BCL Industries Limited (524332) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Ladies and gentlemen, good day, and welcome to the Q3 and 9 Months FY '25 Earnings Conference Call of BCL Industries Limited, hosted by Go India Advisors. [Operator instructions]. Please note that this conference is being recorded. I now hand the conference over to Ms. Priya Sen from Go India Advisors. Thank you, and over to you, ma'am.

Thank you, Sejal. Good afternoon, everybody, and welcome to BCL Industries Limited earnings conference call to discuss the Q3 and 9 months FY '25 results. We have on the call Mr. Kushal Mittal, Joint Managing Director. We must remind you that the discussion on today's call may include certain forward-looking statements and must be, therefore, viewed in conjunction with the risks that the company faces. May I now request Mr. Kushal Mittal to take us through the company's business outlook and performance, subsequent to which we will open the floor for Q&A. Thank you, and over to you, sir.

Good evening, everyone. Thank you, Priya, and welcome, and I would like to welcome everyone to the Q3 and 9 months FY '25 Earnings Conference Call of BCL Industries Limited. The financial results and investor presentation have been made available on the exchanges, and I hope you've had the opportunity to review them. BCL Industries enters its 50th year of incorporation, a milestone that reflects decades of strategic evolution and growth. As we celebrate this achievement, we extend our heartfelt gratitude to all our stakeholders for their unwavering support. We are committed to creating long-term value for our shareholders. Over the years, BCL has consistently invested in world-class assets and strengthened its grain processing expertise. This foundation has enabled us to emerge as one of India's leading producers of ethanol and ENA. By adapting to changing market dynamics, we have reinforced our position in the industry while contributing to the nation's energy security. Today, BCL plays a vital role in reducing fuel import dependency and is recognized as a key player in green energy, driven by a legacy of innovation and sustainable growth. The company currently operates a total distillery capacity of 700 KLPD across Bathinda and Kharagpur. To further strengthen its presence, BCL recently acquired Goyal Distillery Private Limited in Fatehabad, which has the necessary land and approvals for setting up a 250 KLPD grain-based ethanol plant. Initial groundwork is progressing well and necessary works are expected to begin in the coming months. The company is also moving forward with establishment of 150 KLPD distillery in Bathinda. All the necessary approvals have been obtained and the construction has commenced. This project is scheduled for commissioning within 12 months. Along with this expansion, we're also installing another paddy straw based boiler to help decrease our fuel cost in the future as well. The total capital expenditure for this project is approximately INR 116 crores. In line with its commitment to green energy, BCL is in the process of setting up a 20 metric ton per day bio-CNG plant, utilizing approximately 300 tons of paddy straw per day. This initiative will not only mitigate the issue of stubble burning in North India, but also enhance farmers' income from agriculture waste. The company is also currently setting up a 75 KLPD Biodiesel plant in Bathinda, which will support complete vertical integration in ethanol production. This, we expect to be commissioned in the next 3 to 4 months. The estimated CapEx for the project of Biodiesel is around INR 120 crores. Additionally, BCL has received the approval to establish another 75 KLPD Biodiesel plant in its Kharagpur distillery, reinforcing its long-term commitment to green energy. Further updates regarding the 75 KLPD Biodiesel plant in Kharagpur will be given in the coming quarters. BCL is undergoing a peak transition with a phased exit from the edible oil segment to enhance profitability and operational focus. The exit is expected to be completed by Q1 FY '26, freeing up INR 90 crores in working capital and significantly reducing the debt on the company. This will also significantly bring down the operational and overhead costs the company continues to bear in low-margin business of edible oils. The company is also continuing the gradual divestment in its real estate inventory with proceeds allocated towards further debt reduction. The recent allowance of FCI rice for ethanol at price INR 22.50 per kg is a positive opportunity for the industry. This measure is expected to enhance supply chain efficiency, manage surplus stocks and support the industry viability. BCL with its capability to process both maize and rice is well positioned to benefit from this development. Additionally, raw material prices are expected to reduce, positively impacting our margins. The PML segment delivered strong results, supported by seasonal demand with approximately 13,21,223 cases of liquor sold. This momentum is expected to continue in the coming quarters. As BCL progresses across multiple initiatives, its focus remains steadfast on leveraging its expertise in grain procurement and processing to drive sustainable margin and long-term shareholder value. Moving on to the financial performance for quarter 3 FY '25. In Q3, BCL reported total revenue of INR 763 crores, reflecting an 18.1% year-on-year increase. EBITDA stood at INR 48 crores with a 6% margin, down 15.7% year-on-year, while PAT reached at INR 21 crores, down from INR 33 crores in the previous financial year, marking a 36.3% decline with a 3% margin. This quarter, we experienced a significant rise in our raw material prices impacting our margins. However, the company expects price correction with the arrival of FCI rice for ethanol, which will also help reduce the dependence on maize for the entire industry. The distillery segment demonstrated robust growth with ethanol volumes rising by 26.9% to 48,845 KL. Revenue from the ethanol segment reached INR 350 crores with a steady 37.8% increase year-on-year, while the distillery segment EBITDA stood at INR 42 crores, reflecting a 14.2% decrease year-on-year. This now concludes my presentation, and we will now open the floor for questions.

[Operator Instructions] The first question is from the line of Dipesh Sancheti from Manya Finance.

Firstly, just wanted to understand because of which raw material, mainly because of maize is what the impact was there on the financials?

Yes, both maize and rice.

Okay. I believe that FCI rice had already come into the market, right?

No. It's yet to come into the market.

Okay. So is it expected to come into the market maybe this quarter as in since we are already halfway in this quarter, has it come into the market or still to come?

It is still to come. I think we are awaiting the allocation, which we are expecting to receive in a day or 2 from the OMCs. But just the news of FCI rice being available for the industry has cooled down the grain market.

Okay. Even the maize prices. So what are the maize prices in last quarter and right now, if you can just…

Last quarter, they were hovering around INR 27.5 per kg. And this quarter, they're somewhere around INR 25.5 to INR 25.

Okay. So this quarter has already the prices have corrected. So I mean, we can take this as a one-off quarter, December quarter, right? Is that assessment okay?

Yes. I mean just like any other business, there will be fluctuations with the raw material prices, and that is not in the control of the company. So it's not -- I cannot make a comment that whether that was a one-off quarter or not. I can say that, yes, with the FCI rice coming in for the next year or so, the company expects raw material prices to stay in control. And yes, that's the statement which I can make.

No, because we have always outperformed every other company because of our power cost, because of our expertise in procurement. So INR 25 of maize as well as if the FCI rice also coming in, that will definitely up our margins from what it was.

That will help our margins. And yes, we continue to innovate to stay ahead of competition, whether that is through paddy straw and with the establishment of the Biodiesel unit. And once that comes into commission -- that comes into production, I think we will really majorly differentiate ourselves from our competitors.

Right, right. Can you provide some insights on your bio-CNG industry? I mean this is something which newly we have understood. So including the total addressable market and what are the expected margins? Because your Biodiesel margins are, I mean, amazing because of your -- the entire raw material coming in from your maize. Also, if I can add in that since if you move to this FCI rice, how will it impact your Biodiesel?

See FCI rice will be a certain amount that we'll move to and FCI rice is a temporary measure by the government to help the industry. In the long run, maize will be the best raw material for the industry. And up until then, as the crop increases, the government also had a problem of too much rice and the industry also had a problem of not enough maize. So I think it was a win-win situation for both. But this is a temporary measure. And in the long term, maize is the raw material for the ethanol industry. So we don't see much of an impact from there. And the answering your CNG question, I think to -- I will wait to give in any margins forecast as of now because CNG prices are fluctuating on a daily basis. Bio-CNG is not something like ethanol where the prices remain stable for an entire year. So we're still studying the technology, evaluating which technology to opt for. And once everything is final, only then will I make any comment on that.

But have we received anything from the OMCs because they will be the major --

No, there is demand for bio-CNG in the country. That's -- the demand is not an issue.

So already, people are doing bio-CNG? I mean, is the companies buying bio-CNG?

Yes, of course. Bio-CNG is being bought by whether that's the gas companies or the OMCs.

So if you can just tell us what is the address -- total addressable market, that would also be okay. Because margins are --

[indiscernible] Addressable market, very accurate figures as of now. But yes, there are many others, there Reliance is venturing in -- Reliance has already commissioned 1 project, and they're setting up more. And the demand of bio-CNG is not an issue.

Okay. Okay. And because I wanted to say that the margins are always better with BCL. So that's the reason. So what is the expected time line of the plant 20 MTPD biogas plant?

See, that plant will be commissioned along with the 250 KLPD plant in Fatehabad. And so we are seeing a time line of about 18 months for the 250 KLPD ethanol plant and at least 2 years for the bio-CNG plant.

Bio-CNG plant. And for the ethanol plant when did you give, I mean, what time line did you give?

At least 18 months from now.

18 months.

150 KLPD. We've already begun work for the 150 KLPD at our Bathinda capacity and expansion. So that we're hoping to commission within 12 months.

Right. Because in your presentation also in Slide 21, you mentioned that from 700 KLPD or FY '26, it will become 850 KLPD. Now apart from this 850 KLPD in FY '26, even our Biodiesel 75 KLPD as well as Svaksha, we were planning some Biodiesel plant, right? So what will be the Biodiesel capacity?

Biodiesel capacity would be 75 KLPD only. For Svaksha, we've only received the necessary clearances as of yet. We haven't begun any work or any machinery order. We haven't done that. We'll wait for our 75 KLPD plant at Bathinda to be commissioned successfully before we make any orders there.

Right. And so what is the debt situation right now? How much of it is long term? And how much of it is working capital?

See, for BCL, the current working capital is around INR 200 crores and which will be further reduced by another INR 60 crores. We've already reduced INR 30 crores as we're slowly shutting out our edible oil business. So for long-term debt in BCL, there is the 1 loan that is under interest subvention with Canara Bank, which has about INR 107 crores outstanding. For Svaksha Distillery, we have a working capital of about INR 55 crores and 2 term loans, one for the 200 KLPD, which has about INR 39 crores outstanding and another for the ethanol expansion, which is under interest subvention about INR 65 crores. And the rest, the company has taken 2 LRDs for commercial buildings. And besides that, there's no other debt.

Okay. So -- and we are planning another expansion of about 100 -- you mentioned about INR 140 crores, right, total CapEx?

Yes. So with Biodiesel being around INR 120 crores and ethanol INR 150 KLPD was -- I think it was around INR 116 crores.

So this will be additional?

Yes.

This will be additional, right? Okay, okay. And so understanding your -- since you're moving out of the entire edible oil business, how much estimate of real estate value can you actually as a company generate? Because I'm sure that we are sitting on very prime land in Bathinda. So once all -- you're done with all the edible oil units being wound out, how much of expected real estate value you expect to generate?

I think it's too early for me to comment on that. Let's wait out to see how the real estate market is once the business is shut, and we've removed our machinery it'll -- which will be at least the next 2 years. So I think it's a little early for me to comment on that.

Okay, okay. And about the IMIL, how much -- we have given very interesting projections in your. So does the current Punjab -- current Punjab government helping out in IMIL sales and…

The Punjab policy is quite normal with -- which allows free trade and hence, we are doing well in the trade. So we'll continue on that front.

Okay. And if you could just mention how much was in this quarter, how much was ENA sales and how much was the ethanol sales?

I think that should be mentioned on the presentation. If not, I can get back to you. I don't have the exact figures with me right now.

I'll get into the queue and I'll just check again if there is something.

The next question is from the line of Narendra from RoboCapital.

So my first question is that given that the FCI rice will be available from, I guess, full effect next quarter. So as things stand, what is more profitable? Is it the rice or the maize?

Are you talking about FCI rice or damaged rice?

FCI rice.

They're about the same.

Okay, okay. So I mean the margins would go -- are we expecting given that the maize prices have corrected and the FCI rice is to come in, do we expect the margins to go back to previous quarters, 7%, 8%?

Yes, we expect margins to increase. I think once the edible oil business shut, so the cumulative margin of the companies will increase significantly. So when talking about EBITDA margin, we expect the distillery EBITDA margin to increase with the correction in raw material prices. And we have good crops forecasted in states like Assam and Bihar, which will also help the industry. So yes, we're quite hopeful on that front.

Okay. So what kind of margins are we looking at? Is it 8%? 10%?

I think the company will go back around to at least 10%, 11% of EBITDA margin from the distillery segment.

Okay, okay. That's great, sir. Second question is regarding ethanol pricing. So the ethanol price from maize, are we seeing any -- are we expecting any increase in that from the government?

No, I don't think there will be an increase in the price of ethanol from maize.

Okay, okay. So given there's this new Biodiesel plant coming in, right? So -- and given that there would be no price increase, and we are already functioning at 100% capacity. So next year, our revenue should be around INR 2,500 crores, INR 2,600 crores. Is that a correct guess?

See, the distillery should give us about INR 1,750 crores to INR 1,800 crores. And the Biodiesel once working at 100% capacity utilization should give us anywhere close to INR 250 crores of revenue. But for the first year, we're not taking 100% capacity utilization because there will be somewhat of a learning curve as we're entering a new industry. And with the Bengal unit working at 100% capacity utilization, should give us a revenue of at least around INR 750 crores to INR 800 crores. So yes, your figures are broadly correct.

The next question is from the line of Balamurali Krishnan from Onam Investment Advisors.

Regarding this FCI rice policy, I think it's even though it's government relaxed the price a little bit, but I think it's valid till June-end only. So earlier 1, 1.5 years before we are using FCI rice for making ethanol. So at that time, what was the procurement price and the margins we were getting the FCI rice?

See, firstly, the FCI rice policy, I believe, has come on now till the end of this sugar year. So I think the industry will have FCI rice until September end, at least. When FCI rice was available in the past, it was available at INR 20 a kg, which is now at INR 22.5 a kg. So that is the one big difference from the past to now. Otherwise, I think the policy overall remains the same.

Yes. Okay. So the -- earlier when we were using FCI rice at that time, the EBIT margin of the distillery was around 16%, 17% when we see. So with this INR 2 difference, maybe we can expect around 15% EBITDA margins…

No, I think -- let's see because I think they are safer to say, as I mentioned, in the lower double-digit range. But once the Biodiesel kicks in, I think we will be again moving towards the previous EBITDA margin as Biodiesel will have very minimal raw material cost and mostly processing costs.

Okay. Fine. So in the current quarter, this maize's price is around INR 25.5 right?

Yes, as of today.

So and one more thing is regarding -- so in this year, we are expecting only Biodiesel to get commissioned. So maybe this 150 KLPD will come on stream by the end of the year, right? So only the additional revenue would be from the Biodiesel plant and we'll lose that edible oil revenue maybe around INR 800 crores in this fiscal, right, next fiscal?

Yes.

Ladies and gentlemen, the next question is from the line of Saket Kapoor from Kapoor & Company.

Sir, [Foreign Language] So what are we investing at the same? And how have we planned it in terms of the output and the feedstock stock.

[Foreign Language] So we'll continue to do the same there. And our power plant, again, since we've had good success with paddy straw as the main fuel and Fatehabad also being a rice belt, so we'll go again with the paddy straw based boiler there.

Okay. And what will be the CapEx?

See, we're still finalizing the machinery orders. So I can't -- I can only give you a ballpark figure. As we finalize, we'll have more clarity. But I think including the bio-CNG, the paddy straw-based power plant, and the distillery, I think we're looking at around INR 370 crores of CapEx in total.

Okay. Sir, you have alluded to a number of capacities in terms of additional capacities. So one request, sir, if in the presentation, we could provide what are we eyeing in terms of capacity addition, greenfield, and brownfield so that would summarize and also give us an update on where are we in terms of commercialization of the same. I think so [Foreign Language] so if that could be summarized in a single page in a presentation -- included in the presentation that would suffice a lot of questions for us.

Noted [Foreign Language].

[Foreign Language]

[Foreign Language] About INR 107 crores in BCL is the long-term debt, which is under interest subvention. So the applicable interest rate is 4.5% on the same. Working capital in BCL as of today is around INR 200 crores [Foreign Language] INR 60 crores [Foreign Language] in the next coming quarters, next 2 quarters because we're shutting down the edible oil business. For Svaksha Distillery, about INR 105 crores in long-term debt, [Foreign Language] INR 65 crores again is under interest subvention [Foreign Language] and working capital of INR 55 crores at Svaksha Distillery. Besides this company [Foreign Language] commercial buildings [Foreign Language] where they have taken LRD and no other debt besides some small vehicle loans in the company.

Sir, when we look at the IMIL business or the ENA part of the story, I think so the feedstock [Foreign Language] Is that understanding correct?

You're correct.

[Foreign Language]

[Foreign Language] Now we are using rice. But yes, many times we use rice for ENA.

[Foreign Language] How is the ENA market sir, currently shifting in this states where we operate and I think sir, interstate [Foreign Language]

[Foreign Language] You're right. ENA market 1 is doing very well because the alco-bev sector is growing at -- about, I think, 10% to 12% year-on-year. And ENA [Foreign Language] I think I know of just one small ENA plant being added in the country as of now because the licenses have become extremely difficult to get along with the environmental clearance. So it is a business that has very high barriers to entry, and we're seeing very little competition coming in at the moment. And with the excise policy where the excise policy is concerned, Punjab [Foreign Language] policy, import, export [Foreign Language]. It allows for free trade, whereas Bengal has now added about, I think, INR 6 a liter on import into Bengal. So that is beneficial to the distilleries stationed in Bengal.

[Foreign Language]

[Foreign Language] since the liquor prohibition, now they can't sell their ENA in Bihar. [Foreign Language] With the import duty coming into Bengal it's given us level playing field.

[Foreign Language]

I think around 70, 69 around that stable around that.

[Foreign Language]

[Foreign Language]

[Foreign Language] That is what the though process is behind setting up the distilleries with multiple feedstock?

Correct.

Okay. But sir, when you look at the long-term policy for -- from the government end, sir, have you people are there for a long time. Have you -- are you people getting the sense that is the government able to address this feedstock issue because the way people have come up with the distilleries and even your one in the [indiscernible] the feedstock issue has not been addressed in that proportion.

Feedstock issue will be resolved in the coming time. I think the government [Foreign Language] Maize is the future and maize is an industrial crop. [Foreign Language] and now you're seeing farmers getting MSP and above MSP from the industry. See, it has many, many benefits for the entire nation. One, your water level is not going down as opposed to growing paddy. Secondly, paddy has now become a crop [Foreign Language] at MSP, which is way above the market price [Foreign Language] right? So now the government does not want to intervene. And third, it's a more profitable crop for the farmer as opposed to paddy. [Foreign Language] they will earn about 20% more as opposed to paddy. And in states like Bihar, where the yields are as per the global standard, the farmers are benefiting greatly from this policy. So one, it saves the nation's water. Two, it does not involve the government getting involved in the procurement procedure of the crop, which is a complete waste of taxpayer money. And 3, it directly impacts the farmers' income. [Foreign Language] So with time, if there is demand, there will be a supplier. We no longer need the rice we are growing. Punjab and Haryana really desperately need to make a shift towards crops like maize if you want to have a sustainable future for our children. So I'm not worried. I think with time, the cropping pattern in the nation will change. It is changing. We're seeing it change and maize will become the crop -- the preferred crop for ethanol. And you will see that BCL will continue to differentiate itself from our peers. We're not worried about the competition. We're always looking to be bulletproof, that's what we did with the paddy straw. That's what we're doing with Biodiesel, and we'll continue to innovate on this front.

[Foreign Language]

Maize is sufficient, maize is fine too. Both [indiscernible] are fine.

[Foreign Language]

It's not the same. OMCs will not buy. They have their specification, which we have to adhere to and only then. See, any crop we're extracting alcohol out of starch, any starch bearing material can be used to extract alcohol.

Okay. And lastly, sir, pricing front, how are the price trends for maize being for this quarter and even for 9-month average and the comparative number?

See this quarter, as I mentioned, we've seen a correction from the previous quarter, and we're expecting to see more correction and -- hopefully, we're hoping for more correction in the coming quarters with the new harvest coming in and the FCI rice being allowed for ethanol.

In pricing terms, in percentage terms, can you give some color in what has been the trend price reduction, which we are witnessing in the procurement prices for the-- raw material?

[Foreign Language]

Sir this is for the FCI [Foreign Language].

[Foreign Language]

Okay. So maize prices have been reduced from INR 27.5? Maize and rice are equally priced at the same level?

No, Rice is priced -- always rice is more expensive and rice is priced differently in -- there's a major difference in the prices of rice in Bengal and Punjab since milling has started in Punjab. So Punjab rice is now around INR 25.5, whereas in Bengal, it's still around INR 27, INR 27.5.

The next question is from the line of Shravan Niranjan from Analyse India. I would request you to please use your handset.

Is it better?

Yes, sir.

Yes. So with respect to the distillery segment, sir, you had mentioned that we could see maybe around INR 750 crores to INR 1,800 crores, INR 1,900 crore revenue. So this would be with the 700 KLPD plus 150, if I'm not mistaken.

No, no this is -- no, this is not including the INR 150.

So this is just with the 700 KLPD?

Yes.

And sir, assuming we reached that INR 1,100 mark, maybe 2, 3 years down the line, how much would 1,100 KLPD, how much would it fetch up in terms of revenue as a rough number if possible?

1,150 would be, I think, around -- depends on the ethanol price in the future, but [Foreign Language] I think it should be around INR 2,800 crores.

All right. Okay. Sir, then the -- so the Biodiesel, just to again clarify here. So the Bathinda plant, the work is going on, which will take another couple of months. And Kharagpur as of now, there has been no work. We've only got the permissions or clearances required. IS that correct?

Correct.

And in terms of not very specific, but again, a 75 KLPD in terms of Biodiesel, what would that fetch us in terms of revenue? And like you -- would you be able to give an idea of the weak margins I may get on that EBITDA margin?

See, the revenue is around -- what is working at 100% capacity utilization. We expect the revenue to be close to INR 50 crores. And margins, I don't want to give any specific figures as of now, we are waiting to commission. But margins, of course, will be very good, considering the fact that most of the raw material that we will be using to produce the Biodiesel will be in-house with very little cost, only processing cost involved. So we expect very, very good margins from that sector of the business.

Right. Sir, just one -- with respect to the -- there was a slide in the presentation about the different players in the industry and how we are about 6th as of FY '24, say, 7th, in fact, in the industry. So this is both molasses and with the grain-based distillery. If you could give us a number -- only grain-based distillery, if I was to consider that, where would we be standing?

I think in the grain-based, we would be top 3. I don't know. I think the top 3 are quite close by in terms of capacity. So it's tough for me to comment.

And otherwise, if I want to make a switch from molasses to grain-based do -- is it a sort of expensive procedure? Like would -- is there a lot of -- in terms of my plants and machinery, is there a big difference? Or can -- is it roughly the same? How easy is it to convert from one?

There are a few sections that are exclusive to grain-based ethanol production, and there's a few sections that are exclusive to molasses-based ethanol production. So if an ethanol plant -- if a molasses plant wants to set up a grain-based plant, yes, the CapEx is significant. But we're seeing some of the big players establishing some grain capacity for off-season. But yes, the CapEx is significant.

Right. Sir, and just lastly, so it's been mentioned at a couple of cases that we use wet maize, we procure wet maize. Is there a difference between wet maize and dry maize in terms of either availability or pricing or anything of that sorts?

Yes, see, wet maize is a crop that very few buyers are there in the market because mostly it's infected maize. Once the maize has been wet for a couple of days, it tends to catch an infection. But what we've done is we've installed our own dryers to help dry out the maize very quickly. And so the benefits of that are there are very few buyers in the market for the maize. Yes, the quality is inferior to properly dried out maize, but the price more than makes up for it. And we can blend it with good quality maize, so that doesn't impact our process whatsoever. So we definitely do take advantage of that.

The next question is from the line of Rajesh Agarwal from Proprietary Advisors.

Congratulations on the Golden Jubilee year. I hope some physical involvement with the shareholders will be there in some form or the other during the course of the year. Now my question is at what price since FCI rice price is fixed, INR 22.50, now at what price the margins are same with maize? Because maize is a fluctuating price. Last quarter, it was INR 27.50. Right now, it is INR 25. So at what price, the rice and the maize, they result in similar margins?

See, for that, one major factor is the price of DDGS. Just price of DDGS is also highly fluctuated. And currently, what we are experiencing is that the acceptability of maize DDGS has increased significantly in the country, and we're getting a good price for maize DDGS. So considering the current prices of DDGS of both rice and maize, if they are to remain the same, then once maize is around INR 24, I think the profitability will be the same in both the sectors. But price of DDGS tends to fluctuate a lot. So it all depends on that.

Okay. If Goyal Distillery Plant, I think it is approved for interest subvention scheme?

The Goyal distillery will not be under interest subvention. Although it was approved for interest subvention, the deadline for commissioning has passed. So that will not fall under interest subvention.

Okay. Okay. No issue. And can I take it like this that last quarter, average maize price was INR 27.50 and now it is INR 25?

Not INR 25 because it has -- there has been a steady decline. So currently, it's around INR 25.5. So I think it would be safe to say for now, the average is around INR 25.7, INR 25.8. Let's see if we have another 45 days.

We have. But last quarter, it was INR 27.50.

Around that, yes.

Yes. And when can we expect our -- the 75 KLPD Biodiesel plant to be commissioned at Bathinda?

I think it will take another 3 months from today at least. We're trying to do it in less than that, yes.

Okay. Maybe around May, May. May will be safe month to say.

Yes.

Second thing, what is the -- any idea what is the current Biodiesel price at which it is being supplied?

I think it's around INR 104 liter.

INR 104 liter. Okay. And what -- our corn oil, what percentage of the raw material it will constitute?

For a complete 75 KLPD plant, around 50%.

50%. That's very good. That's very good. And the rest of the raw material, we will be able to procure from the market?

Yes. See, we are setting up an oil extraction unit in our Kharagpur distillery as well. So we're not setting up -- we have taken the permission for Biodiesel, but we're waiting to set that up. But oil extraction unit, we have started the work. So even the oil that we are extracting there, we can easily transport it and bring to Bathinda. And there are other various raw materials available also. Acid oil is available, some quantity of used cooking oil is available. Fatty oils are -- fatty acid is available. So we'll be using that.

Wonderful. Wonderful. I must appreciate it's a very good forward-looking planning.

The next question is from the line of Shashank Agarwal, who is an individual investor.

I have a couple of questions. Sir, the Biodiesel plant, you have a capacity of 75 KLPD. Sir, why only 75 KLPD?

See, raw material being an issue. Of course, we could have added a bigger plant, but raw material is an issue. As I just mentioned, 50% of raw material will be in-house and the rest we have confidence that we'll be able to procure from the market, but we didn't foresee we will be able to procure too much raw material in one place because India as of now does not have a used cooking oil supply chain. Major raw material for Biodiesel globally is used cooking oil, but we don't have a formal supply chain in our country. What we see is whether that's the [Foreign Language] or the caterers, they continue to reuse the same oil. So there's no formal supply chain for that. And secondly, for Biodiesel, the oil should be indigenous. India does not have enough indigenous oil in the country. So for that, we set up a 75 KLPD Biodiesel plant.

Sir, one more question related to this. Sir, like some of the listed players like [ Kodak ] everything, sir, they are having the capacity, but they are not able to sell it because OMCs are not lifting that much. So will it be a problem for this company also for Biodiesel?

From my knowledge, the tender that was out was it was not...

Sir, the tender -- so the entire quantity volume of the tender is very small, like what I have studied in the sector so far.

But the capacity is also very small. There is still a gap between the tendered amount and the offered capacity. So we don't foresee that being a major issue.

Sir, Kodak has a capacity of 1,500 KLPD. It is not --it is still not able to sell. It is only using 10%. So there is a problem with the sector. That's what I'm trying to tell you, right? That's what I'm trying to tell.

From the people we have spoken to, we haven't heard of anything. I can -- I'm not sure about the specific company you are mentioning. Even we've spoken to 2, 3 manufacturer. Yes, there is a major problem on the raw material front. But this is the first time I'm hearing that you're saying that there is a problem from the procurement front, which I don't foresee. Yes, there is a problem industry-wide when it comes to raw material availability. But we have our own raw materials to suffice for 50% capacity. So we're not too worried on that front.

The next question is from the line of Bhavesh, who is an individual investor.

Congratulations on a Golden Jubilee year. My first question is with respect to the show cause notice issued by SEBI. I forgot to ask you this on the previous call. So can you throw some light on this? What exactly is this?

So I think the show cause notice from SEBI, I think it's -- it was regarding entity which they said should be considered as promoter, which was not declared as promoter entity. And I think the case has been adjudicated, and we will come up with a resolution soon.

So no penalty and nothing, right? Or you are going for in settlement?

We have applied for settlement, and let's see what we're hoping to hear back soon.

Secondly, so now you're going to shut down the edible oil business and you're going to start the Biodiesel plant in a few months. So can the Biodiesel and your 150 KLPD compensate for the loss of business due to the shutting down or it will still?

Are you talking about just revenue?

Yes, I'm talking about the revenue.

See, just these 2 capacities will not make up for the revenue loss from the edible oil setup. But let me clarify. I don't -- I don't know why we should just look at the revenue. With the closing down of the edible oil business, we're freeing up our working capital, reducing our overheads. So many costs involved in running this edible oil unit, which has such low margin and such high volatility in the market. So I think all the ratios of the company, the working of the company will see a major, major improvement once this edible oil business is shut. So I don't think we should just look at the revenue. I think the revenue loss will be compensated by a mile by the increase in efficiency and the overall profitability of the company.

[Operator Instructions] The next follow-up question is from the line of Dipesh Sancheti from Manya Finance.

Congratulations on BCL completing 50 years. And just the question was regarding the rice prices. Now since you mentioned that BCL will also go in for some rice -- the rice prices of ethanol is around INR 58.5. So isn't it better to go for only ENA with rice and rest…?

To manufacture ENA from FCI rice.

So how much are we planning to use rice as a raw material?

See, we have filled in the tender. I cannot comment on that until the tender results are out. We are waiting on the allocation. And once the allocation is received, so we have filled in about 15% to 17% of our quantity to be from FCI rice on an average throughout the year. So let's see what the tender results are.

When are we expecting these tender results?

I think in a day or 2.

Okay. In a day or 2, that's early. Okay. Now just to understand what the maize prices for every INR 1 fluctuation in maize prices, how much is the margins differentiating?

About INR 2.6 a liter.

INR 2.6 a liter. Okay. And this INR 116 crore CapEx, which you mentioned, that was mainly for the 150 KL for the Bathinda plant, right?

Yes.

So for the 150 KLPD, right?

Yes.

And this Goyal Distillery it will be only ethanol or it will be a mix of ethanol and ENA?

No. Just ethanol.

Just ethanol. Okay. Is there any PLI scheme from the government?

No.

Nothing.

The next question is from the line of Niraj from NJ Investments.

Most of my questions have been answered. Just one question I have. Can you please share what was the DDGS price for the last quarter that has just gone by? And what is the current DDGS price for both rice and maize?

See, for last quarter, DDGS was priced, I think, around about -- I think the average for maize DDGS, I think, would be around INR 12 to INR 13. And in the current quarter, currently, I think it's for maize is around INR 15 and for rice is around INR 16.

The next follow-up question is from the line of Saket Kapoor from Kapoor & Company.

Sir, Slide number 30, you have mentioned about how the debt repayment schedule is going to be. So [Foreign Language] you have mapped it in your presentation.

See, that depends on our future expansion plans [Foreign Language] Otherwise, with the current debt, I think we're already on the peak. Now, depending on how we choose to finance our future projects, I think '25 max.

[Foreign Language] working capital 100. So this is taking into account the Goyal refinery also expansion [Foreign Language] excluding that.

Excluding.

Okay. And there, we will be requiring INR 60 crores, I think you mentioned?

I didn't mention [Foreign Language]. We were yet to decide. I had mentioned that a total project cost of 250 KLPD ethanol and 20 tones bio-CNG plant would be around INR 370 crores.

[Foreign Language] this is what we are replacing with the vanaspati and ghee business that we are exiting and Goyal refinery we have purchased through any NCLT route or how have this shaped up?

There was a direct share transfer.

[Foreign Language]

We haven't disclosed that.

Okay. But everything has been done. Cash has been withdrawn. We have paid completed.

Everything has been done.

Okay. So this is through the company only BCL has direct ownership of the share 100%.

Yes, yes. Goyal Distillery is a wholly owned subsidiary of BCL Industries.

Okay. [Foreign Language]

It wasn't a significant -- it wasn't a huge amount to change our -- have a significant dent on our balance sheet.

Okay. [Foreign Language]

[indiscernible]

[Foreign Language] But how will -- why are we not hide it off and sold it in some way or the other by the brand which we have created over a period of time? Or why is it that we are setting it down here?

Brand was created, but with time, it's become increasingly difficult to compete with giants like Fortune and others. So -- we thought it was the best to shut it down. Secondly, the unit being in the heart of the city, we were not going to get environmental clearance for much longer. We would have had to shift the unit anyways. And we envision that shifting the unit would be too expensive as shifting would mean that we'd have to set up a -- pretty much a new unit, [Foreign Language]. So the CapEx would be too high and there's no return on that. So that's why we decided to exit.

Okay. The land that is leased or owned by the company?

Mostly owned. Some part is leased.

Then we will look to divest that. So that should be the thought process going. [Foreign Language]

Yes.

[Foreign Language] just to get what kind of …

[Foreign Language] I think we should wait and you'll have more clarity in the future.

Then you will -- we'll take at an opportune time, but since it's the heart of the city, I would just like to understand [Foreign Language]

[Foreign Language]

The next follow-up question is from the line of Shravan Niranjan from Analyse India. Ladies and gentlemen, we have lost the connection of the current participant. We will move on to the next participant. The next question is from the line of Rajesh Agrawal.

Yes. Anyway, congratulations for stock being categorized in breweries and distillery segment. I think many of the shareholders may not be knowing both the BSE and NSE have categorized instead of edible oil, it is now under breweries and distilleries. See, my additional question is right now, we are going with the CapEx on 75 KLPD, which is in the last leg, no doubt and 150 KLPD ethanol expansion. That is something around INR 130 crores and INR 115 crores. I believe it is all coming out of internal accruals or any amount of debt is involved?

For now, it is coming out of internal accrual, but I think the company will look to raise about -- get about INR 60 crores to INR 70 crores in debt for these 2 projects.

Total. That will be the total.

Total.

[Operator Instructions] The next follow-up question is from the line of Bhavesh, who is an individual investor.

Just a quick follow-up. So since you are going to raise some debt in the next 1 to 2 years, would your interest payments go up like?

Interests will not go up because we're reducing our working capital by INR 90 crores. So even if we are to raise a debt of INR 70 crores, our overall debt will go down only.

So that will be raised from banks and not from the investors. Because, as I can see, the promoter shareholding has gone down to 57.77%. So like are promoters planning to sell and put in the capital?

We're raising debt, of course, [Foreign Language]

Okay. So no further selling of shares?

No.

The next question is from the line of Manish Gupta, who is an individual investor.

[Foreign Language] What was pricing in that?

I'm sorry?

[Foreign Language] What was pricing in that?

[Foreign Language] Including all of transportation, just let me look at that. [Foreign Language] This we for INR 77 a liter.

[Foreign Language]

Fixed. [Foreign Language] There is some finance cost also involved. Besides that also, it is good price.

[Foreign Language] That should add to a margin for this project.

[Foreign Language]

Great. That's all for my side.

As there are no further questions from the participants, I would now like to hand the conference over to the management for closing comments.

Thank you, everyone, for joining, and I wish you all a great evening. Thank you. Thank you again.

On behalf of Go India Advisors, that concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us, and you may now disconnect your lines.