Accsys Technologies PLC (AXS) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Good day, and thank you for standing by. Welcome to the Accsys Technologies PLC preliminary results for the year ended 31st of March 2023 webcast. [Operator Instructions] I would now like to hand the conference over to your speaker today, Stephen Odell, Executive Chair of Accsys Technologies PLC. Please go ahead.

Good morning, everyone, and welcome to our preliminary results presentation for the year ended 31st of March 2023. This is our usual disclaimer, which I'll let you read in your own time. Next slide, please, operator. In terms of this morning's agenda, I will begin with an overview of the results, then Stephen Salo will take you through the financial detail. I'll then go through the business review, highlighting progress on our growth and expansion strategy, the recent challenges we've overcome and the outlook for our business. Next slide, please. Overall, I'm pleased with our performance in FY '23. Demand for Accoya and Tricoya brands has been strong throughout the year as customers have continued to seek out our outstanding products. The strength of the Accoya brand has allowed us to offset macroeconomic inflationary pressures, such as high energy and chemical costs through price increases. As a result, revenue increased by 34% to EUR 162 million. The completion and start-up of Reactor 4 in Arnhem combined with the Reactors 1 to 3, returning to production after the plant shutdown in April and May 22, has led to a 6% growth in volumes and record volume production in quarter 4. I'm delighted to report that EBITDA rose by 120% to EUR 22.9 million. Turning now to our operating highlights. The completion of Reactor 4 in Ireland adds 33% additional capacity to the plant and has enabled us to sell more products than ever before. Since breaking ground at our Accoya USA plant in Kingsport, Tennessee in April 22, we've made good progress with construction, successfully completing a number of key milestones. However, as previously announced in May this year, the project has experienced some delays and cost inflation, which is being felt throughout the industry globally. The plant, which will service the substantial latent demand in the North American market is expected to commence commercial operations mid-2024. And of course, we're providing a significant update on our whole project today. The Board has been reviewing the plant over the last 6 months and believes in the underlying attractive economics and margins of completing its construction. We will, therefore, continue to explore funding options to support the plants construction. More details of that later. And I will now hand over to Stephen Salo to go through the numbers.

Thank you, Stephen, and good morning, everyone. I'll now take you through the financial results, starting with the financial highlights. Revenue growth for the year was strong, up 34% to EUR 162 million. This was achieved despite a 19% reduction in sales in H1 caused by production constraints in Ireland during the construction of Reactor 4. The strong growth in the full year revenue reflects high product demand, higher average sales prices and the implementation of an energy price premium to mitigate higher gas prices. Despite the gas price and other inflationary cost pressures, our key manufacturing profit metrics were strong. Gross margins were 4% higher than last year at 34% and in excess of our long-term target for gross margin of 30%. This enabled gross profit to increase by just over EUR 19 million to EUR 55.2 million, with price increases more than offsetting rising raw material costs. The results in underlying EBITDA of EUR 22.9 million represents growth of 110% ahead of our previous guidance of nearly doubling last year's EBITDA. We have recorded an exceptional noncash impairment charge of EUR 86 million in respect to the Tricoya assets. This takes account of the previously reported CapEx to complete construction of EUR 35 million, a higher pretax weighted average cost of capital, principally due to higher interest rates and a decrease in the production volume forecast for the plant from 30,000 megatons to 24,000 megatons. Stephen will cover the latest on the Tricoya project in detail later on. Net debt increased by EUR 16.9 million in the year to just over EUR 44 million. This is due to the planned investment of EUR 29 million in Accoya USA and CapEx investments of EUR 30 million in respect of Arnhem and Hull. The spend was partially offset by the EUR 19 million capital raise in May 2022, the reduction in the NatWest loan of EUR 9.4 million as part of the Tricoya consortium restructuring and from EBITDA generation during the year. Next slide, please. Looking now at our sales mix. During the period, we have continued to balance our customer demands with our capacity constraints, while successfully targeting key growth markets. We continued to see strong underlying demand for Accoya across all our regions and with our Tricoya panel manufacturers. Our proportion of sales into North America increased where we are targeting the market ahead of our planned U.S. capacity expansion in what remains the largest market for our products globally. 24% of our total sales volumes come from Tricoya, and this proportion increased during the year by 2%, clearly an important product for us. Looking now at how Accoya and Tricoya have performed during the year. Accoya's revenue and sales volume rose by 37% and 6%, respectively. The increase was driven by product demand, higher average sales prices and the implementation of the energy price premium. At the interims in November, we guided the market to expect a 50% uplift in sales volumes in H2, and I'm delighted to report that we beat this with a 64% sales volume increase H2 on H1. While sales volumes into the U.K. and Ireland and Europe were slightly down year-on-year, we delivered double-digit growth in our key American and Rest of World markets. I'd also like to draw your attention to the final figure in the chart, the 18% sales growth of Tricoya to our customers. The strength of this performance and the continued market demand for the product underpins our belief in the long-term market potential for Tricoya, which brings me to a few more comments on Tricoya. Next slide, please. Again, you can see the revenue and sales volume performance of Tricoya on the chart on the left, but I think one more number warrants attention and that is the 24% of total group volumes that Tricoya represents. This clearly reinforces the strategic importance of the Tricoya market to Accsys. As mentioned on the previous slide, market demand for Tricoya remains strong, and the applications of our Tricoya product continue to be many and varied. Turning now to EBITDA progression. You will see that we have carefully managed our profitability at a time of increasing raw material costs. Average Accoya prices increased significantly, offsetting higher raw material prices and ensuring that we achieved in excess of our long-term target of 30% gross margin. Included within the EUR 30.7 million sales price increase, EUR 23.3 million is purely attributable to Accoya price increases implemented in both FY '22 and FY '23. EUR 3.5 million is due to the benefit of stronger U.S. dollar, noting that we sell Accoya in euros to most of our customers, but our North American pricing is in U.S. dollars. And EUR 3.9 million is from the energy price premium, which we implemented in May 2022. This is a mechanism whereby we invoiced our customers an additional amount if gas prices increased above certain thresholds and enabled us to mitigate the effects of volatile acetyl pricing. With the stabilization of gas prices during the second half of the year, we are no longer adding this surcharge. EUR 3.1 million came from higher volume production. Raw materials increased driven by higher acetic anhydride costs and Rhodia costs. Other manufacturing costs also increased due to the higher inventory levels and higher utility costs, most of which is due to higher energy pricing. The core operating costs and other group operating costs both increased more moderately with main increases due to higher staff and insurance costs. The Accoya USA JV share of loss also increased, reflecting an increase in project activity levels. Most of the costs incurred have been capitalized within the JV with a total of EUR 31.2 million invested to date. The costs associated with the JV will increase in FY '24 as we gear up towards mechanical completion and the operation of the plant. Next slide, please. This brings me to summarize the 5-year profit and revenue performance of Accsys. You will see that Accsys has been on a journey, a successful journey and one worth reflecting on. Whilst the jump in revenue in FY '22 to FY '23 is impressive, it is important to view this in light of the overall strong progression that's been made over the last 5 years. We have managed to grow revenue on a compound basis by 21% and underlying EBITDA by 125%. We plan to continue building on this growth and positive momentum. Turning now to our debt position. Opening net debt of EUR 27.2 million increased by EUR 16.9 million during the year, ending with a closing net debt position of EUR 44 million at 31 March 2023. There are a number of moving parts to highlight. The Accoya business generated EBITDA of EUR 38.5 million. Following the Tricoya construction being put on hold following the November restructuring, it generated an operating loss of EUR 5.1 million. Working capital increased during the year, driven by higher inventory levels and higher receivables following the increase in production levels related to Reactor 4 coming online. The group spent EUR 29.8 million of CapEx during the year including EUR 7.9 million into the Ana expansion project, plus EUR 20.1 million of the construction of the whole plant prior to being put on hold. Our investment in Accoya USA during the year was EUR 29 million. This cash represented Accsys' 60% investment and was made alongside Eastman's 40% investment. Finally, Accsys completed an equity raise by way of replacing in May 2022, raising net proceeds of EUR 19 million, which have helped strengthen the balance sheet, increase liquidity headwind and fund additional costs for Reactor 4 in Ireland. Moving on to the next slide and to explain our financial position in more detail. I have covered net debt investment and our investment into Accoya USA, so I will not repeat those comments here. To note, tangible assets of EUR 110 million decreased by EUR 71 million due to the Tricoya impairment of EUR 86 million, partially offset by additional CapEx spend during the year. Net working capital increased by EUR 14.7 million, driven by higher inventory levels, EUR 9.6 million, receivables, which increased by EUR 1.2 million and a decrease in payables of EUR 4 million. In relation to the reduction in payables, EUR 8.7 million of the opening balance was mainly connected to a CapEx spend on hold prior to the project being put on hold and unwound during the year. I would also like to draw your attention to the DRI or value recoverability instrument, which represents liability of EUR 1.4 million. This instrument was issued to NatWest as part of the Tricoya debt restructuring, which I will cover in more detail shortly. At 31 March 2023, we held cash balances of EUR 26.6 million, a EUR 15.5 million decrease on the prior year. This is attributable to construction costs relating to Ann and Hull and the investment into Accoya USA and the increase in inventory referred to above. This was partially offset by the capital raise in May 2022, EUR 10 million proceeds from loans and cash flow generated from our operating activities. More importantly, when adjusting for the cash pledged for the letter of credit provided at First Horizon Bank of approximately EUR 10 million. And in the prior year, the adjustment for cash earmarked to be invested in Accoya USA, adjusted cash increased by EUR 12.5 million during the year to EUR 16.8 million. Next slide, please. In November 2022, we agreed with our partners, INEOS, MEDITE, PGF and Volantis to acquire 100% ownership of the plant, the whole plant and the Tricoya group entities, Tricoya Technologies Limited and Tricoya U.K. Limited in exchange for 11.9 million new shares in access, representing 5.74% of our total share capital valued at EUR 9.5 million. At the same time, we restructured the debt arrangements between Tricoya U.K. and NatWest which resulted in a EUR 9.4 million reduction in the principal debt to EUR 6 million and restructured into a new 7-year term loan with no capital repayments during this period. In addition, we issued the VRI instrument to NatWest as part of this restructure. The construction of plant was then put on hold. It is clear that the market for Tricoya has attractive underlying fundamentals, which Steve Odell will discuss in more detail very shortly. However, this restructuring was executed to provide access with a wider range of options in respect of serving this market and in relation to completing the plant in a time frame, more of our making. The reorganization of the Tricoya consortium will also provide access with improved licensing opportunities. I will now hand back to Stephen for the business review and outlook.

Thank you, Stephen. Many of we follow our business closely, so I'll run through the next few slides pretty quickly as a recap of what we do, our products, our market and our strategy. Our proposition is this, we have innovative technology and world-leading products, which are positioned within the global wood products market, which is currently estimated to be worth some $748 billion in 2023 and with a compound annual growth rate of 7.4%. For Accsys, we transformed fast-growing, certified sustainable wood into a building material with characteristics that performed strongly against man-made, resource depleting and carbon-polluting alternatives. As our products compete with and indeed displace other building materials, including concrete and plastics, the market opportunity is even greater. We have bold but realistic growth ambitions, and our strategy is predicated on 4 key pillars of growth. The first is to develop market opportunities to drive revenue growth. The second is to grow our global manufacturing production capacity and do things faster, better and more safely. Thirdly, we will continue to develop our process-related technologies and products to protect and grow our leading market position. And fourth, we will continue to develop our people and organizational capability to enable us to meet our growth objectives. Next slide, please. Many of you will be familiar with this slide and our products, so I'll skip over it. We'll upload the presentation to our website after this call, if you wish to review it in more detail. Next slide. This year has been one of major significance for the company as we completed the expansion of our plant in Ireland through the addition of Reactor 4, which began operations in September 2022. Reactor 4 adds an additional 20,000 cubic meters of capacity, taking Arnhem's maximum annual capacity to 80,000 cubic meters. As reported back in November, we did have some unexpected delays in the final installation and supply of equipment for Reactor 4 and also experienced some defects to machinery, which resulted in an unplanned second shutdown across the plant in April and May 22. Since startup, however, the reactor has been working well. Further work on enhancing productivity to reduce cycle times and deliver more capacity is planned for the coming year. We're also investing in new stacking technology to drive efficiency improvements across the plant. A couple of words now about our cooler operations in Barry, Wales. The plant has increased our ability to convert a coil wood into the cooler. The product which combines the benefits of a pro wood with color all the way through the wood from surface to court. A lot smaller site in Ireland, the plant has a maximum capacity of 12,500 cubic meters a year. Operational improvements to the site last year resulted in an increase of production of 140% to just over 4,000 cubic meters. And while this is a good result, we would expect a further increase in production in the coming year. And Accoya Color unique proposition is proving to be very attractive to customers in our target markets, particularly in the decking category, where the surface to core grade color requires less maintenance to maintain over the long term. In addition to our existing markets of Germany, Switzerland, Austria and the U.S., Accoya Color was launched this year in Australia, New Zealand and France. It's also worth pointing out to you that Accoya Color generates a higher gross profit per cubic meter than Accoya, and so will enhance our product margins over time. Turning now to the U.S. and our joint venture with Eastman. As we have said many times before, North America is the largest potential market for our products. Together with world-leading chemicals giant Eastman, we are building an Accoya plant in Kingsport, Tennessee. The new plant, which will replicate the proven technology of our successful plant in Arnhem has an initial capacity of approximately 43,000 cubic meters. Under the terms of the JV, Accsys holds 60% interest and Eastman 40% in the project. Progress with construction of the plant, which commenced in April 2022 has been good and a number of key milestones are now complete. However, as announced in our May trading statement, the project has experienced some delays in cost inflation, which I will add on being experienced throughout the construction industry at the moment. So we're not alone in this. We, therefore, expect to commence operations in mid-2024. Both we and Eastman remain fully committed to the project and its successful completion. As you will have seen highlighted in our results statement this morning, costs will increase at the site in the coming year. Now this partly reflects the inflation increases I referred to just now, it's mostly because as we near completion, we need to increase our investment in people and infrastructure in preparation for startup. And finally, before I move to the next slide, a comment about health and safety at the site, which is, of course, of paramount importance to us as a group. By the 2023 year-end, the plant celebrated over 150,000 hours worked with only one minor first aid injury, which I think is a fantastic achievement. Moving on now to the world's first Tricoya plant in Hull and the Board's review of the project, which has been on hold since November last year. Before I go into the detail, let me start by saying the key finding of the Board's review. We continue to believe in the underlying attractive economics and margins associated with completing the construction of Hull and we will, therefore, continue to explore funding options to support the plant's construction, including strategic partners and lending institutions. Looking at the cost to finish the construction and complete commissioning, our regional assessment was that we would require up to EUR 35 million for this, and we can confirm that this is still the case. Accoya production for MEDITE has continued over the period, and our offtake partners, MEDITE and FINSA, who convert Accoya into Tricoya and help seed the market remain committed and supportive partners and demand for the product remains strong. Ongoing discussions with both partners about future arrangements following completion of the plant remained positive. We've also been in discussions with certain strategic partners with a view to providing appropriate funding necessary to complete the plant's construction. To date, the company has been unable to reach acceptable terms with any of these strategic partners. Looking forward, should we be unable to secure third-party funding, we will use modest levels of internally generated cash to maintain the plant and progress some preconstruction works. Despite our continued confidence in the future for Tricoya, the Board is clear, however, that the core Accsys business must not be compromised to find a solution for Hull. In the meantime, we will continue to work with our partners to develop the Tricoya market using Accoya, including exploring the expansion of dedicated capacity for greater volume production within our existing facilities. Next slide, please. To the left of the slide is a summary of our performance. And despite some disappointing setbacks, it has nevertheless been a year of considerable progress as I hope we have communicated to you today. Looking forward to FY '24, we expect to leverage the benefits from greater economies of scale associated with higher production volumes at our plants. This year will also be one of transition during which we will implement actions to ensure the business is sustainable growth and to drive value creation for our shareholders. These actions include moving towards completion of the Kingsport plant, which will incur higher cost this year, as I have already outlined and also further investment in the Accoya business to support higher volume production. In view of our increased capacity from the expansion of Arnhem and future capacity from Kingsport and in light of the softening of price and demand in the global construction industry, we're dedicating more resources to our sales and marketing activity globally and particularly in the U.S. to create more demand as supply becomes available. We've made a good start to FY '24 with performance in line with our expectations. With our new executive management team in place to drive the business forward in its next phase of growth, we are confident in delivering further financial and operational progress in the coming year and in the longer-term demand and growth opportunity for Accoya and Tricoya. Thank you for listening. We will now hand back to the operator who will moderate today's question-and-answer session and which will be hosted by our CFO, Stephen Salo. Over to you, Operator.

[Operator Instructions] Our first question comes from the line of Martijn den Drijver from AMRO.

My first question is with regards to TricoyaU.K. When you've had 6 months of discussions, you see long-term potential, attractive margins or even financing preconstruction. So can you shed a bit of light on what is the key hurdle? Is that valuation? Is that shareholder agreement details? Is it that your strategic partners still see some uncertain economics that would be part 1. And part B would be, as I said, you've had 6 months. What time are you going to take to complete this process? Is it going to be another 3 months? Is it going to be another 6 months? Just a bit of light on the timing of this process. That's question one, please.

Thanks very much for the question, Martijn. I think it's fair to say we have been talking with strategic partners around funding options. I think it's fair to say we need to get -- we need to reach an agreement that would work for both parties, including our shareholders. So we haven't been able to reach an agreement with any strategic partner that we been speaking to date. In terms of -- your question was what is the biggest hurdle that we see right now and the biggest hurdle that we see right now is putting in place the appropriate financing to fund the completion of the construction. So we will continue to explore options in respect of that. And in terms of your second question, what sort of time frame that we put on this, we will continue to assess it, but the group continues to generate excess or excess cash -- generate cash flow and internally generated cash flow maybe in time, deployed to complete the construction of all.

Did I understand you correctly that you -- okay. So even if developments move your way, you might even decide to finance it and fund it completely. That's what you said last?

So effectively, all options are on the table. And yes, we will consider the use of internally generated cash flows from the construction in time.

Okay. And just going back, obviously, funding was the key elements that needs to be resolved. But in your discussions with the strategic partners, what is the key hurdle? Is that the valuation of the plants? Is it that you're still in discussions, not so much on the valuation, but what happens if things turn out a little bit different from the planned scenario? Are these strategic partners understanding of your belief that there is an interesting economic proposal. Just to get not so much funding is, of course, the key here, but what are these strategic partners saying to you why you couldn't reach an agreement?

Martijn, I think you probably appreciate that we wouldn't disclose discussions that we're having with third parties, the details and all.

Then I'll move on to my second question. Could you provide a bit of guidance. Obviously, no sales or EBITDA numbers, but perhaps something on production or whether that 34% gross margin is sustainable? Could you provide a bit of color on 2024, bit of guidance there?

As a policy, we don't provide guidance. However, I think what I would draw your attention to is we have indicated record production in H2 of FY '23. And as stated in the Chairman's statement, we've had a good start to FY '24. In terms of our long-term gross margin target is 30%, and we will do what we can to maintain and to beat that target.

Okay. So it does it make any sense to ask your question about the incremental OpEx, the staff additions, the marketing investments, anything you could help us with to understand what the impact might be of those elements in terms of OpEx.

In terms of -- sorry, what was the question, Martijn, do you mind repeating it, please?

Yes, in your press release, you've outlined that you've been adding staff, group operations and engineering director, a center of engineering projects. Obviously, there's a tailwind effect of that in 2024. You've announced a marketing program in the U.K. You will invest more in marketing in the U.S. So is there something you can help us with regards to OpEx, incremental OpEx in 2024?

So at the moment, we're not providing guidance at that level of detail at this stage.

Okay. And hopefully, one that you can answer. Accoya Color, to what kind of capacity is the plants after these modifications? Where can you go in terms of production capacity?

I think, if you like, we're looking at in FY '24 targeting a few thousand meters cubes to go through that plant less than double digits.

Okay. And then my final one, the cost overruns Accoya USA. Is there anything you could help us with in terms of ballpark, in range perhaps so we can get a better understanding of what the cost of run means?

Yes, I've got nothing more to add beyond what we've stated in our RNS.

We'll now move on to our next question. Our next question comes from the line of Christen Hjorth from Numis.

3 questions from me, if that's okay. So the first one, just following on, on the question on Hull and the ability to use potentially internal resources in time. I imagine that's not necessarily the first choice as we stand here today. But if that is the route that has to be taken, how should we think about that in terms of timing and capacity to increase leverage, et cetera. The second one is just on the U.S. Accoya plant. A modest delay and as you say, not driven by project specific dynamics of a general theme across the U.S. But how does the Board consider the risk of future delays from here? And are there any particular pinch points or milestones, which we should be aware of? And then finally, I know H2 was very strong at Arnhem in terms of production. But you wouldn't even need to generate the same level of production volume in FY '24 to be at full capacity utilization. So what is the reason that Arnhem can't or is there a reason that Arnhem can't run at full capacity utilization in FY '24 rather than sort of ramping up over the 2 years that you've guided?

Right. Let me just try and address those questions. So in terms of timing of funding half from our internal cash flow, that would not be a short-term measure. I think it's flagged, that's a medium to long-term measure in the Chairman's commentary on Hull. And in terms of leverage, I mean, I think we'll need to assess how the group develops over the next 12, 24 months and any bank's appetite to increase or potentially project finance that asset. But we are very much looking at all options at this stage, and we will continue to reassess utilizing internally generated cash flow over the period. In terms of the U.S., the milestones to completion, there aren't really pinch points. We continue to work with Eastman and our contractor on the site in Kingsport to complete the project. We're working very, very closely with a very experienced project team and continue to push that forward toward completion. With respect to Arnhem and the -- let's call it, operating at capacity. I think there's a certain point to mention just in terms of extrapolating H2 production over an entire year. We go through a period of regular maintenance or a maintenance stop in respect to Arnhem, and that occurred this year in H1 rather than -- and did not occur in H2. So if you like, you had 6 months of relatively uninterrupted production in H2, whereas in H1 this year, we will have conducted our maintenance stop. So that would impact an extrapolation or pure extrapolation of H2 production. That answers your questions.

We'll now move on to our next question. Our next question comes from the line of Johan van den Hooven from Edison Group.

A few questions left. If you look at the Arnhem plant and indeed, our 4 you mentioned before, ramp-up of 2 years, that is September next year, what are the plans if there are plans for Reactor 5 or more. And the second question is about the new stacking technology. I thought you had built a completely new stacker when are 4 of us going to be ready. Can you explain a bit more what it means the new stacking technology? Are you not satisfied, content with the current stacker?

Is that just 2 questions, Johan?

Yes.

So in terms of a fifth reactor, I think it's fair to say that the management team are focused on, firstly, delivering Kingsport. And at this stage, a fifth reactor is not currently being planned for, although we'll continue to assess that. I think it's worth mentioning the Kingsport facility in the U.S. whilst it commences with 2 reactors, it has the ability to add on additional reactors much more easily than perhaps the adding a fifth reactor to Arnhem. So that's just something to bear in mind. In respect of the stacker technology, so there was a stacker. A new stacker was brought in to let's say, cope with the additional capacity that was coming online with the fourth reactor starting up in Arnhem, and that's the reason why we've moved to a fourth -- a new stacker of technology in Arnhem.

If I understand correctly, that came hand in hand with the new stacker, I guess. So what's happening now that you're looking into new technology?

Sorry, I think the point was made around the stacker was installed in line with R4, and we are looking at improvements to the stacker technology or sorry, let's call it, the new stacker that we have in Arnhem.

Okay. So I think Mexico capacity was 100,000 cubic meters, I think, the stacker, which might not be there yet, of course. And that's what you mean we have to improve.

Correct. There are some more efficiencies that we want to add to the stacker so it runs more smoothly in line with our reactors and our production schedules.

Okay. Last question for now. Martijn already tried about the cost of risk in the U.S. If you don't want to give -- disclose any costs. But going forward, is there more risk, so to speak, to more cost overage or is it agreed now that's to a certain amount, and that's it until it's realized?

So look, I think the point to age is that any major complex projects involves change orders and, let's call it, scale improvements. And that's what we're doing with the contractor, together with Eastman in respect to the development of the plant in Kingsport. So we're still expecting to complete the project in mid-2024. There is time frame in there that we may decide to change some of the scope or make some changes to the delivery of the plant, and that would obviously come in as additional cost, but we won't do so unless we see a benefit.

We'll now move on to our next question. Our next question comes from the line of Ben Bourne from Investec.

Just a couple of questions. I'm intrigued by Tricoya now at 24%. Can you just expand on the use cases so far to give us a flavor for the longer term? And then the second question relates to Accoya U.S. sales expansion. Which regions are you most excited about and why, please?

So do you mind repeating that question -- those questions for me, please, Ben?

Sure,. The first one is, can you expand on the Tricoya use cases so far, just to give us a flavor for the longer term? And the second question is relating to Accoya U.S. sales expansion, which regions are you most excited by and why?

In terms of the Accoya and the Tricoya panel applications, I mean, effectively, we sell our Tricoya to -- sorry, we sell our Accoya, which is chips and used as Tricoya to our 2 partners, FINSA and MEDITE and they use those chips into manufacturing Tricoya panels, which are a much more sustainable, durable and reliable MDF panel or alternative to MDF panels. So wherever you see the use of MDF panels, you can extrapolate the use of a Tricoya panel, which will involve a much stronger, durable, more sustainable product. With respect to the U.S., I mean, I think also in terms of North America, I mean we see the U.S. as a market where we can expand our presence and our distribution. You'll be aware that across Europe, we primarily use distributors to sell our Accoya product. And those distributors are in the states are represented across wider areas than simply individual states. So there is a real opportunity for us to expand our distribution networks in the U.S. and therefore, penetrate the U.S. market and on the North American market much more widely than we currently do. There are no further questions at this time. So I'll hand the call back to you for closing remarks.

There are no further questions at this time. So I'll hand the call back to you for closing remarks.

Thank you very much for everyone for joining this webcast. I appreciate the questions, and we shall see you at the interims. Thank you.

This concludes today's conference call. Thank you for participating. You may now disconnect. Speakers, please stand by.