Bumble Inc. (BMBL) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

All right. Good morning, everyone. Thanks for joining us again, Citi Global TMT Conference. I'm Ygal Arounian. I'm on the Internet team here. Really happy to have Bumble CFO with us now, Anuradha Subramanian. Thank you so much for joining us. I'm going to just read Bumble's safe harbor first before we get started. I saw people roll in still. So this presentation, including our comments and answers to questions may include forward-looking statements. These forward-looking statements are subject to various risks and uncertainties and reflects our current expectations, based on our beliefs, assumptions and information currently available to us. Descriptions of these risks and other factors that could cause actual results to differ materially from these forward-looking statements are discussed in more detail in our earnings press release dated August 7, 2024. And our filings with the SEC, including our annual report Form 10-K for the year ended December 31, 2023, and our subsequent periodic filings. Now I know what it's like to be an IR.

All right. Let's -- a lot's happened. Obviously, the best place to start is just with the new strategy you guys laid out in Q2, which is off the back app refresh. So maybe let's start there with that app refresh in April. Kind of what happened there? What led to the -- to do this more kind of fully fledged relaunch now?

Yes, absolutely. First of all, thank you for having me, it's great to be here. If you take a step back, at the beginning of the year, we announced a set of fundamental changes to how we were thinking about the long-term growth of the business and a part of that included the work that we did to reset our cost base. We brought in a new management and leadership team, a lot of fresh talent into the company. And we also announced that we were embarking on a sort of multi-step product refresh road map. The May launch of our product was really our first in that process. And if you look at the components of what were in the May relaunch, we had things like Opening Moves. We had additional features from how do you have new photographs on the profile, how do you make use of creating profiles robust, all of that. And all those things are very successful in hoping bright for our customers, and coming out of the profile -- coming out of the May launch improvements in a lot of those metrics, seeing better matches for women. We've seen more engagement and more can come out of those changes that we have done. So we feel really good about the path we are on from a product perspective. However, if you look at the trends that we are seeing from top of the funnel, and we've been saying this now for a few quarters, that we are seeing some softness, especially in some of our more mature markets. We took a step back and we realized that we needed to do a more holistic reset in terms of what the overall user experience was on the app for us to reignite user growth. And so now we took a hard look at what our road map looks like over the next few quarters, and we've made this decision. And as you can imagine, this is not a decision that we've made likely. But we fundamentally believe that for us to not just reignite user growth, but for us to build a strong business in the long term, this is the right step that we need to be taking.

Okay. So we'll dig into the components in detail before we do. There were 3 components in this. I mean just -- so just to refresh for everybody, what those? We'll kind of dig into each individually?

Yes. So if you think about ultimately what is core to a dating app, people come to a dating app to find other people that they want to meet. That is, at the most basic level, what a dating app stands for. And Bumble's strength historically has really been -- because we have been the preeminent app for -- that puts women at the center of their relationships, puts women at the center of the dating experience. And that is something that still holds very true today. If you look at NPS scores and you look at customer satisfaction scores, we stand head and shoulders above our peers in terms of what we stand for in terms of women. Where our focus now is going to be on is really what does our core product experience looks like. And we've effectively highlighted 3 things that we want to focus on. One is focusing on our core ecosystem. And when we talk about ecosystem, it is effectively everything that you see when you come to the app, the people, all of that. The second part of it is, what does the core customer experience look like, whether it's from a product perspective, whether it's from a support perspective, safety perspective? And the last part of this is, how do you think about the monetization experience that someone has on the app? And that includes not just what some behind the paywall, but it equally extends to what someone sees if they are just the free users. So these are the 3 sort of pillars that we've laid out for the next few quarters that we will be focused on.

Okay, great. So let's dive into each of those individually now. So maybe like we could frame it in the -- what was the challenge and what's the solution, I guess, for each? But in the need to balance the ecosystem, you talked about Bumble was always women-centric and had a healthier ecosystem in that regard. What happened? What do you see in the need to balance the ecosystem? Was it bad actors? Or was the -- did the mix of male versus female change too much? And what's the approach to changing? Or where do you want to get it here?

Sure. So I think it's important to remember that when we talk ecosystem, we are not just talking about removing bad actors or increasing the number of women or increasing a certain cohort of people, we're talking about it much more holistically than that. And obviously, removal of bad actors, removal of spam, all of that is an always-on experience for us because ultimately, the safety of our users is at the core of what we do. But if you go back to what I said earlier, people come to the app because they want to see the people they want to see. And so our ecosystem is effectively the product that we are offering our users. And so we want to make sure that we get the balance of what people see when they come to our app, right? And that includes, in some cases, fixing the balance in terms of gender. In some cases, it includes fixing the balance in terms of intent. It includes everything from what do you put out there in terms of your profile because ultimately, all of these can impact the experience that someone has. So to give you an example, if you show up with your profile and you have one photo of yourself, it's a photo that is half hidden, you could barely see someone's face. In some cases, we see people put photographs of like a group picture, you don't even know who is the person that you're supposed to swipe on. And that ultimately creates a bad experience because the person who's looking at that photograph doesn't entirely know what that other person's intent is. So forcing the ecosystem be curated, such that everyone shows up at looking like their best self, is a huge part of what we're looking to do. And this also actually extends to how we think about marketing. So being intentional about who we are acquiring in every market is also a big part of what we will be doing as we think about focusing on the ecosystem.

Okay. Well, I want to talk about marketing more. We'll come back to it. Does this change the overall kind of user growth trajectory, or let's say, user growth TAM, if you're trying to weed out? Maybe that's not the right word, but put some of these things in place, to higher the hurdle?

Yes. So I think it is possible that on a temporary basis, we do create a little bit of friction as we are looking to curate the ecosystem. So to give an example of one of the things that we did as part of our May relaunch was we mandated that everyone should have 4 photographs on their profile. We did see that, that has an impact on things like activation rates because sort of drop out when they are forced to fill out 4 photographs. But ultimately, what we did also see that women had a better experience on the app coming out of that. There were better match rates. People were having more conversations with other people because, again, that eventually finished the activation process and showed up in the ecosystem where the people that were -- a better quality in terms of their intent, right? So we know that all of these things ultimately are huge in terms of driving word of mouth. And while it may have a temporary impact on things like activation rates, ultimately, it actually leads to a better improvement in overall top of the funnel user growth. So over time, we believe that these are the right steps for us to continue growing users again.

And that was the factor that went into your guidance for the year?

Exactly.

Right. Okay. So let's move to talk about the customer experience, which is mostly around product and product innovation. And I don't know, broadly, product innovation or maybe lack of product innovation among the dating app ecosystem tends to get blamed for some of the challenges the ecosystem has seen. So what was lacking there? And what's the focus around product innovation that gets you back to the trajectory you want to be on?

Yes. I think product innovation is key to ultimately how we show up for customers. And Lidiane, who is our new CEO, is extremely passionate about, especially this aspect of the plan that we have set in place. And ultimately, if you look at dating apps over the last 12-plus years, the product experience has largely stayed the same. And so we want to make sure that we are bringing back to the forefront when it comes to the customer's experience. And if you look at the dating journey overall, even in real life, right, dating can be quite daunting for people, right? It is you're putting yourself out there. It's a very personal experience. And a lot of the same challenges remain even on dating apps. And so the job that we have to do is to create product experiences that help customers in a way that removes the friction in the experience. And if you think about it from the dating journey perspective, from the time someone comes to the app, how do we help them create the best profiles? How do we help them curate the best photographs? How do we help them have the best conversations? How do we help them look through other profiles to have more meaningful experiences in terms of people that they can engage with? What does our recommendation algorithm look like? And how do we make sure that, that is the best possible in the ecosystem? All of those things go towards making the overall product experience better. We also want to make sure that we bring sort of joy and fun back into the experience. So a lot of the features that you'll see in our road map over the next few quarters will really be about, how do you just make the experience just more joyful? And when you do user research, when you talk to people about what are some of the biggest pain points in dating, a lot of them will tell you it's lack of confidence, right? They just don't know how to put themselves out there in a way that showcases who they are. Some of the features that you will see us unveil over the next few quarters, especially around things like AI photo picker, things like that, are really about showcasing the best who you are as a person. And really, again, removing the friction in the experience. The second part of the product experience is customer support and safety, making sure that safety is at the forefront of what we do. We are going to be rolling out some new product features that are very specific to the safety experience, things like ID verification that are going to be core to how our users can feel safe about who the other person is on the platform and knowing that they are all real people that they interact with. All of those things are also going to be part of the core product experience.

Okay. And in terms of the product focus on a particular segment, so Gen Z and women come up regularly, is it geared towards making improvements more on certain areas? Or is it really just across the board?

I think the beauty of Bumble has always been that we are known as the brand that puts women at the center of the experience. So the focus on women is going to be pretty paramount. But we've also been pretty broad-based in terms of the user base that we've catered to. We've never been on a we are an app just for Gen Z or were an app just for millennials. We have a pretty healthy ecosystem across all sort of genders all demographics. So our goal is very much to be meeting people where they are in the user experience, and that could mean something different if you're 18, and that could mean something different if you're 45. The marketing experience that we bring to support the product experience is a key aspect of how we do differentiate. So if you think about our college experience, as an example, our campus ambassador program, that is very specifically catering to the 18- to 22-year-old demographic because we show up in a very different way versus how we show up to a millennial, as an example. That's where I think we can differentiate really well. But again, our app is very broad-based. So you'll see us do different things for different people.

Okay. And then the third pillar is monetization. So you're going to pause monetization efforts, not pausing monetization, completely, just clarify that point. And then what does that mean? What does the road map look like for short-term monetization, long-term monetization? What are you trying to achieve? Maybe what's the end target from that?

Yes, I do want to clarify. We are not causing monetization, right? Our monetization efforts are very much ongoing. Obviously, we have millions of people that come to the app today that we are monetizing, that pay for various experiences that they get on the app. The monetization effort is really about us looking at the value proposition that we are providing of users across their user experience. And that may involve us rebalancing the feature sets that exist between what a free user gets today versus what a paid user gets. And again, I think as a premium app, it's very important to cater not just to the paid experience, but also equally to the value that you're providing the free users. So it's really about us taking a pause to look at the experience end-to-end and making sure that the right value is being created at each stage of the user's joining. So that's really what we are doing. So it's not a pause in monetization. Obviously, we still have very robust subscription offerings. We still have active -- what that's ongoing around things like pricing, all of that is still happening. What we have decided to do is we have decided to temporarily pause on adding more features to our higher subscription tier, that Premium+ that we had talked about, while we do a little bit of this balancing work in terms of what the monetization looks like.

Okay. So it's just on that Premium+ tier?

It's on the Premium+ as well, but we are equally looking at what does monetization look like potentially on the lower end. Also something that we are taking a look at. We're also looking at rebalancing feature sets between, like I said, each of these tiers as well. So it's a pretty comprehensive set of activities that form the overall sort of monetization value. And that also includes the work that we're doing on consumables as well.

Okay. Do you want to elaborate on the consumable part for a second?

We've historically talked about consumables quite a bit as Bumble has always been subscription-first in terms of how we show up product paid users, but we have used consumables very effectively in providing value-add at different points in a user's journey. Compliments is a perfect example of something that often is an entry point for a non-payer to experience a paid feature. And then it becomes a valuable engine to then convert someone into a subscription tier. So you'll see us continue to push in those areas strategically, with the goal to, again, making sure that there's value being created across the user [ of app ].

Got it. Okay. But -- so generally, in the near term, what's a focus to drive up free-to-paid conversion, but nothing changes strategically in the long term on that objective?

Correct, that's exactly.

So now you mentioned, marketing and the brand a little bit, but I think kind of worth tying it all together around these 3 points. You're involved in the product. There's one side on making the product better, and there's the other side around keeping the brand message and conveying to users that, hey, we've made all these changes. So can you talk about the marketing road map and what that looks like?

Sure. So Bumble's brand has always been one of its biggest strengths. So our goal is in ensuring that we continue to remain top of mind for our users from a brand perspective. So that isn't always on effort, and that's something that you'll see us continue to invest in. For example, most recently, we've announced this partnership with Women's NBA as an example, where we are a sort of big brand ambassador for the program. So we have a lot of sort of brand building activities that we will continue to invest in. We have other activities that we are investing in like the campus program that I talked about, which continues to be a source of introducing Bumble to people that are using dating apps for the first time. And in the last 10 years, our college ambassadors have been some of our strongest sort of brand ambassadors for us, right, in terms of talking about Bumble and talking about the features of what this app for. So we want to be more thoughtful and deliberate about how we continue to curate that program. And then we want to be much more intentional in how we are investing our brand dollars in some of our mature markets. In a lot of our mature markets, our brand awareness is very high already. So now it's about, okay, how do you take that high brand awareness and put it into something that is much more meaningful? So you'll see us investing in exponential events, IRL events things that -- again take the brand awareness that we already have and convert it into people actually meeting in real life. And then a lot of Tier 2, Tier 3 cities where our brand awareness may be lower. I think it's much more about how do you bring people into the funnel. We're also equally investing in analytics and technology around marketing, as increasingly becomes sort of more digital. We want to make sure that we are very methodical about how we can create attribution for our brand dollars. So that is a growing area of investment. So revamping our MMM models, making sure that our performance models that track our performance spend are sort of up in terms of the tools that are available in the market, all of those things are things that we want to continue to invest in.

Okay. Just to be clear, when you talk about the more mature markets, are you talking city by city or kind of country like U.S. versus international?

We look at markets at a pretty micro level. So you have cities in the U.S. that are more mature, but you equally have large cities in the U.S. where we are still very new and nascent in terms of our growth. So definitely, it's not a country-by-country approach, it's very much a regional city-by-city approach.

Okay. All right. So shifting gears a little bit. Maybe just for a second on the macros, it continues to get so much attention here. How is that impacting what you're seeing at all? Things getting better or worse, just kind of rehash what we're seeing in the macro?

So like we said in August at our earnings, we are seeing some softness in top of the funnel, and that's continued into Q3 as well. We certainly think, Macro is playing a part in that, especially for consumer companies are -- as people are being a little bit more conscious in terms of spend, we do expect that, that is something that is having an impact. Again, it's something that we're keeping a pretty close eye on. And if we see any more changes, obviously, we'll update everyone.

Got it. Okay. Let's hit on Badoo for a little. There have been some changes there, some of the metrics. There's a lot of factors there with Ukraine and [ whatnot ] in Europe. But you're still making some more changes there. So what's the road map for Badoo? What's the kind of ultimate end goal or end stage and expectation for Badoo?

Sure. So Badoo is actually a good sort of case study in the efforts that we've taken over the last, I would say, 12 months in sort of rebooting the user experience that exists in Badoo. And for those that are not familiar with Badoo, Badoo is a very scaled app that has millions of users in a lot of markets, especially in countries such as Eastern Europe, Brazil, France, et cetera, et cetera. And it's an app that's been around for many years. And it caters to a socioeconomic group of users. Badoo users are usually often people that have 2 jobs, that are frontline workers, people that are often strapped for time. but still obviously want to make connections on all. Badoo always optimized for quick instant connections. That's really where Badoo shines. You can get on the app. If you have 15 minutes of a break, you can immediately start talking with someone. And because of the scale that Badoo has, it's seen a lot of success over the years within this demographic, especially with some of the macro challenges that we saw coming out of COVID. And then the war in Ukraine, we saw this user base was hit pretty hard from a macro perspective. And so we saw challenges in Badoo. Last year, we embarked on this sort of multi-quarter strategy of rebooting the product experience because Badoo had been around for a while, the product has gotten quite cluttered. We have done a lot of work to simplify the core user experience on the app. It's much cleaner. It looks much fresher. We did a big sort of brand redesign in terms of what the app looks like. We have also done work from a marketing perspective to sort of refresh the brand. And it's really started to pay dividends in terms of the users are coming back to the app. We've started to see the rate of decline stabilized, and now we have started to see growth again. So we've been very pleased with the work that we've done on Badoo. One of the key things that we are going to be talking about for Badoo is around what we call revenue rearchitecture of the monetization experience on Badoo. So part of that involves us looking at, again, the value that we are offering across the different subscription tiers and rebalancing that. So it's very similar to what we are thinking about for Bumble, but we already have 6, 9 months of experience because we've already done that on Badoo. And we are launching that now in Q3, and that includes us testing a lower subscription tier with which acts as an entry point for Badoo, and it's really resonating well. And there's a lot of research and a lot of testing that our revenue teams have done. And this also includes rebalancing the pricing that exists within the different tiers. So we're very excited about what this means for Badoo because, again, it's going back to the basics. And it's fixing what really used to be the core value proposition of Badoo. So we're excited about that.

It sounds like that road map may be informing the road map for Bumble.

We're definitely taking a lot of learnings, especially on the revenue side from what we've learned over the last 6 months, and definitely taking it to Bumble.

Okay. Got it. And I wanted to ask, and I forgot the kind of time line for this revamp, but how do you think about that? And what are some of the people should be looking for as you kind of go through it?

Yes. So we are thinking about the revamp as a -- it's a sort of multi-quarter strategy. We don't have a specific time line to give everyone yet. Our goal really is to come back every quarter and update investors on our progress. Internally, we are very heavily focused beginning on metrics that are going to go towards engagement and retention. And obviously, that's -- it's hard because it's not data that you see externally. So our goal is to come back and provide more updates to everyone around what we are seeing in terms of improvements. because ultimately, focusing on retention, engagement, things like that are ultimately going to be really beneficial in driving word of mouth, which then will drive top-of-the-funnel growth again. So that's where we are focused on internally. And our plan is to sort of come back and give everyone an update on those numbers.

Okay. I think there's at least a minority view from investors out there on the part of what you guys have seen is driven by a competitive environment. Can you talk to what you're seeing in the competitive environment? Have you seen things change? How you -- kind of how you operate with that context?

Sure. So listen, I think competition for dating apps has always been there since Bumble started. So competition is not something that's new to us. As we've talked about in the past, people use multiple apps, dating apps, and that continues to be the case. And Bumble still is the #2 most downloaded dating app in the world, right? So we are still a top dating app for millions of users across the world, and that has not changed. Our brand continues to be one of the top brands, not just for dating, but just for women across the board, right? So we feel very, very good competitively around how we are positioned. So nothing that I would point out as something that is happening that's directly impacting us. I think where we are heavily focused on is ultimately as consumers have the pick of apps that they want to choose, we want to be top of mind for them because we want to be the best app that provides the best user experience for the customers. That's really our goal, and that's what we are focused on. And that's in our control, right? We are -- as we like to say, we are a competitor aware, but that's not where we are focusing our attention. We are focusing our attentions on our experience -- and ultimately, because of how strong a brand we have. It's very easy for us to get people to the app, we just have to make sure that we provide them the best product experience.

Okay. So that's a good segue into the broader portfolio outside of Badoo, but your strategy over the years to build, not just a dating ecosystem but also around that with friendships and also post relationship, so BFF has been a big effort. And you recently acquired Geneva, which was pre-revenue, correct? But can you talk about Geneva BFF and that kind of what you're trying to accomplish? And also how big that nondating part of -- it doesn't need to be quite fine in revenue necessarily, but what that opportunity could be for you?

Sure. So we're very, very bullish about what we are calling the larger connection space. Our Bumble's mission is to build healthy and equitable relationships for all, right? We happen to be today in the sort of romantic relationships category, that's where we started. But that's certainly not like to eventually end up. And we -- from a relationship perspective, we want to meet customers where they are in their journey. And if you look at someone as a person and their experience -- relationships span several different arenas, right? You can have your romantic relationships, you have relationships that you have with your friends. You have relationships that you have with your business partners, colleagues, whatever the case may be and you have more casual relationships that you may have with you have a running mate that you run with. You may not be best friends with them, but that's a relationship that you have. So we want to just be a platform where people come to for relationships wherever you may be in that journey. And eventually in the long term, we want it to be a seamless experience where we are able to move you across our apps in a way that just feels very authentic and feels very organic. And Geneva and BFF are extremely important to sort of this vision for us because as you look at the statistics out there in terms of connections and loneliness, the numbers are quite staggering, right, in terms of people feeling that they are more connected online than they've ever been, but they are more disconnected in real life than they have ever been, right? So our goal is not for you to meet on the app and just stay on the app, our goal is you meet someone on the app, and we immediately get you to meet them in real life, right? So from a friendship perspective, that's really our focus. And that's where Geneva becomes really interesting because they have built up a phenomenal tech platform that enables meetings in real life at scale. And so we are very excited about sort of integrating them with our company. We'll talk more about the exciting road map that the Geneva platform has, but we're very, very excited about that. The last thing I would say is there's a lot of talk about like Gen Z and with the Gen Z stating, et cetera, et cetera. A lot of users that are Gen Z for us will tell us that for them, romantic relationships often start with friendships. They turn into romantic relationships. So this also becomes an on-ramp back into dating for us because you meet someone on BFF or you meet someone on Geneva, eventually, you sort of move them date experience. So again, this is a very comprehensive vision for how we expect relationships to manifest over the long term.

Got it. I know you're exploring the monetization model, but I think you've mentioned in the past the monetization model for friendship and nonromantic part is a little bit different. So how do you...

Yes, absolutely. That's a great point. Today, we are predominantly a subscription revenue-based business. We've -- people often ask us about how we think about advertising and the core dating experience? And it's definitely an area of focus for us, but we want to be thoughtful about how we think about advertising on the dating app because obviously, dating can be a very personal experience, and we want to make sure that it feels authentic and natural to the experience that 2 people have. But where something like advertising or sponsorships or partnerships become really interesting is in that space. Because as you think about it, you're bringing people together for a common purpose, whether you are a wine enthusiast or you're running enthusiasts or whatever the case may be. You're effectively bringing together a cohort of people, have a common sort of interest and goal in mind. And it's a perfect ground for us to get an advertiser into because, again, it can feel much more organic and authentic. So we are very interested in exploring our revenue options outside subscriptions as we continue to scale the user base for some of these nondating experiences.

Okay. Let's talk international for a second. Maybe on your road map, there's a number of countries that you're more focused on near term. What's the opportunity? And as you kind of think about the road map in international, what's different about what you need to do? How you're approaching it differently? What's the broader opportunity? Can you see those markets eventually kind of catching up in terms of penetration of online dating the way the U.S. and Western markets have?

Absolutely. I think if you look at the dating category overall, a lot of the non-U.S. and sort of maybe non-Western markets are still in very early stages of secular changes, cultural changes in terms of how they are approaching online dating. And even in the last 10 years, we've seen pretty big growth rates in even markets like India, for example, which have been more sort of traditional historically. And so we are very, very bullish about us continuing to be a big force in those markets. I would say that international is still an early opportunity for us. We have a lot of strength in markets like Western Europe. We've talked in the past quite a bit about markets like Germany, where we are growing really. But a lot of those markets are still very early in our overall growth. We are seeing strong user presence in a lot of those markets. Monetization is still at an early stage. So you'll see us continue to push, and international has been an area of strength for us. So that's been great. Markets like India, as an example, are high user-based markets, potentially ARPPU markets, but the volume is so high that there is so much more that we can do in terms of acquiring users. We're very good at taking a nuanced approach to marketing and international markets, while still keeping the core ethos of what Bumble stands for. So if you go to India today, Bumble is, again, known as the women's brand that puts women into the center of relationships, but how we show up for the Indian market is very nuanced and is catered to them. But again, the core USP of Bumble stays the same. So we've been very good at like taking the core experience of women making the first, but then tailoring it to different markets. And what women's empowerment stands for also varies quite a bit based on which market you're in. In market like Western Europe, where people may say, I already feel quite empowered, that can mean something very different versus a market like India, where we may be much more sort of proactive about how we talk about women's empowerment.

Got it. Is the local competitive environment different region by region? Or is it largely the same players you're seeing on a global basis?

We do see, obviously, the -- we see some of the bigger players in a lot of these markets as well. In some markets, we see local players that cater very specifically to the local needs of the market. So it varies quite a bit. I think the thing that we've done really well is take the, again, the message of what Bumble stands for, and that's really resonating in every market. It doesn't matter whether it's a Western market or a market in Asia, the core women's experience aspect has resonated everywhere.

Okay. Great. And then just to talk about the margin -- the right level of investment as you embark on this here, you were previously targeting 300 basis points of expansion, you pulled that back to 2. But still expanding margins and where you're making a big investment in the product. So what's the right way to think about the margin profile? Why not more? Why not less? Or how to think about that as you work your way through this process?

Sure. We've said in the past, I think our commitment to expanding margins in the sort of medium to long term has not changed. We're obviously going to provide more information about what it means in the more near term, we've given our guidance for this year. We feel really good about the dollars that we have allocated towards our product and technical investment because that is really at the center of what is going to drive the reset that we are talking about. We also feel really good about the marketing dollars that we've allocated. Again, our goal is to get our dollars to work harder, to work more. We are being very diligent in our spend in terms of the things that are not moving the needle, and you'll see us be quite ruthless about cutting back on things that are not working. But our goal is obviously to focus on growth. So we want to make sure that we continue to invest for that. And the margin profile that we've given you for this year very much is towards that goal.

Got it. That's our time. Thank you, Anu. I appreciate you joining us.

Bye.

Thanks, everyone.