Arkema S.A. (ASH) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

August 31, 2021

New York Stock Exchange US Materials Chemicals m_and_a 52 min

Earnings Call Speaker Segments

Operator

operator
#1

Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to Arkema's conference call. I will now hand over to Thierry Le Henaff, CEO. Sir, please go ahead.

Thierry Le Hénaff

executive
#2

Thank you very much. Good morning, everyone. Thank you for joining us on this call at such a short notice. I am here together with Bernard Boyer of Strategy and M&A; Marie-José Donsion, our CFO; and Vincent Legros, Head of Bostik. Also with us is the IR team. You have seen a set of slides, which we have just sent to you, which you can use as a reference for this call. So as you know, we have organized this conference call. As we announced earlier this morning, the project to acquire Ashland's Performance Adhesive business. And as you can imagine, I'm very pleased to announce this transaction as it is a company that we have been looking at for a number of years now and following Ashland's strategic announcement in May. So we are very keen to pursue this opportunity. As you know, the adhesive market is still fragmented globally, and there are many small targets available that we acquired and will continue to acquire, but attractive major targets are much harder to come by. So this really was a great opportunity. Besides, I must tell you that over the past few years, we have been very selective regarding acquisition despite our significant firepower, and we have walked away from a number of potential targets in different fields as we have stuck to our stringent criteria of strategic fit and value creation. So Ashland Performance Adhesive is a high-quality business with leadership positions in industrial adhesive in the U.S. This business enjoys very good margins, a strong growth potential and a very talented management team. The strategic fit between Ashland's Performance Adhesives and Arkema is evident. This is the case at a group level, as this business will contribute to strengthening our Specialty Materials platform in line with our 2024 ambition to be a pure Specialty Materials player. And it is also the case, obviously, at Bostik's level, as we have many times expressed our strong ambitions to grow our adhesive business over the long term. In my view, for the strategic reasons, we were the natural buyers for this business. The timing for this transaction is also optimal, as it comes in the context of Arkema's current positive dynamic, with the recent disposals of functional polyolefin and PMMA, the start on the strategic review of fluorogases and a strong cash flow generation on the back of our excellent results this year. In a nutshell, Ashland adhesive should generate sales of around $360 million this year, with an EBITDA margin in excess of 25%. With both first-class technologies as well as diversified end market exposure, with a presence in building and construction, transportation, labels and flexible packaging to name the most important ones. Adhesives business division is highly complementary with Bostik from a geographical viewpoint, Ashland has a limited presence outside of the U.S. And the company has technologies that can be easily rolled out in Europe and Asia, where Arkema and Bostik have a stronger foothold. From an application viewpoint, Ashland product ranges can be found in flexible packaging, hot-melt pressure-sensitive adhesives and high-performance industrial adhesives where Bostik already has a presence. Apart from this obvious and significant synergy with Bostik, there are clear synergies with our Coating Solutions segment on 2 levels. Firstly, with the acrylic value chain, which is the backbone of pressure-sensitive adhesives. And secondly, in the formulation of emulsion, which is an area where we can complement and reinforce Ashland's knowhow. From a financial viewpoint, the offer is based on a multiple of 15x EBITDA taking into account the value of the tax asset. Besides the level of synergy is very high, given the potential of cross-selling and geographical expansion, we estimated them at around 12.5% of sales, which is high, as you can see, which comes to around $45 million once fully achieved. Taken into account the full amount of synergies, the multiple will be then reduced to 8.7x EBITDA in 2026, which is much closer to our own multiple. The first transaction is EPS accretive for year 1. And by 2026, according to our forecast, we will gain EUR 1 of earnings per share. So this transaction is highly value creative for our shareholders. Following this acquisition, we decided to revise upwards our midterm guidance for Bostik. By 2024, the segment sales should exceed EUR 3 billion. So nothing has changed, but the EBITDA margin should stand at least at 17% versus our initial guidance of 16%, positioning Bostik among the very best in the sector. So as a conclusion, because we wanted to keep this call short and concise and get your questions, I will conclude by saying that the acquisition of Ashland's performance adhesive represents a unique opportunity and constitutes a key milestone in the group's transformation and for Bostik development in particular. More importantly, the deal is highly value creative for our shareholders, given the excellent strategic fit and strong synergy potential. And at the same time, it will increase the group's earning resilience, thanks to an improved business mix. So I would like to thank you for your attention, and I'm ready together with the rest of the team to answer your questions.

Operator

operator
#3

[Operator Instructions] The first question comes from Alex Stewart from Barclays.

Alex Stewart

analyst
#4

Congratulations. I can see why you've adjusted the purchase price to reflect the lower effective tax rate to these assets now that you can deduct it with amortization from pretax profit in your tax calculation. But could you tell us what the effective tax rate is in the business and how that compares with Arkema today because that will help us do a like-for-like comparison on valuation multiple? And then just related to that, could you confirm whether you have taken into account the current value of money on the tax synergies to be discounted the benefits over time? Or have you just taken them at nominal value?

Thierry Le Hénaff

executive
#5

Okay, Alex. Thank you for your question. I will hand it over to Marie-José.

Marie-José Donsion

executive
#6

So Alex, regarding the tax rate, as you know, there is currently a tax reform in the U.S. that will probably move things a little bit in the next year. But at present, the tax rate of Ashland's adhesive business is around 24%, 25% effective tax rate, which is actually higher than what we have at group level for Arkema. Since you know we are more around, let's say, 20% effective tax rate in our case worldwide. The assumption we've taken to assess the tax synergies on this transaction is based on basically an allocation value of 85% to the U.S. with an amortization period of goodwill over 15 years and reduce the WACC of 7.5%.

Thierry Le Hénaff

executive
#7

Thank you, Marie-José. So -- yes, go ahead.

Alex Stewart

analyst
#8

Sorry. Can you -- taking those into account, can you tell us what the effective tax rate would be of the assets when you've acquired them to take into account the goodwill amortization?

Marie-José Donsion

executive
#9

As I said, because there is a tax reform coming in the U.S., in fact, the current tax rate is probably not the right assumption to consider in the future. But at this present time, the rate we consider for the U.S. is indeed less than 12%.

Thierry Le Hénaff

executive
#10

Which means that our assumption, Alex, is conservative by definition because the tax rate in the U.S. will increase and the benefit will be higher than that, that the one we have taken.

Operator

operator
#11

The next question is from Martin Roediger, Kepler Cheuvreux.

Martin Roediger

analyst
#12

On the synergies, you mentioned the 12.5% compared to the sales of the target company. But compared to other M&A deals in the chemicals, this is rather a high ratio. What makes you really confident to achieve that figure? You mentioned cross-selling opportunities due to the complementary fit. So is your estimate based purely on top line synergies? Or also does it include cost synergies? And if so, can you elaborate on that cost synergies? And once the asset is fully integrated, how can you measure in the year 2026 that you have achieved these synergies? That was my first question. The second question is on the financing. Maybe this is a misunderstanding from my side. But you mentioned in your press release that you look at this acquisition also with the perspective that you currently do the strategic review of your fluorogas business. And in this context, my question is do you make progress and received already interest for that asset by strategic or financial investors? And as a follow-up, do you consider to sell the whole fluorogas business or just the commodity part?

Thierry Le Hénaff

executive
#13

Okay. So two very different questions, Martin. So on the synergies, we have first 60% top line and 40% cost. And the cost is between, let's say, raw material-linked synergies and fixed cost, and fixed cost in industrial optimization and G&A. We have 2 advantages in this unique deal. The first one is that Ashland is very, very strong in the U.S., but has a limited presence outside of the U.S., which mean Europe and Asia where both Bostik and Arkema are, as you know, very strong. So because of this difference of -- which is significant in market positioning, the geographical synergies are very, very strong. And we can really duplicate very happily what we have in the U.S. to the other region. It's one thing which makes it unique. And the second thing is that we benefit, and I think this is why also we are a natural buyer of the acrylic value chain because the acrylic is a specific backbone to the Pressure Sensitive, and this makes the difference between, I would say, high synergy, but in the current range, I'm sure you have in mind something like 8% synergy, which is more typical and we announced 12% and the differences between the 8% and 12% comes from these 2 features; this geographical complementarity and the support of the acrylic value chain. This means that the synergy are not only with Bostik, but also with the coating platform, which is great, in fact. With regard to fluorogases, so I will not -- otherwise, you would have been informed before, so I think the process, as you know, has been launched. What we want to dispose of the fluorochemicals, pure specialty non-emissive, fluorochemicals emissive business, which is linked to air conditioning, which is a good business and making a lot of cash and name. But we are very consistent with what we have said so far to the market. This is what we want to dispose all. And we keep the specialty, which are really linked to the natural market of Arkema, which is linked to the energy, housing efficiency or linked to battery. And I would say the process is developing as planned, but there is no breaking news to answer to your question. But clearly, you can see synergies and thank you for the question. What we are doing and we have been doing since the market day -- Investor Day, now it's 1.5 years, where we have sold the functional polyolefins and the PMMA, we have launched fluorogas disposal, and we have made some small bolt-on acquisitions in the middle, and now we have the major acquisition. This is about portfolio evolution, and we are really moving very fast to reach our goal of becoming a 100% specialty material company.

Operator

operator
#14

The next question comes from Chetan Udeshi from JPMorgan.

Chetan Udeshi

analyst
#15

A few questions from my side. Number one, it seems Ashland mentioned their last 12 months EBITDA of about $82 million versus what you guys are talking about pro forma EBITDA of $95 million. Is the delta entirely because of the different time frame? Or have you adjusted certain items from their numbers to get to $95 million. That would be first question. The second question was, I'm just curious, why is the margin of this business so high? Like is it a function of product mix, et cetera? And can you also help us understand how has this business grown pre COVID? I'm just trying to understand, what is the business where maybe there wasn't any investment in growth and maybe that explains why the margin is high. And last question was on financing, can we assume that eventually this -- or sorry, essentially this deal will be financed using the cash on the balance sheet? So in other words, no new debt will be issued?

Thierry Le Hénaff

executive
#16

Okay. So obviously, Marie-José will answer the last one. I will take the first 2 ones. So I would say the first one is the classical difference between seller and purchaser. There is important allocation of corporate cost. When you look at reported accounts of Ashland, so -- which gives you the $80 million. And when you take out what needs to be taken out, which this allocation of cost, which is our view. So pro forma adjustment, which has been really been used in detail many times, plus a little bit of a time difference. You have also a few million time difference, you come to this $95 million. So we are quite comfortable on the $95 million, which gives you the multiple we have explained. And after that, we take, as Alex mentioned, the tax benefit. With regard to the growth, first of all, everybody, which is more or less familiar with the adhesive business knows -- knew already that Ashland's business was a very good one in terms of quality, management, customer intimacy. It's true that they have excellent technologies, which are very difficult to copy because even outside, we have never been able to match them. So where they are in niches, high value-added applications, superior knowhow plus customer knowledge and intimacy, which has been built over years, as it can happen in certain fields in adhesives. So it's really a combination of management focus, long-lasting customer intimacy and what is superior knowhow with innovation on certain fields, which are growing regularly above GDP. So it's really a combination of all that, which give you this kind of margin. We know that because we are inside Bostik but also in the rest of Arkema, which is like that while you've superior margin for exactly the same reasons. For the financing, I will ask Marie-José to answer.

Marie-José Donsion

executive
#17

Okay. So regarding finance, you understood correctly. So we are -- we have liquidity level of close to EUR 3 billion. So we are paying cash for this transaction. Basically, the group pro forma that we expect end of the year -- basically the normative level we have currently is around EUR 1.3 billion net debt prior to this acquisition. So then we have the enterprise value of the deal that we should be paying in the coming, let's say, 4 to 6 months. So let's say the pro forma net debt to EBITDA ratio should be in the range of, let's say, 1.8x, 1.9x EBITDA at end of this transaction.

Operator

operator
#18

The next question comes from Jaideep Pandya from On Field Research.

Jaideep Pandya

analyst
#19

First of all, many congratulations on this deal. Just one question from my side. Can you just give us some color on the pressure sensitive adhesives industry in terms of how big is this business for Ashland? And then in the competitive context, what would be their market share versus players like [indiscernible]? And then when it comes to sort of growth, could you talk about growth around liquid adhesive for this business? And overall growth, do you think that this business is very similar to the top of the pyramid Henkel in terms of growth? Or would you say that actually the growth is somewhere in between for the traditional adhesive businesses which is 3%, 4% at the higher end, which is north of 5%?

Thierry Le Hénaff

executive
#20

Okay. Thank you, Jaideep, for your question and your nice comments. So pressure-sensitive adhesives is good -- is a strong market, growing at more than 5% a year. However, you have application in different films, graphic films, labels, specialty. So there is not one pressure-sensitive adhesive, different momentum. And in terms of technology, we have a different range of technologies with different presence, solvent-borne, waterbornes, UV. I would say that Ashland is really a key player in North America and Europe in solvent-borne pressure-sensitive adhesives, where, I would say, on the side of Arkema with an exit more from knowhow in waterbornes is very complementary. And again, we have some potential development, thanks to our Sartomer business line on the UV technology. So I would say it's really sum of difference -- so it's difficult to talk about 1 market, and it's a sum of different markets where I would say, Ashland is more U.S. and solvent-borne oriented whereas Bostik and the rest of Arkema is more waterborne in other regions. So it's very complementary. But the good thing is that it's in each market, very performance-oriented. I don't know if we would say high end of the pyramid, but it's certainly a high-quality niche and the market growth well above GDP at -- above 5%.

Jaideep Pandya

analyst
#21

Just 1 follow-up on the topic. Basically, are you saying that with your knowhow in UV and waterborne, in the future, when I say future, maybe in 2 years' time or so, you can enter the water and the UV borne adhesives market, which actually is not present right now?

Thierry Le Hénaff

executive
#22

Yes. Ashland has already started some developments, which are interesting. We had some other routes. So it's very good to share them and to see how we can accelerate. But clearly, the idea is where Ashland is more limited in presence, we can really complement with -- and this is what we call cross-selling with Bostik and Arkema coating resin presence. So it's very interesting from this standpoint, very complementary in role, geographical presence and the technological competency. So very good from that standpoint.

Operator

operator
#23

The next question comes from Geoff Haire from UBS.

Geoffery Haire

analyst
#24

Congratulations on the deal. Just 2 questions from me. First of all, could you just sort of comment on what the organic growth of the business has been over the last 5 years and also high EBITDA margins have trended over that time? And the second question is, how many years do you think it will take the ROIC of the acquisition to get back to the group's cost of capital of, I think you said 7.5%?

Thierry Le Hénaff

executive
#25

I think for growth with Ashland, we should be there for 2024 ambition. This is too much the cost of capital. In terms of growth, well, certainly, if I'm right, we have delivered something like 3%, 4%.

Unknown Executive

executive
#26

4%.

Thierry Le Hénaff

executive
#27

4% of that part of growth. And we believe that if not the whole, we can nearly double this growth with this, what I explained to Jaideep, which are these geographical and the technology synergies. So this is the idea. You have -- we have external growth that we have had in the past 4%, and we will nearly double it with this cross-selling synergies that we see from the geological standpoint and the complementary knowhow. So this is very exciting from this sentiment.

Geoffery Haire

analyst
#28

Do you think organic growth for the business will be 6% to 8%?

Thierry Le Hénaff

executive
#29

Exactly. Yes. Exactly.

Operator

operator
#30

The next question comes from Graham Hunt, Morgan Stanley.

Graham Hunt

analyst
#31

Just 2 for me, please. First one is on capital investment and one-off costs. I wonder if you could just talk a little bit about the phasing of the -- of any additional CapEx as you integrate the business and also just in terms of quantity around one-off costs. And then the second question, just on -- a little bit on the digital footprint of this business and how that will compare to Arkema's current digital footprint in the adhesive solutions division and where you see that going over the 5-year integration.

Thierry Le Hénaff

executive
#32

So I would say with regard to one-off cost, we assume EUR 15 million, 1-5, EUR 15 million one-off integration cost, typical administrative cost, information system, et cetera, on the business. And with regard to CapEx, we have planned for over the period of 3, 4 years, EUR 45 million CapEx to implement the synergy because as you have understood, the nature of the synergy are mostly geographical. And because of that, we need to make sure to extend the capacities in the regions where we are more limited. And so all in all, it's what we have put in our model. With regard to the digital footprint, I think it's too early to answer. We are really focused on -- I don't know if one of the team wants to answer instead of me, but I think -- we think that will be interesting, certainly complementarity, but it's too early at this point.

Operator

operator
#33

The next question comes from Andreas Heine from Stifel.

Andreas Heine

analyst
#34

Andreas Heine from Stifel. First, just a clarification. Did I get that right? The closing should be at the beginning of next year, so more to 6 months it would mean? One. The second is the acquisition lifts your margin to a new level. Does that mean that performing bolt-on acquisitions will be more that they selective and future acquisitions also meet this higher targets of -- target is 17%, but in addition, we made -- it is more than the region of north of 30% after synergies. That's the second question. And the last one is the same split different to what you have published by now is industrial assembly and construction consumer. Will you share more broader split on your adhesives business in the future?

Thierry Le Hénaff

executive
#35

So Marie-José will answer the last one. So with regard to the second question, can you repeat it? The line was not very good.

Andreas Heine

analyst
#36

Sorry. So the acquisitions in the future probably have not always been margin accretive from the outset at a much lower level. So when you go now to 17%, then I think it requires a number of acquisitions or targets we are looking at to have considerably lower margin and would be within this synergies diluted. So does it mean that in the future you will look for a pretty good profile of acquisitions in the adhesive business?

Thierry Le Hénaff

executive
#37

Okay. So with regard to the date of closing, we expect 4 to 6 months of closing, obviously, the earliest is better, all of us. So we start now already tomorrow, really a big priority to try to speed it as possible, but take 4 to 6 months. In terms of acquisition for the adhesives, each acquisition is of a different nature. You can have half synergy or you can have more top line synergies. So depending on which kind of synergy, you can start with acquisition with lower margin that where the synergy are very high. But I would say more and more with Bostik, if it is your question, we focus on the acquisition with margin already above 15%, okay? And this has been the recent experience with [indiscernible], with Fixatti, with Prochimir and we have done this one. So this one is rather unique and with EBITDA margin almost 25%. But I would say, if you look recently, most of our acquisition has been at least 15%, and we should continue in this direction. So not really any change. And don't forget that a significant part of the increase of EBITDA of the Bostik will not come from acquisition, it will come from the continuous improvement by the team of the current business, which is direct value creation. Marie-José, the last one?

Marie-José Donsion

executive
#38

So regarding segmentation. As you know, we published today around 4 segments. So the 3 segments which constitute our specialty portfolio, the adhesive, the materials and the coating solutions. Basically, on the adhesive, the split in terms of business was roughly 50-50 between construction and consumer in one hand and industrial assembly on the other hand. The impact of this transaction of Ashland basically increases the share of industrial and assembly adhesives by 5 to 6 points in the split of the business itself. And it gives also a bit more momentum to North America versus the heavy lift we traditionally had in Europe for the adhesive segment. We normally give some color when we comment the performance of Bostik around those elements, so both between construction consumer and industrial assembly adhesives in one hand and from a geographical sometimes on the other hand. But we don't plan today to further segment, let's say, the business into different pools. Clearly, the next segmentation objective for us is once we are finished basically with the fluorogas portfolio reshuffling, probably at that point in time, the intermediates, we need to reduce it, but this would probably be the figure in the future for a change in segmentation for Arkema.

Operator

operator
#39

The next question comes from Georgina Iwamoto from Goldman Sachs.

Georgina Iwamoto

analyst
#40

I've just got 1 left. I'm just wondering about the raised margin target. So 17% for the adhesives business by 2024, do you think that's a bit conservative given the potential that you have to roll out the Ashland business's advanced technologies across Europe and Asia? And I'm also wondering what could be the impact on profitability in other segments. And so for example, you could roll out new capacities in the pressure-sensitive technologies in Asia and start to integrate the Coating Solutions business or the acrylic assets that you have there. Is that something that you see potential for in the future?

Thierry Le Hénaff

executive
#41

Okay. So first of all, I would say mechanically if you make the math, you gain 1.5 points.

Unknown Executive

executive
#42

1.2.

Thierry Le Hénaff

executive
#43

1.2. So you gain 1.2 points. And you know, Georgina, that our current level is 14%, which is our target for this year. So end of '21, would be a 14% pro forma plus 1.2% is 15.2%. And we say that after '22, '23, '24, so 3 years, we get from 15.2% to 17%. So I would not say it's a stretch, but it's a quite ambitious target. So no -- so I think it's very consistent. I would not say we have margin for -- we are conservative. I think we are realistic. It's quite a demanding target, but I think it's completely achievable. But I would not say we should target something above because if you make the math, it's really very consistent with what we say -- our business plan, et cetera, are consistent with what we have said so far. So basically, I think 17% is really what we have in mind, which will position us at a very, very good level. Again, 17%. We started Bostik at 10%. And if you look at the adhesive business, including companies like Sika, [indiscernible] which are at 17%, there are not so many. So with a level of capital intensity which is around 3%. So which makes it in terms of EBITDA something which is very high. So I think it's a very, very good target. After that, you mentioned the other business, I would say, by definition, it depends where you put the synergies. But by definition of synergy, we have allocated all the synergy to Bostik, which means -- so that in the real life, it may be slightly different. But I would say, we can't also what we will do in the coating. So you will get some benefit on the acrylic monomers, which will be limited, but which will participate to the synergy. But it's really compared to the whole synergy, it is limited number. It adds to the synergy but it's a limited number. So consider that -- to get the story short, already strong target for Bostik, very nice and realistic. And with regard to Coating Solutions, it will be an addition. Most of the addition would be in the Bostik P&L and some of them, but not so much higher compared to the total, which we have been announced of EUR 45 million in the Coating Solutions. But at the end of [indiscernible] and it shows you, which is certainly the element of your question, that between the different platforms of Arkema, the 3 legs that we have, Coating Solutions, Adhesives and also High Performance Polymers, we're very close to each other.

Georgina Iwamoto

analyst
#44

Yes, absolutely. And congratulations. It must feel like a great result after a busy summer.

Thierry Le Hénaff

executive
#45

Okay. Thank you, Georgina.

Operator

operator
#46

The next question comes from [indiscernible] Market Solutions.

Unknown Analyst

analyst
#47

Congratulations for the acquisition. I was wondering with $95 million EBITDA you give for $95 million and the multiple of 15x, we arrive to $1.4 billion. Should we -- the difference between $1.65 billion and $1.4 billion is that all you value of tax advantage?

Thierry Le Hénaff

executive
#48

Yes. Yes, yes. Thank you for asking the question because we [indiscernible] in the press release, but then I think it's clear for everyone, yes, the difference is there. And this is what Marie-José reemphasized answering one of the questions before.

Unknown Analyst

analyst
#49

So that's about $200 million of tax advantage.

Thierry Le Hénaff

executive
#50

So that's not conservative, as I mentioned, so.

Unknown Analyst

analyst
#51

Yes. Understood. And this is based on 24%.

Marie-José Donsion

executive
#52

Correct.

Operator

operator
#53

[Operator Instructions] We have a new question from Laurent Favre from Exane BNP Paribas.

Laurent Favre

analyst
#54

Congrats. My 2 questions, Thierry. Number one is on the M&A pipeline side. You've mentioned that the balance sheet would get a comfortable level of gearing. Should we assume that you're not closing the acquisition side in terms of bolt-on acquisitions? And then the second question is around net pricing for, I guess, this new type of assets in Adhesives. So we've spent a lot of time talking about raw materials and pricing for Bostik back in July or August. Given that they are more focused in terms of raw material purchasing and that their customer base might be a bit more sophisticated, more industrial, bigger companies. Should we be assuming that the raw material squeeze may be bigger for them in the short term and you may require a bit of time to work through that net pricing in 2022 -- during 2022?

Thierry Le Hénaff

executive
#55

Okay. With regards to the M&A pipeline and tell me if I answer your question. So this one is obviously a major one by the size, by the value creation, and we want to try to speed up the first -- the time between signature and closing and then the execution of the deal as much as possible. So I would say, in terms of major for us, this is really our focus and we'll be busy for a certain time on it. Beyond that, we'll continue to make small bolt-on, which is, as you know, our capacity, okay? And they can be really very value accretive, even the ratio [ relative ] spend on this side is high. All the small ones, which we have been doing in the past 3 years has really created a lot of value. So we'll continue. So what you should see from -- and then the pipeline is very big, but we'll continue to be selective. So I would say every year, you can continue to count between, let's say, 3, 4 small bolt-on every year. And from time to time, as I mentioned, a major one, which is the one we are making today. So I don't know if I answered the question, but this is a profile of what we'll be doing.

Laurent Favre

analyst
#56

So that answers the question perfectly.

Thierry Le Hénaff

executive
#57

Okay. Now your question on the pricing of raw material was specifically on -- I'm not sure...

Laurent Favre

analyst
#58

I'm just wondering you won't comment on that specifically, but on this type of asset.

Thierry Le Hénaff

executive
#59

Yes. So clearly, the more specialty you are, it may be a product for you, but you see that with our acrylic value chain, which has reacted very quickly on the raw material, where for Bostik it takes more time. It's true that the more specialty and downstream you are, the more it takes time to pass the full impact of raw material and it was in the same direction. But on the other side, when the raw materials are tight, you have normally strong volumes which help. This is why this kind of business are quite resilient, and this is what happening to Ashland. And this is what is happening to Bostik. So to answer your question, I would say, in terms of EBITDA profitability between margin and volumes, you see really a strong resilience and robustness. In terms of margin percentage squeeze, you can have temporarily a couple of quarters where you suffer more. But overall, it's not longer than that, okay, because you have pricing power, but you are, let's say, more progressive in the way you develop your pricing on pure specialty and on businesses we are a little bit more upstream, okay? But at the end, I would say, you took about a couple of quarters, not more than that. So we are quite confident for this business for '22, but also for the rest of Bostik with whatever the raw material scenario is. And you can see it on the Bostik, I think -- I remember when we talk about 14% margin for Bostik on this year, there was some doubts which were expressed and we tried to answer. And in fact, raw material wave has been significantly higher and we still confirm the 14% for the year.

Operator

operator
#60

Your next question comes from [indiscernible].

Unknown Analyst

analyst
#61

It's just a short one. Obviously, you're buying a company at a much higher multiple than where Arkema is trading. Do you feel like the company and management has moved on from the sort of phase of risk when a few years ago when we saw Elliott around and the possibility of this coming forward like that?

Thierry Le Hénaff

executive
#62

I'm not sure I catch your question, but clearly...

Unknown Analyst

analyst
#63

So what I'm saying is that this might be somewhat [indiscernible] value creation in terms of buying a company much higher. So I guess it shows a comfort level that you've moved on from a few years ago when Elliott was around, if that makes it any clearer.

Thierry Le Hénaff

executive
#64

So first of all, we've told you many times, we don't comment on [indiscernible] and we have never commented. And secondly, on the acquisition, if you look at the history, we have made -- wonder how many acquisitions in the start...

Unknown Executive

executive
#65

30.

Thierry Le Hénaff

executive
#66

30? So we have made 30 acquisitions in the start. And you have all kind of multiple profile or whatever, what is very important is the value creation and we have been -- in terms of value creation, you can see the accretion of the share price is very strong. So I don't think it's a change in strategy at all. I think when we bought Sartomer, we paid significantly [indiscernible] obviously, we paid significantly in multiples and when we bought the assets of Dow in acrylic in the U.S. So it depends really on the time. But at the end, value creation is great. So we continue to focus on, I would say, our value creation. But now as we say [indiscernible], which is what comes, we said that net of the benefit of tax we would have paid 8.7 in 2026, which is not so far from our current multiple and don't forget on [indiscernible] that our strategy and we strongly believe that our multiples will be higher. So -- and that it will be helped further by performance transformation. So it's not a sort of tactic game or static vision. You need to look in dynamics. So we believe that with the performance transformation and unfortunately, we can start to see that today. The share price will benefit and the value creation will benefit and so we'll get this value. And but at the same time, it's not enough, we want to take down the multiple. And this is what we do because we announced for 2026, a multiple getting down at 8.7. So I think it's very consistent. And I would not say that our strategy has changed so much. I think we want to be a pure player in specialty and we are ready to buy some high-quality assets at high price because we believe that it's worth doing it for the transformation of the portfolio. And maybe last part, you know that we have sold recently our Functional Polyolefins business and our PMMA business. I think we benefit also from this environment of higher multiples. So you see it for the acquisition, you see it for the disposals.

Unknown Analyst

analyst
#67

And just a follow-on, if I may. Just on the fluorogases business side. Will that -- I know it's a complicated setup there and probably be a complex solution there. But do you think that will move the needle, finally? I know you've been frustrated about the multiples for many years.

Thierry Le Hénaff

executive
#68

I think -- so first of all, you say it's complex, okay, it's your words, but I think, it's completely manageable. We are progressing that with other disposals, which are not complicated. So it's not an issue so much for us. And then again, I think that it's not one -- let's say, one component of portfolio transformation, it's many components. It's a sum of different components, which ideally takes the company where we want to take it and what we believe will benefit from this appreciation from this market. So I think PMMA disposal will be one step. Fluorogas when we will do it, will be another step and acquisition of Ashland is another one, the Ashland [indiscernible], we are making with the Sika or so are the ones and -- but not only [indiscernible] our disposal. It's also what we do organically, for example, I think that all this capacity addition in PVDF for battery are value accretive and with specialty business, we take the profile of the company and do same for this project of polyamide [indiscernible], bio-sourced polyamide in Singapore. So it's a sum of element at the company. I mean it will be even dangerous to believe that one movement will change the company, no. I think we have started the transformation of the company nearly 20 years ago.

Unknown Executive

executive
#69

It's 15.

Thierry Le Hénaff

executive
#70

Okay. I went a little bit -- so more than 15 years ago and I think we -- what you have, I think, which is good with Arkema is that at the same time, we are able to deliver the short term but to deliver a journey which is supported by a long-term vision. And I think it's unique with Arkema.

Operator

operator
#71

[Operator Instructions] No more questions.

Thierry Le Hénaff

executive
#72

Okay. Thank you very much for participating with the short notice. And as we told you, we are very excited and -- to get this opportunity to welcome this very talented team for a very good business. And I think it will be a right move for Arkema again. So thank you very much and looking forward to see you in [indiscernible].

Operator

operator
#73

Ladies and gentlemen, this concludes the conference call. Thank you all for your participation. You may now disconnect.

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