GoHealth, Inc. (GOCO) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Thank you very much. Before we begin, I need to read the following disclaimer statement. This call is arranged by Truist Securities Research for use by institutional investors and issuer clients as defined by FINRA. If you are not an institutional investor or issuer, please disconnect at this time. For required disclosures, please see our website at truistsecurities.com or our equity research library. On today's call, we have Clint Jones, Co-Founder and CEO; Travis Matthiesen, CFO; and Jay Koval, VP of Investor Relations from GoHealth. I guess from a perspective of being timely for the benefit of investors on the call, could you please provide a short overview of your business and some highlights, given the fact that you just reported earnings last night?

Yes, absolutely. First off, just, Tobey and the Truist team, just thank you for hosting us this morning. Excited to be here. So GoHealth has been around 20 years, and we're an online health insurance marketplace. Over the last 5 years, we made a shift into the Medicare Advantage world, and that's 95-plus percent of our focus today. So ultimately, we help consumers shop, compare and navigate their different Medicare options, whether that's Medicare Advantage, Medicare Supplement, prescription drug plans, what have you and help them enroll in the right plan for them. When you think about, especially during a period of time when health care is top of mind for everybody, we set a record in 2021 -- or sorry, 2020 with both enrollments and revenue, getting more people through our funnel. This is kind of a highlight of what our platform looks like today. We have a wide omnichannel marketing approach, both online and off-line, targeting consumers that come through our platform. We're able to kind of take those consumers, score them from a lead standpoint, route them to a specialized agent that would meet their needs or their Fit, and ultimately, go through a very rigorous needs analysis, fully understanding the providers they go to, the drugs they take, the additional benefits they're looking for and then help them navigate a wide variety of different carrier plan options that would meet their needs. Once somebody's enrolled, we have a Telecare team that really guides them through how to use their benefits. We set appointments for consumers. We help them look for maybe generic drugs that could save them money, so really a full end-to-end platform, navigating somebody through their different plan options when it becomes -- from a Medicare standpoint. From a TAM standpoint, there are about 11,000 people turning 65 every single day, which equates to about a $30 billion market. We generated $877 million in revenue in 2020, which puts us still about a 1% track for the overall market from a sizing standpoint. And again, a revenue year for about a 63% growth rate, which we're extremely proud of in kind of what was a -- what I'll call an abnormal year, to say the least. You think about the pandemic, moving everybody to a work-from-home environment. And then our busy season is the fourth quarter, which is the annual enrollment period, which had an unusual election cycle this year. As we all know, the election did not end on election day, and we were able to navigate through that all the way through AEP, which ended on December 7. So all in all, a great year. We saw a huge opportunity as we think about the trends we saw in AEP. You think about -- this business kind of looked like the travel agency market back in the early 2000s, where you had literally a travel agent on every corner of Main Street America. And in a matter of a few short years, that all transformed online to the Expedias, Priceline, Travelocity and what have you, and that's how most consumers buy airline and hotels today. We expect that, that was going to occur and had seen trends of that moving online over the last several years. We thought it would take 5, 6, 7, 8 years to fully transform online. COVID really, really accelerated that process, where you think about a stay-at-home order or just the safety of not having somebody come to your house and talk about a Medicare plan and the ability to do it online or over the phone under the safety of your home. So that trend, we think, transformed and kind of brought forward the market by many years. We have overabundant of activity and call volume that we actually could not serve in AEP, which gets us really excited about the ability to kind of ramp up our platform, hire additional agents and be in a position in 2021 to service that volume we had. So really exciting sitting here where we are today to kind of tackle that opportunity. And just thankful for the team we had that put in the results we were able to put on the field in 2020.

A couple of questions about the results last night, just to kind of catch people up if they weren't able to participate in the call. Submitted applications started out real strong, up over [ 80% ]. And you previewed that when you reported third quarter results. Could you describe how matching ad spending and agent capacity may have driven slower overall results in November, December and that sort of the dynamic post-election?

Yes. Sure. Yes. So for the first 2 weeks, we did see kind of an 83% increase in activity year-over-year. We actually ended AEP around 75%, 76% over -- from the prior year. So still maintain a very strong growth rate. A couple of factors there. In the first 2 weeks, we had a lot more callback deployment scheduled than we had in the past, meaning that our agent force that talked to consumers in August, September, early October that weren't eligible for SEP, a special enrollment period. So they set an appointment to call them back. They had already created a relationship there, so the closing time was much faster. As we move forward into AEP, we saw our handle times starting to increase. We were spending more time with consumers, a lot more questions around COVID and what was covered with their plan. That ultimately, that additional handle time led to increased LTVs, which is ultimately a testament to the quality of the business we are writing. As far as kind of, what I'll call, supply and demand mismatch. If you think about -- we prebought a lot of TV media going into the election, assuming there was going to be a lot of noise. But again, we assumed that noise would be mostly done by election day, and then it would be a little bit back to normal. What we saw were those trends not changing, right? Breaking news coming out all the time, ads being pushed, our ability to clear ads limited. A good example would be, we may have had a TV ad at 4:30, 5:30 and 7:00 on a day. So we had stacking prepared for those different call times. The 4:30 and 5:30 ad got bumped, and they all aired at 7:00. We can imagine then not being able to handle all that kind of volume coming in. So therefore, we had a lot of leads falling on the floor that were qualified consumers looking for help from a plan standpoint. Cost per opportunity, which is kind of the actual lead or the inbound call, was within our range, the expectations. Our actual CPAs were higher than we had planned simply because we had so many opportunities that we paid for go unsold.

Perfect. How do you think about the long-term margin opportunity for the company? And I'm thinking specifically adjusted EBITDA margin as the guidance, at least the initial guidance for this year, looks relatively flattish on an overall company basis for the year. How do you think about long term?

Yes. So what we talked about yesterday, there's kind of 3 major areas we're going to kind of double down from an investment standpoint. And we really think we're still in kind of a land grab or early stages of a large market capture, right? So we think the prudent thing to do is to continue to invest, continue to scale the business, continue to take market share to maintain that market leadership. So I think about the demand we saw all in AEP and our ability not to be able to serve that, and we're seeing similar trends in Q1. Just the overall demand up, hiring and increasing our agent counts to be able to handle that demand. This is still a product that people want to speak to somebody and get validation on the plans they're choosing. We're obviously testing with DIY and other sources, but we still see, as it stands right now, the ability to connect to an agent is parallel to helping folks match the right plan. We'll continue to invest in technology, primarily our decision support platform, to make the process more efficient. Overall, long term, that will pay off in EBITDA dividends and efficiency gains as we think about that. And then our brand and our Encompass Platform is another area that will set us apart over time and continue to drive additional margins because it's a revenue stream that's outside of traditional commissions paid on additional services we'll do. So that will ultimately drive, if I think about the revenue per member, that will drive that up. So we will invest heavily in the first 3 quarters of this year. We'll start seeing the payoff in Q4 AEP. But I think what you'll see is that Q4 and into 2022, those margins start to accelerate as we think about optimizing the platform.

Yes. And the only other thing I would add there, Clint, is if you think about our business, we have 4 segments, 2 segments within our Medicare channel and 2 segments within our IFP or under-65 channel. We've talked a lot about -- Clint mentioned earlier, pivoting into Medicare just in the last 5 years. The other area where you see opportunity for margin expansion, kind of, as Clint mentioned here in Q4 as we make investments throughout the year and beyond, is more and more of our resources are being moved into our highest profitable channel which is Medicare. And if you think about the Medicare channel here in Q4 of this past year, it was a 49% margin channel. So as we continue to add more agents, more resources focused on Medicare, just having more and more of our revenue come through that channel and be Medicare also creates the opportunity for margin expansion moving forward. Hence, why we're investing so heavily in the first 9 months of this year into that channel.

That makes sense. Kind of shifting one on -- I had a couple of questions on LTV to CAC and sort of growth efficiency. GoHealth has emphasized LTV to CAC from the beginning as a key KPI to track efficiency for the firm's growth. How do you think about managing to improved lead generation conversion? And associated with that, where could LTV to CAC trend over the long-term as you execute?

Yes. It's a great question. And you're right, it's kind of been our North Star and kind of the guide rails around our growth and how we think about things. So starting with the LTV, we -- unlike our peers, we actually we've reported Q2, Q3 and Q4 increases in LTVs. So we see an opportunity there to continue to invest behind that process. Last year was a year we added more carriers to provide more choice to consumers. Ultimately, that will pay off long-term in increased LTVs, right? Because you have stronger conviction from everybody in a unique plan that's perfect for them, and they're going to stay in that plan longer. We started our retention, our Telecare team, about 18 months ago. So we've invested heavily behind that strategy. Even though we're still -- I'll call the early innings of that, we're starting to see the payoff occur as I think about how we're positioning year-over-year. So there's an opportunity there. As far as the CAC side, our investment model has the cost of opportunities rising throughout the next several years, right? It makes sense as the market gets a little bit more competitive, you're going to think about the cost per lead going up. But our efficiency gains and conversion rate, our ability to hire more career-oriented tenured agents, you'll see increased conversion rates, which is going to stabilize the overall cost of acquisition. I think when we saw this last AEP, like was the -- our ability not to answer the -- all the deals with all the consumers coming in and service them kind of reduced our -- or increased our CAC, which kind of limited it. I still think, Travis, we're about a 3x LTV to CAC during Q4, which is still very strong. We think there's room for upside there. But I think that our team focuses on everything we do, does the initiative drive LTV or does it have the ability to reduce CAC or make CAC more efficient? So that's still how we think about the business.

Yes. And I think the one thing I would just add, Clint, is as you think about that, we've seen a few points of growth in LTVs. For those that are new to the industry, CMS regulates the commission rates. So there's a little bit of opportunity for improvement as we improve persistency. But where you really differentiate yourselves and win in this market is on the denominator on the CAC side, which is why the investments we're making in agents, ensuring that we've got the best agent workforce out there to help educate, enroll consumers in a decision that's very, very difficult is vitally important, and that translates into higher conversion rates and more conviction at the point of sale. And then the efficiency side, which is why we're investing behind our proprietary technology and our scoring and routing of consumers with agents because being really, really efficient through the enrollment process or the CAC process is ultimately where we win. And that's why we're focused on the denominator there, and we think that's what sets us apart.

And as a follow-up, does it make sense that adding all of the new carriers last year was sort of a drag on your LTV? And that there, the maturity of that going in and selling those plans from that carrier in year 2 and 3 can convert into a tailwind?

Yes. No, you're absolutely right. Any time you add a new carrier, you may see a drag, right? The -- you're not going to be fully optimized from a -- on sales standpoint, right, where agents might not have the full education on the product suite. That product suite is going to be rolled out fairly slowly. You're not going to be fully integrated from our marketplace technology platform and the decision support systems. So -- and we're still not. Some of the new carriers that we onboarded last year, that process will be completed by the end of Q2 this year. So that's still a long process to get it going. So we think there's still some upside there from just the overall carriers we added last year. There's also -- you may get a relationship with a new carrier where your commission levels aren't optimized, and maybe it's a volume-based model, where the more you do, the more opportunity you have to grow your kind of revenue per customer that you have with that carrier. So as we scale up with carriers, there's additional upside. And I think the key thing is we need a lot of data through our platform to really optimize a lot of the AI and decision support capabilities we have within our technology stack. That doesn't happen overnight. The more data we get to that platform, the more we're going to optimize it and more we're going to get it within the feedback loop that will drive more efficiencies. That just takes time.

Right. In the past, you've also talked about having a very efficient cash profile, balancing the commission business and your other adjacent activities. Could you talk about the drivers of that and the firm's ability to self-fund very rapid growth in Medicare Advantage, principally?

Sure, Charles. I'll take the first part of that, and you can kind of chime in as well. But you think about -- we've had 2 main lines in our businesses: the commission model, which is an LTV based model that does have a cash drag as you scale it up. We've also had really deep integrated relationships for years that we have in our enterprise revenue area that are kind of outsourced models, technology programs, marketing development programs, enrollment platform and even our Encompass revenue that we're starting to generate as well, are more traditional net-30, net 60-day contract terms. And those are typically multiyear arrangements where we have predictability around cash and timing, what have you. So we've kind of leveraged a lot of that side of the business to scale our commission model. And we'll continue to do so. I think from a payback period standpoint, right now, we're roughly, call it, a year from a cash payback period overall for the business. So I'll let Travis give a little more detail just on the scalability of that and how we're thinking about financing the business on a move forward basis.

Yes. I think just a couple of things for those that are a little bit new to the space. So when we enroll an individual into a plan, we recognize the full lifetime value of the revenue at the point of sale. And then based off of how carriers pay commissions, they pay commissions month over month over month over month as that individual stays in the plan. So to your point, Clint, that's exactly why there's a cash drag of we incur all of our marketing and advertising and agency costs to enroll the individual in the plan. And then over time, we collect the cash. Because we've built relationships with carriers, where we're -- we looked -- we're looked at more as a partner than a broker, we've been able to generate what we call internally enterprise revenue, which are all the different types of revenue that Clint described. And typically, all of that cash is paid either upfront or think about a normal like net-15, net-30 model, where we're able to bring that cash upfront to ultimately fund our commission growth. And you can see in the slide that Jay put up here, that balance of enterprise and commission revenue as well as an eye and a focus on our consumer acquisition costs, or CAC, being very, very efficient there is what drives our payback periods to roughly 1 year. And so that's how we've been able to scale and grow the business to the volume of submissions that you're seeing here on the screen. As we think about moving forward, we have both the capital in place as well as a seasonal revolver. As Clint mentioned, Q4 is our busiest period where we incur a lot of cash and a lot of cash flows out the door, just to have, in Q1, the carriers start paying all the commissions on those new plans. So we also have a seasonal revolver in place to help with some of those timing dynamics that we'll be able to continue to leverage to continue to scale our growth. So we're really, really excited about where we're at and the position we're in to continue to drive the growth that we discussed last night.

Yes. I think one thing to add, Tobey, there's been a lot of questions on LTVs and validation. And obviously, LTV predictability is really a proxy for cash, right? So if you think about all of our older vintages and what happened throughout the past several years, in 2020, we collected more than 100% of all that cash. So it's kind of a testament of like the predictability of our model, how kind of, what I'll call, spot on we are. From the day we got into Medicare, we realized that we had to be really, really accurate. At that point, we're really self-funded, and any mistake we made could have been detrimental to the business. So I think we've taken a great approach on how we predict our LTVs. And ultimately, that's resonating the right cash collections.

Perfect. For a second, I want to talk about enterprise revenues. How do you think about the TAM for enterprise revenues? I think this is an aspect of the business that is not shared by all your public sort of peer stocks. And could you discuss the recent growth in the platform and the opportunity set and what you see as the drivers that will provide continued growth in this business over time?

Sure. So if you think about it, I'll go back to the travel industry for a second. When you think about buying an airline ticket, right, when you think about flying American Airlines. I distribute my -- I sell my tickets to -- or through 2 primary channels. One is going to be these kind of online marketplaces, like the Travelocitys, the Expedias, what have you. And the other one is direct-to-consumer. We can go to aa.com and buy your ticket that way. So health insurers are thinking about a similar way, right, where they have their direct-to-consumer way, where they go sell it on a single carrier model. You can go to Blue Cross Blue Shield or you got a health care and buy a plan directly, or you can go through a broker, whether that's an online telephonic broker or a traditional field-based broker. So in that situation, you think about our enterprise platform and programs help those carriers power that direct sales model, right? So we initially started with leveraging, building technology, white label technology with our marketplace platform, for the carriers embedded in their own websites on a single-carrier model. So you could go to carrier ABC, run a quote. It looked like it was akin to them. It looked like their brand. It was our technology in the background. Then we got into them saying, "Hey, can we outsource the sales calls and it leads to you as well? You are more efficient than we are. This is your DNA." So we sort of taken on their direct sales capabilities where the consumer would call in, we'd answer the phone on behalf of that carrier, enroll and get paid a service fee or an enrollment fee. That kind of morphed into doing additional, what I'll call, retention or service type models for them as well and kind of extending that footprint along that way. And now you think about kind of where that can go with our Encompass Platform, as we think about value-based care initiatives, member care assessments, health risk assessments, social determinant health surveys, a lot of extension there. So that's kind of how the model has evolved. Our kind of strategy here is not to go wide in multiple verticals within insurance, but it's to go deep in health care and remain the experts and kind of drive the results that way. So that's kind of how we think about our engagement in that area. We'll get in more detail with our Encompass Platform on our Q1 call. But we started kind of testing our Encompass Platform Q2 of last year, had a couple of pilots going throughout the 2020 and now have rolled those into full-blown programs as we think about 2021 and beyond. So we think there's a huge opportunity to continue to scale up the TAM and grow the revenue from these channels. It also has a long-term benefit of the more engagement we do with consumers in these funnels, the lifetime value actually of those members grows as well, right? Because they're a more engaged member, they're staying on the plan longer and there's a lot more activity there. So we think there's kind of a -- it's a 1 plus 1 equals 4 scenario in that situation. So that's kind of how we've positioned the business. And we capitalize on our enterprise opportunities, which really result around the relationships we've built with carriers over the many years. We get a lot of -- we have been -- we get a lot of questions on our external channel, right? It's a lower margin channel for us. But why do you do it? Well, there's a volume play. And carriers see our platform and our ability for smaller agencies to plug into that technology and be efficient where the carriers actually don't have to manage that agency. They can -- we can manage them for the carriers. And that volume is key. And then the carriers look at us as a very large channel that's got different types of distribution capabilities for the carrier that they can scale up and partner with over the long run.

Inside the industry, there's been some hiccups as far as growing too quickly and choosing the optimal way to do so. How do you put guardrails around your business in terms of persistency in LTV and sustainable growth and not turn too many dials at the same time so you don't know the sort of the cause and the effect of the change?

Yes. No, that's a challenge. If you think about any growing business, I mean, in where your kind of revenue is a key metric here, you've got to be disciplined. So I'll give you a quick example. So this past AEP, we got 2 or 3 weeks in AEP and realized the handle times were longer than we had forecasted, right, which was going to lead to kind of a challenge if you think about the amount of volume we could put through the system. So we had -- but we also had early indicators that the quality of the business, because of those longer handle times that improved needs analysis, was going to be higher. So we kind of held course and stayed -- we're going to stay with these longer handle times. We're going to continue down the path of doing a more rigorous needs analysis because we believe it's going to lead to a higher quality member at the end of the day. Now we may miss out on some revenue, and we may have a higher cost metric here. But we think the long-term strategic decision that's right for the business is to stay the course. So I think having kind of a prudent approach to laying out a strategy, understanding the risk and what guardrails you want to put around those and executing and have your team laser-focused on that is the right thing to do. And I think we're measuring quality, cash along the way in every way we turn to make sure that we don't kind of get ahead of our skis, if you will, and step on our toes.

Yes. I would just add, Clint. I think Tobey were referring to some of our peers in the space and some of the things that have occurred. If you think about, while we have achieved really, really strong growth rates, I think what's unique to us is that the way we've gotten there is continuing to do the same thing and not go outside of what we know, right? So we've got our own proprietary technology that we leverage, where we hire our own internal agents, making sure they're our employees on our platform. They're taking consumers or leads produced by our internal marketing team. So we're not outsourcing our agents. We're not buying third-party leads from third parties that we don't know who these consumers are. And ultimately, we're walking them through our Plan Fit score to make sure we're enrolling them with the right plan and have been thoughtful about slowly adding carriers over time, making sure we understand the unique offerings of all of the carriers to ensure we're educating the consumer as well. And so I think as we think about growth, it's really about how do we continue to do what we do best, knowing what we do and be able to scale that well and being able to operate without going outside by deciding to bring in third-party agents or leverage third parties or buy a bunch of third-party leads. We've been really focused on doing everything that we do internally so we can track and aggregate the data, and ultimately, create the best customer experience. So that's how we think about it, and it's just about how quickly can we do that well in terms of bringing on our own agents, continuing to develop our technology. And that's kind of exactly what our 2021 plan is, is, it's continuing to accelerate those investments.

I think also you've got a management team that's been around working together for a long time. We've got -- I've been here 20 years. We've got quite a few executives, 10-, 15-year tenure. We know the industry. We have the relationships. We kind of know what moves what needle and kind of where to focus on. So we're going to be laser-focused on that execution and ensure that we do everything the right way.

With respect to the longer handling times, is that something you expect to persist into this year? Because while a lot of seniors, in fact, probably all that want it will be vaccinated by the time AEP starts, it probably is still a topic that's front and center.

Sure. Yes. So we expect -- we're okay with if the handle times lead to increased persistency, better kind of customer outcomes from a conviction standpoint around the plan and higher LTVs, that's the right trade-off all day long. We think there's room to optimize that process through additional technology and decision support capabilities. We know along the funnel where we saw the handle times increase. So we can attack those areas and figure out, all right, are there certain things we can put in place, whether it's technology, it's additional decision support or what have you to start focusing on that. So if you think about the average call, we know exactly during that call process, where we saw the increased handle time. So the way our model works, it's all kind of data-driven on our tech stack. So we can look at those and start running A/B tests and things of that nature to see if we can optimize around that area without sacrificing the consumer experience. So that will be iterations we kind of do throughout the first couple of quarters of 2021 as we think about getting prepared for AEP.

Could you talk about the experience here in the first quarter with the selling season, kind of, what you've seen? And do you expect the new administration to continue this opportunity in future years? What's kind of your view there?

Yes. So I'll start with the second part of the question first. Yes, we believe and what we've heard is both the Republicans and the Democrats are favorable for Medicare Advantage. So we've not seen any indication that things will change. Another was discussions around lowering the age of Medicare, that's not in our plans. If that happens, that's awesome, but we don't think that's likely in the next several years. So we're just focused on executing where we can execute. As far as Q1 and some of the trends, the volume and the demand is still there, right? And I think there's a -- I think I go back to the seismic shift, I'll call it, from how Medicare was distributed a few years ago to where we are today, and I think, as anything, once consumers realize how easy it is to go through our platform, leverage the Internet, telephonic enrollment, what have you versus having to meet with somebody at a local Denny's or them come to their house and sit down and fill out a paper application, you can imagine just the velocity of change there. Another interesting stat, and we talked about this yesterday, on our digital channels, 90% of our engagement on our digital channels came from mobile, right? So you think about that customer now that's sitting there on their iPhone or their tablets is probably a customer that will never want to meet with somebody face-to-face or sit down and actually fill out something on paper. So there's a really big shift in trend there. So we think that our platform is positioned for strong growth and capabilities over the next many years. So as we think about kind of the run rate now in Q1 and positioning us for the year, we get excited. And it's just we need to hire, develop, grow, optimize and be more efficient with some of the technology activities we're doing to take advantage of the overall demand we're seeing.

One of the things that was featured on last night's call was a change in the way that you're -- the timing that you're going to bring on new agents this year and grow them and cultivate them. Could you talk about that and maybe some lessons learned from last year in what was an unusual operating environment?

Sure. I'll go with lessons learned first. So we had a -- typically, in years past, Q2 and Q3, later part of Q2 and Q3 are when you really ramped up and brought your agents onboard. And we -- that was -- remember, last year, around March, everybody went from a work-from-home environment. So kind of March, April, you're trying to figure out like how do we take a traditional sales center or call center environment that's all physical to work from homes? There was probably 30 -- 60 and 90 days of figuring that out. And then as we started scaling up, you've got to go through the process of like, "All right, now how do you interview, hire, onboard, train agents totally virtual, without meeting them ever? So we got that process figured out. But then as we started pushing people through to get licensed because like all -- many of the states where we're in, there are actual states and their licensing programs were shut down due to COVID. So we had a big backlog of agents in kind of Q2 and Q3 that we couldn't get through. So that was kind of lesson learned. Now do we think that's going to happen again this year? No. We've also expanded to multiple states that didn't shut down. So we think there's a way to mitigate that risk in case something does happen in the future. But we are going to -- we never had enough agents last year. If I look at the demand we generated, our marketing efficiencies, not at one point in time were we, what I'll call, agent-constrained -- I mean, lead-constrained. We are always agent-constrained, meaning we had more consumers, more opportunities than we ever had our ability to answer 100% of those calls, which is kind of one of the main reasons we're kind of pressing the pedal to bring on more agents earlier in the year.

Okay. What's your expected time line for -- to the extent you can have visibility into a time line, for returning to on-site work? And if you read press reports and think vaccinations are going to proceed on schedule, by October, most people who want one will be able to have one. And if you do plan to return to on-site, is there a productivity improvement that would accompany such change?

Yes, it's a good question. And not having a crystal ball on this whole thing is a little challenging, too, because we have these debates all the time. What does the new norm look like, right? Is it Monday to Friday, 9 to 5? And what is the new norm? We kind of think there's some sort of a hybrid approach here. And we've also hired a lot of agents in areas we don't have physical offices. So the work from home and virtual model is here to stay for us. We think there's an opportunity to bring agents in, especially during the first maybe 90 days they're on with us from a training standpoint to really understand, help them navigate through that first training process. But we've gotten our productivity up really, really strong to where we were when we were in-office. I think having the ability to have some in-office activity to maintain that benchmark of where you want your productivity to be, that then goes out to your virtual agents and say, "This is the norm. You need to get to this level," is a good thing to have. I think the ability to bring people in for -- to meet with their teams face-to-face, to continue that camaraderie, build the culture is critical. So we're going to evaluate, and obviously, follow all the CDC and state and local guidelines when those decisions are to be made. But I think there's an element of work from home or remote staying, if you will. But there's also an element of there's a lot of people that want to get back in the office, want to get around a whiteboard, want to collaborate and have a strategy session. So we'll be flexible on our approach and always do the right thing for the employees in the company.

But it does sound like some of the energy of, at least, periodic on-site, either training or sales activity can have a productivity impact.

Yes, you're 100% correct.

Okay. Could you talk a little bit about the long-term expectations for growth in the Medicare Advantage market? And then with that, not just from a volume perspective, but I was curious what your long-term expectation is for price or sort of commission rates. You did see a little bit faster growth under the prior administration, not a huge change from trend, but a little bit better.

Yes.

So I'm curious what you think of that trend is as well.

Yes. So overall growth, if you think about -- we're still like a tiny fraction of this market. So you've got kind of macro trends of more and more people aging into Medicare. You've got macro trends of more and more people switching from original Medicare to Medicare Advantage. So there's a lot of like tailwinds there that are really, really positive for us. And then I'll say there's some additional like trends around the way that consumers are buying our products as well, right, as opposed to kind of an in-person face-to-face field distribution model, shifting more to a platform like ours that again provides more tailwinds for us. So it's our job to make sure that, that customer experience is second to none. And we start to get a lot of referral business. Our brand starts building, and we become that major player in the space. And when somebody says, "Hey, who do you enroll your Medicare with?" They name GoHealth, right? That's the vision. That's the goal there over time. So we think there's a long runway for growth for us. As I also think about revenue beyond the commission stream, I mean, that's another area we're focused with our enterprise programs, which we think will pay dividends over the next several years as well, then obviously can expand the TAM and just give us another kind of leg to stand on from a school standpoint that we'll continue the growth there as well. So really excited about the position we're in and our growth opportunities. Travis, anything you want to add to that?

Yes. I would just say, as we think about commission rates embedded into our LTVs and how we think about forecasting LTVs in the future, we've taken a conservative approach, understanding exactly what you mentioned, Tobey, about a slight increase in acceleration of commission rates recently. We've pulled back a little bit as we think about what that might mean moving forward and been thoughtful about where we're at with the LTVs, which is again why we're so focused on the denominator of the LTV to CAC equation, knowing that that's ultimately where we're going to win and ultimately drive and continue to sustain the industry-leading margins that we currently experience.

And I know we have just a small amount of time here remaining. We'd love to hear your thoughts on competition and changes that you might expect in particular, and maybe you could segment it between the Commissionable business and your enterprise efforts.

Sure. Yes. I mean, obviously, there's -- if you think about competition on the commission side, there's a couple of public peers and there are some other smaller players in the space. We're focused on our model, what we do best. We think that the agent-assisted model is the right way to go. Consumers have a ton of questions and they need -- still need a lot of hand-holding through this process. So that's kind of where we're focused on the growth there. On the enterprise side, you've got like some outsources. We compete with carriers direct. But we have such a unique offering when we go to carriers and how we approach that business. A lot of times, if we go in and try to win the business, it's there if we see the right opportunity. I think what's -- we're uniquely positioned in -- from our Encompass standpoint, which I know we don't have a lot of information out there in the public eye, what we're actually doing there, which we'll share after our Q1 call. But we think there's a huge opportunity there to leverage our membership growth and then the other value-added services that we can provide to the consumer and the carrier, which will drive good activity there. And as a market leader, once we say something, it seems like every one of our peers ultimately use the word value-based care or they copy some of the ads we're using. And I think that's just the position we're in as you're the kind of leader in the market. But we'll continue to kind of double down on the scaling the new innovations we have. And I think it's a testament of just the carrier relationships we've been able to build over the last many years and our ability to sit at the table with a carrier and have them test and pilot new things with us.

Well, Clint, Travis, Jay, thank you very much for joining us. Good luck with the rest of your meetings today.

Thanks, Tobey. Thanks for [ hosting ].

Thanks, Tobey. Take care.