Ferretti S.p.A. (YACHT) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Good afternoon, everyone, and welcome to Ferretti Group 2025 Preliminary Results Webinar. Thank you all for joining us. We appreciate your time and interest in Ferretti Group as we share an overview of our performance over the past year and discuss the outlook for the future. Before we begin, let me introduce our speakers. Mr. Alberto Galassi, our Chief Executive Officer; Mr. Marco Zammarchi, our Chief Financial Officer; and myself, Head of Investor Relations and Sustainability. Today's agenda will cover key highlights from 2025, business dynamics, financial results and final remarks, followed by a Q&A session. [Operator Instructions] With that, let me hand it over to Mr. Galassi. Mr. Galassi, the floor is yours.

Thank you so much. Good afternoon, everybody. Jarigo. I'm very pleased, honestly, very, very pleased to confirm that Ferretti Group fully achieved the guidance across all metrics. And we are presenting today to our investors, to our supporters, to our stakeholders, the highest level of revenues and margins ever since this management took the responsibility of managing this company in 2014. Adjusted EBITDA grew by 6.7% versus last year. And EBITDA -- adjusted EBITDA margin 30 basis points. So we are at 16.5% from 16.2% of last year. Revenues grew new boats without pre-owned of 5%. By the way, we will have a look slightly after, and you will see that the market did not grow at all, 5%, EUR 1.232 billion versus EUR 1,173 billion. And the order backlog, which I'm very proud to say is an incredible number is EUR 1.76 billion, 3.1% versus previous year. Now let's have a general look on how the year started. We do some selected boat shows. We don't limit our participation on only the most important ones. But there are 2 boat shows that give us a flavor on how the year is beginning, the start of 2026, there is Dusseldorf boat Show and Miami boat show. So high-quality level of clients and our profile. So we had less visitors, but we had more visitors with quality that do own a boat. So the interest of visitors that do own a boat in Miami was plus 16%. So boat owners coming to see us. And in Dusseldorf, it was 2% higher than the previous year. So it's an interesting figure because it tells that selected owners, which have a real interest and potential real prospects are coming to see what's new in the market. Now as I said before, Ferretti Group grew by 5%, but the market did not. This is Phil Draper Associates as an external provider of data based on the third quarter 2025 and on the full year 2025 estimates is telling us that despite the growth in the market has been, I would say, often and stable from '21 to '24, it has been always a buyer digit. In '25, it decreased by 3.1%. This digit is driven by -- the measure is the value of production. So from EUR 7.2 billion of 2024 to EUR 7 billion of 2025. Ferretti Group, as I said before, outperformed because we grew 5% in '25 versus '24. Have a look though on how the market changed in '25 versus '24. The gray line is describing the boats above 30 meters, what we call high end -- what we call made-to-measure in Ferretti Group. And the other one is describing the boats below 30 meters. So you've seen that the market decreased in the small segment. There's been an increase that basically nearly neutralized the decrease. The decrease on the made-to-measure nearly neutralize the decrease on the other segments. But there is a message here. The message here, you have to compete and you have to play in the arena where the wealth is, where the customers are, where the customers are less impacted by whatever happens in the war. And we didn't miss anything. We had 2, 3 wars, 1 pandemic and the tariffs in and out. So the message is if you're well positioned and we go to see what our competitors do, and let's benchmark a little bit, there is no problem at all. So Ferretti Group is #1 in the most profitable segments. But the most important digit is we have in the global market, value production from 30 feet up to 100 feet in fiberglass and carbon fiber. This data excludes Super yacht. It could be dramatically misleading, of course, a super yacht in this. We have 16.8%, plus 2.3%. Azimut-Benetti decreased 0.3%, Sanlorenzo increased 0.9%, the British shippers are suffering a lot. Sun Princess is decreasing 0.7%; Sunseeker 1.8%. Now where do we want to be leader? We want to be leader in the most profitable segments. Okay. We have everything that flows from 9 meters to 95. So we are also in the segment from 30 to 60 feet. But we don't want to be #1 in that segment. To be #1 in that segment, there's no money there. Let's be honest. It's entry level. It's interesting when you attract customers and prospects. You want to be there only if you have the best brands in the world, which according to the market is Riva and Wally, where you can sell a 30-footer for EUR 1 million. You can sell a 38-footer for EUR 1.5 million. This is where we want to be. And by definition, by design, we don't want to be the top player there. Still, in the other segment from 60 to 80 foot -- feet, we are #1 exactly with Azimut-Benetti with 12.9% of the market. The source is still the same. I mean, it's not our data. And where do we are very proud that we are leaders in the high composite yachts from 80% to 99. We have 27.1% there and 22.8% in the made-to-measure, which is from 100 feet above. Now I'm very proud to show you one slide, which makes us the biggest differentiator between Ferretti Group and all the other competitors. As you can see, we have -- where we're catering our sales. So repeating clients repetitive clients in 2024, they were 44% of our clients. Now in 2025, the repetitive clients are 49%, but the most important data is that among between the 49% of repetitive clients, 47%, so nearly half of the 49% are cross-selling across brands. They buy from one brand from Ferretti to Riva, from Pershing to Custom Lime or they may have more than one boat. Why I want to highlight this that makes us unique. First of all, because the number is growing from 4%, 40%, 49%, 49% of our sales, we basket, we fish in our, I would say, own lake. And that's -- nobody else has it. The other clients, as you can see in the gray, are coming from competitors. We attracted more clients than the previous year from the competition. 27% of our clients in 2025 are coming from the competitors. And there is a data which is diminishing. New clients, first owners. Why? Because the market of the small boats diminished because the market of the newcomers is diminished. I mean if you have the problem of the tariffs, if you have the problem of the war, if you're worried about your own business, are you really thinking to change a boat and enter into the entry-level segment? No, we have to have our clients and proudly, I can say that 47%, they buy from Ferretti Group cross-selling and 49% they come and stay in the group, but because we do know that our clients are the ones which are less affected than all by whatever changes in the world as we speak. We kept investing. We kept launching models. We kept renewing the fleet. We splashed 13 new models. Now anytime you see Super next to Riva, it means there's an evolution, a face lifting an update, a mid-life update of the program. We presented the Riva Iseo Super, 1 unit sold. We presented the Dolcevita Super after more than 30 Dolcevita, which is a 33 meters boat. We sold 9 units of its restyling, the Dolcevita Super. Aquariva, I don't know how many boats, maybe 300 nearly Aquariva were done, the special version, 17 units on the market. Okay, let me repeat, this is a boat about EUR 1 million and is a 33-footer. Riva 58 Capri, very proud of telling you that the Super Yacht division is doing very well with 54 Riva, 54 meters. We sold 4 units, price tag above EUR 30 million. And then we did another limited edition. Riva is the only brand that can afford to do a limited edition, a special edition Riva. The Cento celebrated the 100 units of the 38, which is the derivative boat. We sold 11 units up to today. Today, the Board approved the sale of the last one, the 12 unit. So the entire production is gone. It's a EUR 1.5 million boat, very, very unique for a 38-footer. We also started the relaunching of the new ITAA fleet. It's a brand that has been hidden and in a niche of the niche for too many years. The new 54 is in the market. We sold 4 units. The GTX70, the entry level of the sport utility yacht, what we call the SUY of Pershing, it's coming with 4 units sold, very brand-new successful Ferretti 720 and Ferretti 940, more than 27 meters boat. We sold 10 units, 3800, 24 meters boat, we sold 12 units. Also in the Super yacht divisions, we went very well splashing and delivering successfully AMOR À VIDA, a 67-meter boat in steel aluminum. And we enter into what Ferretti calls the Corse Clienti.. The race is the competition for the clients with the brand Wally. We had the wallyrocket, and now we have the wallyrocket expansion, which is the 71-footer with 1 unit sold. What's going to happen in 2025, we announced 2 projects that will be splashed this year in '26's the new range of the Custom line. Custom line, let me remind you, is the made-to-measure brand for excellence. It's built in Ancona , more than 19 splashes every year, average price tag, EUR 15 million, EUR 16 million, EUR 18 million. So the new line site, which means Lightning in Italiano, is the planning yacht, the brand-new 128, we sold 2 units. And the Custom line Navetta 35, which is a smaller sister ship of the Navetta 38 with more than 8 units sold with 2 units sold of the Navetta 35s a EUR 15 million ship. The financial results are super solid, as we said. Margherita, you want to do it? Or do you want me to...

No, no. Thank you, Mr. Galassi. So let's start with order backlog. Order backlog increased double digit from September to December, EUR 14.5 billion and the net backlog increased from last year. This outstanding result reflects the order intake, especially in the Made-to-measure that we will see in a few minutes. Also, the backlog -- the net backlog this year provides greater visibility over 2026 revenues compared to last year. Last year, we had EUR 534 million in 2025, whereas this year, we have EUR 613 million in 2026. This also reflects the mix with many super yachts taken last year and Made-to-measure. Also, we collected 1.137 orders corresponding to 214 units while we delivered EUR 225 million. This demonstrates once again, we are shifting towards larger-sized models. Also, the average ticket increase from last year, moving from EUR 4.6 million 2024 to EUR 5.1 million in 2025. If we look at the order intake, the order intake has been in line with last year. Despite the lack of super yacht, we only took 2 super yachts branded in 2025 compared to the 5 super yacht of last year. So this is a really outstanding results, and it's all thanks to the made-to-measure and the large composite. If we look at the order intake per quarter, you can see that the second quarter, if you recall, has been tough because of the tariff and the war in the Middle East. The clients were distracted. April was a very bad month. And then the second half of the year was a lot better, clients coming back, more confident, and we had a very good season in the Mediterranean as well as in the U.S. The book-to-bill remains above 1. And if we include the composite, it is just below 1. As of today, we still have a very high level of negotiation, including Super yacht, it's EUR 580 million, so higher than what we had in the last quarter. If we look at the order intake per segment, again, you can see the excellent product mix, the explosion of the made-to-measure, plus 47%. And if you look at the result quarter-on-quarter, you can see it's plus 98%. So this is all thanks to the strategy to the new models that we've been launching year after year into this segment that finally is giving its results. We also had a good performance of the composite yacht with more than half of the models coming from units above 80. Super yacht, as I mentioned before, this year, we sold 2 branded super yacht, while last year, we sold 3 branded super yacht and 2 bespoke. This is again demonstrates that our business model that is based on 3 segments on an offer that goes from 8 meters to 95 is the winner because you cannot predict exactly when you will sell a super yacht. It's more volatile than other kind of yacht. And so this year that we had only 2 super yachts, still, we were able to keep the same level of the order intake as last year.

Let me highlight something here, if I may. The business model that is driven by having 7 brands, none of them overlapping with each other, gives us a super strength. I remember when we listed first, one competitor, which we respect was saying that the power of having one single brand and focus on a single brand is more important than having more brands. I would say the market is telling exactly the opposite. Because clients are different, generations are different, taste is different. Continents and kind of usage of boats are different. You can't have the same brand and you cannot label all different kind of products with the same brand because you lose the identity of one brand, you need to have a differentiator. Of course, it's complicated, avoiding the overlapping implies different designers, different architects, different sales force, different sales network, but it's paying off absolutely. And I'm pleased to see that also our competitors are adding brands to the group because otherwise, there is no chance. We would have lost many sales if we had only one brand. The second message I'm giving to the audience is big doesn't mean you're safe. I mean, super yacht only, there's been another company which we do not consider a competitor, who has been saying that we play in a different arena. We play super big, we play super yacht, and we are basically immune by anything that happens in the world. Our recent news that we read that is not true. It depends on how you work, how you position yourself, how you calculate your cost, how you calculate your margin, how disciplined you are in the managing of the company? And how do you position your product? You know many times, we should have had maybe 3, 4 super yachts sold this year if we just accepted terms and conditions, which were totally unacceptable for the profitability and for the profitability range of this company, maybe 3. I would say easily, Marco, 3. We left the conversation. We said, "Goodbye, arrivederci. We don’t need your money. We don’t need your cash. We don't -- we are not here to sell discounts. We are here to sell ships. So Ferretti Group has a unique capacity of selling only with the profitability, not selling below cost. No need to sell to survive, no debt. And more important, we are in any possible country, 70 countries with many different products, many different brands to attract a completely different but extremely loyal client. Sorry, Margherita, if I interrupted you.

Thank you. So let's have a look at the order intake by geography. You can see we have a good performance in Europe. Middle East was affected again by Super Yacht. Last year, we had 3 Super Yachts only from this region. So that's the main difference. And the Americas performed very well. And again, if you think about Americas last year, we had a Super Yacht, which we didn't have this year. And still, we increased plus 22% by a mix of made-to-measure and large composite. So now I'll hand the microphone over to Mr. Zammarchi for the revenues.

Good afternoon, everybody. Revenues, we increased, as we said, 5% versus prior year. The major contribution to this growth was provided by the backlog and namely by the super yacht the super yacht and the Made-to-Measure that we were able to more than compensate the shortfall of the composite yacht. On the other hand, have you seen previously that the order of composite yach continue to grow. So we'll provide additional revenues in 2026. As we said, a growth of 5%. And on top of that, additional EUR 50 million were provided by the sales of preowned business that for us is a marketing tool, and it's good to provide additional sales. In terms of profitability, instead, we were able to grant a continuous growth of 30 basis points. And this happened in an environment not so easy because of the price -- the pressure on pricing generated by some competitors, especially on the composite segment. But thanks to the product mix, so more focus on made-to-measure and branded super yacht, coupled with a very careful cost discipline, we were able to continue to grow. And what make us happy is that we see this trend following also for 2026. In terms of CapEx, instead, we were aligned with guidance to be closer to EUR 90 million. What we'd like to highlight is 2 points. First of all, that more than 50% of the CapEx were devoted to R&D. So to launch a new model into the market or to restyle -- make restyling of some existing model because this is outcome of the best boost that we have in our company. And the second one, it was to complete the increase of production capacity. Now Ravenna Plant has been completed, almost completed. And the overall utilization of our shipyard is 76.5%. And so that means, in other words, that for the next 3 years, I mean, the next 3, 4 years, we -- to continue to grow our company doesn't need a significant cash requirement. So in terms of net financial position, as planned, we are -- we closed the year over EUR 100 million of net financial position, to be precise, EUR 111 million. This factor was supported by the American seasonal deliveries and also thanks to the collection of advanced payment of the good order intake of the last quarter. As a fact, also the net working capital ratio was decreased to 13.1%, not very closer to the target that we have in mind to be 12.5%, but I believe we are in a good pace to be achieved in 2026. So Mr. Galassi, I believe the final remarks is to you.

Thank you very much. Okay. What is the picture that we have in front of us that we had in 2025? Let's spend a few words on '25, and then let me give you a flavor of the first 2 months of '26. First of all, client trust remained with Ferretti Group, its effect. If you -- otherwise, you don't have 49% of sales coming from recurring customers. Two, after a second quarter, which was very low, I think we were below EUR 200 million, I think it was EUR 196 million of revenues. If you consider that, that number has been overtaken by 2x in the second and the third -- in the third and the fourth quarter, you understand the superpower of the biggest enemy that we have in Ferretti Group, which is uncertainty. The message that we are reading here is the clients were in love with us. The clients' attention has been diverted by top priorities, which we too fully understand, no matter which kind of business you are in, driven by the tariffs application and how the entity and the size and the magnitude of it, everybody in the world was affected, no matter if you sell in 70 countries or in 2, no matter which kind of business you're in, you are affected. Your attention is diverted. But once we manage and we live and we cope, we find a way of understanding that it's manageable. There's going to be still life in the planet after the applications of the tariffs. Well, the clients came back. They didn't go everywhere. They came back in Ferretti Group. They came back in one other competitor that we have, respectfully, but they didn't go everywhere else. So the market is a little bit shrinking, yes, on absolute numbers. The market is very selective. Absolutely, yes. Money, one day wisdom Warren Buffett told me, Money, Alberto, don't forget, Money has fear. And they don't fear to invest in Ferretti Group their money because they know we will deliver their boats on time with the best possible quality and the best possible brands in the world. Now what is the feeling in 2026? America super well. The beginning of January was very, very good. Dusseldorf, some good signals. Middle East, extremely well. And finally, and luckily, we didn't spend much on the weakness that we had in 2024 and 2025. We had the weakness, which was Asia Pacific. I cannot accept personally that Asia Pacific is representing a fraction of our revenues and a fraction of our order intake, considering the amount of wealth, which is in Asia Pacific. We know that Asia Pacific is mainly driven by Greater China, but we have to understand and consider there are some other countries which are Indonesia, Malaysia, Singapore, Thailand, New Zealand, Australia, Japan, Korea, Taiwan, that can support. So I think Ferretti Group will make important investments over there. We do believe there's room for improvement. And we are feeling as we speak, there is room for improvement and some improvement coming from there. Back to United States, we had a very good start. Now tariffs are still the headline of the breaking news. We were used to 15% of tariffs if somebody wants to ask because it's always been 15% actually, in our case, it's 16.5%. So it's not changing for us, but still attention is going to be diverted. As attention is going to be averted, what's happen whatever happens in Mexico for the United States and American market. So this is what is the flavor I'm giving you as an optimistic flavor, positive flavor in a shrinking market unless you are well positioned, well brand and you feel you are considered a safe harbor for the investors -- and sorry, for the owners and the clients to invest, buying their boat buying your boats. The presence is the most profitable segment. When you have 54% of full year '25 order intake, which are coming from the made-to-measure segment from 30 meters to 45 meters in fiberglass, well, the strategy of the CapEx cycle is absolutely paying off. So this is the bread and butter for this company. And last year, it was 36% only. And if you consider also the over 50% of the new orders in the composite segment in general are coming from yachts, which are larger than 80 feet, so larger than 24 meters is a strong signal that our strategy is well planned and extremely well executed. The business model is unique. As I said, we have a wide offer, a completely different brand identity. We have 7 brands not overlapping. We attract clients which are 19 years old, young pop star, idles to top entrepreneurs, royal families in all over the world. And this is a super strength of Ferretti Group. Let me also remind you as a final important message for the investors. I mean, there's been a constant growth in Ferretti Group since this management team, myself, Marco, some others are still with us, Giordano Pellacani, some others left. We started all this in 2014. And in 2025, we can tell you that from EUR 281 million of revenues, the company is EUR 1.23 billion of revenues with a market cap today, and I'm proud finally realizing that the market is appreciating our effort and the beauty of this group around EUR 1.3 billion. So -- but the growth is not -- this message is not here to say, okay, you were bra, you were executed, you are disciplined. No. The message is look at the positioning operating group in the market above 80 feet. We had only 13%, and now we have 25%. And below 80 feet, we had 5%, and now we are 9%. We grow where it's important to grow. One more thing, very important, this has been done only organic. There's not been any acquisition apart from the brand Wally. There was just the brand. There was no facility. There was no market, no contracts. We just started in 2019 with the brand Wally, and this is where the group is. Now if you ask me for the future, well, do I see this going this way? Well, I think the group, it's really, really urgent time for M&A because this group will grow with M&A. Now there are incredible opportunities. Now the market is reasonable. Now the prices are back to planet earth. I think it's the year 2026 for acquisition and growing not only organically. So there's a lot of work to be done still to provide satisfaction and to provide value to the investors and shareholders. Thank you very much.

Thank you for listening. We reached the Q&A session. [Operator Instructions] The first question is from Emanuele Gallazzi from Equita.

I have 2. The first one is on the boat show already held in the first quarter. You have already provided some color, but can you just discuss a little bit more about client engagement and whether you have seen any change in buyer behavior compared to last year? And in addition, if you can provide some details about the order intake in January and February, so for this beginning of the year. The second question is on the governance. Clearly, full year '25 results mark another step in the transformation journey that you have started over a decade ago. But with the upcoming renewal of the Board of Directors, should we look at this phase as a, let's say, a continuation of the current strategy? Or will this represent the beginning of a new chapter for Ferretti?

Okay. On the first one, the boat shows, as I said before, less people, less curiosity, more potential prospects. United States, America went very, very well, 16% boat owners plus more than previous year and important contracts that we signed also important boats. Dusseldorf was more stable, but we signed contracts there. Now I don't know whether I can disclose or not the numbers of the contracts in January and February. I can tell you, January is very, very happy. February, I was very happy. Then there is, again, another -- the word that is sort of a nightmare, like a sword on my head, tariffs again. Now one client called us yesterday and he said, what if -- why should I buy a boat from you today with 15% tariffs? If tomorrow -- and I have the Chief Commercial Officer next to me, Giordano Pellacani there because he just reported that it's true. If tomorrow, there's no tariffs at all, why should I give up a 15% discount? Now think about the automotive business for a second. From 10%, if I'm not mistaken, they go to 15%. who's going to take care of the extra 5%. So again, we're going to lose a week before we understand, we don't understand what's going on. I don't think it's going to change much. For us, 15% is 15%. But if I have to give you the flavor, anything, anything that implies what is going to happen to my value, to my contract, to my final price is going to delay the process. So what I'm expecting as we speak, I'm expecting the month of February to be delayed by decision-making process by what's going to happen in the next 1, 2, 3 weeks. So to answer properly to your question, January was very good. February was in line with our expectations. The second half of February, the last week of February, if I'm not -- I don't -- and I want to be optimistic, hopefully, to have a final solution at the beginning of March, will be, for sure, impacted, especially for the U.S. market, by which kind of tariffs am I going to pay? Why should I pay if I can avoid to pay. This is basically -- we're talking about millions euro. Don't forget, Ferretti average price tag is EUR 6.1 million, excluding Super yacht. So it's a serious digit that clients, and I do fully understand are asking lawyers, what should I do? What do you recommend me to do? So the process takes a little bit longer. The rest of the world, especially Middle East, is going very, very well. As I said, there's a little bit of life back. Asia Pacific was ridiculous, EUR 24 million of order intake in 2025. I mean, Italy only is around EUR 100 million. So unacceptable. So that has to change and will change. And as we speak, there's a board shows season there, it's changing. Back on the governance. Well, we all know, we call it in Italiano, the Pulcinella secret, the secret that everybody knows. The expiration of the entire Board of Directors will be with the shareholders' meeting of May 14, 2026. Well, there's a lot of things to do in this company. There's a lot of room to go and create better value. We, as management, are available, of course, but the decision has to be taken by the shareholders' meeting. And don't forget, whatever decision the shareholders' meeting takes is fully respected. So we did an incredible journey. It's been fantastic. Are we ready to do another journey? The answer is, obviously, yes, who's going to leave this company. Unless you're insane, you don't leave this company. If you leave this company, you leave the industry and you go elsewhere. But it's a decision that the shareholders' meeting has to take.

The second question is from Adrien Duverger from Goldman Sachs.

Maybe one to start that's a bit more big picture. So in 2025, we saw that the composite market suffered a bit much -- a bit more than the made-to-measure. Do you think this is a trend that we can expect to continue? Or do you think this was more a one-off due, for example, to the consequence of the impact of tariffs or were there some delays? And a follow-up on this one is, do you expect the your competitors to keep pushing discounts and incentives for clients? And what do you expect for the future of this industry, let's say, in the next 3 to 5 years? Then my second question would be on the EBITDA margin. Marco, if you could please help us explain the improvements that enabled you to improve the EBITDA margin to the level you reached this year and what we can expect for 2026, let's say, if we keep FX and tariffs in line with the current levels? And then the final question would just be on the impact of pricing for 2026.

Thank you. On the first question on composite, I can assure you 100%, the trend will remain the same, if not worse. We see obscure brands, Zombies company that restarted during the big moment after COVID, bringing into the market model, there is no chance, in my opinion. I'm very straightforward. I don't think there is a chance for any improvement unless you have a top brand, unless you play in the niche, unless you can differentiate yourself versus the competitors. Because I remember when I was starting in the United States, I was not a very good student, but I remember very well when I was driving on the 405, an ad they used to say for a sort of a McDonald's equivalent, a tremendous savings. The tremendous savings was basically saving a couple of cents on $1 in hamburger. This is what's happening. I mean, we -- every single day since a couple of years, it’s not [indiscernible] to the start today. Our sales force, our dealer network meets a client that says, listen, I have an offer with 35% discount to me. I have an offer with 21%, 25% discount from me. I have an offer. And we say, okay, but I will take it. And if you think apples and apples and pears are the same, do it. We don't sell discounts. The secret is limited numbers of boats. The secret is limited number of boats divided by different kind of boats divided by 7 brands. We don't have to grow by volume. Otherwise, we are going to die. We have to grow by products which are selected ideally with a waiting list, different than others and honestly, nicer and better than others. Will it cost us more to manufacture? Will it cost us more to promote them? Will we promote them the same way or differently? We are trying to do this since 14 years. So am I expecting any better if I am an obscure composite manufacturer or not very spread out or very long? No, 0. Zero chance. The other part of the question was -- so thank God, we have made-to-measure. That's why we're investing. That's why you've seen in the presentation, we are splashing the custom line new series, new range.

About EBITDA margin, okay, this year, we -- as I said, we experienced an increase of 30 basis points despite the pressure on pricing on composite segment. What we expect for next year is maybe it's too early to provide a guidance, but we have in mind what could happen in 2026. First of all, give a glance to the backlog and the backlog is represented mostly by the made-to-measure that we know that is a very interesting contribution margin. So we expect a growth on this from this point. On top of that, we already made some effort in cost discipline in the second half of 2025, and we believe we'll continue to work on this direction also in 2026. And why? Because we believe that the pressure on pricing, especially in the first half of this year will continue. I don't know for how many months more. Maybe some competitors should give up on this kind of policies, but we are ready to face it. So we believe that also 2026 will continue to grow to achieve in the midterm, as we said, our midterm targets.

And just on the -- on what you expect for pricing in 2026?

In terms of pricing, we continue to -- usually, we revise the prices every 6 months, and we'll continue to revise it, taking into consideration what the other competitors are doing and also the inflation. So we believe that as an average, our pricing will be increased between 2% and 3% depending on the model, the success of the model, the life of every model and so on. But generally speaking, this is what we expect.

Don't forget that both is made of lists and options. So also on the options is very important. It was a big contribution from the options.

This is a good point that I forgot to mention. In fact, we also expect additional contribution on our margin provided by the optional because now they are representing more than 25% of the final prices and the margin with -- associated to the optional is significantly better than the standard board.

So bespoke, personalization, differentiating from one board to the other, this is what the market is looking for.

The next question is from Natasha Brilliant from UBS.

Three questions from me. The first one is on M&A. So you mentioned that, that's very important for you. Can you tell us a bit more about the pipeline, the type of assets that you're looking for? I think at Q3, you said you were looking at 2 targets. So any update there would be helpful. Second question on Asia Pacific. You highlighted the potential and you're starting to see some improvements. Can you just give us a bit more color on how you're addressing that, the investments that you're making, any changes that you're making there and when you expect to see a meaningful improvement? And then my last question is just on Super yachts and whether you have any visibility on orders in the coming quarters based on your current conversations?

On M&A, that looks -- I sound like a prophet, an old prophet, which is speaking in the desert because since we listed, we had opportunities which were simply too expensive. our evaluation in terms of EBITDA was very low in the market -- in the stock exchange market and the companies that with the targets that we were looking, they were extremely more expensive than us without being as profitable or as interested or as strategic as us. So that was banned by rational. We didn't acquire jointly with a competitor the assets of Perini Navi because Perini Navi assets from the bankruptcy were way too expensive for us jointly and collectively and still some other people bought it for an incredible price. So you have to be disciplined. You have to be rational. You have to be it's like owning a football club. You can't be a supporter. You can't be a tifoso because if you think and you manage like a supporter where you end up with the books in court. So you have to be very disciplined in this. Now what we do see is opportunities. There's definitely one we are looking after for more than, I would say, 6, 7 months, which potentially the new Board of Directors I'm expecting will address. Don't forget, there's going to be a new Board of Directors, so the strategy may completely change or remain the same in 2026. And we are still focused on 2 things: the services and acquisition of something strategic, which is compliant to what we are missing or something strategic, which helps us to grow where is the most profitable area of the company. The third question on Asia Pacific. There's been an interesting season of boat shows from Thailand to Sanya, if I'm not mistaken, recently. And there is a lot, a lot, a lot of different feeling and mood, the mood that drives the emotional sale of a boat. And so we have interesting points. What is the company doing? We are investing more in Asia Pacific than we did the past 2 years, both with the presence and most likely, don't forget, we have a dealer network that is going to change in the summer of 2026. And I'm expecting that not the same dealer network in Asia Pacific will represent Ferretti Group in the future with the of new dealers.

Okay. And just the last question on whether you're expecting any Super Yacht orders in the very near term based on current conversations?

If you want to sell a superyacht, we have 3 superyachts under negotiation today. The team is negotiating them since months. A super yacht sale is not an easy thing, but you need to be very disciplined there as well. You need to be consistent with what is the marginality that you expect with the delivery date and the contracts are very complex. So positive. Yes. What's happening in superyacht environment with the recent breaking news is not helping the Italian industry to be considered reliable. But again, there's always a differentiator between A and B and C. So there are 2, 3 port and shippers in Italy, which are completely reliable and they can easily compete, and I'm not referring only to Ferretti, they can easily compete with Northern Europe. And sometimes we are better with Northern Europe with a better value for money. So very confident, absolutely. But again, it's better to leave the negotiation instead of selling with below cost with a reduced margin.

Yes. In fact, if I may, as Alberto mentioned, we are we have a lot of negotiation in place. But we -- because we are not in a hurry, for sure, we have to increase our order backlog, but we are interested to get -- to achieve order that grant marginality the one that all the investors are waiting for. So we believe we are quite confident to close some deals, but only when -- if and when the marginality is granted.

And don't underestimate delivery time. We are talking about delivery 2030. So next [indiscernible] slot between 2029 and 2030 because the sheds are completely full.

There are no more questions. So thank you, everybody, for listening, and have a good day.

Thank you very much. Have a good day.

Thank you. Bye.