Count Limited (CUP) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Well, good morning, everyone. My name is Doug Richardson, and I'm the Company Secretary of Count Limited. Thank you for joining us today for Count's FY 2026 results briefing for investors and analysts. The results were released to the ASX earlier today and are available on our website. Before we begin, I'd like to acknowledge the traditional owners of the land in which we meet today, the Gadigal people of the Eora Nation, and pay our respects to elders, past and present. We extend that respect to all First Nations people joining us today. Shortly, you'll hear from Hugh Humphrey, our Chief Executive Officer and Managing Director, who will take you through the key highlights and strategic progress for the year. Keith Leung, our Chief Financial Officer, will then cover the financial results in more detail before we open the line for questions. [Operator Instructions] I will now hand over to Hugh.

Thank you, Doug, and good morning, everyone. Financial year 2026 was a significant year of delivery for Count. We delivered strong revenue and earnings growth, continued to improve margins, completed another 10 acquisitions, not including Oracle, and delivered on our commitment to further expand the earnings contribution from wealth. In addition, the Oracle acquisition, which completed in July of 2026 and therefore is not included in these numbers, ensures that we are well placed to drive further organic and acquisitive growth, post integration, and as a platform for the coming years. It expands our employed adviser footprint and gives us greater exposure to financial planning and wealth management. Today, I'll walk through the key insights and discuss the drivers of the results. Later, we'll hear from our CFO, Keith Leung, for further analysis and commentary of our numbers. There were many highlights to be very pleased about in this year's result. What pleased us most this year was seeing the revenue and earnings growth come from all 3 of our operating segments, the flywheel turning a little faster and all segments working together and lifting. Wealth continued to be a standout. Equity partnerships delivered another good result and services grew. We delivered select AI solutions and automation in all segments of the business to enhance productivity like AI file noting, professional standards file reviews, business activity statements for our accounting businesses, processes and financial reporting. We have subtly evolved our brand to Count Group, creating a more contemporary framework to support our new ventures like Count Wealth and the future expansion that we have planned. And we have a pipeline of interesting technology developments. We're also seeing more interaction between the segments. Our investment solutions are supporting advisers. Our services businesses are helping firms to scale, and our equity partnership model continues to provide attractive opportunities for growth. Two years ago, we introduced the concept of the flywheel as the framework for how we would build Count, driving results between the segments as well as within the segments. Today's results show that model working as intended with each part of the business contributing to and strengthening the others. The business is stronger, more diversified and better positioned and we operate in a market with growing demand. Turning to the headline numbers. FY 2026 was a strong result. Revenue was up plus 16%. Underlying EBITA increased plus 20%. Underlying NPAT attributable increased plus 27%. Underlying EBITA margin increased to just over 20%. This performance is a result of focused execution to capture the growing demand. Importantly, we've remained disciplined on both cost management and the deployment of our capital. And that discipline underpins our ability to keep investing for the long term while continuing to deliver better shareholder returns. As a 46-year-young business, we continue to take a very long-term perspective on growth and returns. A standout in this year's result was the continued growth in wealth, and we participate in 3 different growth areas: the financial planning revenues within our Equity Partnership segment, the investment solutions income and the AFSL licensing revenues that appear within the Wealth segment. Funds under advice increased to $43 billion and funds under management increased to $6.5 billion, including Oracle. FUM growth over the last 12 months was a very strong plus $2.6 billion. We now have 101 firms in various stages of embracing the CARE philosophy. This is pleasing as it shows our investment solutions are resonating with advisers and their clients. CARE is not just an SMA product conversation; it's helping advisers to run better businesses, have better investment conversations with clients, and that is a key reason we know it has further room to grow. We completed another 10 acquisitions during the year while maintaining a clear focus on balance sheet discipline. And reflecting the strength of the result, the Board declared a final dividend of $0.03 per share, the highest second half dividend in 9 years, taking total dividends for FY 2026 to $0.05 per share fully franked. I'll now turn to the segment results. One of the key themes this year is that all 3 operating segments contributed to earnings growth, providing greater diversification and resilience across the business. Wealth benefited from stronger funds under management and improved adviser economics. Equity partnerships benefited from acquisitions, increased holdings in key firms and continued growth in financial planning revenues. Services also performed, supported by outsourcing, education and actuarial services. Keith will go into the analysis of our numbers in a bit more detail shortly, but I wanted to touch on a few of the strategic points first. And starting with wealth, revenue was $45.8 million and EBITA was $15.1 million, pleasingly with the EBITA margin increasing to 33%. The key drivers of this were funds under management growth, the transition of the Count portfolios in-house, continued CARE adoption across the network and stronger gross business earnings per adviser underpinned by advice process enhancements and AI initiatives across our network. Our advisers continue to serve more clients. So we're releasing more capacity into the market, meeting more client needs, and this is how we will meet the rising demand for wealth advice. Equity partnerships delivered revenue of $87.1 million and EBITA of $19.3 million. Financial planning revenue within the Equity Partnerships segment grew by plus 15%, which is important because it indicates strong organic growth in the financial planning revenues, which is where we have a laser focus on driving higher organic growth. Services delivered revenue of $33 million and EBITA of $11.1 million. This result was helped by the McGing acquisition, growth in outsourcing and the continued expansion of our education and actuarial capability. And there remains a very significant cross-sell opportunity in services. Only 29% of our clients within the network currently use one or more of Count service offerings. Overall, the segment results show a business that is benefiting from scale, along with the demonstration of our flywheel. I wanted to show how the shape of the business has evolved in line with our very deliberate and stated and consistent intent over the last 4 years. We've grown funds under management from $0 as we entered FY '23 to $6.5 billion as we enter FY '27. Funds under advice has also increased from $12.1 billion in FY '23 to $43 billion over the same period, including the Oracle Investment Solutions and our funds under advice as at 30 June 2026. At the same time, group EBITA margin has improved from 11.4% in FY '23 to around 20% in FY '26, and dividends have increased from $0.0375 per share to $0.05 per share. For me, the key message here is that the business is benefiting from the industry tailwinds and the execution of our strategy and our flywheel is underpinning the financial performance to date. We now have a larger wealth base, a stronger advice footprint, more services being used across the network and a clearer pathway to keep growing recurring wealth revenues. And what we do really matters to our clients' lives. This slide shows one of the most important shifts in the group. In FY '23, wealth-related earnings represented 31% of total EBITA. In FY '26, that has increased to 44%. And post the Oracle acquisition, it increases further on a pro forma basis as announced to the market in March 2026. The Oracle acquisition further accelerates that shift to higher growth wealth revenues. It gives us a larger employed adviser network, and it strengthens our financial planning capability. The composition of the group continues to evolve with a greater contribution from wealth and advice, supported by a strong and growing accounting and services foundation. One of the most encouraging trends we're seeing is the continued growth in our investment solutions business. Funds under management set a new record $6.5 billion, including Oracle FUM, with growth coming across CARE, the Count portfolios, the managed discretionary accounts and the Oracle Investment Solutions. Importantly, this isn't being driven by a single product or proposition; it's the breadth of the offering and the freedom of choice that's resonating with advisers and their clients. CARE has continued to build great momentum across the network, while we're also seeing growing adoption of our broader investment solutions suite. What gives me confidence is that we're still at an early stage of that journey. As more firms adopt our investment solutions, it creates a better experience for clients, it strengthens adviser engagement and it grows funds under management. We continue to see adoption upside for our investment solutions with limited penetration despite the growth delivered. It takes some time for a firm to fully embrace the entire philosophy. And when they do, it releases benefits for their clients, their business and Count Group. So I see this as a steady long-term growth opportunity that we will continue to invest into. Before moving on and in response to some questions historically, it's worth spending a moment on what makes CARE different and a whole lot more compelling than generic SMAs. At its core, CARE and the associated tools provide an end-to-end advice business model and holistic client engagement tools. It's designed to keep the adviser at the center of the client relationship. It's a philosophy, not just an investment portfolio. It's a framework that helps advisers guide clients through investment decisions and stay focused on long-term outcomes, and that's an important distinction. Generic investment solutions often focus solely or primarily on portfolio construction. CARE combines investment management with education, technology, structure and ongoing client engagement. We think that approach aligns well with how advisers want to work and how clients want to be supported, always ensuring it is in the client's best interest. That's what makes it a differentiated offering within the market. The historic client returns, of course, that aren't guaranteed, have been strong, and the data is unequivocal. Firms that use CARE do better. Turning to Oracle, which completed on the 20th of July 2026, so there's no contribution to these results. This is the most significant transaction we've completed since Diverger, and it materially increases our exposure to financial planning and wealth. What attracted us to Oracle was not simply its size; it was an alignment with where we see the market heading. The transaction expands our employed adviser footprint and gives us greater presence in a number of markets where we previously had limited scale. Just as importantly, it gives us a platform to pursue a broader range of acquisition opportunities. Whether that's succession transactions, adviser tuck-ins or larger advice businesses, we now have greater capacity to acquire, integrate and support those opportunities within Count Wealth. We partner with 500 advice firms, and that is the market for us. While FY '27 will include a strong focus on integration and investing in capabilities and people, the bigger opportunity is what this platform allows us to do in the coming years. One of the things that we're particularly pleased with is the progress we've made on integration. A significant amount of work was done prior to completion, which has allowed us to move quickly under our ownership and minimize disruption for both clients and advisers. All key employees have signed new contracts, and other major milestones such as the Count Wealth brand launch, technology integration, operating model changes, establishing the leadership structure and policy alignment have already been completed. The focus now shifts from integration to optimization. Over the next 12 to 24 months, we'll continue to invest in aligning systems, processes, simplifying operations and starting to realize the benefits that come from greater scale. Importantly here, we are not starting from scratch. The foundations are already in place, and we're entering the next phase of stabilizing the business with a clear plan and strong engagement from the team. We remain optimistic about the long-term outlook for advice, particularly with the federal budget-proposed changes, improved regulatory dialogue, increasing client demand and the sector focus from superannuation funds. The reality is that financial decisions are becoming more complex. Whether it's retirement planning, superannuation, self-managed super funds, business structuring, tax changes or intergenerational wealth transfer, clients are increasingly looking for advice on how to navigate those complex decisions. At the same time, adviser numbers remain below historic norms. So we're seeing growing demand for advice in a market with constrained capacity, and that represents a significant opportunity for firms that can provide high-quality advice in a scalable way. What we like about Count Group's position is that we participate across the advice value chain. Through our accounting firms, financial advisers, investment solutions and services businesses, we're well placed to support clients as those advice needs emerge. While individual policy settings will change over time, the broader trend is clear: advice is becoming more valuable, not less, and we believe that provides a favorable backdrop for the group over the years ahead. The new class of adviser, as announced by the minister, will create a pipeline of future advisers for us. Our PY, Professional Year program already has 50 participants, and we'd like to see that grow to over 100 in the next year or so. Superannuation funds getting interested in advice is good for attention on the sector. I hasten to say they know they must do it the right way. But the fastest growth will not come from more advisers. It will and indeed is coming from our advisers seeing more clients. As a point of reference, in the U.K. market, which is the most relevant market comparison for advice to Australia, and where there are actually fewer advisers per head of population than Australia, 400 clients per adviser is not unusual. In response to adviser shortages, succession challenges and increasing regulatory complexity, we're seeing a growing number of firms looking for scale, support and succession solutions turning to us. Over the past year, we've sharpened our focus on financial planning opportunities, primarily within our existing network, but also outside and across the broader market. That's reflected in the transactions we completed during financial year '26 and the opportunities we're seeing in the market today. What's different today is that we have more options than we previously had. Through our equity partnerships firms and now through Count Wealth, we've got greater capacity to support growth, undertake tuck-ins and acquire advice businesses where there's a strong strategic and cultural fit. We also see a significant opportunity within our own ecosystem. Many firms are dealing with succession planning, adviser recruitment and capacity challenges. And increasingly, we're able to provide solutions that help keep clients, advisers and revenue within the broader Count Group network. The opportunity ahead is substantial. We'll continue to be selective in adding quality advisers, quality client relationships and opportunities that strengthen the broader Count Group platform. And we're deliberate with our terms, return on investment and accretion hurdles, deferred payments and where appropriate, we leave behind the licensing risk and secure warranties and indemnities. Before I hand over to Keith, I wanted to touch again on our technology evolution, AI and automation. We spent the last year moving beyond experimentation and focusing on now practical applications across the business. That's already resulted in some new revenue opportunities through client-facing solutions while also improving some efficiency within our own operations. We are seeing benefits in areas such as software development, compliance processes and workflow management. But importantly, we've taken a measured approach. We're being deliberate and cautious in how we roll these tools out with appropriate governance and training in place and an eye to the cost of these solutions. But it's an area where we're already seeing positive results and further opportunity ahead. It's early days, and we know that these developments will make a meaningful difference across the business, particularly in the advice and accounting client experiences. And this will help us to double the number of advised clients. At the end of the day, our people are our product and their relationships are the key. AI and automation will enable them to expand the number of client relationships they can effectively hold. The ratio of client-facing time to admin for our accountants and advisers is still out of proportion, and there is a lot of upside. I'd now like to introduce Keith Leung, our CFO, and hand over to him to take us through a greater level of detail around our FY 2026 financials. Keith, over to you.

Thank you, Hugh, and good morning, everyone. I'm pleased to welcome new and existing investors on the call today and look forward to engaging with shareholders over the coming weeks. I will take you through the financial results for FY '26, starting with the key financial highlights before delving into individual segments. Turning to the financial results. FY '26 was another exceptional year of growth for the group. Underlying revenue increased 18% to $165.9 million, and underlying EBITA increased 20% to $33.4 million compared to prior period. Underlying NPAT attributable increased 27% to $13.9 million and underlying NPATA attributable to shareholders increased 20% to $17.6 million. The result reflects strong growth across the business, supported by organic growth, particularly through FUM growth and acquisitions completed over the last 2 years, including Count Adelaide and WSC becoming subsidiaries. Financial planning revenues within Equity Partnerships segment continue to grow as we target 50-50 financial planning revenues within the segment, noting that it currently represents around 1/4 of the segment revenues. This will increase further in FY '27 following the Oracle acquisition. Overall costs increased at a slower rate than revenue, which contributed to the improvement in profitability during the year. Finance costs were lower than FY '25 following the capital raising completed in April and May, and we maintained strong cash flow management across the group. I'll now step through the main drivers of the result. On the next slide, we can see the key waterfall bridge between the FY '25 underlying EBITA to the FY '26 underlying EBITA. The first point to note is that the growth came from both organic and acquisitions. The growth was driven by a combination of pricing, financial planning revenue growth, new clients and continued expansion of our service offerings. We also increased our FUM by $1.8 billion during the period, which has contributed to increased investment income. And more pleasingly, we achieved record inflows in FY '26. Overall, we saw good contributions from both organic growth and acquisitions during the year. Within the segments, starting with Equity Partnerships, revenue increased 27% to $87.1 million and EBITA increased 34% to $19.3 million. We delivered 9 out of the completed 10 transactions into the Equity Partnerships segment in addition to increasing our holdings in WSC Group. We continue to experience one-off integration costs related to acquisitions and write-offs during the period, especially in a period with significant M&A within the firms, and we have assisted firms in implementing stronger integration and change management processes. We continue our laser focus on driving higher organic growth through the financial planning revenues, which experienced 15% revenue growth in this segment. Within Wealth, revenue increased 8% to $45.8 million and EBITA increased 16% to $15.1 million. Growth was driven by increased FUM through the transition of Count portfolios and strong CARE net inflows and higher adviser licensing revenues. EBITA margin increased from 31% to 33%, and we continued our technology investments into Game of Money, our client engagement tool for advisers during the period. In Services, we delivered growth with revenue increasing 8% to $33 million and EBITA increasing 21% to $11.1 million. This result benefited from the McGing acquisition, growth in outsourcing and continued demand across our education and actuarial businesses. Corporate costs increased during the year as we continued to invest in technology, marketing, M&A capability and anti-money laundering and counterterrorism financing compliance initiatives. We ensured tight corporate cost management with the overall corporate cost at 7.3% of total revenues. We continue to target corporate costs as a percentage of total revenues downwards as we increase our revenue base over time. The corporate cost initiatives we made during the period ensures we continue to support ongoing growth initiatives, uplifting maturity for future periods, particularly around adoption of AI, cybersecurity risks, delivering our M&A objectives, meeting compliance requirements such as AML/CTF, modern slavery and payment times reporting due to our increased size and scale. This slide shows how the business has developed over the last 4 years. As you can see, we have made tremendous progress in every operating segment, not just where we have invested, but also reflects the progress we have made in how we operate our business units in terms of capability, maturity and operational efficiencies. The numbers on the page reflect the combination of acquisitions, organic growth and improved scale across the business segments. This is really strong evidence of a flywheel in action. Following the Oracle acquisition completion, we expect the overall business EBITA margins to further improve. When you step back and look at the trend, the business today is significantly different to 3 years ago. Turning to cash flow. We again produced strong cash generation during the period. Net operating cash flow increased 41% to $31.1 million, driven by the growth in earnings across the business and a strong continued focus on working capital management. Importantly, cash conversion remains strong with underlying EBITDA cash conversion of 102%, broadly consistent with the prior year. Interest costs were lower than FY '25 due to the placement in April and the share purchase plan completed in May '26, while our tax payments increased in line with higher profitability. The cash flow profile of the business continues to provide flexibility to fund acquisitions, invest in growth initiatives and support increasing dividends. Turning to the balance sheet. We finished the year in a strong position. Cash at year-end was $63.9 million and gross debt reduced to $37.8 million, resulting in a net cash position of $26.1 million. The balance sheet shows strong operating cash flows, together with the capital raising completed in April and in May ahead of the Oracle acquisition completion. We operate with significant headroom within our debt facilities, and we have approximately $35 million of undrawn headroom as at 30 June. This increased to around $52 million following the completion of the Oracle transaction in July and the refinancing through the new CBA debt facilities. In addition, we also established a $33 million accordion facility, and that gives the business plenty of flexibility to continue to fund our disciplined M&A strategy. Overall, leverage remains comfortably within our banking covenants and provides flexibility to continue pursuing acquisition opportunities as they arise. The Board has declared a final dividend of $0.03 per share, fully franked, bringing total FY '26 declared dividends to $0.05 per share, up from $0.045 in FY '25. This dividend falls within our dividend payout policy range of 60% to 90% of maintainable earnings, and the increased dividend is a result of the strong earnings and better cash flow generation during the year. Dividends continue to be funded from operating cash flow, and we finished the year with approximately $20 million of available franking credits. The dividend reinvestment plan is once again available to shareholders and will operate at a 0 discount. This represents an opportunity for shareholders to further increase their holdings and the funds from the DRP will assist with additional cash to enable Count to enable deploying capital at accretive returns. We have a strong focus on capital discipline and optimizing returns through new and existing investments, and we are very focused on accretive initiatives where we can improve and grow our earnings. Thank you for your attention, and I'll pass back to Hugh to share his views on the outlook for FY '27.

Thank you, Keith. And can I please also acknowledge your tremendous work throughout the year to support these successes. Well done, and thank you. Before we move to questions, I did want to spend a moment on where we're focused over the coming years and the outlook for the business. Our ambition remains to build a stronger accounting advice and wealth business that delivers true value to clients and shareholders. And the 4 pillars on this slide reflect the areas where we're directing our attention: expanding our advice capabilities, strengthening our education and expertise offering, continuing to grow our investment solutions business and building scale through our equity partnerships. Supporting that is continued investment in our people, technology and AI and our operating model. We know that we face choppy investment markets ahead. We'll make long-term investments into Count Wealth, and we're doing the hard work now for the payoff in the years to come. While the plan itself has evolved a little over time, the underlying objective has remained constant: grow the business, deepen client relationships and improve returns and all in service of our purpose, which is simply: Make it Count. As we look ahead, the opportunities in front of us remain significant. We see substantial upside across financial planning, investment solutions, services and of course, our mergers and acquisitions. And we know that we're well placed to continue building on the momentum of recent years. We remain very focused on growing our financial planning capability, increasing adoption of the CARE philosophy and Count investment solutions, supporting our equity partnership firms and continuing to expand the take-up of our services across the network. Thank you for your attention. And I will now hand back to our Company Secretary, Doug Richardson, who will take us through the process to open up for questions and answers.

Thanks, Hugh and Keith, for your presentations, and thank you to the investors and analysts for your attention. [Operator Instructions] I've noticed there's a few hands up. We might go with you first, [ Oli ], because I've noticed you've had your hand up the longest, so we'll take it to you. So we'll take you off mute.

Congrats on the strongest result, I think, I've covered on you, which I think is the 10th now. Obviously, pre-date your time, Hugh. Maybe just on the M&A pipeline for Keith. Have you seen any change in the multiples there? How has the capability that you've built on M&A allow you to execute those deals better with more or less risk? And then of the $52 million, how much do you think you'd be willing to kind of actually let go without the Board starting to stress about leverage levels?

Thanks, [ Oli ]. Look, the M&A pipeline continues to be very strong. We do get a lot of inbounds, and that's constantly increasing at the moment. I think where we're seeing the multiples is it is quite a heated space. And we do see a slight nudging of the multiples in some areas. But really, it is in the Ts and Cs where I think that's still a big matter or differential, particularly to the vendors and how they think about the overall transaction. And it depends on the model itself. So where vendors are staying or they're looking for a 100% divestment, that's a very different outcome in those scenarios. But we do see that being played out a lot more in the Ts and Cs in terms of deferred and earnouts. And I think that is a very important distinction to call out where our model very -- differs to some of the other private equity players that are looking for a type of 100% type acquisition. I think in terms of the headroom, look, that always is subject to how accretive transactions are. So -- but we've got significant headroom in our debt covenants. As we stand today, the new CBA facilities provide us a lot of comfort around that. So we'll continue to be able to execute on that and for at least the foreseeable future at this stage. Obviously, a bit different for large transformational-type acquisitions, but our BAU acquisitions is -- we can continue to maintain that run rate going forward.

I might add a couple of comments as well, Keith, just on that, just to throw out a comment you made around, certainly, [ Oli ], while we are seeing a lot of interest in the market, both in advice and accounting and a lot of that being foreign capital, what we're also finding is that our proposition has a lot more strength than just a headline offer. And increasingly, with more players in the market, I think advisers and accountants are wisening up to comparing the propositions, and they generally are looking for more than just an injection of capital. And so where foreign capital might take out 100% or a minority investment, but not come to the table with other support and services and a future pipeline of M&A and other things, it's less attractive than what we offer to the market. The second thing I'd just say is, in addition to building M&A pipeline, Keith and I have been very focused on building out a very strong integration capability, and we now have 2 program managers within the business that ensure that when we bring these businesses in, we land them really nicely. And obviously, the quicker that we can integrate and get them up to speed, the better we can drive the returns.

Any further questions, [ Oli ]?

Yes. Just in terms of the technology capability, you seem to have invested reasonably heavily on that. I guess, how do you see the payback on that? Is it -- are you charging the underlying firms that you don't necessarily have equity interest in for that? And what are the capabilities specifically that you funded? And I suppose what's the outlook into '27 for any tech build there?

Yes. Thanks, [ Oli ]. I'll start with that, and I'll invite a couple of comments from Keith, who has oversight of our Equity Partnerships segment as well. I think we think about technology in 3 ways. Firstly, for our financial advice partners in the licensees, we have a team of technology experts that will do reviews of emerging capabilities, help with workflows, provide sort of consulting services into firms to help them to improve the way they do to negotiate agreements, et cetera. And so that advice technology team plays a big role and our firms pay through their licensing fees for that. The second area is the technology initiatives that we run across our Equity Partnerships segment, and that's obviously where we might take a more active involvement in helping to develop and to deliver solutions there. And obviously, as an equity owner in the firm and then as an extreme, if you take Count Wealth, clearly, that has a big and significant payback for us. And the third is our corporate [ CARE ], which is -- and really what we've called out in this pack is if you go back 3 or 4 years ago, [ Oli ], we had sort of one kind of IT manager in the business. So today, we do have a small but well-formed team of technologists who are looking at those different segments and creating opportunities to improve how we do business. More specifically, the projects that we're working on, and I sort of hasten to add, we're very cautious with our technology budget. So we're not anticipating some sort of big or material change in the proportion of spend. However, it is becoming increasingly important. And so we're developing AI capabilities to sit on top of our knowledge shop help desk. We're looking at programs of work. We have a technology program to build out the CARE philosophy, Game of Money pathway to work to continue to enhance those tools for advisers and clients. And those initiatives are obviously critical in terms of driving growth in the business.

Yes. Look, I think just to add to Hugh's -- and really his response was quite extensive, the equity firms definitely is still ripe for that kind of disruption. I think you look back at a lot of the businesses, particularly in that small to medium enterprise, can't afford to have like AI technologists to help them drive efficient processes. So there is still a lot of upside in driving that, and that will come through to us, not just in dividends, but also the model itself and the value proposition that we will have to other equity firms as well.

Thanks, [ Oli ]. I might give an opportunity for Andrew to ask a question then followed by Nick. So go ahead, Andrew.

Let me just start on equity partnerships. Just in terms of -- I guess, in the medium term, we've got an expectation that the margin will lift slowly as financial planning becomes a bigger part of that business. But in the nearer term, do you think there's any upside to that margin as a function within accounting that as you get the review of taxation and more people come in, where accountants previously had sort of lower utilization at different parts of the year, that gets bumped up by that extra activity that's going on?

Yes. Thanks, Andrew. Look, we do -- we have seen, as you look across the equity partnerships, some steady improvements in margin over time. I think our view would be on the accounting side. Those -- that sort of gentle trajectory would continue. As you point out, probably the most significant lever there is the introduction of those accounting clients into the wealth side of the business, and we know that we're nowhere near where we anticipate to be in the future. So that -- and that we see, as you rightly point out, is the margin growth. I think in the accounting side, we will -- we are and we will see some modest improvements in the processes that will allow for some efficiencies, but I don't think that we forecasted sort of a dramatic change in that space. And again, importantly, a lot of those conversations, again, as you rightly point out, are quite complex discussions around family offices and small businesses and complex tax matters that aren't just transactional. They do require some strategic work and so forth. But the more time we can free up from our accountants, the more time they can put in front of their clients. The other thing I would say is that I think over the last sort of 4 or 5 years, we've also done a good job of really smoothing out and kind of the annual workload of accountants because a lot of that work doesn't need to wait until the 30th of June; it can be done throughout the year. So we have a pretty tight resourcing model. And Keith, did you want to touch on anything?

I think definitely, to add to Hugh's point is, we continue to be focused, obviously, on driving that better margin. But offsetting that is the number of M&A opportunities that the firms are also ingesting. So it's a balance between that revenue growth and earnings growth and the margin. As you ingest in an acquisition that first 12 to 18 months, there is some one-off costs that we saw in the last financial year that did hit that segment and been more moderated this year, obviously. But that's the balance you have between a really healthy business that purely focuses on organic and the balance between having to have that business distracted with some of those integration activities. So we are balancing that out and the balance between revenue and the margin itself.

And could I just turn your attention to the Services division. It was a nice margin improvement there. I noticed that you've sort of identified some of the operating efficiency come as a function of AI tools. I'm just after a sort of a description of where you think that process is up to, as in, does that have more to run with respect to improving the back-end efficiency of that division leading into margin?

Yes. Thanks, Andrew. And specifically in our actuarial consulting business, we build a lot of models to help businesses solve complex calculations and the revenues that we're generating there and the cost efficiencies come from the ability to use AI to build and test those models and reduce the turnaround time for that. So we see that clearly enabling some of the revenue growth from the actuarial consulting business. Where it's sort of earlier days is the potential to, I think, create those operational efficiencies and as we're starting to see AI and automation take effect in our outsourcing services, and as I alluded to, in businesses like knowledge shop, where we have a huge amount of complex information that we can serve up to answer specific client needs as asked by accountants to us, then we see some efficiencies over time. We think that will probably be a combination of really allowing us to generate more revenue from the cost base that we have as opposed to necessarily seeing a reduction in the cost base, particularly once you include the cost of some of these technology solutions. But certainly, we think it's still at a very early stage and the figures that we've shared today are relatively modest. I mean the other point to make in another part of the business is not services, but in advice, and I think I've made this point before. As we transition from reviewing some advice documents after they've been implemented for the client to a state where we review all advice documents before they're delivered to the client is a transformational change in terms of the client experience, the adviser experience and the precision removes the rework, gives us a much greater degree of confidence around the risk profiles, et cetera. So there are some fairly dramatic improvements that we are anticipating that might not just be cost, they might be revenue, but they might also be associated to the risk profile of the business as well.

Welcome to the call, Nick.

Can you talk through the kind of conversations that advisers and accountants are having now around the budget -- the proposed tax changes in the budget? Are they -- is there any action happening now? Or is it really waiting for legislation to then undertake some restructuring?

Yes. Look, I think great question, Nick, and it's probably a combination of all of the above. And as always, it depends on the individual client circumstances and their objectives. So what I would say is there are an awful lot of conversations happening. It's not just a sort of a one-off. These proposed changes and subject to all of them being implemented in what shape and form, not all of that is clear as yet. But there's going to be multiyear implications, potentially sort of intergenerational implications from some of the changes proposed through the federal budget. So it's driven a lot of inbound and outbound activity from our accountants and our financial advisers, lots of questions about restructuring. Obviously, with things like the changes to the nonrecourse loans within self-managed super funds, that was a time-based thing. So plenty of activity around that space through the month of August. But in other areas, there is a bit of wait-and-see until there's the confidence of exactly what those changes look like, so people aren't jumping the gun too soon.

So it's potentially more of a benefit to back end of FY '27, maybe into '28 in terms of actually fee events?

I think what we think it does, Nick, is it just really emphasizes the importance of having great accountants and having a financial adviser. And I'm sure you feel the same, everyone you talk to, there's a lot of confusion and misinformation out there around what these budget changes actually mean and then what might come next, and so seeking assistance, seeking help. Certainly, we're seeing elevated demand, and we expect to see that continue out for some time. Obviously, we've got still constrained capacity, both in terms of accounting and financial advice, so more demand than we can meet. But the other, I think, significant and kind of big system change that this budget has enacted is a real sharp focus on the value of superannuation and investments, particularly to younger generations who are now perversely locked out from property ownership and other asset classes becoming less attractive and the tax benefits of paying, sort of circa, the 15% on your super contributions and circa 15% on the earnings within that environment, very, very attractive for people. So we think that super moves into a new phase of attractiveness across generations that perhaps in the past have been less focused on that.

And maybe just a question on Oracle. You obviously provided an update on the contribution or the earnings of that business in '26. How should we think about the momentum of that business into '27? Should it be above the circa $9.1 million contribution that they booked in profit for '26?