Gibraltar Industries, Inc. (ROCK) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Good afternoon, everyone. Thanks for taking the time. Again, we're back here live with the team at Gibraltar Industries. We've got Bill Bosway on the line and his colleagues. I will leave it to Bill and Tim to run through some slides and really jump into the key of what's going on with their business of late. And then obviously, we've got some time for Q&A, so again ping, e-mail, chat, however you guys want. I want to make sure this is engaging. So with that, turn it over to you, Bill, share your, screen jump through some slides, and we'll take it from there. Thank you. Thank you to all.

Yes. Thanks, Julien, and thanks for having us. We've got Tim Murphy with me as well, our CFO. I hope you guys can see these slides. I just have a few I want to share with you. We'll jump right in and give you a quick overview and then we can open up for some questions. This is us end of 2021. Now really 3 main segments make up around 95% of who we are. You can see there on the slide. Residential is a big piece of what we do and working pretty hard on that in the last couple of years. And then we entered Agtech and Renewables back in 2015 with an acquisition, and we've since been building those 2 platforms out. When we bought them, they came as one, we subsequently split them out. So if you effectively look at kind of the portfolio the last couple of years, you think of this as 2 main segments that we've subsequently split into 3. Agtech and Renewables always are uniquely different. And inside renewables, it's really about solar energy. But the solar energy piece of our business and our Agtech piece, which is really about growing food, account for about 47% of what we do. And those are really important to us as new adds to the portfolio, they really drive, I think, both top and bottom-line growth relative to where that portfolio has historically been, which for those of you who know us, we kind of grew up in an industrial setting mainly around steel, steel processing, serving some -- mainly industrial markets. So we've been changing the portfolio. Renewables and Agtech have become a really important part of that. We've invested quite a bunch in it. And if you go back to our November 21 Investor Day, we shared some targets for the business overall. We think we'll grow the business around 12% per year through 2025. Operating margins will increase 190 basis points. EPS should double, and we'll generate about $750 million of cash from operations. We've been pretty profitable, really strong balance sheet historically, and we expect that to continue. Let's go to the next slide. Just a couple of slides on Renewables and Agtech. I think most of you that are on the call understand Renewables, this is probably not anything that you haven't seen. But the way we think about what we do in solar, first and foremost, we think of ourselves really C&I-oriented. We don't do much in utility. So if you're going to ask the question, how do you compete with some of those utility guys? The answer is we really don't. We're, by far, the market leader in the C&I space. Have been -- and we've been in the space for -- really 12 years. Gibraltar has been in it with the acquisition for 7, so it's been part of a public company for a long time. We're probably the longest standing public company in solar, if you will. Made money every year, so it's a good business for us. We think it's got a lot of runway and it's got a good market. We are -- North America was really focused in the U.S. We're not going outside the U.S. At this stage, we don't really have any immediate plans. There's plenty of runway here inside the U.S., particularly in the C&I space where we have a pretty broad portfolio to help support that. Think about what that portfolio is, it's really made up of the 4 boxes up top. We do a lot of work upfront with our customers in design. We have a software company we acquired to help us do that called Sunfig that was done in 2020. And that really is about configuration of your piece of land. And the industry really hasn't had, I think, an approach of how to do that in a more -- in an effective way when you think about the hundreds and hundreds of variables that you've got to sift through literally to figure out what's the best option to put on that piece of land to get you the best return. We use that to then determine what infrastructure is required. That's the second big box. And what we're made up of today is we have an eBOS offering called SolarBos. You see below the brand or the logo there. We have different types of racking systems and ground mount. We have fixed tilt and tracker and inside tracker. There's multiple configurations. If you think about 2P, 3P, 1P, horizontal, vertical, et cetera. And on the right side, what you have there is canopy and roof systems. And we do a lot of that work. Probably, the largest supplier of that in the U.S. as well. And then finally, in the bottom, foundation technology. Most of the industry uses driven pile, but screw is becoming more and more important, particularly in C&I when you're trying to navigate into different parts of the U.S. where you don't have flat terrain. So it's not uncharacteristic for us to put a field in a pretty unique spot, whether it's on the side of a mountain or hill or in some pretty tough terrain. And to do that, you really need to screw foundation. So ultimately at the end of the day, in regards to your foundation, you want to combine and be able to combine different racking systems on different types of foundations. Obviously, we don't actually try to sell anything in particular that we make. What's really most important is when we can figure upfront whatever gives you the best solution set is kind of what we sell. And ultimately, that's packaged with field operations. So we do all our install. And if you think about that at the end of the day, in C&I, we're not only the largest but probably the only one that does everything from design, estimating, manufacturing, everything that we do and then put it in the ground before you do the installation. And that's a complete package. So when we bring you a solution set or the return for the piece of land that you have for the megawatts you're going to generate that flows into the PPA that you've negotiated, it could be any combination of that infrastructure that's there that I show you, and we have many examples where there'll be a combination of that stuff that is put together to get the best return on that particular piece of land. So ultimately, at the end of the day, once you have a field out there, how do you make sure that it's continuing to run the way it's supposed to and the way it was designed, I think that's an area that we'll continue to look at as the industry matures. That's effectively who we are in the space. It's made up of a couple of acquisitions. As I mentioned, we bought RBI back in 2015. The other big add to that was TerraSmart in 2020. RBI and TerraSmart, were both complementary competitors focused on C&I since our inception. You bring #1 and 2 together gives us a really strong position. We added Sunfig on the front, and then SolarBos is our eBOS solution set. So that's how the portfolio plays out today, and I think it's necessary for what we're trying to do across the U.S. Everybody wants to know what's going on with supply chain and particularly as it relates to panels. And I would tell you, there's 2 things that we all know of. One is the UFLPA. I would say the industry is still working through that. Day-to-day, there's some progress being made. I mean, just recently, we learned if someone had finally got some panels through. I do think that's going to get better and better as other suppliers learn how to break through that process and do it the right way and so forth. And that's really necessary. We've been dealing with this for now 6 months as an industry, where effectively not a lot of panels have been flowing through. But I do expect that to get better. And hopefully, over the next 6 months, you start to see that flow open up. And as that does, I think you'll see the demand that's been building up some time, everyone able to start taking advantage of that. Below the line there is the DOC investigation. Preliminary decision came out last night in favor of the complaint. I think 4 of the 8 that were investigated in terms of panel suppliers were deemed okay without a need for a tariff. And then you have 4 that will have some kind of tariff on them, and that tariff will differ depending on which one you're talking about. That being said, executive order to actually delay the tariffs for the next 2 years is already in place, went in place in June. So there's still a good chunk of time there to kind of neutralize the ruling one way or the other. And so hopefully, that's behind us. That's a positive thing. But also at the end of the day, as we've said ourselves over and over again, it comes down to the UFLPA and industry learning how to work through that process. So hopefully that will continue to evolve accordingly. The backdrop also then we'll talk about IRA. You want to know how that's impactful. Yes, there's a number of things that have to be done to take advantage of that. We've been working on that along with the rest of the industry. Some of those guidelines are coming out as we speak, whether it's prevailing wage requirements or Made in America requirements, all that's kind of being worked. I think the beneficiaries and the amount of the benefit you can get is going to be case by case, customer by customer. And once this UFLPA kind of allows panels to flow in, people will be able to start to take more advantage of the IRA. You can't really move forward so quickly as an industry unless you have panels that are flowing. So that's the most -- that's the gating item. The rest of it is positive, just once these panels start to flow, we'll be able to take more advantage of it. I just want to show 2 quick slides on Agtech because a lot of people aren't familiar with Agtech as an industry. And for us, it's something that, again, we've been in. When we bought RBI, it's something they've been in for 80 years. This is a relatively private industry, privately owned industry. It's been around for a long time, 40 or 50 years where you see a lot of growth of fruits and vegetables and plants and flowers, et cetera, inside. And you can imagine how that's become more and more important to our food chain, not just here but around the world, but inside the U.S., you can see where now you're able to get a lot of different varieties of fruits and vegetables on a regular basis throughout the year. And a lot of that's because most of that has grown inside. So your produce departments, when you go into a retail supermarket, you're seeing a lot of that come through throughout the year. These are very large, complex facilities that we designed from scratch and then built, but also then oftentimes quote and integrate the subsystems that go along with growing. And everything that you grow has a different approach. So based on what you are going to grow, we'll dictate the design. It will also dictate the subsystems that are required. So our customers are large companies. They've been around for a long time, as I mentioned earlier, but these are not fly-by-night start-ups. They've -- these are quite substantial in both revenue and volume that they produce for all your local retailers. It's a pretty good-sized market, continues to grow at a relatively good clip as the demand for this type of grown food increases. And so we're pretty excited to be involved in it. This is what we do, very similar to the renewable space: You design upfront, not just the facility, but based on what you're growing, all the subsystems that are going to go in there with it. We will then manufacture that for you. We'll build it, and then we'll take it to the field, and we'll install it and then integrate the systems, get you up and running, get things started up, hand you off a set of keys and let you start growing. We've built this business over time with the acquisition of RBI, but we subsequently added to that company called Nexus and Thermo Energy. Thermo is really the company that got us in a big way into the produce segment, which is going to be our biggest segment within this overall space. So a good place to be. We're excited about both of these businesses. I think the runways for the end markets are pretty strong. And I think they're going to be there for a long time, and we're excited to be involved in that. I'll stop there and take any questions.

Excellent. Well, thank you again to both of you guys. So let's just kick this off here. So first off, I just want to come back to the -- where we chatted a few minutes ago on the solar side. How are you seeing just industry growth here? I mean you've got a nice, diversified exposure, given the business acquisitions, but how are you thinking about the growth trajectory on the solar side here? And specifically, how are you thinking about '23? You mentioned and alluded to over the trade nuances, maybe not entirely resolved. But at the same time, obviously, the [indiscernible] was going to kick in at some point. How are you thinking about that eventually taking flight and in consideration to some of the nearer-term nuances?

Yes. So our historical organic growth was roughly around 18% over a 5-year period. So we -- that's pretty good annualized growth organically. And then we acquired TerraSmart who went -- took the business from $100 million to $430 million last year. And I think the industry on average grows between 10% and 15% across utility and C&I space. Like I mentioned earlier, we're really C&I. I think C&I actually has been growing a little bit faster than utility. But all that being said, the last 12 months have been a challenge with this -- these trade issues between the UFLPA and obviously, the DOC investigation. That's really put a lot of our customers at a tough spot. And as these things get worked out, I think you'll get back to the same market growth rates that we are experiencing before. The timing of when that actually happens as it relates to 2023, I think the general consensus that you'll hear from the industry is, hey, we've got more time to ramp up on UFLPA. So Q1, Q2, we started out a little slow, and then it will pick up as we get into the second half. We won't make up, I suspect, as an industry, a slowness in the second -- in the first half just because it comes down to -- you can only do so much in a period of time. But the hope is that the run rate for the industry is back to where it should be as you exit '23, and then you really take off in 2024. If you look at the U.S. on the solar energy side of things, the last couple of years we've not installed what was expected going into each respective year. So relative to the overall renewable goals for the administration, for the country, we've got some catch-up work to do. That's why these trade issues need to get resolved. And I think it's going to take a little more time. You just got to keep things in perspective. We think about UFLPA as a law, and therefore it's easy to follow. It's black and white. But in reality, you've got a U.S. custom border protection group that's got to now go through a process, not just for solar panels, but anything that comes from that particular province in China, Xinjiang province. So there's multiple industries that are going through the UFLPA, solar is just one of them. So you can imagine taking on that onslaught of effort overnight. On top of that, you've got panel guys that have to learn how to actually comply with the traceability that's required and you're talking about hundreds of pages of documents to prove that. Once you get over the hump, I think it starts to flow. And Jinko, I think is the one that we just heard has been successful, and we hope that, that opens up for them. And then as you get the next 6 or 7 folks, they break through that as well, and then you start to see things pick up and the panels flow. And as that happens, I think you'll see the industry start to take off again. It's not a demand issue. Trust me. I mean, it is -- we've got a lot of customers in the red zone, ready to score touchdown. They just -- they can't -- they're in a permanent time out until they see the panels come in. And frankly, they've been waiting on this DOC preliminary decision, but that's not really been a gating item. It's all been UFLPA. So I think that will open up, you'll start to see people get out of the red zone here as we get into 2023, we're looking forward to it after the last 12 months of some unknowns.

And maybe I can ask you this way. I mean what kind of true-up could you see? I mean, for as much as '23 in the last couple of years have proven to be a little bumpier, as you think about those kinks and all these delayed projects kind of saying, okay, now let's go. Hey, we got it. Let's move. I mean how much -- could we actually be above trend line in '24 as you think about it? And how are you seeing those orders kind of come in? I mean that might be more like a backlog customer conversation type.

Yes, I think it's going to take a while to catch it. We could be in a position in all honesty, that the U.S. has lost that opportunity, that capacity forever. And the reason is it sounds bad, but total demand for solar continues to grow at a pretty rapid clip. So you got a capacity challenge in general that we got to continue to build capacity to support some of these key components. And I don't think that's been outpacing demand. I think demand continues to be running right with it or a little ahead. So once you lose it, you lose it. So it's a matter of getting back on a cadence and a pace that will get us back going in 2024. But I don't think we'll make up what was lost in '22 and '23 in the first part of '23. I don't think that will be made up. It will take a while. But that doesn't mean that we won't grow a little bit next year as an industry. But I think '24 is where you start to really see things accelerate, assuming again the panel flow starts to continue -- or continues. I think the incremental investments going in place for panel, everywhere in the world will be meaningful, will be helpful, but it's going to take a couple of years to come online. And then at the same time, demand is not going to slow down. It's going to continue is the general kind of thought process. So all in all, it's a good thing. But I think it's going to be hard to make up what's been missed in a short period of time. It's going to take some time to pull that up. It will grow.

Yes, I hear you there. Excellent. All right. And then just if we could give the new pivoting there, I mean, even within the solar segment, just to kind of talk about your competitive evolution and differentiation, how do you effectively compete in this space? It's constantly evolving. How do you think about pivoting and laying out your -- or leaning into your competitive advantages? And in fact reimagining yourself, right, again, I just think about the litany of other -- maybe not the litany, but other competitors, et cetera, how you think about your advantages, et cetera, and selling to customers?

It's a good question. So just a little context for everybody. We've been in the solar space for 12 years. We've been -- it's been part of our public company for 7. We're kind of on maybe a best kept secret in that sense, we fly out of the radar a little bit. Part of that's because I think we're in C&I. I don't think C&I gets the press utility does and that's fine. We root for all of solar, but I think C&I has actually been growing at a faster rate. So when you think about C&I and you think about utility, they are distinctly different segments, and they are served in a much different way. And there are very few people have ever successfully crossed over from utility into C&I. It's a lot easier to go the other direction. It's simply because in the utility world, you're really designing, you're outsourcing the manufacturing and shipping to site and you're done. In C&I, it's everything from design from the beginning to manufacture and everything, to actually put it in the ground for your customer. The other thing that's different is the average project size is much smaller. So if you're in a utility, you may do a couple of dozen projects a year. And if you're in our space, you can do 700. Well, think about the difference. I mean we'll do as many projects in a week or 2 that utility racking company in utility will do in a year. Just the way it's different. And so your business systems are completely different. Your DNA is much different. And your secret sauce around being able to support 20 projects a week is a lot different because you're manufacturing, but you're also installing. So when we go out and talk to a customer, it starts with Sunfig and us being able to configure your piece of land around the best return you're going to get, or the PPA you signed and investments that you need to make. And that configuration can be anything that we have. So we're not out telling you we're a tracker company selling 1P. We don't really care. If it's fixed tilt 1P, 2P, 3P horizontal, vertical, pile-driven, screw, it could be any combination thereof based on the piece of land you have in the partner country you're in. And we'll configure that to give you 2 or 3 options. And that's really important in our world, in C&I, because you're not going to be in a big large piece of land. You're going to be pulled in somewhere in some unique place. So it's important for us to have that. But if you think about your estimating, your design processes, you're dealing with that many projects on a regular basis with so many different customers, we're serving 200-plus customers every day, that's hard to duplicate unless you've grown up in it and you design your systems, including manufacturing and your serviceability in the field to do that. So imagine any time, one point in time, you might have 100 projects in flight. Yes, there's value-add in that. So when we quote something, it tends to be across the whole gamut. We're not -- we don't break it down and tell you what our cent per watt at is for what we manufacture. Here's the return that you want. Here's the investment you'll make with us and then we'll bring it to the table. So not to be naive, There'll be customers, hey, well, I want to know how much is this and how much is that? And not every customer is necessarily going to be exposed to that and they may not choose us because we don't give them all that information. But at the end of the day, what we do bring to the table is the return you're looking for. And it requires us to go from beginning to end, getting that in the ground for you. And I think that's one of our differentiations. Now what I will add to that, all this noise that we've been dealing with in the solar industry, as hard as it has been on everybody, we're going to look back at this and go, it could be one of the best things that's ever happened. Because it has really forced us to challenge the paradigm that the industry kind of grew up. This is not a very old industry. But for the first 10 years of its life up until 2021, it only had tailwinds. Everything was relatively easy. Cost was coming down, scalability of innovation. I mean, heck, we had huge duties on imports for panels and this that and the other, yet the cost of the panel was lower with the import than it was 5 years earlier. So you had inflation. You had deflation, if you will. You had scalability. Not a ton of issues with labor. Transportation was fine. Commodities playing -- were in good shape. Cost of financing was relatively low. And then it got flipped on its head. In 2021, that all changed in a dramatic fashion, in a very short period of time. And that will actually end up weeding out a lot of folks. But at the same time, if you don't take advantage of that opportunity that presented itself, for instance, look -- look at those supply chain and the way contracts were developed in Ts and Cs and how equitable was it, and did it make sense. And so we worked really hard in the last 12 months to start thinking differently about how we go to market, how we think about serving customers and the Ts and Cs that go with that. And if you don't take advantage of that during this time, then I think you missed an opportunity. So I tell people all the time, if we went into this year and said we're going to run this business at double-digit margin this year in the second half, and that's pretty tough to do when the market has stopped or is down on sales and you still have all this noise. But man, if you can do that in this environment, think about when it starts to stabilize and the flow of panels and less disruption, you're in a much better position to operate. And I think inherently, that's -- you got to dig in and start questioning everything about the industry that we grew up with that was challenged during this unique macro time as well as the trade issues. So we're really excited about the work that's been done. We just can't wait for the panels to start flowing because the [Indiscernible] isn't a demand issue. It's all about execution. And so that's why we're pretty confident this business will go north of $700 million in revenue. Margins will be north of 15% operating income. I think we'll touch 17 plus on EBITDA. Yes, we were 14.5% in '20. So it's not rocket science to get there. It's not volume that drives it either by itself. We've got other things that -- between product mix and new products and volume and value propositions, all that matters in C&I, and we're going to stay in the swim lane. I will also tell the group, and this may hurt us a little bit from an interest perspective, we're not in the market share. I don't push our team to drive market share. I push our team to drive profit share. Because if you think about our business model, we control a lot of the costs in our offering, right? Design, manufacturing, all the field installation. So ultimately at the end of the day, that's the profit chain that we can actually impact. That's great to have it in your control. And so now it's about how you execute off of that. How do you invest in technology to make sure that you're extracting as much value as you can on those things that you control. And that's the beauty of, I think, of the model in the C&I space. And those that do that really well can make this a really good business that drives a lot of cash, makes a lot of money and grows at the same time. But we're not going to chase the shiny toy just to get the extra volume. It doesn't matter to us near as much as one might think on the surface. It really doesn't. So I'll stop there.

Excellent, Bill. And just to follow up on that. I mean I think that the really interesting point right you talk about where you can get on EBITDA margins, you talked about being kind of that 14 and change in '20. Sounds like you changed some of the T and Cs here, frankly, probably been able to pass along some of this inflation. And maybe that's a structural change and some of that ability to pass [Indiscernible] that. Does that mean that actually potentially you could actually be at a structurally better position than where you were coming from back in '20 year? I mean I know you're talking about 17 perspectively. Could we get to leading edge in '24 even higher here, if you will?

Well, I think honestly, Julien, if I could predict what this panel flow will look like and how soon it happens, I think we're in a much better position to take advantage of some normalcy than we were even, when we were in 2020. But the work that's been done is on a number of fronts. But it's not just about passing stuff on. Think about the model and the way it works. And if you're in the field and how you execute and move your troops from one job to the other and how much you can automate that process. We use a lot of autonomous vehicles to install a lot of our foundations as an example. So you think about labor, and there's just a whole host of things there. And then doing things right the first time and using technology to make sure that as we go into a location. We've got it really, really well understood before we start the process. But that's really important when you think about estimating and making that pitch up front for the value proposition. So buttoning up, I think a lot of those internal processes has really been something we've been focused on because, I will tell you the last 12 months have exposed, if you had gaps in processes or you had some weakness that you got exposed -- and that was my point earlier, you got to take advantage of those opportunities. You can cry all day about how tough it is. But man, that's where the opportunity lies. So we've been trying to work that pretty hard over the last 12 months while waiting on UFLPA and everything else to kind of work. Can't sit still. We've got to go after some things. And I think it started to show up in Q3, we just -- again, on down sales of 15% because customers can't get a panel, we were able to generate almost 13% of operating cost. And that's not bad. It's not great, but it's not a bad quarter. But that tells you there's profit opportunities out there if you execute in a different way or a better way. So we'll continue to work that pretty hard as we move forward.

Again let me push you a little bit on this concept, right? Because I mean, listen, I think the narrative that you put it forward as a possibility, I think is likely a reality, right? I mean first half of '23 is going to be trickier. I think this conference has thus far indicated that you're not going to get UFLPA recognition, at least in 1Q. But as you pivot through the course of the year, that's going to likely change. I mean WRO has been resolved. UFLPA is next. And to that end, right, you should have -- I mean maybe it's not an outsized acceleration, but the recovery is a hem. How do you think about leaning into that from a reinvestment perspective? You talk about labor and positioning troops. What about your positioning to kind of seize that, not from a market share perspective, but just reinvesting where appropriate to make sure that you're seize that opportunity as it weakens to manifest itself in the back half of next year?

Yes. Ultimately, in this business, it's one field at a time, right? So it's really about taking those 210 customers we have. You tier them accordingly based on kind of what their current position is, and that's kind of where we've been working in the last 12 months. And your success in C&I in particular doesn't require you to be great with 210, or all 210 have to have a panel, it's really do the right customers that have enough business with them in a given time period have panels or not? And yes, there are projects that are out there. The question is, do you have a panel on hand? And as that gets clarity for us with our key customers, I think that will dictate the speed at which we can weigh in and drive and go faster. But we're ready to go relative to taking this and moving it at a much quicker rate. It's just a matter of working with each customer to make sure they are as well. And it comes down to do you have a panel? The other thing I would say is it takes time for industries that effectively were shut down for some period of time to ramp back up. It's not just flip a switch. We had a lot of people in this industry that, in a very short period of time, were not part of this industry. And you can imagine a lot of that was in the field where there's a lot of installing stuff for a lot of customers that have to be done. Those folks went somewhere. Either they're working somewhere else or what have you, but you've got to get that engine going as an industry as well, and it may take a little bit more time than people think. But I do think you'll start to see acceleration in the second half. I hope it's sooner than that. We're ready to roll either way, because I think our capacity to deal with even more demand than our capacity per unit of labor, if you will, is greater today than it was 12 months ago, for sure. So we'll continue to make those investments. In terms of how we expand, if we want to add more of the portfolio, I feel pretty good about our foundation-racking position. There are some things that we're expanding in our tracker portfolio that we've talked about that I think are coming out here shortly that would be kind of cool that will help us. Inside the eBOS world, I'm sure the audience probably is aware of this, but -- if you think about eBOS, it really is a utility scale solution set. eBOS, for C&I, never really has existed. What eBOS is and C&I is individual local contractors, contractors pulling wire-making connections. It's probably about a 20% incremental cost to do that in C&I versus utility because of the way it's done. And you may say, well, why isn't it done? And you can ask the same question to us or [ shoulder ] or anyone else, why aren't you in that space? And -- remember what I said earlier, if you want to be in C&I, think about 700 projects, 20 a week. Want to be in utility, think about much less, longer runs, et cetera. So the way you design your systems, your manufacturing, everything is going to be one or the other. And very rarely, you're going to find someone that can do both quite well or cost effectively. So when you think of our business, when we bought our -- into SolarBos, we were 100% utility focused, for the most part. I would say now, a chunk of that is starting to move into C&I. It's not the sales process, that's the tough challenge, it's actually taken advantage of our labor and the fact that we're on site already for the foundations and the racking systems. So we are there, why not make the connection with the eBOS solution for our C&I customers? Why isn't that ever been done? And we're starting to make headway there. So we've selected with a couple of our partner customers looking at the whole ball of wax. But what that requires us to go back to our SolarBos business and put in place the operations capability to do design, estimating and manufacturing at 20 projects a week, or 15 or 10, not 1 or 2. And that takes time to kind of get that culture and that process capability in place. But that -- we've been working on that for the last year. It's becoming a bigger piece of our sales. Still got a long way to go. But I actually think that's -- that could be a $200 million, $300 million, $400 million market that we can create, and leverage the fact that we're already there, right? We're doing 700 projects. There's an eBOS solution for all 700, why aren't we getting that? And now that we have our own eBOS solution, it's about being able to stick with or stay up with the same processes we have for foundations and racking. So that's one of the growth initiatives that we've built into the plan and talked about expanding tracker. And then the last piece is our canopy business, which is not a ground mount, right? So ground mount, fixed-tilt tracker. I think we're the #1 guy in canopy and roof. And we're really talking about industrial here, and that's really caught an interesting business. You guys go on -- go to JPMorgan Chase side, look at their ESG report on the cover, is the largest thing ever done in North America, we just did that. So there's a lot of investment going on in canopy in your cities and a lot of other areas that people don't realize. That's a different DNA than ground mount, but that's part of our portfolio, and we're the leader in that. So we're pretty excited about that. So we're not a tracker company, not a fixed-tilt company. We're not a canopy company, we're not an eBOS company. We're a combination of those things, trying to serve a piece of land that will take whatever makes the most sense for the return. That's how we think about our business model. I don't think it's rocket science. I don't think it's super unique per se, but how you execute it is. And so we've got work to do to get better, but I think we're making some good progress.

That's awesome. Listen, final question please super quick, just to tie that last thought process together. When you think about, hey, making that eBOS sale or what have you, I mean, what is the quote attach rate, if you want to use that word, of kind of a hybrid sale, right, where you're going to be able to go in today and sell an eBOS. How much opportunity is there to kind of ramp that up with the same customers. You just implied to understand the order of magnitude of that sales upside, if you will, or that co-sale?

Yes. I mean we're in the process of piloting that now. And I think where it's worked well is -- in C&I, the other thing to remember, is your developers are relatively small compared to maybe on your -- the EPCs you might be working with and utilities. So they don't have as many people. They have more people wearing multiple hats. So you may only have to get to 1 or 2 people. So the sale process of convincing them to shift from what has always been done because they had to do it this way because there was no eBOS solution being offered. It is something now that we can actually leverage for them. Because ultimately, when you think about schedule of the field itself, now you're just dealing with less contractors. Now it's in control of one person doing potentially on the field, the foundation, the racking, the eBOS. Now you just got to put the panel on and you're 90% of the way there. So there's a lot of scheduling benefit. There's a lot of foreign customers. There's a, I believe, a cost benefit for them and for us, because we have the opportunity to already be there. There's an opportunity to drive margin for us, but incremental growth because those dollars are being spent with a contractor. And here's the other interesting thing: Electrical contractors aren't necessarily super excited about pulling wire and making connections. What they'd really like to be doing on is more value add with the rest of the electrical system that goes in that field. We're not looking at that piece. We're looking at the piece they'd actually like to get out of. So it's kind of an interesting opportunity. And I think we're 6 months to a year into it, and we're starting to see it percolate and take off a little bit, we'll just expand with our partner customers over time. We're not looking to blanket the market tomorrow because ultimately at the end of the day, still comes down to 1 deal at the time. That's what makes up the market. Even for a customer, it's one job at a time. And we'll have that discussion and starting to -- we're starting to get some traction. So I'm pretty excited about that. But like I said earlier, the market is anywhere between -- because it's not just the material that you're selling, it's the install, it's the labor piece. So is it -- is it $200 million, $300 million, $400 million? So that's what we're trying to define. But it's something that's, I think, relatively substantial for us.

Nice. I know we've been at it for a little bit. I'm a little bit out of time, but I wanted to make sure we got that all in there. So Bill, Tim, thank you guys very much. That was an excellent update. I really wish you guys the best, and enjoy the holiday season here, and I look forward to connecting here as you guys get underway, right?

Great. Thank you. Thanks, everybody.

Thank you all, guys. Thank you so much. Appreciate it.