Avon Technologies Plc ($AVON)

Earnings Call Transcript · May 15, 2026

LSE GB Industrials Aerospace and Defense Earnings Calls 42 min

Earnings Call Speaker Segments

Operator

Operator
#1

Good afternoon, ladies and gentlemen, and welcome to the Avon Technologies Plc Interim Results Investor Presentation.[Operator Instructions] Before we begin, we would like to submit the following poll. And if you could give that your kind attention, I'm sure the company would be most grateful. And I would now like to hand you over to the executive management team from Avon Technologies Plc. Josh, good afternoon, sir.

Mark Sclater

Executives
#2

Good afternoon and afternoon, everyone. Thank you for joining us. I'm Josh Sclater, I'm the CEO. And on my right is Rich Cashin, the CFO; and on my left is Steve Elwell, who runs our Avon business. And we'll take you through the slides. They are the slides that we gave at the results, but we will try and go through the narrative maybe a bit quicker than we do with the results. It was a very good first half for us. We delivered very strong revenue growth, strong profit growth and excellent margin progression. We actually moved our margin into the target range that we originally set for 2027. So we delivered it 18 months earlier than originally planned. We are now getting to the end of our transformation program. It was always expected to be a 3-year program. It will end as anticipated at the end of this year. It has involved a lot of heavy lifting for the team that you see in front of you. As that comes to an end, it does free us up a bit more to really focus on organic growth and potentially, if we found a value-accretive idea, we would look at buying and improving other companies in our space. We do have a strong balance sheet. It continues to get stronger, and we anticipate it will get stronger still as we go through to the end of this financial year. This does give us some latitude either to look at acquisitions or if we couldn't find anything to return capital to shareholders. So with that, I'll hand over to Rich, and I'll take you through the financials.

Richard Cashin

Executives
#3

Thanks, Jos, and thanks, everyone, for joining. So as Jos said, we've had a strong start to the year. We've made some good strategic and operational progress, and that's starting to feed through into a pretty strong financial performance. Headlines are order book is down a bit as we work through the military backlog, and we'll talk about a bit more about that in a moment. But revenue is up 7%, operating profit is up 39% and EPS is up 45% compared to the same period last year. The standout number for me though, given that my preferred measure of performance is ROIC is that our return on invested capital is up 450 basis points to over 20%. This puts us comfortably ahead of that 2026 goal of ROIC of over 17%. Cash conversion wasn't particularly great at 38% but we did have a late flurry of deliveries in March, which pushed the receivables balance over the balance sheet date. We actually received $18 million of cash very early in April. Had that been captured, cash conversion would have been 100%. Notwithstanding all of that, net debt to EBITDA at the end of the half was still around 0.9. So the balance sheet is in great shape. So looking at the P&L, as usual, comparatives on a constant currency basis, but order intake of GBP 118 million was down on a very strong first half last year. We have got a very robust order book of GBP 220 million, which covers us well into 2027 and beyond. Revenue growth of 7% up to $161 million with particularly strong growth in Avon Protection more than compensating for a bit of a slow start in Team Wendy. That's dropped through very nicely to operating profit, as Josh said, within the 14% to 16% guidance range of 15.2% or $24.5 million. Finance costs came down again, reflecting the lower average net debt. So that gives us adjusted EPS of $0.564 up over 45%. The dividend is going to move up about 6.5%, which is broadly in line with the increase of the full year to $0.081 per share. Within Avon Protection, order intake dipped a bit, but that compares to a very strong first half in 2025, where we benefited from about $30 million worth of what we would class as one-off or unicorn orders, including some support for Ukraine. If we strip those out, you can see that actually the underlying momentum is continuing to progress strongly. And in fact, we announced an additional order on Wednesday with the half year results for a $14 million filter contract from the U.S. Department of War, and that will be for delivery over the next 12 months. Order book is continuing to grow at $112 million. And that's quite significant because historically, this business has had a very low order book. It's a fairly fast in and ship business. So we've got enormous confidence in the second half and beyond in this business. Revenue growth of 23% reflects excellent underlying trading, particularly in relation to our European contract, the NSPA contract, where we acquired an additional 2 nations. And the drop-through to adjusted operating profit gives margin of over 22% for the half. That is exceptionally strong. We benefited from some product mix. And we also -- the margin was flattered to an extent by -- whilst we have a desire to continue to grow investment in growth around R&D and new product introduction, it's very hard to grow that investment at the same rate as revenue growth when revenue is growing over 20%. So I do expect those factors to normalize over time, but a very strong first half. Team Wendy has actually made a lot of strategic progress in the first half, but not all of that has flowed through to the numbers yet. Order intake did decline and we're burning through the order book. We do see that as a bit of a positive actually because whilst we have very strong order cover on the DOW contracts well out into the middle of 2027, the Department of War is not motivated to give us any more orders until we start delivering the ones we've got. So the quicker we can deliver that backlog, the sooner we will get new work. And I'm sure Josh will talk about that later. Revenue, therefore, was held back. We did have that slower ramp-up than planned in the first quarter, and we saw some commercial softness as the grant funding in the U.S. was held back by government shutdowns. We are seeing recovery in all of the above, and we are now up to full production rate on both ACH and IHPS. So I do expect to return to growth in the second half and for the year as a whole in Team Wendy -- what I will say though is that the improvements we've been making over the last 18 months are now starting to feed through to operating profit, which is up 100 basis points to 5.4% in the half. And then just before I hand back to Josh, it's worth stepping back given some of the changes in the world we're seeing around us and looking at some of the longer-term growth opportunities in our markets alongside the sort of near-term stuff that I've just been talking about. The geopolitical environment has certainly shifted materially over the last few years. We're seeing more conflict now than we have since World War II. This is clearly driving higher investment, particularly in Europe as Europe moves to a reinvestment cycle and the U.S. adjusts its positioning within NATO. In the near term, demand has been reinforced by the conflicts in Ukraine and the Middle East, both of which have highlighted the continued use of conventional warfare and the increased threat from chemical weapons -- so what we're seeing is defense budgets are going up and the amount of money in those defense budgets that's being diverted towards CBRN equipment is also going up. On -- so that certainly helps Avon protection specifically. In Team Wendy, improved ballistic protection remains a key theme with increasing numbers of military and first responder people and increasing gun crime, particularly in the U.S. driving upgrade cycles. And then on the right-hand side of that chart, very high-level view, but you can see that the trends in all of our key market growth drivers are moving in the right direction and at a stronger pace than they were last time we did this analysis 2 years ago. I'll now hand back to Jos to run through an update on our strategy.

Mark Sclater

Executives
#4

Thank you very much, Rich. So just a reminder of our high-level strategy. The first part of the top left is that we continuously strengthen our businesses through our strengthen system, which is -- it's our own proprietary version of continuous improvement. We are still running 2 projects on transformation. One of them is to increase production reliability in our Cleveland farm, and I'll talk a little bit more about that in a second. And the second is improving our IT function whilst simultaneously reducing the cost of it, which sounds counterintuitive that we can do both. But in fact, what we found is that it was less efficient than it could be and less effective than it could have been, and we're addressing both of those. It will lead to a run rate saving of $1.5 million or so once we've completed that project. It is going extremely well so far. Advance is all about building sales capability and developing products that deliver medium-term growth. And revolutionize is all about investing into long-term projects. And by that, we really mean projects that are unlikely to result in revenue growth for at least 5 years. So we're looking really in the 5 to 10 year period there. We'd like to keep an eye on that to make sure that we are investing into developing products that drive growth in the long term for us. This slide just shows how we see continuous improvement. I think people sometimes assume that the benefits of continuous improvement are linear. We actually see the benefits of continuous improvement as exponential because each improvement adds to previous improvement. So it does compound over time. We've seen that in Avon Protection, which is entering Phase 4 now that it's some way up the curve and has had extremely good results and its margin now is up to over 22% operating profit margin. Team Wendy is earlier in its maturity. It took a bit longer for us to embed the culture, but we do now see it starting to improve every single week, and we're very happy with the capability we've got there. So we do expect to see further improvements coming through with increasing pace in the future. This just shows how we've delivered opposite the nonfinancial metrics that we set out 3 years ago now. We originally wanted to increase productivity by 35%, and we have delivered a 44% improvement in productivity so far, and it's perhaps worth bearing in mind that originally that target was for next year rather than this year. We do believe that productivity ultimately equals wealth, both for our internal people and most importantly, for our shareholders. Scrap rates have come down 62%, again, exceeding our target 18 months early. They have actually crept up a bit recently, although not really through our fault one of our -- we were forced to change a supplier, critical supplier actually because they stopped making the product that we needed and the quality of the new supply is not yet where we want it to be, but we are working on improving that, and I'm sure it will come down in the second half. And then on inventory turns, as you can see, they have steadily increased. At the moment, we're actually more focused on improving production rates in Team Wendy. But over the medium term, we're aiming for a target of 5%, and we are still aiming for that target and we'll look to make more progress next year. Production rates are important to us in our Team Wendy business. The higher the production rates, the better margins it makes. And also in the first half, we had a situation where we recruited people in the first quarter in order to increase production rates in the second quarter, which did mean that productivity temporarily dipped in the first quarter and margins were there. IHPS has been steady. We're already making at the rate of the customer demand. We have, however, achieved the rate we need on 1 shift, whereas formerly it used to be on 2. And on ACH, we've actually doubled production over the last 6 months, and we are now hitting the rate that the customer wants and actually, it's the rate that we've contracted to demonstrate that we can deliver as well. We were contracted to deliver at 9,000 a month. And in March, we actually delivered 9,800 a month. So we've exceeded what the customer wants us to do. We are the only supplier, I think, to hit the contractually required rate at the moment. Just a quick summary of what's driving growth across the business. As Rich mentioned, the threat environment is increasing. I actually see it, there is a question on the change in government affect demand. The answer to that is not really. Demand for a business like ours is really driven by the perception of conflict. At the moment, Russian aggression, Iranian intransigence, and the potential for Chinese aggression most notably against Taiwan. All of that increases the threat environment and then governments respond by increasing spend on defense. And then in addition, we do sell into the police market. The threat of civil unrest in the U.S. and increasing gun crime also provides demand for us. We continue to drive competitive advantage through continuous improvement. We see continuous improvement as strategic because we believe that by improving every week, we create enduring competitive advantage versus our competitors, and it enables us to win more business by ensuring that we are cost competitive. We continue to expand our portfolio. Steve will talk more about that in the context of Protection, and I'll talk about it in the context of Team Wendy. We have invested a lot into the sales team recently, most notably the international sales team. And when we say international, we mean outside of North America, and we are diversifying our business into adjacencies and Steve will touch on that in a second.

Steve Elwell

Executives
#5

Okay. Thanks, Jos. So as you've already heard, quite pleasingly, Protection continued its growth journey. Revenue was 23% up, order book increased 19% pipeline ahead of us is at record levels. Just a few examples on this slide. Demand across NATO remains really strong, and we now have 16 nations purchasing the FM50 respirator under that NSPA contract. Earlier in the year, we announced a $30 million order in the Middle East. It was a new customer for our filter products. We're very, very pleased to have won 100% of the latest Department award for filters that was worth $14 million. This was the one that we announced post close of the half year period. So you can't see that reflected in our results. This program is particularly exciting as it's the first time we've secured full filter program for what is normally a dual source award. Later this year, we will launch our new digital voice protection unit, which improves speech clarity in the demanding operating environments our users operate in. You can see the pipeline on the screen. It's very strong and units are already in quite advanced trial stages with military users around the world. And then lastly, the pipeline for our next-generation power and supplied air systems looks great. We expect to receive independent European certification for our latest supplied air system fairly soon, and that will open up a broader market in the European defense market. Part of our growth strategy as well as the core I just talked about is expanding protection into the adjacent markets. In non-Chem/bio, we were delighted to secure a multiyear Canadian Armed Forces contract for MITR, which we announced this week, and we've now started to receive orders under that contract. That's the first Five Eyes nation to adopt our half mask capability, and we expect some other Five Eyes countries to do so the same fairly soon. The MITR Half Mask also achieved independent U.S. and European certification in the first half of this year, and that opens much broader law enforcement and first responder markets where that certification is required. MITR remains the only half mask that is both independently NIOSH certified and is purpose-built as a military system, which reinforces the market-leading position of this company. In integrated CBRN, we expanded the suits range and been successfully then selected to take part in competitive evaluation trials with the U.S. Department of War. So we've now got several hundred suits that have been ordered to support those trials, and we're in the process of delivering those now. That's a significant potential opportunity for us in the next fiscal year, and we're building the support of the supply chain to support any potential future ramp-up there. On boots and gloves across NATO, the contract ceiling for our NSPA contract with that product line has been increased by 50% to meet the European real demand and demonstrates the demand we have across Europe that order book for that product now runs well through until the end of 2027. Underwater, disappointingly, France did cancel their Rebreather tender with some budgetary challenges, and we expect that to recompete later in the year. However, we are working on opportunities with the Australian Navy, the U.S. Navy, the U.S. Marines and the U.K.'s Royal Navy as well as being extremely busy delivering the backlog for this product. So this slide tries to demonstrate some of the major programs we have in place, and we can see in the future. Across the top there, M50 and M53A1 are expected to remain in service with the U.S. military at scale for the foreseeable future. And we're working with the customer to simplify contracting and bring those 2 programs together. In parallel to that, we are engaged on Mid-Life Upgrades to the masks, and those are designed to materially reduce the burden on the soldier and improve their combat effectiveness -- this will create a fairly compelling upgrade path for that U.S. customer from what is now an aging M50 installed base to more modern M53-like systems. Longer term, that will position us well also for the next-generation respirator program and gives us continuity and volume visibility whilst that transition takes place. Alongside masks, we've got a number of long-term opportunities across filters, suits and as a new NATO systems program that provides an upgrade path for that growing FM50 installed base in Europe to more modern 53 and 54 masks as we go forward. And then finally for me, revolutionize is sort of longer term. We're now starting to move beyond some of those stand-alone products and really transition to be a true end-to-end CBRN ensemble provider. The Department of mask upgrade is a compelling performance enhancement, improving their combat effectiveness and will create export opportunities on the back of that program. Alongside that, our lightweight EXOSKIN suit is reducing thermal burden, improving mobility and allowing operators to stay effective for longer in the demanding combat operations that they're in. This is the type of user innovation that our customers want. And worth saying for the past 2 years, the user community has voted our suit the #1 most wanted CBRN capability during their experimentation events. We're single source on the U.S. Hood Mask Interface program, and that builds our Ensemble integration capability. And actually this week, we won the CBRN Innovation Prototype Award for that HMI solution from the Department of War. So altogether, the pipeline is building real depth across our Ensemble, and we're doing this in direct collaboration with our customers. The business has got proven execution, deep customer relationships and a very, very clear pipeline means it's well positioned to outperform the market and deliver sustainable medium-term growth. I'll hand you back to Jos.

Mark Sclater

Executives
#6

Thank you very much, Steve. So we just go back a slide actually. It's worth touching on this slide. This shows the Artemis 2 astronauts and rescuers and all of them are wearing our bump helmets and search and rescue helmets. That is obviously absolutely excellent for our credibility and very good publicity for us. One of the things that we don't maybe talk about as much as we should is we actually sell more bump helmets and search and rescue helmets into the Navy and search and rescue teams than we do ballistic helmets. And as we'll see in a minute, we're actually upgrading our portfolio. In our core ballistic and bump portfolio, demand for IHPS we see continuing in its current format for several years to come. We're expecting more orders as we go through the back end of this year. ACH demand remains very strong. We see at least the next 6 years with the continuing requirement from the U.S. Department of Defense, and we do expect more orders during this calendar year. And the pads that go into our helmets and other people's helmets, we continue to see strong demand there as well. In the commercial area, the new RIFLETECH helmet continues to get a lot of interest. And the Australian contract is performing strongly. We expect more orders under that framework contract this year. And actually, we expect a new framework contract to be signed last year in the next 5 years. And the [indiscernible] in the Middle East is driving some demand for us. We've actually had an order for our brand-new Endurance helmet where Middle Eastern customers already ordered 400 of those, and we haven't even launched it yet. So that's a good sign of things to come. This is our new recon helmet. Unfortunately, you can't actually see how cool it is in this slide as well as you can in real life. It's actually a hybrid construction of carbon fiber and polycarbonate that makes it light and also enables it to have very high impact protection. It's the first helmet we think of its type that is able to meet the blunt impact protection standards under 3 different certification requirements under combat mountaineering and White water. And that means that offices like the one on the right of this photo will no longer have to carry 2 helmets when they go on mission. In this case, you've got our bump helmet, which is combat rated and he's got someone else's helmet for climbing up a clip once he land up with helicopter, that obviously doesn't make a lot of sense and our new helmet is designed to solve that problem and will, in turn, extend our addressable market size. This is our new Endurance helmet. Also, [indiscernible] you can't see it in real life, you have to take my word for it that it looks great. This is a lightweight ballistic helmet. It's the type of helmet that SWOT teams would use. It has sold well historically, but it did not have our new and proprietary No through hole system , which means that the rails that you can see in both photos actually, on everyone else's helmet, those rails are attached by bolts that go through the helmet. That creates a weak point in the helmet, and we have demonstrated with competitors helmets that if you shoot the helmet near to those holes, the bullet can go through. We also know from extensive real-world scenarios that if a bullet goes through the shell, it is extremely bad for the user. So -- we design our helmets where we have bosses that the rails screw onto and we don't create a weakness in the ballistic properties of the shell, and we've upgraded this helmet to that technology. We do expect it to sell well going forward. We will launch it later this year, although as I mentioned, we've actually already got an order of it prelaunch. This is our contract portfolio on the helmet side. IHPS, we expect to run through to the end of 2028 in its current form and then for sustainment to continue after that. We are already working on the third generation of helmets with the Department of War, and they have ordered 100 of them of our RIFLETECH helmet, which is our commercial rifle-rated helmet. They've ordered that so they can do trials in the desert to see whether that might be suitable for the third generation. And then beyond that, we are actually working on an even higher rated helmet that can stop some of the newer ballistic threats that we're seeing in Ukraine. And we are ordering a very large press to start running trials on that. We are also working with the U.S. Department of War funded by them actually on integrating data, night vision and power onto the helmet to make a complete helmet system. That may one day involve making integrating respiratory protection with a bulletproof mask as well. The U.S. Air Force continues to buy EXFIL. We may see them moving to IHPS in the future. We continue to supply pads, and we are expecting -- we have been told, in fact, that the Australian contract will be extended all the way through to 2030 and beyond. We are interested in applying our proven skills in improving businesses to other businesses. We would be looking at things in our area. We sort of see it in 2 ways. We would like companies that help us accelerate our strategy. For example, if we can accelerate our suit development program through smaller bolt-on acquisitions, we'd be interested. And we'd also be interested in other companies in a similar space for us that we believe we could apply our recipe for improving businesses to improve them. If we could deliver the same kind of margin improvement that we've seen in our existing businesses over the last 3 years, we would be confident in creating shareholder value. That said, we don't like overpaying, -- we'll be selective if we can't find something that we think we can improve and find shareholder value, then there is a capital allocation policy in our results deck that shows that if there is spare capital, we'll return it to shareholders. This just shows our performance over the duration of our strategy, including the last 12 months. You can see that over the last 12 months, we've actually delivered our revenue growth targets, our margin targets, our ROIC targets and very nearly delivered our cash conversion target as well, and we've delivered -- in fact, we're actually better than our leverage target. That does mean that we've delivered all of our targets apart from missing cash conversion by a fraction, 18 months earlier than originally planned. So in summary, we're doing what we said we would do. In fact, we're doing it faster than we originally said we would do 18 months earlier than expected. We're in the final year of transformation, -- that does mean that cash flow is set to improve next year as the transformation programs cease. We're increasingly confident in production rates in Cleveland and margin expansion in Team Wendy. Our strengthened system goes from strength to strength and is delivering in all of our factories, and we are increasingly focused on investing into growth for the future. So with that, we'll hand over to questions.

Operator

Operator
#7

If i may just jump back in there and thank you once again to all of you for updating investors this afternoon. [Operator Instructions ] We have received a number of questions, and thank you to all of those on the call for taking the time to submit their questions. But if I may just hand back to you to read out those questions and give your responses where it's appropriate to do so. And if I pick up from you at the end, that would be great. Thank you.

Unknown Executive

Executives
#8

Okay. I'll read out the questions. So in the current market climate, are all defense stocks too expensive? Or are there potential acquisition opportunities that enhancing the current growth?

Mark Sclater

Executives
#9

I don't think we see all defense stocks is too expensive Actually, we don't see our own stock is too expensive. I think it's going to depend a bit on the sale process. We do see private equity driving the prices of some companies up to high levels. I think if something was very dilutive or not accretive to us because it's rated higher than us, then we would clearly think very carefully about that.

Unknown Executive

Executives
#10

And related to that, what particular characteristics are you looking for in M&A?

Mark Sclater

Executives
#11

Well, I think our baseline is that we want the return on capital to be higher than our cost of capital within 3 years. We do believe that in many cases, our improvement system would enable that to happen. People can see how much we've improved return on capital in the businesses that we took control of 3 years ago. And we would -- as mentioned previously really, we would be looking either at bolt-ons to accelerate our existing strategy or businesses that are close to our existing space.

Unknown Executive

Executives
#12

As Team Wendy scales, how far margins realistically progress and steady state?

Richard Cashin

Executives
#13

That's a good question. I mean Team Wendy margins in the first half of 5.4%. That doesn't really give the full story of what was going on in the first half. As we were ramping up production in the first quarter, we were taking on all the employees we needed to hit the higher production rates, but we weren't hitting the higher production rates. And so actually, Team Wendy was loss-making in the first quarter, but was materially more profitable in the second quarter. Team Wendy is quite sensitive to output rates. And actually, as we went through February and March, the level of profitability in Team Wendy was significantly closer to the group average than you might expect. I wouldn't necessarily encourage you also to model it staying at 15% for the rest of the year. But I think the consensus has us at around 10% for the full year for Team Wendy, and I think that's appropriate.

Unknown Executive

Executives
#14

Can you describe the share register, U.K. versus U.S. percentage? Is there a shift to U.S. investors?

Mark Sclater

Executives
#15

You can answer that one...

Unknown Executive

Executives
#16

So there's around 20% U.S. investors on the register at the moment. We do also have a large shareholder that's actually based in Spain. And predominantly, most of our register is based with U.K. small mid-cap as you would expect. And as we've moved into the FTSE 250 last year, we had a higher number of index funds that are buying FTSE 250 stocks as well.

Richard Cashin

Executives
#17

It's worth saying actually on that question that we are very relevant to U.S. investors. 70% of our business is in the U.S. 70% of our revenue is generated in the U.S. one way or another. And actually, when we get the opportunity, we go and speak to U.S. investors, and we always fill the slots available. So there is certainly interest on that side of the [indiscernible] .

Mark Sclater

Executives
#18

It's really a U.S. business listed in the U.K. for historic reasons.

Unknown Executive

Executives
#19

Yes. And as we get larger, we're starting to get more relevant. liquidity is always a problem with U.K. small mid-cap companies and U.S. investors. So as we get bigger, that will start to -- another question, brilliant progress. Thank you. To what extent does the erratic nature of the U.S. administration and Congress affect your ability to achieve stock turns and cash conversion you see now your improvement program nearing completion?

Mark Sclater

Executives
#20

Good question. Yes, it's been thankful in the first half, particularly in Team Wendy because the way our contracts work is we produce a lot of, say, 1,300 helmets. And then the government comes in, inspect a lot and then they randomly choose helmets that get sent to a government lab. That government lab was shut, which meant that we couldn't ship any lots during the government shutdown. And that does definitely slow down inventory tons because it lengthens the time between completing the lot and sale of the lot to the U.S. government. We hope it's in the back of U.S. government shutdowns, although nothing seems to surprise us. However, in the second shutdown, the lab was actually deemed essential, which meant that it didn't shut down in the second government shutdown. So I think there is hope that if there are further government shutdowns, the lab that we rely on, the Department will relies on will stay open, and that would increase the velocity as we would look at it from lock completion to payment.

Richard Cashin

Executives
#21

I mean it's actually an excellent question because what we really care about, as I was explaining on the cash conversion point earlier, we never try and land the balance sheet on a 6 months at the end of the reporting period. That's not a particularly effective or efficient use of our time. But what we do care about is average working capital. And as Jos said, clearly, if you're making helmets, but you're inhibited from being able to deliver them, that impacts your average working capital, which is where value can be destroyed if we're not careful. So it is an issue that we're keeping a close eye on. Hopefully, we're through it for now, but that's this space.

Unknown Executive

Executives
#22

And [indiscernible], I might need more information on your next question. The question I've got here is non-U.S. production getting closer. I'm not sure if that's related to tariffs.

Mark Sclater

Executives
#23

I think we can have a go. I mean we already manufacture masks and rebreathers in the U.K. and boots and gloves. In helmets, we only manufacture in the U.S. We do get good operational gearing by making everything in our Cleveland factory. So if we could get higher volumes and make them in Cleveland, then we would love that. However, there are customers, particularly in Europe that are interested in local production. We don't want to build a factory that doesn't have any work. But on the other hand, if we could win a program in Europe and it required European production, then we would certainly look at moving some production or a bit of our production to Europe. There is a scenario where we can mold shells in Cleveland where all the expensive capital equipment is and finish them in Europe, what we call [indiscernible] .

Operator

Operator
#24

Perfect, guys. If I may just jump back in there. Thank you very much indeed for addressing all of those questions that came in from investors this afternoon. And of course, if there are any further questions that do come through, we'll make these available to you immediately after the presentation has ended for you to review. But Jos, perhaps before really now just looking to redirect those on the call to provide you their feedback, which I know is particularly important to yourself and the company. If I could please just ask you for a few closing comments just to wrap up with, that would be great.

Mark Sclater

Executives
#25

Well, I wasn't expecting closing comments. I mean I think -- I mean, 3 years ago, we set out to radically improve this business. The team you see in front of you and gas is behind the camera. We have developed a strategy to improve the business, and we delivered on the strategy to improve the business, and we've actually done it faster than we thought. We now think the business is very well positioned to grow organically going forward, and we're going to focus on investing into new product development and driving growth as fast as we can.

Operator

Operator
#26

Perfect, Josh. That's great. And thank you once again to all of you for updating investors this afternoon. Could I please ask investors not to close this session as you'll now be automatically redirected for the opportunity to provide your feedback in order that the management team can better understand your views and expectations. On behalf of the management team of Avon Technologies Plc, we would like to thank you for attending today's presentation. That now concludes today's session. So good afternoon to you all.

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