Azimut Holding S.p.A. (AZM) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Good afternoon. This is the Chorus Call conference operator. Welcome, and thank you for joining the Azimut Holding update on 20 years since listing and presentation of new project conference call. [Operator Instructions] At this time, I would like to turn the conference over to Mr. Pietro Giuliani, Chairman of Azimut Holdings. Please go ahead, sir.

Thank you very much, indeed. Good afternoon to everybody. Thanks for being here. We are at the 20th year since our going public, and I'll start at Page #3, starting by the customer. In the last 20 years, since 1995, we have overcome the Fideuram Index of about 32%. I mean 1% per year, long 28 years. Page #4, since our IPO, we have a Bloomberg total return of about 15x the invested capital at the beginning of our equity story. As you can see, all the competitors of ours are below the second quite a half and so on, the third, et cetera. You see that we have about 1,500% vis-a-vis the Italian index of 150%, 10x the index of Italian Stock Exchange. Page #5, if we give a look to the main financial institutions in Italy, I mean Mediobanca, Intesa Sanpaolo, Generalia Assicurazioni, our over performance is very amazing, 20 years, 15x the invested capital. This is our figures, and we are very happy to have this year -- 20 years in this way. Page #6. Among the FTSE MIB stocks, we are rank #3. Before us, we have Interpump, an industrial company and Recordati, a pharma company. We are the third stock inside FTSE MIB in the last 20 years since our IPO. Page #7. Let's give a look to the last 5 years, adding the net inflows, I regard net inflows as an index of capability of Azimut and the competitors of ours to deliver growth. Well, in the last 5 years, we are ranked #2 EUR 1.6 billion under the #1. And if we jump to Page 8, and we regard the same companies following the criteria of net profit in the last 5 years, we are again ranked #2 following Mediolanum. A consideration that I would like to share with you in this 20 years birthday, we are ranked 2 in terms of growth, in terms of net profit during the last 5 years. Our value according to our actual capitalization is #4. Maybe I have lost something about my know-how in terms of mathematics calculations. Jokes apart. Let's give a look to the last Slide. I mean the net profit of our competitors that are banks, I mean Banca Generali, Fineco Bank, Mediolanum Bank, well, they have an increasing of 50% on average year-on-year, mainly due to carry trade by interest margin, collective money by cash account. Well, we can't only see and comment this growth in terms of net profit is because of it that we propose to the market, and we are just working. About the spin-off, you read something in our press release. Last page of my presentation, #9, by transforming part of network, let's say, roughly speaking, half of our Italian network. In a bank, we could intercept the interest margin through deposit, which is today outside of Azimut perimeter. So we may reach our perimeter, including this interest margin. Spinning off a new bank and lease them to have EUR 1.8 billion to EUR 2.2 billion of value adding to our value because we foresee under EUR 160 million in terms of net profit after 1 year the creation of this new bank. I thank you again for the attention and for participation to our birthday. I give the floor to my colleagues. I mean the 2 CEOs of Azimut, Paolo Martini, that will be the CEO of the new bank and Gabriele Blei that will explain you how Azimut Holding will be not changed and will go on for the next 20 years to make at least 15x the value we have today. Good afternoon to everybody. Gabriele, please.

Thank you, Pietro. Good to have you on the mic after many years. As you have seen in-- at the beginning of the presentation, there is a very specific disclaimer. This has been agreed with our advisers, legal and nonlegal, the stock exchange as well as the authorities. And I want to stress this because it is important first and we, at the same time, believed that it was important to inform you, our shareholders alongside our financial adviser to whom the project has been outlined this morning during our 20th birthday celebration. So let's start from Slide 11, and this is something you are very familiar with. It's a snapshot we have presented to you with the full year results, 2023, the typical vertical that we have. And given the transaction of today, we will focus on Italy only. And you can remember that we generated EUR 334 million of adjusted net profit in the full year 2023. Italy accounts for EUR 37 billion of assets as well as EUR 7 billion of assets under custody. And on top of all this, we have EUR 4 billion coming from the private markets product that has been raised by our financial adviser network in Italy. Still in Italy, we have 241,000 customers, and this is served by a network of 800-- sorry, 1,837 financial advisers with roughly speaking, 255 employees. In the next couple of slides, so Slide 12 and Slide 13, we will describe the perimeter and the key points of the project that we announced this morning. So what is the project about? In the first phase, we will transfer into a NewCo, a selected perimeter of our Italian distribution which will include no less than EUR 20 billion of assets and no more than EUR 25 billion and about 1,000 financial advisers as well as up to 50 Italian employees. Moreover, some fintech activities that Paolo will elaborate later on will be transferred as well. The objective is to create a digital banking platform with banking license that will allow the NewCo to collect deposits and benefit from net interest margin, as was mentioned before. It is important to mention that Azimut ex. NewCo, so ex the perimeter that will be transferred, will maintain about EUR 20 billion to EUR 25 billion in total assets and about 850 financial advisers in Italy, the entire asset management platform and all the international activities and the other fintech businesses. Lastly, the first phase involves finding a banking financial partner that will take up to a stake of 50% in NewCo to drive further growth and support the development of the digital banking platform. Moving to Slide 13. The second phase of the project is expected to spin off and finally list the new entity on the stock exchange in Italy, with Azimut holding less than 10% in this NewCo and less than 10% is because Azimut Holding will not become a bank nor will be subject to Bank of Italy regulatory framework. And we'll continue to act as we are -- have been acting for the last 20 years being listed in 35 years of history. A key feature of this project will be a binding long-term partnership agreement that will last for 20 years between the product factory of Azimut and the NewCo that will grant access to the entire product suite of Azimut for the client of the NewCo, who will also have access to third-party products. So effectively, they will distribute Azimut products, both private and public as well as third-party products. Management fees and admin fees and other fees will be in line with the current fee structure. And Azimut will pay a rebate to the distribution network of NewCo equal to 80% of the fixed management fee. And this is, again, something you have heard us saying even in the case of the UniCredit transaction. Another key feature of this long-term agreement is that NewCo has a commitment with Azimut to maintain at least the same level of gross revenues that are being generated today by the assets that will be transferred. NewCo will be a growth company and is expected to strongly expand its financial adviser base and to double our assets in the next 5 years as well as net profit, but Paolo will provide more insights into this shortly. Moving to the next slide. This is simply an illustrative example. It is not by all means what may occur in the end, but we wanted to simplify or oversimplify into an example what could be a potential structure and the perimeter of this structure of the project. So in the first place, there is going to be a spin-off with the stake of the banking partner in this NewCo up to 50%. And the remaining part will be held by Azimut in this phase. This is a pre-IPO, then with the IPO, Azimut would potentially hold no less than 10% of this entity. Moving to Slide 15. The rationale behind this project is attractive for various reasons and from the many different point of view. First, it is attractive for any player that we'll have from day 1 access to a strong distribution network with about 1,000 financial advisers in Italy. Any other acquisition in the market, if available, wouldn't take probably a much higher cash outlay and will not benefit from the capabilities of the Azimut Global Management Team across public and private markets that come as part of the 20-year agreement. At the same time, this agreement provides for continuity for a recurring fee stream for Azimut and its shareholders and provides potential further -- for further upside through the growth of the new bank. So we have basically floored the revenues that Azimut today is generating, which will not translate into a potential loss for Azimut ex. NewCo as far as revenues are concerned. Paolo will describe in much more detail in a second, the NewCo, how it will leverage the banking license across various dimensions from net interest margin to recruitment of financial advisers and grow assets and profits over the next 5 years. Furthermore, it will also replicate the partnership model that has been a key pillar of Azimut's success by allowing financial adviser to participate in the capital of the new venture. This ties into with the next slide, which you have already seen and basically shows the value creation of Azimut over the last 20 years. Consider that a good or if not more than 50% of the people within Azimut Holding shareholders' agreement are financial advisers and those financial advisers that have invested have benefited from this appreciation of their investment. And this is what we will be focusing on delivering within the new bank as well. Turning to my last slide, let me reiterate again that this transaction is value accretive for Azimut and its shareholders. First, the proceeds of the transaction can be significant. And second, part of these proceeds can be expected to be reinvested into growing the platform within Azimut further. Third, as already discussed, the growth of NewCo will positively impact Azimut as well. As far as Azimut is concerned, it will continue to remain independent and listed with Timone Fiduciaria, so the people that work in Azimut as key shareholder. Moreover, we will continue to operate without a banking license within Azimut Holding. And we will pursue growth across the various strategy that we have discussed over the last years within our business model. This includes distribution activities in Italy, which will account for on 850 financial advisers initially after the transfer of the perimeter. The entirety of the global asset management platform, so all the development within the public markets that we have done as well as more recently since 2019, the focus on our private market initiative in Italy and outside of Italy. The partnership that we have signed last year-- sorry, December 2022 with UniCredit, which has just started in its execution phase from January 2024. All the international operations, so the entire development of the business outside of our domestic markets will remain within Azimut Holding, and we hope to be able to demonstrate that there is significant value not reflected yet very soon. And lastly, all the fintech and the corporate and investment banking activities. The EUR 500 million bond remains in Azimut. And as we have mentioned a couple of weeks ago during the full year results presentation, will be repaid in December 2024, making us basically debt free by year-end. Paolo to whom I turn the floor will lead the new bank and will provide you further details.

Thank you, Gabriele. Good evening, everybody. What I'm going to present today is the potential future project that has been announced this morning to our 2,000 financial advisers as well as to the press and will be submitted to the supervisory authorities for approval once the [ contra ] parties are identified and the relevant technicalities defined. So today, we are presenting a general picture of the deal. Clearly, we will be more precise about the numbers and details of the deal in the near future. Slide #19, once the approval process is complete, the new bank would be a listed digital bank, also owned by financial advisers, which will provide the retail and private banking services to all the financial advisers of the Azimut Group, that pending its offering. So we complete our offer. Slide #20, let me give you an overview of the main reasons underlying this project. First, since we are not a bank, we have missed all the revenues that over the past years has been generated by the net interest income. When considering our listed competitors in the Italian market, this account for 20% to 40%, 50%, even more of the total net revenues. As you can see in the slide, this is a source of revenues that we can't miss any longer. Secondly, our aim is to accelerate our growth in Italy and generate renewals enthusiasm among our financial advisers. Next slide. Moving to our future potential in terms of growth on the deposit segment, it's worth noting that today, Azimut Group has only 2% in deposits, while our main competitors show at least 10x as much from 2% to 23%. If we change our strategy and focus also on current accounts, we could come to an estimated EUR 7.5 billion, EUR 10 billion in the future, thanks to more than 230,000 clients in light with the share of our main competitors. Moving to Slide #22. To dive deep into the reasons why we have decided to start this new project, I can say that our first target is to generate added value for clients, shareholders, financial advisers and employees while unlocking our full potential. We also intend to involve and engage our financial advisers in a new, challenging project, exactly as Azimut did 20 years ago when it got listed while simultaneously revamping Azimut funding principles, independence, innovation, ownership and partnership. A further reason results from our desire to grow remarkably and constantly in order to become more attractive to both customers and advisers. We're becoming a digital bank, we aim to grow in terms of both retail and private clients and consequently, accelerate what Azimut started in the past. Last but not least, we will be in a position to leverage synergies and benefit from the agreement with the potential new institutional partners once identified, which allow us to improve our positioning in the market and grow both scale and culturally while further extending our offering to customers. Moving to Slide #23. The macro factors that will allow us to stand apart from our competitors include our broad-based ownership, our fintech-based model, which will be financial adviser centered, our multifamily office model and our focus on the real economy and digital corporate services, which has considerably boosted Azimut's growth over the past years. Naturally, we will also benefit from the support provided by Azimut Holding and more precisely from their global team for private and public markets with the platform implemented in the past from their pensions and insurance services where Azimut is leading in terms of quality and products as well as from the corporate and fintech ecosystem. With Slide #24, let me also give you some further color on our future business guidelines. The new structure will present 2 networks, a Financial Adviser's Network and Wealth Management Network. Investments will be massively growth and business-oriented, which will bring in new customers and new financial advisers. We are also going to increase the operational support that will be provided to both advisers and clients. Another competitive advantage will be offered by the widespread active participation of financial advisers in the life of the company, which has always been at the heart of Azimut's strategy, in combination with an innovative 360-degree communication strategy and a strong focus on teamwork and training. Turning to the next slide with regard to the main differentiation factors, the financial advisers' network will focus on banking services, mutual funds, insurance products, capital accumulation plans and pension funds. Whereas the wealth management network will concentrate on teamwork, private markets and corporate, multifamily office and then wealth management services. Both teams will profit from the support and the global services of the new bank as well as from the integration with Azimut Global Team specializing in public and private markets. If you look at the Slide #26, based on the above segmentation, our target is to divide our sales force, as just Gabriele said, in 2. With the new bank, we expect to reach EUR 20 billion, EUR 25 billion and 1,000 financial advisers and wealth managers. While Azimut Group in Italy will count on 850 financial advisers and wealth managers and EUR 20 billion, EUR 25 billion. The financial advisers will be selected based on the qualitative and quantitative criteria with the goal of preserving Azimut profitability on one hand and on the other, meeting the demand of those financial advisers who want to leverage the banking license. The geographical division is not planned. Let me now turn to our growth target for 2025-2029 in Slide #27. Depending on the starting scope, which we estimate at EUR 20 billion, EUR 25 billion total asset and the banking or financial partnership will be able to finalize. We expect our net inflows from the asset management, insurance, custody and advisory services to reach EUR 16 billion, EUR 19 billion and liquidity and deposits to come to EUR 7.5 billion, EUR 10 billion by 2029, which will put us in line with our main competitors. We expect to reach EUR 50 billion and hire 500 new financial advisers and world managers by 2029. This will let us double our figures in 5 years exactly as Azimut did in the past. Our drivers recruiting between 2013, 2017, we have already done this kind of growth in Italy. Also, and then we have the boost of the 200% per share allocated to our financial advisers for 5 years. So for recruiting part of the business, this is really important because this is something disruptive on the Italian market. Internal motivation and enthusiasm, this is so important for the new project for financial advisers and then positive spill-over from the banking license. Slide #28. As I already pointed out, our broad-based ownership has always been one of our strong competitive advantages. The slide shows that for the first 5 years, 2% of the shares per year will be allocated to the Financial Advisers/Managers employed at the date of the launch and recruited from the market on the basis of meritocratic standards. The shares will fall under a new shareholders' agreement exactly with the same rules established in the Timone agreement. We have always been able to develop resource and effectively match them with opportunities that created value over time. Slide #29, considering the increase of Azimut's stock and the dividends distributed, whoever, among our financial adviser, has invested EUR 100,000 at the time of our IPO in 2004, will now have EUR 1.5 million. Let me just conclude with Slide #30, by saying that with this project, we aim to create a fintech bank designed for growth based on an innovative fintech platform fully devoted to our financial advisers and focused on banking, wealth management and multifamily office services. While developing new distribution channels across Europe, we're going to start from Spain and persistently focusing on growth. This brings me to the end of my presentation. Thank you for your kind attention. I give the floor to Gabriele for the Q&A session. Thank you.

[Operator Instructions] The first question is from Giovanni Razzoli with Deutsche Bank.

That is really brave and ambitious plan. I have a couple of very top-down question, if I may, because there are a lot of details that would be probably clarified in the future. Can you share with us what's the timing for the partner of the NewCo? What is the time frame that you have in mind for this partnership? And looking at what you've written about the value of the NewCo that is EUR 1.8 billion to EUR 2.2 billion, shall we look at this as a benchmark for the deal with the partner? Second question, can you please clarify what you mean with the commitment to maintain the same level of combined revenues between Azimut ex and NewCo? What shall we -- how shall we read this? And the third question, don't you see a risk that there will be a little bit of disruption between your financial adviser network because I presume that there will be a lot of them that would like to join the NewCo because of the upside that is here. So how do you plan to manage this? And are there any kind of potential of conflicts between the clients and the business development on the NewCo and Azimut ex?

Thank you, Giovanni. So coming from -- on the first question, timing of the partner. We have, as you may imagine, ongoing discussions with several potential interested partners at different stages. We hope that at least one of them will be finalized and will be on board at the NewCo level with the stake, as we mentioned before, up to 50%. From our point of view, this is a project that will be done, executed and delivered regardless of the timing of other interested partners. So we have, as you all know, a very strong mindset on completing projects, reaching targets within very specific timing. And even in this case, the aim is to go as quickly as we can, bearing in mind that there are regulatory approvals that will be ahead of us. But timing-wise, we hope to be up and running in the next 6 to 12 months. As far as the value that you mentioned and we have disclosed to you, it is, yes, a benchmark, then as in any negotiation, there can be some sort of flexibility, but we don't expect very significant values given that we believe this NewCo perimeter has very strong potential. As far as the revenue commitment, it means exactly what we stated. If today, the perimeter generates [ x ] of revenue, this is the [ x ] that will be guaranteed for 20 years. Then the NewCo will have the potential to use third-party products as well as grow the asset base, and we might suspect that if they are happy with our performance and product suite, they will continue to use our products in part at least, even in the future. For the FA network and the disruption, I will turn to Paolo. I think we all have very strong knowledge on how to manage these kind of aspects, having managed financial adviser network for the last 30-plus years of our professional career, but Paolo.

Thank you, Gabriele. Yes. As Gabriele said, we have a lot of knowledge about managing sales force in Italy and financial advisers. So I don't see any particular risk even because we have to consider that all our financial advisers are shareholders. And so we have the same interest. So this is something important. It's something more that we have to consider. Then we will sell the same product and services at the end. So this is another important thing that we have to consider. And then in Azimut Group, Azimut Holding remains all the asset management business, as you know, how it is important for our financial advisers because the strong integration between asset management and distribution is our key point. So at the end, I think that we will have a equilibrate division from the 2 network. And so I don't see any kind of particular problems.

Maybe just let me add one aspect, which is important. As you are all aware, Azimut has 1,850 financial advisers. And this translates into a very, very minor share in terms of market share of the Italian wealth, which is probably 0.6%. Within the Assogestioni data, we account for 2% or roughly more than that. So I suspect that there is plenty of room to keep growing within 2 different organization that will meet different characteristics in terms of financial advisers and products and services that will be available. Consider on top of all this, that if the 850 financial advisers that will stay within Azimut will also be able to promote the banking products of the NewCo.

The next question is from Alberto Villa with Intermonte SIM.

I have several questions, but most of them probably it's too early to ask. So I will just ask you till like strategic guidelines in addition to what you already said. One is on the kind of partner you're looking for. Is there any, let's say, ideal partner that could add to the project? So would it be an industrial one or more a financial one that could help the project to accelerate and have the success you are aiming for? The second one is on the features of the digital bank. Have you in mind anything different from what we have on the market I mean now, or it would be a rather, let's say, simple in terms of banking services offering? Are you looking at, for example, having also brokerage or things like that to accelerate the growth? And if I'm not mistaken considering the number of financial advisers in the assets, it seems that you think in the new project will be mostly moving the financial advisers with lower assets under management. So I was wondering if that is correct. And I guess, you have now EUR 7 billion of assets under custody in the Italian operations. The more it goes on the new platform, probably more is put at work for you to having a carry frame. My final question is on the recruitment. Do you think this project will be specifically more attractive for certain kind of professionals in the market and why?

Thank you for your question. About partner, I think the fast one and the more committed because for us, it's very important to be fast because we really believe that this project can be a big game changer in the market in Italy. And for us, maybe a banking and finance partner could be better at this stage. The second question about the platform, we are looking for any different kind of platforms. There are now new -- a lot of opportunities in Italy or maybe better in Europe. But at this stage, we don't -- we have limited information, so we will provide a more detailed update as the situation becomes more clearer. And about network, we will have both the retail and FA network, so we would like to help our financial advisers with the more easy products. So to sell a saving account, it's easier to sell a venture capital product -- venture capital products. But we will have both. Also the wealth management side of our business is absolutely in line with our general guidelines, the multifamily office approach, wealth management approach, corporate and the private markets are really in line. So we will have both. So this is the reason why we decided to divide our network in 2 parts. And for recruitment, I think that we will be absolutely attractive for many kinds of bankers. The top bankers, so the bank is focused on ultra-high net clients. So we just started with our recruitment process many years ago. So we'll continue to develop this kind of business and shares would help us to change in the market because 200% shares per year is absolutely an important amount that means EUR 40 million, EUR 50 million a year dedicated to our financial advisers. And then I think also financial adviser from some of our main competitors that want to follow a new project, a new idea that is 100% Azimut made.

Okay. If I can just go back one moment on the decision of who is going to move to one -- the new platform and who is going to stay with Azimut as it is today? Is there any cutoff in terms of the size of the assets under management or anything that could help us understanding how the process will work or -- you have presented the project today to the network. Is that -- I mean, any way we can understand how someone will move or not to the new digital bank?

Yes, we presented today the project, and I think that they have more or less 1 month to indicate their preference for the one project or the other. But at the end, it will be Azimut's the decision. And I believe that for many financial advisers will be the same. So I think that at the end, maybe they decided to stay in Azimut or to go into new fintech bank. And we will wait at the end of April to take our final decision. There are some bankers, some financial advisers that are very close to this project, in particular the wealth management side and also some young financial advisers that can be absolutely in line with our project and then there would be a part of financial adviser that will take the final decision talking with their manager in line with our general guidelines. But I think that at the end, we will find equilibrium and so we will divide our network in 2 without any particular risk or any particular problems.

Let me just add one thing, Alberto, which is very important for us. We will not tolerate any internal fights nor behavior that are not aligned with the fact of continuing to grow both entities and creating value for shareholders. Bear in mind that financial advisers will and are shareholders in Azimut as well as potentially, as Paolo was mentioning before, will become shareholders also in the...

The next question is from Lam Hubert with Bank of America.

I've got 3 of them. Firstly, can you discuss the setup costs for the NewCo, the cost of getting a license, how much capitalization is needed for the NewCo? And can you let's know who's going to provide these upfront costs? The second question is, again, on the bank offering in the NewCo just wondering how -- I assume most of your -- the inflows you would expect to come to the new bank would be from existing clients. But like how much confidence do you have that your existing client base would shift from their existing relationships over to the new bank? And like what edge do you have in banking? And the last question is around, again, about the hiring of advisers. On the slides, you talked about increasing your adviser head count by 50% or an additional 500 in the NewCo. I think you discussed a bit about why you think it's attractive. But if you look over the last year, your advisers headcount in Italy has been relatively flat year-on-year. And I know it's a very competitive environment, too, with other competitors like Medicobanca also trying to get more financial advisers. How confident are you in terms of increasing your headcount by 50% over the next 5 years in the new bank?

Thank you, Hubert. I will leave on the last couple of questions to Paolo. As far as the setup cost of NewCo, as you are by now accustomed with our approach, it will be extremely light, and we are not expecting to incur cost already day 1 without having firstly clarify the plan, the partner, the structure and so on and so forth. So we're not expecting nothing major or significant to be on Azimut Holding P&L, if this is the question. And as Paolo was mentioning over time, we do expect to have significant synergies among the 2 entities on a number of different products as well as services for the benefit of both entities. I'll leave Paolo on the other 2.

Thank you, Gabriele. For banking offering, we are so confident because our financial advisers have so strong relationship with our clients. As you know, Azimut has never focused on current accounts. They also account in a negative way for the balance sheet to our financial advisers. So now we completely changed our strategy. And so I'm quite sure that from to 2% to 23%, that is our share main competitor in terms of deposit segment, we will increase because the relationship to our financial advisers are so strong. Until now, we didn't take any kind of focus on this world. About hiring, I know that over the past 12 months, we were more focused on revenues and less on the growth side of the business. But now with this new project, this would be a growth company, really focused on growth. We have the capabilities to hire people because the project is very innovative. The bank will complete our offer and can also help our managers to recruit new financial advisers. And so I'm quite confident that we can start again growing as we have just did in the past, as I told you in 10 years ago in the 5 years 2013, 2017, we exactly initially collected more than EUR 16 billion. We've just done this 10 years ago. It's a question of focus. The new bank will be absolutely focused on the growth on the recruiting on new clients. And so I think that we can replicate the results that we have just done in -- 10 years ago more or less.

The next question is from Filippo Prini with Kepler.

A couple of questions. Firstly, as a Azimut Holding, what Azimut Holding will plan to do with the cash that it will receive from selling the stake to the banking partner or if you want, making the listing of almost 100% of the capital of the NewCo if a new banking partner will not be found? And second, a financial adviser that will become shareholders of the NewCo up to 10% in 5 years could be -- could remain also in Timone as shareholders of Azimut Holding.

Thank you, Filippo. As far as the proceeds -- the potential proceeds from this transaction, which we expect to be of a significant size, first and foremost, this is done to unlock value to strategically catch growth sector and in a segment of the business that we were out for specific reasons. As Paolo was mentioning, this will attract significant people over time. Azimut Holding with the proceeds has many options. We'll discuss internally on how to allocate this. But as you have seen in the past us doing, we invest in the business, we remunerate shareholders. And if there is going to be the opportunity, we will be buying back shares. One aspect is important. We will be debt free by year-end. So there is not going to be this burden anymore. And this is a business and a company that does not consume or require too much capital to be run. So as some may have a doubt on our capabilities to have this cash, I think the cash is there. It's allocated across several businesses and initiatives. It is invested into growing the business, and this is what will drive us also in the future. As far as the financial advisers, I leave it to Paolo.

Yes, the financial advisers that will move to the NewCo will -- they can maintain shares of Azimut Group, and I think that they will maintain these shares. So I think that will continue to be absolutely connected because at the end, the DNA is in Azimut DNA and also relationship and business are absolutely connected.

[Operator Instructions]

Well, thank you very much for your attention. Thank you for being and staying with us even just ahead of Easter. We do apologize for the short notice with which we convened this presentation, but we thought it was important for all of us to be able to share some thoughts. We will definitely remain available for any further follow-ups, and we will keep you posted in the coming months and quarters. Happy Easter to all of you and your families and talk to you soon. Bye-bye.

Ladies and gentlemen, thank you for joining. The conference is now over. You may disconnect your telephones.