Burstone Group Limited (BTN) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Hey, guys, good morning or afternoon. It's nice to have you all here, and welcome to all those that are joining on Chorus Call. We're going to run through the presentation and then take Q&A afterwards. You've got the full squad here today. So we've got the 2 pools. I don't know if the other pool's here from the U.K. and Europe as well as the South African management team. So it'd be good to spend some time going through questions. I think just running through the results for the half year. We're very happy with the performance of the underlying assets on both sides of the water. And I think you'll see that coming through the numbers as we work through them. South Africa, strong momentum post-COVID and Europe continues to perform really well and capture the underlying dynamics that are playing out on the continent. On an earnings basis, up 2.7%, and we're looking to pay out 95% of that by dividend in December. And the balance sheet sitting really nice and healthy at around about 38% LTV and Jenna and the team are close to finalizing the ZAR 5.3 billion refinancing package or debt package over the course of the next few weeks. And we're going to see in a few weeks ago that our debt rating was reaffirmed by GCR. And we'll get on to it a little bit later, but the ESG strategy is really starting to pay dividends, and there's a lot of work going into that as we roll that out. Just turning to each of the different portfolios, South Africa, as I mentioned, really strong 8.3% like-for-like growth year-over-year and really it's a leasing story, predominantly across industrial and retail, but let's not forget office, and we'll get into some of the detail later. But you're seeing increasing metrics coming through the vacancy line sitting at 7.1%. That has actually trended lower over the course of the last month or so. So we're sitting at around about 5.2% today. And we've come off September last year of 9.8% so a really strong result from the team, having leased up around 90% of the space this year. Graham told me yesterday is a little dig to Paul from the European team that they've -- the South African business has leased more space than the European team. And they've got all the tailwinds, and we've got all the trouble. So it has been a good result here. In Europe, 2.7% on the NOI line and again, a real story around leasing, up 6% -- almost 7% in terms of positive reversions. We've captured 6% indexation. That indexation rolls throughout the year doesn't come through all in one go. You'll see the absence of the rental guarantee from last year, not sitting in the numbers this year. So that's heavily impacted our bottom line earnings. And the challenges that we flagged in Europe historically have been around that corporate cost base. So there's a lot of work going into that, and we think we'll see the fruits of that over the next 6 to 12 months. And more recently, you're seeing the impact of the accelerated rate rises in Europe. We've got a slide later on that really sets that out, but that will certainly impact our second half given that we're -- although we're hedged at 90%, that hedge is really by a cap instrument as opposed to swaps that we use here in South Africa. Although this is a half year presentation, we do -- always like to touch on our strategy and some of the focal points of the business, really underpinned by real estate, how we think about it, how we think about our clients, how we think about experience and a lot of that. And it's taken the last 2 or 3 years in terms of rolling that out, is starting to come through and you're starting to see it in your numbers. And so there is a lag effect, and we're very pleased with how that is taking place. We've got some really nice initiatives on the ground here in South Africa as well as offshore. And we'll end off with some of the thinking around what we're going to be doing. But ultimately, everything we do is underpinned by the real estate in which we invest, and that is coming through in the results. In terms of operational priorities, just to reiterate, I think certainly here in South Africa, speed and agility is what gets us the answers and that has been a core focus for the team. And again, you're seeing that come through the numbers, especially in office up 4.2% and the vacancy trending down. That is not sector wide, and it's certainly not a result of what's happening in the sector. It's what's happening on the ground with the management team as an example. We have the innovation building in Randburg, vacant around about this time last year, 15,000 square meters. I wouldn't exactly say it's the best piece of real estate that we own. And today, we're fully let there. And that is not down to Randburg. As I know, that's down to how we've shown the space and how we've actively worked the tenants and potential tenant base in order to fill that. I think in Europe, the value unlock is clear for everyone to see, but we see opportunities in the dislocation in Europe right now. And when you've got a strong management team with a track record and experience of having navigated the global financial crisis in '08 and '09, I think we're well positioned. And if we think about the balance sheet, rigid and robust focus on making sure that that liability side is well maintained or well managed. And we're exploring some capital-light opportunities offshore and looking to leverage the management teams that we've got across the order. In terms of the financial review, and I have touched on a lot of these numbers, so I won't go through them in detail here, and we'll get some of the detail on the following slides. But you see the impact in Europe of the absence of the rental guarantee. Nice to see if you look on the right-hand side, in terms of the European performance, top line at 6.2% and the impact of amortization and incentives that drags or brings that back down to 2.7%. And on the interest line, a huge amount of work has been done on the treasury book, and that's unlocked a surprisingly good upside from a cost saving perspective. So we're in the business of managing real estate as well as managing the balance sheet for total returns to shareholders. A quick bridge, again, just highlights or simplifies what this looks like and the impact of those European costs. And on the far right-hand side of that box, you see the impact of the corporate costs and the interest rates. The interest rate impact in year in the first half is not as big as it will be in the second half, and we'll talk to that in the following slides. On the balance sheet, as I mentioned, really well positioned valuation-wise. There hasn't been a lot of movement and we're comfortable with where that's sitting even given the volatility in Europe. The uptick in NAV is really driven by mark-to-market on the FX position. So it's not true underlying NAV growth, but certainly comfortable with where the balance sheet is positioned as we walk into the second half of the year. Running through some of those metrics, and I don't want to spend a lot of time on this slide because the real meters on the slide that follows relating to the refinancing. As I mentioned, the credit rating being reaffirmed, really healthy metrics if you look at interest cover ratios, leverage and where we are from a hedging perspective and a lot of work done on refinancing of -- or hitting the sustainability targets on the existing sustainability linked loan. And there's some work in the background on the bridge loan that we got into Europe, and we're hoping to see that unlocked over the course of the next 2, 3 months. We're just awaiting senior lender approval. On the refinancing, there's a lot of detail on that slide, and I'll try and pick out the key bullets or highlights. I think the total package of ZAR 5.3 billion we were putting on hold until we had clarity around the Project Portland or the European disposal process. So it's nice to see this coming to fruition. The ZAR debt package, which I think is around ZAR 3.9 billion of the ZAR 5.3 billion. We're going to shift that expiry profile from 1.5 years to 4.6 years on the euro debt from 0.6% to 3.4%. And on a blended basis, that takes our debt maturity profile from just over 1.5 years to 3.3 years after this is done. Net cost to the P&L will be fairly immaterial and is a significant portion of this refinancing that is linked to sustainability or has an ESG element. So again, tying in what we're doing around sustainability initiatives to how we finance our business. Also good to see that we've introduced some new lenders into this package and increased some of the exposure to lenders that came into our debt book over the last 12 to 18 months. So nice to have some new faces on board. I guess this is the story around really H2 and it's impacted the last quarter of our first half, and that's the European interest rates. Almost the graph almost doesn't put into context what has happened there, but really moving 200 basis points over the course of the last 4 months. I don't think anyone saw that rate of change. And certainly, the size of that change on a combined basis so it's certainly the biggest story of the year, and we all know inflation, Ukraine and the impacts that has had. And I think although the balance sheet is well positioned, we've managed the treasury book accordingly. There is leakage that will come through as a result of those accelerated changes in Europe. Moving on to South Africa, and I'll skip over this slide because there's detail -- a lot of detail on the next, which I think we can talk through. You'll see on the base NOI lines, office up 4.2%, really a story of reducing vacancy. So we're sitting at 10.3% today. We actually at 8.9% today. We're at 10.3% in September. We're coming off 13.9% this time last year. So it really is a leasing story, very similar in industrial. I roll back the clock in March '21, we were sitting at 17% in the industrial book at September last year at 10.5% and today, that's sitting at 6.9%. So a really great result from the team and being able to move our space really quickly. And then in retail, the business that just keeps on giving, and we've always said it's a very defensive portfolio. Look at the metrics, or the trading metrics that come out of their trading densities are sitting around 2,100 meter. That's up about 5% to 7% year-over-year. Turnover growth 7.7% and cost occupation sitting at 6.7%, so all of those metrics have improved. They're all sitting at a very comfortable level. And so we're comfortable with where the income line on the retail side is going to move to. If you look at arrears, also a big shift year-over-year. So a significant amount of work done in managing the tenant base and the cash collection. And so all credit to the team, including the JHI team that I know is heavily involved in making that happen. Just to summarize or look at the leasing activity. I think one key point here is just looking into the second half, where we've already dealt with almost 2/3 of the space that comes back at us in that -- in H2. Reversions are still high, the 17%, negative 17%. That is a result of a lot of longer-dated leases rolling off. But in the absence of real market growth, even newer leases effectively escalated at a rate much higher than market. And so you're still seeing negative reversions even on leases that were struck or restruck 3 or 4 years ago. So it really is about bums on seats and making sure that we don't lose tenants. A core focus for us, you would have seen this matrix. I don't know who came up with it. But really, the idea of moving -- we're trying to move everything to the top right-hand quadrant, we would like to put more lines in there, but you see everything moving in the right direction. So bottom right-hand side where you don't want to see anything -- we've managed to move around ZAR 700 million from there, either straight up to the ideal state or we've exited or we've moved it into a better position. But really taking about ZAR 2 billion from the top left into the top right and from the bottom left into the top right. So a really good story in terms of how we're managing the risk profile of our assets, which is important and really moving everything from a value add into a core state over time. And anything that we see as being noncore or tail, we're very focused on moving that out, and you'll see that come through in 2 or 3 slides time. Office, I mean, it's been the story over the last 3 years, really focused leasing and activity. And I think where we are positioned today, from a portfolio perspective, puts us in good state. Bryanston, where we've got relatively big exposure, I don't think we have any vacancy. If we do, it's a couple of hundred square meters. And we've seen a really nice uptick in Rosebank at the Firs where we had probably this time or 2 years ago, we're sitting with about 5,000 or 6,000 square meters of vacancy. Today, we're sitting at 1,500, maybe 1,000 meters next week if Dennis decides to do his job. And -- but the business is or the portfolio is really well positioned. Very limited exposure in real terms to Sandton where we've seen little or no demand over the course of the last 2 years. The capital recycling, we've been banging this drum for years and really have been focused on it. Effectively, we've got around about ZAR 450 million sitting in the held-for-sale as we stand today, ZAR 325 million of that has already been signed, and it's just awaiting transfer and ZAR 120 million is currently being marketed. And then we closed off at the beginning of this year, around ZAR 300 million of assets that were held-for-sale last year and concluded in the first half of this year. And that's gone towards either paying down or reducing our leverage or recycling that into some of the capital projects that we've been rolling out. Europe, as I mentioned earlier, around interest rates, but it's also about inflation, and it has both a positive and a negative impact. I think everyone is focused on the potential negative impacts of what's playing out macro -- on a macro basis in Europe. But certainly, we haven't seen the impact on it from a negative perspective on the portfolio. So demand remains high across the continent. Supply has become even further constrained. Development costs have gone up 20% to 30%. And the cost of financing for a developer has blown out. So your -- the development returns are almost not feasible anymore. That's put further pressure on the supply side. And with the demand side holding up, we've really benefited nicely. That gets the question is going to be what plays out on the occupier base, for how long can they absorb the inflation, the energy prices? If we look at our portfolio, the first warning sign would be in the arrears number. We haven't seen any of that. There have certainly been some tenants that have seen volumes falling off a little bit, and that was to be expected, but it gives them the ability to right-size their business. I think the opportunity for us is playing in the, disconnect utilizing or leveraging the management on the ground. Looking at the opportunities of which we've seen more probably over the last 2 to 3 months and over the last few years, given where pricing has moved, and that's the impact that interest rates have had with some of the financial buyers effectively sitting out of the market. That gives us the opportunity to go and play much like we have done historically in South Africa and in Australia. From a return or numbers perspective, I've covered a lot of the ground here, but really, the portfolio could not be better positioned as we walk in or move into the second half and we walk or try and navigate the volatility and uncertainty that may arise over the next 6 to 12 months on the ground there, vacancy sitting at 1.2%. We actually expect that to trend lower, which I didn't think was possible and the portfolio metrics are very healthy, WALE of north of 5 years, but enough leasing activity over the course of the next 12 to 24 months, that enables us to capture potential rental growth and support valuations from a balance sheet perspective. On the leasing side, again, I've covered all of this, but it's important to just point out the WALE on all the new leases at 7 years. And although the retention ratio at 42% might seem low -- through the asset management and kind of moving in of tenants, we've been able to capture that that alpha from a leasing or reversion perspective. And I was talking to Paul earlier today, the ability to move your tenant base and accommodate new bigger or more profitable tenants are saying that we work on consistently and we'd look to achieve further performance similar to this as we move into H2. I've walked through the P&L of Europe earlier. And I think just on the cost side, which you'll see is up 33%, which is a big number. Roughly 1/4 of that sits in the operating costs linked to the asset management fee, which is linked to the gross asset value, which year-over-year was -- is up kind of 10%. And the rest is the corporate structure, which I alluded to earlier being complex and is a big work stream being undertaken at the moment to refine that and stabilize that over the next 6 to 12 months. The development pipeline, which we put on hold as we went into the sale process, we've opened up again, looking at it, as I mentioned earlier, massive cost inflation. So across our feasibilities, we've seen aggregate costs up 20%, but there's been movement on the leasing or the revenue side, which would still enable us to come or deliver those projects at an initial yield of around 7%. And the key for us is finalizing a financing or development financing facility in Europe, which at the moment, just given the state of the banking markets is challenging. And I think we look to attack that in Q1 or Q4, but Q1 calendar year next year. From an ESG perspective, I alluded to it earlier, we've seen a lot of work done and linking that to our refinancing package, but all on track in terms of Green Star ratings, the solar PV, we're actually going to deliver more. We're going to come in at around 3.2 megawatts over the course of this year as opposed to the target of 2. Energy performance certificates and carbon footprint is all rolled out. And I think it will be such in -- well it will be May, we'll have more to talk to on those targets. Looking ahead and really wrapping up, I guess, the first is just to talk through the revised guidance. So you would have seen in the SENS announcement this morning that we pulled that back. That really is purely down to the interest rates in Europe and the impact that that has going into the second half. I mentioned earlier, a small portion of that acceleration has been -- has impacted our first half, but the majority will come through on the back end. Again, the cap that we have in Europe is at 1.4%, and that will flow through. And that's taken our earnings guidance effectively from that low single-digit DPS to marginally negative. It's an unfortunate result, but that is what it is. And thankfully, the performance of the asset base on both sides of the water continues to trend in the right direction. So that's where we're going to really leave it off. I guess, South Africa well positioned again, the portfolio across the board, across 3 sectors for the first time we're seeing real stability and the strength of that portfolio coming through. Good leasing activity and good momentum as we move into Christmas. In Europe, the performance continues to be bolstered by the supply and demand dynamics. We are -- I guess we've got to consider and be open to what may or may not happen in the occupier base in relation to inflation and energy costs doesn't help when there's a rocket fired into Poland last night. But the balance sheet is in probably one of the best positions. It's been, post this refinancing, much better position or stronger than we were 6 months ago. And that gives us the opportunity to explore some of the growth opportunities, both here and offshore. And if we look overseas, we're exploring some capital-light opportunities together with the European management team as well as some others, and we're seeking to capitalize on some pricing dislocation. In Europe, it all comes down to capital and the availability of capital. So we'll continue recycling very aggressively on both sides of the water as well as seeking capital to come and sit alongside us and the strategies that we have on the ground. So that is it. I think I've probably got through that in record times, Amy. But yes, it really leaves us some time to go through Q&A.

So we'll go first, I think, to Chorus Call. If there are any questions coming in from the call?

At this stage, there are, no questions sir.

Getting nothing? Guess we'll go on the -- some of the questions come through digitally. At the moment, there's just 1. So Darryl, maybe you should ask another 1. But from [ Ridwaan ] at Nedbank. The question is, please, can you expand on the dislocation you're seeing in Europe regarding opportunities? Is it country specific or as a whole? I mean maybe, Paul, I don't know if you are marked up, but it's pretty good to hear from you around what you're seeing. We got a mic coming.

Hello, can you hear me? Yes, my name is Paul Rodger. I'm the Managing Director of the European Business. In terms of dislocation in the market, I mean it's still fairly early days at the moment to see any real distress or fractures coming through. But what you can see is that there are people who have, let's say, overlevered and exposed themselves to that rising interest rate exposure. And I think there will undoubtedly be situations where the management teams are not reacting to their tenant base as perhaps dynamically or as fast as they should. So we are expecting to see opportunities present themselves over the course of the next 6, 12 months. I think from our perspective, we've spent quite a lot of time in the continent, really working with tenants over the past, well, 4 years since the original acquisitions of the portfolio. And working through the income streams, making sure we've got the most robust tenant based bank guarantees, securities in place so that we are in -- as secure form as we can going into any repricing or downturn in the market. And certainly, as Andrew said, I mean, as of today, we're not seeing any movement in our tenant. There's no tenant stress coming through. And in fact, quite the opposite, we're still seeing a real push for demand and additional take-up of supply, hence the reason that our portfolio is now sitting at 99% occupied.

Thanks, Paul, keep the mic. There's a question that's come through from [ Miago ]. Can you provide some color on valuations in the subsectors in both South Africa and Europe, specifically in relation to cap rates? And before I hand it back to you, we were telling about it earlier. And where you're seeing the stresses in Europe specifically around valuation is on those portfolios or those assets that have a much longer dated lease expiry because of really the inability to get at that positive rental number. And given the impact of rising interest rates, the longer dated stock is getting harder hit, but maybe you want to give some more color, Paul.

Yes. Look, I mean, I think 2 things are quite important there. I mean, one is we were never buying the stock that was in the low 4s and underneath the 3s across the regions. We pulled back from the fundamentals of those types of acquisitions. So the long-dated Amazons, the Zalando's, the Ocado type units is not what we've been buying. And as Andrew alludes to, it's albeit stabilized rental income streams. It's shorter income streams than that, and that gives us the ability to capture the rental growth position. So whilst it's no secret that yields are moving out and there is a repricing given the interest rate movement, I think the value position is being supported by the rental growth story, and we're very much capitalizing on that at the moment, A) from a CPI indexation perspective, where it's coming through on an annual basis. But also when the leases burn off, we can get into direct negotiations with those tenants and try to mark-to-market those rent levels.

I mean I think the other point in Europe is if you -- a lot of the commentary is around cap rates moving kind of 100 basis points over the course of the last 3 months -- 3, 4 months. And it's just important to keep in mind that's coming off the highs. So the -- if you look in the listed sector, the likes of Prologis and Segro trading at 50%, 60% premiums to book and coming off of those levels as opposed to offer what were typically book values, whether it is listed or unlisted. And so when we look at our portfolio and we're actually going through a process into 31 December with CBRE, I always get it wrong. But with CBRE around our portfolio and it's -- yes, the starting point in terms of trying to back solve to what's happening with cap rates isn't book. It was premiums to book. [ Graham ], do you want to give some color in South Africa?

Yes, sure. I mean I think looking at our South African portfolio over the last 2 years, we have taken approximately about a ZAR 2 billion write-down within that portfolio. So we're very comfortable with the levels that we're at. We didn't run a full external revolve process now at half year. As you'll recall, we externally valued half our portfolio at March and previously, the other half in that year. We spent a lot of time discussing with the external valuators whether they've seen any move in cap rates. Their view is it hasn't shifted regardless of the interest rate shifts we've seen. I think we echo that sentiment. And look, we're very comfortable with the levels we're at in our South African portfolio. Currently, as I said, we have taken a lot of that pain, and we think that is largely out of the system.

Yes. I think in -- if I look at the impairments on the South African portfolio, over the last couple of years, we've taken what, north of ZAR 2 billion, ZAR 2.5 billion of impairments going back to pre-COVID. So yes, the portfolio is well positioned. I think the other point, if you contrast what happens in across the water versus here in terms of rate of change in valuation and cap rate linked to interest rates, certainly more volatility in Europe relative to South Africa, which is quite interesting to see. I don't see -- are there any other questions on Chorus, nothing coming through or on the floor? Mweisho? Normally you're the first, so you must have been thinking about this one.

Okay. Do you have a catalyst that you're sort of waiting for looking forward to open up the potential sale of the pulp business?

Yes -- when we look towards the back end of last year, it was hugely opportunistic, right? We've always said we're a long-term holder of majority positions, and that was one of them. But where we -- where the market was pricing portfolios relative to where we thought long-term returns could get to, I just think we all kind of looked at what was going on and thought there was a great opportunity to deliver outperformance through an exit as opposed to a long-term hold, where markets have moved to today based on really interest rates as opposed to the underlying. I don't think that opportunity exists. In a lot of ways, I mean we're very -- I'm quite happy that we still got that business. And you see the benefit of having both the diversified business as well as a geographically diversified business. I think the focus for us now moves back into opportunities there, growing the asset base, looking at the development portfolio and really think about some of those capital-light opportunities that might become capital, more capital intensive over time depending on then what happens in our availability of capital here. So yes, I can't see us looking at that, again, unless markets move substantially, which in the absence of a pullback of interest rates I can't see happening. And our view is that interests don't go back to negative, right? They kind of stabilized. Maybe they don't sit where they are today, but they certainly maybe sit between where they are today and where they were 6 months ago.

Okay. And then just on the SA portfolio, you guys have done about 8% like-for-like for the first half. Second half, I think there's less upside from vacancies reducing. So do you have a ballpark or range for what you think the second half might be?

Yes. I don't -- I think the -- we've got a couple of -- we've had some good leasing activity. We've worked the asset base. You're not -- I don't think we're going to be far off those kinds of numbers, maybe a little bit tempered, but not significantly in terms of base NOI. I think we're also starting to see the design quarter asset is almost fully complete. We've seen some decent leasing there that comes through -- starts to come through in the second half, although not entirely. And then yes, some of the benefit of working with the tenant-based incentives, arrears collection comes through in H2 as opposed to H1. So yes, I think we're still expecting a similar number, maybe a little bit off there, but not materially. Any other? [ Ev ]?

Just the expenses on the -- disposal, what's the actual number of expenses incurred? And over and above that, are they in your distribution going forward or the current distribution?

So the majority of any cost linked to that sale would have been on success. So that's not triggered. And we've got on the vendor due diligence side or tax advice and that kind of thing or the DD cost that is absorbed by the business and effectively capitalized for the time being, but we've got access to that over the short-term in terms of being able to utilize that to bring in third-party capital.

Okay. And just another 1 on listing, I remember being convinced into an external Manco because of the depth in property skills in Investec. And obviously, as the [ Sam's moved on to Detica ] and now Darryl's moved, I want to know how you're going to fill that gap and who's next in line because we, as an investment community, we haven't seen the successor?

Yes, I think it's a relevant question. I think the -- if you look in Europe at the depth of the bench there, Paul and the team, and I know some of you are coming on tour with us this next week. So hopefully you get access to that. I think Darryl was building and had built a strong bench here in South Africa. You see Graham here, so Graham looks after our South African business from an asset management perspective. Sam and the Board is still heavily involved in the key decisions of that. So the broader property skill set still sits with us as well as with the Investec Property business on with David, Gavin and the development side. So the crossover and how we leverage each other is still very much alive.

But is that still an empty seat to full externally or are you happy with the status quo?

I think we've got a couple of ideas around the local asset management space, I think probably most importantly in retail. Industrial is the smaller side of our business and has performed. I think we have performed really well. We've got the right skill sets. And in office, like I said earlier, I said to someone in one of the journalists, it's a grind. And if you look at the skill sets or the results that have come out of there and the traction that we've had over the last 2 to 3 years, it's very much within the D&A. So I think the key focus is on -- is really to fill retail the retail space. Anything else? All right so that pretty much brings it to a conclusion. I think the 1 thing I just wanted to close off on was to welcome some of the new non-execs that have joined the Board, Rex and Disebo who joined today. And Rex has been with us for a few months. Disebo has replaced Connie and Connie had been with us for 10 years. So I must say thank you to Connie and a big welcome to Rex and Disebo and then to see Darryl sitting there today. And I feel a bit -- it's like awkward not having you next to me.

Yes.

I'm just glad that you're not sending me messages telling me what to say and what not to say. But yes, I think it's -- from my side, I just wanted to say massive thank you to Darryl because he's been not just -- I was trying to think of the different metaphors, but certainly hasn't just been a wingman, but has been a sound counsel for me over time, and I hope that that continues. He's going to be continuing to work with us and the team on a contractual basis. Hopefully, we don't have to have a look back at the contract, but we also wish Darryl well in his new endeavors and I see he's really gone into the branding world and has launched his new business. And so we -- yes, we hope that we continue to remain close together. I know that we're going to do a lot together over time. But it's yes, massive thank you, and for what you did here, not just at IPF for the 3 or 4 years but also at Investec for the better part of '20. So we will certainly miss you, but we know that you're going to be around a lot. So thank you. Right, so we always Investec is always known as effectively a catering company with a banking license. I know the guys are put on a good spread outside. It would be good to have a drink and same to eat with you and chat further after. So thank you for coming.