hVIVO plc (HVO) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Good afternoon, ladies and gentlemen. Welcome to the Open Orphan PFC investor update presentation. [Operator Instructions] I'd also like to remind you that this presentation is being recorded. Before we begin, we'd like to submit the following poll. I would now like to hand you over to Cathal Friel, Executive Chairman of Open Orphan plc. Good afternoon to you.

Paul, thank you very much, and thank everyone for dialing in or Zooming in to get the update tonight. I think the reason I was very keen to an update, there has been a lot of crewing and throwing. There's been a lot of market volatility. So I think most of my 20-minute presentation tonight will probably hopefully deal with volatility in the share price, how it's dropped off, what we're doing to correct it. And probably more importantly, rather than blame markets expense, some of the reasons why our share price -- and bear in mind, I'm the single largest shareholder, so when the share price drops, nobody gets hurt more than me. And do bear in mind, I found the share price -- I've been keen to increase my stake for quite some time. The only time I could increase it was post publication results, publication the last number of deals that allowed me to get 2x my annual salary, my annual salary at Open Orphan is GBP 146,000 and I spent GBP 300,000 when I started, and that will be locked up for as long as I'm a director, directors cannot sell shares really. Okay. With our fortitude, let's get into the reasons. First of all, let's target delivery. So hopefully, we can see the presentation. I'll talk through some of it, and then I'm going to -- I think we have about 40, 45 pre-submitted questions-plus here tonight. Do submit the questions, I'll work through as many of them as possible. And I have something more -- a lot of the questions come in, if they're already in, we'll take them to come. First of all, overhang crew [Audio Gap] as a result of the lockout freeing up on the 27th of June, there was not 1 unfortunately, there was 2. There was a significant seller in the market as a result of the lockup. That particular seller, if you look at a share ratio 7.8 million shares, unfortunately, he decided to just keep dumping them and as you've seen, 7.8 million shares have appeared at the end of June, and he kept selling. It could have been handled better and -- but we are who we are.

Good afternoon, ladies and gentlemen. And looks like we've just lost Cathal here, so if you can bear with me one second, just while he reconnects. [Technical Difficulty]

Do you hear me now?

We can hear. We cannot see. I suppose we can just turn your camera off and to keep your audio line open, please. That's great. We can hear you now.

But let's try and see as well.

If you just click on the camera icon, there's an old-fashioned video camera at the top of the screen. Can you just click on that one?

So that was a bit dramatic. A bit like a drop in our share price, we insured nothing dropped off, and it was a slip. Let me start again. First of all, I said there was a sticky show at the market result at the end of the lockup. That particular shareholder, if you check, [indiscernible]. He has now been cleared off all the share registers. Unfortunately, we weren't able to place the shares on -- anyway for other reasons. The market did blame. It wasn't Tony Richardson. He held 16.3 million in mid-June. He did sell, but as a result of freeing up the lockup, he did sell 1.5 million in June, and he sold a further 1 million last week, on the 6th of August, which has seen his trade go through on Friday. And he has now agreed, he's reassured the Board of the company, he's going to hold the rest of them. So Tony Richardson is keen. I think he buys into the company strategy now at the same time. He said he's keen to avail of the spin-offs and dividend spaces. And he's not a desperate for cash. He thinks [ book where else have got my ] cash. So I think it's a reasonably good working relationship with Tony. So I think the market can relax. There is other unfortunate result of that first shareholder dumping his shares, and it was a result of the lockup coming up. He was a legacy shareholder, nothing to do with the current management team. Nothing to do with the directors of the Board. But look, it did create uncertainty. Secondly, around the exact same time as that shareholder freed up on the 27th of June. It was almost a perfect storm. We published our results for last year. And again, there was a bit of confusion around there in the market, but I wish to confirm that we are profitable and market expedition success will be very firmly profitable for all of '21.

[Technical Difficulty] Cathal Friel, let's just keep your audio line and perhaps have your camera off for the time being, just so we can keep that connectivity as you seem to be just coming away.

Folks, I can -- I apologize for this, this is a bit messy, but let me continue. Around the same period in time in June, we had our result from last year. And look, they're very clear. People are a bit -- spoke to where the results happened that will we profit were we not? So basically I can finally confirm in 2021 as a company, no matter how you look at it, we guide the market. We will be very fairly profitable, pretax profit, EBITDA profit, you name it, it is profitable. Also, around the same time in the 17th of June was a recording date for the Poolbeg Pharma spin-off and the 2020 results. On that day, 20 million shares of public were traded. So again, what happened there around the end of June, people got the feeling sell Open Orphan, free up cash for Poolbeg and there was a feeling that Poolbeg would be dilutive clearly, spending all these companies are absolutely not dilutive for the following reasons, look at Poolbeg. Any of you who held shares in Poolbeg on the 16th of June, there was 680 million shares in the Open Orphan. Today, there's 680 million shares to Open Orphan. But any of you held a single share, we now have an additional -- for every 2.8 million -- or 2.898 Open Orphan shares, you've ended up with 1 additional Poolbeg share of 10p. So GBP 25 million in new funds come in from new investors. And Open Orphan shareholders owned the majority of Poolbeg as we speak. In Imutex, likewise, I'll come to that later, is not going to be dilutive, PrEP Pharma is not going to be derivative and the [indiscernible] are not going to be going to do the exact same way. So I'll contact the [indiscernible]. During the Poolbeg IPO process as well, there were some issues in that we were very publicly doing it. And then for those 8 weeks, we were limited what we could say and market updates. So -- but during further spin-offs, and we know there's 3 of them up there in front as we've done. We will make sure that there will be very additional updates and information as we go along. And there'll be no more you saw the market that was almost an 8-week blackout or [indiscernible]. Furthermore, just being very clear, I spent, how do I say, GBP 300,000 in -- of my own money on the 14th of July, that's 2x my salary, due to increased demand. The China study business is expanding. We're now offering malarial Chinese studies. And the aim is to sign 1 to 2 of those for the rest of this year and 3 to 4 of them into 2022. I said all along, the Open Orphan business is 85% non-COVID.I know we've had a great balance with COVID. But this year, last year and next year. And I'll come to that how that we would say, well, it's basically from our malarial studies from our RSV studies, which we got a lot of them. He was 1 of the last 1 of them, we signed to GBP 70-odd million, and that's well underway. So we have non-COVID Chinese studies and really important for every like, the minimum 1 is about 3 to 4 or 5, that's the average 3 to 5. But we have significantly hard figures. The last 1 was 7 -- 7 [indiscernible] how we're pushing those up. Then [ great ] office and then [ Paris ] offices have signed multiple contracts and doing very significant revenue both last year, but really important, but we only announced then contracts that they're in excess of GBP 1 million. Post-pandemic, the infectious disease market has experienced enormous growth. This is a part that has missed a lot of people. It's gone to -- annual infection disease market is GBP 20 billion in 2019, had been like that for 20, 30 years. It's exploding to GBP 250 billion by 2025, that's 3.5 years away. As such, infectious disease is a business we're in, there's a huge increase in the range and number of Chinese studies for Open Orphan. There are flu studies, RSV studies, HRV studies, COPD studies, malarial studies, asthma studies and, of course, COVID-19. We're not running away from COVID. It's going to be around for a long time, but we're trying to get across the market why I constantly say we're 80% to 85% non-COVID. Just look at Q2, the Pfizer CEO's update of the Q2 highlights this year, there was 4 of them, but the key one we're complementing is that [indiscernible] RSV Chinese study. And I said FierceBiotech quoted Pfizer jumps the queue and leaps in the RSV vaccine intention with human genes trials. COVID-19 studies, yes, I know everybody is very keen to find out more of what's going on there. They're ongoing in the roll free, work at the existing contract's underway. There has been a very significant contract extension announced in July. There will be follow-on vaccine antiviral Chinese studies. They will take place when that study is completed, and the study is nearing completing. It's taking a little longer, like everything in this business. Sometimes I think even should happen much quicker. But rest assured the U.K. has been and is the world leader and the rolling out and approval of vaccines, and we'll continue to be at the center of developing and testing vaccines for many years to come. So this is a cracking place to be as to be doing any new COVID studies, any new Chinese studies, anything to do with vaccines. Really clear. And what I'm trying to say, not alone is the basic business going really, really well for our China studies. Now we do know over the summer, there hasn't been that many Chinese studies and that's for a host of reasons. I think as you go forward, rest assured you'd know on Christmas, there will be a good number of non-COVID Chinese studies announced. And into next year, quite a number, not 1 every month but maybe every second month at least. As regards to spin-offs, I'm really clear that we have people who thought what we had to do. We've spun off Poolbeg, we have hundreds of shareholders, 25 million dividend species. So look at this, our dividend species pre 16th of June, was 600 million Open Orphan shares. Today, there's [indiscernible] is not dilutive. We handed it back. We were in on dividend species share in Poolbeg for every 2.9. We've covered that. So if you held 1,000 shares before on the 16th of June, today, you hold 1,000 shares in Orphan, but you also hold 335 shares in Poolbeg. It's a HMRC tax-neutral dividend species as all different species will be for our shareholders. Thus, there's no income tax on that dividend we paid you. There's no need to sell your Poolbeg shares to cover your tax, the only tax you'll pay will be paid from the Poolbeg shares sold. So that's clarifying, there's been confusion about it. The IPO price was 10p, and we believe there's lots of upside in that share price. If any of it tags anywhere we did in May Open Orphan one, just watch that space. Multiple of the IPOs in the last 2 months are off 10%, 20%. We're up 8%, 9%, 10%, [indiscernible] still up 5% to 6% since IPO. There's a lockup, people ask why, for 9 months to allow the share price to stabilize, to help trust by [ DSA Beach growth ] nominees. And you will automatically, every shareholder who has held shares since 16 will automatically get those in 9 months post-IPO. We may try and release some earlier, depending on [indiscernible] is try and get the share price moving in the meantime. The spin out of an IPO of Poolbeg Pharma completed on 19, pre-fundraiser, all pharma shareholders owned 90% of Poolbeg. Poolbeg raised 25 from new investors at a pre-money 25, market cap 50, today 53, and that's with absolutely no news flow. And here's where the real synergy comes. We only hired 1 new employee who is the Poolbeg CEO, Jeremy Skillington. We have 8 to 10 of employees now, 50% of their salary at least come from Poolbeg. Office space and overheads are now shared by Orphan and Poolbeg. Poolbeg will commission Chinese studies and other workforce. So far from being dilutive and far from taking away from the value people try to understand the spinout is hugely by the book under the opposite, it's a huge synergy between the companies. The other noncore ones, I've covered Open Orphan, the data business that is disease in motion, we all are working hard on that one. PrEP Pharma, absolutely, 62% stake. And in Imutex, we only own 49%, all I'm saying we are adamant we will get an announcement pretty soon and people say why [indiscernible] more or less take control of that process and make sure inmates 100% of it happens over the coming months because we've got kind of hard waiting in the 51% shareholder. So all I can say is rest assured that process is underway. And we're actually -- now that Poolbeg is done, there's no reason why we can't do these other 3 very quickly and efficiently ourselves over the coming months. Financial performance. And I say to be perfectly honest with you, it was almost a perfect storm at the end of June with 1 of the locked-up shareholders dumping his shares. At the same time we published last year results. So this is what I want to clarify, there is definitely a confusion in the market on last year results. Last year results [indiscernible] in June. We integrated 2 loss-making businesses last year. We took [indiscernible] at the end of February last year [indiscernible] only over a year ago. And we also intervened with the loss making vendor business. We put the 2 together, neither had made a profit ever before. We combine both businesses, and we make clear to the market we were operationally profitable Q4 2020, which is very important. We make it really clear on the market expansions, we will, we are profiting for the whole of 2020 more. At Christmas, we cash at 19.2, people were a bit spooked, oh, where did the cash go? We dropped 15.1. That cash was preparing all 4 noncore assets. We will not be digging into that cash anymore. I was preparing Poolbeg [indiscernible] PrEP Pharma and getting disease and motion ready to spin off. We also put some cash into noncore [indiscernible] the wearables project, new models, such as the malaria announced today. And as such, I want to reassure the market that cash pile is not reducing. People are worried that time we come to Christmas, whether they've gone, absolutely not. We may use a small one for a bolt-on cash acquisition because we're in expansion mode in a very, very significant way with the business. So I want to address that. We will do a proper update at the end of September, the first half and the proper guidance for the year-end. But the real guidance is we're expanding and people should rest assured this is a profitable business, will be profitable. And to date, I'm not going to be buying shares in my personal name if I thought I was buying into a loss-making company. This is a piece that people should be aware of. We're in a 20 billion infectious disease market. We test infectious disease products. This market has gone to work for years. It's about 20 billion. We do the annual flu business. It's now exploring post-pandemic. And we have now a very increased range of studies under contract, under negotiation or flu, RSV, HRV, COPD, malaria, asthma and of course, COVID-19. Hence, the expansion to malaria. There's a huge increased awareness in infectious disease at the moment. [indiscernible] cost within the pandemic at the moment was GBP 17 trillion. That's 90% of the entire GDP of North America. So after 30 years of no investment by big pharma, you now have their 30 years catch up. Every major pharma company, Pfizer, GSK, J&J, Merck, have rolled out multiple new non-COVID programs in the last 12 months. They're restocking and replenishing 30 years of underinvestment in infections disease products would be one of the biggest goldfishes in the history of the pharmaceutical industry, and Open Orphan are ready and waiting to test many of those products, which is a good place to be. Let me talk about Pfizer one, the Pfizer contract alone. And this is the 4 key pointers and this is the world's largest pharmaceutical company. So overall, you got the CEO said, our Q2 highlights, the 4 key highlights. And the first one, we've completely successfully Phase II a human challenge trial with RSV for adult vaccine candidates. I guess too that was [ HP ]. That was our study. We signed at end of October, and we delivered the data into March. Bear in mind, we've always said our studies 6 weeks -- 6 months from signing to delivery. These are not big, long multiyear studies. Chinese studies, money upfront and completion in the 6 months. The other 3 things a lot of them went into EU contingency authorization, patient doses and for recruitment. There were other -- the 3 other highlights Pfizer had. But bear in mind, the key highlight was ours, and first Pfizer [indiscernible] into RSV vaccine potentially human challenge trial. So in summary, I've got a lot of questions answered true here. So we get through the summary. We have a really strong pipeline channels. We have new China study models going through, a huge significant expansion in infectious disease market. We're EBITDA profitable in H1. So there we go. That's it. We're on target for all year profitability in 2021. That's EBITDA, pretax, no matter which way you look at it. We are monetizing the noncore assets. The first spin-off is complete. Opportunity to progress disease and motion platform, and the demergers offer an excellent opportunity for shareholders and maximum [indiscernible] to shareholders in a number of other companies. The whole idea is we want to be a pure 0. We don't want to think Open Orphan and that is left with very little. It's not -- we're going to have a very profitable, very fast growth, world leader in the tested vaccines and antivirals based here in London. And that's a pretty good place to be and to have. So what I look forward to do is bring up some of the questions and answer them. And if any other questions, I see that are coming in through the chat box.

So [ Eric ] at a small company, [ Champion ], has put forward 5, and he's representing a group of high net worth clients. So [ Eric's ] questions are as follows. He's got 5 of them and they kind of cover a lot of the things we've just gone through at the moment. So it's the first question. You often referred to COVID being 20% of the group business, this seems unplausible to me. Do you mean in terms of time and company resources, cash generation? My point being, if the 2 government challenges, there is worth over GBP 40 million, the natural question is, what is the remaining 80% of the cash is total confusion. Yes, look, really, I keep emphasizing, we're not a pure COVID start. And of the -- it wasn't GBP 40 million, it was GBP 37 million, quite a part of that went through all [ free ] for the facility. Another chunk of it goes to Imperial. And of our total revenue last year, no more than 15%, 20%. Again, this year, no more than 10% or 15%, because you can see the rest of our business is bringing in quite a few tens of millions, excluding the government contract. So that's why I want to make clear, people think we've got every penny of that 40% plus an additional 10% for the extension. We have a substantial amount of extension between now and the autumn time, but that's why I wanna make that clear. And that's why I emphasize we are not purely -- yes, COVID has been interesting and covered current and will continue results but we are in the Chinese study business and covering all of those infections disease products. Second question, dilution of the company cash post spent before Poolbeg [indiscernible] GBP 19.1 million cash post this 15, investors assume they is a cash drain for each spin. Therefore, no cash remaining at year-end. Absolutely, definitely not. We are maintaining that cash. The reason that drop, that was between the end of December and the beginning of the summer and part of it was getting first of all, getting Poolbeg ready. Second was getting each of the noncore assets ready. That investment is made. Third was getting our malarial Chinese study ready. And fourth, knocking the business in shape and for the rest of the year, we're targeting that cash to remain flat and growing as we go forward. Not -- so there's absolutely no chance we run out of cash. That's the very beauty of it, but make it very clear, if we're solidly profitable year, where does the cash go? And people worry are we getting the costs under control. If we are generating profits, we definitely have our costs under control. So there will be next to no further cash required for any of the additional spinouts. They're all now good to go. Question three. Can you be more specific regarding the timing of the extension to the U.K. government human challenge study commencing? If not, why are so many investors guessing and more importantly, net benefit and cash terms over and beyond the original contract? I think I'll deal with that question too in that there has been an extension. Like all things in the pharma industry, sometimes I try and move them too fast. That expansion is underway and will be completed by the Orphan time. Question 4, there has not been a Tier 1. The share prices fall 27 -- 47 to 20, can you explain to investors behind the dramatic fall, it is best not to lump or what other COVID-related companies because you have significant insurance policies with our projects. So I think I handled that. The shareholder who got all locked up was below the 3%. So there's no Tier 1 acquired. He has not gone. Tony Richardson is also just margin below. Tony Richardson has assured us that the Board is happy, to tight till summer of next year. So there's no Tier 1 required. But hopefully, when it looks at the 7.6 million shares of locked up, you see it has gone to 0. So hopefully, the selling has not stopped from, let's say, that particular somewhat difficult shareholder. It's gone, it's clear. It has spooked the market and there is other people maybe selling them. But hopefully, over the coming weeks as we now start delivering positive news flow back into the market. We'll see certain appreciation of price. As you all know, if there's a 7.8 million shares being dumped in the market, it's hard to absorb that, especially over the summer period when there's not as many [ bars well ]. Five, post spin-out, I believe, Orphan will be attractive, suited to a number of big pharma. What is the company official line on growing the company or preparing for a trade sale? If the latter, what price do you believe will be reasonable? But first of all, I've always said we sell at the right price. My view at the moment is, we are, by far, the #1 in the world. U.K. is by far the number #1 in world in development vaccines. So why will we rush to sell at a bad price? Everything is for sale at the right price. I believe in that. I wouldn't be buying shares at 26p, 27p. I think that unless we're massively undervalued. So that's hopefully answering [ Eric's ] 5 questions. Moving swiftly on. Got quite a few more questions to get through quite fast. The results, they're grouped into 14 or 15 results. We've got a bunch of questions around spinouts and host. So let's go through these on the results. One, why is the cash balance reduced in December? I mean, I think I covered that. We are profitable. And the cash will stop dropping out because we did have to make investments. Bear in mind the spinout don't happen on thin air. Malarial study took a little bit of work. And basically, the wearables project took some, but it didn't take 15 -- bear in mind 15, folks, is a lot of money for a company that's firmly profitable. So don't worry that cash balance is not going anywhere. Are you still on track for a cash dividend? Second question of Christmas. Yes, we're targeting if this is going to be, and there is a very large cash balance, profitable services companies. Always pay dividends. That's all I can say in that regards. Question three, will you publish interim results in September? And if so, are you optimistic there will be a decent financial share? Also, you said on many occasions in the last quarter of 2020 was profitable in every month onwards since then. Considering the expansion of the expenditure of all parts of the business, are we to expect some profits? No. We have quite a firmly very, very attractive, highly profitable business. So we have no regards. We are going to, I think, our financial reporting at the end of June could have been done better, and it will be done better. So I think let's target the first half results at the end of September, for the first half year where we try and get that -- I think the confusion was Leo, our CFO, was trying to explain 2 public companies, one of them was [indiscernible], one of them was then life science and then [indiscernible] for last year. For a comprehensive up-to-date view of the company's progress for each of this plans dividend investment, I think we've done that in time scale. We've got -- we've done one. There's 3 more to be done, and we'll work in progress as we go. If you can, the Open Orphan share price should command [ 8x ] revenue by year because Open Orphan is #1. Investors should have hard numbers. Yes, I think, look, let's get hard numbers 2022 towards the end of September. Next question, question 7, Tony Richardson's 2-year lockup expired in June 25. Do you know his intentions regarding the 16 million shares. There have been discussions that he has commenced unwinding his position. Given our little affiliation, I've been clear, it wasn't actually Tony who was doing the most damage, it was another shareholder who was locked up. He's now gone and Tony Richardson has reassured the Board, he has sold 2.5 million shares of his 16 million, and he's happy not to lock up and stay with us until next summer. A share buy -- a share buyback was approved in the AGM. How much cash will be allocated to this? What is the max buyback price? And why is the share price not being used to clear sellers? That is an option. There's always good of options. If we have a large cash balances, all we say we do not to have that option in there. Nine, in the 14th of July RNS, we reported a solid profit. H1 2021 remains on target, do you envisage a solid bottom line? Absolutely. I'm saying for end of 2020 profit everywhere which you look at. Question 10, how is the cash balance looking after the [indiscernible] spinoff recruitment in the last few months? Cash balance has now stabilized around the GBP 15 million. And as we drive forward, it should be growing, and that's the plan, absolutely it's growing. 11, given the rapid growth of the business and the delay between the end period of formula in terms full year reports with the company considering trading update. Absolutely, look, I think the target will be the end of September. And there will be less confusion then. We'll be focused on the first half of the year. And you'll -- no matter which way you look at it, we already said the first half of the year is profitable. Next question we have here is, 12 before the 2021 results, you've given [indiscernible] financials. They were significantly worse, particularly, there seem to be very substantial unexpected rise in costs. This has provided more fuel to critics who are encouraging to you that company can't control this cost, and we may get the same again this year. Can expand a part of this cost? You get cost base in '20 -- bear in mind, we more than doubled the size of our business and more than doubled our size of revenue. So naturally, people focused on cost increase year-over-year. Just watch in the first half of the year we reported, that is firmly under control. We do focus on costs. So I think a lot of people don't want people to say costs are under control. They're far from -- they're very much in control. Spinouts, a number of questions here. Question one. Cathal you said in early April that he thought to be 1 of the possible 2 spinouts at the end of April, when is the rest? So look, end of April. Okay, [indiscernible] month long, which is the first one. But absolutely, look to west, our work in progress, we have got them at the shape. And all we can reassure everybody, they are underway. That's all I can say. Sometimes, I want to move very fast. And sometimes with partners involved in these things, it takes a bit longer. But that is very, very definitely work underway. Two, what is the ongoing relationship with Poolbeg Pharma in supporting drug development news? Absolutely, the relationship being pulled back, I covered it earlier. We're sharing staff, which is great. So that's less of an overhead. So the cost base is dropping rapidly. We can put staff, there is only one new member. So this is a very good relationship. And Poolbeg now will be commissioning Chinese studies from Open Orphan because that is a customer. Trade is a Poolbeg Pharma and mission [ to opposite ], Cathal Friel has been appointed nonexecutive Chairman, expected time commitment 8 to 10 days from. Cathal in the past that would be actively involved disease and motion spend out when it happens. What does this mean for ongoing involvement overall? Absolutely, I like the role. I think, being the role of Chairman, we have a proper CEO in Poolbeg, Jeremy Skillington, he's done a fantastic job. We may look within Open Orphan to getting a disease and motion is coming down the track as fast as we know of having, it will need a CEO. And at appropriate time, absolutely Open Orphan May get our hands on the CEO late this year, early next year at the moment. I think we're managing quite fine. But yes, with disease motion, it has to come with a CEO, it cannot be CEO of other companies. So what is the reasoning for preventing investors selling POL for 9 months, which is grossly unfair to investors, surely would lead to [indiscernible]. Why not allow? Yes, we're giving virtually 100% [indiscernible] back to the Open Orphan shareholders, Open Orphan has no stake in it. So it's owned by Open Orphan shareholders. And the plan is to wait 9 months to allow the share price that allows some decent growth stories to allow us get towards [ an ASA ] listing. And if demand allows in the meantime, we will start releasing it earlier, but we said a maximum 9 months. So I think by giving the company, or the full-time CEO, some time to get the show on the road, I think if you look, we started at 5.7p, just over 2 years ago with Open Orphan. If we had 3 new shares after 1, people probably have sold at 8, 9 10p. And even in the fresh share price today at 22p people who held, they're up 4, 5x. So I think Poolbeg would just allow some time for some share price appreciation. And particularly, that we've handed those shares on dividend pieces that have no tax consequence. The only tax you'll pay [indiscernible] is capital gains when you sell them. You've previously commented question 7, the company has provided the higher market cap. I think I covered that already. Question 8. Every time a noncore asset is diverged -- is divested from open, the value becomes less. No, I think we're going to address that better. People thought when we spun off Poolbeg, it was dilutive. That was because we had that for seller. That was because we had last year's results. People saw last income this last year, I think we'll handle it better, as I've shown and said, when you spin out of these companies, they're not dilutive. If you end up with shares an additional company and it allows the core business to continue to grow. Nine. In previous meet you said you but expect each spinoff to be worth perhaps 15% to 20% of the company. So expect the market cap to register -- yes, so each of them has potential, if you think of this GBP 25 million is handed back to shareholders and build back. That is about 15%. So 15% to 20% is what each of them. And some of them could be substantially bigger. And that's before the share price we get news of it going. 10. How much is of charge in [indiscernible] license? If I'm able to confirm, yes, look there is a payment. Bear in mind, Poolbeg was 90-plus percent owned by all shareholders day 1, even today, post the fundraise, third party is still majority owned by Open Orphan shareholders. So absolutely, it's a commercial arms length agreement, it allows Poolbeg to monetize some of that data. Bear in mind, we still have a lot of data for disease motion. Question 11. PrEP Pharma rumors the Nasdaq listing via U.S. back it's an issue for investors in U.K. [ ISS Solis ], are you able to clarify whether there's a plan for a sole listing. Absolutely, look any listing we all know with [ ISS ] institutions, if they go to NASDAQ, that's PrEP Pharma and [indiscernible], we must also have another dual listing, which is really easy. We can have an aim or standard listing. So rest assured, and it goes to NASDAQ, we'll have a London dual listing as well. And we've made it clear that Poolbeg is going that way, and it will be dual-listed from very early doors. 12, do you know what solid plans Conserve Bio has for flu? Being perfectly honest, we feel we've been disappointed with the Concern Bio. So I think all I can say is in the coming week or 2, we will be updating the market. And I think that's a case of -- we're going to do that job ourselves basically. And we own 49%, they own 51%. I still can't understand why that hasn't been done in the grades and infectious diseases. There's still plenty of opportunity to do it in the months ahead. That ties to the question 13, Conserve Bioscience is really the rebranding of the 51% stake in Imutex. So question 13, Imutex, what is going on here without stating you were pushing them exactly how we closed, yes, all we can say [indiscernible] for a couple of weeks, and we will update the market on that in a very positive sense. Question 14, how much have we raised in the disease and motion IPO? Substantially less. Disease and motion does not mean a lot of cash. It will be owned more or less 100% Open Orphan day 1. All of you, the shareholders, the exact same you will get a dividend species. It will come HRNC, it will be -- the plan would be that will be tax neutral. And we'll do a small fund base, I think that could be a really, really exciting project. Questions, service business, non-COVID. You previously said that you were having ongoing discussions with regards to China. Absolutely. A lot of these things take sometimes more time than IPO. Work in progress. We all know China is very interesting. China is the reason we are very interested in vaccine development. Question two, can you elaborate what expansion plans are placed to serve as further [ anticipate for human ]. There's lots of plans in place, where there's a lot more Chinese studies coming through. Bear in mind, we have the [indiscernible] hospital for all our COVID work. They're ongoing. We have our 24-bed GMP facility, and we have the [indiscernible] hotel, and we can get -- we can roll out additional bed capacity as we need, as we've done already. 4. what is the current opposite [indiscernible] what is the cost of closing? We don't intend to close in any clinic anytime soon. So there won't be any cost to close the clinic. And the current we've always been clear, we'll follow for the rest of this year. There's always gaps we can slot in for occasions, we have free clinics. And we're pretty well booked out for most of next year. But bear in mind, with free clinics, you never get them past that 80%, and you can always squeeze a little bit. So there's always room to slip in some more studies, especially when we've got currently 3. And as always, we're looking for a fourth. Question 5, in one of your presentations, your Q&A a couple of months back, you said you had 5 influenza lined up. So excluding the recent Altamine one, absolutely. Influenza is one of the biggest growth areas. And that's where we're trying to make clear. COVID is around. It's not going away. There will be a lot more COVID work. But don't forget, influenza is our bread and butter. We're also [indiscernible] bread and butter, and now we have malaria bread and butter. So it's nice to have a lot of these steady straightforward studies. And I think as I said earlier, our Chinese studies, they are a minimum of 3 on average up to 5%. And quite rightly, we do 7 million per Chinese studies, and we do them in 6, 7 months. Service business, COVID. One, when do you think the COVID characterization study will complete and can we sign the COVID contracts? As we announced [indiscernible] a little bit. That study is ongoing [indiscernible]. We expect this characterization to complete this autumn. That's all we can say about it. Question 2 is [indiscernible] Phase II trial for [ corogenics ]. Again, it's a sense that we can't say much, but you can take it as well. We have a strong opportunity and substantial more work from [ corogenics ]. Three, to Open Orphan have continued access to Royal Free Hospital after completion of government studies. If so, with the COVID chance to be a viable position offering staff. I'm not absolutely [indiscernible], but Royal Free Hospital we've made it clear, we do not pay rent. The government pays the rent in Royal Free. So it's a fabulous facility for us to have. It's quite busy with the COVID work, and let's see what happens. So it's a [indiscernible] the previous question talk about shutting down or anything else, but we have just access to it, to run the COVID studies. And it's a part of the reason there's a disconnect somewhat on the GBP 37 million, which is quite a bit of money the government out of that largely goes directly to Royal Free that we don't commit to and doesn't involve us. Fourth, when do you expect the results of the extended government trial later this year? Question five, how much was paid for the current structure, and how long? All I'd say is there is a significant extension, and our average challenge is 3, 4, 5, so you can take it as very significant is in excess of that. Sixth, we are expecting [indiscernible] COVID vaccine Chinese trials, are we expecting these to generate much? And will it come in? Are you expecting the clinics would like -- yes, look, the Royal Free is geared up to do all of those studies, we're not paying rent. And when they come through, they will come through to be complete the characterization study. That's all I can say in that regard. I am always emphasizing, we are in an 80% to 85% non-COVID business and it's a fabulous place to be. When you think of the infectious disease growth, this market has gone from GBP 20 billion annually to GBP 250 billion, and that's a hell of a place to be. None of us, in the 9 months, would have guessed infectious diseases would have a tenfold increase. And that GBP 250 billion a year by 2020, that is not going away any time soon. Seven, Oxford are conducting a coronavirus reinfection challenge. Can you confirm [indiscernible] for this trial? If so, does that mean the characters is yours? Yes, the beauty with that is we are the only people. Oxford had to get us to grow and use our -- the challenge agent that we grew that was paid for the U.K. China vaccine that was paid, but that is the challenge in that we grew. General outlook and we're getting in near, I'm just conscious that we said we'd keep this presentation by 1 hour tonight, so we've got some more questions. And then there's quite a few of these questions already answered. And [ Louis ] did the most. Let me keep going quickly through general company, I'd look one, assuming Open Orphan isn't bought out, what is your vision, including market caps for the core of business and all this been as 2 to 3 years' time? I just think the general outlook is a hell of a place to be. We're the only people in the world where you can do Chinese studies for testing vaccines and antivirals. There are some small competitors such as Universe and these things. But we're by far the market leader, that's a hell of a place to be. So I'm quite excited. We will spin off the spin-offs. We will hand you diligence pieces every time, and that will allow us to really grow the core business and continue to be a market leader. And which does make us very attractive to third parties. Question 2. In general, in the view of the public, Open Orphan has been at least partly those exception, with the company consists of [indiscernible] Chairman and CEO, each of the spin-offs will have their own CEO. I quite enjoy I think, the role of Chairman across a number of companies. But over the next 6 to 12 months, if Open Orphan continues to grow as it's growing, absolutely, we will look at a proper CEO for Open Orphan. But I'm going to remain very hands-on as an Executive Chairman's role. Three, this is acceptable that's been overall [indiscernible] which has not been confirmed with this. Yes, I said numerous times. Sometimes I can oversee [indiscernible] sometimes the one thing happens really first, I think we'll have quite as fast as 1 would hope for. So hopefully, I'm contempering, but at the same time, nothing has changed. We've a very profitable, very attractive business. It's grown as cash balances. We are not burning cash. So I think there's a few companies on the name at the moment that is attractive in my view as what we have here. Five, would you please put update the top 10 shareholders on Investor page. Unfortunately, when it comes to shareholders, unless they're over 3%, we're not likely to know them. We have a lot of institutions who came in May last year across the 3% threshold. Some of them have sold down. But any of you go to Bloomberg, you can see we still have quite a range of institutions. Unfortunately, below the 3% [indiscernible] so that's unfortunately where we are. And given the fact that we're still a couple of hundred million market cap, it does take a chunky institution to pop above that 3%. Six. The company has completely lost a positive sentiment. Absolute, yes. Just a few months ago, [indiscernible]. Hopefully, I'm trying to repeat the positive sentiment. Was -- it was a perfect storm. It was the end of June. We had as a result of the lockup, one of the shareholders literally dumping very substantially with the shareholders. Tony Richardson got the blame, people kept looking at him with 16 million shares. He only sold and he's cooperating and working with the Board, and he's agreed to lock up us the balance. Hopefully, and to be honest with you, that shareholder, and I think you know we operated in the last 6, 7 weeks, as he was dumping, one could say the company might have so much -- we weren't rushing but too much news flow. I think it's ironic in the time and we announced our malarial study today. That is a very, very big fundamental, and I don't think it would have made sense to be announcing that malarial Chinese study in recent weeks until we got rid of that share. So I think, as I said, this is a start of the fight back. The overhang was cleared last week. It's gone. There is no other overhang. Naturally and unfortunately, there will be other shareholders that are selling. But hopefully, we're going to crank up the news flow as in from today, and this is the start of, let's say, the fight back to get some life back into the share and knowing that there's no one else who is substantial. Okay. Moving to questions as noted. You commented [indiscernible] as part of a small Eurotrip. Was it just to visit Bruno, eyes up some expansion plan? All of those. Bruno was there. I think, yes, this was space [indiscernible] the Benelux countries, certain -- interesting to reveal [indiscernible] coming month or 2, all positive. It wasn't just to visit Bruno. Share price and there's the last group of these questions and then we're going to win the -- we've got 5 or 6 questions in share price. I think I've dealt with most of them. A question [indiscernible] market shares, are you aware of current shareholders, I think I've dealt with that. It was -- one party was locked up, the minute it was locked up, unfortunately he started dumping shares, and we are where we are. We've got rid of them. And if you track that shareholder, you'll see he's off the register. Two, are there any institutions to sell the [indiscernible] and are they selling down in an neurotic way? Are you trying to be more institutional support for Open Orphan, would you place promote the core business more in a number of countries? To be honest with you, between now and Christmas, I have always said we should try to have 1 challenge study every month, but they have one every month. Between now and Christmas, we definitely will see quite about the news flow on new channel studies and not just COVID work. And it wouldn't have made sense over the last 6 weeks, where we had so many dumping shares to be feeding. So we're not completely stupid. There is contracts out there, and we're working on them. Question 3, how many shares? I think we made clear. Tony Richardson sold 1.5 million ended June. And he sold 1 million last week, and he's happy to lock up the rest. So that should be very good news for everybody. Question four, please [indiscernible] the share price. I think it clearly dropped a bit, it's all done. Are there any institutions? Yes, look, at the end of the summer institutions around the [indiscernible], we would expect the insurance we placed last week either do it myself, were with institutions. So the plan now would be to try and get institution showing interest as we come in there this summer. Question five, are you optimistic the share price back to 40? Absolutely. I would not have bought shares at 26, 27p. I want to see my shareholding double. Six, what is putting big investors off the board or what are you doing about? We're engaging with large shareholders. So we would hope to say we placed the balance of that distressed shareholder last week and hopefully, more to come. Okay, just going down through these, taking these to the top. GMC, [indiscernible] plan for all was to sell access to just the pharma companies? Do you -- yes, look, this is all wrapped up in our disease in motion. So James, that's work in progress. That's the disease in motion. That -- we made it really clear, disease in motion, we've proved we can do it. Bear in mind, we have to prove the model. We got rid of the build-up losses. We can now pay different species, so the spends have started. Just reading some of these already answered. James, [ SGS ] are getting very near to having their own building complete and ready. Jim, are you taking it? James, look, we don't see any issue with [ SGS ] at the moment. They are, of course, happy with us. They're very much in the phase 1. So yes, we've no issue and I know with the business of friendly and working with them and we know they've got 24 beds, which they're not particularly using. So [ SGS ] could be very, very useful, let's say, friendly party that are very careful, really gearing up. Clearly, there's no income tax. However, do a base cost per cut at the issue price for dividend fees. This is the pull back shares, there's no income tax, you only pay capital gains tax at the dividend species value. E&M. What's taken -- what's taking -- does new CEO have if no one was -- yes, look we've been very clear, people are going to be worried with getting the model right. I have a very small with 1.5%, 2% of Poolbeg. I incentivized myself to work very hard. And we put a small stake together for the management team, and I have a very small stake in this. So that's where we didn't have 100% [indiscernible]. [ CFD ]. If we held Open Orphan shares in CFDs before the qualify did, they -- yes, if you held them in a [ CFD ], the [ CFD ] provider gets the dividend species. So anybody who helped open up. But again, look, you need to talk to your [ CFD ] provider because that's -- I might have my lead in that regard, so you need to talk to your advisers, anybody who held shares on the qualifying debt in the company got Poolbeg shares, if there was other products you need to talk to your adviser. [indiscernible] new vaccines development. We're focused on the beauty with Imutex, and the reason they're massively frustrated by it is that -- and folks have done your last [indiscernible] questions, so we will be closing down within the hour-ish. There's something fundamentally wrong about our friends and considerably weren't able to do something there. All I'm saying we are going to make something happen, that vaccines, antimalarial, all that space is in there, it's huge, huge growth. And let's sit back. There is more dividend species coming and Imutex one is just crying out to be done. [ Robert Dee ], can you spend how you conduct a China study in COPD and asthma? Very simple. We bring them in and we exasperate then use 1 of our viral challenges as we induce very mild master. [ Robert ], we have full control of 2 or 3 spinouts, hasn't minority changed with our friends. Absolutely, look, some of our friends don't move as fast as we do. But now we have the fourth one. Bear in mind, we, as a company, and you, very large shareholders, we have created a second public company. That's not a rinky-dinky. Bear in mind, Poolbeg is a GBP 53 million or GBP 55 million market cap company with no news flow. We've got a substantial news flow at the end of the summer and going forward. It'd be crazy that news flow, just they'll be around. So let's get the rest of them done and done fast. [indiscernible] Yes, Bruno, you mentioned using some of the cash to make it targeted bolt-on. We're always looking for things to -- we're not going to spend big as a small amount of cash for bolt-ons. So we are in expansion mode and all I'd say is, watch that space. Last 3 questions, or last 2. [ Colin K ], what's your forecast time frame to get the share price back to 40p. Let's see where we go, I think as we start spinning these off and people realize the distressed shareholder has done that we are definitely very profitable this year, while the confusions around the current, I think the share price will start ticking up rather nicely. [ Steven R ], please, can you comment on the recent statements published the government confirmed the current have been completed the safety and expanded and what it means to Open Orphan. Yes, that was a [indiscernible]. But that was the original one. So you've been ahead of the game. That didn't include extension. And as we said, the extension is well underway and will complete this on. Folks, I think that completes all the questions, I think. I think we did it within the hour. And apologies with the video, who knows what happened there, but hopefully, Paul, if you and all the folks could hear me okay. No, look, the final word is, I managed to rough through the presentation and are despite some technical difficulties, I think it's a really exciting place to be. I think [indiscernible] in Dublin, virtually 100% in the U.K. It's a fantastic time to building business like this. We are almost the center of the universe here in London at the moment or was passing through. And I couldn't be happier, more excited, I know, busy. We know we've had 6 weeks. We could have done them better. And it was almost a perfect storm of issues. But we have a lot done. A lot more to do in the next 6, 8 weeks and the next 6 months. I have to say, I couldn't be more excited,and let's see where this all brings us.