Ajmera Realty & Infra India Limited (513349) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Ladies and gentlemen, good day, and welcome to the Ajmera Realty and Infra India Limited Q2 and H1 FY '25 Earnings Conference Call. [Operator Instructions] Please note that this conference is being recorded. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Dhaval Ajmera, Director; and Mr. Nitin Bavisa, CFO from Ajmera Realty and Infra India Limited. Thank you, and over to you, sir.

Thank you. Good evening, everyone, and a warm welcome to you all. On behalf of the company, I would like to thank you all for participating in Ajmera Realty and Infra India Limited earnings call for the second quarter FY '25. The call will commence with opening remarks by our Director, Mr. Dhaval Ajmera and will be followed by the business performance briefing by myself. We have already shared the operational updates for the quarter in the second week of October 2024. The investor presentation and the press release based on the financial results are opted by the Board have been uploaded on the stock exchange website and can be downloaded from our company website. Please do note that some of the statements in today's discussion may be forward-looking in nature, reflecting the company's outlook and may involve certain risks and uncertainties that the company may face. I would now like to hand over the call to our Director, Mr. Dhaval Ajmera. Thank you, and over to you, sir.

Hello. Good evening, everyone, and thank you for joining us today. I will begin my discussion with sharing the macroeconomics of the sector updates and thereby taking a little bit of highlights on our company as well. As we all know that the real estate market is looking very buoyant and especially the residential sector, which we all operate in a larger way continues to grow with a stronger buyer sentiment, increased demand of living spaces like larger living spaces, and supportive policies by government. Major cities like Mumbai have recorded higher sales volume and significant year-on-year growth, reflecting a healthy market dynamics. A reduction in unsold inventory suggest a balanced supply/demand scenario with the stable interest rates have made for home loan even more accessible. These are some positive developments in the real estate sector, and that is why established players like us has favorably been able to capitalize on the momentum of the market and thereby making us better growth in the company. Furthermore, technological advancements are reshaping the industry with a lot of developers, including us, are adopting to digital tools for sales and customer engagement and even for construction and customer relation management, et cetera. With these encouraging trends, we are positioned to leverage the opportunities ahead and continue delivering value to our stakeholders. On the back of these great macroeconomic conditions, I'm delighted to inform you that we've achieved INR 560 crores of sales during the half year of FY '25 driven by a few of our projects, which are such as Ajmera Manhattan, Ajmera Prive, along with the recently launched project in last quarter Ajmera [indiscernible]. We remain committed to achieving our operated guidance for the year. FY '25 is expected to be a significant leap of growth in our journey with all our projects performing well and generating robust collections, our flagship project Ajmera Manhattan with compact luxury apartments have seen 85% of its inventory sold out. As a result, the next phase is expected to be launched soon. The project is significant progress with Tower we completed up to ninth level and Tower A up to eighth level. We've also launched the next phase of Ajmera Greenfinity and have sold 59% of its inventory. Regarding construction status, Towers A and B have completed up to second level. On our other projects as well as Eden in Ghatkopar has seen about 69% of its inventory being sold with the 14 floors flat completed, which is almost the last lap of the building. For Ajmera Prive, which is our project in Juhu, the structure and the framework and with plaster has been completed and 69% of its inventory is also being sold, contributing significantly to our sales value, and we are hoping to give possession of this project very soon. We are submitted to handing over all these projects in a couple of quarters and advancing towards a faster completion. Furthermore, our newly launched project, Ajmera [indiscernible] at Bhandup, which saw a great successful launch in the last quarter. And until now, I'm very happy to say that we have sold 49% of the inventory, which was opened up. It is current under the exploration stage with filing work ongoing. These developments have collectively supported our sales performance. Moving to Bangalore projects. Our affordable residential projects like Lugaano and Florenza, has sold about 90% of their inventory and under -- and under fast track execution. We remain committed to delivering all our projects well ahead of the coveted Ajmera time line. Looking ahead, we are more than confident that in achieving our strategic vision of [indiscernible]. We are exciting we're ahead with the potential launches of what 17 lakh square feet with a gross development of INR 4,200 - plus crores. To conclude, it's worth to bring to your notice, and we are very happy to say that we have successfully done a preferential allotment of equity shares amounting to INR 225 crores to some market strategic investors and plan to utilize these proceeds, which have been committed for debt reduction and for our growth purposes in the business. On this note, I would like to thank you all for being part of this journey, wishing you all a very, very happy festivities, which are coming ahead. And we hope this new year and Diwali brings a lot of success to not only us but to all of us who have been part of this journey, and we wish you all a very happy Diwali and a happy new year. I will request our CFO, Mr. Nitin Bavisi, to take you through the performance highlights of our company. Thank you.

Thank you, sir. Before we move on to Q&A session, allow me to summarize the compelling operational and financial performance what we have delivered for quarter 2 and first half of FY '25. Starting with operational performance for the quarter, our sales value stood at INR 254 crores and sales area stood at 114,000 plus square feet. Our collection grew by 20% to reach to INR 133 crores. On the financial highlights, our total revenue grew by solid 38% to INR 204 crores. Our EBITDA stood at INR 65 crores, up by 62% Y-o-Y and full PAT stood at INR 36 crores which is also 58% growth Y-o-Y. Coming to our performance for the half year ended, our sales value reached to INR 560 crores, marking an 18% Y-o-Y growth, with the sales area touching to 2 lakh, 44,000 plus square feet. The collection stood at INR 298 crores, which is 34% growth Y-o-Y. Revenue for this period reached to INR 400 crores, representing 51% increase Y-o-Y. Our EBITDA stood at INR 131 crores, which is 67% growth Y-o-Y and EBITDA margin at 33%. PAT stood at INR 69 crores, which is increase of 55% Y-o-Y, resulting PAT margin of 17%. I'm also pleased to inform you that despite aggressive business development activities, our debt remains stable at INR 793 crores. And we have improved the debt equity ratio further below 1x benchmark to 0.85:1. The ready unit cost of debt has marginally increased to 12.22% on the back of project level private equity debt which is successfully closed for part funding the acquisition and approval related costs at our one of the projects. Further, the proposed equity raise company remains very well capitalized to [indiscernible] growth plans. With our OC received and ongoing portfolio, we have a revenue visibility of INR 1,780 crores and from our projects in launch pipeline, which is estimated to contribute about INR 4,270 crores. And our total revenue visibility stand stronger than ever to INR 6,050 crores. The estimated net cash flow from our OC issued and ongoing projects is poised to about INR 760 crores. With this concise summary of our business highlights and financial performance I invite your question and look forward to interacting further with you all. Thank you.

[Operator Instructions] The first question is from the line of Jeevan from Sahasrar Capital.

A few questions. One is, obviously, if you can give some detail on the private equity detail actually of INR 88 crores. So what is the total project cost? And how much -- so how big is that project? If you can -- and what percentage we are basically diluted and all. So if you can just give some detail on the private liquidity?

Thank you, Jeevan bhai. This project, what we have done, we have done a deal with Motilal Oswal. It is a project which we have acquired from Tata Communications, the land which is acquired from Tata Communications in a -- in Vikhroli. The total salable area over there is roughly about INR 3 lakh square feet with the top line expectation of INR 650-ish crores from the project. And the project cost is roughly in about INR 250 crores to INR 300 crores so -- plus the land and other things. So we are expecting a great, what you call, a margin in this project and the market is looking buoyant with the mid-segment -- what we are targeting over there is a mid-segment market. So that's where we are working on.

And Mr. Jeevan, just to clarify on your question regarding the dilution. It is a structure dating with [indiscernible] so there is no equity level dilution, if I read the question right. And it is completely with the cap of the IRR as such.

Perfect. Perfect. And secondly, on the part of the -- so we were about to sell the land in the South Mumbai to reduce our debt. So that's been -- we are talking since the last 2-3 quarters. So any update on that? Are we closer to that? Any good news there?

Well, we are -- to be honest with you, we are still under discussions. There are a few offers which have come in. Some are not to our satisfaction, some are still evaluating because these are high ticket HNI individual items where they are doing evaluating, which will take a little time, but we are on the job. We've got 2-3 offers. Few are not been up to the mark, so we've not proceeded further. 1-2 are looking positive, but they are taking time to evaluate in terms of the legalities and also which we are expecting and moving ahead accordingly.

Great, sir. And third part is on the repatriation. So we were supposed to repatriate our profits from outside. So any update on that? How long will it take for us?

So repatriation, there are two parts. Some part of it is coming from London. Second part of it is coming from Bahrain. While the London part, some part have already started getting money in the -- in our books, and we have already got -- we have got about INR 40 crores, INR 50 crores plus of money to be coming in more, and we are expecting that to come in the next few quarters. As far as Bahrain is concerned, we have -- our deal with the company over there is that we would get area against the money, which is to be given. And we are expecting to have a deal for that in terms of selling that area, which is expected once the building is ready. And our assumption is by next year, the building should be ready. So our sense is late part of '25 early part of '26 is where Bahrain money should be expected.

Perfect. And the last question, Dhaval bhai, is on the consumer side. So any time line you can share when are we expecting to launch our first project in Kanjurmarg?

Kanjurmarg, we are -- we've already given our guidance. We have already started giving our applications for approval. Plannings have almost frozen. We are hopeful to have this by March-April this year -- I mean next -- '25.

The next question is from the line of Dikshit Doshi who is an individual investor.

So this is in this Kanjurmarg land, all the litigations which were there because there was some PIL earlier in high court. So all those litigations are now cleared and settled and we are -- this land is now clear to -- for the projects to be launched or that litigation is still under process, and we expect it to get cleared?

So this property of ours did not have any litigation, number one. Well, there was a PIL file, but our land was wrongly demarcated or earmarked in that suit or the PIL, which we have already clarified and the court has given us the order to that effect accordingly. So our property is not part of any litigation. And hence, we have already started proceeding in terms of all the approvals related to Kanjurmarg and its buildings and et cetera. And that is why we are hopeful to launch by March '25

Okay. Very good. And my, sir, second question is related to Wadala land. So our company has development rights for Wadala land. And from what I understand is this land was purchased long back when this company was not formed. So we have the development rights and the ownership of the land lies with Vijayanagar apartments. So when we -- in our Manhattan project, we do a tripartite agreement between Ajmera, the buyer and the Vijaynagar apartment. So we have to give some consideration to Vijaynagar against this land? Or how does it work? If you can help us explain.

So back in those days, there were always development agreement, which was there because there was -- 20 years back or 23 years back, the same duty [indiscernible] implications were different for a development agreement versus an outright buyer plan, [indiscernible] plan. And hence, every agreement was on development agreement. But having said that, Vijaynagar has already given -- I mean, there is no consideration to be given to Vijaynagar apartments further for the sale of flats in Manhattan. They have -- this already entire receipts and the money of the sales receipts are going to come in the company itself.

Okay. And that will be true for the future projects to be launched in Wadala for all the...

Yes, yes, yes. All sales of apartments in Manhattan or Wadala will be all the receipts of this comes in the company.

[Operator Instructions] The next question is from the line of P.T Patel, who is an individual investor.

Congratulations on the spectacular set of usual numbers [indiscernible] Ajmera. I just wanted to know about the joint venture, which you're undertaking with [indiscernible]. It was launched with a lot of fanfare, but we are unable to detect if there is any plan to launch it anytime soon?

If you go to our presentation, we have already given that as a guidance of launching this project again sometime in March '25, wherefore which the site has already been vacated over there. We have already started applying for permission related to the approvals, et cetera. And we are hoping to get that in the next 2-3 months' time. And by March, we should be able to launch this project.

Okay. Would you be planning to sell any residential units in this or commercial?

No, I would think -- our plan is to do commercial over there, and we would be doing early commercial. And of course, there will be residential for the tenants who have been part of the society. But for our sales portion, it's going to be either retail or commercial offices.

All right. Clear. Is there any, by the way, is there any -- when will the [indiscernible] registration occur? Is there a time line set for this? Is it March? Or will it be earlier?

[indiscernible] March, we are expecting that to happen by February-March, only. So that the moment we get the number we are about to sell -- we start selling.

[Operator Instructions] The next question is from the line of [ Pavan Dipatia ] from NB Alpha.

Sir, when you say potential launches PDV is INR 4,270 crores -- Hello, am I audible? -- so in your slide when you say INR 4,270 crores of launch GDB. So is it safe to assume that this is the launch pipeline over the next 1 year, and it will be executed over the next 2 to 3 years?

We have given the launch time lines and as well the estimated completion timeline. In our estimate, given the intake, it is 3.5 or 2-3 years, which we are targeting for the entire portfolio. And yes, for in that particular time, we estimate to consume the entire project cash flows.

Okay. And the estimated cost required to complete these launch GDBs that you're talking about?

So as you know that this is the very mix of the -- our own land bank plus the asset-light models like the redevelopment, society development, R&D development and such kind of a thing. So cost model there is project to project kind of thing. But overall, on the -- we remain in the very same trajectory of about 30% plus on the EBITDA and the PAT margin somewhere sub 20%.

Okay. Sir, one more question, sir. What is your expectation on the margins when it is online and/or when we are doing a redevelopment or JV? Do we have an understanding of the breakup of the margins that we can achieve?

So yes, every project, what we do are on a different margins and percentages. What we usually do is for our own land banks where we've already paid off for the land and only the premium and the construction cost and all that is to be done, we are expecting IRRs over there in the range of 35% to 45%, depending upon the cost of construction, et cetera. And these are our EBITDA margins, sorry. And when we look at redevelopment projects, we look at anywhere between 25% to 30%. If it's a joint venture, also it's the range of 30-ish percent and outright is in the range of 25% to 30%. Some slum redevelopment or society redevelopment projects, if the location is very good, we are okay to look at a little lower margin between 20% to 25%. But if I have to give a sense, it's between 20% to 30% in the projects, which we look outside our portfolio or books what we have. And within our own projects or our own land bank, we are looking at 35% to 45% gross EBITDA margins.

Got it, sir. Sir, on the Wadala and the Kanjurmarg land, what is the freehold land that is available with us when you talk about acres? Because you said -- you have said on the slide, which is 1.1 -- or 11.1 million potential development potential. So if we can get an underpinning on the breakup that what is there in the Wadala land? And how much is there in the Kanjurmarg land?

So Kanjurmarg, it's 66 acres land parcels. And Wadala is a layout of 100 acres, which we have already developed a bit. We've already -- like that is under construction and some which has already been developed, 1/3 of which is also garden. So the balance land area, which we had is basically -- because it's a larger layout, so we look at the layout FFL not the land FFL. So basically, we may be having -- if I have to look at in terms of acreage, it will be about 15 or 20 acres, but you want it here and there. But FSI point of view, we have about 3 lakh square feet of -- sorry, INR 30 lakh square feet of sellable area to be sold and revenue to be generated from that.

INR 30 lakh in Wadala, correct?

Yes. And INR 80 lakh in Kanjurmarg.

The next question is from the line of [ Venen Agori ] from [ Sentivity ] Wealth Management.

Dhaval bhai, just there's one correction that has to be done in the investor presentation is the Wadala Residential segment -- No, it's okay. Residential -- Okay. So -- right. There is around 3.1 million square feet available land for development in Wadala. Am I right, right? So the current price is around INR 35,000 to INR 37,000 square feet. So this becomes a potential INR 11,000 crores top line for us?

Yes.

And similarly, Kanjurmarg, how much would be the potential for the 8 million square feet, or the period of 5, 7, 8 years, whatever it is?

See, ideally over there, the prices today are around 27,000-28,000 for residential and about 30-ish for commercial.

Okay. So even if we consider INR 25,000...

This year scenario, I mean, 30,000 is what we should consider on a conservative side.

Okay. And just wanted to know the road map for SPV, where currently, we got the NCLT approval for the 6.5 acre land in Wadala?

So happy to bring the development that all the NCLT-related for an it is completed, shares on the demerger has been allotted and credited to the shareholders. So all the formalities on [indiscernible] has been completed.

So what are our plans with that land now? Like when are we going to develop that? And are we going to rent it out or are we going to sell it off, so any plans over there?

So we are under the master planning stage now, now that we have all the complete clarity in terms of the legalities and all of that. Secondly, we are definitely looking at commercial development over there. While we are doing the market planning but we are open for -- as a company, we are very open for a partnership level to come in, which will add value to the entire piece of land. And hence, we are working on the same if somebody wants to come. But however, the market plan and all of the approval processes, we will start in the next few months time.

[Operator Instructions] The next question is from the line of Amit from [ AG Hava ].

Yes. Actually, most of my questions have been answered. And congratulations for a good set of numbers and happy Diwali to all the companies.

Thank you. Thank you, wishing you a very happy Diwali in the New Year.

[Operator Instructions] The next follow-up question is from the line of [ Venen Agori ] from [indiscernible] Wealth Management.

Dhaval bhai, apart from Wadala, Wadala is two sections, one is the SPV currently and normal Wadala and then Kanjurmarg. So -- we've got [ Vicroli ], and any other land banks we own apart from this?

We have Kanjurmarg, we have Wadala, we have [ Vicroli ]. We have Ghatkopar, we have Juhu, [indiscernible], Borivali, Bhandura. These are the projects where it's going to either in the planning stage or launch stage in the next few months' time.

Okay. So just a suggestion now own the land bank, can you also mention the other land banks also?

In terms -- sorry, I didn't get you.

Development potential, we have a section owned land bank in the investor presentation. So apart from the current plan, if you can mention the other owned land bank if possible.

So Slide #20, which kind of us is the entire details of the launch pipeline. And where we have the two projects which are on the -- our own land bank. And rest of the projects are the asset-light partnership for the redevelopment projects, plus we have about 8 lakh square feet plus on the bundle balance phase. We have only launched the first phase. So that 830,000 or is going to be the development potential out of the [indiscernible] fund also.

Okay. And now with the vision of going growing at around 50%. So will we require some cash flows to like invest or any fundraise in future and multiple optionalities coming in like the commercial for the Wadala, Kanjurmarg launch? So is there probably a possibility that to grow parts if we get an opportunity, get something there's a possibility of fundraising future as well?

We have on the first round of the press issue, which is the equity raise of INR 225 crores and wherein the end use is that of the multiple debt repayment, project launches and to fund the promoter contribution and the initial contribution of those launches. So to bring the momentum on the launches and as well the general corporate purpose. Going forward, yes, we will be having some partnerships at a project level where there is a requirement of the capital is like we have sensitized on the Wadala commercial development. Where we are open to such partnerships because being the commercial development, it requires a capital requirement, plus we are looking at a credible partnership whereby not only the capital, but as well the credentials of the partner will be of the level whereby the leasing support and such kind of a value addition to the overall project development.

The next follow-up question is from the line of [ Pavan Dipatia ] from NB Alpha. [Technical Difficulty]

When we talk about INR 4,270 crores of GDV over the next 2-3 years, we are talking about at least INR 800 crores to INR 1,000 crores of construction cost at least? And the land that we are speaking about, we have not even included Kanjurmarg in that. And then the growth potential for both side of very big for the company as well. So how is our thought process for the cash flows that we get from in terms of developing these lands? Because as you said on this call only, March is somewhere you were going to launch Kanjurmarg. And then you would have a thought process of developing it. It's a huge land parcel. So what is our understanding on building those cash flows and funding it for the construction?

So let me clarify that out of this entire INR 4,270 crores of the launch pipeline, two projects, which is almost about 50% of the -- this total, which is Wadala, 1,550 crores and the Kanjurmarg first space, which is INR 800 crores. So about INR 2,300 crores of the -- our own land and rest of the other projects, which are of an asset-light strategy, where there is -- the cost is spread over on the life cycle of the project. It is not so upfront. So we believe that it is not going to put a pressure on upfront requirement. However, we are looking at a project level debt requirement and debt funding, which is our working capital loans. And we will continue to do this particular with the support of our operating cash flow because a good number of projects are getting over soon as highlighted into the opening commentary so that particular support plus this equity raise is definitely going to keep us well liquidized and well capitalized or to take this show forward.

Basically, both these projects like Wadala and Kanjurmarg, okay, they are larger projects. And definitely, it will have different segments of projects coming in. It's just not going to be residential or only commercial or retail. It will be a mix of everything which will come over there. The demand for the micro market may have limited for a residential project may have limited for commercial, may have limited for retail. But if we do all three things simultaneously, my sales value or my sales potential becomes 3x rather than 1x. So that is the whole game plan what we are working on. Obviously, this all will require funding, we all will require partnership. And as we -- as Nitin bhai rightly said that we are open to bring in partners who add value to the project and we bring in better potential than probably we individually can do. So definitely someone who is a master in -- let's say giving an example of retail or commercial or hospitality or something like that, we are very happy to partner because A) it will add value to the entire complex. B) It will also add value to the project because it will come with a brand or it will come with a legacy and C) it will probably also give it a better valuation and probably just doing it alone. So it's a win-win situation, but we are looking at it.

Okay. But with your estimates, this INR 4,270 crores, plus the revenue potential of onwards is INR 1,700 crores, what will be the cash flow requirement for you and your planning that you must have done in -- over the next 3, 4, 5 years, that is going to emerge? As you said, there will be projects which will be completed also. So what is that commitment that is there in your mind over the next 3-4 years?

So to give you a very perspective about this requirement of cash, the cash -- rather the cash generation out of these particular projects to launch, which is having the GDP of INR 1,200-plus crores is about INR [indiscernible] crores. So that gives the kind of cash requirement and the cash generation out of this one. Plus on the Slide 29, we have given the entire breakup of how the cash flow is going to be accruing to us in the next about 3 to 3.5 years. Ongoing projects is going to contribute about INR 760 crores of the cash from the completion and where we are looking at a life cycle of about maximum 2.5 to 3 years. Plus, we have cash generation from other revenues and asset monetization, which is INR 330 crores. And these -- all these three pieces together is going to generate a cash of about INR 2,300 crores estimation.

Mr. [indiscernible] does that answer your question?

Got it. Thank you.

As there are no further questions from the participants, I now hand the conference over to Mr. Nitin Bavishi for closing comments.

Thank you, everybody, for participating in this earnings call for quarter 2 and first half of FY '25, look forward to interacting with you all. If you have any further interactions or any further queries. And tell first hand, I wish you all the best and the very happy Diwali and happy New Year to everybody, to you and your family. Thank you, everybody.

Thank you.

On behalf of Ajmera Realty and Infra India Limited, that concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us, and you may now disconnect your lines.