Integer Holdings Corporation (ITGR) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

All right. I'm still Joanne, and I'm still here with the management of Integer and I'm very, very thrilled that both of you are joining us. So thank you.

I want to start off big picture. You've had a CEO transition recently, you did notice, I know. But I'd love if you could just sort of step back and talk about what you see coming in. Some might call it a rocky start, you might call it an opportunity, but I'm going to leave that for you to label.

Yes. Thank you for that, and thanks for having us. It's great to be here. I certainly see this as an opportunity, and I'm very bullish about our business. Let me maybe take this opportunity to tell you a little bit about our business and maybe give you some perspectives on why I believe that we are very well positioned to deliver premium shareholder valuation. Maybe for those who may not be as familiar with Integer, we are a contract development and manufacturing organization. We're one of the largest in the world. We are very well positioned in the med tech ecosystem as a partner of choice for the most respected, largest and the most innovative companies, med tech companies in the world as well as some smaller -- a number of smaller companies and emerging customers. Our focus in our business is on some of the fastest-growing markets in our space, which are electrophysiology, neurovascular, structural heart and neuromodulation. And our strategy, if I really want to simplify it is that we work to build differentiated and critical capabilities, both engineering and manufacturing so that we can better participate in novel therapies and we work to get designed in early. We engage with our customers early in the development cycle so that we can get designed in. And as products launch years later and ramp, hopefully, they're successful, we are successful with them. And we build these capabilities through either organic means or very targeted strategic tuck-in M&A acquisitions. That's the primary reason why we make acquisitions is to build these critical capabilities. So as a result of this strategy, we have a very strong pipeline. This pipeline has grown every year. And how we measure it and communicate it as a leading indicator is our product development sales. If you think about it, when we work with our customers to help them with the design development of next-gen products, we get paid for that. And the more revenue that we have in that -- for the development, so that's an indication of the fact that, that pipeline is growing. And that pipeline is about 80% focused on these fastest-growing markets. So we've demonstrated that this strategy works by virtue of the fact that we've delivered above-market performance in recent years and expanding margins. Now 2026, if I just want to talk about that for a moment, our core business is expected to grow between 4% to 7%, which is in line with our weighted average market growth rate of 4% to 6%, slightly above that in line or slightly above, but this is being offset by the headwinds that we have with 3 specific products. These products had strong growth in 2025, particularly in the first half of 2025 and they're not having the rate to market adoption that our customers had hoped and anticipated in 2026. That's what's given us headwinds. And this is not a result of a competitive loss or in-sourcing or any changes in the supply chain structure. This is purely a market adoption rate. And we see this as a short-term event because the comps are more difficult in the first half of '25 to '26, compared to '25. We see this primarily as a first half of 2026 pressure headwind. We expect to get to market growth in the second half of 2026 and to above -- back to above market growth given our strong pipeline in 2027. So to conclude, I am a strong believer of our strategy. I was part of the team that developed it, have been executing it. I'm incredibly excited about our pipeline. Our business is very strong. Our core business continues to perform. This is a short-term air pocket, we call it, a 3-quarter headwind, and we fully expect to get back to growth in the second half of '26 and above market growth in '27.

So I want to just pause on like 14 things you said there. One piece of it is, I'm going to step back, even bigger picture. What do you think that you're going to do differently now that you've got the CEO title?

Yes. So we have built a very strong foundation, I want to continue building on that foundation. If you look at some of the focus areas that you said I talked about, what gives us that differentiation. If I want to step back and just think about what is it that our customers are trying to do? Because at the end of the day, we have to see the world through their eyes. What they're trying to do and what their customers are trying to do. This is kind of how we look at our customers' customers, what they're trying to do and back to how do we deliver value in that chain of value. And what our customers are trying to do is to develop the next-generation innovative therapies. They want to focus on that. They want to focus on things related to reimbursement of whatnot, so that their products can be successful. Where we can deliver value to them is to be able to be the partner of choice that can help them with the design, development and manufacturing, to help them bring products to market faster, and in a cost competitive way. These are very technically challenging products. They can't afford to lose months or years in the development. So that engineering expertise is absolutely critical that -- those capabilities. We have built a lot of that. I want to make sure that we continue to strengthen that over time, either through organic means or M&A acquisitions. We'll continue to focus on the fastest-growing markets that we have. Look, at the end of the day, execution is critical, quality delivery. Those are the table stakes that we continue to do well in. But being the most innovative CDMO on the -- in the world is definitely my vision.

And so I'm going to dig in a little bit on what happened on the third quarter call, but I do want to talk about some of the steps which you've done since then, which includes $200 million share repurchase program. What made now the right time to do that?

Yes. Look, Joanne, I think the Board authorizing the $200 million share repurchase is clearly showing their sign of how they believe in our fundamentals, our financial strength as well as our strategy and growth perspective. It really gives us another lever for capital allocation, right, with the stock reacting as it did from third quarter, we believe that the stock is undervalued and it gives us another avenue for capital allocation, continuing to balance organic investments, inorganic M&A as well as then being able to have this other lever to return and generate value for our shareholders.

When was the last time you did a share repurchase program?

We have not done a share repurchase program in the past, so this is really...

Most of your cash has been used for M&A, if I remember correctly.

For both organic investments and then inorganic investments, right, continuing our tuck-in M&A strategy.

Okay. So let's pause on the third quarter for a second or maybe for a bit more than a second. So one of the things that struck me as I was reading the press release and then we were doing our call and then the subsequent call back was it seemed as if these 3 headwinds happened over -- at some stage over a 90-day period. And so the question I have is, at what stage during the quarter, do you sort of look up and go, this isn't working or others communicate with you, they're changing their orders?

Yes. Let me take that one and let me maybe offer some context and background to this. So, as maybe I will start with that the 3 products that we're talking about did not impact 2025. It's purely a 2026 event. So we have delivered and plan to deliver in the remaining weeks effectively what our customers had asked and what we had forecasted that we would do. We learned during the course of the third quarter that the 2 EP products, in particular, are not having the rate of adoption that our customers had hoped, which would impact on '26.

So let's just pause on that. So it's a product that's in the market, and they think you're going to sell X and then based on their feedback from their customers, they're willing going to sell X minus something?

Or said differently, they were selling X in 2025. But because of rate of adoption and maybe some competitive pressures, they expect to sell less in 2026.

Right. Okay. All right. So that's -- so both EP plus neuro or that's...

So it's the 2 EP products and neuro. In any given year, Joanne, it's not unusual for demand to go up and down for a certain product and -- or for 1 product, not to do as well or because they usually get offset. So one product changing is not an event. And we knew a little bit earlier about the 1 neuro product not doing as well, but that's just normal, course of event, those things get offset. But when we learned about the 2 EP products in the third quarter, now you have the stacking of 3 products. That's what -- that's highly, highly unusual in my tenure with Integer. We haven't seen 3 meaningful products, having strong growth in 1 year and a significant decline in the next. But I would, if I may, also suggest that, that diversification of our portfolio, the fact that no one program that we have in our portfolio represents more than a few small percentage points of our total revenues in the, say, low single digits, it's a strength for us because we don't have -- if you were to imagine if we had products that were 10%, 15% of our revenues, and then you would have the stacking of those, obviously, that would be a structural change in the company. We have 3 meaningful products not performing as well, and we are saying that it's going to be a 3-quarter headwind. We're going to get back to growth and above-market growth. So I would like to suggest that this is actually the diversification of our portfolio is one of our strengths that allow us to easily weather these things.

So the fear, as I talk to investors is that you had 3 in the third quarter and then another pops up or then another pops up. So what are the checks and balances to ensure the consistency of the revenue stream?

Yes. Yes, of course. So maybe I can delineate between, say, our core business and maybe new products. And what I would say is that our core business, we get forecast from our customers. That tends to be fairly stable and steady. These are products that have been in the market for quite some time. Our customers know what these products are going to do, the expectations, they plan their manufacturing to give us rolling forecast. And look, there are ups and downs in this business. But generally speaking, it's fairly steady. We're talking about new products because new products are a little bit more difficult to predict in terms of what the true rate of adoption is going to be unless the product is actually in the market for quite some time. Now let me also say that our strategy is to launch more innovative products so that we can grow. This is how the industry goes. This is how our customers grow. On aggregate, when you have more innovative products, you're going to grow. Within that, you have products that do well, products that don't do well, but on aggregate, you grow. We're talking about an unusual situation where 3 of them are going the other way at the same time. So back to the question about what we do and what we can do. We already are very in tune with the market. We have product management teams. We talk to physician groups. We talk to our customers on a regular basis. We are very connected with our customers at all levels. We buy reports. And if we believe something that might not seem right, we have those conversations with our customers. But at the end of the day, the people that truly know best what's happening in the marketplace are our customers. They are the ones that have the products in the physician hand, they get feedback. And if they tell us, here's a purchase order for the next few months, deliver X, we deliver X. When they say, we want you to plan for X capacity, we do that. But when a product launches, after the typical ramp period that happens at the beginning and once our customers start to get some feedback for the market, they always adjust up or down or steady. Again, we're talking an unusual situation, 3 products not doing as well. That's what we're talking about. It's unusual.

Yes. Yes. Well, the stock, share that...

Yes, we believe the stock is undervalued because our fundamentals have not changed. Our core business continues to do very well, very strong. I mean, again, taking the impact of these 3 products out. Our core business is still expected to grow 4% to 7%. So our pipeline continues to grow year after year. Our strategy is strong. This is an air pocket. Yes, our stock price is, we believe, is an overreaction.

So let's step back from this and take a look a little bit at the medical device space today. And I spend my entire life talking about new products coming to market, sort of like you do, too. And it strikes me that we're hitting a phase of multiple new products and multiple new iterations of them after years of R&D, would love your viewpoint?

Yes. We are incredibly excited about the markets that we're participating in. This is some of the most innovative times. I mean, if you look at -- we've been talking about electrophysiology, obviously, because of the 2 products that we're talking about, but electrophysiology has been doing phenomenally well. Obviously, PFA has been driving a lot of procedure volumes, and that market has been doing really well. Our EP portfolio has been doing phenomenally well over the past 4 or 5 years because we have presence in the whole procedure from access to.

So let's stop there for just one quick second because I think a lot of investors translated EP equals PFA. But you are saying now that you've got the portfolio of the electrophysiology. You've got the catheter, the guidewire, maybe RF, maybe cryo, definitely PFA. And how do we think about maybe navigation?

We have access to all of that.

All of it?

And mapping and diagnostics. I mean there are many, many steps. The ablation, and I know there's a lot of focus on PFA because it's an incredible technology. But that's the last step. But there's a lot that has to happen before you get to that step, and we have participation across all of that. So as volume procedures -- as procedure volumes grow, well, that gives us tailwinds. And even if you remove -- so our EP portfolio has grown above market over the past many years. In 2026, where we have the 2 headwinds, if you remove those, the rest of our portfolio is still growing at market, which is growing very strongly, double digits. So this is not a structural thing. And then going beyond that, because we're talking a lot about EP, we see a lot of innovation going on in structural heart with tricuspid and mitral, for example, we have participation in the delivery system for those. Lots of innovation going on in the neuromodulation space with a lot of different exciting therapies. We've got a strong pipeline there. And neurovascular is something that's been a focus for us, and we've strengthened our capabilities through both acquisitions and internally, we are very excited about the market -- the strength of the market in the future and the customer relations that we have, the trends that tend to be towards outsourcing, we're very bullish about our business.

You participate also in renal denervation?

We do. We have exposure to RDN, which is very -- from a technology capability perspective, it is very similar to electrophysiology. So we are very well positioned for that. RDN itself is -- has a ton of potential. I mean, companies talk about that a lot. You put out a report this morning. We're very excited about that space. But it is something that's going to take time. It's not a meaningful part of our portfolio today, but we certainly believe it can be a tailwind for us.

Okay. Structural heart, you mentioned tricuspid, mitral, aortic?

We are less indexed towards TAVR. We are more focused on tricuspid and mitral and more specifically in the delivery systems for those.

Okay. So it's not the valve itself, it's the delivery system?

We try to focus on more on the delivery systems. Yes, we work with our customers to see where we can deliver the most value so that we can help them bring products to market faster. And we have developed capabilities where they can be of value to our customers. and we focused a lot on the delivery system.

And what about LAAC?

Yes. We have -- it's a great market. We have some componentry there, but it's not a big part of our business today.

So if you could educate me just a little bit, I'm company X and I say I need a catheter. How far in advance do I contract with you for said catheter? And you think my catheter can be something else. But I'm trying to think about our conversation when it starts. And then are you -- am I sending you -- if it's -- let's say, it's a mitral valve, am I sending you the mitral valve and you attach it to catheter? Or are you sending me back the catheter and I do the packaging on my side?

So maybe I can explain the process, if that's helpful a little bit.

Yes, please.

Yes. So, catheter, specifically minimally invasive, that would be a cardiovascular business. We're very focused on that. So -- and let's just say catheters can be highly, highly complex, can be not as complex, but let's just say kind of the middle of the road catheter. Typically, our customers, when they work on the next-generation therapies, they have a design in mind. And we work with them early to maybe build some prototypes for their -- think about engineers working in a lab, right, putting stuff together and very quickly, assembly, not manufacture -- not something that's manufactured, but you're trying to do a proof of design, if you will. So our engineers, either they come to our facility, we go to theirs or we work -- that work goes on for quite some time. There's a lot of iteration that goes back and forth, about, look, this design, the steerability might not be, we need more torque here, we need more there. I mean there's a lot of tech talk that goes on back and forth. That can go on for quite some time until the design gets to a place that, okay, now the proof of concept is proving as viable. And that could take a number of years, by the way, until we can get there. So along the way, as the design gets more certain and closer, tighter, now we shift our focus to how do you manufacture this because that manufacturability and be able to scale effectively becomes very critical. That's a core competency that we have that our customers rely on. Think about -- and these could be some true numbers. In a lab, the prototype stage, the catheter can take 8 hours to assemble. But you can do that when you're trying to make tens of thousands of them, right? It could be -- it should be measured in minutes, right? That takes a lot of thinking about the fixturing, the automation, how do you do that. That's where a lot of the expertise that we have. So over the years, once the design gets frozen per se, that's a tech talk for that. Then now we're getting to really get into the manufacturability of it. Now customers go and focus on their clinicals, they focus on the regulatory and they'll leave it in our hands to make sure that we take it to a place that is ready for manufacturability. And where they -- and they give us those launch dates in advance. So we work towards that in tandem so that when they're ready to go, they give us a go ahead and then we start ramping the product.

Okay. I have a question for you, Diron. How do you think about managing on the expense side as the company goes through this air pocket?

Yes, sure. There's really 2 levers for us when we think about it, Joanne, and I'll maybe step back to, call it, our typical margin expansion algorithm. And that's going to be generating gross margin expansion primarily through our Integer production system, which is our version of lean, and it's where and how we take waste out of the manufacturing process, be it direct materials or direct labor, getting more efficient in the manufacturing. We have teams of people that are simply focused on that in the manufacturing space. And then the other part of the algorithm typically is the fixed cost leverage, either leveraging overhead or OpEx on higher volumes, growing those costs at a rate less than your sales growth. That's typically how we generate our margin expansion story. So as we go into 2026 with some of the volume headwinds, we still fully intend to drive the manufacturing efficiencies through Integer production system. We are completely invested in that, and we're continuing to grow the maturity of the organization around that lean culture. For the fixed cost, it will be a bit more of a pressure point. So we're going to be much more disciplined in how we manage the cost on the fixed cost side, the overhead and the OpEx during this kind of air pocket that we're in. So we're going to be focusing our investments on the areas that will drive growth in the second half of the year and support any product launches that we have that are going to be focused -- that will support then the 200 basis points above the market in 2027. That's where we're going to be focusing our investment in OpEx and/or overhead. But I want to be very clear, we're not making significant structural changes in our organization and our cost structure during this period because we do see it as an air pocket, and we want to make sure that we're ready to support the growth that we see coming in the second half.

So we should think about gross and operating margins lower in '26 versus '25?

So it will be a pressure point, right? We've talked about our sales outlook so far is down 2% to plus 2% reported, and we shared our operating margin being down 5% to up 4%. So on the -- if we see some more volume and we get on the higher end of the range, we should be able to leverage that volume to expand margins, but we potentially see some pressure on the downside on the low end of the case.

And so to get back to above-market growth and then to, I would assume, returning to growth in margins depending on whether you're down 5% or up 4%. Is that new contracts, new products coming in to fill this air gap? Or is this just sort of a normalization of the infrastructure?

I'm sorry, Joanne. Did you say?

To get to '27?

The above-market growth? Yes. So that's -- a key piece of that is our product launches. If you think about our overall algorithm, our kind of base business is growing at the WAMGR, the 4% to 6%. Our above-market growth is generally derived from new product launches from -- that we've won working with our customers. And so that's the key piece. We have some very exciting new product launches in the second half of '26 as well as into 2027 across our 4 targeted markets.

And so those are contracts that you already have for the second half of '26?

Yes. These are -- back to payments conversation about the development time line and the development cycle. We have programs that are in development for 3 to 5 and even for some of the PMA products upwards of 10 years. So these are things that we have been developing with our customers for a very long time.

Yes. Anything that's launching in the second half of '26 or '27 has been in development for years.

You know it?

Yes. Yes, we know it. We know what the product launches. These have gone through those early stages, and they're in the more mature phases. It is rare. Look, it could happen, but it is rare that something goes through very quickly. If it's a simple component or something, of course. But we're talking about generally, any product with any complexity, especially if it's a new therapy, we're talking about years of development.

And that's where we do our risk adjustment because, again, we are tightly connected with our customers on the launch timing, launch volumes. The risk adjustments that we look at there are more -- if there's a delay, maybe an approval delay or something to that effect, that's where we risk adjust those launches. But generally, at this point, they're very, very tight in terms of what the plan is.

Excellent. Where do you do your manufacturing?

Where we do our manufacturing? We have a global footprint. We do manufacturing in the United States. We have a number of locations in the United States, in Mexico, in Europe, in Ireland, in Central America, in Asia, in Malaysia. We have a global footprint for manufacturing.

So you know where I'm going with this. I'm trying to figure out with all of the changes which are happening globally, how do you think about manufacturing in what region?

Yes. So our manufacturing footprint is -- we have a strategy behind this, and it's based on a number of criteria, obviously. So we look at availability of expertise where we have centers of excellence. Some of the things that we do, it's highly complex and takes years of expertise. So we really value that expertise. That's our differentiator. So that's one criteria as to where do we want to have manufacturing for certain things. Obviously, we want to make sure that we're cost competitive. Cost isn't necessarily in a certain country, we call best cost locations, best cost plants because you could have high-cost labor areas in the United States to be very cost competitive through automation and whatnot. So we have a manufacturing strategy that determines what the footprint should be. But we also have to realize that med tech and our customers are global. So we also want to be close to where our customers are and operate. We have, for example, Ireland is a very large med tech hub. Well, we have a very strong presence there for that reason. We do manufacturing, but also engineering design because we want to be in those regions where the work happens. And so that's really the primary reason why we have this global footprint. I'll stop because I think you might have a follow-up on that.

No, no. I'm just -- it goes from my point of with tariffs, with globalization.

So yes. That's what I thought your follow-up would be the tariffs because the question that we've been asking and I anticipated you would ask...

I think I have asked too.

Yes, yes, you certainly have. What could happen if the tariffs. So because we actually feel our global footprint is a competitive advantage for us because tariffs -- so first, we have to see what's going to happen over time. Obviously, tariffs have been a very dynamic situation. And how -- what it's going to be a year, 2, 3 from now, something to be seen. But because it's a global structure, tariffs are not only one way, things coming to the U.S. There could be some reciprocal tariffs that are going outside. So our global footprint allow us to kind of manage through that. Of course, working very closely within the guidelines. We try to mitigate tariffs as much as possible, and we've done that with our customers. But what I can tell you is this, although tariffs are something that have been discussed a lot. It's not a big exposure for us. We've talked about that for us would be somewhere in the range of $1 million to $5 million for us in 2025. We have ways within the guidelines to mitigate that for our customers, but also the things that we buy. The majority of the products that we buy, the supply for our products is U.S.-based. So we're not -- we don't have a big exposure. We have very little exposure to China, for example. So it's not a big thing for us. But when we talk with our customers about next-generation products, the location of manufacturing is decided in those early stages. So think about if we're talking about a product with a customer now that's launching in 4, 5 years, we decide today where the manufacturing location is going to be collectively with our customers. We have not had any discussions with our customers today about, well, maybe the location should be X because potentially tariffs could be Y. That's not their primary factor. They want to make sure what is the most important rate of success for the product, for its competitiveness, where the expertise is. So we don't see that as a big, big event today. Over time, once I think everybody understands what tariffs might look like, yes, but we are well positioned for that because of our global footprint.

I've been doing this long enough. I remember Wilson Greatbatch. And Integer has been formed through a series of acquisitions, consolidations. Does that continue?

In terms of us making acquisitions?

Yes.

Yes, that is a very important part of our strategy. What I would highlight though is that our strategy for acquisitions is mostly around tuck-ins with critical capabilities. The acquisitions that you're talking about that happened in 2014 and 2015, 3 companies coming together in short order, they were more transformative acquisitions. When Accellent in 2014 bought Lake Region and then Greatbatch bought that company of Lake Region. Those were transformative. We -- that is not part of our strategy today. We're looking more at tuck-in acquisitions, which are very targeted and really focused on critical differentiated capabilities within our business.

And you've also spun out several noncore. To my eye, you don't have anything else noncore to spin out, but I love your response.

Yes. We have -- we look at our portfolio all the time. You're correct. Not too long after Integer was formed in its current form, we coined the name Integer in early 2016 sometime. And in 2018, we divested an orthopedics Advanced Surgical business because we determined at the time that this was not the most strategic thing for us, the level of innovation, whatnot, capability there was not a differentiator. So we made a strategic decision to exit that in 2018. We made a strategic decision to exit our portable medical business, working with our customers over multiple years because we want to make sure that our customer had a continuous supply while they find alternatives. That happened over 3, 4 years. We're completing that this year. That's the external batteries and chargers, whatnot, where we didn't believe that the level of innovation was something that we wanted to participate in. And then lastly, we exited -- we had a small business that was called Electrochem, which was batteries for nonmedical. We exited that in 2014. What we have right now, we are excited about, cardiovascular, cardiac rhythm management and neuromodulation. These are core. We're a pure-play medical company with some of these exits that we have and this is our portfolio today.

And how do you think about the integration of artificial intelligence in your manufacturing processes and in your product development?

Yes. It's very important. We have a focus on artificial intelligence. We have brought in an AI leader on board to kind of help us with that. AI has a lot of different uses, obviously, in the tech industry, it's a very different use than it is for us. But we're definitely looking at how do you use AI for efficiency overall in your business. That can be across the business. In manufacturing, we have a lot of automation, for example. And because of that, we have a lot of data. We have been launching systemically what's called manufacturing execution system. Think about it as paperless that we're building platforms over the years, we got a long plan that everything is like database. And what AI needs is a lot of data. And we believe that we're well positioned just because of what we're doing to have that data and how do you bring intelligence into that, that can work with your automation. So we see that as an area of opportunity in the coming years for us.

One of the things, I think, in my conversations with investors is I hear a 3-quarter air pocket. And so if you think about the next 3 quarters, what are the progress reports that we should be looking forward to, to get back to your growth rate guidance for 2027?

Yes. The 3-quarter air pockets, we're talking about 4Q, 1Q, 2Q, right? And that's what we're talking about. We expect to get back to market growth in the second half. We have, as I mentioned earlier, Joanne, our core business continues to perform well, and we have good visibility, and we've demonstrated that it can be a predictable part of our business. That core continues to do well and grow 4% to 7%, we expect, as I mentioned. What's going to get us to growth in the second half is primarily because we're going to weather the tough comps. Now there is some impact of new product launches that are going to happen in the second half of the year. But because of the timing of it, that contribution is not as big. It's mostly in 2027. We're very excited about '27 because when we step back and look at all the products that we have expected to launch half of '26 and '27 in all of our growth markets. And when we risk adjust them, we risk adjust them for, say, time of launch, if there's an issue with the launch, regulatory or whatnot or what if the set products don't do as well as we had hoped. When we risk adjust them and we take a balanced view, we are comfortable that we can get to 200 basis points of our market.

So Payman and Diron, when we're here next year and we're talking, what do you think we're going to be talking about? And for you, I'm going to add, what are we not going to be talking about?

Well, let's just say I'm going to be looking forward to that conversation. What we're going to be talking about is how we have got the company back to market growth in 2026, how we're excited about getting to above-market growth in 2027 and how we are confident that we're demonstrating that we're delivering value for our shareholders. I'll let Diron answer and then I'll get back to what we're not going to be talking about.

Yes. I think a key piece of it is, I think we'll be talking about the diversity of our portfolio and our sales base, allowing us to weather a storm where we did have this unusual event that we were able to weather it over a very quick period return to market growth in the second half and its payments at above market in 2027.

We won't be using the word air pocket.

Very good.

Yes. It's something that we'll refer to as a past tense, and we're going to be talking about our future, the strength of our pipeline, which I'm incredibly excited about.

Both of you, thank you so much for joining us, and have a fabulous day.

Thank you for having us.

Thank you, Joanne. Appreciate it.