Ford Motor Company (F) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Good morning, everyone, and welcome to the third company on track 1 of our Global Automotive Mobility Tech Conference. Very pleased to welcome Ted Cannis of Ford. Ted leads the Ford Pro business, otherwise known as their commercial -- not just vehicle but vehicle and software and services business.

I want to kick off, Ted, for those listening who aren't as familiar with your -- with Ford Pro or the commercial vehicle business, can you lay out the pillars of the Ford Pro vision?

Yes, absolutely. So it's a stand-alone company within Ford, global, focused on both internal combustion and battery electric businesses to create integrated end-to-end solutions, digital and hardware around the world. That includes Ford Pro vehicles, ICE and battery electric that includes end-to-end charging solutions for public and depot charging along with the e-telematics because, really, the electric vehicles only work really well in a great environment if you add that all together. It includes our service elite operations, our capabilities to manage uptime for our company -- customers, improve productivity with a global service footprint, including mobile vans. And it includes our FinSimple operations and our Ford Pro Intelligence, FinSimple being financing for small and medium business in the commercial space. And our Ford Pro Intelligence connect to software solutions linked to modems and others' multi-make and Ford.

Okay. And you've recently assembled a leadership team that includes a number of people outside of Ford. Could you maybe walk us through that? Not name by name but kind of the types of skills and experiences and how those differ from the sort of what you're able -- obviously bringing talented people over from the rest of Ford to bring in.

Yes. So if you think about it from our standpoint with our long, long experience in the commercial space leading in North America with over 43% share of the full-size truck and van business and pickup business for the U.S. market, Europe transit leading the market, we have people that know how to architect very worthy designs that can handle many vocations and stresses in many conditions. We know people who have to match upfits to the type of job for plumber vans, construction vehicles, cherry-picker. We have all that. But in a world that we need to move to charging and electrification skills in a world where we're going heavily to digital solutions both in the data, big data usage to understand customer needs and intelligent solutions of software sales and SaaS products and charging solutions, we're bringing a new team. So we brought in team members that had generated -- had grabbed software talent at Target and Disney. We have people that have implemented social solutions and media marketing solutions across other key parts of the business digitally. We purchased Electriphi with all of their depot charging solutions and incumbent customers. So we're going on and handpicking these people as we switch the model for both vehicles, services and always-on.

Okay, so let's go into some of those pillars. We'll start with the vehicles. Because I actually want to leave a lot of time for the service and the kind of other parts of the product value proposition. On the BEV truck side, you have the E-Transit vans now. Criticism we hear from your EV pure play competitors, one of whom will get to you've invested in, is that those are, although not [indiscernible] from them, is that those are retrofits into existing platforms. How do you see -- and therefore may lack some of the range or economy as expressed in terms of miles per kilowatt hour of purpose-built vehicles as well as maybe the functionality in terms of going to a pure skateboard? So how do you see the competitiveness of the current product lines? And given Blue Oval City, given what competitors are doing with dedicated LCV EV product, would you be moving in the future to a dedicated skateboard-based product for commercial vehicles?

So two things that are important here is the difference between retail and commercial customers, and what that entails and how we're thinking about electrification and what we take to win there as well. In retail and commercial, most big customers turn over their business 10% to 15% per year. So they're managing ICE and BEV vehicles for years. Most have multiple types of vehicles in their portfolio to handle different kinds of jobs. And like any big company, they're trying to reduce complexity and simplify their work. With Ford in the Class 1 trucks, seven vehicles, now in E-Transit and a pickup. That 40% of our volume that is purchased by customers who have both F-150 then Transits, for example, is we are trying to create end-to-end solutions for them for their whole business, a one-stop shop including supporting them on multi-make cases so that they get easier. And if you think of E-Transit, which does an average 74 miles per day based on hours in our commercial business and the ICE business before we move, and the E-Transit can do up to 126 miles. So 74 miles is normal use case on average. It has already because of the scale of the operations, multiple roof heights, multiple lengths, et cetera. And we see our orders rolling in. It's something like 20% low roof, 20% medium roof, for example, and the rest high roof in different lengths. Pretty hard to garage a high-roof van in the home when you have a cable van or something coming in. So we know we're getting the scale. And they can transfer their upfits that they're already purchasing at scale across ICE and BEV and continue that simple purchasing process that they know will work with the fits and solutions they already have. So many of our competitors, they have to start small with one or two big clients because they can't handle the 125,000 active clients I have just in the U.S. with long relationships. And so they've targeted something big in typically the delivery space, but their solution can't reach the broad range of customers for this huge new evolution that's coming.

And so what they would probably say is, over time, they'll learn small, medium enterprise. They'll hire sales force away from dealers and yourselves. So it gets back to -- they would come back to the competitiveness of the -- certainly, I get the package. But in terms of the actual product, would there be plans to move to as you have the skateboards -- the two skateboards that Jim outlined earlier in the year? Are there plans to move the Transit and the lineup to that? Or is that maybe, but you don't want to confirm anything at this point?

I think we've had -- as we've said, we've had tens of thousands of requests for reservations on E-Transit and in total over 160,000 in pickup. We see our strategies working. And as we said recently, the next gen -- and of course the next gens of products coming out, like the Blue Oval City plant in Tennessee and Kentucky where we have a next-gen pickup coming already in that time frame. So we're all in. So we're going to cover everything. But we want to go fast and cover as many vocations from day 1, not just one.

Okay. So I think what you've done with Ford Pro is it's not just a product. It's the service. It's the software. So let's move on to the service. How many of the dealerships signed up for the -- may be a bigger start, which is what kind of criteria have you -- did you establish for dealers? Mobile service was part of that, but that's only one part of it. How many of your dealers signed up for a mobile program? And were there any rejected in there who choose not to kind of step up to the Ford Pro commitments?

So you think about our business a bit. So I mentioned the 125,000 accounts. You get your small plumber or maybe 35, 40 units rotating a year, et cetera. And they need that local support, up to the big giants across national who need one [ come ] away to go to the business. So we have 3,000 Ford dealers in north -- in U.S. Of those 3,000, you get some ideas of a number. Over 2,300 for example are already EV-certified, so they handle the EV business coming our way in a big place. But we have 650 commercial vehicle specialists in North America out of that 3,000, over 650. Similar in Europe, we have over 800 Transit centers that are specialized in commercial customers, who they see different than retail all the time because they're rotating their vehicle fleet every year versus a retail guy might come back every 5. So they have long-standing, very sticky relationships, and they're dedicated only to this. And they have a long relationship with that customer, which is much narrower than you would with a wide range of retail. So we have these 650 specialists. And of them, we have a new program rolling out, a new footprint, a commercial service-only that takes them and takes 120 super mega hubs for cost and scale for longer hours, higher day doors. That is special -- specialized to really roll out. And that's like the 4%, and we call service elite. And that is going to give us even more coverage over the business, which we say will add about $750 million in revenue, parts revenue over the 5 years. And of those, I'd say you're right. Currently, we're at 500 of those. Mainly, the commercial vehicle centers, which is where we wanted them, are signed up on mobile business. In business, there's probably over 300 units in operation already in mobile service and growing every day. We see the repair goes up because it's much better, "Come to me and fix 10 units at my site, rather than me driving 10 units to your site."

And a couple of questions. What kind of extra dealer commitment does it require to do multiple service? And how do you monitor and ensure the quality of the services within the mobile service appointments?

So to be a commercial vehicle center at Ford, you sign up to a series of additional requirements. Expertise required, training required that you can have that kind of -- it's difficult that you have here [ do these ] and towing requirements. I have an upfit for a particular construction load of work, same with electric vehicles. So it requires a dedicated team in place and the standards, as I mentioned, like longer hours. In addition, we provide more back-end support for that commitment. We provide more marketing support. We make technical hotlines and specialist support so that you can phone a friend if you need help on charging and charging solutions and technology because nobody can know everything. So typically you have an overlay team who's very deep in that area. Then you hang up, but you have somebody that maintains the relationships. You've got 100 years with whatever customer. And we have a few of those long, long-time customers.

Okay. And I guess we're going to be talking about charging and intelligence in a moment. But a question that often comes up is how do you make sure on the sales side, there are knowledgeable personnel at the dealership who know about Ford Pro Intelligence, who know about Ford Pro charging because frankly, people's perception of a car sales person and -- usually doesn't include they're knowledgeable about software and EV charging.

You're absolutely right. So as I mentioned, [indiscernible] we set it up as there's somebody who's the account manager who's dealing with fleet management. And now with charging, we're talking on the customer side a much wider range, both with a small business and the dealer. But even at the big companies, we're talking to choose sustainability offers and the site manager who has kilowatts. It's a completely different audience as we're moving through this change. So to help the point of contact, we built a team around them who are all specialists. Phone a friend for that deep work and to help maintain the preparation. Get people installed for that process of planning, deployment and ongoing management of those services. And that's where this field force already in place already dealing in customers in high rotation, it isn't an occasional sale. It's so frequent. It really helps in the commercial space when we already have that presence.

Wait, and is the field sales force employed by the dealership or by or Ford?

So there's two. For big accounts, which is a lot of the volume, we are the sales force. We -- and then the dealer supports with delivery and obviously service. And it acts more like a -- it's a very thin margin model. And most of those are built to order and deliver to the customer where they need them, which could be anywhere nationally. And then there is the small and medium business, which acts a bit more by retail. But the rotation on that -- because they're turning over the fleet every year, because nobody wants the cash flow ahead of one time. So that relationship is much more steady ongoing already, and now you overlay on top of it. So it's quite a different model than retail in many ways.

Okay. So let's move on to charging...

[indiscernible] Because they'll have -- this also goes into the ICE BEV thing as well. That same guy is going to handle the Transits that you currently have and BEVs that you currently have, needing the service support and other solutions, intelligent solutions that support both ICE and BEV. It gets to one-stop shopping. It's just easier.

Okay. And so let's move on to charging. How much of Ford Pro charging are you planning to build out and pay for? And how much will be the various -- many of the charging companies we have on track 2 today, third-party networks that are being built out there?

So I think in the commercial space, the model is quite different again. If you think of the three kinds of commercial solutions, public, employee home charging, and depot charging where there's a site where there's chargers in the vehicles left overnight, for example. We have through what we do with the Mustang Mach-E, we built the Ford Pro charging network. And it is -- covers many different companies. And it's agnostic and allows to roam with over 63,000 plugs across America that you can go and use ChargePoint chargers, Electrify American chargers, et cetera, allowing -- like the old days [ hotel ], so roaming [indiscernible] to go massive coverage, present that information to you in digital tools. So you can find the charger, and where available, is the charger occupied? Is it already in use? And we keep that. So that will be available to our commercial customers through our e-telematics solution. We also offer home charging. We also provide, which is we will provide you a wall box at a home. But in the commercial space, the key thing is two key things. We will split your bill. Your bill for the refrigerator is you. The vehicle bill is me. And I want to make sure it's this car that's paying, not somebody's other electric vehicle. And things like preconditioning, so you can get maximum range that you could only do through e-telematics and through the vehicle. You cannot do it through a charging company. It requires that handshake with the vehicle and inside the algorithms of Ford. And if you don't get that, then your vehicle is going to not have full range most of the time, and especially in the cold.

And can you talk about the...

Depot charging on site. Go ahead.

So can you talk about the Electriphi acquisition? How does that fit in with the dealers' involvement in charging? And how is it going to be different than the charging efforts of the more personally used light vehicle test supercharger, Volkswagen, Electrify America and so forth?

Yes. So to think about Electriphi, so if you think about Electrify America, or we are an investor in IONITY in Europe, a public charging infrastructure used by everybody in retail. These are different solutions. These are solutions for you when you have 500 people driving. And some of your people take the vehicle home, in their jobs, service guys or supervisors. And some may charge them at depot. To complete our charging solutions, we purchased Electriphi because they were already doing depot charging for large vehicles, school buses electric in California at our fleet accounts. Now that software as a service system and really was the juncture between I've got to bring in a series of vehicles at different rate of charge every evening, linear programming that with a different kilowatt and prices. And integrate it into the back end of the customer's dispatch system, et cetera, in an open platform so you can pull that all together. We add that plus our home and public charging solutions, and that's what you get you this end to end. And that's so totally different than others. The others will send you to one person to put in the infrastructure, and another one to go purchase the hardware, and another one to manage the operating and maintenance and another one for software. What we've said with Ford is no, no, no. All of those, and we've got the back on all of those, we will give you end to end. We will put the deployment, the installations, the management, and the ongoing operations, we will cover. You need chargers or no chargers. We've got you covered.

Okay. So let's talk about Ford Pro Intelligence. Can you just begin by starting by saying what is Ford Pro Intelligence and the fleet managed -- fleet telematics business in general?

So I think there's two things that you need to think about when we think about our new essentials product and how it works with our new uptime tools that we have. So we're -- everybody in the productivity a business of commercial, government accounts, et cetera, they just want their business up and running. They want to do their roofing or their delivery or their construction. They don't really want to manage vehicles. And what they really don't want is the vehicle not operating. That is a catastrophe. And what you don't want really is unscheduled not operating. So these tools and digital tools allow you to keep the vehicle open prognostically with data. Just like our smart watches or whatever else telling us how to run our business with a Fitbit, you want to know how the vehicle is doing. Well, the vehicle needs an oil change. The vehicle has an engine code. And just like retail customers, commercial customers go, "Yeah, I can wait 'til next week." "I'm going to wait a week after." But those turn into very nasty, very long repairs. And it tells you to get recalls soon. We'll do over-the-air update scheduling their fleet manager can do for their set of vehicle. So one is keeping the health of the vehicle running, running many of those fleets in all those digital signals. And we engage with uptime tools to say, hey, if it [indiscernible], we can track to see how it's being done, so you can get it back if it's stuck anywhere, so you can get it back faster. And in the U.K. we launched that program earlier this year and already saved 22,000 days of downtime for our customers with our new data dashboard there. The other side is the human side. Am I operating productivity? Are my drivers in the right place? Do I need to read dispatch? Is the vehicle in the right place? Are they going over the speed limit? Because that directly affects my insurance rates, my other, my damage costs, my [indiscernible] cost and my downtime. So it's to manage the vehicle side, and it's to manage my job and my personnel side and my asset protection to improve value. And what is our business' total cost of ownership? [indiscernible] our productivity, they're guys with Excel spreadsheets, just like us who are all finance guys. It works the same for a fleet manager.

And so if you take what you just said and compare it to the fleet telematics industry and solutions that are out there, what is really different in terms of level of insight, especially small, medium fleet can get from Ford Pro versus Trimble, Fleetmatics from Verizon, any number of fleet solutions that are out there?

No, it's a great question, and there's two parts to that. What does the customer get? And why is it also better for Ford? On the customer side, they can't see what happens when it goes into the dealership and make the connections. And they can't get rich prognostics data anticipating issues that we're doing with proprietary algorithms because we have scale across many vehicles, and you can produce signals and triggers for successful repairs that you can't see. So you get a benefit. That big data is getting us all now that the world is connected with modems, and you can create new opportunities. The company gets something that the telematics guys or a subscription guy doesn't get. I get the referral. Oh, I need service. Go to make appointment. Let me help you make that appointment at a special price for you. I've already prenegotiated across the country, and I get a massive referral to my parts business. And I can get a massive referral to the rest or the rest of the business that I have. And so you can generate better share of wallet because you're in a constant selling of services, but you're also constantly connected to upsells and cross-sells and maintaining that sticky solutions with the customer, and recurring revenues is built ongoing. And for them, it's just easier, which is why we have Ford Pro FinSimple. Just make it easy for me. I don't want all this complex. I just want to do my roofing, my plumbing. Let me be.

Well, let's -- that actually what you just said gets me back to a question around service. I think obviously warranties go through the dealers. You have set, according to your franchise laws, what you have to pay them for. But as is well known, postwarranty dealers often, at least on the retail side, are not involved. The price that's to be perceived by the consumer rightly or wrongly is not competitive. How does that work in the fleet business? And is there really -- how do you ensure that the dealerships who signed up for Ford Pro service are in fact offering cost-competitive postwarranty service to your fleet customers?

So for example, one of the things we're doing as we really leaned into Ford Pro and just this total solutions for customers of all sizes, we created a national maintenance pricing program across the whole time that you opt in, and we buy down your maintenance costs from whatever your rate, your particular dealerships are because labor rates are different across the country. But we will offer one price to everybody in that process where we offer with a subsidy that they can come and join that program. And what the customer gets is if I'm a three-state guy, I get a consistent pricing because I'm at scale and I have that opportunity. And so those are the kind of solutions that we make for them. So they deliver the parts easily, and we're making our processes easier for them. The digital world makes it easier for them. A vehicle's coming. It's got these issues on it before it arrives at the dealership. You don't have to wait to get there to plug it in. I already know before it's even arrived. And I can get the background check and start the analysis before it plugs in and all. So the ability to do prediagnostics prognostic that there's a problem and to do remote diagnostics before it's starting to get there, I can anticipate issues. These are huge opportunities, and therefore, people would like the service better.

Okay. And so Ford Pro Intelligence, small, medium businesses, what percent of those are actually using a fleet management product? And would you be seeking to displace that or interface with what they have?

So if you think, especially if you think of the big fleet management companies, they operate in a thousands and thousands. That cost of acquisition for a small guy is difficult. But because I've got 3,000 dealers all over the country, in North Dakota and all, I can reach -- we can reach more people. And we already have existing relationships with many more customers. And being the largest commercial player in both North America and Europe and from a brand standpoint, we're much larger. We have the strength behind us, and we can match those customers up much more easily. And frankly, they don't need the full offer of a large company. The small guy needs smaller stuff. And just make it easier for me. And that's a lot where our Ford Credit solutions are coming in now where we really -- with FinSimple, we used to just target that's APR, retail and lease guy, cash [ reback ] for retail individual owners. Now we all bundle that with smart, small, medium business. And we pull those together into, again, making easier to bundle intelligence and other products charging so that you get a simple process. And that's why we feel really confident about growing our small and big business share in Ford Credit from 10% to 25%, which increases the sticky loyalty of the whole system.

And as part of that, and this question came in because you did talk about the dealer requirements and the sales requirements. Are you doing mystery shopping to see if the dealers are actually selling software descriptions? Are there economics for the dealers and enrolling a fleet into Ford Pro Intelligence? Because I think there's a worry there that if you can't sell to the customer directly, then the dealer either, a, is not capable of selling software; or b, is somewhat capable but siphons off all the economics that puts Ford at a disadvantage.

So I think we have multiple channels to go to market on this, and we see it. And the good thing about the digital space, it's binary. You got the ones and zeros. So you know it's going on. So we have multiple channels. The dealers have lead processes, and they benefit. And now they benefit from all sales because they're better connected for their service later. But the dealer is a channel, the direct to customer on going to market leads from self-help on our website itself in search, for example. So we have a whole range of tool inbound. And certainly, dealers have their role in the generation. But the process to create leads and create value for the deal is further down the stream, comes from multiple different channels, not just the dealer channel only, for sure. Charging will be the same. And that's why both the multi-make service that we're providing on the mobile service and the other part, it's a multi-make intelligence platform. It's a multi-make charging platform. It can support all of the other vehicles. But Ford with the [indiscernible] is getting advantage in many ways.

Okay. Well, you mentioned Ford Pro financing. How does Ford Pro change the traditional financing of products that you've sold to small to medium enterprises, whether it's finance or lease?

The commercial contract and the commercial, the way the loans are written are a bit different. So we had to make some changes there. The bundling of those for just the convenience of how the structures -- when it's a multi-VIN, I have 25 VINs of five different types of vehicles, so just making that process much easier, making the process of turning over your line of credit when you need to add one more vehicle on 25 rather than restarting again. So we had a lot of just basics things and the bundling, the capabilities and the software systems across the entire Ford process to make them just much easier. So I can make that financing piece, add intelligence, maybe add it to my existing charging solution, so you can get one clean bill for multiple vehicles. And this is where the ICE plus BEV over time. Not all the vehicles are going BEV. Not all -- they don't serve all needs right away. Maybe too much towing or the new vehicle line there. So you can support all the customers' needs on multiple different ICE and BEVs over multiple park years of age with easy, simple solutions. And that's what people want. They want to do their real work. They want to know how to get the data to run their business better, and that's what we can provide.

Okay. I know this has been asked before, but can you bridge the revenue growth of Ford Pro? You've talked about $27 billion to $45 billion. In a parallel track, Jim has talked about growing the services business. So -- but if we think of those chunks of $27 billion to $45 billion within Ford Pro, what are the major revenue walks?

So certainly, a key part of that is the vehicles. They command a large price, and it's a very important business. And vehicle like a Super Duty is a bigger higher-priced vehicle. But what we see is over time in North America, we can see opportunities to mix improve those products because demand continues to be very high. And in Europe, we see even more opportunities, as we said going electric with some of our new models like the Transit Courier coming up and others and E-Transit next year. So we see both growth in the vehicle side, but the faster [ path ] to growth and the higher-margin business is the newer businesses, enhancing service using digital and the new capabilities that we have connecting the customer with always-on, which is -- which just wasn't leveraged previously. And we really didn't have full modems in the vehicles until full year sort of 2020-ish. And now we have this capability that we can add these higher-margin software sales [indiscernible] annual subscriptions where once you're moving and really making a recurring mint higher and with very strong margins. So that's what we anticipate. At that growth over time, you start to see the higher-margin business become a much bigger portion of it. As I mentioned in the parts revenue, we think just in North America alone will be about $750 million in revenue. We see the depot charging $1 billion of revenue by the -- in just the U.S. by the end of the decade. So it's growth in these new businesses as well.

And just to ...

[indiscernible] The fueling business.

A question on the Internet over e-mail. Does the software service revenue streams from Ford Pro disintermediate sort of F&I and other ancillary things your CV dealers would normally sell? How do you navigate that? And how do you share the economics? Or do you risk alienating your dealer partners?

Well, the irony on this one is our CV dealers are doing not very much financing on small and medium business, which is why we picked up this whole work stream. It's traditionally gone to the banks where they didn't get that kind much of a margin. And for them, that was never that great because the banks aren't as sticky to Ford necessarily as Ford Credit is sticky to Ford. It's a more loyal business. So I think this is going to be a win-win-win all around on that one. And we don't see dispute [indiscernible] 1 plus 1 equals 10.

Okay. And just to kind of finish up more questions. It's not lost many people watching that you have a stake in a highly visible startup that's making both pickups and, for Ford Pro, delivery vans. Can you talk a little bit more about the relationship between your companies? Is it purely financial at this point? Or are there opportunities to work together?

What we said along the way, we've had a lot of strategic dialogue with Rivian from even back when I was on Team Edison. So I think there was -- but the intentions of the portfolio were quite different, and you can see that lays in the product. The Adventure pickup, which is sort of Ranger-size Ford with BEV box, which $70,000 or so is not what we're doing with a full-size work truck targeted at 40 -- $39,974 on the F-150. So the usage, capabilities and clients were very different in a targeting world. And like I said, we were targeting multiple [ kind of ] vocations, multiple capabilities in existing business even in our commercial space and knowing we're going to end up these end-to-end products, which is very different than a bespoke vertical, one-customer only. That's pretty hard to do multi-make, multi-class vehicles support that most of our customers need. So there were some very different targets there. And I think where there's good sharing makes sense, sharing has happened.

And the question comes in, what about your very valuable stake in that company now? What are the intentions vis-a-vis that?

I'm sure we'll wait for that for another day, but it's an excellent question.

Okay. So let's look back. I want to kind of get one thing if you think about it. So for the last mile delivery business, you've described your key focus. Small, medium enterprise is 125,000, very niches. But certainly, there's some very high-profile shippers who have taken stakes in companies like we just discussed, and some of the other [indiscernible] contracts with others. So how do you think about that last mile delivery space? There's been expansion even on the ICE side. I see a lot of Promasters around doing last mile delivery. So is that a market that you don't worry about? Or is it something where your capabilities are something you want to build upon?

Well, of course, last mile is a growing business and has been. And certainly COVID tipped over everybody, new demographics and new categories that went digital that never were there before. We see it in new people entering the space, especially things like [indiscernible] and pieces like that. There's different needs in that depending on the kinds of application, and that we'll see -- we see that changing already. And that's an important piece. It's grown to, the last time we looked, to around 10%, which is including all the growth that was around 10% of the full-size truck and van business in North America. We know E-Transit covers a lot of that with some mileage with the higher-roof van and/or stepping van. So we know we can cover a lot of that, and certainly, we are going to play in that space. In Europe, the miles are -- cities are a little denser, the miles are a little shorter, and the application is a little bit different. So we think we're well positioned for all the early stages and have more than enough demand already, and we will be very well positioned for later as well.

Okay. Just final -- I'll just squeeze in one last question since you are in Europe, where you just mentioned Europe. It gets to the dedicated skateboard platform. Volkswagen, obviously, has MEB, less so the larger vans, but the Transit Connect would seem to be perfect to roll off the MEB platform. Any -- yes, I think you have plans to do that, but I think you can talk about kind of electrifying the smaller vans in Europe.

Well, certainly we're thinking platform plays in all of them. And as we're looking at the global platforms we announced at the Capital Markets Day, a platform that was capable of various different elements. And as we also didn't mention the next-generation pickup coming. So I think we plan to be all in and win. That's all I could say. In the area of battery electrics, we plan to have as much share in the commercial space across Europe and North America, if not more. That is the intention along the way. And we are scrambling to get battery supply. Demand for what we've already announced so far has outstripped our expectations. And we are full on handling the many different vocational customers who've expressed interest. And that where we're going to have this advantage because what's really -- I've met with a lot of big companies on this. And first they go, "Do you know anything about charging?" "Oh yes, yes, absolutely." We -- then you ask me if they have one charger and they have one trial vehicle in one location. There is not a good understanding of how the software systems and the various capabilities of plug-and-play charging, like the DC charging that we've built in the car or like when we built in the onboard charger on F-150 or preconditioned. There is an understanding of how these work together between telematic solutions, charging solutions and vehicle solutions. And not integrating those three is going to have very disappointed customers. And that's what we've mastered, and we're going to catch the whole ball for peace of mind. It's a totally different strategy.

Yes, much more. Kind of the old four Ps, it's not just product, the physical product anymore.

It is.

Well, great. On that note, really appreciate the in-depth update, Ted. Enjoy your trip to Europe. And we look forward to keeping the dialogue going with Ford. Thank you.

Brian, thanks for your time. Great to see you again. Thanks for the talk, everybody.