Helios Fairfax Partners Corporation ($FFXXF)

Love the smiles and the positive energy in the room. Thank you. Good afternoon. Give everyone a minute to settle. Okay. I'll get started. It's great to see so many familiar faces here in the room. Actually, also full of room for a number of new faces. It's great to welcome you. And equally for those of you who are joining us online, good afternoon. Thank you all for taking the time to be with us today. I am Babatunde Soyoye, Co-CEO of Helios Fairfax Partners. I also happen to be a co-managing partner of our investment adviser. On behalf of the Board, my fellow officers and the entire Helios Fairfax team, thank you for your continued support and interest in what we do. For those of you who were with us last year, Toronto provide us with an authentic African operating situation. A power cuts at a very inopportune moment. In Africa, that's the way we roll. This time, we have checked on backup the just in case. Murray, we're good. Okay. The website delivered the presentation last year when the power went was pretty amazing. I mean they told me grope plans called it bad, I didn't believe him, but after that, actually, I really believe it grew pretty bad, which is a place of just outside Lagos where there's probably a bit more power cuts than I will on this -- the agenda for today four main areas. We will start with a quick overview of HFP strategy. We'll then move on to our performance review, which will look -- include a look into how we think about the discounts to book value and what we're doing about this. We'll take questions and close with some remarks on where and how we go from here. On to the reason of why we are here today, if there's one message I would like you to take away, it is this. Helios Fairfax Partners has completed a fundamental reset. The Trouble legacy portfolio is behind us. The new investments are performing. The accounting consolidation is complete. And for the first time, we're in a position to present to you a business where the underlying value is visible. The economics are transparent, and the path forward is clear. This is all, I guess, additional backdrop of an increasingly favorable macro environment. Someone is clicking from me. Thank you. For those of you who may be new our shareholders are also sort of be considering investing in us, I would like to introduce the HFP officer team. Some of you will be familiar with most of these faces. And many of us on these faces is here, we're presenting during the day or answering questions later in the day. Starting with Tope Lawani, my co-CEO, who I've known and worked together with for over 25 years. We're at working together as an early pioneer of the global private equity industry. And I think since then, the vision, the dreams and the ambition was created, and that's what here today. Next on the screen is Luciana Germinario, our COO. Luciana has been instrumental in the operational transformation of HFP over the past several years. We also have Vitali, our CFO, who joined us last year, towards the end of the year, and will present in the financial section today. And last but at the least, our resident in Toronto, Sonia Keshwar, our General Counsel and Corporate Secretary. As you can see, most of us also happen to be part of our investment manager, HIP. And this was a result of some work we spoke about last few years of trying to improve efficiency and efficacy by integrating the businesses together. I would also like to introduce the nonexecutive directors of our Board. Today, we've got Quinn here. We have Kathy here. And we have Chris here. I haven't missed anybody. Chris is here, everyone. So go through our directors here, and I think they are available to talk to and the team to meet with answer your questions on queries through the day. Last but not the least, I'd like to hand over to Tope and pray that he does not have to prove that he's on a bottom point again this time.

Thank you very much, Baba. So very good afternoon and a warm welcome again to all of you. Thank you for taking the time to come and spend with us. I know you all have many important things to do with your time. So always very grateful when you choose to spend it with us. It's a pleasure always a pleasure for me to be here with you. So believe it or not, it's been 5 years since we formed HFP by combining the assets and the capabilities of Fairfax Africa and Helios Investment Partners. And in the next hour or so to come, we will reflect on the journey so far. We'll reorient you on our investment strategy and then bring you up to date on how we're performing against that strategy. And of course, we'll set some time aside to hear your own perspectives and to get -- answer any questions that you may have. And I hope that by the time we wrap up at the end of the day, that you'll share our excitement about what the future holds for HFP. We think it's a really exciting time, and we're glad to be able to share that with you. First, a quick reminder of what HFP is. As you know, we're an investment holding company that focuses on high-growth, high-impact African companies with the benefit of the experience, the expertise and the reach of our investment adviser, Helios Investment Partners. So with HIP, we've been investing in Africa for more than 22 years. And during that period, we have deployed more than $4 billion of equity capital into the region and generated about $5 billion of liquidity. We work out of 4 offices: London; Lagos in Nigeria; Nairobi in Kenya; and in Paris, and of course, in addition to Toronto, where we are now. So Africa is what we do. And in the current environment, you might reasonably ask why Africa. When you have the whole world to choose from, why should you be investing in Africa? And why should you be doing it now? Many reasons. Well, the first one is Africa is very large. You can fit all of the lower 48 states of the U.S., all of China, all of India and much of Western Europe into Africa. So that's just too big a footprint to ignore. I know we didn't throw Canada in there because you guys are quite big, but still. And second, and I think perhaps most importantly, Africa has what the world needs. In a world that is where many of the major economies are suffering or not suffering, but experiencing rapidly aging populations. The attractive demographics of Africa will make it the source of much of the label force of the global community you will need in the decades to come. Second of all, Africa has most of the farmland that the world is going to need for food security. And it has the critical minerals that are required for the semiconductor revolution and for the energy transition. So third, African assets are very attractively priced. The MSCI Africa Index trades at about 11x earnings versus about 26x for the S&P 500 and even the TSX at 22x. I'll come back to this shortly. And lastly, while it's obviously true that you have a broad universe of investment destinations to choose from, there are actually very few that would give you the kind of diversification that Africa actually will. So when you look at the correlation between the returns on African assets and the returns arising from other emerging or developed markets, you see that, that correlation is very low. So I mentioned the fact that African assets are of a better value. Even after the last 12 months when the valuation gap has begun to close, the gap between the valuation of African and also emerging market assets and those of the developed world are still pretty close to an all-time high. You see that on the chart on the left. EM indices are trading about 8 multiple points below the S&P 500 and African indices are full 14 points below. And as you see on the right side, this is notwithstanding the fact that Africa, the emerging markets broadly, the data is not very readily accessible for just Africa. But emerging markets broadly are offering vastly higher rates of earnings growth. So the forecast for this year is about 34% for 2026 versus 20% for the TSX, which in truth is actually not that bad and about 17% for the U.S., the S&P 500. So normally, you would have to choose between value and growth. But in Africa and in emerging markets, broadly, you're actually getting both at the same time, you're getting superior value and superior growth all at once. And now after a long period of underperformance, it started around the -- after the global financial crisis, the relative attractiveness of African markets is starting to show up in performance. Since the start of last year, African indices have outperformed other emerging markets, including favorite destinations like India, and have materially outperformed developed markets like the S&P 500. So since January 2025, MSCI Africa is up more than 50% versus the S&P 500, which is up about 10%, maybe a little bit more than 10%; and MSCI India, which is actually down a little bit. And with valuations in Africa still lower, as we saw before, still lower than those other markets and growth rate is still higher, we believe this cycle is very much in the early innings. We think there's a lot of room still to run. And finally, just to put a finer point on the diversification case. Over the last 20 years, African markets have had a materially lower correlation to returns on the TSX and the S&P 500 than any other emerging markets region. On the left-hand side, you see that, that correlation is only 0.54 for Africa ex SA and 0.62, if you include South Africa. So for a Canadian investor with already significant domestic equity exposure, which I assume will be many shareholders in our company, HIP is not only offering African levels of growth, but it's also offering a source of returns that genuinely moves differently from everything else that's likely to be in that portfolio. So to summarize, why Africa and why now? Well, massive resource wealth and superior demographics, attractive valuations, strong earnings growth, less exposure, believe it not, to geopolitical turbulence; and it offers an excellent source of portfolio diversification. So how we set up as HFP to take advantage of this opportunity? Well, we're an investment company with two segments. First is the Investment segment, and this is where we deploy our balance sheet capital into high-quality opportunities that are originated and managed by Helios -- by Helios Fairfax Partners. These investments will fall into two categories: most of them will form part of a portfolio diversified portfolio designed to generate strong capital gains over a medium-term horizon of, let's say, 5 years. A select view, which have the potential for long-term compounding and cash yield will be designed for a longer hold. And then we have the -- so the investment segment, I should say, is really all about capital appreciation and book value growth. And then we have the alternative asset management segment, which is where we earn fee income through our equity interest in the excess management fees and the carried interest that arise from the funds that are managed by Helios. So this segment is designed to generate recurring, durable and scalable earnings. So to recap, we believe that Africa presents a very timely and exciting opportunity that we have the capability and the business model to capitalize on that opportunity. And so the next question is, how are we actually performing against that backdrop? Before we get into the numbers, I'd like to do a little retrospective on the journey of these past 5 years. In 2020, we inherited a very challenged portfolio of investments. We have now virtually fully divested our portfolio and redeployed the capital into strongly performing investments originated and managed by Helios. And we've also invested in the launch of several new and promising investment strategies in sports and entertainment, venture capital and public equities. On the alternative asset management side, we got off to a rocky start. COVID made it virtually impossible to do a normal fundraising for Helios IV -- Helios' fourth private equity fund. And that ended up being much lower than target in the ultimate size with correspondingly lower fee income arising from that fund. And those effects continue to be with us for the years to follow -- that followed. Today, things are in a very different place. Helios has successfully raised ClearOne, its climate focused fund and has successfully invested Helios IV, which is creating strong momentum for the raising of Helios V. These efforts have created a solid foundation for the alternative asset management business going forward. And operationally, a huge amount has been achieved even if less visible from the outside. Five years ago, we were heavily dependent on our partners at Fairfax for several key functions. But since then, we have materially strengthened our executive team and have achieved full operational independence. And lastly, and I know very importantly, because many people in this room have identified this to me historically, our complex structure led to financial reporting that was very dense, very hard to understand, even, I should say, for financial professionals. We're pleased to say that we've now completed an accounting transformation, which we believe will materially simplify our reporting. You'll hear much more about this from my colleague, our CFO, Vitali, in a couple of minutes. So 5 years on, the transition is complete, the foundation is strong and HFP is poised for a bright and exciting future. And yet, the share price does not reflect any of this. The orange line, which you see at the top represents book value per share, which is our preferred measure of performance. After a long downward trend, the efforts and progress that I described began to show up in book value growth at the beginning of 2025. And book value per share has been up every quarter since then. But the blue line, the share price has continued its downward trend and actually for time, accelerated that downward trend. So that by the end of 2025, which our HIP shares were trading at a 65% discount to book value. That's by far the highest that we've seen so far. So to state the obvious, share price performance is what matters. That's what matters to most to all of you. And as very significant shareholders ourselves, we have that in common. So why is it that the share price is not reflecting the recovery and the potential in the business? We believe it comes down to three main factors: One is complexity; two is historical performance, I'll elaborate more on that soon; and the third is illiquidity in the stock. We'll take each of these in turn. And since complexity is the most complex, I'll be very happy to hand that one over to someone who is much more qualified to articulate the nature of that problem and the solutions that we've enacted. So please welcome our CFO, Vitali Harwardt.

Thank you, Tope. Good afternoon, everyone. I'm Vitali Harwardt, CFO at HFP. I joined HFP in November last year and worked before for more than 20 years in private equity funds and listed corporations. What I would like to do over the next slides is to walk you through how we are addressing the complexity topic. Our corporate structure, particularly around the ownership of fee and Kristen through TopCo A and B has made it difficult for the market to see the underlying value drivers of our business. TopCo A represents our carried interest entitlements and TopCo B represents our management fee entitlements. Both are recorded at fair value in our balance sheet. And the problem is that the fair value movements has made it difficult to follow our financial statements and it reduced the high volatility. These movements do not always reflect the underlying operational performance of our business and made it harder for the investments to follow our true earnings power. On top of that, the way we historically reported limits our comparability with listed asset managers. The revenue streams are bundled inside for value movements rather than being presented as recurring high-quality fee income streams as they actually are. We recognize that this complexity has been a barrier to a balanced valuation. Let me now walk you through how we're addressing it. Effective first January '26, we have transitioned to a consolidated reporting. And there are several key changes connected to it. First, we have consolidated the key entities from our alternative asset management business into a senior group together with the investment business. This eliminates the multilayered structure that made our financials difficult to follow. Second, we are enabling HFP to report revenue streams that are behind the TopCo A and B investments directly, no longer hidden inside OPEC fair value movements. Third, we are introducing a segment reporting for the alternative asset management and investment business as outlined by Tope. This means investors will be able to see clearly and separately the performance of each of the 2 economic segments we described earlier. And finally, we are providing a supplementary investor-friendly reporting that is more comparable to our peers in the listed asset management space. So the objective is simple, simplify and enhance transparency. Let me show you what this looks like in practice. I'll start with the balance sheet. This is what investors have been looking at prior to consolidation in a simplified version. You see the TopCo investments at the top. Again, TopCo A representing the current entitlements and TopCo B, the management fees. These are fair value assets on complex holding structures and the underlying economics are not clearly visible. The presentation for portfolio investments is rather focused on accounting standards and legal structures instead of according investment classes. So the problem is clear. An investor looking at this balance sheet cannot easily see what's inside, how the underlying businesses are performing or how value is being created. And this is exactly what we set out to improve. Now here's a side-by-side comparison. On the left, you see the old balance sheet, the one I just walked you through. And on the right, the consolidated view as of year '25. By consolidating the TopCo A and B investment, we now recognize the underlying contractual assets directly. Intangibles representing the contracted management fees and current entitlements, and go to representing the corresponding future portions. More important is the presentation of the portfolio investments. They are now split out into different asset classes, private equity growth venture and listed securities, enabling all stakeholders to apply the right valuation metrics at each asset type to close the valuation gap. Total assets increased were with $67 million. The main difference are the additionally consolidated private equity asset from the alternative asset management entities that provide entitlements to co-invest and future management teams. Let me now walk you through the changes in the P&L. Again, you see on the left side, the P&L prior to consolidation. Under the prior reporting framework, the P&L showed $64 million of investment income at the top line. This was essentially the fair value movement of HFP's investment portfolio, including TopCo vehicles. Below this, you see the advisory fees, G&A expenses, other expenses, lending into operating profit and net income. And the key issue here is the visibility. The management fees that HFP earns through TopCo A and B, high quality and recurring fees are not visible here, an investor cannot distinguish between variable fair value movements and recurring management fees, that makes it very difficult to value the asset management business. Let me show you how we address this through consolidation. Here's again the side-by-side comparison. On the left, you see the old presentation and on the right, the consolidated P&L. The critical change is at the top Management fees of $23 million are now reported as a separate revenue line combined with investment income of $64 million, total income rises to $87 million. On the cost side, you will notice the investment in advisory fee line drops to 0. This reflects the consolidation of fees paid from HFP to HFP Helios Investment Partners, now being part of one consolidated group. The G&A expenses rise to $45 million. This reflects the inclusion of costs to run the asset management business; the cost of our main office in London, where most of the investment team and platform team sits; and the cost of our smaller offices in Paris, Legos and Nairobi. To summarize, the consolidated P&L now provides a transparent view on the earnings, fee income that is directly comparable to listed peers and investment returns that can be assessed independently, all in one P&L with associated costs to support the business. Now let me walk you through the main changes in the segment reporting. This is the same P&L on a consolidated view without the old format along side so that you can compare the changes side by side. The new segment reporting will separate our financial statements in two segments, as already outlined into the Investment segment and alternative asset management segment. The Investment segment will capture the realized and unrealized fair value gains in our portfolio, less the costs associated with managing and sourcing these investments. The alternative asset management segment will report fee-related earnings as a key performance measure consisted with how our listed peers reported. And the performance-related earnings from carried interest will reflect the Asset Management segment when the applicable performance thresholds are met under IFRS. Additionally, we will also introduce best practices for KPI performance measures to improve comparability to other listed peers. Investors will be able to look at our fee-related urgent -- margin and growth and compare it with our listed peers regarding performance and value improvement. And finally, this slide brings it all together into one valuation framework. Everything I've just shown to you, the transparent P&L, the balance sheet, the segment reporting, all feeds into this valuation framework. The framework is a sum of the parts. You see on the left side, the investments with the fair value. On the right asset classes, as already outlined. And you see on the other side, the alternative asset management segment with fee-related earnings and performance-related earnings, each valued against market multiples for comparable listed asset managers. That is how we will measure the value of HP. And if you compare it with our current market value, you will notice there's a significant discount currently, which we set out to close. To sum it up, the reporting improvements I've outlined are designed to give you the building blocks to apply this framework to yourselves while reviewing our financials, transparent investment classes, visible revenue streams and comparable performance metrics, all of the inputs you need to perform your own valuation. And with that, I will hand over to Tope for the performance review.

So we've -- two things, actually. So we've clearly covered a fair bit of ground and some of this is still a little bit dense, but it's a simplifying form of dent. So -- we will have a Q&A opportunity afterwards. And so please feel free to ask any questions that you might have after that. The other point I wanted to make is Sonia has just mentioned to me that I know that some of you are keen to capture some of the data on the slides, but just so that you know we'll be posting the presentation onto the website when this is done. So don't feel the need to do that. Well, thank you very much, Vitali. So just to recap as to where we were. So the first challenge and the first reason we think driving the discount has been this complexity point, and Vitali shared with you our solution to that problem, which brings me to the second one. And this is historical underperformance and the extent to which the historical underperformance created investor skepticism about the timing and extent of a durable recovery. And there are several dimensions to this. On the investment side, the legacy portfolio really weighed down on our NAV for several years as the mix shift to the more strongly performing Helios managed investments took time. On the investment -- on the alternative asset management side, the fee miss on Fund IV and the general, I think, is popularly known the generally difficult private equity fundraising environment, I think caused investors to have some doubt as to the prospects for recovery in that particular segment. And of course, the early-stage losses on the newly seeded investment strategies were a drag as well. So this created a little bit of a show-me mentality among shareholders, which is entirely understandable. But so let me try to show you. What you see from this chart is a clear break between the past and the present. From 2020 to 2024, we divested six legacy positions, we launched four new investment strategies. And as I mentioned before, we made significant operational improvements, a huge amount of positive activity. But these improvements did not show up in rising book value. Instead, book value declined at an average rate of about 9% over that period. So it wouldn't be surprising if shareholders were questioning the effectiveness of these initiatives in driving the thing that matters, which is book value per share. And so basically, a credibility gap existed. Now with all of that having been bedded down in 2025 being an almost clean, if you will, year, the flow-through to rising book value is now happening. During 2025, book value per share rose by 10% and actually accelerated on a quarter-on-quarter basis as the year wore on. So we're entering 2026 with very good momentum on that front. What is also noteworthy is that the growth in book value has come from both segments of the business. We ended 2024 with $416 million in book value. And during 2025, the Investment segment added $52 million in gains, the first orange box that you see. And the Alternative Asset Management segment added $3 million. And after accounting for overheads and other items, we ended the year with $457 million in book value or about $4.22 per share. By the way, it shouldn't be too surprising that the -- that we're seeing the benefits flow through first on the investment side because after all, changes in the values of investments happens instantaneously. On the alternative asset management side, things take longer. The funds that are being raised have to get to their final close, the net fee income has to flow through with operating leverage and then carried interest follows last. So that -- it shouldn't be too surprising. But the point is that this kind of broad-based growth is evidence that the economic engines of the business are all working and contributing positively, and that's a very good thing. So let's turn to the Investment segment in more detail. The main point to highlight on this page is at the far right, which is the performance is very strong. We have $360 million in value invested in 19 companies. And as of December 2025, we're achieving a 23% IRR across that whole portfolio. We think that's very strong performance by global standards. And beyond the existing portfolio, the investment pipeline that's being generated by Helios is rich in opportunities that reflect the potential and attract valuations that Africa has to offer. Our alternative asset margin segment has an interest in two active strategies. The first is Helios' generalist PE strategy, which comprises two funds that now fully invested Helios IV and the new Helio V, which is being raised and invested as we speak. And the second is Helios' climate-focused fund to ClearOne which is nearing a final close and has also begun investing. There are two other strategies that are in development, HSRF, which invests in public equities and to a lesser extent, corporate and sovereign credit; and HDV, which makes tech venture capital investments. Both have been ceded with HFPs capital and returns so far have been quite strong. And it's now a matter of Helios raising fee-earning third-party capital to scale them. The three basic requirements for the success of any alternative investment business. First, you have to fund raise then you have to invest well and then you have to generate liquidity and exits and send the money back to your fund investors. So we'll take each one, one by one. First, on fundraising. The cycle is certainly turning in favor of emerging markets. The macro conditions that made EM private equity fundraising so challenging from, let's say, the end of the global financial crisis, to about 2023, essentially very low interest rates in developed markets, driving really strong performance in financial assets have shifted decisively. Investment strategies that depended on high leverage and just sitting back and enjoying the multiple expansion are not working anymore. And to investors -- fund investors are once again interested in funds that are less about low rates and they provide true diversification from whatever else they already own. So Helios is benefiting from this as evidenced by the success in raising ClearOne, which is the largest climate-focused Africa fund, and by the progress that they are making and have made towards raising -- towards achieving the $750 million target for Helios V. So that's on the fundraising side. On investing, Helios IV continues to perform very strongly, recording a 23% gross IRR and a 2.1x gross multiple of money as of December 2025. According to the industry data we have seen, this would place it around the top decile of PE funds globally of that vintage, which would be very impressive indeed. And Helios V is off to a very good start, having completed its first investment, which was an acquisition of the leading glass packaging business in Nigeria. It's a company called Basic glass. This is a company that makes more than 65% of all the glass bottles that are made that are used by the beverage companies in a country of 220 million people and growing. Suffice it to say that we think this will prove to be a very valuable asset indeed. And ClearOne has also made its first investment in a company called Sun Mobility, which is a leading designer and operator of EV battery swapping infrastructure that's already strong in India and now pushing to expand across Africa with Helios' help. And for both Helios V and ClearOne, the investment pipeline beyond these initial investments is very healthy. So good news on fundraising, good news on investing. And lastly, liquidity and exits. Here again, Helios is performing well. Despite the well-publicized challenges the PE funds are having in exiting their investments, Helios continues to successfully generate liquidity for its fund LPs. In 2025, Helios generated $460 million in liquidity, bringing the cumulative liquidity generated across Helios I, II and III to about $4.7 billion, a bit more than $4.7 billion. And by the way, this is heavily weighted towards what we consider to be high-quality exits. So sales to strategic buyers, exits through public markets, not pass the parcel deals with other financial buyers. So similar to the positive situation in the investment segment, performance and prospects for the Alternative Asset Management segment are also looking quite good. So back to where we started, what is driving the discount? First, complexity in our structures made our financials hard to understand and made it extremely difficult to compare us to our peers. We've addressed that with the accounting transformation that Vitali described. Second, the historical declines in book value per share that led shareholders to question whether all of these great initiatives would ever show up in the numbers are behind us. The initiatives are taking hold, the underlying businesses are healthy, and the progress is now showing up in the form of rising book value per share, which brings us to the third factor that we believe is driving the discount, which is the lack of liquidity in the stock. The free float is small. The relatively small market cap makes entry challenging for investors that are seeking larger positions. And the low trading volumes deter equity research because there's no trading income for them to make from it. And this in turn limits market awareness, particularly outside of Canada. So what are we doing about that? Well, these are structural constraints. There is no single silver bullet, and we're not going to solve this overnight. But we're super focused on it and solve it, we will. Obviously, the first thing that we can do is to continue to drive NAV growth because even with a discount which will -- even with a discount NAV growth will cause the market cap to increase. And a small float against a larger market cap can lead to a meaningful improvement in liquidity just by itself. Aside from that, we're pursuing a number of initiatives. We're evaluating, for example, options, alternatives, I should say, for sponsored research for commissioned research. And we're materially enhancing and broadening our investor relations effort, both within Canada and also in markets where there is a greater concentration of EM focused investors, places like London, for example. And on the free float more broadly, we're exploring various alternatives. Again, there's no silver bullet that is -- that has made itself obvious. But we'll continue to work at it and we'll continue to communicate to shareholders, particularly when we have something concrete to say. So summing it up, it's very obvious that the company is materially undervalued today. At Friday's close, we were trading at a 55% discount to NAV or rather to book value, which is better than the 65% of December, but it's still massive. Taking just the actual tangible investments that we have on the balance sheet and ascribing no value whatsoever to the alternative asset management business, you get to about $3.26 per share. That's a 70% increase over the current price. And when you include the value of TopCo, this is pre consolidation, but just taking the value of TopCo today, that's the alternative asset management business, you get to $4.22 per share being our book value, more than double the current share price. And of course, that ascribes no value at all to the franchise. So as an example, carried interest that Helios might earn and therefore, that we would get a share of from funds that might be raised in the future, surely, that's going to be worth something. So where do we go from here? Well, if we continue to execute as we are and continue to improve the way that we communicate our performance, and expand the universe of investors that we reach out to, we believe there is very meaningful upside to the share price. In a modest scenario, which you see on the lowest line, if we simply compound book value per share 10% per year, which, by the way, is below our stated long-term objective of 15% and the discount narrows to 30%, which is still very large. That would result in more than 20% annual return on the share price over the next 5 years. At the orange line, compounding book value of 20% per year and narrowing the discount to 20%, that would yield more than a 4x return on the shares over that period. Is that far fetched? I don't think so. So there's a lot to play for. I hope you get the impression that we're extremely excited about what lies ahead, and we hope you share that enthusiasm. Thank you very much for listening. We've covered, as I said, a lot of ground. We'd be more than happy to take any questions that you may have or hear the perspectives that you have on what we've shared so far. So thank you very much.

So good afternoon, everyone. We're starting the Q&A section of the presentation. We have people online and obviously, people in the room. So if you want to ask a question from in the room, just raise your hand and the mic will be provided. And then we'll cover also some online questions. So...

Good afternoon. Thank you for a great presentation. And congratulations on your earnings of more than $40 million in 2025, $0.37 rather per share and your growth of 10% in book value. There seems to be like a turnaround story, and I was wondering if you can speak maybe a little bit about the Sports & Entertainment division, the NBA Africa investment, particularly. And in regards to your plans of crystallizing the value of that asset, if any plans might be in the future. And in view of the valuations in the United States of professional sports franchises, as we know, are quite significant. So any plans for the crystallization of value for that.

Sure. Happy to take -- can you hear me? Yes. Thank you for the question. So I'll give -- first, a general response in terms of what is the thesis behind our choosing to invest in this sector. The thesis is essentially the same that applies more or less to every investment that we make in Africa, which is we like investments or sectors that are driven by two things. One is the demographics and urbanization trends in Africa; and the second is technology and innovation. And when you think about demographics, first of all, Africa, as I mentioned in the presentation, has the most youthful demographic in the world. The median age is 19. In Europe, it's 43; the U.S. is 39; forgive me for not knowing what it is in Canada, but it's probably about 39; and China is aging very quickly. So what that tells you is that if over the next several -- in the decades to come, something like 70% to 80% of the growth in the population of young people globally will come from Africa. So what that means is that anything that you associate with young people sports, music, literature, this that and the other thing, we'll probably becoming increasingly out of Africa, and we're seeing it already. If you look at sort of the performance on all the streaming media in terms of what genres of music are growing fastest, African contemporary music is growing much faster than Kapopnow, which was for a long time the leader and so on and so forth. So we think that, that demographic trend is going to naturally lead to opportunities in this space. The second is on the technology side where Africa has not historically been a big media market because affordability is relatively low, right? And the reason for that has been -- it's been a very -- so cable television, for example, or satellite really more precisely, it's all you can eat. So you pay a lot of money to get everything all the channels that you can consume. Well, very few households in Africa can afford that. But with technology and the fact that 1 billion people now are walking around with mobile phones and about 600 million of them are smartphones, the ability to consume media has become much more democratized, so the market has become enlarged. So we think that the market for consuming entertainment products, which are basically media product, within Africa itself has grown. So that's the big thesis. Now as it relates to the individual investments, of course, there's the NBA Africa, which probably is the best known because it's the NBA. But in addition to that, we have BFL, which is a mixed marshal arts series, PFL Globe is the second largest after UFC. That's one of our investments, the Africa subsidiary, I should say. We have the Malikai Group, which operates the largest festivals business for African contemporary music and so on and so forth. So we think of these as collectives and as mutually reinforcing and interacting pieces of a whole. So the NBA Africa investment is part of that. By itself, it's a bit less than 10% of our investment portfolio. We obviously have very high hopes for it. But I would urge you to think of the Helio Sports & Entertainment Group as a whole. And from a monetization standpoint, it will be long-term investment. It's a growth investment fundamentally. And our objective would be at some point either to take that public or who knows, maybe there might be strategics that might be interested in buying or which we don't believe is super far fetched.

In the -- can you hear this on. Yes. In the management fee disclosure, the new management is and there were the active strategies that you had was private equity and then clear. But with the new capital raised, doesn't HFP also have a management fee component to it as well?

That's a really good question. You found the hard case. HSCT sort of straddles both because it does have -- there is a management fee component. It's not technically a management fee as such. It's more of a -- it's a cost contribution, but effectively, you could think of it as working the same way. But as between the two, we view -- the weight of HSCT really is on the investment side, if that makes sense. But that -- but you are correct.

Okay. And then there was, I think, maybe two since the last one got cut off. web, but I think maybe two investor days ago, you guys kind of went through the math on incremental AUM to breakeven FRE to then what could it look like after that with Fund IV hopefully getting to a close kind of -- or Fund V, I'm sorry. Where do we kind of stand with that today? And how are you thinking about that going forward?

I think just -- I'm just a bit cautious about any kind of forward-looking statement on that. I think what we can do is to sort of do a similar what if, if you see what I mean, that's similar to what we did last time rather than provide really a forecast, which I'm -- I think Sonia would tell me I should not do.

Got a quick one. Thank you very much, Tope, for the presentation. Can you expand a little bit on the thesis for M2P and conduit and where that fits in with the overall strategy?

Okay. So I think the African market where, as you know, 50 -- over 50 countries and where the currency is a big issue for places the costs of moving money around and storing money with devalues against the dollar. So a big -- think is the use of technology in the help and to solve that problem or those problems, and a big solution around that is this whole stable coin as a means of solving those problems in Africa and globally, would Africa have been actually the bigger users of blockchain type technologies globally. So conduit basically plays to that theme. MTP, on the other hand, is as -- so Africa is Calastopa mentioned, very large population, very young population, but usually on banks, sort of 20%, 30% of the population is banked. So the growth of the -- population and through fintechs and banks is quite massive and quite large. But given the old technologies of the big old clunky pay 30 million for a big system, we think that's not the way that's going to actually enable those markets to develop and have customers served. So we found this company called MTP that developed -- has developed and is doing quite nicely and growing quite nicely in India. I use this what I call modularized financial technologies, SaaS products to enable fintechs and banks literally buy for paper accounts for each price card rather than spend huge upfront costs to get into business. So this is all about just the fundamental growth in Africa, understanding the problems that people at Africa, people and businesses face. And finally companies, I've got leading world-class technology. I can solve those problems and applying them to the African continent.

We have a couple of questions from online as well that -- oh, okay. Sorry.

Can you talk about what do you do with the geopolitical risk? And how does that affect you decide which country to invest on your project?

Yes, that's an excellent question, and I'll take it. It's interesting because we actually believe that one of the strong advantages of being invested in Africa is that we are -- no one is immune by the way, from geopolitical risk, but less so if you think back, for example, to Liberation Day and the imposition of tariffs across the board. What's interesting about Africa, I'm not saying this is a universally good thing, but as it relates to geopolitical risk. If you take that as an example, of all of the exports of Africa, 4% goes to the U.S., right? And of that 4%, 20% is in manufactured goods. The remaining 80% of the 4% is in commodities and things of that nature, which were sort of outside of the sanctions regime. So while -- so Africa, when you're providing things that the world needs and you're not fighting the great power battles, you tend not to be -- you may be collateral damage to some of these things, but you tend not to be the target of these sorts of initiatives. So from that standpoint, we actually think, given what's going on the world right now, Africa is well placed. In fact, what we're seeing is greater competition amongst the so-called great powers for influence in Africa, which unlike 150 years ago is actually manifesting in better, more interesting deals for African countries, African governments, and we think that's on the balance for the better. We're not saying that it's better that the world is turbulent, but we're just saying given where we are, that's better. So that's on that side. But I would say that more generally though, in our business because we're private equity investors or were really illiquid investors in illiquid situation. It's very difficult to make a decision to invest in a country because you think it will be perfect for the rest of time. So we don't actually invest in that way. We invest in actual opportunities. And in every individual opportunity, we try to assess, okay, what is the exposure of this particular company to this particular kind of -- to geopolitical risk generally. So if you take a company like conduit, which is one of the ones that I was referring to, well, conduit enables people to move money around across borders in and out of countries or regions where there's a lot of friction around that. There's costs around the capital controls, et cetera, et cetera. And it does this in a very regulatorily compliant way. Well, whatever the geopolitical risk is, that is a need that will exist and probably is actually inversely correlated to geopolitical risk. So we look at opportunities. We don't invest in countries. We look -- we invest in companies. And we look for companies that in our risk evaluation, are able to withstand or at least to thrive, notwithstanding any kind of political upheaval.

I have two questions. The first one is, can you tell us 2 or 3 countries in Africa that -- where you're playing, which have the best corporate governance or sort of the best rule of law and your favorite places to invest everything else being equal?

Well, so that's -- again, I think we've been investing in Africa for 22 years. So we've experienced -- all these scenarios are not new. We're not exploring, right? So again, to the question of rule of law, which is some of you commonly hear about being deficient in Africa, we live it. We've been living it forever. And we have not had situations where a rule of law -- and I'll expand on this point where that has been an issue for us in any investment. And the simple reason is when we make it -- so where you get in trouble is when -- it depends on the counterparty and the kind of relationship you have with the counterparty. If I make a promise to the government to do -- where I do something now and the government will do something in 10 years, that's a pretty risky type of contractual situation, right? Because I'm not sure that I can rely on them. But if I'm selling goods to a private sector buyer who is paying for them because buying them because they want them and have a contract, I can enforce a contract in courts. So as long as I'm in the private sector world, and I'm going to -- and I have recourse of the courts, I can do that. Now the courts might move slowly and so on and so forth. That's a different point. But there is actually recourse. It's not super complex. So we -- so I'll tell you the -- probably one of the best single investments we've ever had was our telecom towers business in Democratic Republic of Congo. There's no 1 here who would put DRC high on their list of of countries with good corporate governance, right? However, when you're in it's a difficult operating environment, there's a huge demand for telecom services. The mobile operators need to have towers. And therefore, the more -- the bigger the problem you're solving for them, the greater the returns that accrue to you. So I think I'm just -- I'm not trying to not answer the question, but we just don't look at it through that lens. It's just not the lens that we apply when we invest. We get much more micro in terms of who is doing what to who, who's your counterparty, what's your value chain, and is that a risk worth taking.

That's fair. You're talking to somebody one's 4% of a gold mine in Nicaragua. So...

Okay, fair enough. Okay.

My next thought is not as much of a question as a comment, which is I've been through a handful of these meetings for the last 3 or 4 years, maybe a little longer. And this is the first year that the turn has been obvious to the people to me. Before the graph was going down. And my advice is don't worry too much about the stock for the next 12 months, don't spend any energy on it, grow the book value. I would tell you, don't spend a minute on the stock because if you grow the book value, you'll get your stock price. The stock is hard to buy. People will find it. And in a year, if you come back here and the book is not 422, but 450 or 470, your stock won't be $2 and you'll have -- It will be easier. You've got to kind of have the full turn of the full story. I'm not telling you anything you probably don't know, but that's my advice. It will take care of it of your job is to get the book value growing at 15% to 20% a year, everything else to work out.

That's good advice. Thank you.

Okay. Maybe we take one online as well. Can you walk us through what your reporting changes mean for investor? Vitali, do you want to take that one?

Yes. There are several key improvements connected to it. First is the transparency. So in the P&L, the management fees and the performance fees will be available, representing our true earnings power. In the balance sheet, we will present all the asset classes for the investments by tie private equity venture growth. So this will improve materially the transparency for the investors. Then we have the enhanced valuation framework. Right now, we have all the investments there, and this will be completed by the related earnings and performance-related earnings with multiples. So with a more complete valuation framework, which would represent HFP's value. And the last 1 I would add is the comparability to other listed asset management peers. So we will introduce like fee-related earnings, share-related earnings margin growth. So we would be more comparable to other peers regarding our performance and value. So all is an enhancement regarding the reporting.

Okay. Any other questions?

I'm a prospective shareholder, so I'm not apologize if I'm not overly familiar with your operations, but a great presentation. In terms of increasing book value, how do you measure the book value of progress of private investments?

That's actually a really good question. Vitali, do you want to talk about how the valuation price?

Yes. Yes. Basically, if you summarize what's book, it's equity growth and everything lands at the end of the day, it equity your whole P&L. So your whole all fair value movements, the expenses, everything will be reflected there after the year-end and for value movements of private equity investments, which are in the balance sheet and they will land in the P&L and ultimately, in the book value, yes. But that's not all. So there will be also -- the growth is also dominated by the cost, so the ultimate result counts for us. So we should be disciplined also cost-wise and on all investments we do, not only private equity investments, we have also growth venture. So everything counts for us.

And maybe if I can add, if you're referring to the fact that the companies are private and therefore, there is not a mark-to-market on a daily basis, we go through an exercise on a quarterly basis, and we look the progress of the company on a quarterly basis across the entire portfolio, across all strategies. And we discuss the progress in terms of earnings potential exit, multiple expansion or different methodology that we apply. And we do that on a quarterly basis, if that answers your question.

Yes. And so you use things, for example, like comparable company multiples, we think -- so let's say we make an investment today, and we make -- we buy it, I don't know, 5x EBITDA, for example, and the comps, the most similar publicly traded comps are trading at 5x. Then you just sort of track them and if they go down, you just assume that your value has gone -- your multiple has gone down as well and vice versa if they go up. Usually, we're applying some sort of a discount to what is actually a public market comp. And we have these -- these valuations are reviewed, correct me if I'm wrong, Vitali, reviewed quarterly by KPMG and then audited right annually, is that exactly. So reviewed quarterly by KPMG or is it annually. But yes, it's -- they're market standards. EPA has valuation standards, I think, pretty much all private equity firms are required to buy.

I guess my question is specifically around the fee income. So the management fee versus the performance fee. So I know you mentioned there were about $450 million of exits last year. So management fee would come to an end at the end of 2025. So 2026 would not have any. But how would the performance fee work? Like would it take 1 year, 2 years, 3 years? How long does the car interest work, I guess, come through on the, I guess, management fee line -- sorry, on the field momentum?

Yes. So how much time -- so I'll describe this to one, but I might prefer to be tell you how IFRS accounts for it. So most of our funds on what's called the European waterfall. So what that means is when you -- so let's say it's a $100 million fund for the sake of argument, you deploy the $100 million and you have to return the whole $100 million back to LPs and the deferred return. So let's say it's an 8% preferred return cumulatively, you have to return that to the LPs. And so when you've done that across the whole fund, then you start to earn your share, the general partner share of the 20%, of which HFP then has an interest. So it's quite back-end loaded. So the answer to your question is it depends on where that $460 million -- what that $460 million represents, whether it's a return of capital or whether it's a catch-up on the hurdle or whether you're in the carry? But then there's an IFRS dimension in terms of when it's recognized, and I think I probably have to defer to the experts on that one.

Yes. So maybe to add also on this. So those are different fee streams. So the management fees are pretty stable. So you apply just 2% on the assets. And this is really visible in our P&L. So multiplied by all the funds, and then you have the management sees. And as outlined by Tope, the performance fees are more complex. You have the waterfall. So first, you have to return the capital, then you have the 8% hurdle and so on and so on. And once you have the threshold where you are able to realize the carrier that this is where you met the threshold and you can realize this in your P&L.

It takes from the start of a fund from the point in time, we probably finish -- it depends on So if your first investment was at 10x, that is very quick. Yes. So -- very clear. So I think the point I think it really depends on your portfolio, your pace of it. It's actually very -- and by the European waterfall makes it more back-ended than what you might see elsewhere the point.

And I think if you think about it simplistic terms, you start investing the fund, they'll take you 3 to 5 years to be fully invested, then you start realizing not always in the same order that you invested, but that will take some time. And you need to return all the capital to your LPs and the prepared hurdle. So they will take a little bit more time. So it's back-end loaded, so you can count 5-plus kind of scenario.

Yes. Maybe to add on this. So as Luciana outlined, it's a typical J-curve, which is about 5, 6 years. And in our P&L, we would have follow-up funds. So right now, it's [indiscernible] 5.6. So they all will go through the cycles and you would see a recurring stream once we have one cycle after each other.

I would like to know what is your long-term target of increase -- percentage increase in book value per share long term. What is the number? And why?

Sure. Yes, few years ago, we put the target out for long-term book value per share growth, which is 15%. It's ambitious, but it's what we believe, what we should be achieving for the shareholder when we invest in Africa. And I think you saw that -- they were -- depending on the segment. You saw in 2025, we were at 13%. So we are on our way towards achieving that target, but it's a long-term objective.

Sorry, can I -- so this might be a little bit nitpicky, but just trying to understand the tough period that you've been through. So am I correct in saying that there is a distinction between our generally private equity structures and management fees versus incentive fees. So what I mean by that is while you're deploying the fund, you earn the management fee. Once you've deployed the fund, you do not earn the management fee anymore, which means that if you're running a corporation, what you really want is to stack the fund. So you want like as the first, let's say, as the prior fund is getting to a point of being fully deployed, you then -- in order to continue to earn management fees, you need to have another active fund, which is -- which I would assume is a major issue with what happened with COVID and the inability to raise funds would -- I would expect that what would happen is you'd go through a period, which one could regard as unusual for an established operation, where you don't have the normal fund that you would expect to have in operation at the time when it should be there, which means you, in a rather unusual way, did not earn management fees for that period. So I guess a very long question, but I first want to know, is that correct? Okay? And then the second question, which flows from that is, given the tough -- if that is correct, given the tough time that you've been through and given the lack of management fee, has it affected your productive capacity? In other words, were you able to retain your teams and fund their existence such that you are firing on all cylinders as you seek to deploy the funds that you're raising now? Or is it so bad that you actually had to retrench capacity through that period?

That's a really good question. So the answer to the second is, no, we didn't have to retrench. We were able to retain the team, et cetera. But the reason for that is that the reality is not as extreme as you described in the sense that, at least in our funds, and I think for most -- well certainly in our funds, and we speak for that. You don't go from earning the management fee to not earning the management fee. You earn -- for the investment period, which is typically 5 years, the management fee is earned on the total fund commitments. Then once you get beyond the investment period, so after the fifth year, you're still earning the same -- the management fee, 2% or whatever that fee is, but applied to the investments that you have in the portfolio at cost. Do you see what I mean? So there's a step down, but it's not a step away, right? So you might go from 100% of the management fee in the fifth year, by the sixth year, maybe it's 80%, right? So it tapers off. So it doesn't mean that -- you're still being rewarded for that. And so -- but your general point is true, you then need to raise another fund in good time to sort of plug that even if it's a 20% gap or a 40% gap, you still do need to plug that. And so what we think is with a -- hopefully, we'll avoid another COVID but also with the diversification of funds. So between the clear funds HSRF, HTV, et cetera, et cetera, you're not having all your -- everything coming off at the same time from a calendar standpoint.

SP-23 I'll Also add to that which is what we're seeing is that the different strategies are having on the whole different investor types from different regions and different. So I think that's the on the business as well. That reduces the volatility that will come from the kind of thing that you mentioned.

Thanks for all the good work you guys are doing. I've been here coming to these for a couple of years. I was here with some of the legacy stuff when you guys took over and the tankless work you did of having to answer questions -- answer questions from angry people about stuff that you are in here when it happened. But my question is, is more to the idea of you guys founded this investment manager, and now there is HFP. You guys are big holders of HFP and you have the investment manager. We have some claims on the income streams of the investment manager. A view now this is just -- and thanks for consolidating the reporting. Do you guys ever think to like big picture, very long term 1 day, HFP owns the investment manager? This is not without precedent. As you know, at Fairfax and its investment manager was separate at some point, and they became one -- so I just wonder, is this -- and again, I know you can -- please do use the answer. We don't talk about the future. Like you don't have to give a specific answer, but just maybe like big-picture thinking? Is this something you'd think of blah, blah, blah?

Well, we always think about the future. We talked about the future all day. But that's not -- and that's really not something we've actually given any thought to. So I don't know whether we have a view on it either way. But it's not because we don't think of the future. I just -- we haven't really gone through what that means and what the benefits of that would be for shareholders. We just haven't really got through that, to be honest.

Honestly, giving lending funds in Africa, well-needed source. I mean, when lead in place is really commendable. Having said that, the question I have is, the -- either emerging markets or frontier markets, the inflation is the biggest threat and the currency depreciation is there, reasonable. I mean you need to account it for. How do you manage that? Do you source the funds from the emerging markets so that the depreciation will take over the depreciation on the other side? Or do you hedge the funds from the places where would you invest?

So that's a great question. I think we covered this point stop again a few years ago. I think at the end of the day, you're absolutely right, so that inflation and currency devaluation is probably the biggest Euro returns in the emerging markets. Okay, I have you voice your Indian and certain things are going on through there right now. So we've actually spent a lot of time on this point. And at the core of what we do is that every single investment we make, we spend, I would say, a big fair chunk of our time understanding how the business has got some level of protection or resonance or against inflation and concept evaluation. And there are many, many metals that can be there with it. Africa is not a place where you can hedge to answer your question directly or directly hedged. But some of our markets have got the Franco for African markets and bases like Morocco, I've got the currencies actually pegged to the euro. So on Morocco's case, a basket of the euro and the dollar. So investment in business is actually you've taken very little FX risk. There are businesses in Africa that are exporters. They've got dollar revenue, how currency costs. So we've got businesses that do export fruit to veg and if you things out there. They also have businesses that fundamentally because the nature of the business, your competition actually is imports, yes? And so you price at a price that just reflects the competition, which is actually imported product. Well, you've got a business that has got amazing strong pricing power, small, very low price point items and market position very strong, high pricing power and they move up their pricing with inflation. I was saying is in consumer business where you just push your price up as the inflation rises to capture it. So just we look through each business and item number one is how does this business how does FX affect this business of what the investment period done to exit.

I really enjoy that you've updated the financials. And I'm just curious if that's your internal view as well, how you look at your investments? And secondly, what are the biggest risks for this business? And how are you looking at that?

Yes. So maybe on the financial statements. Thank you very much. Yes, it's it is our internal view. And the way we presented it, it is more a simplified an investor-friendly version. So if you look on the IFRS accounting, it's another version. And our goal is to publish quarterly and investor-friendly presentation where you would be able to follow our internal view, how we look at the business performance and the assets. So it is then all aligned with our view with this investor view. And -- yes, starting from Q1 '26, we will be following this one end.

Should I take -- the risk. I think that's a really good question. So we feel -- clearly, we will make our own mistakes, and we've made many, but I think that we feel quite good generally about our ability to make investments. If we have the capital, we think we can find interesting opportunities, and we feel we can deploy the capital well. So the risk that we see, though, is actually what manifested in COVID. COVID was an extreme scenario. But if you think about that, this kind of notion this period that you might go through where fundamentally, there is volatility in private equity fundraising, there's even more volatility in private equity fundraising in emerging markets. So the risk is that you come into one of these pockets again, where whether for reasons like that or for other reasons, it proves difficult. So one of the things that was in the presentation, which we didn't really dwell on in the presentation is that the approach -- so what we're very focused on trying to do, and this is actually the single most important strategic initiative that Helios has at the alternative asset management side is really to diversify its funding sources. And not -- I don't want to say away from, but to supplement the traditional LPGP fundraising structure with more sources of permanent capital. And so there are a few initiatives that Helios is working on now, which would be essentially to raise money in permanent capital structures that would just where there's ability to sort of keep recycling. And so that you'll never -- not never, but the chances of you ever come into a position where your fee income gets interrupted because there's some macro broad-based issue around fundraising, that risk gets diminished. And that, again, just the compounding of it, if you're able to keep recycling the capital, your fee base grows more strongly and more predictably. So I think that the overall -- the biggest risk to the business we think is that. It's fundraising risk, but there's some quite significant effort going into actually addressing that.

All right. Well, thank you -- One more last.

So I do know that ESG considerations are paramount, but they also don't automatically override other investment factors. Can you share an example where an ESG governance issues materially changed an investment decision or post investment value creation plan and explain how that helped protect to enhance shareholder value?

That's a teapot, no negative positive. So I think just to start with, actually, there's the process that we go through to ESG at the heart of what we do. We also we don't confuse impact with ESG without two different -- I would say, maybe I would say we're more falling on impact that were on ESG. ESG is about 2 now ham and impact is actually about positive, doing something really positive that's driving really batten soft. So ESG is a real there because it's cost -- actually cost money if you get it wrong, having wrong governance, having an environmental spill those are things that actually cost you real money. We've had many, many businesses where we come to our investment committee, we do screens. So we have a whole team. We've got demand for doer, Henry field, Winnie, Houston Charlotte 4-person team who spent all habitat time looking at ESG and also the impact. And what that means is that when we're coming to rescope to you, we've got their business in different categories. If it's a business that's only doing software, the ESG risk is very low. But if you have bus manufacturing, there is a lot of water and a lot of people, young children around. That's going to be a high ESG risk -- so our categorization of each business as it comes through to us. And then with the actions and plans we have is depending on what category the business is. And it's something we take extremely seriously not because we like to, but because there actually is a value I think is a diminutive thing if it does really, really, really go wrong.

One more.

And I don't know much about your history, but seems like Helios came in and saved today. I'm wondering what your relationship is now at Fairfax. Is that -- are they now like partner kind of thing?

I mean I think Fairfax is -- I'm not just saying it because they're an amazing partner I mean, I'm sure there are many people here who've been partnered with them in other context as well. I think Fairfax has been an amazing partner. I think that they are very supportive. They're not meddling in the business. So I think they trust the judgment that the executive team the executive team has. And so I think from that perspective, I think their standards, the rules, their guardrails, et cetera. And I think so long as we're operating within those guardrails, I think they let the team do the work. But I think from our perspective, we actually value their judgment. So there are many things that we reach out to sort of seek advice thoughts or whatever it may be, even if strictly speaking, there's no piece of paper that says that one needs to do that. I have to say it's kind of a highlight of the many low lights of the last 5 years. That one is a highlight.

Wonderful. Thank you so much, everyone, for being here with us today. We really appreciate the people in the room and the people online, and we'll be hanging around if you have further questions or thought that you want to share with us.

Thank you.

Thank you.