income growth was broad-based. Retail funded income grew 21%, supported by strong customer activity, while wholesale business contributed a further increase of 23%, reflecting selective growth in core client segments across the government and the public sector. In terms of our nonfunded income, this remains an important source of earnings diversification for ADIB. Hence, it is contributing 37% of total revenues in the first half of the year. We've seen a clear acceleration in customer activity during the second quarter, resulting in 6% quarter-on-quarter increase in the nonfunded income. This is an important trend for ADIB as this improvement has been broad-based with strong performance across our fees and commission lines like covered in debit cards, trade finance, foreign exchange, investment income, reflecting higher transaction volumes in the second quarter and deeper customer engagement across the franchise. Overall, our nonfunded income remains on a positive trajectory and continues to demonstrate the benefits of higher customer activity and transaction volumes across the bank. On operating expenses, the bank continues to invest, particularly in talent, technology, digital capabilities and customer experience. We have remained focused on productivity and operating efficiencies to ensure that these investments are self-funded over time. This is reflected in our second quarter performance, where we've seen expenses decline by 2% quarter-on-quarter and our cost-to-income ratio improved further to reach 28% despite investment across the business. Moving on to Slide 15, in terms of our provisions. The key takeaway is that our portfolio quality continues to improve while we maintain a prudent and disciplined approach to provisioning. Our cost of risk, therefore, was 33 basis points, remaining comfortably within our risk appetite. We continue to do -- we continue to perform regular stress testing across the different portfolios within the bank and ensure that we have a disciplined approach to risk recognition and provisioning over the year. During this period, in the last 6 months, we have continued to take prudent provisioning as a result based on portfolio performance and our forward-looking assessments of risks that we face. In terms of our nonperforming portfolio, as you can see on Slide 16, what is particularly encouraging is that the asset quality continues to improve while we have ensured that we have continued to grow the balance sheet. While customer financing assets have increased by 26% year-on-year, our nonperforming assets ratio has further improved to a record low of 2.2%, while total nonperforming assets have decreased by 22% year-on-year as well. From an ECL perspective, we remain comfortable with the overall risk profile of the book. Stage 2 balances broadly remained stable, while Stage 3 exposures have continued to decline, reflecting the continued improvement that we have seen in the underlying portfolio quality. Finally, coverage levels, as you can see on the right-hand side in the graph, have strengthened further. Collaterals -- coverage excluding collaterals have increased to 108%, exceeding the 100% mark for the first time in the history of the bank, while coverage, including collaterals remained particularly strong at 177%. Moving on towards our balance sheet side of the business. Our balance sheet has remained very strong throughout the first half of the year with total assets increasing AED 44 billion year-on-year to exceed the AED 300 billion mark for the first time. Our customer financing assets have been the primary driver of growth within the balance sheet, increasing 27% year-on-year to reach a record high of AED 206 billion. Most importantly, this growth has been supported by continued expansion in our customer deposits as well, which has increased 15% to reach AED 246 billion. The strength of our funding franchise continues to provide the capacity to support the financing growth, while we have maintained a healthy and diversified funding profile in the bank. Moving on towards the financing side of the balance sheet. The customer financing has remained the key engine of our balance sheet growth, increasing by AED 25 billion year-to-date, AED 12 billion in the second quarter alone and 27% year-on-year to reach AED 206 billion. This growth has been, as you can see -- remains broad-based across the portfolio, reflecting healthy demand across both our retail and wholesale banking businesses. Retail continues to be the primary engine of the bank, now representing approximately 40% of our financing portfolio and growing 23% year-on-year to reach AED 104 billion by the end of the quarter. Growth was driven by continued momentum across our core products, particularly home finance, which has increased 37%, alongside growth in personal and auto finance. Our investment portfolio has broadly remained stable at AED 35 billion and continues to be managed conservatively with approximately 85% held at amortized cost. The portfolio remains high quality, well diversified, and primarily invested in Sukuk and other low-risk instruments, supporting liquidity management and balance sheet resilience. In terms of deposits, these have continued to grow strongly during the first half of the year, increasing by AED 17 billion year-to-date and AED 15 billion -- 15% year-on-year to reach AED 246 billion, providing a strong foundation for continued financing growth. More importantly, this growth has been supported by continued expansion in our current and saving deposit balances, which has increased by almost AED 10 billion year-on-year to reach AED 157 billion. CASA remains a key strength of our franchise, representing 64% of our total deposit base, while we continue to support a competitive funding profile. Within retail business, CASA remains exceptionally strong at around 91% of total deposits, reflecting the depth of our customer relationship and the strength of our retail franchise. Overall, deposit franchise continues to be a key differentiator for ADIB, enabling us to fund strong financing growth through stable customer deposits while maintaining healthy liquidity and funding metrics. Lastly, on capital, we continue to maintain robust fundamentals across all capital and liquidity metrics with ratios which are comfortably well above the regulatory requirements, supported by both growth and resilience. We ended the quarter with a common equity Tier 1 at 12.2% and total capital adequacy of 15.6%. Throughout the first half of the year, we have continued focused deployment of capital and continued efficiencies has ensured that our risk-weighted asset growth of 15% year-on-year was almost 60% of the total financing asset growth of 26% year-on-year. While at the same time, total capital balances have increased by 10% year-on-year, benefiting from earnings accretion. In terms of our liquidity ratios, these remain comfortably above our regulatory requirements and particularly strong with advances to stable funding ratio at 90%, financing to deposit ratio at 84% and eligible ELAR ratio at around 15%. With that, we conclude the financial side of the presentation.

We will begin the Q&A now.

[Operator Instructions] Our first question is coming from Shabbir Malik from Morgan Stanley.

I have 2 questions. So in the second quarter, we saw your margin coming down to about 3.67%, 3.70% level. You're going into -- what's your sense of how this NIM is going to look like by the end of this year? And assuming there are no further rate cuts in 2027 -- if there are no rate cuts in 2027, what do you think is the more of a normalized or medium-term NIM outlook for the bank? My second question is around lending to the public sector. This quarter, we saw pretty decent momentum on public sector growth. Can you give us a sense of the typical ROEs that you're earning on this lending? I think you've talked about this before that the capital requirements on these tend to be really low. But just wanted to get a sense of the return on equity on this type of lending. Plus, is there any constraint other than funding in terms of how much you can lend to the GRE sector? So yes, those are the 2 questions mainly.

Thank you, Shabbir. Let me start first with the question on the margin. And I think before answering this question, maybe I'll just spend 2 seconds explaining how we think about margins within ADIB. So one of the key strengths for ADIB has always been the strength of its margins driven by its strong retail value proposition in terms of its CASA. But we are also equally providing wholesale business. The way we measure or we always control the net profit margins in the wholesale banking is you will see that the total assets in wholesale bank are almost equal to total Wakala deposits from corporate bank and wholesale bank as well. They go hand in hand, AED 70 billion, AED 80 billion in financing to wholesale bank, AED 70 billion, AED 80 billion Wakala. And reason that is -- is that they move together variably because they are price sensitive. Rates go up, you charge higher on the asset and you also pay a bit more on deposits. Rates go down, you lose a bit on the asset yield, but also you make actually more of it sometimes on paying less on the deposit. Now having said that, we are in a very unique situation where we had a few rate cuts at the end of last year, which had filtered into our wholesale bank book. And what normally should have happened is that the funding cost on these Wakala should have gone down as well. But what we've seen in the -- clearly since March -- and this is not ADIB specific, this is market specific -- is that there was stubbornness or resilience in terms of pricing down these deposits because we were focusing on ensuring liquidity is available, and we were all competing for the same liquidity pool. So what has happened is that you lost a bit on the asset yield on the wholesale bank, you could not price it down. And that's why you see the margin compression. Now answering your question, we will be looking forward as we go into the end of the year as per the guidance to be anywhere between 3.7% to 3.8%. But there will be an exponential correction, in my view, next year when the market goes back to normality because what will happen, your asset yield will have largely been repriced because that's a function of benchmark, but you will be able to faster now normalize for your funding cost and bring that down. So probably this year, we'll have to live with that, guidance 3.7% to 3.8%, but next year, hopefully, when that all is behind us and the market normalizes, the margins will, in my view, significantly improve and go back to normal levels as it should be for a franchise like ADIB as well. So that was the question on margins. The other question on returns for GREs. They are always very capital accretive because as you rightly said, Shabbir, some of them are actually 0 RWE. I wouldn't even say 20%. So depending on who is the offtaker or who is your counterpart, it can go anywhere between 0% to 20% to 50%. So it's never really a matter of return. Returns are also always very accretive. And the moment you add in some of the escrow accounts, other ancillary business, the relationship return can go anywhere between sometimes 20% to 30% even, because -- and in some cases, even infinite because there's no RWE consumption. But what is important for us that we always price accordingly as well, so we don't go too fast on these assets and accordingly put pressure on gross yields as well for financing. So it's a bit of a balancing act between returns, but also pricing at that front. Does that answer your question, Shabbir, for the 2 questions?

Yes. Just maybe one element of this question was, like, is there any -- so there isn't any capital constraint as such, but is there any other constraint which stops you from growing, let's say, uninhibited in this sector, like liquidity, leverage?

Leverage, no, because our capital is -- has enough room for us in terms of single borrower limits, that's not also a problem. We just -- so far, we haven't had to make a choice to not do a transaction we wanted to do. But if there will be ever a decision point choosing between 2 transactions, it will probably be a liquidity discussion at that point in time, because today, liquidity is a bit scarce and then you will have to think how you would deploy it. It hasn't been the case so far. And I think also when things normalize, hopefully, [indiscernible] answering your question will be probably a liquidity discussion rather than capital liquidity or return discussion.

Our next question is from Naresh Bilandani from Jefferies.

A few quick questions, please. So one was, in the second quarter, we saw the retail -- could you just explain, please, in the second quarter, if the retail origination was actually more driven by expats or locals? And given that retail growth remains driven by home finance, can you please confirm if the new originations are more for completed properties or under construction properties and at what LTV have these originations been done? So question one was mainly on retail driven by expats or locals. And given that this was mainly driven by home finance, how much of this is -- was -- the new origination was to completed or under construction properties and the -- some number on the LTV. So that's the first question. And my second question is, actually, when we're looking at the staging -- categorization of the assets by staging, we see some of the portion of the cash and Central Bank balances actually having been put into Stage 2. Could you please explain what drives the shift of some of these assets into Stage 2, given they are traditionally -- we always see them in Stage 1? That's the second question. And my third and final question is, we have seen a creep-up of your LD ratio clearly over the past 2 quarters. So from a modeling perspective, and if you can give some perspective on how should we see the LD ratio evolve in the coming quarters, that would be super helpful.

Fantastic. Look, I think there's 3 questions, many elements. So if I miss any part, just let me know, And Ahsan, also please come and...

Sorry for that, Mohamed. I'm happy to repeat those if...

No, that's fine. We'll take it one at a time and then let's see if I miss anything. So I think the last question is the LD ratio. That's just a function of the financial package provided, right? So when the conflict started, the Central Bank offered a reduction -- not reduction, but you could dip into your reserve requirement up to a certain percentage of -- I think it was 30% of what you have placed usually, and then there was a cliff. So ADIB never used the cliff facility, and hopefully, we never have to do that. I think we are fine on that. But it was -- from day 1, we said also in the last call is that we utilized the reserve requirements to help us or to support some of the liquidity growth we had. So what happened is that, immediately some of the Central Bank liquidity, which was part as reserve requirement profit free immediately was reduced and redeployed into assets. And that's why you see that the client deposits did not need to grow as fast as financing growth because you had that excess liquidity to help you growing your business. And hence, you have seen that reduction in LD ratio. Now the financial package, the last revision, which came out is that there's a gradual pullback of that reserve requirement element. I think the first one is coming next week where 50% will have to be now redeployed again and the other 50% in September. So you will start actually seeing, as we approach year-end, the usual LD ratio of ADIB, which is sub-80%. But today, it's more than 80% because we just had that excess liquidity available to us, and we did not need to raise customer deposits to support some of the financing growth. So that was on the LD ratio. What was your first question? Just tell me the hint and I will ...

Yes, this was the reason for having cash and Central Bank balances into Stage 2. That was one. And the other was --

Yes.

-- on the expat versus local and the quality of origination.

Okay. I talked about the home finance piece, and then I'll let Ahsan talk about the staging for the reserve requirement as well. So I think it's a tale of two -- a story of two things as I said, right? So when the conflict started, clearly, March, April, asset origination in retail almost halfed, right? So it was a very -- as expected, the momentum was not there, and it came down. I can tell you that, in June itself, we had -- I wouldn't say we are pre-conflict in terms of asset sales. Actually, we recorded the highest ever sales in ADIB's history, again, in terms of selling retail products to our clients. So it just shows you how quickly the ADIB business model bounces back because of the type of clients we have. And this will answer also your question of how is the mix between UAE and expats. The mix has not changed. If I take the entire portfolio together, home finance, personal finance, auto finance and everything together, it's still the 80-20 split, right, where -- now it's probably 70 -- yes, 78-22 split between UAE National and expat. And that's also reflected in the outstanding portfolio when it split between UAE and expat. In terms of home finance itself origination, it's a slightly more a balanced mix, I would say, probably 50-50, where it's UAE and expats are 50-50. In terms of -- is it off-plan already it's still very much so ready property. We are offering facilities for off-plan financing. I think the reason why it has not really shown a huge impact on the portfolio is it has to do with the timeline of deliveries, because I think most of the properties, which are at the stage of off-plan just about to deliver will come probably in the next quarter and as we approach year-end, and that's where we'll see more and more of that coming. Ahsan, would you talk about the staging question?

Yes. So, Naresh, the balance that you see within Stage 2 for cash and balances in the central banks are primarily related to our franchise in Iraq. So the classification of -- within stages is really based on the risk rating of the country. And then because of certain rating in Iraq, these are classified right now as part of our Stage 2. So these are typically Central Bank balances, deposit balances that we hold with the Central Bank of Iraq.

Our next question is from Jon Peace from UBS.

So first question, please, would be on the provisions. It looks like the others category was quite a big piece of the provision charge this quarter. Just wondered if you could give us, please, a bit more color on that. And then the second question is on the cost-income ratio. It looks like you're tracking to come in well ahead of your guidance. I just wondered if you could even be below 29% this year or if there's some expenses in the second half of the year that we should anticipate?

Sure. Thank you. So in terms of Q2 -- let's answer also the provision question slightly more broadly. So what we've done in Q2, and if I just go back in Q1, what we said, ADIB has not taken overlays because we stress tested each and every portfolio and took what we needed to do. In Q2, we have done -- we have taken a slightly, I would say, an enhanced approach in terms of now building what's done in Q1. So all what you see there is actually overlay additional provisions we have taken, right? And the reason why the cost of risk overall has not really accordingly grown is that we also had a major recovery in quarter 2 as well, which has helped us not only in reduction of provision, which I would say was almost all of it offset in the overlays and additional provisions taken, but also it had impact on reduction in our nonperforming assets by almost AED 800 million to AED 900 million, bringing down the ratio to 2.2%, and you see it in the lower left graph. And also it had some impact -- positive impact on the capital as well because there was an element of it as a provision or impairment reserve booked in equity. So this one huge legacy resolution of a very big, I think, outstanding item we had in our nonperforming assets, all closed and recovered in-house. So it's not a sole asset, but we actually resolved it. And we got a nice credit back, whether it's on P&L or NPA. On the P&L side, we offset it all with our overlays and additional provisions. So answering your question, this other is all overlays and additional provisions we have taken in quarter 2 of this year. In terms of cost-to-income ratio, we're still tracking just about 29%. We are still targeting for the full year to be sub-30%. I wouldn't want to pressure point that too much at this stage because ADIB's philosophy has always been -- and when you go even 4, 5 years back into our investor call, we always said the same thing, we invest through the cycles. We don't take reactive measures. We have a clear path. We have a few strategic projects we want to invest in. We will not defer from them. And if top line softens a bit due to circumstances not under our control and nothing to do with our business model, we still go ahead and we're going to invest. So that's why maybe for the first time you see us having negative jaws, so our costs are growing faster than revenues. We are perfectly okay with that at this stage because we know revenues will pick up again. But if you put the brake on some of these strategic investments to restart the entire process, you've already lost the game. So we will continue for that. We will still be sub-30%. Will it be significantly below 30%, I don't know, and I think we will still be okay with that because that's going to be our landing point.