Deutsche Bank Aktiengesellschaft (DBK) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

[Interpreted] Dear shareholders, ladies and gentlemen, welcome to our Annual General Meeting 2024, which I hereby open. We're looking back on an eventful year, which was, once again, marked by macroeconomic and geopolitical conflicts and challenges. In this volatile environment, Deutsche Bank once again demonstrated its resilience, sending shoulder to shoulder with our clients. Our bank demonstrated sustained revenue growth and delivered its highest pretax profit in 16 years. We are especially pleased to, again, be increasing our capital distribution this year. Today, we propose a dividend of EUR 0.45 per share. That is an increase of 50% year-on-year. Apart from the mere numbers, there's a number of other topics that we're going to discuss with you today. Many of you used the opportunity to submit questions in advance. Once again, this year, we received about 300 questions, and answered them. Before we turn to the questions, we will, however, first of all, take a look at the number of formal points. The meeting was convened in due and proper form. And the convocation document was published in the Federal Gazette on March 26, 2024. All Supervisory Board members are present here today. My Deputy, Norbert Winkeljohann [indiscernible]. Mr. Duscheck unfortunately can't be here today. We wish him all the best and good health. Mayree Clark and John Thain both follow from the U.S. All other members are here in a separate meeting room in this building, from where they follow the AGM and are able to communicate with us here today. I would also like to welcome them all very warmly. On your right, [ Mr. Habetha ], our notary public, is assisting here. He will take notarized minutes. The list of attendees is currently being prepared. It comprises, on the, one hand, the proxies for the company, who are present in the attendance area here today. All electronically -- all shareholders joining us by electronic means will also be included in the attendee list. We will provide you with more information once the list has been completed. It will then also be made available for everyone, and it will also may be accessible to all shareholders and shareholder representatives. The attendance area includes the forum and the ancillary rooms in the B2 section in this building, plus the facilities in B29, where the back-office is hosted and where later on, the votes will be counted. In addition, we have a meeting room for the Supervisory Board and ancillary rooms at A35 level. The agenda and the resolutions -- the proposed resolutions are available for inspection here. A copy is held by the notary public. The same thing applies to the announcements of counterproposals submitted in due time, which we also made available on our website. So much on the formal aspects. Ladies and gentlemen, 2023 was another very intense year for the Supervisory Board, too. In total, the Supervisory Board and its committees held 55 meetings. Don't worry, I will not take you through all of these meetings. However, I would like to give you a brief overview of our key priorities. One of these priorities, of course, included our personnel decisions. In April 2023, we made the changes to the Management Board that I presented to you in detail last year. I would like to take this opportunity to express my sincere thanks to the new management team for the smooth transition and their hard work over the past 12 months. Under the strong and successful leadership of our CEO, Christian Sewing, the management team has, once again, done an excellent job. In the light of the difficult environment already mentioned, the focus was, once again, on the bank's resilience and sustained profitability. This was also reflected in the work of the Supervisory Board. The committees focused in particular on the bank's liquidity, on managing credit and market risk and on potential nonfinancial risk. This includes regular updates on relevant legal cases. I will not go into detail about the Postbank litigation at this point, suffice to say that the Management Board will continue to vigorously uphold the bank's position and interests in this matter. Another key topic was how we further improved our controls in order to protect our clients and the sustained profitability of our bank. To this end, the bank invested around EUR 1.2 billion in 2023 and hired around 1,000 experts worldwide. We also regularly discuss regulatory issues in the Supervisory Board meetings. We know we can do better here. The bank is focused on delivering further improvements and is making sure that the necessary resources are available. Further strengthening our controls and meeting the high requirements of regulators in this area is essential for the success of our bank. It, therefore, continues to be one of the most important priorities this year, against which we will also evaluate Management Board performance. Other key issues the Supervisory Board dealt with last year include the restrictions for our clients following the migration of Postbank IT to a common platform. The Management Board regularly reported to the Supervisory Board on how backlogs that had arisen were resolved and how such problems can be avoided in future. It is quite clear in this context that our bank failed to meet our service and quality standards on this occasion and disappointed our clients. Both the Management Board and the Supervisory Board have apologize sincerely for this. Having made additional investment in technology, processes and controls last year, it was even more important to maintain cost discipline. Here, too, the Management Board reported regularly to the Supervisory Board on our progress. A further focus was on our financial targets up to 2025, including, in particular, our capital objectives and distributions to you, our shareholders. Above all, however, last year was about setting the course for future growth. The Supervisory Board, for example, dealt intensively with the strategic development of the corporate culture and business model. The Supervisory Board expressly supports the stronger focus on the bank's role as a Global Hausbank for our clients. Christian Sewing will tell you more about this in detail in a moment. So much in terms of looking back on the past year. As always, you will find more information in the annual report. I would now like to address 2 forward-looking issues, both of which are particularly close to my heart, the new Management Board compensation system and the definition of a clear corporate purpose. First of all, let me turn to the Management Board compensation system, which we have revised and you will vote on today. We have performed a fundamental review of the system. And of course, we've also taken account of market trends as well as the feedback from our investors. At its core, we are pursuing 2 objectives: First, we want to simplify the system, making it more transparent. Variable compensation will in future depend on significantly fewer targets and performance indicators. Second, we aim to align how we evaluate management Board members' performance even more closely with the interest of our shareholders. This applies above all to the long-term component of variable remuneration, which will no longer be measured against past year's results. The new system compensation is based on how targets develop over the following 3-year period. Targets that are particularly important to us include diversity as well as climate protection objectives. The revised compensation system will be made effective use of -- by the Supervisory Board, and you can be confident of this. Over the past 2 years, we have demonstrated that we strive for consistent performance-based compensation. This also means taking responsibility for negative developments, which is also adequately reflected in compensation. The new revised compensation system will already apply for this financial year. We therefore ask you for your approval today. Even more fundamental to the long-term success of our bank is the second topic I'd like to elaborate on. Our identity and the definition of a purpose, a shared understanding of what this bank and our employees stand for. Why we are here? What we aspire to? And how we get there? For more than a year, the Management Board has been working intensively on a framework that brings together our bank's purpose, strategy, vision and aspirational culture, a mission that is also dear to the Supervisory Board and me personally. We have, therefore, supported the process explicitly and closely monitored progress. Personally, I strongly believe in the power of purpose-led organizations. I am convinced that companies that want to be successful in the long term needs something that guides and unites employees for the benefit of our clients and other stakeholders. In purpose alliance goals, values and actions, it unites us as a bank. It provides us with orientation even when taking difficult decisions. It gives us meaning and conveys pride, pride in what we do for our clients and equally important, how we do it. Our purpose, which Christian Sewing will present to you in a moment, puts our clients at the center of everything we do. This unwavering focus on our clients must be our top priority. For me, this is what our Global Hausbank is all about, and it is the basis for lasting success for you, our shareholders. I am deeply convinced of this. The bank is on the right track. I would like to use this opportunity once more to thank all our employees for their dedication and hard work every day to enable further progress for our Deutsche Bank. I also thank the entire Management Board for its successful work and in particular, Christian Sewing, for his strong leadership and unwavering commitment to the bank. And, of course, a heartfelt thank you to my colleagues in the Supervisory Board. After a number of changes over the past year, we came together quickly as a team to continue to lend constructive support to the bank on its path to success. Our CEO, Christian Sewing, will now explain to you, in greater detail, how we envisage this continued path to success. By way of conclusion, just one comment. Just as last year, I have passed over Chairmanship of the AGM to my Deputy, Norbert Winkeljohann upon the presentation of Christian Sewing. Thank you very much. Over to you, Christian Sewing.

[Interpreted] Dear shareholders, I also would like to welcome you most cordially to this year's Annual General Meeting. For me, it is also a notable one because this is the tenth time that I have attended an Annual General Meeting as a member of the Management Board of Deutsche Bank. And it is the seventh time that I've had the honor of reporting to you as CEO. I am pleased to be able to report many positive developments again this year. And to give you an outlook for the years ahead, 2023 was another very good year for Deutsche Bank. We achieved a strong increase in business in revenue growth. We made pretax profit of more than EUR 5 billion, and we, once again, accelerated our strategic development. In doing so, we laid a strong foundation for future growth. And we have laid the groundwork to increase distributions to you, ladies and gentlemen. We can be particularly proud of this accomplishment as we achieved it in a difficult environment. The geopolitical situation is volatile, characterized by wars and conflicts. The economy is also facing increasing headwinds. Protectionism and self-interest are spreading. In addition, there is a weak growth, especially here in Germany and Europe, which was exacerbated by rising interest rates in 2023. Structural problems, such as high energy prices or excessive bureaucracy and regulation, make the situation even more difficult. And all this at a time, ladies and gentlemen, when we must overcome challenges posed by technological disruptions, such as artificial intelligence and the transition to a sustainable economy. And this environment will not change fundamentally in 2024. That makes one thing essential, guidance. We want to give our clients this sense of direction. We want to be their compass and help them navigate through these difficult times, at the same time, encouraging new growth. But we can only do that if we are clear about our own identity. Only when everyone at Deutsche Bank understands who we are, where we want to go and what needs to be done, can we get the best out of ourselves. Only then can we be fully there for our clients, and only then can we grow sustainably. Over the past few years, we knew what we had to do. We first had to stabilize our bank, reposition and refocus it on our clients. We had to transform it in order to be profitable again. We've done that. We are back in growth mode, and now we are taking the next step focusing on the long term. At this point, it is important to sharpen our purpose, and that's what we've been doing over the past few months, as our Chairman of the Supervisory Board, Alexander Wynaendts, just mentioned. Sincere thanks goes to Alex at this point because he and the entire Supervisory Board supported us greatly throughout this process, the result of which is crystallized in this sentence, dedicated to our clients' lasting success and financial security at home and abroad. It emphasizes even more strongly what we stand for. And what I have underlined again and again since 2018, it must be our aspiration to be at the center of society and to put our clients at the center of everything we do. For us, it's not about maximizing short-term profits, it is about long-term trusting partnerships, in which our clients feel safe and in which we make progress together. We are convinced that this is the only way to ensure our sustainable success. This self-image must guide us every day, and it applies to all our approximately 90,000 employees worldwide. Obviously, words alone can have a little effect, which is why it is so important that our purpose is reflected in our vision, in our strategy and in our culture. And it is crucial that we embed it firmly in our day-to-day actions and processes. That also means giving back more responsibility to our business divisions. Since we have started our transformation, many decisions have been taken centrally in the past few years. Now we want to gradually return more decisions to the businesses, of course, without letting up on our controls or on risk management. Focusing on the business and on our clients in this way is one of our top priorities, and that is exactly why I also want to focus on our clients today. I would like to show you a few examples of how we already live our purpose today. This is particularly evident where we have been working for our clients for a long time, often over many generations. Take Mercedes-Benz, for example. Last year, we hosted Mercedes CEO, Ola Kallenius, and I brought him a letter of recommendation at that time, a letter of recommendation for Carl Benz from a predecessor institution of our bank, a letter written in 1899. Ladies and gentlemen, since then, our 2 companies have been working closely together. Pretty much exactly 100 years ago, we supported the merger of Daimler and Benz. And to this very day, we continue to serve the Mercedes-Benz Group as its Hausbank all over the world, with our global network and our local expertise. An internal -- international reach has been part of our DNA since we opened the first international branches in Shanghai and Yokohama in 1872. Deutsche Bank was founded to accompany German companies abroad, and that's what defines us to this day. For example, we support the Hamburg-based family-owned company, HELM AG, in its expansion, specifically in the Asia specific region. Among other things, HELM trades in chemical products, the prices of which are often very volatile. The company continuously expands its portfolio, especially regionally. That's why it needs a bank that has the flexibility to quickly adjust credit lines and apply them to different countries. That's exactly what we can do. Mercedes and HELM are just 2 examples that show what drives us, the lasting success and financial security of our clients at home and abroad. In order to live up to this aspiration, it is important that we are robust and profitable, and we succeeded at this again last year. Our clients conducted more business with us, which meant that our revenues increased by 6% to almost EUR 29 billion. At the same time, we have remained disciplined in terms of spending, with adjusted costs growing at a slower rate than inflation at 3%. And thanks to this operational strength, we were able to increase our pretax profit again. At EUR 5.7 billion, we achieved our best result in 16 years. This success is based on the 4 strong pillars of our bank, our 4 businesses, which complement each other and thus, give us stability. In the past year, the Corporate Bank and the Private Bank benefited particularly strongly from the interest rate environment and significantly increased revenues. All areas of the Corporate Bank recorded double-digit growth, while in the Private Bank, the German unit stood out, with strong revenue growth as well as high net inflows. Ladies and gentlemen, when I talk about the Private Bank of Germany, I cannot do so without mentioning the sometimes considerable delays and restrictions that some clients experienced following the move of Postbank's IT to a common platform. I can only emphasize that we fell short of the expectations of our clients here and the expectations that we have set ourselves. We are sorry for this inconvenience, and we have apologized. As announced, we managed the backlog of client-critical processes, which were also the subject of BaFin's orders by the end of March. And we continue to work on improvements. New requests from clients are generally dealt with within the expected processing times. At the same time, we know that we still have more work to do to further improve our client service. This includes, among other things, further automating processes to ensure that processing times in all areas consistently meet expectations and requirements. Coming back to our businesses. The fact that our Corporate Bank and our Private Bank delivered particularly good results in 2023 should not detract from the performance of the Investment Bank and Asset Management. Both performed well in a difficult market environment and position themselves for future growth. This is already evident in the first 3 months of the current year, especially in the investment bank, where investments in our origination and advisory business are bearing fruit. DBS -- DWS also had a very good first quarter. And thanks to continued inflows, has laid the foundation for further increases in revenues. We are very proud of what we achieved in all our 4 business areas. And we're also proud of the fact that we were able to keep our risks under control at all times in a challenging environment. Our risk management has, once again, lived up to its first-class reputation. Building on our high-quality and well-diversified loan book, we were able to keep loan losses and loan loss provisions within a very tight range. And we are well prepared if the economy remains bumpy, which we assume. In terms of costs, the past year was a turning point for us. In 2023, we invested in business, technology and controls. Added to this were restructuring and severance costs related to the strategy as well as extraordinary items, such as goodwill impairment relating to the corporate broker Numis. A large part of these costs will not recur. Finally, we were able to make great progress on capital in 2023. We had to reserve less capital for risks on our balance sheet and at the same time, created capital organically in our business operations. The bottom line is that we have strengthened our capital base and created room for maneuver, scope for further investments and above all, potential for higher distributions to you, our shareholders. I am very pleased that we can, once again, reward you more strongly for your loyalty. Last year, we increased our dividend by 50% and spent EUR 450 million on share buybacks, which was also equivalent to a 50% increase year-on-year. Today, we are proposing to increase the dividend by another 50% to EUR 0.45 per share. And we launched another share buyback program of EUR 675 million in March, and we start with that in March and half of which has already been completed. Ladies and gentlemen, we can, therefore, look back on a year in which we have taken another important step forward. And we are not the only ones in viewing it this year -- this way. Last year, 3 of the leading global rating agencies, Fitch, DBRS, Morningstar and Standard & Poor's, further upgraded our ratings. We want to continue on this successful path. And we have a clear picture in mind, a vision of what we want to achieve. As the Global Hausbank, we want to be the European champion and the first choice for our clients. To be a European champion, we need to be successful internationally and offer our clients a strong global network. Europe is and remains the central market for us. Ladies and gentlemen, Europe is our home market. And as the largest bank in Europe's leading economy, we can settle for nothing less than being the European champion. At the same time, we are convinced that Europe urgently needs a strong domestic bank, with a global focus. Europe needs an alternative to U.S. banks if it wants to reduce dependencies and attain strategic sovereignty. As a Global Hausbank, Deutsche Bank has all the prerequisites to be this European alternative. But what does being the Global Hausbank actually mean? Now let me explain this in more detail. Being a Global Hausbank means making the entire bank available to clients. We can only achieve this if our business and infrastructure units work closely together. A very good example is the cooperation with Miles & More, which makes us the exclusive banking partner of the loyalty program with the Lufthansa Miles & More credit card. This is an important success for us in the payments business and the result of intense bank-wide collaboration across the Corporate Bank, the Private Bank and our technology and infrastructure functions. Being a Global Hausbank means first class and extensive advice like in the case of Schott Pharma. In September last year, we arranged the company's IPO, which was the largest in Western Europe in 2023. Deutsche Bank shaped the company's positioning vis-a-vis competitors and presented it to investors worldwide. And this paid off. At the IPO Schott Pharma had a market capitalization of just over EUR 4 billion. Being a Global Hausbank means identifying and mitigating risks for our clients. This aspect cannot be overemphasized in uncertain times that we are experiencing. Our solutions help our clients protect themselves against uncertainty and provide them with financial security. Our clients know that they can rely on us, all over the world on a small and large scale. This applies when we help clients secure their liquidity in times of rising interest rates and volatile markets. And it equally applies when we help our private clients avoid becoming victims of fraud. Last year, we were able to do this on several occasions. Being a Global Hausbank means keeping up with the times and enabling modern technological solutions for our clients. One example is the work we do for Siemens. We are supporting the company in the introduction of a virtual account structure that will allow European -- it will allow German payment transactions to be processed with only one Central Bank account, and that simplifies matters for both Siemens and its clients. Being a Global Hausbank means accompanying clients from all over the world, wherever they go. We don't just support German companies' global ambitions, we support clients from all over the world with their international development. A good example is the start-up XTransfer from Shanghai. XTransfer offers accounts to Chinese businesses that allow them to accept payments in more than 200 countries and regions. We help XTransfer collect payments from local buyers in local currencies and then convert them into U.S. dollars or Chinese yuan, so that they can be paid out to the Chinese merchants. Being a Global Hausbank means enabling lasting client success that goes far beyond the financial. Sustainability is a strategic factor in our client relationships. And sustainability, that means environmental, social and also got good governance considerations in equal measure. More and more transactions have at least one ESG component. And more and more often, we support clients as they take major steps in their sustainable transformation. Salzgitter AG is one such example. The company has launched a project to produce low carbon steel in Germany in the future. Once production gets underway, the project has the capacity to reduce Germany's aggregate carbon emissions by 1%. We granted Salzgitter export financing worth EUR 500 million and acted as sole sustainability coordinator. These loans are in line with the EU taxonomy and the Green Loan Principles of the Loan Market Association. This is just one of many examples of the expertise we have built up in the ESG space. Over the past year alone, we have facilitated sustainable financing and ESG investments worth EUR 64 billion. Overall, and including the first quarter of 2024, we are now at a volume of more than EUR 300 billion since the beginning of 2020. At the same time, we have expanded and sharpened our own policies and commitments to credibly and resolutely accompany our clients on the path to a sustainable economy and society. After we presented our overall strategy at our second sustainability deep dive in March 2023, the publication of our first transition plan in October was another milestone. This plan describes how Deutsche Bank aims to achieve its net zero targets. Our biggest lever here is in the loans we grant to clients from carbon-intensive industries with whom we are in close dialogue. In this context, in 2023, we published net-zero trajectories for 3 more segments. This means that more than half of all emissions that we finance through corporate loans are now covered by exactly such pathways. We do all this to contribute to an environmentally sound, socially inclusive and better managed economy, a contribution that we want to have as great an impact as possible. Our actions are not just limited to Germany, they are global. [Audio Gap] also means that we play an active part in improving the communities in which we are active for our clients. We can do this through our core business or through our contribution to society. Dear shareholders, last year, we invested EUR 52.6 million in social projects either ourselves or through our foundations. Almost 4 million people have benefited from this. And there is another figure that I am proud of. Last year, more than 23,000 Deutsche Bank employees worldwide were involved in social projects and invested more than 212,000 hours in them. One focus of our commitment has been on the financial education of the next generation. And in the aftermath of Hamas attack on Israel and the worldwide increase in antisemitic incidents, we donated EUR 1 million to charitable institutions that teach tolerance and empathy to young people. At the same time, we also opposed the spread of right-wing populism. Deutsche Bank stands for diversity. We are present in 57 countries, and our employees represent more than 150 nationalities. Ladies and gentlemen, there is no place for intolerance, exclusion and hatred at Deutsche Bank. We sent this signal to the outside world, but also to our employees. It is part of our social responsibility, and that is very important to us and to me personally. Dear shareholders, I have given you a few examples of how we breathe life into our Global Hausbank strategy. They show that we have already achieved a lot, and that's reflected in our results. We are in an excellent position to be our clients' first choice for a Global Hausbank and to realize our vision of becoming a European champion. But we need to do more. Despite all the progress, we still need to improve in some areas. And we have to continue to evolve just as the environment and competition evolve. I'm not talking about fundamental changes to our setup. We have the right strategy. Our 4 business units are all leaders in their market segments. And we know what we need to take the next step and grow sustainably. Five things are crucial. First, we need to further sharpen our business model. We have been focusing on our strengths since 2019, but this must be an ongoing process. We must keep checking where we can sharpen up and make even more targeted investments in those areas where we are strongest, offer the most value to our clients and can also operate most profitably. Second, we are doing everything we can to become an even more efficient organization. The disciplined use of the available resources is the be-all and end-all. We have already achieved a lot, but we still have room for development here. With the increased expenditure in the past year, we have paved the way to significantly reduce costs from this year onwards. Technology and leaner processes will help us with this. However, we must also remain disciplined in our spending. After all, cost discipline creates the space for us to invest in future growth. Third, we must remain disciplined with capital. We can become even better in allocating our capital to the various business areas. We need clear targets of what the individual areas are supposed to achieve. And we need to control the use of capital more strictly according to whether the targets have been achieved and what the future prospects are. Fourth, we will continue to gradually strengthen our risk management. This is absolutely crucial in these times. And it's not just about protecting our clients, it's also about guaranteeing our stability. This includes further strengthening our controls in order to be prepared, for example, to resist the increasingly sophisticated methods of financial crime. But this also means that we must arm ourselves against other risks. I'm here thinking of speculative attacks, such as those carried out in March 2023. And I'm also thinking of the area of cyber crime, where fraudsters continuously try to attack banks' data networks. Strengthening our controls is of utmost importance. We have already achieved a lot here, but we also know that we need to further improve. We are working on just that. To this end, we are in close dialogue with our regulators and will continue to invest in controls and processes until we meet all expectations here. We owe that to our clients, and we owe it to you, our shareholders. Because only when we have our controls in order, can we be successful in the long term. Fifth, a strong corporate culture is critical to execute our vision and live our purpose. We want to empower everyone in the bank to excel together every day. To this end, we strive for a corporate culture in which our employees act responsibly, think commercially, take initiative and work collaboratively. We can strengthen this culture with systems, structures, policies and processes. But what matters is how we behave. We want to empower our employees to be risk-aware and confident at the same time, to ask questions, to innovate and to look for solutions that create a first-class client experience. In some aspects, we are not yet there. And it is not something that will happen overnight anyway. But I'm convinced that we will make progress on this and the other points this year. The greater these advances, the better we can be at being there for our clients, and the sooner our vision of becoming the European champion will be within reach. Ladies and gentlemen, the next milestone on our way to our vision is at the end of 2025. We have set ourselves specific financial targets for this time. And following last year's good results, we made them even more ambitious at the beginning of February. These targets remain unchanged, and the recent development in the Postbank litigation changes nothing, either. I want to stress this emphatically as we have had this question put to us several times following the hearing and the proceedings on April 26. After the higher regional court indicated that it could rule in favor of the plaintiffs. We set aside a provision of EUR 1.3 billion. We are obliged to do so. We are still of the opinion that Deutsche Bank had neither taken control of Postbank before the purchase bank had come into effect, nor before the purchase agreement had been approved by the Federal Supervisory Authority, BaFin. And yes, I'm also concerned that ruling in favor of the plaintiffs would set a precedent that would have far reaching negative consequences for German financial markets, especially as a location for M&A. Takeovers of listed companies would be subject to considerable legal uncertainties in the future. Of course, the provision for the Postbank case will negatively impact our results in the current year. But ladies and gentlemen, it doesn't change our strategy. And as I already said, we continue to be confident that we are on track to achieve our financial targets for 2025. The strong results in the first quarter confirm our optimism. We increased our profit by 10% year-on-year. Despite the expected normalization of the interest rate environment, we increased revenues slightly to EUR 7.8 billion. And we reduced adjusted costs by 6% year-on-year to EUR 5 billion. In other words, we achieved our quarterly cost target. We are very pleased with these figures. They are further proof of our continued progress. The share price tells us this, too. Since the beginning of the year, it has risen by roughly 30%. And since our Annual General Meeting last year, it is up by almost 70%. But we want to make even more progress. We want to accelerate our growth trajectory, and this is also reflected in our financial targets. First of all, this applies to the earnings outlook. Originally, we wanted to achieve annual average revenue growth of 3.5% to 4.5% for the years 2021 to '25. Having consistently been higher over the past 3 years, we have also raised this target to 5.5% to 6.5% per year. By the end of 2025, this would bring us to a revenue level of around EUR 32 billion. In terms of costs, our aim is to achieve a level that protects us against negative external influences in an uncertain environment, and we see this level at around EUR 20 billion per year, and we want to reach it in 2025. We also continue to aim for a cost income ratio below 62.5% by the end of 2025. If we deliver on revenues and costs, we should also achieve our target for the return on equity. For the end of 2025, we have set ourselves a target return on tangible equity of more than 10%, and we continue to aim for a CET ratio of around 13%. All of this forms the basis for us to keep the promise that we made to you, our shareholders. We want to gradually increase capital distributions, and we have set ourselves the goal of increasing them by 50% per year. With our dividend proposal and the share buyback that has already been launched, we remain true to this commitment. With these 2 steps, we want to return EUR 1.6 billion of capital to you, the shareholders. Since 2022, this would amount to a total of EUR 3.3 billion. And ladies and gentlemen, we remain confident that for the years 2021 to 2025, we will be able to distribute more than the EUR 8 billion that we had initially aimed for as our target. Continuing to increase our payouts to you remains a top priority for us. Dear shareholders, it was important for me to explain to you today what we stand for as a bank. To talk about our client focus and our dedication to our clients' lasting success and financial security at home and abroad. But what do our customers say about us? We asked a couple of them, and we recorded their answers in this video. [Presentation]

Ladies and gentlemen, these are honest responses of clients. I think you were able to see that for yourself. They showed the great respect and appreciation for our colleagues who serve these clients, and that's something that we are very happy about. And I'm even happier to know that these colleagues of ours represent our total of 90,000 people working in our bank, achieving great things every day. Deutsche Bank can be proud to have these people on board at home and abroad. I'm enormously proud of all of you, dear colleagues, and I am grateful, grateful for your excellent work and continued commitment, grateful for your dedication to our clients, your engagement for social courses and your care for each other and grateful for your accomplishments that make the success of our bank possible in the first place. Very special thanks also to my team on the Management Board, for the spirit of trust in which we work and for their commitment to the bank's continued progress. And I would also like to thank our Supervisory Board for our constructive collaboration. Together, we have already achieved a lot. And there is still a lot we want to achieve together. We have a clear idea of who we are. We know what we want to achieve, and we know what it takes to get there. I'm very much looking forward to the years to come. Thank you very much.

[Interpreted] Well, thank you very much, Christian Sewing, our CEO, for his very clear explanation. Dear shareholders, Christian Sewing gave -- shared his very clear idea of how the Management Board sees the bank and on which path it wants to follow. And the Supervisory Board will continue to support and constructively accompany the Management Board on this journey. Ladies and gentlemen, before we enter into the agenda, it's been well-established tradition at our AGMs that we commemorate the employees and pensioners who have passed. I would just like to ask everyone present to raise from their seats. In the past business year, 80 of our active employees and 660 of our pensioners passed away. Our thoughts are with them, as they are with the victims of war and armed conflict all over the world. Ladies and gentlemen, thank you for raising to commemorate the deceased. We now turn to the agenda that comprises 9 items. Item #1, is the annual financial statement of Deutsche Bank for fiscal 2023. This includes, amongst other things, the established annual financial statements and the management report for Deutsche Bank AG, which is established according to a German Commercial Code. It also includes approved consolidated financial statements and management board according to IFRS as well as report of Supervisory Board. These documents have been made available on our website since March. The annual financial statements under management report as well as the approved consolidated financial statements and consolidated management report have been audited by Ernst & Young GmbH Wirtschaftsprüfungsgesellschaft. Neither the audit through the auditor, nor the review by the Supervisory Board have given rise to any objections. The auditor thus issued an unqualified auditor's opinion. Supervisory Board has approved the annual financial statements and the consolidated financial statement at its meeting on March 13, 2024. The annual financial statement has thus been established according to Section 172 of German Stock Corporation Act. Ladies and gentlemen, when it comes to next items of the agenda, they are available in full text on our AGM website. These items are appropriation of distributable profit for fiscal 2023. The Management Board and the Supervisory Board proposed to pay out a dividend of EUR 0.45 per share from the distributable profit. The updated noted for a revolution considering own shares as of today can also be found and retrieved on the Internet page of the bank. Item #3 and 4 is ratification of the acts of the Management Board and the Supervisory Board; Item #5, selection of the auditor and the election of the auditor of the sustainability report. We also suggest to entrust you -- we thus suggest to again elect Ernst & Young GmbH Wirtschaftsprüfungsgesellschaft. We also suggest to entrust them with the audit of the sustainability report. It will most likely become necessary for 2024. Item #6 is the resolution on the approval of the compensation report for fiscal 2023. Item #7 is about the changed compensation system for Management Board members, and we are asking you for approval of this change compensation system. And items #8 and 9 are about approving annually recurring resolutions for the acquisition of own shares and the framework of share buyback programs as well as the use of derivatives for the flexible implementation of these programs. Ladies and gentlemen, finally, let me point out that counterproposals and an election proposal are published -- were published on our website in keeping with the legal requirements according to Sections 126 and 127 German Stock Corporation Law. Precondition for this was that these proposals and motions get to us before the end of the 15th day before today's AGM and that they required publication. We also published statements from shareholders that were not connected to counterproposals. Now ladies and gentlemen, this concludes my explanations on the agenda. Let me now announce the first attendance of the share capital of EUR 5,106,436,078.08 subdivided into [ 1,000,971,535 ] non-par value shares. In today's AGM, 837,505,403 shares with the same number of votes are represented, which is 41.96% of the share capital. Part is for 129,819,166 shares. The possibility of casting an absentee ballot was used. If you add those votes, we have an attendance rate of 48.47% of the share capital. The attendance list has already been uploaded to the shareholders' portal and is there available for the shareholder and shareholder representatives online so you can inspect it there. In the shareholder portal, the attendance list will be updated during the course of the AGM. Another formal update of the attendance will only be given in connection with the voting process. Well, ladies and gentlemen, as in the last few years, Deutsche Bank has been paying special attention to safeguarding shareholders rights and enabling interaction within participation of the shareholders when planning its AGM. Now this year, it's exactly that intention that made us provide shareholders the possibility of sending in questions in advance, which would then answered by the bank by the day before yesterday and then published on its website. Here, you will find more than about 290 questions and answers, which in part, consists of explanations to summarize answers providing a broader context. This format on the one hand, gives the bank the possibility to deal with the questions raised in a more intensive fashion. On the other hand, it makes space for more focused exchange at today's AGM. Now in order to give appropriate room today to matters -- essential matters were addressed by various shareholders before the AGM, the Management Board will address some of these matters and provide explanations that were also included in the answers provided on the website during the course of this AGM. Ladies and gentlemen, it's of utmost importance that we have live exchange on all statements, where you basically enjoy all the rights as in-person meeting. As the meeting Chairman, I determined, in accordance with Section 131 Paragraph 1 of the Stock -- 1F of the Stock Corporation Law, the questions may only be asked in the context of video statements, thesis when making use of the right to speak. Let me also point out that today, only add on questions within the meaning of Article 131, Paragraph 1D and questions on new matters within the meaning of Section 131 Paragraph 1E of the Stock Corporation law will be answered. Now as communicated in the invitation, you can register in our password-protect shareholder portal as of 9:30 today. If you want to take the floor via the button [indiscernible]. We've already received some requests for the floor. But again, may I ask you at this juncture again to register early so that we can plan ahead properly. In this context, ladies and gentlemen, I'd also like to ask you to identify if you wish to comment on particular focus areas or submit a motion so that we can take this into consideration when determining the sequence of speakers. After registering a request for the floor, you will see this in what is called [indiscernible] my statements. Status of your request can be inferred from the color coding. Directly after registration, the caller will be orange. This is the signal that your -- that we received your request and are working at it. Now as we did last year, we will have blocks of speakers and the speakers of each block will be contacted for technical check before the start of every round of speakers. Ladies and gentlemen, please be aware that depending on the number of speakers and the allocation to a block, we might only be contacting you later in the meeting. Now at the appropriate time, we will then invite you to the waiting room via pop-up window occurring on the shareholder portal here, an operator will get in touch with you to check the technical functionality of your video communication. Let me point out that all the functions of the portal will be available to you while you are in the waiting room. Ladies and gentlemen, I would like in the following give you a report regarding the exclusion of subscription rights. No, ladies and gentlemen, for the first round speakers, we will be contacting the speakers for the first round straight away. The following people Andreas Thomae, Alexandra Annecke, Klaus Nieding, and Markus Kienle. Please get ready for the technical check that will start in a moment. This we will most likely not require a break anymore before every round of speakers. Our technicians will now get in contact with the named shareholders and shareholder representatives to link them up and check functionality. Ladies and gentlemen, please be ready if you're registered to take the floor and your name is called. And please also let us know if you decide against making an envisaged contribution. You can then either withdraw your request to speak directly in the shareholders' portal, which will simplify operations or you can do so when speaking with the operator later. Now based on the experience of this year's AGM season so far, I'm cautiously optimistic that we will not need a strict limitation of speak and time. However, I have to retain the right to do so. In respective of that, I would already like to ask all speakers to limit their statement to 10 minutes. So that speakers coming off of them can take the floor within an appropriate time as well. Now to provide the same conditions for everyone, the speaker and myself only, we'll see a clock to provide a point of orientation. After 9 minutes have elapsed the green display will change to Amber, signaling the request to please make time for the next speakers. After 10 minutes have elapsed the display color will change to red. Now we will, of course, be free to register again for making another statement. Now further before we enter into the discussion, I would like to ask James von Moltke and give him the opportunity to explain to how the Management Board used the authorization of capital measures, excluding subscription rights, during the year under review. James, the floor is all yours.

Thank you very much, Norbert. Ladies and gentlemen, I'd like to briefly provide you with some explanations regarding subscription right exclusions in connection with the transfer of treasury shares to employees and the acquisition of Deutsche Bank shares. Since the last Annual General Meeting in 2023, there has been no issuance of shares or additional Tier 1 capital instruments. Therefore -- and so far, there was also no exclusion of subscription rights required. Since the AGM in 2023, a total of 100.5 million shares, which is approximately 5.6% of the current nominal share capital were repurchased under the authorization to purchase treasury shares in accordance with Section 71 Paragraph 1 Number 8 Stock Corporation Act. Thereof 71.1 million shares have been repurchased for redemption. The remaining 40.3 million shares were repurchased for past and future compensation purposes, in particular, from share-based variable compensation programs as stipulated by the German regulation and compensation in the banking industry, also called Institute for [indiscernible]. Since the last Annual General Meeting, 39.6 million Deutsche Bank shares, which have previously been acquired under the current or previous authorization were transferred to employees on the compensation programs or employee share programs with the exclusion of subscription rights. Ladies and gentlemen, thank you for your attention.

Thank you very much, James. Ladies and gentlemen, I see the first speakers are now waiting to take the floor. Let me briefly remind you again to please stick to your speaking time of 10 minutes. Please don't speak any longer than that. The first speaker is Mr. Andreas Thomae. Mr. Thomae, and I'd also like Mr. Klaus Nieding and Mr. Markus Kienle to get ready. Mr. Thomae, the floor is all yours.

Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, dear members of the Management Board, dear shareholders. My name is Andreas Thomae. I'm representing data investment, which is the biggest -- which is the representative of Deutsche Bank's. Mr. Sewing, you've been trying to win back trust of investors and customers making many efforts. You promised thinking cost increasing share price, et cetera, et cetera. On the 25th of 40s, you formally announced the best quarterly result since 2013. And at just 1 day later, it was a shock. It was a legal dispute with Postbank shareholders, which got 15 years back. You have to set up a provision of EUR 1.3 million. This is basically in line. This is basically equivalent to the entire profit made in the first quarter. This was shareholders with funders truck. So trust was destroyed again and you cannot afford because we have not really seen an upward trajectory over the past few years. We were basically marking time, although revenues anguished by 6%. Stable businesses profited and benefited from an increase in interest rates, but the profits made there were actually eaten up by a decrease in investment banking. Also, the costs were higher than anticipated. Here, you have to do a lot of rework. Deutsche Bank share in the last year did not stand in comparison with the European banking index. This year, it's going well. However, the book value is still fairly low. So price to book, but the quality of profits increased. The stable business now make a bigger contribution to the profit, the loan loss provisions is solid. And there was just a slight increase of the fall rate. ROTE was 7.4%, but affected by positive tax effect, it was only 5.6%. Mr. Sewing and Mr. Von Moltke, we would like to know from you how do you we want to keep costs at EUR 20 billion and at the same time, ramp up revenues to more than EUR 32 billion has provided for in the strategy program, strategy project. I mean this is a precondition to getting to an ROTE of above 10%. This is a very ambitious program. Implementation of that is your core task because there's only then that the share can go out of the trap of under evaluation. So what are the next steps? What are your plans? Increased interest rates and interest rate income is at a level that it will most probably not increase in 2025. So you are banking on an increase in provisions and commissions stable businesses, the corporate bank, the private bank and asset management are to increased their revenues considerably in order to make the bank more stable and more diversified. And this is absolutely necessary for you to achieve your targets. Now let's have a detailed look into the various businesses. The Investment Bank last year lost revenue, but when it comes to fixed income business, you're well positioned, you want market share. And this year, you were also to benefit from the higher issuing rate of bonds. What is the role of the Numis acquisition in that case? Where do you want to grow the strategic advisory, asset management, thanks to [indiscernible] DWS in 2023 and less. And for 2024, they assume that also profits will stagnate. So growth is to be generated by alternative investments, multi-asset and index products primarily. Here, I would like to know, when it comes to asset management, you want to grow organically, continue to grow organically? Or might you be looking at investments? The KGaA structure has been a problem for quite some time. This leads to the fact that the share price is marked down. So please end this nonsense. When it comes to the corporate bank, you want to provide a more comprehensive offer to your clients when it comes to payments you want to be more successful also when it comes to custodianship for digital assets. What about e-commerce? How far have you advance that? What is the potential for the loan growth? What about the situation in the United States as regards to commercial real estate? And what are the risks here when it comes to the private bank last year, it was on fire. I mean we had customer complaints in the wake of the Postbank integration. You did only destroy money here, but also reputation. Now you say that you done with that. Is that really the case? Are there any follow-up costs from the integration with Postbank. And what about existing customer complaints. And we want to get back to the provisions for the Postbank case. I mean just think about this, EUR 1.3 billion, out of think air. How can you be so wrong in your assessment of things? Are you trying to come up with a settlement? Or are you waiting for the core judgment and then appeal? What will be the effect on the distributions for our shareholders for 2024. Ladies and gentlemen, Wealth management is to make a bigger contribution in Germany and abroad. Now what about the wealth management and the extension of Private Banking and Wealth Management? What are the revenues that you assume will come in as a result of the cooperation with [indiscernible]? How would you position the private bank in the market in the future? Now let's have a look at the core topic of Deutsche Bank. This is costs. Costs half absolutely have to be brought down to the EUR 20 billion up until 2025. The track record of Deutsche Bank over the past 2 years is not good enough. And the market is skeptical here, and rightly so. Mr. Von Moltke, could you please explain to us where the savings are to come from and which benefit can be read from the cost-reduction program? And does it also take the inflation in the next 2 years into consideration? Over the past few years, you made strong investments into IT infrastructure and slimming down of your processes. Mr. [indiscernible], how much have you advanced? And when it comes to the add-on cost for regulatory IT and infrastructure costs, have they peaked? After the IT integration of Postbank, has the legacy IT been switched off completely. And can you now pull back on the entire Deutsche Bank product portfolio. How much do you bank on AI? And how is the partnership with NVIDIA doing in this context? What does it provide for. Time and cyber security is of utmost important for Deutsche Bank. Hacking attacks are ever increasing. How well can you protect yourself against this? And what are the dangers that will arise in context with AI. Ladies and gentlemen, Deutsche Bank wants to increase its distribution this year, 50% of the profit after 30% last year. So you made up space for that, you create the space for that and you create additional space by selling assets. How much are share buyback taken into consideration when it comes to your distribution, apart from cash. Mr. Von Moltke, how much excess capital do you have for share buybacks? Now environment is -- Deutsche Bank has made additional progress. The adjusted compensation system was de-complexified so to speak, complexity was reduced. Also the target of shares also was improved. And also for first time, the climate targets for the sectors was included which we think it's a good thing. Also, Deutsche Bank and its transition plan up until 2030, created transparency. When it comes to Scope 1, 2, 3, CO2 emissions and the decarbonization path were made more concrete. When it comes to biodiversity, you created a cooperation with Aura for the oceans and you're also a member of the task force to nature financial disclosure initiatives. Now when it comes to sustainable business volumes, why where you -- are you lacking behind your plan? When it comes to variable pay, it is obvious, it's very striking that there were reductions when it comes to the brokers made in any money laundering and monitoring. How much did you make progress when it comes to the regulatory requirements? When it comes to the climate stress test of ECB, are you already fulfilling all the requirements? It is also striking that when it comes to the people survey, there was a decrease, you fell back. What is the reason for this? Because you need your people in order to make your targets. In 2022, you established a future council that is to provide advice to the bank when it comes to geopolitical matters and others. How often did that council made in 2023 and what was the advice that you got?

Ladies and gentlemen, let's now have a look at our voting behavior. We will be voting in favor of all proposals of the administration. However, we are going to give you a promise. If you do not achieve the targets in 2025, we will not ratify the acts of the management of the Management Board. I mean, unlike of course, this is due to economic matters that out of your control. Now we wish a lot of success and energy to all members of the Supervisory Board and all employees of Deutsche Bank. Thank you very much.

Thank you Mr. Thomae. Thank you for your contribution and your questions. Next, we will hear Ms. Annecke from Union Investment. And after her, Mr. Nieding and Mr. Kienle. Ms. Annecke, you've got the floor over to you.

Thank you very much. Members of the Board, members of the Supervisory Board, shareholders. I'm Alexandra Annecke, I'm a fund manager at Union Investment. As a fund company of the [indiscernible], we are a shareholder of Deutsche Bank, and we represent the members with the interest of our 5.8 million shareholders. Ladies and gentlemen, in the past 12 months, the Deutsche Bank share had a very gratifying development of plus 70% for its shareholders. This is better than the European average in the banking sector at 46% and better than the [ tax ], which managed to achieve a performance of 19%. Last year, Deutsche Bank continued to cut its costs and launched further measures for the more efficient use of its equity capital. And these efforts are bearing fruit, growing dividends and share buybacks are other measures helping the Deutsche Bank to catch up with its European peers. The bank is perceived as more profitable, more robust, more resilient and more trustworthy in the capital markets. And this has led to a reevaluation. The PE ratio has improved from 0.3% to 0.5% in the last few months, a significant improvement. However, it is so far below other banks in the banking sector with a PE of 1%, despite all that has been achieved, a lot remains to be done. Mr. Sewing. You mentioned it in your speech. The processes are not all where they should be, problems in the IT migration of Postbank more embarrassing a bank must not leave its clients stand in the rain, which is what's happened in the Postbank case. Ladies and gentlemen, Deutsche Bank has proven to be an active consolidated time and, the problems in the IT migration of Postbank raised out as to what the Deutsche Bank is able to use these key skills and abilities. The Postbank case and the special BaFin monitor are certainly not once it speak in favor of Deutsche Bank Mr. Sewing, Numis is not going to be a success in itself. The integration will entail risks because the clients would no longer be dealing with the corporate broker, but it was a big bank. And the same thing applies to the employees. It's a tighter walk in between leveraging synergies and retaining the value of the assets. Ladies and gentlemen, as a long-term investor, we focused in particular on the economic, social and governance-related criteria in short ESG criteria. We welcome Deutsche Bank's climate targets and implementation of these commitments. In this respect, we are convinced that in the next few years, Deutsche Bank will make further efforts in terms of green transformation. We'll have to and will do so. We call them to be more ambitious in terms of supporting green businesses. And we hope there will be fewer loopholes in financing energy such as fracking, which are not conducive to the environment. Let us turn to the agenda, ladies and gentlemen, Today, we will not approve -- rectify the active management of the Supervisory Board. We believe that both bodies are responsible for the virtual format, which denies shareholders the right to ask questions, this reduces the value of an AGM, and this makes it impossible for shareholders to voice their views. We have told Deutsche Bank time again in the run-up to the AGM. Deutsche Bank now is the only company in [ tax ] forces its employee -- its shareholders to submit questions in advance. This prevents a lively debate. Will be consider to be essential for the Board and the Supervisory Board to be able to personally comment on the questions submitted by shareholders. It is not a substitute in the general debate, you simply refer to the document that's been written in advance. We also will vote against the remuneration report for 2023 because in terms of share-based payment in the introduction of the compensations to systems still valid was not sufficiently disclosed. This is to do with share-based compensation. These virtual phantom shares grants an equivalent. And this should actually be made transparent when a compensation system is put up for the vote because this is quite rare in Germany. Unlike the U.S. The new compensation system, however, will be approved by us because it contains more ambitious targets for the Board and therefore, is more strongly aligned with shareholder interests. The long-term targets are partly driven by the PE ratio and return on tangible equity. The bank aims to achieve a return on equity of more than 10% in its business plan for 2025. In order to fully achieve its targets in the form of variable compensation in 2026, 11% will be required to achieve the full targets. We will also approve the other agenda items here today. Mr. Sewing, the 5 levers you were mentioning in your speech today are indicators of an institute that is well managed. This is the only way to bring Deutsche Bank forward again. And this is the only way to restore trust in the capital markets. It's not going to be a sprint, it's going to be a marathon. We thank the Board, the Supervisory Board and all employees for their hard work and commitment, and we wish you all the best, a lot of perseverance, stamina and success. Thank you very much for your attention.

Thank you, Ms. Annecke from Union Investments. Next, Klaus Nieding from DSW, German Security Investors Protection Association. Mr. Nieding, the floor is all yours.

Chairman, ladies and gentlemen, I'm Klaus Nieding. I'm a lawyer in Frankfurt, and I'm speaking to you in my function as Vice President of DSW, Germany's largest and leading shareholder association. Mr. Sewing, first of all, we owe you and your colleagues on the Board and on the Supervisory Board, but of course, also all employees of Deutsche Bank, our thanks and our recognition for the positive results which once again proved to be very strong. As announced, you would have thought in 2019, when you started, Mr. Sewing as CEO, you had announced this and you have achieved what you had announced. Now it is becoming very clear that it made sense not to close down the investment bank altogether. Unlike what some of the wise men predicted at the time being, you have managed to get a bit of both worlds and used the best of both worlds. A decline in revenues of 18% in investment banking and asset management was offset by a plus of 27% in the corporate bank and the private bank, so this more than offset the loss. Unfortunately, we cannot tell and show you personally how much we are satisfied with what you have achieved. Once again, you are using a virtual format shying away from contact with us. This is a format for covets, and you are not ready to stand up to shareholders in an in-person meeting as a token of appreciation to your shareholders where you're also ready to stand up and face up to any challenges by shareholders. And once again, some time ago before the COVID pandemic, you were the benchmark in Germany. But in the meantime, this is no longer the case in particular. So with regard to pre-submitted questions. I can't accept a situation where you have to submit our questions 5 days in advance and don't have any chance of spontaneous reactions. It is quite indicative that you seem to be showing clearly what your preferred format is because you had 2 in-person supervisory board meetings and all the other meetings were held in a hybrid format where you had an in-person meeting, plus virtual meetings. You did not have one single Supervisory Board meeting, which was entirely held in a virtual format. So I'm calling upon you, please return to an in-person format, which is what many other [ tax ] companies have started to do. We also are negative when it comes to Item 5 of the agenda, election of the auditors. We do not understand why you should be electing EY, which were involved in the Wirecard cases, as long as EY are not actively contributing to sorting out and contributing to the damages caused by Wirecard for DSW are not prepared to accept the election of EY as auditors. We will therefore vote no with regards to item 5 on your agenda. Regarding the numbers presented, we've got the following questions. In the past 2 years, our bank benefited strongly from the rise in interest by the ECB. Now you've got to prove that even when the ECB's lowering rates, you will still be profitable. The market environment is becoming more difficult without the interest rate doping Deutsche Bank saw a decline of 5% in the Corporate Bank in the first 3 months of 2024, and you were happy to compensate or overcompensate this in other areas. The planned increase in commission income will be more than difficult, in particular in asset management. There is a strong competitive pressure in general for 2024, at least 1 or maybe 2 downward interest movements by the ECB expected? Do you share that expectation? What will this mean for you? And the question is, are we well prepared for that type of scenario will the bank be able if interest rates were to be lowered again to still earn money. You have said more than -- you are aiming for more than 10% in terms of equity ratio, CET1 ratio. However, the numbers you've presented do not confirm that our Equity ratio was 9.4% in 2022 and has fallen to 7.4% in the reporting period. And the 9.4% in the previous year were only achieved thanks to a tax credit which did not repeat in 2023. So the question is, how are you going to achieve the more than 10% by 2025 in a bit commerce? This is what your target says? But even if interest rates were to remain high, you would not be able to achieve that other than through cost cuts. The cost income ratio incidentally is less than 50% in some of the peers, in some instances, even less than 40%. Against that backdrop, please comment your current cost income ratio. We've seen an increase of EUR 1.3 billion in operating costs and nonoperating costs rose by more than EUR 500,000 actually. So we are far away from the cost/income ratio of 62.5% announced for 2025. A lot remains to be done. And even this 62.5% does not seem to be very ambitious in an international comparison comments but, for example, achieved 61% in 2023. In this context, one of the biggest cost factors are Personnel costs, as always, will be -- this puts the comparison with Commerzbank in relative terms because they don't have started strong investment businesses. We've seen an increase of more than 5,000 jobs. How are you going to ensure that we will still be attractive for new challenge in the future in the light of a lack of highly professional staff in Germany? Or do you think this is not going to happen unlike in other parts of the German economy. And please tell us how many employees are expected to retire in the next 10 years? How are you going to compensate for the retirees? A large number of branches have been closed down. Savings banks are doing quite the opposite. They are planning to retain their branches and even open up new branches. According to current media news, this seems to be going down well with clients and a negative example is Postbank, very often mentioned in this context because it is set by the media that people would want to have a person to talk to and to provide them with advice. So are we on the wrong track, in particular, Postbank would be well advised in particular, to return to personal inter-human advice because IT, as we all know, is one of the biggest construction sites in Postbank. So please tell us more about the state of play in terms of Postbank migration, any good news there and Mr. Sewing to put it very bluntly, reliability is the biggest asset in banking. I don't have to tell you. You and your colleagues therefore, have paid their service, have done a very bad service to the bank with this Postbank migration. The special monetary firm BaFin was extended until 30th of October of this year after insufficient transaction monitoring took place and the Fed in the U.S. imposed a fine of USD 183 million against Deutsche Bank in the U.S., insufficient anti-money laundering activities were complained about. So the bank still does not seem to have a static system of transaction monitoring. What progress has been achieved? And what progress has been achieved in terms of risk analysis? And this would then enable you not to repeat what happened with regard to, for example, Danske Bank. The bank has to tell us more about the timing in this regard. Have you already set aside any provisions? Next, CumEx here in this context, I'd like to know whether we have submitted any data to BaFin for 2017, 2020 and 2022. If so, what are the expected tax payments due? What is the probability of us having to retroactively pay any taxes? If so, do we have to set up any provisions. Next, Epstein. There's been a settlement. Deutsche Bank has paid EUR 75 million in this context. Does this cover all cases of litigation in this context. Next, Russia. Here, I'd like to know what the current set of play is? You are saying that you don't onboard any new clients in Russia. You're reducing activities in Russia, when exactly are you going to close down Russia entirely? Is there any risk of us violating any sanctions? Are there any processes to prevent sanctions violations. What is our exposure in connection with the existing Russia business? By way of conclusion, once again, thank you to all employees including the Board and the Supervisory Board, we wish you all the best for the new financial year. We hope you will be able to achieve positive results once again. Thank you very much for your attention. And I think I've managed to stick to the time line. Thank you.

Yes, thank you, Mr. Nieding. Yes, that's exactly what's happened. You've stuck to the time line. Thank you for your contribution. The next speaker will be Markus Kienle from SDK.

Thank you very much. Mr. Wynaendts and Mr. Sewing, members of the Management. Dear shareholders. My name is Markus Kienle. I'm a lawyer in Frankfurt and also a member on the Board of our Shareholders' Association. Mr. Sewing did you deliver? Of course, you did. In the past fiscal year, you and your colleagues, however, showed somewhat a mixed picture, which also showed a return on tangible equity of less than 8%, which means that the target you had communicated in 2022 was missed in '23. And here, of course, it does not help if -- in answering my respective question you just answered that you had not announced any specific [ ROTE ] target for 2023, well, do you think that the shareholders are dumb and stupid? Now as you target for ROTE in 2022 must at least be the minimum for the subsequent years. And again, the numbers that you achieved was only due to a EUR 1 billion positive tax effect. Now you will certainly understand that here we have to be skeptical about your ability to implement your strategy. If in a fiscal year where throughout the year, you had the tailwind from the interest rate turnaround, you did not even achieve your ROTE target, which in the previous year, where you didn't have the positive interest rate effect. When you had already exceeded that target ROTE, although thanks to a positive tax effect. But I will come back to these figures again later. Now first of all, I would like to thank all of the employees for the great achievement in the past fiscal year, and we kindly ask them to pass on this gratitude of the shareholders to the workforce. Now it's not this mixed overall picture, which why we do not want to approve your acts on the Board of Management. The virtual format of the AGM is the reason for our denial of the approval of the acts of management. Last year, we already pointed out very clearly that we accept the virtual format only if it is absolutely inevitable due to the circumstances. I do not, once again, want to counter the arguments in favor of a virtual AGM because I did so last year. However, your reasoning, namely the virtual AGM, has proven its worth, is not supported by your own experience. Now my respective question was answered by you, let me saying that last year, only 2 shareholders last year used their right to ask questions. Now that's not really a success not listed. Back to the figures. Now the interest-based revenues were increased by almost 82% year-on-year. But nothing really of this increase reached the profits, and this in spite of a positive tax effect of EUR 1 billion. Now that overall picture is becoming even more worrying if the noninterest revenues increased by 13%. So the interest rate profit slightly decreased, which means overall revenues increased by only 6%. Now by what amount did the tax to be paid to change in the year 2023? Now the Corporate Bank developed positively year-on-year. Not only did it see a revenue increase, but also an of ROTE more than 6%, which was higher than cost of capital. Asset management did not as good as last year, but it still earned its cost of capital. Now quite in contrast, the situation in the investment bank. In addition to fluctuating revenues in the years '21 to '23, this segment never earned its cost of capital, not even in 2022, the personnel costs rather increased every year. And the profit after tax of EUR 8 billion as of full consolidation resulted in a very high multiple that you paid for the acquisition of Numis. Now will Numis, by itself, cover the cost of capital in the investment bank? Now is the basis for the cost of capital to be earned by Numis are the historical cost or historical value or the written off goodwill. Now regarding the investment bank, you said that on a comparable basis, to your competitors, you are satisfied with your personnel costs and then you also invested in hiring additional managers. However, since 2021, the cost income ratio of the investment bank has deteriorated continuously. Now what do you think is a comparable basis to your peers? How did you identify them as of when will the investments in executives payoff to what extent? Now at least you said that the figures for the first quarter of this year in the Investment Bank looked good. And at least on a quarterly basis, the investment bank earned more than its cost of capital. That is gratifying, the private bank, of course, had a lot of bad fortune. However, the problems in the segment are homemade. In spite of increasing revenue since 2021, this increase did not translate into increasing profits because there was always one special items, be it the problems with the Postbank integration, be it be the contracts of the past. Now regarding the takeover of Postbank hitting you back again. Although no ruling has been published yet, it seems that the legal development of this battle seem so threatening that Deutsche Bank now felt obliged to recognize provisions of EUR 1.3 billion. Now although I do hope that setup and takeover of Postbank turns out not to have been fraud, I cannot accept your denial to let us know who the legal advisers were and whether you are still in a possible to take recourse to such lawyers. And so I cannot understand why you write this information so confidential, especially when I'm asking about potential damage claim. So once again, let me once again ask you, do you still have the possibility to file claims against such legal advisers? And have you made sure that they cannot be subject to termination? We are going to act as follows regarding the ratification of the active management of the supervisory board. Now Ms. [indiscernible] did not participate in any meeting of the TIC meeting, and we would like to point out that the Supervisory Board is not something like a waiting room at a train station where you can come and go and leave as you just like. This also applies to the employee representatives. If they do not want to participate in the meetings of the Supervisory Board, they should not become a member. And participating in Supervisory Board members is not subject to the freewill of the Supervisory Board members. The only thing they can really decide on themselves is whether they accept the election to Supervisory Board or not. All the rest is mandatory. It is not acceptable that in the Supervisory Board report, Mr. Wynaendts, you do not disclose why Ms. Laumen did not participate in any of the meetings and why she left again, the Supervisory Board so quickly. Mr. Wynaendts you received EUR 900,000 of compensation in the year 2023 for your work as a Chairman, but you do not provide information in that regard. I leave it up to the management to provide more details despite then change also our voting behavior. The compensation system, we especially praised the reduction of the complexity regarding the number of details and the future-oriented compensation identification base. However, the increase of the variable compensation to 40% in the short term is rejected. We only accept a 30% share for the short-term bonus. We also are critical in regarding the total shareholder component and its design due to the slow progress in the compliance and anti-money laundering prevention matters and also due to the fact that BaFin still has special auditors at Deutsche Bank. For that purpose, Mr. Wynaendts and Mr. [indiscernible], the compensation model should establish a basic hurdle for the earning of a variable compensation, which means that variable compensation is only paid for and in the year in which the BaFin auditors have left Deutsche Bank again because we don't want to prevent these BaFin representatives to view Deutsche Bank as their new home office. Now how many enforcement actions were still open in late 2023? You refused to answer this question directly. So I, once again, go back to your statement saying that in late 2023, about 150 such enforcement actions were still pending. Now this 150 enforcement actions are these all really so-called enforcement actions? Or the supervisory actions the same as enforceable actions? And how do you arrive at this number? Your proposal on the share buyback of own shares will not be approved by us as long as we do not reobtain an appropriate dividend, which should be in the range of 40% to 60%. That's why we reject such a share buyback unless you just withdraw them and redeem them to reduce the capital base, which would then increase the return on equity. Now one basic shortcoming is the ongoing appointment of EY as the auditor in spite of all of the difficulties and taking into account the lack of and the problem of the cooling of period, we still expect you not to fully utilize the 10-year period for the appointment of EY. Mr. Sewing, yes, you and your team have achieved quite a lot and taken the bank back into the profit zone. But the progress is not large and not quick enough. Whether the turnaround really has been achieved can be told only when you earn your cost of capital. But again, on an adjusted basis, we wish you and your team all the best and all a lot of courage because you need to be courageous in order to be successful. And be also courageous in referring to an in-person AGM again. And with that, I'd like to thank you for your kind attention.

Well, thank you very much, [ Mr. Kini ] for your contribution and for your questions. And before we now turn the floor over to the Management Board to comment on some of the topics there, we'll also focus of the questions submitted in advance. Now before that, I would like to tell you who our speakers in the second block will be. Now these are the following: Mr. Tilman Massa, Ms. [ Catherine Pete ], Ms. [ Ines Norilbi ], [ Matthias Cabler ] and [ Ulk Ulrich Gable ]. So these 5 speakers will, in a minute, see the pop up on their screens, and they will then be admitted to the waiting room. Now, however, I'd like to ask the Management Board members to comment on some topics which are relevant for a wider circle of our shareholders. And that means all those who have not familiarized themselves with the question and answers published on the Internet, they will be given the chance to hear the position of the bank on these matters. And the first one to go is Mr. Christian Sewing, who will talk about the strategy of the bank, and then James von Moltke and Stefan Simon will then continue. Christian, the floor is yours.

Thank you very much. And also, many thanks to all of the shareholders who submitted their questions in advance. The topic of strategy was one of the focal points of those questions, and I would like to address this now. As mentioned in my speech, Deutsche Bank's strategy and financial plans up to 2025 are geared towards positioning the bank as a global house bank. The core of our strategy is to be the first point of contact for our customers in all financial matters. We are committed to building trusting, long-term relationships with our clients, and we want to support them in managing technological change, macro and geopolitical uncertainties and the transition to a sustainable economy. Our 4 client-focused business divisions, our comprehensive product range, our deep capital market expertise, and our extensive global network enable us to provide targeted solutions to the structural challenges our clients are facing. Our annual results for 2023 underline the strength of our strategy as a global house bank. In the 2023 fiscal year, we achieved the highest pretax profit in 16 years. We grew faster than planned. And in spite of important investments, we maintained our focus on cost discipline. At the same time, we have built up considerable amount of capital. And this puts us in a position to accelerate the capital distributions to our shareholders. All of this makes us very confident that we will achieve our targets for 2025. In 2023, Deutsche Bank accelerated the implementation of its strategy and made further progress in all areas. We have raised the target for the average annual earnings growth in the period from 2021 to 2025 to between 5.5% to 6.5% and for the year 2025 are aiming for earnings of around EUR 32 billion. And to this end, we have made investments in order to drive growth in capital-efficient business areas. This applies, above all, to the corporate bank, the origination and advisory business in the investment bank and the wealth managed business in the Private Bank. Second, in 2023, Deutsche Bank made further progress in implementing its operational efficiency program, which aims to achieve savings of EUR 2.5 billion. At the end of 2023, the savings achieved and expected from completed efficiency measures amounted to a total of EUR 1.3 billion. And the focus remains on cost discipline. We are aiming for EUR 5 billion in adjusted cost per quarter and around EUR 20 billion in total costs in the 2025 fiscal year. The bank's capital efficiency program contributed to a gross reduction in risk-weighted assets of EUR 13 billion by the end of last year. This means that around half of the target of reducing risk-weighted assets by EUR 25 billion to EUR 30 billion by 2025 has been achieved. Capital distributions to our shareholders, as I emphasized in my speech, are and remain an essential part of our strategy. James will come back to this in more detail in just a moment. Ladies and gentlemen, a key component of Deutsche Bank's success is our balanced business mix, which allows us to grow sustainably and support our clients in the best possible way. The corporate bank, with its extensive global network, is part and parcel of our offering. This division made further progress in implementing strategic initiatives in 2023, benefiting from rising interest rates and a high level of price discipline. The division continues to invest in fee-generating payment platforms and strengthened customer support with additional advisers. In addition, the expansion of the commission business with institutional clients and a stronger focus on cross-divisional client offerings are planned. The corporate bank is also accelerating the development of new business areas with future earnings potential, such as products for the custody of digital assets and trading solutions. Our investment bank is also a central pillar of Deutsche Bank, offering a wide range of services and supporting corporate and institutional clients on the financial markets. Thanks in part to investments in selective hiring of managers in the origination and advisory business, this division is well positioned to grow and benefit greatly from the expected increase in market activity. In line with this strategy, the Numis acquisition and the integration has created Deutsche Numis, with a leading position as an advisory house, corporate broker and equity underwriter in the U.K. In the area of fixed income securities and currencies, the so-called FIC business, investments in existing and adjacent business areas in which the division has got a competitive edge will be continued. Here, we are building on the strategic development since 2019. As a result, the aforementioned measures should lead to a further diversification of our earnings base and at the same time, ensure an optimized range of products and services for our customers. With more than 20 million clients and a broad range of financial services in 19 countries, our Private Bank makes a significant contribution to Deutsche Bank's global business activities. With assets under management of EUR 559 billion at the end of 2023, which, by the way, is an increase of 8% compared to the previous year, the Private Bank has a strong foundation for future growth. We are focusing on the expansion of digital channels and a transition to internal portfolio solutions. We're also continuing to focus on products with recurring commission income, particularly in the Wealth Management and Private Banking client segment, supported by growth in the Lombard business. Our Asset Management division, which mainly consists of the majority stake in DWS, also has a strong basis for increasing earnings with assets under management of EUR 896 billion at the end of 2023. Here, we are focusing on growth through product innovation and regional expansion in the Passive products business and expect business to pick up in the area of alternative investments. In view of the constantly changing market environment and the higher interest rates, we will continue to focus on fixed income securities and institutional investors. In the multi-asset area, we are pursuing the goal of further strengthening our solutions expertise. In all our business areas, we place a strong focus on environmental, social and governance issues, ESG. Our aim is to support our clients worldwide in their transformation towards a sustainable economy and to play a leading role in this transformation. I would now like to hand over to James von Moltke, who will first address the topic of dividends and share buybacks, and then talk about the development of our share price.

Thanks, Christian. First, on the subject of distribution. Since the start of the transformation in July 2019, Deutsche Bank has significantly improved its profitability and plans to achieve a post-tax return on tangible equity of over 10% in the 2025 fiscal year. This higher, more sustainable profitability will allow the bank to make distributions to its shareholders and gradually increase them. As demonstrated in recent years, Deutsche Bank intends to allow its shareholders to participate more strongly in its profits as a result of the successful transformation. For the fiscal years 2021 to '25, it has set itself the target of returning a total of EUR 8 billion in capital to shareholders, which will be paid out in the years 2022 to 2026. The bank believes it is well positioned to exceed this target by achieving its financial targets. This is supported by the increase in the capital outlook by around EUR 3 billion announced with the results for the third quarter. As outlined in the 2023 annual report on Page 47, Deutsche Bank plans to sustainably increase cash dividends and distribute excess capital to shareholders over time through share buybacks. This capital is in excess of the level required to support profitable growth and upcoming regulatory changes. Last year, the bank paid a dividend of EUR 0.30 per share for the 2022 financial year. Together with a share buyback program of EUR 450 million, a total of over EUR 1 billion was thus distributed to Deutsche Bank's shareholders for the 2022 financial year. This corresponds to an increase of 50% compared to the previous year. For the 2023 financial year, the Management Board has proposed a dividend of EUR 0.45 per share and thus a total of around EUR 900 million. In addition, the bank has received regulatory approval for a share buyback of EUR 675 million, which began on March 4 and expected to be largely completed in the first half of 2024. Deutsche Bank will thus distribute a total of around EUR 1.6 billion to its shareholders for the 2023 financial year. This corresponds to an increase of 50% in both the dividend per share and the share buyback volume compared to the previous year. Including the distributions for the 2021 and 2022 financial years, the bank will thus pay around EUR 3.3 billion to its shareholders. For the 2024 financial year and the subsequent years, Deutsche Bank is aiming for ordinary distributions amounting to 50% of the post-tax profit attributable to Deutsche Bank's shareholders. These distributions are to be achieved through a combination of cash dividends and share buybacks. The bank is aiming to pay a cash dividend of EUR 0.68 per share for the 2024 financial year and a cash dividend of EUR 1 per share for the 2025 financial year, subject to a cap on the payout ratio of 50%. In spite of the announcement of April 26, 2024, that a provision for legal disputes in connection with the Postbank takeover of EUR 1.3 billion will be recognized in the second quarter of 2024, the aforementioned capital distribution ambitions remain unchanged. However, a further share buyback program in the second half of 2024 has become less likely at this point in time. The final decision on when and to what extent the bank will buy back its own shares in future will be made in due course. It should be noted that share buybacks must be approved by the supervisory authorities and the shareholders make the final decision on the amount of dividends. In addition, the bank must also take into account the requirements of the German Stock Corporation Act when making such distributions. An overview of previous share buyback programs can be found on the Deutsche Bank website under the Investors tab. And this brings me to our share price. Since the Annual General Meeting in May 2023, Deutsche Bank's share price has risen from around EUR 9.7 to almost EUR 15.9. This means that Deutsche Bank's share price has outperformed the European STOXX 600 Banks Index by around 30 percentage points in this period, which is, in particular, due to the performance of the past 6 months. While the share performance of European banks in the summer of 2023 was still characterized by the uncertainty in the financial sector in the first quarter of 2023, Deutsche Bank's share price was increasingly based on the bank's fundamentals again from autumn 2023. Improved macroeconomic data and lower inflation expectations as well as the improved outlook for Deutsche Bank's capital, which the bank presented with its results for the third quarter of 2023, contributed to the rising share price from the end of October. The upward movement was also reinforced by the positive outlook for the financial data for the fiscal years '24 and 2025, which Deutsche Bank announced with its results for the financial year 2023. Concerns about the development of the U.S. commercial real estate market weighed on our share price at the beginning of February, but this was only short-lived. Christian Sewing's confirmation of the positive outlook for the first quarter of 2024 and the coming financial years at a specialist conference in mid-March helped our share price to rise again. A further boost from good financial results in the first quarter of 2024 and the confirmation of the outlook for the 2024 and 2025 financial years was offset by the announcement that a provision would be recognized for the legal dispute regarding the Postbank takeover. In the days that followed, however, the share price continues its upward trend since the beginning of the year. As presented at the Investor Day in March 2022, Deutsche Bank aims to become even more profitable and achieve a post-tax return on tangible equity of at least 10% by 2025. The bank remains well on track to achieve this target and the Management Board is convinced that the share price will benefit from this. Deutsche Bank does not expect the provision for the Deutsche -- for the Postbank takeover litigation to have a significant impact on Deutsche Bank's strategic plans or financial targets. Deutsche Bank's current market capitalization is at approximately 0.5x its total book value compared to a value of approximately 0.3 at the time of last year's AGM. However, Deutsche Bank believes that the current ratio between market capitalization and book value offers further upside potential, especially if the bank can increase its profitability as planned. The continuous positive development of the operating business continues to be recognized on the capital market. For example, the rating agencies, S&P, Fitch and Morningstar DBRS, have once again raised Deutsche Bank's credit ratings in 2023. Stefan Simon will now comment on the developments in the proceedings surrounding the Postbank takeover.

Thank you, James. Ladies and gentlemen, I now would like to report about the current status around the civil cases around the acquisition of Postbank in the period 2008 to 2010. In the so-called Postbank complex, 384 plaintiffs are suing in 46 different cases with different courts. About 90% of the plaintiffs are international hedge funds and other institutional investors. The plaintiffs had Postbank shares, and these were offered in the course of the voluntary acquisition offer of Deutsche Bank from October 2010 at a price of EUR 25 per share. The plaintiffs want to be put in a position as if they had already sold the shares 2 years earlier, a few days before the Lehman bankruptcy in 2008 and, thus, at a significantly higher price. The claim that Deutsche Bank already had actual control of Postbank in 2008, which means that the offered price for the acquisition, in the context of the voluntary offer 2010, would have had to be at least EUR 57.25 per share. Some plaintiffs even claim a price of EUR 64.25 per share. The total amount of the case is amounting to EUR 662 million at present, including the interests accumulated until March 2024. The total risk of the claims as of the end of the first quarter 2024 amounts to around EUR 1.3 billion. In the course of the years, the higher court in Cologne had decided several times in favor of Deutsche Bank, first in the year 2012 and then again in December 2020, after a comprehensive discovery period and after hearing numerous witnesses and after analyzing the contractual agreements. In December 2022, the Federal Court of Justice again referred the case back to the higher court of -- in Cologne and specified that further legal and factual aspects had to be taken into account. Deutsche Bank had asked 2 law firms to check the decision by the Federal Court of Justice from December 2022 as Deutsche Bank always assumed on the basis of this and earlier reviews, internal and external reviews until the 26th of April 2024, assumed that it would win the litigation with a high likelihood. No provisions could be made based on the accounting principles. The remaining risk had to be reported as a contingent liability, and this has always been done. In the oral hearing on the 26th of April 2024, the higher court in Cologne again has reviewed 2 cases of 2 former Postbank shareholders, and the higher court in Cologne then gave a preliminary assessment of the factual and legal situation following the Federal Court judgment. And then the court indicated that it now might follow the plaintiff's arguments in some important points, increasing the risk that the plaintiffs might be granted their claims in this decision -- in the decision by the higher court of justice in Cologne. Against this background, our internal and external lawyers now came to the assessment that there is a probability of around 50% to lose litigation, and this is why Deutsche Bank in April 2024 had to make a provision of EUR 1.3 billion. In alignment with the valid ad hoc regulations, Deutsche Bank then informed the capital markets on this provision on the 26th of April 2024. The previous contingent liabilities were reduced by the same amount of the provision. Deutsche Bank had not expected such a changed assessment of the legal and factual situation by the court in Cologne. We are still of the opinion that Deutsche Bank in the year 2008 and thus before the share purchase agreement became applicable and also before the antitrust authorities approved this transaction did not have any control over Postbank. After the higher court in Cologne in the order hearing on the 26th of April recommended settlement discussions, the Deutsche Bank again started talking to the plaintiffs. It is our goal to really find an appropriate solution to the benefit of the bank and our shareholders. At the same time, we want to use the opportunity that was opened up by the bank to again submit our legal and factual arguments. The final outcome of all the proceedings in this complex is still open. However, as we now have built the provisions, this risk is covered in the balance sheet. This, however, is not true for the accumulating interest amounts, which currently are approximately EUR 65 million per annum. Ladies and gentlemen, after the short overview of the Postbank complex, I would like to hand back to Norbert Winkeljohann.

Well, thank you very much to Christian Sewing, James von Moltke and Stefan Simon, and I can now see that we have already the first speakers of the second block of questions in the waiting room. And as the first speaker, I would like to welcome Tilman Massa from the Association of Critical Shareholders. Then [ Spitz ] and Mrs. [ Nolden ]. You have the floor, Mr. Massa.

Thank you very much, Mr. Winkeljohann. Ladies and gentlemen, dear members of the Supervisory Board and the Management Board, well, I do have some technical problems. And I hope you can hear me properly.

Yes, we can hear you. Thank you.

Great. Thank you. Well, yes, I am representing the Association of Critical Shareholders, and we want Deutsche Bank to take more measures to protect the climate and to have sustainability. And we also submitted a counterproposal, which I would like to submit formally here. But I also would like to share the criticism regarding the virtual form of the AGM today. We think it's good -- it's optional to take part virtually, but it would also be necessary to ask questions to Mr. Sewing spontaneously because this would not be in the sense of an AGM if you're only allowed to ask follow-up questions on what you had asked before. So next -- for next year, we really would like to ask you to make questions possible. And you also see that you do not really manage to do this because Mr. [ Nieding ] and Mr. [ Redding ] have already asked questions that go beyond the questions. Yes, I know this is what the Stock Corporation Act says, but you nevertheless can be tolerant and you should make it possible to have a real dialogue, and we really want to have an AGM in presence or a hybrid meeting next year. But thank you very much for answering the previously submitted questions, but I also have some follow-up questions. And we -- well, if you read the answers, new questions arise, and we now would like to use the opportunity to ask these questions, especially regarding points on financing that we had already asked to you. So let me start with the first question. How can we, as shareholders or the public, ever be in a position to check whether you really deliver on your high promises regarding sustainability and climate protection because we would need binding rules for the financial sectors as well regarding sustainability? We would need minimum standards that would be implemented in a transparent manner. And in your answer, you simply say, and this is question 149, that you would welcome binding and reliable rules, but then you say this is taking a lot of effort. It binds many resources. What are you talking about exactly? And could you tell us in amounts what this means, especially compared to your previous costs for ESG and sustainability? Because new obligations, yes, of course, this is always a lot because previously, you didn't have to do anything. There were no legal regulations on this. But now you also seem to point to your voluntary measures, and you say that this is okay. You mentioned the UN Compact, the Global Banking Alliance. But then let me ask, I didn't see the answer. If you really want to have a welcome, reliable and binding regulations in this area, would you also make -- welcome this in your business with large clients because this doesn't really seem to be the case right now? And yes, again, you have a problem with transparency.

And now the speaker, unfortunately, is no longer online. We cannot hear him any longer. Mr. Winkeljohann is saying that at present, there are problems with the transmission. There seems to be a problem with the microphone. So you gave loans and these were not in line with your ESG criteria. Well, yes, we did receive some data, and you also mentioned regarding your investments that it's not possible to specify the volumes in detail, but let me ask a question on this. Could you at least give a ballpark figure regarding your loans to Bunge, Cargill and so on and so forth. As mentioned in the study by Greenpeace and the German Umwelthilfe or are they completely different because we would like to use the right figures. But now also back to your Cargill investments. You already said that there are -- what we also told you that there are massive complaints and especially in the area of the criteria that you would like to use for your investments. And here, I would like to ask a question regarding the project in Abaetetuba in Brazil, of Cargill where there a massive infringements of the public rights you as the investment company, active in Cargill, will you make sure that the company immediately fully respect and guarantees the territorial powers? Yes, this is again my question number 167, but I know that you are not always very transparent. So let me put it in different terms. For your major customers, for your large customers, would you really check on the basis of your own regulations that the approval by the communities was really given? And what is happening if you find later on that such an approval isn't -- had not been given. And to just expect that it is done by the companies is negligible. Yes. And even the courts have said that the slides are not always maintained by the mining companies. And I would like to come back to the AGM. As I mentioned, earlier on. You also say you have a virtual meeting because you also want to make it possible for international shareholders to take part. But why isn't it possible to speak in English here? On other AGMs, it is possible, Siemens, Mr. Winkeljohann, you should know best. And you are offering simultaneous translation into English. So here, again, you say that you are not really making good on your own argument. So please explain why it's not possible to speak English here? And could you perhaps also review this for next year again because this should not be a major technical challenge because you already make translation available. And we will also hear other questions on the climate area, so I will keep it brief. I would like to thank you for your attention, and we will follow, of course, your answers to our follow-up questions.

Thank you very much, Mr. [ Masa ]. As the next speaker, we have [ Ms. Catherine Pitts ], also from the same Association of Critical Shareholders followed by [indiscernible] and by Ms. [ Pitts ], you have the floor.

Yes. Thank you very much. Ladies and gentlemen, my name is [ Catherine Pitts ] I'm representing the [indiscernible] human rights organization, which is also a member of the Association of Critical Shareholders. I would like to now talk about what you said on fossil industries. But now I would like to make a general comment first. We have been observing the fossil industry very closely, and we can see that climate goals and the issues of climate have been ignored. In order to achieve the Paris goals, no fossil energy resources should be used or researched on in the future. But what does the major part of the industry do, they invest millions into the exploration of new fossil fuels. And as long as the company still expands the company can be as good as it will in other areas, it will still infringe the Paris climate goals. And this cannot be denied. Climate transition is only possible if you immediately stop the expansion in the fossil industry -- so this was my first general comment. But now let's come to the questions. Regarding sustainable financing and ESG investments, what are the concrete criteria that you use for sustainable investments. Can you also use CO2 certificates. Can a company get financing that is seen as sustainability -- sustainable even if it expands in the fossil energy area. So for example, loan for a wind farm by BP. And you say that by 2026, at least 90% of your customers with high emission from high emission industries will have to go for a self commitment, what are the criteria that you have here? Do you expect intermediate results? Are there any specifications on CO2 emissions? Or can you also reach Net Zero via netting. And you also say that you want to have a close contact with your customers. And if the do not follow your expectations, you might also cut this. Do you have now any plans to cut your links to some of the companies if the company does not really transform? And you also say that an exit of a client relationship will only happen if the customer does not show any credibility in getting out of this. And from our point of view, the entire fossil industry does not show this willingness. Could you then specify what willingness means in your definition? You say that regarding Scope 3, finance emissions, coal and gas is still volatile. Can you explain this? Why do you think this volatility exists and in the answers to our questions, you mainly focused on the credit loan business, but a large part of the financing is based on [indiscernible] nowadays. And do you have the same reduction goals for these as for the credit loan business? And my last question, some countries can also base their plans on the plans of their companies? Do you also have some criteria there? Or can these be general company financing? If so, how does such financing help reduce the strong dependence on fossil fuels? Ladies and gentlemen, you always say that we need an acceleration towards a sustainable economy, but still you finance a lot of industries which expand in a non-sustainable manner. This doesn't fit together. Thank you very much for your attention.

Thank you very much, Ms. [ Pitts ]. The next speaker is [ Inas Nureldin ] followed by [indiscernible]. I'm sorry, Mr. [ Inas Nureldin ]. The floor is all your, sir.

Thank you, and good afternoon, everybody. My name is [ Inas Nureldin ] my question refers to the share action question, which was sent in previously on the capital markets and the emissions that Deutsche Bank, unfortunately, has not made part and parcel of its climate -- of its reporting and climate goals. Thank you very much for the written answers that we received. But still, Deutsche Bank is not giving us any concrete information on when the effects of its capital markets activities will be included in its goals and in its reporting. The report of banking on climate chaos that was published last week, referring to the increase of the overall financing of fossil fuels by Deutsche Bank of $10 billion in 2022 to USD 13.4 billion in 2023, shows how urgent our questions really are. These questions include the extension of loans, the financing of bonds via capital markets by Deutsche Bank or the European banks have already been reporting this, already reporting this and take their capital market activities into consideration when reporting and when defining their goals. When does Deutsche Bank be catching up on that and will the emissions caused by that be included by 100% in order to really pay account to the full climate effect of those. Thank you?

Thank you very much, Mr. [ Nureldin ]. In our second block, we have 2 speakers: [indiscernible] and [indiscernible]. The floor is all yours.

Thank you very much, Mr. Winkeljohann. Please excuse me, but I dress according to my mood -- and the answers to my questions that I sent was fairly meager. And I wanted to give the expression to this by my choice of dress. So let's have a look at the share price development. This was great in the last 12 months for Deutsche Bank from EUR 10 to EUR 16. But [indiscernible], we still have a lot of catching up to the 16 years ago, 2008, share price was EUR 60. In 2007, it was even higher than EUR 90. So this is still a long way to temporary. And my question is, prices like this, will we ever see them again during your term of office. I'd love to see that. So now on share price development, please give us 3 reasons, why one would stay shareholder of Deutsche Bank or even buy shares at the current share price level. I mean if you want to tell me that Management Board gives no recommendation to buy shares is not an answer. So how many shareholders have been dialed in, in the shareholder portal and how many from abroad, non-German-speaking countries? I think the -- if I look at this, I have the impression that hardly anyone dialing in from abroad, which is the reason that you give for a virtual AGM and then why don't you provide more opportunities in the framework of a virtual AGM to make this more interesting? For example, we have no chat rooms to exchange ideas or opinions with other shareholders or something like thumbs ups, thumb downs or applause, during the presentation of the Management Board, as we know from WhatsApp or other video conferences. This could be introduced without disclosing too many more costs. I reckon also, for example, you could also -- other shareholders could contact others, for example, by e-mail, if they like their contribution or they can send all types of applauses or something like that. So there will be a nice feature to have. So an extension of the virtual AGM will be a good thing. Mr. Sewing, isn't it likely schizophrenic, Deutsche Bank has carries risks in billions in its main business, but when it comes to the AGM, you don't want to take any risks at all. So I'd like to just to be understood as a wake-up call not only to do what is the bare minimum when it comes to legal provisions, but go above and beyond it. And then also the question, what does the future bring. Do you want to go back to an in-person AGM, don't tell me that you will be discussing this in your various boards. You've had time to do this. Please let us know what you decide. There are pros and cons for both formats, but we want to have a clear statement. You perhaps you might -- you could say we have next year with semi virtual, then we have in person or next 2 years will be virtual, then we will be in person. I want to get a clear answer, clear statement from you now. Now on add-on questions to the questions I sent in before the AGM. I mean, Mr. Sewing, Mr. Winkeljohann, listen -- listen, I'm really angry. There were questions, you have time to prepare them -- and those questions were either not answered at all or not sufficiently. I give you a very trivial example. I asked, for example, how many questions of how many shareholders did you get on time? And your answer was 291 previously sent in question. Okay, but by how many shareholders. Why don't you give us that? I mean, Okay. It might be a point of contention as to whether this is part of the agenda or not, but you can give a very simple answer to that. And I don't know why you receive the questions from us in the text file. But what you give us is a PDF file, which does not allow you to copy anything out -- and I mean, in the Internet, there are simple tools where you can remove, for example, the blocking of a PDF format. This works beautifully, works in 10 seconds. So why do you do this? Why do you have this protective PDF then also the EUR 36,000 you say, was the cost for the catering of virtual AGM. And everyone asks yourself why do you have catering costs in the virtual AGM, there are no shareholders. But yes, but there's a back office, providers on site. But if it's -- I don't know how many people are we talking about 150 people, EUR 36,000. What do you serve them? champagne, salmon, oysters? I mean -- I had another AGM where the management Board said, we are catering costs were -- below EUR 1,000, we just served them some dry rolls. So but then that's a side question. And what are the questions that are generated by the BaFin supervision in the context of the Postbank case, your answer to that was that there was a separate administrative act of BaFin and it is in this framework that you pay the normal remuneration, the normal seats. This is not an answer to my question. It is the usual accustomary compensation. Well, this is made. This means that BaFin is a constant guest in your house and you know what they usually charge you, right? But if this is the case, you can give it to us. I'm asking for the cost, I will not biting your head off. No, but I'm asking for the cost. Are we talking about EUR 1,000? Are we talking a EUR 10,000, EUR 100,000, EUR 1 million and I'm really angry because my questions were very simple and inviting simple answers, and you were just evading them. I'm asking again how many private clients and corporate clients were terminated by you in the year 2023? And you say under the general terms and conditions, we don't have to give you an answer to this. And yes, but this is not my question. I also asked some personal questions and Mr. Sewing, I wrote to you personally, and I'm fully aware that you don't read this. I'm fully aware of that. But my question 34 to 45 were not answered at all. You said that please get in contact with customer service after the AGM in order to clarify my questions. This is exactly what I'm not going to do. I mean, I'm pretty frustrated that in 5 months' time, I was not able to open a business account at Postbank not because of problems with my credit -- was in this always in the blank, and I'm always in a good, I'm really annoyed as a shareholder of Deutsche Bank, how inefficiently you're treating your clients. For example, I'm being sent an e-mail that an adviser was to contact me soon. I got this in June of last year. Since then, no one ever contacted me. So the left hand doesn't know what the right hand does. When it comes to customer service, you're in your hotline, you're hanging around in your hotline for 30 minutes and Mr. Sewing, If you call the customer hotline at Postbank, you get a different piece of advice of information every day. So I'm turning around, so why don't you go into my case? Why don't you do that? Why don't you take the initiative proactively not because you want to please me, I couldn't care less, but because of you're learning. And I'm also -- I'm really annoyed as a shareholder because, we could earn much more money if such inefficient processes will finally be done away with. And another question was when it comes to the providers, that helped you with the technical change of Postbank, and you answered that everyone did their job. While, yes, that might be correct answers. But if all the service providers had done their job, how is it then that we had this nightmare. So I will be very grateful if you would give us an answer on that because I received a finance theft test and there is this beautiful headline annoyance with Postbank, are -- do you have trouble with Postbank, how can you defend yourself -- this is not good promotion. This is not marketing for Postbank. Things like these have to be avoided. And then also, you have not remediated everything, so a lot has to be, a lot more has to be done. I also asked you about the original plant costs for the system changeover at Postbank or the actual costs were and what the overall damage is as of now? You just as an answer to this, you gave us the savings effect. I didn't ask for the savings effect because if you start such a project, you will certainly also have an idea of what you wanted to cost. I know I'm most probably using more time than I have. But you shouldn't act as you were at [ Bayer ] -- the last -- the speaker after me at the [ Bayer ] AGM, you just cut off and send to the [indiscernible] This is unprofessional, right? Just to tell you this Mr. Winkeljohann. So I might -- I'm skipping things. But before the AGM, there were problems with blocked accesses. If you can send in questions up until midnight of a Sunday, your hotline has to be open. Your hotline has to be open for this point in time as well. So to refer to user mistakes is also not pertinent. And I'm getting to the end, Mr. Winkeljohann, you don't have to get your knickers and the twisters about this. But basically, I like Deutsche Bank. You might think I'm a critical shareholder, but really I like Deutsche Bank. I mean we have 45 voting points. And in the shareholders portal, you only have a yes for your things but not for the others. The answer was that it's in the usual scope as for other AGMs, so what is usual is that all 3 options are being offered. Yes, no, abstention, for example. And to provide neutrality and for me, I was so annoyed with that, that I pressed No 45x, although I actually did not want to do this, but I'm just so angry. And some technical thing. Section 130, para 2, after Stock Corporation law and also communication of Section 129, para 5, so this is shareholders' information that I'm requesting. Right. Ladies and gentlemen, dear co-shareholders, ladies and gentlemen of the administration. Thank you very much for giving me the floor. But first of all, I'd like -- and most importantly, I'd like to ask every single employee of the Deutsche Bank Group who generated this excellent result for us shareholders. Mr. Winkeljohann, I hope that I will now get substantial answers to my questions. I don't shy away from asking add-on questions to the add-on questions, but I'd rather do not. So I hope that I will get adequate questions to my answers because they're really simple. But thank you very much again.

Thank you very much, Mr. [indiscernible]. We do our very best in order to answer your questions. We will now get to several additional focus statements. And I also see that we have first answers on the questions that were asked today, so I will hand over to the management Board to do this. But let me first continue with the preparation for a third block of speakers. This time, the technicians we got in contact is the following ladies and gentlemen, [indiscernible] then [indiscernible], [indiscernible] and then [indiscernible] for technical reasons was not available. He couldn't be reached now. So this would be Block #3 that we will be starting in a short moment. Please help us with getting you to the waiting room speedily, but now we have a look at the focused topics and with the answering of the questions. We start with [ Mr. Stefan ].

Yes. Thank you very much. Ladies and gentlemen, last year, -- the large majority of more than 87% of the share capital represented, the AGM authorized the Management Board to hold future Annual General Meetings of Deutsche Bank in virtual format until the 31st of August 2025. The decision to hold this year's AGM in a virtual format was made by the management Board in exercising that authorization, taking into account the right interest of the shareholders and the company in accordance with the legal requirements and the provisions of the company's articles of association. The aim of achieving the Board's possible shareholder participation was of particular importance in the course of this decision. Apart from simplifying participation opportunities for our Global shareholders through the use of this format, the positive experience from last year's AGM was also built upon. Last year, the virtual format made it possible to overcome time and language barriers and offer the greatest possible extent of transparency. Shareholders worldwide had the opportunity to submit questions regardless of the timezones they were in and either in German or in English. We are convinced that it is precisely the chosen format that leads to a high quality of answers and transparency and enables shareholders to engage in a focused discussion and intensive dialogue with us on the day of the AGM. We are, therefore, again, providing for questions to be submitted in German or in English in advance and answered in the run-up to the Annual General Meeting again this year. Sustainability and cost considerations also played an important role. The virtual format avoids longer trips for shareholders and saves around 80% of carbon emissions this year. And it also saves estimated cost of around EUR 2.8 million compared to an in-person meeting. Moreover, the legislator also considers an AGM virtual format to be equivalent to an in-person meeting. Many of you also asked us about a hybrid format. Hybrid format would lead to significantly more time and effort required and additional complexity in preparing and holding the AGM because in that case, both formats, the face-to-face meeting and the virtual format would have to be adequately taken into account. In addition to the cost for an in-person meeting such as hall rental or catering or security services, there would also be the technical requirements and the cost of enabling interactive online participation. The exact additional cost for this is difficult to quantify at this point. The hybrid format has incidentally only been used very, very sporadically since it was first introduced in 2009 and in actual practice, it has not been able to establish itself. For this year's AGM, we are again expecting costs of around EUR 2.8 million. This corresponds to the costs incurred for our virtual AGM last year. The cost of our last AGM held in person totaled just under EUR 4.6 million. It is planned for the members of the Supervisory Board as well as the members of the Management Board, the Chairman of the meeting, the notary commission to take notarized minutes and the company's voting representatives to attend the AGM in person. In accordance with Section 19 (3) of the company's Article of Association, members of the Supervisory Board are, however, permitted of the prior consultation with the Chairman of the Supervisory Board to participate in the AGM by means of video and audio transmission if their physical presence at the venue of the AGM would be impossible, or only possible at considerable expense due to their having to stay abroad, having to stay at another location in Germany or due to an unreasonable amount of travel time required. Following this year's AGM, we will carefully evaluate the experience gains again both last year and this year, particularly in terms of the format for submitting questions in advance and in doing so, we will also take obtain and take account of the opinions of our key shareholders. On that basis, we will then decide in due course, which format we will use for our AGM 2025. Ladies and gentlemen, thank you very much for the support many of you have voice regarding the format for this year's AGM. I'd like to pass the floor to Alexander von zur Muhlen, my colleague who's going to tell you more about the backlog in processing in connection with the migration of IT at Postbank.

Yes. Thank you very much, Stefan. Ladies and gentlemen, the transfer of around 12 million Postbank customers to Deutsche Bank's IT platform internally known as Project Unity was one of the largest IT migration projects within the European banking industry. The project is crucial to creating a basis for modern digital offerings at Deutsche Bank and Postbank. The complexity in scope of the program were extraordinary. Deutsche Bank focused on data integrity, and migrated around 50 billion data records of the around 12 million Postbank clients without any problems or complications. However, we are aware that we should have provided more support to Postbank clients, both in the call centers and in terms of processing. The number of inquiries that Postbank was confronted with during the migration was underestimated and led to an operational backlog at Postbank in responding to client inquiries. And it was important for us to work through this backlog as quickly as possible and learn some lessons for the future. A small number of our service processes were affected. However, unfortunately, these included processes that led to considerable restrictions for some of our clients. These restrictions and inconveniences for the affected clients have been intensively covered by the media. However, a more comprehensive view shows a more balanced picture. The vast majority of our Postbank clients have hardly had any restrictions in recent months. Our top priority was on reducing the increased processing times for some of our services and the backlog of client inquiries. This is the basis for us to regain the trust of our customers that we may have lost. To that end, we have mobilized additional resources and deployed more than 800 additional internal and external employees who have supported and continue to support us in dealing with the backlog. We've improved our processes in line with urgency for our clients, and this applies particularly to garnishments and the disbursement of loans. We have automated processes and procedures in order to reduce the backlog. We have introduced accelerated processes and discuss them with the German consumer advice centers in order to be able to help our clients as quickly as possible in the event of hardship. We have introduced a digital compensation process for clients, particularly strongly affected by the restrictions in the field of garnishments in order to be able to fulfill any justified claims quickly. We are also continuously investing in our telephone service. This has enabled us to significantly reduce the average waiting time in Postbank call centers. Since the turn of the year, we've been offering our clients services with waiting times that are now significantly shorter than before the IT migration in 2023. Let me now turn to the current state of play. As at the end of March 2024, we had completed processing of the backlog in client critical processes that were the subject of BaFin's orders, and we are continuing to work towards improving our service processes. Since then, new requests from our clients in these processes have also been processed within the defined service times. Any additional restrictions in service processes that have already been corrected are now also due to other factors. Our call centers as the first point of contact for any queries and complaints from clients have been very easy to reach again for many months now. We're well positioned to deal with our clients' concerns immediately. We are aware that we need to continuously develop our client service and processes over the next few months. And this includes further automating processes in order to ensure that processing times in all areas meets expectations and requirements in the long run. Moreover, we are continuing to pursue the strategy adopted at the end of 2023 of developing Postbank into a mobile-first bank in the medium term and offering its clients all products and services in a convenient format that is through mobile phones, tablets or personal advice. The figures for financial year 2023 have shown that clients remain loyal to Postbank. Postbank clients entrusted us with over EUR 5 billion worth of new savings, savings deposits last year, 40% of which were done via online transactions. The Postbank brand made a substantial contribution to the fact that the German private bank was able to significantly increase its earnings in 2023. Despite the difficulties, the IT migration was a milestone in Postbank's further development. The joint platform of Deutsche Bank and Postbank is the basis for modern digital offerings for all our 19 million customers. We regard migration -- this IT migration as a turning point and the starting point for revising and redesigning our service solutions. And here, I'd like to pass the floor to Christian Sewing who will talk about our sustainability policies and the financing of fossil fuels at the end of this block of answers.

Thank you very much. Ladies and gentlemen, as I already pointed out in my speech, Deutsche Bank wants to support its clients as a strategic partner in the transformation to a more sustainable and climate-neutral business models. Our goal is to support the gradual and orderly phaseout of fossil fuels. At the same time, the goal is to create incentives to promote the development of technologies with lower carbon intensity and credible transformation plans within companies. Deutsche bank has, therefore, published policies for business activities in CO2 intensive sectors, including coal mining and oil and gas. While we updated our policy for coal mining last year, and I will come back to this in a moment. We are currently revising our oil and gas policy, and we expect we will be able to publish our new policy soon. Since 2016, we have significantly reduced our lending exposure to these carbon-intensive sectors. Loan commitments to the coal mining sector, including thermal coal and metallurgical coal, totaled EUR 1.4 billion at the end of 2023. This corresponds to a portion of 0.2% of the bank's total loan book based on total loan commitments. At the end of 2022, this number had been EUR 1.5 billion. In the oil and gas sector, outstanding loan receivables amounted to EUR 7 billion at the end of 2023, and this corresponds to a share of 1.5% of the bank's total loan book. Let me now turn to the coal policy. Deutsche Bank makes business decisions not only on the basis of applicable laws, but also on the basis of its own policies and self commitments. And of course, this also applies to environmental and social aspects. As early as in 2016, Deutsche Bank set strict policies for its new business -- for its business activities in carbon-intensive sectors. And here, in particular, for energy production and energy promotion, in March 2023, the bank clarified and tightened its policy for [indiscernible]. The updated policy entered into force in May 2023. It applies to the bank's business operations worldwide with the exception of DWS. DWS as a listed company published its own policy in April 2023. In future, companies will be affected by our policy if they generate 30% or more of their revenues from thermal coal. Until May 2023, a turnover threshold of 50% had applied. Regardless of the threshold, all companies that produce at least 10 megatons of thermal coal per year or have the capacity to generate more than 10 gigawatts of electricity from coal will be subject to that policy. In the future, the bank will only support companies with a revenue share of more than 30% if they present credible transformation plans. Existing clients must develop such transformation plans by the end of 2025. For new clients, these plans are a prerequisite for entering into business relationship with them in the first place. Deutsche Bank has defined assessment criteria for transformation plans, companies from OECD countries are expected to fully exit the thermal coal business by 2030. For companies from non-OECD countries, exit has to take place by 2040. At the same time, we reaffirm our previous commitment to completely end the financing of existing clients in the thermal coal mining sector with a revenue share of more than 50% by 2025. unless there are any credible transformation plans. State-owned companies in countries with so-called -- just energy transition partnership programs are allowed to define target paths for phasing out the mining of thermal coal in such a way that they comply with the relevant countries obligations under the program. And the changes build upon the existing policies from 2016. The policy now excludes project financing for new thermal coal mines and the expansion of existing mines. It also continues to prohibit the financing of the construction of new coal-fired power plants and the expansion of existing coal-fired power plants. Apart from the policies for the individual sectors, we now have published a Net Zero target parts for 7 of the most emission-intensive industries in our corporate credit portfolio. After Oil and Gas, Power generation, Automotive and Steel in 2022, 3 more sectors were added in the autumn of 2023, Coal Mining, Cement and Shipping. This covers 54% of financed emissions in our corporate loan portfolio with interim targets fixed for 2030 and a Net Zero target fixed for 2050. In May of this year, the bank also disclosed the carbon footprint for its European residual loan portfolio and published its first transition plan in October 2023. With the sectoral decarbonization targets and the residential loan portfolio, the bank has thus published the emissions of around 60% of its entire loan book. The bank is planning to publish Net Zero targets for at least 2 additional sectors in the course of 2024. We also proposed to the AGM that from 2024, a part of the Management Board remuneration in the long-term award will be based on whether or not we meet our own target paths for finance emissions. Our ambition is that from 2026, at least 90% of our clients from particularly carbon intensive sectors will commit to a Net Zero target if they wish to take out new corporate loans. In the light of the global economic development, which is leading to an increase in CO2 emissions over all, this continues to be a very ambitious goal. We are, therefore, working consistently to make transition planning and assessment, an integral part of our dialogue with carbon-intensive companies. Let me also briefly comment on the state of play with regard to finance emissions from fossil fuels. Deutsche Bank aims to reduce finance emissions in the oil and gas sector by 23% by 2030 and by 90% by 2050 compared to baseline year 2021 and calculated in millions of tonnes of CO2. In the coal mining sector, financed Scope 3 emissions are to be reduced by 49% by 2030 and by 97% by 2050 compared to baseline year 2022 and again in millions of tonnes of CO2. For the oil and gas and coal mining sectors, the situation is as follows: As at the end of 2023, let me start with oil and gas. Finance scope 3 emissions amounted to 18.5 million tons of CO2 per year. This is an increase of 11% year-on-year. However, compared to baseline year 2021 was 23.4 million tonnes of CO2 per year. This represents a decrease of 21%. The main reasons for the development in 2023 were above all, effects from the client portfolio, the impact of exchange rate fluctuations in 2021 and 2022 as well as lower emission factors due to higher company values, including cash or total assets. Next, coal mining. Finance Scope 3 emissions fell by 23% year-on-year to 6.1 million tonnes of CO2 per year and they break down roughly equally between thermal coal and metallurgical coal, and they are below the base value for baseline year 2022 of 7.9 million tonnes of CO2 per year. And the development also reflects the fact that we have divested from certain customers, but also that the customers' emission factors have increased due to rising corporate values, including cash in 2022. As a result of which our financing share declined. As already emphasized, over the past few years, we expect the development of Scope 3 financed emissions in the oil and gas and coal mining sectors to remain volatile for reasons that are not within our control. We will continue to address these reasons in the future regardless of whether they have a positive or negative impact on the level of finance emissions. On all other sectors, you will find detailed information in our non-financial report on Pages 59 to 66. We regard it as our responsibility to continue to support clients while investing in the transformation of our economy, even if they still have high levels of emissions at the time being. What matters to us is that we seek credible transition plans and publicly available information and safe commitments. For example, if a carbon-intensive energy supplier invests in sustainable energy production, and we finance that, then this may temporarily lead to an increase in the carbon footprint in terms of emissions in this sector. We are aware that some NGOs want us to act differently. Please allow me to make a comment at this point. As banks, we can only support the transition to a sustainable economy. We cannot bring it about. And we can only support it if we are in close contact with our clients. And that is why terminating a client relationship should only be the last resort, if a client shows no willingness at all to make a credible transition to a carbon-free carbon-neutral economy. It does not help the climate in any way if we did terminate a client relationship and instead finance less regulated financial market participants or companies with weaker standards for carbon intensivities. And if we terminate a client relationship for good reason, we will not talk about it. Confidentiality with regard to existing or potential client relationships is and remains a reliable value for our bank. We ask you for your understanding for once again not complying with your request to provide information potential or existing client relationships at this Annual General Meeting as in the past. We owe itself as a matter of principle, do not comment on any questions regarding the financing or non-financing of certain projects by the bank. The bank will also not comment on any questions relating to companies that are not clients of the bank in order to avoid drawing conclusions in other cases. And in view of the criticism voiced by NGOs in this context, we trust we can engage in a constructive exchange with you, which we actually conduct with many NGOs in numerous formats. As already pointed out beforehand, Deutsche Bank is not afraid to terminate a client relationship if a client shows no willingness at all for a credible transition to its carbon-free economy. Even in cases where Deutsche Bank takes that measure as a last resort, we will not comment publicly contrary to the demands raised by many NGOs. A summary of the existing policies of the bank is published on its website and in its non-furnished report. The bank monitors new developments and best practice and adopts its policies accordingly. So much for our statements. I'd like to hand back to Norbert Winkeljohann at this point.

Thanks a lot, Christian. First of all, I would like to thank the members of the management for answering the question so far, and we will now have the next shareholders asking questions and then after that, we will have further answers provided. So we're starting out with Mr. [indiscernible], then [indiscernible] and after [ Daniel Michael Wehmer ]. [ Mr. Giebel ], you've got the floor.

Mr. Chairman, ladies and gentlemen, first of all, I ask for evidence according Section 25, subsection 5 of the Stock Corporation Act and Section 25, Subsection 4 Stock Corporation Act, and according to Section 130, section 2 of the Stock Corporation Act. My first question is about the refusal to provide access in registering for the AGM for which reasons where various shareholders not granted technical access to register for the virtual AGM. Why even after repeat complaints with the company and the technical service providers were they are not given access? Now as these are shareholders who are known for numerous and critical questions, my fear is that next year, I will, in the same way, be -- not be granted access to the AGM anymore. If today, I ask critical questions from your point of view. The names -- and I have the names of the respective shareholders, but for the sake of confidentiality, I do not want to disclose them at this point, but I can forward them to you if you're interested. My first question on the actual subject matter of the AGM, it's about the risk types of the German Stock Corporation Act within the group and also in the companies of the group for the years 2021, '22 and '23, that is the risk takers. So please specify the 3 most important reasons for the change of these numbers of risk takers in the respective years. Please also specify the number of risk takers within the group and within the German groups of the company, which in the year 2023, were entitled to a compensation of at least EUR 500,000 broken down into risk takers according to the average criterion, according to [ Section 25 (5)b ] and the materiality criteria according to [ 25 (5)b -- (3)b ] -- how many employees and employees refers to male and female employees? Now how many employees did in the years '21, '22 and '23? have an entitlement to an overall compensation that means fixed compensation and bonuses, incentives, long-term incentives and so on and so forth of at least EUR 1 million or the equivalent in foreign currencies. My next question questions applied to the workers' council. According to Section 730, number 1 of the Works Constitutional Act, the members of the workers' council are holding the office without any compensation. Now workers' councils also saw this differently at other companies. Bernd [indiscernible], former Head of the Workers Council of Volkswagen received EUR 750,000 per year, including bonus payments. Volkswagen managers in 2023 were sentenced for reasons of investment in year 2023 for granting Works Council members such high levels of compensation. Basically, the payment for Works Council members in Germany can follow 2 systems. On the one hand, based upon the comparable development of comparative persons within the company and the other method is the so-called hypothetical career. In simplified terms, this means it is estimated, which career an employee would have pursued without his or her Works Council career. And that is why, these are 2 wide threat methods for the payment of Works Council members, not only at Volkswagen. And it's written statement, the Federal Constitutional Court rejected the so-called hypothetical model. Daniela Cavallo, the successor at the Head of the Works Council of the Volkswagen received about EUR 100,000 per year. Now you remember, Mr. [indiscernible] had EUR 750,000. Now up to 80 of the 250 employee representatives had to see their compensation reduced according to that court ruling at Volkswagen. And in some cases, the reduction -- the peak reduction was up to EUR 4,000 per month and one Works Council member dropped from salary bracket 17 to salary bracket 8, which was cut by more than 50%. Now why am I talking about that? Well, that is the introduction to my questions, namely, number one, after the ruling of the Federal Court of Justice of 1st of October 2023, did Deutsche Bank also have to slash the compensation of Works Council members? And in how many cases did that happen? How high was the maximum, the minimum and the average decrease after compensation in euros and also in percent? Please explain and describe the model of payment of full-time Works Council members at Deutsche Bank AG? Is there respective manual or a policy available for that purpose? This also specified the number of full-time Works Council members in the group or members of comparable foreign bodies. Please specify the highest, the lowest and the average overall compensation of the full-time Works Council members within the group. And at this point, I already would point out that the answer to this question cannot be refused with reference to data previously act according to the ruling of the Federal Court of Justice. This is no longer possible. My next question applied to the notary public. Now which criteria and which the skills requirements have been defined by the Management Board and the Supervisory Board in selecting the notary public of this AGM? Now please do not tell us that you're meeting the strict legal requirements. I'm aware of them. I rather would like to know which specific criteria and quality criteria were applied? For how many years has the notary public been appointed for the AGM of Deutsche Bank AG? Does the company like the system for the auditor intend to change the notary public at certain intervals? Did the Management Board and the Supervisory Board verify the independence of the notary public? If so, in which manner and on the basis of which specific criteria? And here, once again, please do not tell me that you just go by the legal requirements. I'm familiar with them. I specifically would like to know what you look into and what you consider important. How high is the compensation of the notary public for today's AGM? Did the notary public have -- did he perform services for the company in '23 and '24 as a notary public? Which were these services? And how high was the compensation for these activities as a notary public for the company in '23 and '24? And please do not give me just a generalized answer referring to the legal requirements and the respective amounts set there. And then please also describe the 20 relevant activities and the respective amounts. So this rather gives me the total. What was the share of payments of companies of the group in the total income of the notary public in the year 2023? And at this point, once again, I would like to point out that answering this question cannot be refused for data privacy reasons or by just saying, we do not know. The share of the income from the bank relative to the notary public's overall income is a key criterion for assessing the independence of the notary public. And any lacking information in this regard would be suited to raise shareholders' doubts about the independence and neutrality of the notary public. The shareholders' rights to obtain information on matters of the company, which he is involved in is a key base -- is a key element of the shareholders' rights. It's considered a basic right of shareholders because such information is an indispensable requisite for us shareholders to live up to our corporate rights and obligations as a shareholder. And only a shareholder having insight into the activities and obligations of the company can live up to its own shareholders' obligations. At the same time, the shareholders also do have rights due to their shares that they are holding and they have also basic rights according to the German Law in complaining about the information, which is not disclosed to them by the company. So therefore, even according to our German constitution, shareholders do have the right to obtain information about the companies they're holding shares in just in the way I did in the previous questions and the ones that are still going to follow. Now my last topic is the partition of patient in meetings of the Supervisory Board and its committee. Which members of the Supervisory Board did participate in which meetings of the Supervisory Board or the committees or which ones did not or only partially participate in such meetings? For which of these meetings did they designate proxies or sent in voting their written votes and in which meetings did they not participate? Please give us just a brief overview of those matters of the meetings with Supervisory Board members who were not present or were only present partially. And please give us also respective names of these members. Which members of the Supervisory Board did participate virtually in meetings of the Supervisory Board or its committees? Thank you very much.

Mr. Gebler, please stay in line. In the very beginning, you asked for the long versions of the results to be read out. Is that correct? And now we were showing the results on the screen. So does it make sense for me to read them out in verbatim because that would mean that the AGM would last 30 or 40 minutes longer?

Well, Mr. Winkeljohann, this is not the first time that you're doing this, and you did that before. And -- with that, the intention of the legislator is ignored. Therefore, I'm very grateful for that question. I specifically referred to the disclosure of the results as required by the law that this means in verbatim and not only by showing them on the screen. And I'm not trying to annoy you by asking for this. But the point is that we cannot take notes and basically, the principle of having an oral AGM applies and therefore, I would like to add one more question, namely, how many lawyers were involved in preparing this AGM and are now working in the back office, how many of these lawyers are members of external law firms? What's the name of those law firms, and what is the cost arising from the support of these law firms?

Well, thank you very much, Mr. Gebler, and this brings us to Mr. Daniel Michael Werner, and then I'd like to ask Clemens Schellenberg and [indiscernible] to get ready. So Mr. Werner, now you've got the floor.

Good afternoon, I'm Daniel Werner. I'm a private shareholder, a long-term customer of Postbank and also of Deutsche Bank. And I've got about 3 key topics, namely the format of the AGM that is application of AI and Postbank. Let me start with the AGM format. First of all, I've got a question because there's something I don't understand. Now my impression is that this year, it is no longer required just to ask follow-up questions on the questions that have been beforehand. But here you have eased the requirements again. I tried to really read the small print, but I didn't see anything. So therefore, I assume that it is no longer such a strict requirement as it was last year. Now the AGM format. Now I once again would like to emphasize my request to return to a face-to-face AGM for the following reasons. The reasons specified by Deutsche Bank in favor of a virtual format are mainly cost arguments. And here, you specified the costs for a virtual AGM, namely amounting to EUR 2.8 million. And the last time you held face-to-face meetings, it was EUR 4.6 million. So that means it's a savings of about 40%. I would have expected more. So the savings do not seem to be too great to me. So it's just EUR 1.8 million. Now I'm not using that no, no word peanuts, but I think these savings are not really too tremendous. Then you also argued that broad-based shareholder participation is to be made possible. I asked about the participation and the tenants at the last in-person attendance, which was about 3,000 at the last in-person meeting. And then last year, at the virtual AGM, we had 900 shareholders who had dialed in. And at the end of last year's AGM, it was only 55 left. So 3,500 compared to 55. No, that's not really a broad-based participation of shareholders compared to an in-person AGM. And then your first -- the third argument was reducing CO2 emissions. Now here, I suggest that like HOCHTIEF did in the past before it was taken over by the Spanish ASC. Now they handed out a free ticket for public transportation to the shareholders intending to attend the AGM, which means any shareholder was able to use public means of transportation to get to the venue. I think this would be a great sign of solidarity. I mean you could distract this amount from the dividend to be paid out. That would not hit the free float shareholders too much, but rather the major institutional shareholders and would be also a contribution to sustainability. Now so much for the AGM format. Then my next topic is the use of AI. I had submitted a couple of questions on this subject, which you had also answered. But one. I had also asked whether Deutsche Bank is not only looking into the ethical matters and complex matters related to AI. But whether you are also members of ethical commissions outside the company. And if you're not, why not? And if you are, what are these additional ethical bodies specifically? Then my next topic is Postbank. And here, my basic question is the following. Now in its traditional Postbank has been a bank which -- especially when I became a Postbank customer was used by people with low income, students, pensioners, people who want to go to the branches and have their savings accounts there. You're still listening? Are you? Okay. And against this background, my impression is -- or my question is -- or I feel that Deutsche Bank also has got a social responsibility in taking over the Postbank namely a responsibility for customers, which are lower -- in the lower income brackets. Now my question is, what is the current structure of the Postbank clients -- where is it? I'm getting lost there. Now the breakdown in terms of profession, level of income and age. Now did that breakdown change or that composition? Or is it still the case primarily elderly people and pensioners are using the Postbank? And in this context and regarding the IT, there's one thing I really would like to emphasize. All the employees who have been criticized so much and who fought the hard battles to support customers one way or the other to help them, and the call centers. I mean these people, they were everyday heroes to me, I did have an issue myself, which was about the determination of a savings card, but still that was not such a major issue, but it took 3 months. And I called the call center many, many times and explained very quietly everything I did and where I had terminated that savings card. So in a very calm manner. And then that employee told me, you know what, you were so nice in expressing what you wanted. People have been screaming at me for 4 hours, but you are the first one who has been very friendly. So I can only say [indiscernible] the call center agents, they really deserve really a bonus and a great thank you for the great job they did answering the telephone calls. Now back to Postbank. I would like to know what Deutsche Bank thinks about the fact that access and digitalization and online banking is becoming more and more complicated every year and that more and more users need to have digital end devices. Now I've got friends who've got accounts not only at Postbank, but this now applies to almost every bank. Now they need to have 3 mobile phones to install the various apps to make sure that in an urgency, they still have access to their account. Now I think this is a very difficult development. And in this regard, I'd like to know what is Deutsche Bank's possibility of having kind of an analog fallback, which means going to the branch or also resulting to telephone banking because this would be, in some cases, the last result will be able to get access to one's bank account. Now unfortunately, placing orders via telephone banking are much more costly for customers than online banking. So if you've got an IT problem, you will have to pay more. And I believe, especially if you look at the structure of Postbank, this might be not really very nice in social terms to put it mildly. So I think this is really a major problem because passwords have to become more and more complex. You always have to make sure you update your apps. And if such an end device is not working or if something is not working on the side of Postbank, then this means people do not have a possibility to access their accounts anymore. So we are becoming more dependent on Apple, Google, Microsoft and all of the other tech groups. When there's a technical problem, then customers have a technical problem right away. Now that has been my regarding question and asking about the structure. And the question for Deutsche Bank, what it thinks of its own social responsibility, especially regarding the private customers of Postbank. Now 2 minor follow-up questions, sustainability. Now you have specified that you also now have teamed up with Miles & More. So that's kind of a discount association for frequent flyers. How does this tell you with your sustainability ambitions. Miles & More means you get a bonus if you fly more, but our ambition should be to reduce flying. And then finally, my -- kind of my summary is that I believe that EY due to the wirecard scandal has lost any credibility to act and be appointed as an auditor. And with that, I thank you very much, and I'm looking forward to your questions.

Thank you very much, Mr. Werner. And next, I would like to ask Clemens Schell to take the floor. He's going to be followed by [indiscernible]. Mr. Schellenberg, the floor is yours.

Good afternoon, ladies and gentlemen of the Management Board and Supervisory Board, dear shareholders. I am Schell, representing my own shares that I've been holding for 15 years. Why do I mentioned this? I want to -- I don't want you to think that I just bought shares in order to give a presentation. We hear a lot about transformation and transformation processes of Deutsche Bank, it's been the case for a few years. And as much as I understand a lot has been achieved, ratios, net income, the capital position of the bank was improved and also the strategic positioning of the bank is more proactive and more fitting, right? But we still have to see that price-to-book is still not very strong. If I look at the EURO STOXX, for example, I have 7 banks with the valuation of which the market capital is higher than ours. So there is no reason for resting on laurels for anyone. Now against the backdrop of all the positive messages that we got from Mr. Sewing and his colleagues, I have to contradict because the transformation of the bank obviously has not been understood by all people. There are still people that live in their ivory towers and have their very own idea of things. I'd like to give you an example. I'm part of an estate, right, an [indiscernible] estate. And we had to dissolve 8 accounts. We had to cancel 8 accounts, and we started this in October of 2023. And we've managed to cancel 6 accounts, 6 banks have managed to do this. And as I'm here at the AGM of Deutsche Bank, you can imagine which banks have not managed to cancel these accounts, it's Deutsche Bank and Postbank. Now after handing in the documents with both banks, nothing happened. Nothing at all. During that time, one of the other estates in Austria died, so that we had to provide additional documents. We did so. And with Postbank, we managed to do so quite quickly, and they then canceled the account. So I hope that this will be the same for Deutsche Bank, but this was different because -- then the bank was really got in going. In spite of us presenting all the documents, they rejected the canceling of the account. When we asked them why, and they told me -- because we told them that the Postbank managed to dissolve the account. And they said, "Well, we don't care a thing about Postbank". I am surprised about this statement. So I was asking you why -- when it comes to the departments dealing with such matters, such estate matters, for example, why don't you merge them? Because it saves a lot of time, to save a lot of cost, and it saves friction when it comes to your approach to the client. I'd like to ask as to whether every department of Deutsche Bank is up to their task when it comes to their knowledge, experience. When it comes to their mindset. And while we are still trying to find a solution with this department of Deutsche Bank, for example, Deutsche Bank wants to have a certificate of inheritance. But in Austria, there's nothing like a certificate of inheritance. So it is also difficult that this department, the estate department cannot be contacted by telephone, neither for the -- by the internal colleagues nor by customers. Another problem is that the estate department has 2 parts. One part that talks to customers and another part that does the back office work, the tests and decides -- investigates and decides, et cetera. So there is no personal contact because an inheritor cannot get in contact with people who take the decisions. neither can their colleagues. So there is no factual exchange possible. No with the people taking the decisions. So my question is your operational organization creates numerous inefficiencies that results in numerous telephone calls compared to other banks and inconsiderable delays. The costs are borne by us, the shareholders. So are you thinking about a potential reorganization of things? Secondly, you are describing, Mr. Sewing, the successes when it comes to reorientation, when it comes to focusing the new foci of Deutsche Bank, et cetera. I have the impression that not all employees are really customer-facing or want to be customer-facing. I rather reckon that they stick to their processes and are in a rather blindfolded way. Blink it, to say so. Are they aware of the fact -- are the employees aware of the fact that with the way they go about their business, they shy away potential clients and also make other customers become ex-customers of Deutsche Bank. I got in contact with the complaints officer of Deutsche Bank. And I asked that I wanted to complain about the estate department, and I asked for the responsible Management Board member so that I can send him or her a letter. This was not possible because they couldn't tell me who was responsible in the Management Board. So I'm quite surprised about that one. So that I'm asking you now, which member of the Management Board is responsible for the complaints department and the estate department, [indiscernible] of Deutsche Bank. And my last question, is it possible that the estate department and the complaints department are really housed comfortably in the ivory tower? And is a disconnect between you and this department that we still have the typical bank lock there? Or that perhaps transformation hasn't gotten to these departments yet? We don't know, you forgot about it. Thank you very much.

Thank you very much, Mr. Schellenberg. And as the last speaker in this round in this block, I see [indiscernible] the floor is all yours.

Well, I'm sorry for the delay. My computer was not inclined to go online, but it's a little older. So my name is [indiscernible]. Since 2009, I have made statements at the AGMs of Deutsche Bank. Deutsche Bank knows myself and the fraud case. And I'm just in nuisance. I'm alone. And I'm poor now. Before I built my house actually, Deutsche Bank knew me as a client. This is why I trusted them. And I got a loan in the amount of DM 132,000 to build a house. And this was a trap and meant to deplete my well-filled account and other documents. The loan was entered into the official register. And then a house was built, was proved to be a useless house, which was -- and it was just -- it was ruined. It could never be used. And then as advised by Deutsche Bank, I continued building. On my own behalf -- on my own costs that I could move in that just to have a roof over my head, and I mean I still live there, but the house is worthless and there is no insurance coverage because it's incomplete and it is damaged. And my payments went from the account of Deutsche Bank to the account of the builder at the [indiscernible] in Siegen. I had a court order into my favor but I have not seen any money because the builder went bankrupt. And then I became ill, I became unemployed. So my life broke down. There was [indiscernible], auctioning of -- they did no longer want me as a customer. However, I then inherited some money for my family, and I could cover everything, and I have now a pension of EUR 1,040. The most vicious part of this fraud is the type of financing that was offered. It was a credit by way of bank guarantee or guarantee credit. Most bankers don't know what this is and [indiscernible] it. And my lack of knowledge was misused. So any authorities or lawyers that came in later on, obviously knew about this type of financing. And I always objected to the result. Also, the kneading loaf, I have mandated at considerable costs, and they also led me into [indiscernible], into pledging of my house so -- until I brought in another lawyer. So there's a lot of water on my building ground. And this is why at the floor of the basement which should have been built in a different way. There is a lot of water. And I can't manage that. It's very clear. When I then filed a complaint because of fraud with the public prosecutor, I was threatened by my banker. They said, if I don't sell, he will learn how -- I will learn how malicious Deutsche Bank can be. This is what he told me. I still live in this ruin because I believe that the justice will be dealt in the last analysis. Mr. Nixtof, he got EUR 10 million to keep quiet about fraud cases. So this is obviously the way to -- this is obviously to deal with this. You have my address and I would finally like to have an honest answer from you.

Thank you very much, [indiscernible]. Thank you very much for your statement. Before we start with answering additional questions, we will now start into last round. For the linkup of speakers, you know the procedure on the list of the remaining speakers are [indiscernible], and however, to be able to structure the further procedure of the AGM. I would like to ask speakers who want to take the floor to do this within the next 15 minutes and after that, I will close the list of speakers. If additional shareholders want to take the floor during the next 15 minutes, we are happy to also put you on the list and ask you to come to the waiting room step by step. But I think we have some more answers, if I'm not mistaken. And Christian Sewing will be starting.

I have one answer. There's a bit of a tactical delay here. Right. Thank you very much, Norbert. I will start with some answers -- giving some answers to questions. Mr. Masa, you asked us for information on business relationships, transparency there. please bear with us that discretion with regard to business relationships has top priority. We are happy to describe the implementation of our guidelines and policies, but not at the level of customer transactions -- individual customer transactions. You will find the answers to your questions in the document that was put on our website under the numbers 143 and 153. And other answer on the question of Mr. Masa, you're asking us for the additional effort that would become necessary through binding rules in the area of ESG controls and sustainability. In our pre-published answer, we refer amongst other things, to the implementation of the EU taxonomy when it comes to collection of data and new data platforms. The effort is created in the framework of our established processes and organization because sustainability as a topic is embedded in that as part of our strategic approach. We do not separately report these costs. An answer on that can be found in our document under ID 149. An additional add-on question by Mr. Masa, you asked about the applicability of sustainability rules for large accounts and the investment business. We welcome reliable rules independent of the group of customers. Even now, our guidelines and principles and policies provide for a due diligence -- a global due diligence when it comes to the investment [indiscernible] of investment banks, the credit for the loan provision of the Corporate Bank and also the lending activities of the private bank when it comes to business clients, the answer can be found in the document on the AGM website under numeral 149. Mr. Masa, you also asked as to whether -- with our clients, we asked about the informed consent given by communities that are affected by measures. Let me tell you this is irrespective of concrete transactions, we are in a constant exchange of information with our clients. ID 161 is the numeral under which you find our original answer to the question. Dear Ms. Pits, you asked us about how we trade customers who do not show any efforts for a credible transition. Over and beyond our answer that was given, we don't have -- I'd like to say that we don't have any general selection criteria, but it's always case-by-case decisions. Our original answers can be found in our document provided on the website under the complex of sustainability policies and financing of fossil fuels. Ms. Pits, you also asked a question on the volatility of Scope 3 emissions in oil, gas and coal mining. We would like to add to the answers already given. Major drivers for the volatility are the following factors that have to be included into the equation, company values, financing of the bank and the shares and information on current and future sustainability reporting of our clients are financing in the area of coal mining are sensitive to, for example, changes of the customer-specific emission factors the bank is providing comprehensive transparency on the measures that are being used and also the impact in its sustainability reporting. Our answers you can find in the document on our website under the heading of sustainability, policy and financing of fossil fuels. Ms. Pits, you're also asking about the possibility for extending loans on sustainable economic activity if a company is expanding in the air fossil fuels. Yes, we do believe it is our responsibility -- part of our responsibility to accompany companies and their transformation. We believe that when it comes to sustainability finance, we assess to use of funds that we provide. This has to have a sustainable purpose and you find the original answer on the numeral number 166. And I hand back to you, Norbert.

Stefan Simon will continue with some answers.

Yes, I do have some answers, and I will start with you, Mr. Gebler. You asked about the number of shareholders that have submitted questions in due time before the meeting, and I can tell you that 48 shareholders submitted questions to us. Then another question also by you, Mr. Gebler, you asked how many shareholders were dialing into the shareholders' portal and peak and how many came from outside of Germany. In total, 378 shareholders locked into the shareholders' portal today, 299 was the peak figure, 290 in Germany, 1 in Austria, 2 from Switzerland, 1 from Luxembourg and 5 from the non-German speaking countries. And Mr. [indiscernible], you asked about the terminology of the implementation measures enforcement measures. This term is in line with what we have described under the complex litigation and cases, and this is in line with the authority measures. So this is a synonym. And the figure here is based on the internal reporting of the bank where we are capturing the number of cases. And then a question by Mr. Gebler. Mr. Gebler asked about the background of the catering costs for last year's AGM amounting to roughly EUR 36,000. And I can tell you that it was not only the catering costs and the day of the AGM itself, but another 10 days approximately for the setup and the dismantling of the equipment needed for the AGM. Norbert, back to you.

Yes. Thank you. Then let's ask for some direction here. Will we now have the next questions? Okay. Then we'll hear the next speakers. And I can now ask [indiscernible] and then again, Daniel Michael Werner. [indiscernible], you have the floor.

Yes. Thank you. Can you all hear me? Yes, very well. Then let me start with myself. My name is Dr. [indiscernible] and I'm a medical doctor in Weinheim, and I have been a customer of Deutsche Bank since 2005, and I have been a shareholder for 1.5 years, and my wife used to work for Deutsche Bank. And the reason why I'm calling in is linking up to what Mr. Schellenberg already mentioned, and this is complaints management. I also have to tell you that I don't like complaints management, and I really ask the Board of Management to make changes here and to deal with this. I know, of course, that many of the requests are about claiming money, and you cannot always be friendly to the user. But if the client has a problem like me. There was just a wrong tax statement because I -- there was a wrong ID about my business. I have always been a private -- that customer, and I always had my accounts as a private customer and I also have a letter by Deutsche Bank. They talk to me as a private customer, so they should be able to help you in order not to have a tax disadvantage. This is what I want to make sure. And what I really experienced with complaints management was really terrible. There were only very few exchanges of letters. And finally, people said, well, they ignored all the documents I presented and they all said, these are still suspicions. And then later on, they said they no longer want to talk to me, everything was settled. And this is something that you could done too with good customers, and I have to ask the Board of Management to change this. Yes, I can't solve my problems myself. I also sent 2 personal letters to Mr. Sewing. I will do it again because the complaints department no longer wants to talk to me, I'm sure that this matter can be solved, but I'm not the only one. I'm also a shareholder and my wife always worked for Deutsche Bank, and she is always passionate about the bank. I don't want to leave Deutsche Bank. I wish bank the best. And I know from the branch offices that all the people are very committed. But then it's not possible to have a complaints management that are so unfriendly when it comes to the request by the customers. This was one point. And now I will -- it was about the tax statement. I always got the normal tax statements, but as I am not a tax and finance expert, I did not see that in these statements there were different versions. I simply didn't know. I'm not an expert in this matter. And this is something that was written to me. This has changed in 2009. In 2008, there had been question to the customers and those who have not responded as a private client, they were reclassified. And I didn't get this letter, and I only got my account, and it was very clearly said that I'm a private investor. In 2014, as I said, I got a letter by Deutsche Bank writing to me as a private investor about [indiscernible] tax. And then when I wanted to sell a few shares because I bought mobile home, then I, of course, wanted to avoid the taxation of my profits. So I sold shares where I made losses and where I made profit, and I more or less was breaking even. But before I did this, I asked or I informed my adviser at Deutsche Bank in Weinheim and ask her for advice. She couldn't give me any advice, but she knew what I was planning. And I was not really angry -- or I first was angry because I thought she was giving me the wrong advice but now she also thought of me as a private investor. She did not know that I was reclassified. And this is another point. You just have to make sure that this -- the classification is transparent to the customer. We always get customer reporting and all the different letters, you can just mention this, because it has become more and more important. In the past, it was not a problem, then you just send all your capital income reports with your cap attachment. But now with the tax office needs information that if there is a mistake, you will have trouble. So I just want to get a correct statement. And in October, I -- in time before I sold the shares, I asked my adviser in the branch office. And there, she should have noticed that there is a wrong classification. And then you can just send me the necessary documentation and change the mistake made earlier. That's what I wanted to say. And then I also have to say that I like the development of Deutsche Bank in recent times. When Mr. Sewing took over, my wife said, finally, it's the right person at the helm of Deutsche Bank. I also support her here. I found his presentation very convincing. Of course, one man cannot do it all, but perhaps it helps you that in the areas of complaints management and customer classification, you change things. This doesn't require a lot of steps, and it doesn't cost a lot of money. Thank you for your attention.

Thank you very much, Mr. [indiscernible]. We listen to you very attentively and the next speaker will now be [indiscernible] and Daniel Michael Werner. [indiscernible], you have the floor.

Thank you. Now I have an error message. Can you hear me? My name is [indiscernible]. And ladies and gentlemen, dear members of the Board of Management, dear members of the Supervisory Board, dear press representatives, dear shareholders, dear employees and dear investors. It is a great pleasure and an honor for me to be here today, and I wish all the people here, a lot of success and luck. It is now a pleasure to talk to you today. My name is [indiscernible] and I was born in Frankfurt, and I love to be in Frankfurt. I first of all would like to congratulate for your excellent profit in the year 2023 and the excellent first quarter result for the year 2024 including the WS. Well, you already explained this in detail, Mr. Sewing and Mr. James von Moltke. Well, on my person, I was a granddaughter of [indiscernible], and also of the company, my grandparents used to work for Commerzbank in the credit department and one of my grandmothers was also working in the stock exchange. My own training was done in Deutsche Bank, New York and later on at Deutsche Bank, Frankfurt. My early passion for money and everything around it, savings account, savings book was because I spend -- accompanied my grandfather to the Commerzbank, but it was also thanks due to all my interest in investments and hard assets. And especially in times of these, this is still very important. Now we see so many crisis, the wars in the Ukraine, the attack on the state of Israel in October of 2023 and the worldwide situation that we are facing right now. Of course, this has an influence on the capital markets and also on the gold price, which is quite high because this is a safe haven for investors in addition to real estate and to diversify the portfolio. And I accept this with gratitude that we are living in peace, at least in Europe. And with gratitude and with joy, I also see that we are striving for -- that we can still strive for our good life. And I have 2 questions, a specific one and one more general one. Mr. Christian Sewing, I have the pleasure and honor to meet you at the end of last November at the European Banking Congress. And I would like to now ask a specific question to you as a customer of Deutsche Bank and especially of Deutsche Bank Rossmarkt 18. And I know that for the data security reasons, this is sometimes different, but the Deutsche Bank at Rossmarkt 18 is one of the few flagship brands, which offers a safe deposit and tons -- and now I know whether -- I want to know whether a member of the Board of Management, in addition to the communication with internal bodies in exchange with these bodies with a Board of Management -- a member of the Board of Management have ever gone to the flagship brand in order to have an exchange with the employees and the customers on site. My father, who has already died, but he was Quality Assurance Manager for [indiscernible] and he also had his own management consulting, and he always said that it's important to have good communication. The best communication is always to have both parties communicating and having a proper dialogue. So it's a 2-way communication that he always focused on. So my question now to Mr. Sewing or to Mr. de Sanctis or whoever is responsible, dear Mr. James von Moltke as the Vice Chairman of the Board of Management and the Chief Financial Officer, has any one of you ever went to the flagship branch at Rossmarkt? As it used to be done by Mr. Jurgen Fitschen, and I would like to know when you went there with date and time? And if not, do you plan to go there quite soon and to have a good exchange with your very best resources, your employees and the customers and to deepen the dialogue? And now the general questions, the closure of branch offices. And this is something that I discussed last year in June, on the 30th of June with representative of the Board of Management of Commerzbank. And now I will quote him. He said that "from a European perspective, the bank branches in the Federal Republic of Germany are quite numerous". We also discussed it with the [indiscernible] Minister of the Interior and several politicians in Frankfurt in the city council. And there were a lot of discussions because -- well, in the past, we had many branches of banks. It was always around the corner, but now it's getting difficult to find the branches of Deutsche Bank, and this is happening at the national level, and this is a big challenge. And Mr. Sewing, you mentioned The Global Hausbank bank, and the services have to be provided and you also have to make sure that there is enough cash available. How do you want to guarantee this over and beyond the general group strategy in view of the changes in the capital markets, also knowing the difficult background conditions and the problems with the ECB license still make it difficult to achieve your goals, but also knowing that the 4 core business areas and your committed performance orientated employees are here for us 365 days a year? And of course, there is some criticism regarding complaints management and consulting, but I know Deutsche Bank from my time at Deutsche Bank and I really know that the employees are doing their very best every single day in order to provide answers quickly to the customers, and I trust that this will also happen in the future. So this was about cash. Currency and the capital markets are still difficult. And regarding the passion and the commitment of all the employees, I'm deeply convinced of the fact that this will be ensured for the future as well. I am now looking forward to your answers. The Global Hausbank, of course, acts with -- in a good manner to reach its goals, and I wish you the best for 2024 and 2025, but I would like to get answers to my specific and my general question. And I would like to thank you very much for your time.

Thank you very much, [ Mrs. Stahl ] Then we now have Karl-Walter Freitag from the Riebeck-Brauerei, followed by [ Daniel Michael Werner ] and [ Matthias Gabler ]. Mr. Freitag, you have the floor.

My name is Karl-Walter.

Oh, I'm sorry, Karl-Walter Freitag, I'm sorry.

Let me start by focusing on the quality of the written answers to the pre-submitted questions. I could have saved that effort because all of the questions, I submitted and the companies that I represent submitted have either not been answered, have only incompletely been answered, have been wrongly answered, or have been answered in somewhat disguising manner. And that is why I'm asking you or I'm asking the notary public to ensure that all questions that I have submitted in my own behalf and on behalf of the shareholders I represent, be taken into the minutes plus the relevant answers. [Technical Difficulty]

Okay. So please make sure that everything will be noted down in minutes. I was actually making sure and trying to do my best to ask Mr. Freitag, unfortunately, we can't see you any longer. Can you perhaps redial in, maybe leave...

Can you hear me?

Yes, but we cannot hear you very well. The sound quality is very poor. So we may have to redial.

Okay. In that case, I will briefly leave the session and redial in. Perhaps another speaker can go first and then...

Yes, okay, that's what we'll do. And we'll take you afterwards.