Gelion plc (GELN) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Good morning, and welcome to the Gelion plc Interim Results Investor Presentation. [Operator Instructions] The company may not be in a position to answer every question received during the meeting itself. However, the company will review all questions submitted today and publish responses where it's appropriate to do so. Before we begin, we'd like to submit the following poll. I'd now like to hand you over to John Wood, CEO. Good morning, sir.

Thank you very much, Paul. It's very good to have this opportunity to continue to update our stakeholders on our progress and to report on our half year. First, I'd like to introduce the presenters, Amit Gupta, our CFO.

Hi, everyone. Good morning to our investors in the U.K., and good evening to our investors from Australia. My name is Amit Gupta. I'm the CFO of the Gelion Group. I've been with the business for over close to 4 years now. It's been a fantastic ride. We're making great progress and looking forward to updating you all tonight.

Thanks, Amit. And I'm John Wood. I'm your CEO. Very pleased to have the honor to lead the remarkable team at Gelion on behalf of our stakeholders. My own history is as a serial entrepreneur. I've built 4 companies before I joined Gelion and have stewarded those technologies. And in most cases or in fact, in all cases, those companies went on to become acquired and part of other large companies. Okay. Looking at our business overview and our highlights for half 1 financial year '25. First, a little update about our business and where we're positioning. Increasingly, we're building our focus around the sulfur battery company. Sulfur battery technology is becoming increasingly seen as the technology that can bring more, bring performance beyond lithium ion. And your company, Gelion, is becoming a leader in that sector. So we're developing lithium sulfur technologies, lithium sulfur technologies for aeronautical, for transportation, high-end activities because lithium sulfur is a very light technology. We're delivering silicon sulfur and working on silicon sulfur, which is a very safe technology, safe anode technology. And we're working very hard on solid-state integration for our technology, proving out that our materials, our cathode materials will complement solid-state technologies as well. The other part of our business that we are particularly focused on at the moment is our integration solutions. This is actually using third-party cells, and this is a sector of our business that is starting to generate revenue and margin now even as we develop on our own technologies. As well as our core technologies, we're also continuing to incubate and develop our other 2 technology areas, our zinc battery technology, which we have succeeded in developing the match to market for. We see a potential for this technology to extend beyond what is commonly done in the lead acid industry. It's a benign chemistry. It's a very, very safe chemistry. And our team has been continuing to progress the development of our performance. And then our recycling technology, and I'll talk in a few moments about some of the progression that Battery Materials have been making. They have been doing that very successfully and have been progressing the grant rewards that have been given by the U.K. government DAP program, very successful in that and extending those programs. So 2025 is the year of continuing the development of our sulfur technology leadership and then driving commercial success through our integration efforts. So we're going to continue to be watching our expenditure as we do this. We're very prudent in everything that we're doing. We will be continuing to develop and grow our integration solutions business. And then we're moving towards establishing collaboration partnerships with our core technologies. And I know everybody is looking for progress in that area, and it's an area that is our primary focus right now. As part of that, we're working towards what we call our minimum viable performance for our technologies as well. So your company has been delivering consistently on each of its primary objectives, and we are continuing that momentum and looking forward to a lot of success as we proceed from this point forward.

Yes. Thank you, John. I'll take you -- take everyone through the first half FY '25 results. It's kind of become a consistent theme where our results are better than what we have internally forecast. We started this cost saving program sometime in FY '24, where we announced that we will be -- we are buying to find a range of items that we can cut costs and expect that to be over GBP 1 million. And we reported for FY '24, we reported cost savings of GBP 1.1 million. What's good to see is that continued past FY '24. So we haven't stopped in terms of cost rationalization. When you look at the results, adjusted EBITDA for the first half '25 is better than what we did in FY first half '24. So it's GBP 300,000 lower and approximately 8% lower than what was in the prior year. This is driven by an increase in grant income. So we acquired OXLiD. OXLiD had a bunch of approved grants that we have been able to take advantage of. But it is also driven by a consistent cost base. So in first half 2024, we acquired OXLiD in November. So the results only included the financial performance of OXLiD for a month. However, in half -- first half '25, it includes the results of the 6 months of OXLiD. So even though we acquired a business, the cost base increased, but on a reported basis, the cost base is pretty much the same, which proves that our cost rationalization program continues to be effective. Our cash position was GBP 3.5 million at 31st December 2024. And since then, we have cut further costs in the business around GBP 0.5 million or 7.6% of the cost base. So in total, the cost savings that we delivered in FY '24 and post that, the 7.6%, we have decreased costs over 21% in the business. That's huge for a small business, and we continue to operate the business in a similar fashion that we continue to look at areas where we can run more effective programs, more focused programs and cut costs wherever possible, but not at the expense of R&D programs. So whilst we are cutting costs and making the business more efficient, we are making more progress both from a technical perspective and commercial perspective. This slide summarizes where the cost savings are coming from. And I think I presented -- and I presented a similar slide when we reported the FY '24 results. So if you look at first half '23 compared to first half '25, you see a big decline in all expense categories. And the stacked bar for first half '25 shows the proportion of costs that we acquired through the OXLiD acquisition. So in total, all these cost savings are helping us reduce our cash burn and also help us taking every pound further and efficient deployment of capital. On the first slide on the financials, I spoke about the cost savings measures that we introduced in January 2025, so approximately GBP 0.5 million. It's coming through staff costs, so reduction in headcount. Our directors have taken a voluntary cut in the director fees between 40% and 80%. That's giving us a savings of GBP 100,000 as well. And external services being consultants and designers and marketing, we have cut further cost approximately giving us another GBP 100,000. So a total of GBP 0.5 million from the recent cost cuts, taking the total cost cuts to GBP 1.6 million. Thank you, John. Back to you.

So I'd like to give you a little insight today into the background behind the strategy and particularly Gelion, the sulfur battery company, and where we're going here. So we see sulfur as being the next generation. And in that extent, we are working across the spectrum in the field at the moment. So lithium sulfur, initial markets, those benefiting from super high energy density, but initially lower cycle life. So niche high-value applications. Silicon cycle life -- silicon sulfur, increasing our cycle life, still high energy density products, working towards semi-solid-state products. And this is where we're capitalizing on unique technology, again, increasing cycle life and delivering high energy. And then finally, the results we've shown most recently where we're complementing our cathode materials with solid-state technology and the results that we shared with the market about the compatibility of our cathode materials. So looking at it then, we are looking across the marketplace with sulfur. We're looking at the very high-value applications initially for high performance, then into entry-level transportation markets and with our eye squarely on the mass markets as well. Now the goal in this work is to work with partners, of course. So we see ourselves being a materials company specializing in the cathode materials and the licensing technology supplying into the global supply chain. Why sulfur? Sulfur batteries are lighter, safer and more sustainable versus lithium-ion. So double the gravimetric energy density, that means a lighter battery, more energy, lower manufacturing cost with low CapEx and low OpEx. The materials that we're using, we're using low-energy formulation processes with those materials. Certainly, opportunity for improved safety and our cathodes are rare earth metal-free. So also bringing a reduction in the carbon footprint. Your company has a strong IP portfolio and technology portfolio. So that came from the initial work that was done by Professor Thomas Mashmeyer's team at the University of Sydney, complemented by the IP and technology portfolio that was acquired from Johnson Matthey with Origin in OXLiD technology. It's a very advanced portfolio and covers many aspects of -- core aspects of sulfur battery technology to protect our work as we move forward. We did announce that the government has supported us in Australia with a GBP 2.5 million co-investment funding for a project we call our ACPC, the Advanced Commercial Prototyping Center. The Advanced Commercial Prototyping Center takes our technology and takes it through to the commercial prototype stages. Now we are working very hard at the moment at bringing in place a strategic partnership to match fund the ACTC project. And that brings us to our global footprint and the work that we're doing to entice our strategic partners right now. I will say that I am on a plane again tomorrow morning and visiting each of the dots that are on this map, sorry, I'm not going to the U.S., but we are working very hard in Asia with the major battery manufacturers towards bringing our presence into those supply chains and to work in technology collaborations, working through Japan, particularly into India as well in the Middle East and into the U.K. and Europe, also reaching out to partners in the U.S.A. Looking at our summary and outlook. You can see that indeed, we have performed consistently delivering on all of our core objectives since January 2025. So continuing the work towards our lithium sulfur on track with our cost controls, very prudent cost management in the company. But while we're applying that cost management, what we're also doing is continuously improving the team and the performance of the company as well, continuing to incubate our zinc and recycling towards bringing in external investment into those activities and delivering the value of the technologies for our shareholders. We are looking to double the sales of our Integration Solutions business. Our first focus at the moment is ensuring total quality in our very first large system that we're doing for Borg Industries in Australia, making sure that, that system goes in with total quality so that we become a reference site for strong growth. We are working hard on executing strategic partnerships, and they can include investment. I would love to be able to share more with you actively. As a public company, it's sometimes difficult to convey the progress that's being made until it's completed, but a lot of very healthy progress being made towards some key objectives here. And we are progressing continuously our lithium sulfur technology towards minimum viable performance, demonstrating that. And all these goals are aimed at delivering shareholder value very quickly. So we think we're very close to that inflection point where we start to convert the value that's been accumulating in the company into share price. That brings us to the question please.

Thank you very much indeed for your presentation. [Operator Instructions] I'd like to remind you the recording of the presentation and a copy of the slides will be available on the Investor Meet Company platform. John, Amit, as you can see, we've had a number of questions throughout today's presentation, and thank you to all the investors for submitting those. Could I please ask you just to read out the question, John, where appropriate to do so, and I'll pick up from you at the end.

Okay. I'll start with the first question, which was why the sudden fall of the share price immediately after our last upbeat meeting? It's disappointing always to have a share price fall. I do believe personally, there's a disconnection between value and share price at the moment. So I do believe that will correct and that will correct as people continue to see us delivering on our objectives. And of course, there are some very, very significant objectives coming up for the company in the short term. And delivering on that, I think, is going to start to correct that disconnection. And I do hope for and anticipate that we will see the increasing value starting to reflect in share price. Of course, the market is the market, and we cannot control that. The next question is, when do you anticipate signing a strategic investor to come on board? I will say that the company has been working hard on that and has a bit of optionality about the way that we progress. There are a number of ways that we can be bringing in strategic collaboration with alignment to enter the supply chain. Now the important thing in that is that the company has a compelling proposition, a truly compelling proposition to become a leader. And that's what we've been working towards. We've been solidly working to fortify the proposition that we take out to investors -- to -- sorry, the corporate strategics. Now what I wanted to say there is it does come back to what I'm trying to say about the value accumulating in our business, very strong team, very strong IP, very strong technology. And what is coming along now is that reflecting in breakthrough performance of our technologies as well. So you will see good news about performance of the technologies, and that is also feeding into our work with our strategic partners. There's a question here about what has happened at Thomas Nashmeyer. Is he still with the company? Hell, yes. Professor Thomas Nashmeyer is very, very active. He's a wonderful man. He helps in so many different ways in Gelion. He is active every day in one way or another, working with our team members to help them, mentor them or to help them with technology. And he's an enormous help to me in opening doors and opportunities for me around the world through his network. He is one of the world's -- regarded as one of the world's top 15 chemists. He is an extraordinary academic and an extraordinary person. So yes, the answer to that is a solid, yes. Thomas Mashhmeyer is very active and making a very compelling contribution to the company. Who are your competitors in the sulfur side? How do you differ to them? And what is your advantage? This is a really important core question. Thank you, whoever put that one up there. It is important to understand where Gelion is sitting. The 2 prime competitors that I look at are LG. LG is a very large battery company, one of the majors, and LG is committed to lithium sulfur. I see that as a tremendous advantage in what we're trying to achieve for Gelion in that LG is helping to create the market. The next competitor that I look at is Lyten. Lyten is a very professional company, a very strong company out of the U.S. doing great work in lithium sulfur. And Lyten has taken the approach of deciding to build a gigafactory. So Lyten will be putting $1 billion into building a gigafactory is their objective. So there are other competitors as well in the marketplace. But they're the 2 that I benchmark most against for Gelion. Now how do we differ to them? We are taking an approach mostly on the technology that is quite different. It's difficult for me to tell you too much about that in this meeting. But I think that Gelion is getting itself into an extremely strong position on the performance of our technology. I don't think; I know that Gelion is getting a very strong position on the performance of our technology. That's important because the second part of the answer pertains to the commercialization approach that we're going to be taking. So we aim to be the enabler of the supply chain through supplying materials and licensing our technology. So we see LG creating the market. We see Lyten competing in the market. And what we want to do with Gelion is to enable the market. And that means that many large manufacturers who are competitors to LG, who will want leadership in lithium sulfur. And we want to come into the supply chain in such a way that we enable that broad market of large manufacturers by coming in on a materials and licensing model. So we celebrate success of LG, and we will celebrate the success of Lyten with their Gigafactory because they're helping us create the market for our own business plan. The next question is fairly long, but whilst I appreciate your general diligence in managing cost and cash, the reality is the company is still in a growth and development phase where speed to market and of scale is arguably more important than cost management. Is there a risk that you are, in fact, simply undercapitalized and the focus on managing so tightly within current cash constraints is actually damaging the longer-term growth potential of the business? Obviously, more capital is likely be dilution to current investors. But the long slide of the share price we've seen over a period of time now seems to be headed in one direction. So we're about -- well, sorry, I said something I allowed to say, but I believe we're in good shape to turn that around. We have been indeed trying to work as a growth business while controlling costs. Our team have contributed a lot to that. I do want to commend the leadership team of Gelion for the extraordinary effort that they all put in. And I want to really reach out and commend all of the general team, all of our scientists, all of our safety people, all of everybody that's -- the accountants and finance, everybody in Gelion is working really hard, and they're working enthusiastically in only the way that a great tech initiative can do. So there's an enormous energy in our team right now, and we believe that we're on a track to win. And we're trying to earn our way through that, I guess, the negativity that's been on our share price and on our market. We've done some things that have been moving the company towards breakout. So when you go back and look at the presentation, going in detail and look at some of the great achievements that the company has been doing. Some of these are not small. The acquisition of OXLiD brought with us a wonderful team up at Nottingham and with Adrian in London, fabulous contribution to our growth, leapt us forward. The acquisition of the Johnson Matthey IP also left us forward. We are not finished with those sort of activities that will leap us forward and move us fast. So I'm confident that we are in a position to succeed and become a leader and that we're doing the things that we need to do that and that the prudent cash management is just part of being a good business, continuously improving our team. What is the current cycle life of Gen 3 batteries? And what is the target cycle life of your MVP? So current cycle life of Gen 3, we haven't really announced, but we did say that -- we did indicate that we're moving towards a minimum viable cycle life of the order of 100 to 150 cycles. We're on track in that direction, and that's for minimum viable for niche applications, high-performance niche applications. I will say that Gelion is also on track. We're on track with incremental improvement, but we're also on track right now to some very significant breakout improvement as well. We believe that we can take sulfur way beyond the limits that people commonly associate with sulfur on power and cycle life. But that's research, and we will inform people of actual results as we deliver on them. It would seem while research is continuing, expenditure is closely monitored, but the missing part is revenue. And the only additional revenue is grants via share dilution. The reason many supported Gelion was the promise of the initial battery and the idea of an in-strain production. I still haven't heard of a coherent reason why the trial in Spain was a fail. Gelion cannot continue trimming costs and continue as a solely research company without decent sales. You don't have any on the horizon. The advanced sulfur cathodes are primarily going to be used in military drones. Is this going to be the focus? Are you happy with the listing in the U.K. market, frankly, in Asia. Retrospective looks like a scam when you could have remained based in Australia, ASX, especially where the map shows your focus is now. There seems to be a massive battery is announced on a monthly basis, none of which is Gelion. Okay. There's multiple questions inside that. I will try to answer them as well as I can. Yes, we're monitoring the expenditure closely. Revenue is starting to come through our integration services business. The bit that is not as easily traced is value. Value comes from accuracy and effectiveness of our match to market and the development and research activities that advance us to becoming a leader. In that value metric, you have to take my word on it, the company is really outperforming right now. You will see the result of that. And the way that you will see the result of that is by external recognition of the progress that we're making. So I'm very proud of what our team is actually doing there. I do respect the next statement, which says that many supported Gelion initially because of the initial battery and the idea of Australian production. I guess this is probably set by someone in Australia. And what I would say is I would welcome them to come and visit the facility that we have at Sakata, in Redfern, and I'd be happy to take them through to show them the effectiveness of our team and what our team are doing right now. The sulfur cathode business will be initially in high performance, but we will be -- I'll take a point of updating everyone on how sulfur extends beyond into the general market and particularly into the energy transition at the next opportunity for presentation. It looks like the cash runway will last until just after June '25. What happens then? Massive dilution. That is not the plan that we're working to in terms of dilution. The company is working on ensuring that we have optionality around making sure that we convert the value in our company and we reach inflection without continuing to dilute our shareholders. So it means that we want to achieve value. We want to increase the share price. We want to also start to get the perception of the value of the company out there. Will the time taken to recharge the batteries be a factor? Time to recharge the batteries is power. That is a factor. And it is an important thing that we are working on addressing right now. So I am confident in Gelion's ability to make high-power variants -- make progress on the power for variants of our lithium sulfur. Again, that will be announced as it's achieved. And I'm just advising my confidence in that. Are there any plans to explore EM opportunities to license technologies that could contribute to major low-carbon transition opportunities in major growth markets? EM, I'm guessing is energy market or anyway, I'm sorry, I'm missing that one. But the question pertains to licensing technologies to low-carbon transition opportunities. Yes, indeed, absolutely. You will see our products going into those markets. What did happen in the original Acciona trial? What really happened was that the company -- our team performed really well. We built 1,000 cells. We made the cells. We made the system. We made the trial system. We ran the Acciona profiles on our trial systems. That was quite an achievement by the team. I did come out soon after that, though, and announced that we missed on the match to market. We couldn't achieve with that particular cell, the safety performance and the cost in the same cell. And that's why the company at that point in time, changed away from using bromine in our cells and has successfully from then -- from that point in time, now established some great cell technology and it's at the point where we are ready to start delivering the value from that work for our shareholders. That's the -- some of the questions, I do believe.

Fantastic. John, Amit, thank you. As always, you've answered every single question that's come through. And of course, any further questions that do come through the team, we have the ability to view those and we will publish responses where appropriate to do so on the Investor Meet Company platform. Just before redirecting investors to provide you their feedback, it's most particularly important to you and the team, John, could I just ask you just for a few closing comments, please?

Yes. Look, I'd love to bring the shareholders, everybody that's on this call in to see exactly where the company is from my eyes at the moment. The team in Gelion has done a phenomenal job in the last -- particularly in the last 18 -- 12 to 18 months, the team has done a phenomenal job positioning Gelion, your company as a leader. You will see the results of that. You will see it reflected in the commercial arrangements, in the collaborations that we will continue to put in place. It has been a hard time through the time since the IPO in the early stage to where we've got to now and to be able to create the momentum and the presence that we have. Value is a really hard mechanism. Share price is the rule, and we have to turn share price. I can assure you that what we have been doing is putting in place the substance and the value to be able to start turning that share price around. And my goal now is to reflect that back to you as shareholders and as stakeholders by getting out and bringing back to you the external reinforcement of the value that's been created. The best way to do that is by demonstrating it in the marketplace with collaboration partners. So thank you very much for your support of this company. It is a great company. It's going to have a tremendous impact. And I think this is the most important time to be a shareholder in Gelion, and I certainly hope so. There's always risk, but there's an enormous amount of opportunity here as well. Thank you.

Fantastic. John, Amit, thanks indeed for updating investors today. Can I please ask investors not to close this session as you'll be automatically redirected to provide your feedback and all the team can better understand your views and expectations. This will only take a few moments to complete and that's greatly valued by the company. On behalf of the management team of Gelion plc, we'd like to thank you for attending today's presentation. That concludes today's session, and good morning to you all.