Cyrela Brazil Realty S.A. Empreendimentos e Participações ($CYRE3)

Good morning, ladies and gentlemen. And welcome to Cyrela Brazil Realty S.A. earnings conference call regarding the company's first quarter 2026 results. Joining us today are Raphael Horn, CEO; and Miguel Mickelberg, CFO and Investor Relations Officer. Please note that this conference call is being recorded and simultaneously translated. [Operator Instructions] We'd like to remind you that any statements made during this conference call regarding Cyrela's business outlook, operating and financial targets constitute forward-looking statements by the company's management and may or may not materialize. Investors should understand the political, macroeconomic and other operating factors may affect the company's future performance and could cause actual results to differ materially from those expressed in such forward-looking statements. To begin the first Q 2026 earnings conference call. I would now like to turn the floor to Mr. Miguel Mickelberg, CFO and IRO. Mr. Mickelberg, you may begin, sir.

Good morning, everyone, and thank you very much for joining our call. We began 2026 in a business environment that continues to require caution discipline and adaptability. The macroeconomic environment remains challenging with interest rates still at elevated levels in Brazil while the external environment continues to be marked by uncertainty and geopolitical tensions that may generate additional impacts on supply chain and construction costs over the coming quarters. In this context, Cyrela maintained its strategy focused on selective launches, commercial discipline and rigorous capital allocation. From an operational standpoint, we delivered consistent performance in the first quarter launches totaled BRL 1.7 billion, considering the company's presented ownership and excluding swaps and showed strong customer acceptance with an SOS of 45%. And presales reached BRL 2.2 billion in the quarter, excluding swaps and considering the company's percentage of ownership, slightly above the level recorded in the same period last year. I would also like to highlight the positive performance of finished inventory sales, which contributed to cash generation during the period and reinforces the quality of our portfolio. On the financial side, our results once again demonstrated the strength of the company's business model. We posted net revenue of BRL 2 billion gross margin of 32.9% and net income of BRL 197 million in the quarter. Adjusted ROE for the last 12 months closed the period at 21.2%, remaining at healthy levels and reflecting our ability to generate value for the shareholders. Cash generation totaled BRL 134 million in the quarter, supported by healthy sales dynamics and disciplined financial management, which contributed to reducing the debt to adjusted equity ratio of 19.6%. We'll continue to closely monitor the developments in the macroeconomic environment and the potential implications for the sector while maintaining a disciplined approach in selecting new projects and a conservative stance towards capital management. Cyrela will continue to focus on developing differentiated and unique projects delivering excellence throughout the customer journey and pursuing sustainable results throughout the cycle. We'd like to thank our employees, clients, partner, shareholders and other stakeholders for their trust and continued support. Let's now look at the operating performance. On Slide 4, we'll talk about Cyrela's launches. The launches totaled BRL 1.7 billion in the total Cyrela share, it is a 48% dip year-on-year and 47% decrease quarter-on-quarter. On Slide 5, we have our -- in the [ PaxiladeJargin ] project that is in Rio de Janeiro, the sales performed really well in the first month after the launch. On Slide 6, we talk about the sales in Brazil. We had BRL 2.2 billion in the quarter, it's a 2% rise whether on PAT year-on-year and a 9% decrease quarter-on-quarter. On the following slide, we see the sales speed. Our SOS in the past 12 months amounted to 45.8%, slightly higher than the reference from the previous year, and we can see the launch vintages or periods to the right, and we see that what we launched in the first quarter, 2026 already sold 45%. Let's look at our inventory. We had BRL 11.3 billion in the PSV inventory, and we can see the breakdown in the chart. To the right, we see the breakdown in different regions. We see that 71% of our inventory is in Sao Paulo, 14% in Rio de Janeiro and 7% in the south of the country. On Slide 9, we see the finished inventory. We ended the quarter at BRL 1.7 billion. It is an 8% dip quarter on quarter and we see that 44% of these finished units are in Sao Paulo, 22% of them are in Rio de Janeiro and 19% in the sales of the country. On Slide 10, we look at the deliveries. We had BRL 113 million in the first quarter. It's a 50% rise year-on-year and 64% down quarter-on-quarter. Let's look at our financial results now. On Slide 12, we can see our revenue. We had BRL 2 billion in the first quarter. That's a 4% rise year-on-year and it's a 37% decrease quarter-on-quarter. To the right, we can see our gross profit and our gross margin. It's very similar to the comparable periods, so 32.9% in the first quarter compared to 32.5% in the first quarter of 2025 and 32.3% in the fourth quarter 2025. As for net income and profitability in the chart to the left, we see our net income and net margin. We had BRL 197 million in the first quarter 2026. It's a 9% decrease year-on-year and a 56% decrease quarter-on-quarter. Our net margin was 14.7%. To the right, we see our return on equity in the last 12 months. We closed the period at 21.2% comparing to 22.3% in the fourth quarter, 2025 5 and the first quarter 2025, we had 20.9%. Slide 14. Let's now talk about our liquidity and debt. Our net debt was BRL 8.6 billion. That's stable in comparison to the fourth quarter 2025 the leverage dipped from 21.6% to 19.6% in comparing to the fourth quarter 2025. And to the right, we can see the breakdown of our debt and 87% of the debt is long term. And we can see the average rates for the whole of the debt breakdown. And our cash generation to wrap up. We had BRL 134 million in the first quarter of 2026 comparing to BRL 71 million in the first quarter of 2025 and a cash burn of BRL 38 million in the fourth quarter 2025. This is the end of the presentation. And myself and Raphael will be available for the Q&A session now.

[Operator Instructions] [indiscernible] from Santander has a question.

I have got 2 actually, and they're related to each other. The first 1 has to do with the initiatives that you have to reduce your inventory levels. We see there is some discount in the unit pricing, but what other initiatives do you have considering real estate agents and what trends do you expect to see concerning our inventory? Is there any concern that you actually have anything that requires more efforts? That's my first question. And the second question has to do with selling expenses. Selling expenses were considerably higher than we had expected. We know that -- some of that has to do with the decommissioning of some showrooms. But where and when can we expect some stability in selling expenses looking forward? I don't know if there were bonuses paid to the realtors. But I think it's important that we should understand what we can expect in this line item. These are my 2 questions.

This is Raphael. We're selling finished units better than we were last year. There was no major discount. We are quite pragmatic. We have 50 pretty ready, and we're pragmatic if the price is not correct. We adjusted, but we don't see any major discounts. It's not an easy scenario, but we can navigate it quite well. So we may have made adjustments to the ad product. But other than that, it's business as usual. We had BRL 50 million in discount in BRL 5 billion that -- there's no actual price reduction. As for selling expenses, Miguel's going to be discussing it better, but we look at the selling expenses per product and how much we are spending. And we're really as expected we're really doing as expected. . The balance is timeless for present past and future. So there are some numbers that are correct, of course, but it's not a number that would be concerning anyway. We're not concerned about this line item. It's as expected, by Miguel will further detail it out .

This is Miguel. As for the selling expenses, last year, we had about BRL 180 million with the sales booths and the accounting effect was BRL 139 million. So we had almost BRL 47 million added to our costs in the sales booths. But in this quarter, we had a different effect, the opposite effect as we decommission these sales booths. We had BRL 94 million in the accounting referenced, but the actual expense was BRL 60 million. So 75% of the increase we had in fixed costs or in fixed items has already been given back in this first quarter. We don't expect any substantial increase in this year -- in the well, SG&A as a whole, let's talk about that. It was 15% of our revenue in 2025. And this year, we understand that SG&A should grow a bit more than inflation. And of course, the revenue will depend on the sales. But as we said in our past call, we understand that it should have a positive trend. So SG&A over revenue should be close to 15%, which is what we had last year as well. And as Raphael mentioned, to us, it's much more important to understand that each product is following the budget is spending what we planned so that we can preserve the margins and the returns on each project and we have been able to maintain that.

I ask a follow-up question from Raphael's answer. I understand that the price impact is minor. But is there any initiative to engage more realtors to bring them into the inventory sales because you're talking about the finished units, but there's also some of the inventory that was launched last year. So how do the realtors feel about working more with these other units if any.

Are you thinking about opening a real estate agency? Are you talking about engaging in real state agents, right? I'm sorry. That was a joke. But well -- we have a very strong seller. When you work with third-party agencies. There, there would you at the lunch. And after the launch, they'll be working with the next developer. So the easy low-hanging fruit are the ones that are there during the launch and then what comes after. is not going to be a focus from the real estate agents. And that's why we created a seller 34 years ago so that we wouldn't be a victim of this process. So how can we focus on inventory Well, we have a very strong seller. It's stronger and stronger, the more difficult the market is. The more the seller is a safe haven for the good realtors in the market. Harder market as we have at the moment. The difference of having the seller and working with the seller is even more important. And that's why we can always sell our inventory well. We can have our realtors working for launches and for ready finished units. They can't work only with launches. They have to work with the launches, of course, but also with the finished units there. And as you want to have your own real estate agency, any developer has to have a very strong house and with a strong house, you can have the realtor always focusing on what the developer needs and not only the low-hanging fruit.

Thank you, Raphael. I may try and get a job with you.

Well, we always need good employees, right?

[ Pedro Bata ] from Bradesco has your other question.

Talking about prices, Miguel mentioned that the launches are as expected. But can you try and talk a little bit more about the pressure you've been feeling -- the impact we see on the quarter, if you would have a more conservative stance and what do you expect when it comes to costs? And my second question is when you think about PSV for the year. Can you also give more detail about the 3 brands, the 3 brands?

This is Miguel. Talking about the launches. We don't give guidance, right? And we don't give you a breakdown by brand much because there's a lot of uncertainty, but we don't expect growth in the amount of launches. Vivas should grow a bit. But on the whole, we should probably be slightly lower than what we had in 2025. As for the cost scenario we see price increases in many of the inputs. That's right. Our engineering team considering everything they have already identified either price increases that have taken place or they are about to place, we expect there should be about 7% to 9% difference in the year. And how does this impact Cyrela, right? . The fact that we focus on a mid, high end as well as on the low-end markets creates a natural hedge for us. The receivables that are adjusted by INCC. So excluding all of the Vivaz receivables, basically we have net receivables at are BRL 10.8 billion at the end of the first quarter. And we have construction costs that are going to be exposed to the INCC, the natural construction -- the National Construction cost index that are about BRL 8.2 billion. So we have BRL 2.6 billion overhead, let's call it. So in the short run, higher INCC can be positive for our results. If you look at Cyrela's gross margin in the past 10 to 15 years, 2021 was the year where we had the highest gross margin because the INCC index was very high. So we had 35% in 2021. Of course, there are 2 effects that we need to be mindful of. In the mid- to high end in the medium term, you can only sustain these margins if you can readjust inventory prices. And this is uncertain, depending on the INCC levels, we will see how much we can transfer on and how the market behaves. And on the low-end segment, -- we do not have the INCC index protection, so we could lose margins in the short run. And in the low-end market, we expect a 6% inflation a year. And we have a 2% flat allowance on top of the launches. So this inflation forecast as well as this allowance, they are a cushion, but of course, with a higher inflation rate, you could see an impact on the Vivaz segment gross margin, but that we should see an increase in the mid high end. And of course, the selling prices should keep up with the INCC values, right, so that we can sustain our margin structure in.

[ Elvis Credendio ] from Itau BBA.

I've got 2 questions. The first is to do with sales. Can you talk a little bit about the rhythm, the pace you have at the start of the second -- on the second quarter for finished units as well as for launches. And if you can give us some color on the segment as a whole. And my second question has to do with the revenue. We saw some volatility in the past quarters there. As of the second quarter, do you expect some more stability and looking at the pace of sales you see -- do you expect to see an increase in revenue, maybe a high single-digit increase -- can you share any expectations you may have on that front?

Our perception is that 2026 is very similar to 2025. This is a game for professional players. It's challenging. It's not for the faint hearted, it's not for [indiscernible]. This is for professional players. But for professionals, the market is fine. So we're not concerned. The market is absorbing what we're doing, of course, is not the same levels we had in 2022 or '23. We were in Switzerland back then. And now we're in a okay market. But [ Fannie ] wanted to found her own real estate agency, if you want to have your own high-end developer, I think I would tell you this is a hard moment for you to get started into this business. But for a professional in this business, you can still make quite a bit of money. Of course, the situation can get worse. It could get worse in a year. We could have 18% interest base interest. You could have a recession in the country. From 2018 to 2024, this was 1 period. Now 2025, 2026. This is a new period that has started. But I would say that in 2018, 2019, the amateurs had a chance at this game. But people often say in Brazil that Brazil is not meant for the faint hearted, it's not meant for amateurs, and I really say that 2025, 2026, that is true.

This is Miguel. I give you some data in our last discussion -- last quarter. And I'd like to repeat them now. Because of our accelerated growth in the past years, we see that the sales that are going to be recognized through consolidation, they have been systematically higher than our revenue in general. And what is recognized to consolidation goes straight into the revenue later. So in 2024, we had BRL 10 billion in consolidation and BRL 7.7 billion in revenue. In 2025 we had BRL 10.5 billion and BRL 9.4 billion in revenue. So another BRL 1 billion in this GAAP. In the first quarter, we see this effect again. So through consolidation, we had BRL 2.4 billion, and the revenue was BRL 2 billion. So we have BRL BRL 370 million growth in this future revenue. And with that, the revenue to be recognized net of taxes, closed the quarter at BRL 11.7 billion. And in the first quarter, 2025 million, it was BRL 9.4 billion. So this substantial and growing revenue to be recognized creates a very good dynamic for our revenues in the future. We have [ BRL 5 billion from million ] and we have 3 boxes. We have milling. We have new sales, and we have new launches. These are 3 pillars. As I said in the previous quarter, we continue to see this first line item growing BRL 0.5 billion or BRL 1 billion this year. And our sales are on the level that we expected them to be. We're meeting our targets. And if we continue like that, we'll have similar sales levels or maybe even slightly higher than we had in 2025. And should that happen, then we'll certainly have an increase in revenue because the base of the POC that is POC coming from the milling. So the POC will grow and make sure that the revenue is higher if we continue with the sales levels. So we do believe there will be an increase in revenue, how to say if it's going to be high single digit or maybe even higher than that, but we do expect something along these lines.

That's crystal clear. Thank you, Miguel and Raphael. I'll open my real estate developer when the market is doing better. I'll leave it to the professionals for now.

Alejandra Obregon from Morgan Stanley. .

Mine is related to construction execution and perhaps your construction cycle times. Just wondering if you can talk about how I don't know, recent cost dynamics, labor constraints and even your greater exposure to [indiscernible] have changed how projects go through the percent of completion curve. I mean more specifically, if you're seeing any compression or elongation of your construction cycle times? And how has that translated into quarterly completion and revenue recognition pattern changes as of late.

Alejandra, thank you very much for your question. I think we have basically 1 structural change to our construction cycle, and that is actually in the Cyrela branded, the high-end brand. We have been doing taller buildings. And because of the zoning laws, we have been adding more mixed-use areas to the projects -- and those areas, they create transitions in the construction cycle, which tend to elongate the construction cycle. So in the Cyrela brand in the past, from launch into delivery, the cycle would last more or less 36 months. Today, I would say our average for this segment would be closer to 48 months. But on the Vivaz brand on the [indiscernible] segment, we haven't seen a significant change to our construction cycle. I would actually say they actually are even probably a bit shorter than in the past because we have been starting construction now in the low-income segment after 4 or 6 months after launch. So the cycle today tends to last more or less 30 months from 30 to 36 months for this segment, which is similar to what we had been doing, let's say, 5 years ago. So the main change actually happens at the Cyrela brand because of taller buildings and longer construction cycles. I hope this clarifies your question.

Next question comes from [ Iger Altero ] from XP.

I've got 2 questions as well. When it comes to launches, with the new INCC scenario, you could decrease your sales speed and also cash generation was quite good this quarter. So I'd like to understand that better why there was so? And in the scenario where Miguel said there may not be any increases in launches. Can we have any expectation of a better cash generation in the course of the year?

As Raphael joked, I don't know if you want to open a real estate agency or a real estate developer. Well, so far, we've been doing well when it comes to launches, right? We have launches and [indiscernible] for the Cyrela in April and May for Cyrela, we -- as Raphael said, we understand this year is going to be similar to last year. We're going to meet our targets in sales. As for cash generation, this was a good quarter, BRL 134 million in cash generation. The 2 main impacts were, one, the increase in the payments in the inventory sales. We had an increase in finished unit sales that has an impact, a positive impact on the cash for the quarter. And another factor was the very small expense on land bank. These 2 lines are very volatile in the course of the year. So we see some volatility in cash generation. So, so far in the second quarter, we have a substantial cash burn. So even though we may launch a similar or slightly lower amount in this year, it doesn't necessarily mean we're going to have a lower cash generation in the year. Our Cyrela cycle has been about 4 years from the launch to the delivery. So it takes time until a decrease and launches or stability translating to cash. I would say about 2 years may be 3 after you stopped growing. So this is not something that's going to be happening this year or next year. This year, -- we estimate cash generation that's going to be about BRL 200 million.

Olavo Fleming from [indiscernible] got a question.

I've also got 2 questions. The first has to do with the inventory. It's a follow-up question. You already mentioned you have had some minor adjustments in some projects. But considering a worse macroeconomic backdrop, would you increase the discounts and these and give more discounts and other products? And also want to get a with on the sales for -- in construction and already finished units. In [indiscernible] Vida, we see that the mid-, high-end players saying that they also want to have launches in the low end -- has that had an impact on your land bank negotiations? Or do you see the same players as always.

Again, we're not giving discounts. We're doing well and our targets. We're 100% meeting budget for this year for both finished units and units under construction as well. So what we predicted at the start of the year is what's coming true. So far it's business as usual. First of all, Minha Casa Minha Vida is that gets to the more traditional players. It's now the other players from other segments that have come down to [indiscernible] and it takes time for you to actually be able to have this transition to Minha Casa Minha Vida. It's not an easy transition. Going from heavy weight to to a lightweight, you have to lose a lot of weight.

Tainan Costa from UBS got a question.

Going back to launches for this year. Miguel already said that Vivaz could have an increase in PSV. What is the biggest you expect this to be, considering the structure that you have? So what is the main bottleneck in growth that you see and Vivaz at least and is there any expectation to accelerate sales this year? That's my first question. The second question has to do with with financial expenses. It was a bit more than we had expected. Anything specific you'd like to talk about, once you've sustained the same level of debt? Is there any trigger that big impact of the debt cost.

Vivaz is an independent company and the mid high end is an independent company. [indiscernible] the mid high once you have the best volume and Vivaz wants to have the best volume as much profitable as possible as much profit as possible structure as possible. We got launched BRL 2 billion in 2026. You can have a company much bigger than we already have. So the company has been growing without absurd growth rates because our challenge is to make sure that we can grow, deliver the margins and the SOS that we expect. So not reducing MAP to -- we're not going to be reducing high end to increase the low end, they're independent. So these are 2 completely independent companies and one cave into the other. So MAP won't be impacting Vivaz or vice versa, it's not cannibalizing each other. So we can grow and the bottleneck is ourselves. It's our ability to have a team that can deliver. Their players are more experienced, more seasoned than we are and they have more business maturity, and they can they can have a much higher launch amount a year as they have more salespeople. They have more engineers. They have engineers more experienced a Minha Casa Minha Vida. So we're moving at our pace. We don't -- we don't look to other players. We're playing golf here. We're playing against ourselves. And we're really playing as we find healthy. We're not going to have our profitability at risk .

This is Miguel. I'll talk about the financial expenses. When you look at the line items, you see that the debt level at the end of the fourth quarter 2025 in the first quarter, 2026, the levels are quite similar. But there is an interaction here that is important. In December last year, we issued a debt of BRL 600 million, and we paid BRL 1 billion in dividends. This impacted about 15 days in 90 days of the last quarter 2025 but it impacted this first quarter of 2026 in full. So this leads to an increase in financial expenses and a reduction in the financial results in the earnings. As per the dividend payment we made at the end of the year last year. Other than that, the rest is as expected.

[ Gustavo Forbes ] from BTG has got a question.

I've got 2 questions. I'd like to understand your land bank appetite in the mid-high end market -- how have you been also feeling the market when it comes to competition and pricing in this context? That's my first question. The second question has to do with still monetizing the stakes in JVs. How much could this impact the P&L in the course of the year.

Thank you for your question. Let me start talking about the land bank. Ever since 2025, the market has been more challenging, as Raphael said. And due to that, we're always going to be adjusting our expectations as well as our activities. So we're raising the bar and we've been looking to have a bit of a buffer and the land bank. So he's been saying no to more landlords than in the past. We don't see any problem when it comes to availability. We see a lot of land lots in our committee, but we've been saying no to more landlords than in the past. When the market was -- I'm not going to say easier, but less difficult, at least. So yes, we've been adjusting our stance and our actions. As for the JV stakes monetization, we do not have any set budget for that. when we decide to sell, we will look at the stock prices, and we decide what makes more sense looking at them individually. And with the decreases in the stock prices that we've been seeing since February, a substantial part of our JVs, including Cyrela itself is 30%, 35% lower than what we had in February. We're in no hurry to sell -- so we could really have no share, no stuff being sold in the JV. We will take decisions if we understand that the pricing is better for our sales. But at this point, we're not interested in selling any of them.

Jorel Guilloty from Goldman Sachs. .

I've got 2 questions. I'd like to understand -- what do you expect in land lord considering POC for the coming launches .

We had smaller land lots this quarter, right, that impacted the POC and proportion project. The value of the landlord is lower in comparison to the PSV of the project is being paid in installments. Is this something that was a one-off? Or should we expect to see more of that. And ROE was 21% in the past month in the past quarters, but it was 11% in this quarter.

You said in the past that ROE above wasn't a target, but it was achievable. What is your expectation now for the ROE in the long run? And if 20% reference is still an achievable target?

Thank you for your question. The initial recognizing level of our POCs in our projects, when we recognize launch, we have basically no expenses when it comes to launches. So the recognition is really focused on the landlord. And we have had no structural change neither in the low end or in the mid- to high-end market. An effect you may be seeing is that in this quarter, the low end share was higher and the landlord has a smaller share of the our PSV than in the high end. With the exception of a few outliers, the high-end projects have about 36% recognition at first and the low end initial recognition is about 23%. So there are impacts such as the swap percentage and other factors but we don't see any impact on how much the landlord has been representing of our PSV. There can be more of a mix effect. Now as for our ROE, we understand that 20% is sustainable. This is what we expect to see and what we'll continue to aim at. But of course, it really depends on the market. It depends on the performance of our upcoming launches as well. But for now, we continue to see the 20% reference as sustainable.

Andre Mazini from Citi has got a question.

Raphael and Miguel, I've got 2 questions as well. When I think about the inflation and the impact on construction works. What is your forecast for inflation, maybe if you break it down by living Vivaz and the Cyrela brand. If it's bigger than any of these 3 and when you think about the sales groups, the expenses are there before during or after the launch. And how does that relate to the POC. So basically the timing of the sales booths cost and the launch, how they are related to each other.

Thank you, Mazini. Starting with the inflation forecast. -- we only project inflation in the Vivaz segment and it's 6% a year. In Cyrela & Living, we do not forecast inflation because the sales adjusted by the INCC I mean all of the pending payments are adjusted by INCC and the receivables, whenever you look at them, it's going to be much higher -- then the cost of construction was impacting the project. So the customer has paid for 30% of the sold PSV. When you have 15% of the construction work done. So we do not project inflation because what we project is that the inventory is going to follow the inflation and that the receivables are corrected by inflation. So every month, we correct the INCC inventory and the pending receivables are corrected automatically by INCC. So this is Cyrela and Living. Now Vivaz, we have the inflation forecast because of the segment. Because with the transfer is still in the blueprint, that's how it goes. As for the sales booths, we normally start the expenses about 3 months prior to launch price to launch -- and all of these expenses are going to be capitalized, they go into our assets, and it's depreciated in about 12 months. It's normally the life of the sales booth and we amortize the value or the amount of the sales booth in the expenses. And when you close it earlier, then you have all of the pending balance for the sales booths. I'm not sure if that was clear, but if it's not, let me know. But the POC impact on the sales booth is explained. .

Marcelo Motta from JPMorgan has a question.

I've got 2 questions actually. On gross and net revenue. When we look at the revenue deductions, it's quite volatile on a quarter-on-quarter comparison, but we see that -- this quarter was a bit higher, about 6% if you compare it to 2025. It was closer to 4% on average, but the first quarter had been 7%. We're just trying to understand if there is anything different in this quarter, what we can expect for the year. And on the interest rates for the cost. This also went up this quarter in comparison to what we used to see. And historical reference. Should this go back to lower levels? And what can we expect there? These are my 2 questions.

Thank you for your questions. As for revenue deductions, we normally fluctuates or changes is that when you have swaps then you have no tax levied on the swap. So if we have less or fewer swaps in a quarter, then you have a higher or a lower impact on the impact higher or lower impact on the revenue, but there's nothing abnormal there. And as for the interest rates, Well, the interest should stay on this higher level for now? Because on the margin, we have been taking more loans. So in the third quarter payable and you have BRL 3.1 billion. This is basically what we have now. But again, there is an intra-quarter dynamic and evolve and the capitalized interest is higher now than in the fourth quarter, and we expect the amount now to be -- I mean, there could be some increase still, but we expect it to be about this level, yes. .

This is the end of the Q&A session. We'll now turn the floor over to Mr. Michael Mickelberg, for his final remarks.

I would like to thank all of our shareholders, all of our clients and customers and all of our staff, all of employees. Thank you all. We stand strong and we'll talk to you in the next quarter. Have a great weekend.

This is the end of Cyrela's earnings call. Should you have any questions, please send your questions to our RI team on RI e-mail. Thank you very much for joining the call, and have a good day.