Bayer Aktiengesellschaft (BAYN) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Good morning, everyone. Thank you for attending so early in the morning. I hope you had a good first days at the conference here. It's my super big pleasure to introduce the Bayer Consumer Health team to you, and you have all of them here on the stage. We have Julio Triana, who is heading the Consumer Health business at Bayer. You have Magnus Schellnock, who is the CFO of the business. And then you also have Rebekka Iten, who is Head of Commercial Operations in the EMEA region. So quite a unique opportunity to meet the entire Consumer Health team. And as you might know, Consumer Health accounts for a little more than 10% of Bayer's group sales and earnings. But make no mistake, right, this is a globally leading business here that operates globally and, yes, is leading in what it does.

And maybe to open up here, for Julio, an opening question. Maybe you could speak a little bit about the long-term strategic vision of the business and how that aligns with the overall Bayer company strategy?

Great. So thank you so much. Thank you, Falko. Thanks for the invitation, and good morning to everyone here. Before I answer the question, if you don't mind, I'll say -- maybe open it up for my colleagues here to say something about themselves. So Rebekka, maybe.

Good morning, everyone. Very pleased to be here. Thanks for coming. I'm the Head of Commercial Operations in EMEA, and I hope we will have a good exchange this morning.

And Magnus?

Hi, everybody. Magnus Schellnock, also happy to be here. Thanks for coming and looking forward to the discussion.

Great. Thank you. So it's not the entire team. It's only a few of them. We also have a couple of other regions and manufacturing and R&D. The -- so going back to your question, Falko, I don't know if people in the audience follow Bayer. We, as a company, have a mission to bring health for all and hunger for none. That is the reason why we're present in the businesses that we're in. And our contribution as consumer health is to bring our solutions, self-care solutions to as many people as possible. And we recently launched a strategy that we called the Road to Billions. This is basically a strategy based on the potential that the consumer health market or industry has and the attractiveness it has. It's about -- it's a market that's about -- depends on how you looking at it, it's about EUR 200 billion and has been continuously growing. It's been growing at around mid-single digits. So it's very interesting, has very good margins. We have been able to continue to increase our margin in the last years and a very decent cash. So we have a business of about EUR 6 billion, and we have cash of about EUR 800 million. So it's very consistent. And the way that we're looking at this, we also have a very good presence. We have an incredible portfolio of brands. You probably have heard the term of mega brands. But we feel that those are extremely important. But we also have a lot of local heroes. And this is what is unique about the Bayer Consumer Health portfolio. It is that not only we leverage these mega brands, these are brands that have presence in, I don't know, 40, 50 countries, so quite an amount of sales. But we also have these local heroes that are also very interesting because they are -- we're competing with them with these local heroes in markets that are fast growing and where we have a very strong presence. Strong presence, we qualify that we are top 3 in the markets where we compete. So it's an interesting industry. It's an interesting market for us. We have a very good geographic presence, where we have brands that are really trusted. It continues to grow, and we want to continue to play in this market. Our strategy is that, that we are basically -- we call ourselves, we want to be, and that's our aspiration, the #1 fast-moving consumer health company in the world. Today, we're #3 when you take a look at it in terms of size and just looking at the consumer health portfolio of our competitors. And we feel that, that positions us well to be able to be competitive in this market.

Perfect. The next question is one that I think is one that we're getting quite often from investors. In light of the recent M&A activity in the sector, right, some of your peers have been spun out and became independent, so to say. Do you believe that your business receives the proper recognition as part of this bigger Bayer conglomerate?

In fact, do you mean within the company or...

Within the company, exactly. And with -- in terms of resource allocation, et cetera, in that sense?

So the way we look at allocating resources within Bayer, we always say we -- so we basically have 3 main businesses. And we say as long as we can really earn the right to be the best owners of that business, and we make sure that we're doing the right -- in the proper allocation to those businesses, we will continue to keep them. And that is the reason why I think it was early last year in our Capital Markets Day, we said our intention continues to be to keep the portfolio of businesses we have today because we're not starving any of these businesses. We don't get a lot of recognition and probably even more internally with what our colleagues or our peers have done in spinning out their businesses. When you take a look at their market capitalizations and you compare our size of the business, of course, internally, we say, wow, we have a very good sort of jewel internally. We -- yes, sometimes we don't get a lot of attention because our 2 sisters are much, much bigger. But even though we're a smaller division, people understand that the potential that we have, it's significant. So I don't feel in my conversations with our Supervisory Board, within the Board of Management that there isn't this recognition. In fact, whenever we have ideas in terms of M&A, we bring them forward. We compete for the allocation of resources equally to our pharma business as well as Crop Science. We're extremely active in that space. There's a lot going on in M&A in consumer health. We're just extremely selective in terms of where we want to allocate our cash. We look everywhere, the big deals that everyone knows about around the world, but also we're looking at deals that we can done in countries. Those will be smaller deals as part of our sort of innovation and continuing to expand our portfolio. This year, for example, in Q1, we bought -- we finished the deal with a company, an e-commerce company, it's called Natsana. That if you're interested, you have an expert here. It's in Rebekka's region, and it's an e-commerce company that is a German company, and we bought that one because that is one of the areas we're extremely interested in.

Perfect. That's a great gateway to my next question, right? I mean we have seen this significant trend towards the OTC online channels, right, in consumer health, not just in Europe, but everywhere, but especially in Europe with online pharmacies emerging, et cetera. So first of all, sort of yes, where do you see that going? And how do you participate in that trend?

Look, I think, we have industry-leading omnichannel expertise at Bayer. And we basically go by principle, we sell our products where our shoppers shop the categories. And indeed, e-commerce it's growing, shows significant growth. And also when you look at our share, we basically doubled our e-commerce sales from 2020 now -- from 7% up to 14% now in Q1 2025. So really strong performance in that regard. And like Julio said, we have done the latest acquisition, which is Natsana. It's a German-based company who is selling in Europe, specifically in nutritionals category, mainly on Amazon. So we are leading there now also in the nutritional space. And we not only got with the acquisition of Natsana, a great nutritionals business in the e-commerce channel, we also got a lot of expertise on how to operate in that channel, which we can use now also for our existing Bayer brands. So we got the expertise together with a great business on nutritionals. And yes, we believe we are well set up to double down on the growth that we've seen in the last years.

Perfect. And this trend is likely to continue, right, going forward towards the -- yes, perfect. Then going back to capital allocation. You've done a bigger acquisition in 2016, I believe, right, back in the days. Ever since you have seen a string of divestments, divested quite a few brands. So do you expect M&A to be sort of a continued important theme over the next few years? Or do you feel good with where the portfolio sits?

Yes. No, we sort of never feel good entirely with the portfolio. We always believe that there are things that we can do. As I mentioned, in the acquisition part, we're constantly scanning the opportunities, not only at a global level, but also in the countries where we participate. And we can talk later about what are the priorities, which countries, which geographies. So we're constantly doing that. We're always looking for areas where we can -- we believe that there is significant growth opportunity, where we can expand the category presence we have in those specific markets. We're looking for areas where -- or products or opportunities that are accretive to what we have or could become accretive as quickly as possible and be able to generate the cash. So we're sort of looking for -- that's our criteria to say, okay, yes, this is something that we will pursue. Now because of our legacy, and I mean, we're more than 150 years, a company of more than 150 years. We have a lot of brands. So we do have a long tail of products. We have significant presence across the world. And we're constantly looking at, are we the right owners for those very small products in maybe remote countries. And those are the -- when you said we've been very active in disposing of or changing these assets, it's also in an effort to reduce complexity. That is something that we need to watch when you have a strategy where you value these local heroes and local perils, if you like. You need to be careful as well that if you have these local products that are not as good that you also dispose of those. And what that does is it just gives us the opportunity to be able to save up and look for other opportunities. So that's constantly something we're doing all of the time, and we will continue to do that.

Perfect. Then a few financial topics for Magnus. I'm going to lump it into sort of a bigger question, and you can sort of decide where you want to take it. But how has your Consumer Health business been impacted by all of the macroeconomic things that have been going on, right, whether it's been inflation, supply chain disruptions? We just discussed a slightly change in consumer behavior going to online and then there's obviously the tariff topic at the moment, so how has and how could it continue to affect your business?

Good question. Thanks, Falko. Yes, look, we are a global player. We are #3 in a EUR 200 billion market. We have a broad category footprint spanning 6 categories, and we have a strong global presence with, let's say, 35% in North America, equally in EMEA and then also a good share in APAC and LatAm. That means we are exposed to whatever supply chain inflation or other constraints come. Looking into the past, though, we have also demonstrated strong resilience. Just to give some numbers between 2019 and 2024, we grew 5% CAGR and expanded the margin by 240 basis points over 5 years, landing at 23.3% clean EBITDA margin in 2024. So that trajectory we have still it provides challenges. If you look at '23, '24 as a time period, it was coined by the inflation. And then, post-COVID, a lot of supply constraints happened that drove inflation. And that challenges you, I think, us, but also all other players in the industry on the quality of growth, we call it, which is the balance between price and volume. At that period, it was predominantly price-driven growth that we could record. To give you -- if I'm CFO, I have to give you some numbers. In 2023, we grew 6%, 9% of which was price, minus 3% volume. 2024, even bigger spread, 7.5% price, minus 5.5% volume, lending you at 2%. Market also mostly price driven. I think we all agree in the room that this is not a sustainable path. And the reason was very obvious; with the inflationary trend, everybody priced up. We saw then volume sensitivity. That means that it has a natural end where the consumer doesn't buy you anymore. Us not, but also the entire industry had volume issues. It was amplified by one effect that we saw in U.S. Whilst the supply chain came back to being regular, interest rates in U.S. were still high. That triggered working capital optimization programs in our retailers. So they destock. They take less volumes in their trade inventory. Some even faced financial challenges, closed stores that also takes volume down, and that made 2024, in particular, pretty challenging. And we ended even up changing our guidance when we had these learnings. As a record in Q3, we lowered a little bit the guidance corridor for net sales. In Q1, though, we turned it around. We have 2.5% net sales growth, but 1.7% of which is volume. So that is a good signal that we see this recovery, EMEA, in particular, helping there, but also North America. And that you can also expect to continue throughout the year within our guidance of 2% to 5%. Very recently, the other topic, tariff, has impacts on costs, on currency and on consumer sentiment. On costs, you have heard us in the publication, we confirm our EBITDA guidance between '23, '24 despite the exposure to tariffs, but it's a manageable exposure. Why is that? Our supply chain strategy was always region for region, local for local. Means for U.S., 75% of finished goods are produced locally. There is a remaining exposure. It's not 100%, but for us, manageable if we stated as at constant rates and also at the status that we had at the publication day relative to tariffs. This is, as you know, very fluid, but at that time, we could confirm. FX-wise, to give you some color, again, I'm a number guy, I have to give you some color on numbers as well. Look, there is a sensitivity, as you would have, there's a vector on the dollar. If you take the March rates and then we project March rates to the full year end to see our currency exposure, it was EUR 70 million in net sales negative, if that was the full year rate. A month later, post the Liberation Day, it was EUR 220 million. That swing factor just by the dollar jumping to $1.14 versus the euro. That shows you there is a challenge in FX. That's why we also guide EBITDA at constant rates for that reason because also the swing is 30 basis points in EBITDA negatively. So that we have to carefully monitor. Lastly, and I think amongst us, that's actually the biggest concern, consumer sentiment. If that continues, we have indications on the Michigan University, it's below the 20 years average. It had a steep decline in March and April. If that continues, it will have an effect also on the CH market projections. And we see or saw a muted start into the year in key markets: Mexico, China and U.S. If that continues, it is a kind of risk factor definitely that we have to navigate through. But this is possibly even the biggest effect out of the 3 I mentioned around tariffs. But to close on the positive, Q1 showed a return to growth relative to volume. We can confirm EBITDA guidance. And I think the resilience comes from 2 things: a, the supply chain strategy is region for region, local for local. And second, a broad portfolio like ours, be it category, be it geography, serves you well, actually protects you.

Perfect. Thank you. Any questions on the financials from the audience before we move on? Good. Explained it all. Then shifting a little bit to innovation, your portfolio. How do you think your business differentiates itself in an increasingly competitive and also commoditized environment?

Yes. Maybe we can start with Europe and then I add on the other geographies. Is that okay?

Yes, happy to do so. I think we're differentiated in various ways. Like Magnus said before, we have a portfolio, which is with a lot of global brands where we have also very strong positioning in Europe. But then we have some also very strong local pearls, how we're calling them, which are really strong, locally relevant. And in the way how we're driving the portfolio is that we say we're really consumer-centric. And actually, we do care about our global mega brands, but we also say more important is that we are consumer-centric, and we basically serve the consumer with the relevant brands that are known and where we have the strong brand equity. So we carry that portfolio of strong global mega brands, but also balancing it off with strong local brands. And that I think we manage by doing really well, and it's also what is differentiating us because when you have these brands, then you really can have a different discussion also with customers coming with a whole category story than being just a single brand or what I call the product shooter that you come with one product or one brand. We have really -- thanks to the strong portfolio that we have, we can have a different discussion with customers also in the way how we execute our brand. And then in regards to innovation, we have very strong medical insights coming also from our strong Bayer heritage in the way how we innovate with medical insights with different formulation backed up with strong science, which is giving us the differentiation very often also in our exchange with health care professionals because when you look at competition wise coming into the market, usually in January, they are not having that. We are the only company, I would almost say, who has this pure OTC portfolio and with that also the expertise to drive that portfolio really strongly.

I can just build on that. So basically, the same that we do for Europe, we're doing for the other parts of the world. What we've done is we sort of shifted our innovation model, recognizing that there is -- it is very competitive. It's starting to get commoditized and just to make sure that it is our brand and our brand equity that is first and foremost. So what we do is instead of having the sort of global team thinking that they know what is relevant everywhere in the world, yes, we do have the global team that is taking all these ideas that are coming from the market. So we decentralized our innovation model. So a lot of the ideas that we're working on are ideas that are happening in the different markets where we play. What we also have done is we've scanned what are the opportunities, what are the segments that are fast growing, where we can really be top 3? What are those categories? And what is the innovation that is needed and that is relevant for those consumers in those markets. Once we capture those needs, as Rebekka mentioned, that are consumer relevant, we bring them up and we make sure that we have what is the medical need and what is the science that we can bring behind that medical need. And of course, then we apply a repeatable growth model to make sure that, that opportunity is really maximized in that country. The way we're running our portfolio is we're looking at this -- we call them intersections ourselves. And it's basically the opportunity space and the brands that we have in that country. And that is where we allocate the resources, and we were talking about that resources is not only the financial resources to make sure that we have the appropriate A&P and so on, but also the best people going after those opportunities, the best talent, if you like, to make sure that we seize those opportunities and we're able to continue to grow them. So out of those opportunities, we focus on about 100 of them. And those 100 are spread across the entire world. The 100 is about 10% of our entire portfolio. So if you like, we're shifting the resources, both people as well as financial resources to the highest opportunities we have across the world. Now those 100, they're not static. We're constantly reviewing what is the execution or are there other areas that are also worth coming up with innovation. So this is part of our innovation system, making sure that we have appropriate resourcing and that we're able to repeat the growth model across the world. That's how we're trying to make sure that we stay relevant because you're right, it's a highly competitive space. But at the end, what really, really counts is that your brands have the equity and they're seen as trusted. And this is something that with our legacy, being part of Bayer, it just helps us a lot.

And which are the main product categories or therapeutic areas that you aim to prioritize going forward that you believe has the best growth potential over the next few years?

Yes. So I'll start and maybe Rebekka can follow and talk a little bit more specific about Europe. The -- so I think Magnus mentioned it, we participate in 6 preventive and treatment categories. They're OTC and the nutrients or, let's say, the multivitamin space and dermatology. So basically, those categories are pain, cardio, digestive health, dermatology; also allergy, cough and cold, just to name some of the ones that we have there. We believe all of those, and we continue to participate in those because we believe they're extremely important. There are a couple of them that we are looking more into sort of like the intersection of women's health. We, as Bayer, also have a very strong legacy in women's health, and we want to leverage that, not only on our pharma portfolio, but also in the consumer portfolio and sort of have an end-to-end solution from prevention to treatment of issues associated with women. The whole topic of menopause is an area that we also see as developing where we are coming up with solutions that is part of our innovation mechanism. And the other part is digestive health. You probably have seen and we've been doing extremely well with digestive health in the past. It's an area that is growing significantly. And we have some -- a very, very strong, very good portfolio that we are rolling out across the world, like, for example, Iberogast in the U.S., we have the launch, and it's going very well. We have -- we're expanding the category with products like Talcid in China, and we have many examples of those. So maybe if you can talk a little bit about what you're doing in Europe.

For Europe, we obviously operate also in these 6 categories that Julio just mentioned, but what is really strong for us and where we also foresee strong growth is dermatology, where we have a winning brand, Bepanthen, which is really strong with a strong position where we continuously innovate behind. Like with the latest innovation we just had was on dry eyes with a double function of protection, continuous hydration with a strong point of difference in the market that has done really well. Then we also doubled down on innovation in nutritionals. Nutritionals is a super important category for us, as I was talking before a bit with the acquisition of Natsana, but also our existing brands: Berocca, Supradyn, Elevit, Redoxon doing really well in the region and where we keep on innovating and then where we're doubling down and where we see the category still strongly growing. And then the third priority that we have in the region is digestive health. Also digestive health, where we have a strong regional brand like Rennie, where we keep on innovating and where we see the -- and with Iberogast, which is also a global mega brand, where we see these 3 categories actually really strongly growing in Europe.

Maybe Falko, if you allow me the -- so that is the category perspective, and I guess that was interest. But the geography perspective as well, it's -- maybe that was a follow-up, it's key. So Magnus mentioned right now, the composition of our presence, so we have about 35%, 36% of our business is in the -- in North America. Then you have another 35%, which is in Europe, Middle East and Africa. And then about 15%, 15% is Latin America and Asia Pacific. So when you consider what is the makeup and the distribution and the opportunity for consumer health industry as it all, you would say an opportunity for us is Asia Pacific. Asia Pacific, the consumer health market in the world, Asia Pacific is about 25% of that market. We're only 15%. So there's clearly an opportunity for us to grow. We have a very strong presence in China, and we will continue to strengthen that presence. We have a very good portfolio, an incredible team, and we continue to bring innovation into China. But there's a couple of areas like, for example, India, where we want to -- and we have plans in place in sort of our India strategy to be able to leverage the opportunity more than what we have in the past in other places like Indonesia. So that's really where the growth is going to be. Latin America, we're a bit over-indexed. We're incredibly strong in Latin America. We talked -- Magnus, I think, mentioned we're #1 in Mexico, for example, which is probably one of the largest markets in Latin America. Where we have opportunities are markets like Brazil. In Brazil, we're doing extremely well with dermatology and the team there is coming up with a lot of innovation. So from a geography perspective and with our Road to Billions strategy, with our effort to reach as many people as possible, Asia clearly is an opportunity for us. That's where the majority of the people in this world live, so that is an area. Now in Europe, we have -- Europe is not only developed markets. We have pockets of growth that are significant. We have the whole Central and Eastern Europe. These are markets that are growing double digits and where we have an extremely strong presence. Same thing with the Middle East. So that basically complements our strategies in terms of growth from a category perspective and also geography.

Maybe if you allow me, you talked nicely about these intersects and these power couples. If you look at these 100, of course, they have a strong foothold in EMEA and North America. And guess what? 50% is geared towards emerging markets, including China. And of course, Mexico also being part in that definition. So also the -- yes, the power couple of focus is important. You need to understand where have you a top 1, 2 or 3 leading position to build from. But it also has, of course, this headspace argument and then more penetration in emerging markets. So I think it marries very nicely together.

Perfect. One area I'd like to drill into a little deeper, the Nutritionals category. Lots of focus on it during the pandemic and coming out of the pandemic, so how do you see the medium-term growth outlook for that business specifically? And why do you think it's important to keep offering that in conjunction with all of the other areas you operate?

Again, I'll start and hand over to you, Rebekka. So Nutritionals for us, and we get this question, actually, by the way, Falko, it's a really important question because it's a space where it's really become a little bit of a red ocean. There are many, many, many players. A lot of players that are sort of coming outside of the industry. It's a space that has been -- in the past, a lot of the growth has been coming from, for example, influencers that are using their name to be able to put products out there, using contract manufacturing and so on. And that has been growing a lot, but it's not sustainable. The companies -- we believe that the companies that will continue to remain are companies like ourselves that have the heritage and be able to come up with the claims that we have that are backed by science. That will continue -- that will prevail. It is very, very competitive at the moment. Now we've been in this category for many, many, many years, and we have a strong heritage there. We believe as part of our idea of hunger for none and be able to have in populations that have the right nutrients, we feel that we owe it to our consumers as well to make sure that we have those solutions and that we bring those solutions to them. Part of our strategy, as I said, grow to billions and be able to bring as many solutions to as many people as possible, we have to -- this is a core area, and it's an area where we will continue to invest to make sure that, that happens. But we also see also because of all these new players that have come in, our consumers are making the decisions in these products a lot in e-commerce. So to demonstrate how serious we are about this area, this is the reason why we made the investments we made in Natsana, for example, which is only nutritionals and it's only e-commerce. So we're also seeing, okay, we're sort of migrating towards where our consumers are that are requiring these products that are continuing to buy our products through other channels. So we will continue to expand there. It's really definitely a key area for us. There is a nutrient gap, especially in those emerging markets that I mentioned that we believe we have the opportunity to address. And maybe I hand over to you.

Yes. Like Julio said, it's a super important category for us. Strategically, to deliver on the Road to Billions because we still see that there is a strong potential to still also penetrate the market also with our brands that we have. While we have leading brands, while we have a strong penetration, we still see there is room to grow. And when you look at the Euromonitor data, then they predict a 5.4% CAGR over the next 5 years. So it remains an important category. And then like Julio said, I think we're super well-positioned with our existing brands that are basically addressing the consumer need, which we call on a need base, like energy, like prenatal, like immunity. And then we complement the portfolio with Natsana, which is more an ingredient-led brands and also natural-led brands. These are the 2 big consumer trends that we have seen in this category. And with this latest acquisition, we basically cover both. And the consumers are more and more also educated with digital, with ChatGPT, you name it, in regards to ingredients. So more and more, they focus on a more ingredient-led composition. And with our existing current portfolio that we have also in the pharmacy complementing with e-commerce, I think, we're well positioned to also in future, compete in that market.

Great.

If you read our numbers, this Natsana portfolio, it's a portfolio effect this year, but it's always separated out. It was EUR 35 million in Q1. So it's a sizable contribution this year already in euro value.

Yes.

Is there any question from the audience? And just -- yes, please go ahead.

Every now and then the conversation of general disposal of consumer health comes up. And it feels like we're potentially closer for some reason. I'm not sure if you would recognize that. And is it possible that Bayer would sell this business?

Yes. And I saw you come in a little bit after my introduction.

Oh, yes.

It's all right. No, I reiterated that, that is not our intention at the moment. So we -- I think the way that Bill Anderson, the CEO of the group, put it, it's not now, not never. The way that we always -- and I mentioned that in terms of capital allocation and what are the businesses that we keep, as long as we continue to be the best owner for this business, we will continue to keep it. We continue to get capital allocated to us. Our growth continues to be significant. It's very competitive. We've improved our margins. We continue to generate the cash flow, and we don't get any hindrance to our business. So we -- it's a very separated business. It's -- I don't have any restrictions to be able to say, look, I could do better or we could do better. The business will be -- will thrive a lot more if we were separated or sold or something like that. So no, we're not closer. We're not any closer than when we made the comment that we want to stay with the composition of the group as we are. We do get this question quite often, but it is -- we will continue to keep the business for as long as we continue to be the best owner for it.

Great. Maybe as a closing question, if the 4 of us would be sitting here or are sitting here in, let's say, 2030, right, in 5 years down the road, how would you like the business to look? What would you have liked to achieve over that period? And...

Yes. And -- so thanks for the question. The -- as I said, we kicked off this Road to Billions strategy, and it's a strategy about bringing as many of our products to as many people around the world. We calculate that today, about 630 million, 650 million people get our products. So hopefully, by 2030, that would be above 1 billion into as many people as possible. There is a significant under-penetration of our product -- of all the products of consumer health across the world. And we need to do something about that to make sure that we are able to bring these solutions to as many people as possible. And in doing so, let's say, from a financial perspective, if we have done a good job at doing that, we will be able to grow faster than the market. That we will be able to bring as much innovation as possible in the categories that we play, that we continue to have competitive margins. We feel that they are competitive today, but we can always do a little bit better and reinvest into the business, continue to generate the cash. So that basically would be what I would say that you would see that Bayer instead of perhaps being the #3, would probably get -- still be in that top 3 of the consumer health companies out there and that we continue to bring the solutions to as many people as possible.

Perfect. Thank you very much for those detailed answers, and thank you all for attending and listening. And yes, have a good rest of the day, everyone.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.