Baltic Horizon Fund (NHCBHFFT) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Hello. Good afternoon. This is Tarmo Karotam, Fund Manager of Baltic Horizon Fund, and I would like to invite you to the webinar of the fourth quarter of 2024 and give a regular update of the fund and also about some subsequent events that have also taken place in 2025. During the webinar, we'll try to, as usual, answer some of the questions or most of them, hopefully all of the questions that we've received from investors. So let us get started. So this is a slide that we have internally developed about a year and a bit more time ago, just to set our new goals very concretely, what are the key aspects in our life, and we continue to follow these goals. There's been questions around it. So I will try to a little bit elaborate on these goals from that perspective. So first of all, when this document went out, we had devised a strategy were going forward into the future, we'd like to focus on central mixed-use Modern City Life assets and as well governmental and strong governmental and social tenants as we have many of that in the portfolio today. So I think that strategy is very much still intact, and we consider strong tenants in the social and governmental field very important for our portfolio going forward. So perhaps also lately, we've begun to emphasize that even more together with the Modern City Life strategy. Now when it comes to the occupancy goal and I will explain that also throughout the presentation, that we had the occupancy goal of 90%. We have now set the new goal for June 95%. Yes, we're not yet at 90% as of end of last year. And it was an ambitious goal and there's various thoughts. Some say that we should not set so ambitious goals for us. And there are also investors that say that why don't you have 100% goal. So for us, we want these goals to be still very ambitious and for the team to follow for our property management and leasing partners to follow. So that is why we're setting higher goals than perhaps one would expect. But we are very close to 90%. I will talk a bit more about that in the coming slides. And we do have reason to believe that 95% by midyear is also achievable with a lot of hard work. Now the net operating income goal of EUR 18 million. And so first of all, let me just elaborate where that goal came from. So we did analyze all of our properties and so what is the potential of these properties and how long it will take to realize that potential. So the combination of the potential of all of our properties, we saw that was at EUR 18 million of NOI is the, let's say, the high level which could be achieved by 2027 with attracting new tenants to the properties, making investments from the landlord side, but also from the tenant side. So these take time. But we still consider EUR 18 million to be again achievable with a lot of hard work along with the occupancy goal. Now there's been a question that why do you have this goal still when you're planning to dispose some assets. And hereby, I can only say that this is the potential that we are setting our targets on and also the targets for the property managers and leasing managers. So yes, if we do sell a property, then we have to revise this potential because the property is not anymore in our portfolio. But until then, we do keep this as a target for the overall portfolio. And we do have to also look into the cost base. One side is the income side, the other side is the cost, which is cost of debt, which is high for us. And eventually, what we need to achieve is the net cash flow for our investors. Currently with high-interest rate bond, the net proceeds that are left -- that are left from operations are to the benefit of the bond investors and we want to also change that picture this year as much as possible. So moving to definitely and emphasizing for this year the 50% loan-to-value target. Maybe general remark about last year specifically and perhaps the past couple of years, it's been tough times for us. As you have also noticed, one thing is to manage our income side. The other is to manage our debt side and to manage our cash flows while paying back the bond. So there's been quite a bit of refinancing of our different properties in order to free up cash for reducing the bond, but also for fit-out investments. So there's a lot of financial planning that has happened over the past couple of years in that regard. And I think we have -- as we have noted some time ago that to reduce the bond and get the fund back to the stable net cash flow positive situation, we are looking at various avenues. One is getting some support from the equity investors, which we did last year with a small private placement, then refinancing many of our loans and then through disposals. So I think this year will be -- the focus will be on some selective disposals in order to reduce the LTV as through the refinancing activity last year, we have actually increased the LTV, but I'll come back to that topic a bit later. So -- but overall, these are the key targets that we have for this year. And of course, energy efficiency and GRESB ratings continue to be as well very high on our agenda. Moving forward now to the KPI table and there's some progress there. Of course, as we knew and expected the last year, and especially last quarters were still quite challenging for us. Now here, the occupancy that is in this table is based on tenants who have already moved in and who are in our premises who are paying rent. So it's a net result of tenants who have exited the properties, but also tenants that have moved in. So there's some gradual improvement there. And also, I think one thing to be content about is that we have kept our average rent level quite stable. So it's -- for vacancies, it's tough negotiations to find, first of all, operators and tenants that are suitable for our concept, but then also to find a business case where the rent level is attractive both for the tenant and the landlord and where investments are also managed so that it is feasible for both parties and from our perspective, of course, for the landlord. In terms of the NOI, then it has also remained pretty much the same compared to the third quarter, but we do expect that to increase now in 2025. As I mentioned, the total debt has actually increased through refinancing, and this goes together also with the average cost of debt. There's been a question about debt as well, how did it increase where Euribor is actually decreasing. So the main answer there is that when our key properties, Europa, Galerija and Postimaja Coca-Cola Plaza are going through some transformation and still in Postimaja Plaza, Apollo is moving in and some tenants upgrading in Galerija, we still have also tenants moving in some vacancy, Europa the same. So to achieve actually higher, let's say, debt levels, LTVs in the refinancing process, which we needed for the fit-out program that we have, then the average margin increased in this process, especially for these properties that is reflected here. The plan and strategy here is, of course, at some point, go back to the financing market and with the fully let properties when tenants have moved in and the NOI history is already there to refinance the properties once again at lower levels, lower margins. But since we -- yes, we wanted to have more liquidity and get higher loans for some of our properties then in order to pay back the more expensive bond and also for our fit-out program, then this is visible from the fourth quarter. We are working on that. It's a key metric that we understand, and we know that it needs to decrease and we have a clear plan how to do it during this year. The fit-out sales continue to be a cash outflow for us. And overall, I think the deals that we have achieved with the tenants are overall quite attractive since in many cases, we have contributed as a landlord quite a minimal amount and still achieving attractive rent levels for the contract. An overview of our key properties and tenants. So -- and we do have many governmental tenants in our portfolio and expect to also have International School of Riga in our portfolio later this year when they are moving in. Some more information about then the process when it comes to leasing. So just some numbers that throughout the year, we signed new leases worth almost EUR 3 million and for more than 22,000 square meters. So there's a lot of active work going on there together with our partners at Newsec and Colliers. And our team together with our partners, I believe that has been a good cooperation. So I think we're happy to continue with the same partners and same leasing managers. So as you can see, 61 new tenants were attracted to our properties and with 69 tenants, we extended the lease agreement. There has been as well tenants were moved out, but then they have been replaced as the market continues to be relatively, let's say, uncertainty in the market and that influences some of the decisions of the tenants. But overall, we're net positive based on these actual numbers. Now I've emphasized here and just to emphasize once more that we do calculate different occupancy numbers. They are also in the report with explanations. But the standard occupancy, which is based on the handover date is 82.1% as of end of the year. But as this is such an important metric for us and we need to understand what are the goals and where we can be and where we shall be based on the signed leases that are not yet working for us, the tenants have not moved in, so we are calculating as well the occupancy based on the signed leases. And we also have a figure based on signed leases and the LOIs. So we see what is the probability, what's the probable in occupancy that we think will be in our portfolio in this coming quarters and throughout this year. So the latest calculations show that with the signed leases, we are at 88.5% as of today. So many tenants are still moving in and Apollo being one of them, then we have the school, which has not yet moved in. Narbutas in Meraki has moved in as of January this year. And MyFitness has moved in as of basically yesterday, the grand opening in Galerija Centrs took place yesterday and with a lot of people. So very, very happy about that. And furthermore, there is a new anchor lease, which has just been signed as well yesterday for Europa and more information there will be provided shortly. So we are still very much prioritizing the occupancy figure and getting the best deal with the tenants that we feel that are sustainable for our concept and also work as a business case. Now more specifically about perhaps each property. So in Lincona currently situation is quite stable. The State Information Authority had expanded last year, and we do have as well some small prospects to fill in the ground floor vacancy now in the coming quarters. With Lincona, we are also preparing for Swedbank who is moving out next year in 2026 and trying to find replacement tenants for those premises. So the active work is already ongoing for that. With Sky, let's say, overall, the property is quite stable. And -- but we're also brainstorming how to find, let's say, improvements in the tenant mix. There's one -- it's a private, small, let's say, beauty salon/clinic who is looking for some expansion. So some small work is also going on in Sky to upgrade the tenant mix and to find even stronger tenants from the market. Coca-Cola Plaza, the cinema building, I think it's quite clear we have finalized all the contracts. It is fully leased out. Northern Horizon had a small office in a cinema building as well. But since Apollo needed those premises, so we have even moved out from the property and had those premises also leased out to Apollo as additional office. So we expect them to open the first concept in the spring. And actually, the lease agreement has already taken effect as of February, so partially. So we should also see some small improvement in the NOI numbers in the coming months. And the second part of the concept will be opened in -- most likely in the summer -- late summer. The works are fully in motion at their end, and they are fully refurbishing the ground floor in order to have the ultimate concept of entertainment and social activities there. So we're quite happy about the progress. In Europa, then the challenge has been to find an anchor tenant for the third floor. And actually, there are 2 important tenants that we expect to come -- important names expect to come to the property. So I think there will be news in the coming, I would say, weeks about both of them. So that the moving in time line is not fully finalized yet, but also we expect that to happen at the later part of this year. So -- but what else I can comment is that the restaurants are being opened on the ground floor, preparations are in final stage, and they should also now be opened by spring. So let's say, the actual occupancy today is 80%, but we see that based on the signed leases, when everybody has moved in into their place, the fit-out works have been finalized, then occupancy would be above 90%. So we've definitely made some progress in Europa. And we wanted to, let's say, achieve this already at the end of the fourth quarter, but for various reasons, this has been postponed somewhat, but still also happy to see that the elections that took place in the United States, which have overall, I think let's say, injected some confusion and perhaps uncertainty to the markets, especially in Europe and perhaps also especially in Eastern Europe, then we do see companies still working relatively business as usual. So big tenants, international names, international brands are still doing business and thinking about their activities on a long-term basis. So I wouldn't say that I haven't witnessed anything drastic there in the minds of these decision-makers. In Upmalas Biroji, there's currently limited development. We did welcome a kindergarten there. There is a pipeline of tenants where we're working on in various sizes from 100 square meters to 2,000 square meters, but we haven't yet landed any of those tenants. This is a police building, but work continues, and it continues to also be our priority since the building is well fitted out and I think it will be suitable for a good office tenant. And yes, in regards to Pirita, stable overall and there is also one new anchor tenant that we are negotiating with to improve the tenant mix, but that's too early to comment at this point. Property remains almost fully let and the key anchors, Rimi and MyFitness have prolonged their contracts last year and we're quite happy about that. S27, our school property works are going well. We also had a meeting yesterday in Riga. Works are actually going better than planned. There is quite a bit of also technical work, drawings, also changing or, let's say, upgrading the use of the property and we also had good cooperation with Riga City. The tenant is very excited, very happy to see that they're investing themselves into the outdoor areas with different ball courts. And what I can also say about S27 is that for the vacancy, we have also interest from all kinds of different tenants from education sector, from medical sector. We've signed up basically 2 small ones currently, let's say, a couple of 100 square meters, maybe a bit more. So we continue also to look for tenants that -- for the upper floors that would complement the tenant mix and the school itself. We will have a separate entrance and that's all been worked out with the technical team. So -- but yes, the work continues, and we do expect currently the school to move in, in the second part of this year. There's no big news on the State Forest building, Vainodes. We continue to have a good dialogue with the tenant making some small agreements on some of the fit-outs that they have -- that they would like to have. And so there is some discussions ongoing there for the next 10-year period. And Postimaja, we talked about a little bit as a property. It's fully let. Overall, it's doing fine. Tenants are doing fine. And as well there is one discussion there for a tenant upgrade, but currently too early to mention. In Galerija, we did have the opening of MyFitness, another almost 2,000 square meters opened. Our tenant is paying rent. And I think it will be a good complement to the Burzma food hall on the fourth floor. So the property itself has gone through a major conversion when in the last decade, it was a fashion center in its own right and may be classified as a premium sort of fashion destination. Then the world has changed markedly since then. And it's all about the experience today. It's all about spending time. It's also about fashion, but definitely not to that extent. So let's say that the fashion stores that we have there on the first 2 floors are doing fine. Also the jewelry is doing fine, but we definitely need -- we do have some space there still to fill and on the third floor especially and various thoughts are going around there to be in the service or entertainment field. So yes, the work continues also in Galerija Centrs, but definitely a big step forward. We expect 500 to 600 visitors to MyFitness on a daily basis. So I think also the footfall figures for the whole property will improve considerably during the year and yes, more people to the property as these are destination tenants. And again, happy to have that. So it was full of people yesterday already training. So hopefully, that will continue going forward. And North Star, let's say, stable. We have had some changes in tenants there. Some have moved out, but we have now 2 clinics moved in and still moving in. So we're quite happy with the property. We believe in the location of North Star. It's very close to the city center. It has its own, let's say, it has its own position in the market and quite happy to see that the office segment in Vilnius with the vacancy, even if there's some vacancy being developed, then that is taken very quickly. With Meraki, it's fully operational property. I will talk about the disposals shortly. But overall, the property is working well. It has now been stabilized when the big tenant has moved in from technical side. And we continue to work on the vacancy, which is still there, a bit of vacancy. But of course, overall happy about Narbutas moving in as a tenant. Then about the financial results, overall, the quarter compared to the last quarter remained quite similar and we do expect some improvements in the coming months, especially on the rental income side and also cost coverage side when tenants are moving in. And as discussed before, financial expenses have currently increased for us, and we know this and we are working now to decrease our leverage and really focusing on the net cash flow prospects of the portfolio. And overall, there was some decrease in valuation at the end of last year as there were some deals in the market which influenced the cap rates and the discount rates. There's been a question about our valuator Newsec and how do we actually choose our valuators. So we choose our valuators, first of all, we have some already prescriptions about valuators in the fund rules. But we do follow Northern Horizon Group's tendering policy. We invite qualified valuators to participate in a tender. And then we also get an approval from the fund supervisory board for the valuators and finally make the decision based on their price offer, of course, reputation and the business continuity and the team available to conduct the valuations across 3 markets. So we follow the practice of alternating valuators as well, considering that no single valuator should be evaluating our properties for a very long period of time. So these alternations have taken place approximately every 3 years. And currently, the valuator that we have chosen is Newsec. They are doing the valuations based on their standards, based on [ rig ] standards and the result that comes from them is also being discussed. We have some corrections made if needed and then we end up with the year-end or semiannual value. Maybe one thing to note here is as well that our year-end cash position increased and that was also the goal to be ready for this year and to have a bit more cash buffer for various things for -- just to -- for any kind of uncertainties, but also to understand what fit-out needs to be done, but also how much of that cash could be used and should be used to reduce the bond. So that is definitely an ongoing discussion along with the disposals. Then about the financing summary, maybe something to add here is the hedging, which we had in place for several years. We've always had hedging, but many of the hedges are now maturing this year. They definitely helped us during the high Euribor period. It could have been much worse. And currently, we have been looking into new hedging, but not to the full extent, but we definitely keep on looking at whether and when and if it's reasonable to find additional insurance, let's put it this way when it comes to interest rates. Currently, the expectations on interest rates going down is still there. So we keep a strong eye on also in the economic development of Europe and also on the ECB's activities. So that's definitely a place where, yes, we could make some decisions. But overall, we do want to reduce our loan-to-value. And currently, we can do that through disposals. And the market -- if now to talk about disposals, the market over the past couple of years has been -- the transaction market has been quite dried out. There's been a few transactions in the Baltic's -- in the commercial sector -- real estate field and there have been also strategic disposals and disposals which have been made quite, let's say, at higher yields than one would have expected some years ago. So that has set some new benchmarks. So the buyers are there, local buyers mainly and there are quite a few sellers. So to find the match actually between buyers and sellers, it's not easy as well. So we have looked into our portfolio and considered the pros and cons and the suitability of some of our assets on a long-term basis. And what I can comment on Meraki is that, yes, it's now fully let, and we have fitted out the premises for Narbutas and it has, therefore, attracted attention from the market. We are considering certain proposal right now and it is much better than some of the proposals we had received a year ago when we didn't have a anchor tenant. So we needed to fit out the property in order to get the right price. It does hold as well development potential for the long term, I would say. And -- but we think that developing currently in Vilnius is not part of our strategic focus. So therefore, we have considered it as one of the disposal objects especially. And we've also noticed some interest from the market on that property. Various discussions have also taken place on Lincona and Pirita. Perhaps just for confidentiality reasons, I would not like to emphasize or mention more or note something in case the time is right. And -- but there are -- we have received proposals for these properties, unsolicited proposals. So we're considering those as well. But let's say, the market overall is not full of aggressive cash buyers. So again, it has to suit both the buyer and the seller when it comes to the negotiations. Now we had an announcement about Postimaja and Coca-Cola Plaza and there has been also questions why this property. And since it is considered our strategic asset, Modern City Life property and we've been able to fill the property with new tenants and believe in the long-term potential of the land plot. So we had also received proposals, unsolicited proposals on this property. We continuously actually receive offers on this property. And for us to understand really what the market could offer for this property in the current stage when it's fully let, then as usual, we do discussions with potential buyers on a, let's say, confidential basis without also alerting the market about certain discussions or certain intentions. But in this case, since it is a large investment case, then for us, it's inside information and it would have been almost impossible to consider any kind of tender for this property without making an announcement. So we decided to make it public and invite investors to propose. I would like to say that not maybe to, let's say, to open up too many discussions, but there's various ways for us to dispose this property. And not to forget, we are not the full-blown developer, and we have this property in a prime location, producing for us the cash flows. And -- but this property has long-term development potential and large-scale development potential, and we are not a large-scale developer. So let's say, we could be open for any kind of proposals in that regard. Of course, it's simple to sell a property for cash, but let's say that we are also considering other alternatives when it comes to this property and the future of the property within the Baltic Horizon Fund. And so there's a lot of thinking and brainstorming around that. So -- and also just to say that the transaction -- any transaction we would make has to be to the benefit of the fund overall, to the future of the fund and for the future cash flows -- net cash flows of the fund. So overall, I think this sums up our action plan and perhaps it's time for questions. So I'll try to look at the questions and answer as many as I can.

So the question is about -- I think the question is about the net cash flow coming from our portfolio when our NOI is increasing. And so let's just say that we do see the debt service coverage ratio and net cash flow improving also this year, becoming positive above EUR 1.2 million, but that's, let's say, that's, I think, for us, not enough and I think also not enough for the investors. So for us to pay a, let's say, noticeable or attractive dividend in the future, we're looking for ways how to improve the net cash flow position and that is also looking at the debt side, looking at the expensive debt, especially the bond. So when we do consider disposing some of our assets, the focus is to pay back the expensive bond and improve the net cash flow from the fund and improve it actually. So under every disposal, there is one reason it should be that it improves the net cash flow generation of the fund. So we don't expect the cost of debt to increase further, at least not considerably. So I think that's the limit where it will be. And with every disposal, we do see the cost of debt -- average cost of debt, but also the LTV decreasing quite noticeably. So that's the plan. The question is when is the EUR 3 million bond being repaid? The fund has currently liquidity to pay the bond, but we're also analyzing various things still. One is the development of the Euribor. The other thing is potential fit-out investments for the year and also understanding the disposal, let's say, the realistic disposal time line. So these are the things that we're still considering. We aim to pay it as soon as possible. And we have also a Management Board meeting next week where this is a key discussion point. So I cannot give you any kind of clear answer at this point because we haven't made the decision yet, but it's a priority and the combination of a few additional things that we need to clear out. So there is a question about the market price and the NAV. So where we'd like to see the market price in the coming quarters? So again, it's very difficult to forecast. I think clearly it will be impacted by the results and whatever I say or in the webinars or whatever anybody else writes or opinionates, I think that's secondary. So we have to deliver results, improved results and that will also, I think, influence the market price. So clearly, we want to double it this year and we want it to be closer to the NAV and restore the confidence of investors and stability of the fund. So that continues to be work-in-progress and process. And this year, I think, has to be a year where this is either fully achieved or then not at all, so. So there's a question on what is the investment plan for our properties this year? So I would say that fit-out investments throughout the year are in the range of, let's say, EUR 5 million plus/minus. There's -- why I say plus/minus is that some of the budgets are still not final. And it depends as well if we can sign up tenants faster or if they are somewhat being delayed or postponed, any of these investments. So that's an overall, let's say, number that we're working on. I think there's a question on the -- what sort of agreement do we have with the brokers? So I think the basic agreement is that when we sign a lease agreement, then any kind of, let's say, leasing fees is paid only when the tenant has moved in and has started to pay rent and there's also, let's say, special provisions around that. So I think it's quite well established and it's based on market standards really. Question, how do we define anchor tenant? Anchor tenant is a tenant in the property, first of all, who has a very strong brand name and who is a destination on its own, who is sizable and who attracts customers just by itself. So yes, it can be a very sizable tenant, but it can also be a smaller tenant, which is, I think, important for the -- or let's say, crucial for the concept of the property. We expect in Europe 90% occupancy based on moved-in tenants when tenants are moved in by end of this year. The question is about the NOI forecast for this year. So it's clearly going to be an improvement, but it's difficult for me to share these kind of forecasts actually for a real estate -- for an investment fund registered in Estonia, it's actually prohibited. So what I can say is that we do expect the NOI to improve. And perhaps I can give a more clearer answer in the coming periods or to make it more understandable. Question is about the pricing of our assets when we make disposals. So we do have the latest valuations, and we consider the offers coming in, but they do have to be at least around the latest valuation, plus/minus a few percent, but we're not in the process of higher sale selling at 30% discount. So that I can say, at least not on my watch. The question about what is included in the signed -- in that table of signed leases occupancy. So again, there are 2 different occupancy numbers. One is the actual occupancy based on tenants who have already moved in. And as it is such an important figure, we track regularly, almost on a daily basis, what could be the occupancy when the already signed leases that we have moved in because that's very probable as there are penalties involved and many times, tenants are making investments themselves on a large-scale basis, millions of euros. So we consider that as probable. The LOI component is usually very small in that sort of forecast. And yes, LOI is not that strong as a lease agreement. But the LOI is definitely already a strong document that at least in our case, we consider the probability based on the historic -- based on the history, we consider it also very probable. So that's why we include LOIs in that specific occupancy, let's say, figure. But again, these are 2 different occupancies and just to make sure that that's separated. And why we do it, we do it because we believe it's important to see a bit into the future. So that's the reason why we report it separately. I think I answered already the Postimaja reasoning, Postimaja Plaza reasoning question and the disposals. Don't think I have anything more to add at this point that I can share at least in this webinar. I think at this point, at least to my understanding, we don't plan any new equity issues this year. So I think that's the answer to this question. I think some of these questions I already answered. There is a question on Meraki and what price do we expect? So we do expect this to be around the valuation. And when it comes to the development cost, then, yes, it will most likely be lower than that as the property has been developed with the underground parking already ready for the second part. But that already has been taken into account for the valuation. A question on governmental and social tenants. So I think the answer there is that as we can see currently in our office portfolio, which is not very big. So I think it is -- I think it's clear to the market that in the office segment is facing some challenges as to other segments. But in our properties, we've been able to have and retain and buy properties that have governmental tenants now as well and as well social tenants like kindergartens and these type of associations in the past. For example, the army veterans of Latvia, they had small premises in Galerija Centrs in the past. But now also with the school and considering, let's say, the market -- office market being quite, let's say, in a form of change, we like these tenants and we want to focus on keeping them and also expanding the tenant mix with associate tenants because they also do seem to be most resilient or more resilient than some of the other tenants. Of course, all tenants, all segments do have their own risks, but I think that's why we have emphasized now that part a bit more, especially that we have signed a big lease agreement with the International School of Riga. The question about dividends, I think that's the last question. So I think in the previous webinars, we've discussed and set some goals to be able to pay some dividend in 2025. I think with all the things moving to the right direction, that still could be a possibility, but that's all I can say right now. We have quite a bit of work to be done before that. So -- but that's our goal as well. So -- and we work towards that goal, so. And maybe one question which I missed. The sales process of Plaza and Postimaja is only in the beginning phase. We're just about to receive some proposals and we then take a look, we analyze them, we put them into our models and then think about what could be beneficial for the fund going forward. So that work is to be done now, I think, over the coming weeks, so. There's a question on the buybacks. And I think it's a relevant question. I just have to say that cash is king currently for us and we have several investors, and some investors very much ask why do we -- why don't we do it? And some investors ask that -- or propose us not to do it. So we're currently thinking what's the best way forward. We perhaps could do some buybacks, but buybacks are there to strengthen the capital base. So perhaps we have different ways how we think that the capital base or the capital structure of the fund is the best -- in the best position today. But it continues to be on our table. And it's -- let's say, it wouldn't be surprising if we do some buybacks in the coming periods, so. Okay. Thank you for the questions. Hopefully, this webinar was informative. We continue to work. And let me know in case of any ideas, any other questions and let's be in touch. Thank you.