Anora Group Oyj (ANORA) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

All right. Good morning and a warm welcome to the presentation of Anora's Q2 results. My name is Milena Haeggstrom. I'm the Head of Investor Relations here at Anora. And our presenters today are our CEO, Kirsi Puntila; and CFO, Stein Eriksen. And after the presentations, we will start with the Q&A session. Please also be reminded that you can post your questions during the presentation throughout the call. And please note that this presentation will be recorded and published later today on our website, anora.com. And now, Kirsi, please go ahead.

Thank you, Milena, and good to see you all online. I hope you've had a great summer. We have naturally been playing for sunny teras weathers, and it does look like the world has not just yet totally stopped enjoying good quality drinks this season. Okay. I'm a big believer in open and transparent communication. And my ambition all along has been to turn around the Anora performance, of course, but also rebuild trust in the investor community. And for that, we wanted to share a couple of proof points. I am not sure if of you have noticed -- yes, I can go to the next slide, please. I'm not sure if you all have noticed, but -- now that the midterm strategy is well in action, we have increased our activity externally. First of all, we have met many local Finnish and Norwegian investors, but also attended some international investor meetings in Paris with Deutsche Bank and ABG. Secondly, Milena in our IR -- from our IR from London for the best investor event in the small cap category. And this is the testimonial awarded for our recent Capital Markets Day presentation. Thirdly, we decided to introduce a new way of keeping you all updated in between the quarters. In July, we, therefore, published our first-ever presilent letter, and we intend to make this common practice. You can find these letters on our website in the new IR section. And then lastly, from Q2, we intend to include more concrete and very viable evidence of fit, fix and focus delivery on our quarterly investor materials. The aim is to move the market dialogue from ambition and planned activities towards more documented execution and measurable results. So the first part of my presentation today is about showcasing the development in our FFF strategy. And then the second part is to show you the actual Q2 numbers. Stein will then follow with more details on our financials, as we've done in the past few quarters now. But before anything else, just to comment briefly on the other stock release that was sent about an hour ago. We have signed a letter of intent on a distribution agreement with in Sweden and Finland. We are in a good dialogue with the Pakri team, and if all goes well, this deal would obviously further strengthen our position as the leading wine and spirits powerhouse in the Nordics. It would be also perfectly fitting our fit, fix, focus strategy, supporting our growth ambition. The yearly financial impact for those 2 markets would be around EUR 25 million to EUR 30 million. But as said, this is only a letter of intent, and should go all well, we hope to start the distribution at some point in Q4. Still, considering all the insecurities and limited impact this fiscal year, we don't and won't change our guidance. But let's go back to the day's original agenda and an update on all the fitting and fixing we have done since the launch of our midterm strategy and the Capital Markets Day in November last year. Here is the reminder as to what we set on the Capital Markets Day. We are targeting 6% to 7% annual growth in comparable EBITDA through all the fit, fix and focus initiatives, which should take us from around EUR 71 million, which we had last year '25 to EUR 85 million to EUR 90 million by the end of 2028. As you see, EUR 50 million added to our '25 comparable EBITDA is actually more than our target of EUR 85 million to EUR 90 million by the end of '28. And this is because we have taken into account external environment impact, whether it is inflationary pressures, whether it is category shifts and an overall slower consumer demand. So that will need to offset. So, therefore, even in a negative volume environment, we believe that this trajectory is achievable. So let's then move to the evidence slide and start with the summary before moving into some more details. So just as a reminder, fit means creating a simpler organization and lowering our cost base overall. All these initiatives are largely secured and the sourcing savings are ramping up. With fix then, we start to see the actions already visible in the financial results. So during the H1, our gross margin reached an admirable 46.7%. Our comparable EBITDA increased to EUR 24.8 million, and inventory has reduced to EUR 132.5 million. So now, we talked about fit and fix. And then in the focus part, we are seeing early commercial wins. Wine has strengthened its #2 position in Sweden. New partner brands have been introduced and launches are progressing in selected categories and channels. So the overall conclusion is, therefore, that fit is largely secured as planned, fix is delivering miserable results already and focus is beginning to show evidence, but sure in all transparency, the focus part remains the key area to develop even further. And regardless of all the positives, I have to conclude that market does continue to be tough for the rest of the year, and we still have a lot of work to do to turn around Anora to a sustainable profitable growth. All right. Let's then elaborate a little bit further as to what's going on under each and starting with Fit. The key organizational actions are now delivered, including the new go-to-market structure, which we have talked about to you before and leaner ways of working. So teams are formed, and they are working well together in all markets. Sourcing savings are now ramping up through supplier tenders, packaging harmonization, and we have also introduced a new sourcing tool during the Q2, which gives further visibility for our people when they are working on these matters. By the end of H1, we are -- we have done around 70% of the run rate towards 2028 at Capital Markets Day plan. And this 70% has already been secured. So overall, it is on track and is already supporting a stronger operating margin. Moving on to the Fix actions then. All our value management initiatives have been driving a nice structural margin uplift. The revenue management actions that have improved gross margin in every segment, including the implementation of 1 pricing tool, which I'm very proud of, overall common pricing architecture and governance, price, volume and margin visibility in the full organization and overall faster scenario-based decisions, and that's something that, of course, is a major improvement here in an internal way of work. Another element of the fix part is inventory and working capital actions, both obviously converting straight into cash. Our H1 operational cash flow was EUR 13.5 million better than last year. This all, of course, provides funding for the dividends and also the focus base growth initiatives. We can also see the results in a leaner balance sheet that Stein will be talking about in a while. On top of all that, we completed our refinancing in June 2026 this year, which will cut annual financing costs by around EUR 1 million per annum. And we will get back to this in more detail later. Right. So finally then the focus part, focus-based growth actions, as I mentioned, they are also starting to show early commercial wins. This includes growth actions, first and foremost, in our own core portfolio, which we are expanding. Secondly, investing in new categories and channels, especially in Finland and Norway. And then thirdly, continuing with our international growth. We have already seen good results with new partners, especially with wines, such as Morseland and Cantine Settesoli. And then we've launched new innovations in our liquor segment and fast forward, which is sort of energy drink in a low alcoholic beverage segment. And then one brand to mention is BuzzBall from Sasa Rock which is growing really well. So all nice growth coming from Q2 -- in Q2. But it is our market share recovery, which now remains our key priority for the remaining of the year. The rest of the initiatives are planned to be completed by the end of 2028. So as said, we intend to keep giving you this sort of regular proof points of the FFF progress from now on. Every quarter, probably a little bit more information on a half year basis, but nevertheless, proof points of FFF in every quarter. Right. Then we will move on to the second part of the presentation, which is the latest quarter. Please remember that our turnaround journey is still in progress, and there will surely be further bumps on the road and also bad quarters, but we are quite happy to say that the first part of the year 2026 has been the strongest in the history of Anora. And I'm delighted to say that Q2 provided further proof that our fit, fix and focus actions are improving performance despite continued weak market and our top line development. So in Q2, our net sales decreased by 3%, resulting in EUR 161 million. The decline was related mostly to lower wine sales volumes in Denmark, together with the earlier lost volumes in the filler services and the earlier changes in Spirit's partner portfolio in 2025. But do remember that the effect of these earlier events is anticipated to diminish as the year progresses, so very soon because now we are already in October -- in August. But what really pleases us now is that Q2 group gross margin rose to 46.7% of net sales. And this is the highest level in several years, reflecting disciplined revenue management, our pricing actions, also the portfolio optimization and continued operational improvements. And it was all our segments, i.e., Spirits, Wine and Industrial, that improved their gross margin, both in the second quarter and during the whole first half of '26. The one parameter that's, of course, the most important for us is comparable EBITDA, which increased by 14.6% amounting to EUR 16 million compared to EUR 14 million last year. We also ended Q2 in a healthy financial position with a net debt of EUR 177 million and leverage being 2.5 -- 2.4 after refinancing. And we're very happy about that. We have promised that it should be below 2.5. Looking ahead, We, therefore, keep our guidance for this year, comparable EBITDA expected to be EUR 74 million to EUR 79 million in 2026. I know this slide is a little bit busy, but you can focus on the color to pictures, while I bring you some highlights of the past quarter. First and foremost, all the summer events. We want to provide consumers and our people with meaningful experiences, enjoying our drinks. And it was a good summer with our brands. We were visible in Roskilde festival in Denmark, Estonia, Sweden, Rock Festival and also the ones here in the Helsinki area. Hopefully, you visit super teras where you could enjoy the Leijona experience, and there were many other summary events as well. Secondly, we have continued growing our amount of ready-to-drink, i.e., the can products across the portfolio across different brands. And then thirdly, we have launched a selection of fresh summer wines and spirits, whether it is a paradorcarba, Don Simon Mimosa or then the new Leonie liquer variance. As usual, I will then use some time on the segment performances. And let's go to the wine first. The total net sales in the wine segment did decline to EUR 68.1 million, which is down 9.1%. And this was mainly due to the old topics, i.e., lower sales and pillar service volumes in Denmark and reduced volumes in Finland and Norway. Comparable EBITDA decreased to EUR 900,000. Comparable EBITDA margin decreased to 1.3% of net sales. And this decrease was due to lower sales despite a significant improvement in gross margin, which was 30.6% of net sales. And on a positive side, we still continue to strengthen our #2 position in Sweden, and we did maintain our total market leadership in Norway, Denmark and Finland alike. Okay. Then, if we look at the Spirits segment, net sales declined to 52.8%, which I would say is down only 1.5% anymore. And this is largely explained by the earlier portfolio changes in 2025. And then, of course, the market in general continued to be soft. But again, looking below the surface on the positives, gross margin improved to EUR 47.5 million and the gross profit amounted to EUR 25.1 million. So mix and pricing were clearly improving the profitability in the Spirits segment. And not only that, now we see Baltics and also our expansion markets being back to the growth track. The Spirits comparable EBITDA, therefore, increased by 22.7% to EUR 10.5 million, that is an incredible improvement in EBITDA. And the comparable EBITDA margin increased to 20% from last year, which was 16%. So to summarize, we still work through portfolio changes, but the underlying profitability quality is definitely improving. Next, let's look at Industrial breaking. Industrial delivered a very strong second quarter. External net sales increased by 7.3%, ending at EUR 39.6 million, while the total net sales amounted to EUR 51.9 million. And this growth was driven by very strong sales in ethanol and starch and then also the logistics services in Norway, thanks to our operations. So comparable EBITDA improved slightly to EUR 6.3 million or 10.2% of net sales. And the Industrial gross margin increased to 53.5% of net sales in Q2, and the gross profit amounted to EUR 33 million. So overall, Industrial also continues to be a stable part of the business. Okay. I know that this was quite a handful of information, but there is more to come when I let Stein loose. So over to you, Stein.

Thank you.

I think you are muted, Stein.

Yes, absolutely fantastic. You can start all over again. More numbers, Stein.

Thank you. More numbers, more details. I'm sorry about that, guys. Okay. Let's start. Yes, good morning, everyone, and then I will take you through the financial review for Q2 and H1 of 2026. So Kensri summarized it quite well, but I would just repeat it that Q2 confirmed that the underlying earnings improved while net sales remained below last year, comparable EBITDA increased clearly, supported by continued execution of fit, fix and focus translating into higher gross margin and a stronger performance in Spirits and Industrial. In this presentation, I will cover net sales, comparable EBITDA, gross margin, cash flow and net debt, the refinancing completed in June, and finally, a slide on working capital. So let's start with the net sales for Q2. Q2 external net sales decreased by 3% to EUR 160.5 million compared to EUR 165.5 million last year. The main pressure was in Wine, where net sales declined by 9.1% to EUR 68.1 million. This should also be seen in -- against a challenging market backdrop with Nordic wine market volumes declining by 5.4% in the second quarter. Our performance was further impacted by lower sales and filler service volumes in Denmark as well as lower volumes in Finland and Norway. Spirits was down, like Kirsi said, only by 1.5% to EUR 52.8 million all related to early changes in the partner portfolio in 2025, while our existing portfolio had growth in the quarter. Industrial delivered positively with external net sales increasing by 7.3% to EUR 39.6 million, driven by higher volumes in ethanol and starch as well as logistics services in Norway. So the key takeaway here is that the top line remains under pressure, especially in wine and will be, of course, a major focus area to improve going forward. Let's then move on to EBITDA and comparable EBITDA. But before I start with comparable EBITDA, let me briefly address the difference between reported and comparable EBITDA. Reported EBITDA was EUR 12.3 million in the second quarter, reflecting EUR 3.7 million of items affecting comparability, mainly related to one-off project costs from our ongoing transformation program and the fit, fix and focus initiatives. On an H1 basis, items affecting our comparability amounted to at EUR 5.9 million. These costs are temporary in nature, while the benefits from Fit, Fix and Focus are increasingly visible in our underlying performance. So let's then turn to comparable EBITDA. Group comparable EBITDA increased by 14.6% to EUR 16 million from EUR 14 million last year. And Kirsi already mentioned EBITDA margin improving to 10% from 8.4%. The improvement was driven by stronger performance in spirits and Industrial and reflects the continued execution of the FFF program, particularly through revenue management, mix and structural cost actions. Spirits improved to EUR 10.5 million with a margin of 20%, supported by high gross margin, disciplined revenue and mix management and lower underlying operating expenses. Industrial also delivered a strong quarter, increasing to EUR 6.3 million with a margin of 10.2%, supported by higher gross profit and a good volume development. And Wine remained the weak spot. Comparable EBITDA declined to EUR 0.9 million from EUR 1.9 million the previous year as lower sales more than offset the improvement that we had in gross margin. Overall, we see a good -- we see this as a good quality improvement in earnings with higher margin and stronger profitability despite the continued top line pressure, and the main remaining gap is the commercial recovery in wine. I think the gross margin is the most important financial proof this quarter. In Q2, the underlying gross margin improved to or increased to 46.5%, up from 42.6% last year. And on the right-hand side on this slide, you see on an H1 basis, the gross margin also reached 46.5%, the highest H1 level of gross margin since the merger. There are 3 main drivers that explains the gross margin improvement. And around 1/3 is related to revenue management, that's better pricing, mix and governance across the monoplay markets. Second, positive mix effects from the partner changes, already mentioned, and the filler business; and thirdly, better operational performance, particularly in Industrial. The chart on the left-hand side of this slide illustrates that input cost environment has become more supportive compared with the peak levels seen in recent years. But the important point is that the margin improvement is not simply a commodity tailwind. It's explained by our commercial portfolio and operational actions under the Fit, Fix and Focus program. Also, we are in the middle of the barley harvest season. And so far, I can just say it looks okay. It looks okay compared to last year. Okay. Let's then move over to the balance sheet and the net debt development. Turning to net debt. The seasonal cash patterns is important here. As you all are aware of, H1 is normally a cash outflow period for Anora while Q4 is the strongest cash generation quarter. Net cash flow from operating activities was minus EUR 39.9 million, which is EUR 13.5 million better than last year despite the normal seasonal working capital build. Net debt at the end of June was EUR 176.9 million, down from EUR 199 million a year ago. And the increase from year-end reflects like as already mentioned, normal seasonality and dividend payment in Q2. So the balance sheet remains clearly stronger than last year, and the H1 cash flow improvement confirms that working capital discipline is progressing. Then moving over to the financial position of Anora, leverage was 2.5 -- sorry, 2.4 compared with 3 last year, and therefore, still within our target of below 2.5. We should recognize that headroom is more limited in H1 because of the normal seasonal buildup, and of course, the dividend paid in Q2. Liquidity reserves remained solid at EUR 244 million providing good flexibility after refinancing. And as already mentioned, very happy with the operational cash flow in the first half of 2026, ending million EUR 14 million or 13.5 million to be exact better than the previous year. So the conclusion is that financial position is robust lower leverage than last year, solid liquidity and improved cash flow discipline. As Kirsi mentioned, we also completed the refinancing of the group on improved terms in June. The new financing structure consists of EUR 260 million of committed credit facility and EUR 140 million term loan and EUR 120 million revolving credit facility, together with existing EUR 20 million overdraft facility. Compared with the previous structure, as you can see on the slide here, the facilities have been rightsized with EUR 50 million, while the commercial paper program has increased from EUR 100 million to EUR 150 million, maintaining then a good financial flexibility. The tenor is 3 plus 1 plus 1 years, and the financial covenant remains unchanged and net debt to comparable EBITDA below 3.75. The lender group remains strong and well diversified with S acting as agent and coordinator alongside Danske Bank, DNB and Opal. Importantly, the refinancing is expected to reduce annual financial costs by approximately EUR 1 million on a run rate basis by the end of 2026. So overall, we have reduced the cost of financing, rightsized our committed facilities and maintained a flexible funding structure with an extended maturity profile. Then finally, touching upon working capital. Net working capital was minus EUR 32.8 million at the end of June, corresponding to approximately minus 5% of LTM sales. Inventory remains clearly below last year at EUR 132.5 million compared to EUR 146.2 million at the end of June 2025. And this is despite the normal seasonal inventory buildup during the first half of the year. Trade receivables and other current assets were at EUR 130 million compared to EUR 125.5 million last year. And at the same time, receivables sold were slightly lower at EUR 115 million compared to EUR 121.6 million the last year. So the key point here is that working capital management remains disciplined, inventory is materially lower year-on-year, and this has been achieved without increasing the use of receivables financing. So together with lower leverage we showed earlier, this supports the progress we are making under the fix agenda towards a leaner balance sheet. And with that, Kirsi, I hand over to you for some final remarks.

Thank you so much. It sounds like the CFO is fairly, fairly happy today. All right. So this following page, should be familiar with most of you by now. Our financial targets remain unchanged. We are targeting overall 6% to 7% annual EBITDA growth. We are targeting organic growth being above the market, and market growth is measured from the Nordic market sales volumes change. So here, you can see that the organic growth for Anora in H1 was minus 5%, whereas the market was down 3.4%. But please note that, the organic growth for Anora in Q2 was actually minus 5.5%, whereas the market was down by 5.3%. So in Q2, Anora's organic net sales did not decline anymore as much as the market overall. Then the second target is leverage, which should be below 2.5, and our dividend payout should be between 50% to 70%. So for 2026, we still guide comparable EBITDA to be between EUR 74 million and EUR 79 million. Right. So wrapping up Q2 with the key messages, which are, first and foremost, that our continued fit, fix, focus actions were driving Q2 comparable EBITDA growth up to 14.6%. Comparable EBITDA was up to EUR 16 million and the comparable EBITDA margin improved to 10%. Our gross margin rose to 46.7% of net sales. But yes, net sales declined EUR 161 million, which is down by 3% This was expected given the market conditions. And the decline -- as said many times, was due to lower wine sale volumes in Denmark, together with the earlier lost volumes in the pillar services and changes in Spirit's partner portfolio last year. Our net cash flow from operating activities was minus EUR 39.9 million in H1, an improvement of EUR 13.5 million compared to the previous year. And the balance sheet was clearly stronger leverage now at 2.4. So we want to leave you today with the following takeaway. We are improving profitability and financial position despite a weak market. And that's exactly what we set out to do last year on the Capital Markets Day. Looking ahead, we still expect continued structural pressure on alcohol consumption, for sure, and volume pressure across all our operating markets. So there are no changes there. But the things we can control ourselves are the following facts. We continue executing fit, fix, focus rigorously. We are improving margins and the cost base, and we are also increasingly focusing on the growth actions in future. So our guidance remains unchanged. Comparable EBITDA of EUR 74 million to EUR 79 million in '26, which means that we expect a decent improvement from last year, which was EUR 75 million. So overall, a challenging market, yes, but we are building a stronger, more resilient and more profitable Anora in 1 month at a time. So with that, I hand over back to Milena and potential questions.

Thank you, Kirsi, and I see that we already have some questions. [Operator Instructions] And the first question comes from SEB, Maria Wikstrom.

I have 4 questions. Unfortunately, I couldn't limit myself to a fewer questions on that. I would like to start with the guidance Because, I mean, to my eyes, it looks quite conservative as I mean you are now EUR 2.8 million ahead of last year after the first half of the year. So just having a flat EBITDA would get you to the low end of the guidance. So why to be so conservative? So what are the risks that you wouldn't see earnings growth in the second half of the year?

Well, if I start, feel free to jump in, Stein. But I mean the guidance bracket is quite we, of course, EUR 74 million to EUR 79 million. And despite a very good earnings development in Q2, we do see still challenges in the market overall. And the growth is not quite there yet. So there's no change -- no reason for us to change the guidance with the parameters that we are aware of at the moment.

Yes, okay. Then, I mean, first of all, congratulations from signing the letter of intents in the Bacardi deal. Looks, I mean, very good. And I just wanted so that I understand the structure rights that you -- given that the Swedish monopoly takes care of the distribution for all the alcohol content above 2.8 ABV. So that allows you to take the RTD distribution in Sweden versus in Norway, you don't currently have a possibility to distribute in the retail channel. So therefore, the deal doesn't include the RTDs for the Norwegian market. So is that the reasoning behind that it's a different in Sweden or Norway or something else that I should know?

No. But that's -- as I said, it is only a letter of intent at the moment, Maria. And of course, we have a open and regular dialogue now with the Parkade team, and we're working hard to get the contract signed, but it's not signed just yet. So what we have discussed and negotiated up until now in the past few months is exactly what is said in the stock release that we are working on the Swedish and OEM market, all channels except the grocery, i.e., the RTD segment in Norway. So this is what the negotiations are all about at the moment. We're still very happy about, obviously, continuing the dialogue with Bacardi, and therefore, wanted to send that letter of intent already now.

But hypothetically, I mean, would you have had competence or like the organization to distribute also in the Norwegian grocery?

Let's -- let's just put it this way that we have both monopoly markets and open markets in our portfolio in the market. So our competence is for grocery is definitely there. Having said that, obviously, in the monopoly markets, we're only building our competencies like in Finland at the moment. And right now, the negotiations are only about the channels that I mentioned in the release.

That is clear. Then I wanted to ask on the fixed cost in the Wine segment. I mean, given, I think, according to my calculation, the fixed cost in the wine segment grew by 2.6%. And given the changes in the organization, I was expecting the fixed cost in the wine segment to decline in the second quarter. Is there something one-off in the costs in the wine segment, why it actually grew and not declined during Q2?

Yes, I can answer that one. Yes, there are some one-off costs, Maria. But if you look at H1, I believe that the -- down with 5% during the first half of 2026. So you need to look at a half year perspective in order to get the right number.

Perfect. And then finally, I wanted to touch upon -- I mean, you said, I mean, that you're currently looking at quite good barley harvest. But then at the same time, if we look at the wheat market futures, I mean, we see that there is a likely pressure upwards. So how have you prepared yourself, I mean, for future raw material price hikes?

It's a very good question. From what I have heard is that the Finnish ball season has started fairly okay. So the crop has been good. The quality is good. And also the prices on finished barley seems to be at a fairly stable level. But that being said, you are spot on. I could be highly volatile. First of all, in Finland, you have the African swine fever that potentially can affect the prices going forward. And then also you have the whole bed situation in the Black Sea. So you are correct. This could -- right now, it looks pretty okay, but it could affect our input cost going forward. And that's also one of the reason why we don't change the guiding.

Then, we move on with the questions. So the next question is from Sanna Perala at Nordea.

Thank you, and thanks for the great presentation. I have a few questions I already covered, but I'll continue on the guidance, so just to be clear, or if you could give some color, does your guidance still expect like improvement in wine as we know it has continued weak? Or does it mainly rely on the other 2 segments?

Well, the guidance overall is based on our analysis of the fit, fix and focus strategy as such. So there are obviously different elements which are affecting the guidance. We, of course, recognize the fact that with Wine, there's a lot of work to be done. And the Denmark business continues to be very weak, although, of course, the team is working really hard. And the H2, we hope to see some improvements in the wine segment as well, but those are already built in the guidance. Then, of course, one has to remember that Q2 is only 20% of our overall business. So Q3 and Q4 are significantly bigger. And therefore, there is a volatility, of course, as to the whole market trend, which still seems to be quite soft. So again, no reason for us to change the guidance at this stage.

All right. Well, then continuing in wine, just to clarify, was the lower volumes in Finland and Norway, mainly like market-driven? Or did you lose some market share there?

It was related to both. So we issued the market figures in the pre-silent letter. But as you can see, the wide market, both in Norway and Finland, was pretty weak in Q2, but I think it's also fair to say that we lost some market shares in both of those countries, while in Sweden.

Yes. And then if we look at the next few months or quarters, what do you think needs to happen in wine and specifically in Denmark in order to the strong gross margin to translate into earnings recovery?

Well, as far as Denmark is concerned, maturity of the weak performance is still in the tiller business, as we have been communicating before. Then there are some sort of campaign timings and things like that, which we hope to be seeing now happening in H2. But then, of course, we've also been quite transparent, but sort of a white spots of the Wine category, there's still segments where we are not present, where we now see obviously, a lot of innovations in our pipeline. So it takes a little bit longer time. I mean, what we've done in Sweden is obviously extraordinary, but it has been a very long process, of course, getting into that fantastic situation where we are right now. And of course, the ambition is exactly the same for Finland, Norway and Denmark as well. If you remember, the Danish Wine business, if you look at the commercial side of the reasoning, it is very much due to the U.S. wines, which have experienced a horrible decline thanks to or due to rather due to the situation in Greenland and the Danes objecting to buy American wines. But on top of that, we have other 2 markets Finland and Norway, where we are expecting to see growth also from launching new wines and introducing wines in the segments where we are not present at the moment. But that takes a bit longer time, especially when you talk about channels, like monopolies, you can't just go and launch it when you wish. So there are certain processes in order for you to get those products into the into the distribution, so that takes a bit longer time. But that ambition level is, of course, there to also turn around wine. And maybe lastly, 6 months ago -- less than 6 months ago. I think it was -- we had a new SVP starting, who is working really hard with her team now to turn around one as well.