Kane Biotech Inc. (KNE) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Good morning, everyone, or good afternoon, depending on where you're visiting us from. My name is Philip Renaud, Chairman of Kane Biotech, and thank you for your time and interest in Kane. On behalf of the Board of Directors, I would like to thank our shareholders for their continued support of the company through a challenging period of transition. Over the past year, Kane has transformed itself from a company with multiple business activities into a focused wound care company built around a unique capability, the ability to address biofilms, reduce healing time and improve a patient's life through our FDA and Health Canada approved revyve product platform. The team and I believe that this focus has fundamentally improved the quality and the strategic value of the company. I want to speak briefly about 3 areas. My commitment to came, my confidence in the team and the encouraging feedback that we are getting from both doctors and patients alike with reordering continuing. First of all, my commitment to Kane. My commitment has never been stronger, Dr. Robert Huizinga and his team never stop amazing me with their dedication and hard work, and we are finally seeing the results. As both the Chairman and a significant shareholder, my interests are in line with every shareholder. I understand that my responsibility is to create long-term value through disciplined decision-making responsible stewardship of capital and an unwavering focus on execution. We remain actively engaged in the valuing opportunities that may enhance shareholder value while maintaining our commitment to transparency and sound corporate governance. Since assuming leadership, Dr. Robert Huizinga and his team have brought focus, urgency and discipline to the organization. They have worked to rebuild credibility, strengthen relationships, advanced commercial activities, deepened clinical engagement and position Kane for sustainable growth. No early-stage health care companies without challenges. However, what gives me confidence is not the absence of challenges, it is the quality of the people addressing them. This is not Rob's first time in bringing an innovative game-changing product to the market. He has the scars to prove it. Rob understands what it takes to win. The Board has observed a management team that is prepared to make difficult decisions, operate with transparency and remain focused on the fundamentals of building successful wound care company. They have our support, and they continue to earn our confidence through their actions and executions. And finally, and perhaps most importantly, I would like to discuss revyve. Over many years, Kane has developed a differentiated technology platform grounded in biofilm science. What excites me today is that we have moved beyond a purely development stage story. We now have products that have achieved important regulatory milestones and are being introduced into the marketplace. The wound care market is searching for solutions that are clinically relevant practical for health care providers and capable of addressing the significant burden associated with chronic wounds. Based on the work completed by the company, -- the feedback received from clinicians and the growing body of clinical experience, I believe revyve has the potential to become an important tool in wound care management. As Chairman, I'm encouraged by the quality of the science, the growing clinical interest and the commercial opportunities that management is pursuing. While there's still important work ahead I remain highly optimistic about the opportunity before us. In closing, I want shareholders to know that the Board is actively engaged Management is executing on a clear strategy and we remain focused on building long-term value. We believe Kane is better positioned today than it was a year ago. We have a clear strategic focus stronger commercial leadership, increasing clinical engagement and a product platform that addresses a significant unmet need in wound care. Thank you again for your support, your patience and your belief in the company. I would like to turn over the presentation to Dr. Robert Huizinga. Thank you.

Well, thanks for your kind words, Phil. We really appreciate it. And it really is a team-based approach, not only within Kane, but with clinicians and patients so that we can make a difference for people that have chronic wounds. And before I give the presentation, we welcome your questions throughout today's webcast. To submit a question, please click the Q&A icon located in the meeting controls and just type your question in a Q&A panel. Questions may be submitted at any time during the presentation. Now to help us manage the session efficiently, all questions will be reviewed by the moderator, Ray Dupuis being published and addressed. Now due to time constraints, we may not be able to answer every question live. However, we will make every effort to address the most relevant questions during the Q&A portion of the webcast. We encourage you to submit questions as they arise rather than waiting until the end of the presentation. In addition to a Q&A session, we have our forward-looking statements as well, too. And this may look a little bit longer than what you've seen in past presentations. And that's because we're going to talk about the revenue model that we've put together and what that means for the company, for the patients and for investors. There can be no assurance that the expectations reflected in the forward-looking information will prove correct -- and so readers and webcast participants should not place undue reliance on forward-looking information. Now the intent of today's call is really to have a presentation from myself talking about the commercial access and turning that into a repeatable adoption by clinicians and of course, revenue to the company. And then, of course, Dr. John Lantis, will be talking about a clinician's view of biofilm chronic coolants and revyve in his practice. Now he's running a busy clinic and he's in clinic right now, and he'll be able to join us hopefully during this presentation. Internally, we talk about this as Kane 2.0. And we have a lot of new elements to the company, and that's really building the foundation of a sustainable commercial enterprise. And the first is we have a new board. As you know, we brought a new Board of Directors last year, and you elected them on to the Board of Kane. They have expertise across various arenas of bioscience, including medical devices, drugs financial expertise. And so we are glad to have them there. We, of course, have Phil as the new Chair of the Board as well, too. As a significant shareholder to ensure good governance, we additionally have a lead independent director to ensure that your wishes are being well represented. On top of my new role within the company, we have new commercial leadership as well, too, a person for Canada and for the U.S. have great expertise in not only dealing with wound care medical devices but launching new devices in the wound care space. Kane as a whole has a new vision, wholly focused on human wound care since the divestment of the Animal Health Care division. And of course, we have a family of products, 3 cleared products in the U.S., the gel the spray and the cleanser, which are all FDA 510(k) cleared and of course, the gel and the spray are approved by Health Canada as well, too. Our plan through 2027 is to move it to Europe through a CE mark that will allow us to continue our commercial efforts there. But that's built on the back of a clinical evidence program. You know about the clinical data that we've built to date. We are continuing to build clinical data along the way in new patient arenas like burns. And as these clinical trials start we will be announcing them to. In addition, we have a scientific advisory board that's been formed with the new -- with the first meeting, excuse me, towards the latter half of this year. And we're excited because they also have expertise across the clinical space and the preclinical space. And lastly, all of this has value, but really it relies on an important excuse me, distribution network across the U.S. and Canada. And I'll be talking about that in a few minutes. Now you've seen this slide before. We amputate a limb in the U.S., about every 4 minutes for a diabetic-related complication. There's about 10.5 million people that have a chronic wound that are covered by Medicare alone. In addition, there's about 700,000 people annually in the U.S. who have a burn-related insurance claim, meaning they have a significant burn that requires some sort of acute care. And that care is expensive. And it's not a lot cheaper in Canada either. It's about $47,000 for a diabetic amputation. And overall, that results in about $750 million spend for Canadian taxpayers in diabetes alone. And if you're a First Nations population, your rate of diabetes, and of course, your subset amputation is even higher than that. And so that's the patient population we're trying to address. And so, Ray, I'm not sure if John Lantis has joined us yet?

Yes. Dr. Lantis is on the call now.

John, if it's okay, Ill just to introduce you for a second. You're the site Chief of Surgery at Mount Sinai at West in New York, professor of Surgery at the Icahan School of Medicine. You're the Director of Vance Care. But in addition to all of that, you're the Editor Chief of the prestigious Journal wounds, you've been involved in a lot of clinical trials as a principal investigator over your time and you had the chance to use revyve over the last year in your patient population in addition to co-authoring a publication for us. And I'd like to turn the presentation over to you and just have you share with us your experience of using Reviving your patient population?

So thank you so much for the kind introduction, and thanks for having me today. Sorry, I'm in the middle of May office and clinic day, but yes. So again, thanks for making time. With that in mind, the product is incredibly -- there's a real realization. The other thing that's not here is I train a wound fellow every year. And I also have a significant number of trainees. We have 26 vascular surgery trainees for -- in our program, which is actually the largest in the country. So all that being said, we have a lot of folks who are not -- who are clinically doing actually the work in the trenches. So it's top down. And in our outer rebid especially in its spray on formulation, but in all formulations, but really on the span formulation has done some amazing things. And it is one of those issues that probably addresses biofilm in a very unique fashion -- and the weird portion or the unique portion maybe here is without contact or without debridement, which is painful to patients and there are certain populations. So I guess the amazing component is I have had a gentleman who has sickle cell anemia, which is, of course, an environmental learned trait of our bodies to deal with malaria. So folks from a Nigerian heritage, which for obvious historical inappropriate reasons have ended up in the United States, South America and the Caribbean and have these ulcers. So they develop ulcers in the lower extremities due to poor oxygen delivery to tissue, and they get chronic infection primarily with pseudomonas. So a very difficult bacteria to remove. So I've one gentleman specifically, that is also open at his angle for 36 years. right 3, 6 years. So like older than most of our kids. And his ulcer has been open for that long, and he used revyve spray and he healed. And it's a 62-year-old gentleman who gives you a hug because you heal his ulcer. And I have done other things. The funny part, I debrided him. I've done this, I put on super agent X, Y and Z, but revyve healed him. And I mean that's anecdotal, but we've seen this in sickle cell anemia. We think we see it in other people. There is no magic wand for everybody and nothing is right for everybody. But from our perspective, we have shown in using biofluorescence that we reduced bacterial burden in patients with a topical antimicrobial therapy, and there are other ones out there at the moment. But I think that this is a very, very viable option. And I think for the folks who are not medical who are on this call, one thing to keep in mind, although clinical staff and medical folks are swayed by evidence. A lot of us is very hard not to be swayed by experience. And those are 2 differences. And revyve has for 2 fellows. So these are people with full medical school training, 2 or 3 years of surgical training and for several residents who are again, 4 years of medical training and 2 or 3 years of surgical training. Revyve has given the numerous anecdotal improvements or closures of wounds that have been problematic to them. So I think if you personally think about this, anything that solves a problem for you is usually a benefit to you that can be something that makes your car run better or make your doors not squeak -- and I mean it sounds silly, but when you take care of patients and you see 120 patients a week like I do, and you operate 2 days a week on 8 different patients. things that solve a problem for you, more often than not, are attractive, revives interestingly entered that real. -- right? So for us, it is something we like to have available. We're going to be doing a prospective trial, furthering the data around this. But to date, this is something that in cases, I can say, have we tried this yet? And it's not always a 1 and done. And that's one thing I will say by it's not obviously treating using a spray on or applicable hydrogel with antimicrobial property doesn't do everything for everybody. But it does something for almost everybody. So the issue is there, you move people in the right direction. It may be a portion of the algorithm of care. But the sickle cell guy who gave me the huge hub, which was not expected -- it was just spraying it on 3 times a week, dressing his wound. He's done the same thing for 36 years, like I said, and he added a spray and his wounds closed and he has no pain. -- and single cell wounds are very paint. So from a personal experience, it's almost like I'd like to say that the can Group, thank you because this is the person I care about. He's a patient I see -- I saw weekly. I saw him weekly for 2 years. So he had fundamentally -- I don't see them every week, my follow season will blow up. But fundamentally, you had 104 visits. Now I see them once every 3 months to make sure he's okay. huge improvement. So that's what I have to say. Thank you very much for your attention. But that's that -- and we have other data. I mean, our data says that we reduce bacterial burden, patients get better, they feel better. They like the therapy. -- 1 of the patients with sickle cell anemic, quite frankly, is actually a physician young man who he's a physician and has this problem. He closed on wound is other wound is closing. He goes to work every day, he couldn't do without this. So I think that really covers -- there's a clinical emotional benefit to this that we're very happy to further elucidate whether it is -- who else is helpful too. So this isn't just your diabetic foot ulcer or your this or your that. I think there's a wide spectrum. And obviously, there are other products out there that are antimicrobial, -- this has been very beneficial and a lot of the patients we've had have experienced some of the other therapies that are theoretically competitive and have done very well with this. So we look forward to doing further research work in regards to it.

Some. Well, thanks very much. I appreciate especially the anecdotal story of that 1 patient. One of our key values is patient centricity. So I get really excited when I hear patients already. So I really appreciate you sharing that with us. And we're looking forward to the continued work and investigation of revyve with your patient population. So thanks. I appreciate that. I'm going to continue on to stage on with my part of the presentation. I know you have a tight clinic window, but I'll continue on. One of the things that we've learned over the last several decades is biofilm is a real issue for all of us. And as Dr. Lantis mentioned, it may not be in every patient's wound, but it looks like somewhere between 70% to 80% of wounds have a biofilm component to them. And very simply put, bacteria's response to being potentially killed is to glue themselves to the base of the wound as quickly as they can and to form this thing we call a biofilm. And they form that biofilm within 72 hours. So in sending to virus, you have this mature boom that now makes these bacteria more resistant to antibiotics than it would be normally. And the picture there is in the bottom right of your screen. It's typically not 1 bacteria but it's multiple bacteria forming this invisible shield that they have. And as Dr. Lantis just mentioned, the only way around that is to physically disrupt it. So it's debride the patient's wound, which is painful or to chemically disrupt it. And that's what revyve does us very clearly. We have a biofilm disruption component, which works in 30 minutes. We've seen the difference in biofilm disruption and reducing the inflammatory cascade. So the thing we call the late protease activity. In addition to that, we have PHP as the antimicrobial, which works in the preclinical models for up to 7 days. And when you think about a patient in the outpatient setting, who may not be able to see a physician every 3 days or surge every 3 days, they have the ability to have that combined activity over that 7-day period across multi species and resistant strains. And then lastly, as Dr. Lantis just mentioned, there is this no-touch approach with the spray. But regardless for both products, it's a thermal reversible gel that supports this thing we call autolytic agreement, which basically means it's cleaning the wound underneath as the gel is sitting there. to put it on, it immediately turns into a thick viscous gel on the patient's skin, but then to remove it, cool water, cool saline it comes right off. So there cleared products within the revyve family and a fourth, which I'll talk about in just a moment. We, of course, have the wound gel, which you're well aware of, which is intended for chronic ulcers like diabetic foot ulcers, venous leg ulcers, pressure ulcers. We have the antimicrobial wound gel spray, which intended for burns or large areas or those painful lesions that Dr. Lantis just mentioned, or irregular wounds where a noncontact application really matters to patients. We had already announced that we have a skin of wound cleanser that's been 510(k) cleared by the FDA. And we're presently working with negative pressure wound care companies to find a way to work with them so that their device and our cleaner work well together. And then lastly, the surgery -- the surgical environment is important for us. because right now, the products we have, the wound gel is not sterile, which means it can only be used after the decision has been closed, and they're ready to put a final dressing on the incision. The surgical gel we've heard from clinicians would be very valuable to them because as implants are put into patients when you think about hips and knees, there is a chance for them to have a biofilm and an infection there. So the opportunity to use the surgical gel in the OR with a sterile product is important to us. And that development program and regulatory pathway is being defined, and we hope to see that run through 2027. So you've already heard about the clinical research that we've done with revyve both in Canada and in the U.S. And as you see on this picture here, we've expanded that across multiple centers. So we now have data coming in on burns. We have data coming in, in different patient populations. And when we did the initial clinical series, it really said the same thing regardless of how a patient came to chronic wound whether that was through sickle cell disease, a radiation-induced ulcer, hidradenitis suppurativa, a diabetic foot ulcer venous leg ulcer, they ended up with the same problem due to the bacteria and the biofilm, and we showed in that case series that we had a high rate of conversion from a nonhealing wound to a healing wound, and in addition, as mentioned by Dr. Lantis, a meaningful reduction in pain, which is very important to patients. So over the life of Kane, we've had 11 peer-reviewed publications. But in the last year alone, we've had a tremendous number of conference presentations, both in the chronic wound setting, the burn set, but now, of course, in the military setting, which I'll talk about in just a few minutes. And we are working with a number of partners that you can see down below with us to make a difference in the lives of patients. And you may have seen these pictures before. This, on the left, is a standard 52-year-old male with a diabetic foot ulcer would fail multiple therapies prior to coming to revyve. And if you look at that CV in the heel, that's something that's concerning from a clinical point of view because I may end up in osteomyelitis. And over the 90 days approximately saw near closure of that wound and by month 5, a fully healed wound by the clinician. So a very good outcome in a patient that had filled prior therapies. And on the right is a patient of Dr. Lantis, which is a 62-year-old female with a chronic venous leg ulcer VLU, who had recurrent issue since 2013. So not quite that patient that we talked about 36 years of chronic wounds, but again, a very serious story since 2013. Pain score 10/10 with these VLUs are quite painful. The pain was eliminated by week 6. We can set a healing by week and by week 33 had sustained healing. Those are the reasons we do what we do. We want to see a difference in the lives in these patient populations. So in order to get revived to those patients, we needed to build a distribution infrastructure. And as you know, prior we had exclusive agreements with the distributing the U.S., and we've changed that approach as of today, we have 7 agreements signed with distributors and sales agent companies who will make sure that revyve gets out to clinicians and to patient populations. On top of that, we have 7 commissioned U.S. sales representative we call 1099 representatives who have direct relationships with different forms of wound care treatment. And that's important in the U.S. that we have these different touch points, both in hospital, out of hospital, mobile wound clinics and geographic wound clinics. In Canada, we have 3 distributors and GPOs that we've signed. We've mentioned those already including Ontario Medical Supply, who was just signed recently, and we have 11 further agreements in discussion, including the new GPO that we've signed in the U.S. were very important to us, and they would like to wait for the press release until they have signed their first order. But revyve is a dual use technology in every sense of the word. And we are working with the military as well, too. So we have a veterans a fair distribution agreement signed through Marathon Medical. And that will allow us to use the 10 is to get into those centers and use revyve in the chronic wounds that are there. In addition, we recently presented data at the MHSRS symposium in August and that resulted in a conversation with some military researchers who want to engage on a clinical research plan across several patient populations. And finally, again, in Canada, we've had ongoing conversations with CFHS, Canadian Forces health services, and we're looking forward to continue those conversations and seeing that turn into orders, initial orders and hopefully repeat orders. So what about the military? We've identified very distinct treatment areas for revyve within the military. The first is delayed access. I was at medic many, many years ago, and we used to believe in this thing called the golden hour that we could take an injured soldier, and get them off the battlefield and into a sustained treatment or area within an hour, and Ukraine has taught us that's no longer true. It's taking 9 hours or longer. So we're looking to have longer valuation times, which means they need treatment in the field to prevent the inevitable infections that may happen if the wound is not properly treated. In addition to that, the trauma has become more complex, and so they're looking at the spray delivery and in situ gel formation within this 3-dimensional wound that we have within the battlefield. On top of that, some of the bacteria you've seen in the combat spaces are different than what we've seen in the civilian spaces. So we will engage on a plan to look at those new bacteria and look at bacterial attachment and biofilm development in the combat setting. Of course, frequent dressing changes are important in the military, just that they are in the civilian space, as Dr. Lantis has mentioned, and we're looking to help the soldiers, they can reenter back to their units as well as possible. And lastly, we're looking at battlefield treatments in austere environments, very, very cold environments, which Canadians are well used to and very warm environments provide these to perform in the same deliverable manner in all those different environments in a low technology manner, meaning that a soldier can use it right at the battlefield at time of injury. So those are the plans that we're looking at along military. Now I told you at the beginning of the call, we were going to talk about a model that we built and put together to look at how revyve would be used across various spaces. And that includes the antimicrobial wound gel the antimicrobial wound gel spray, the skin and wound cleanser and the surgical gel. And the first question is how do we build that model. And so we looked at the different U.S. addressable market sources that you would normally have, and then we were able to look at the launches of predicate products, so for example, hydrogels. And we looked at the 5-year launch run of similar companies of a similar size with a similar and I would argue less efficacious product. and looked at their 5-year launch ramp and then modeled it from there. So if you look at the antimicrobial wound gel on the left side of your screen, you need to see that we're predicting a market share of 0.5% moving up to 2.5% in the hydrogel space. So that's a very conservative prediction. The same applies for the wound gel spray, a little bit higher for the skin and wound clench and that's because by this point, we will be working with negative pressure wound care companies, hopefully, to ensure that their products and our products are used together. The surgical gel had to be modeled differently because we looked at active surgical accounts in the jurisdictions where we know we will have a presence, multiplied by the procedures and the protocol penetration rather than a share, excuse me, of the total addressable market, and looking at the first revenue of that product in 2028. And across the bottom, we also did some assumptions for Canada and international sales and of course, held an exchange rate. Now this is a model. And a model is only as good as the inputs have put into it, but we believe we've put together a predictive model that is still conservative. And that means that we're targeting sales of $400,000 through the year 2026. Now those are modest sales, and you might want to say, why would I believe in the Kane story? Why is this important to us? Because you can see that model shows a ramp through 2027 through 2031, which in a very predictable manner and consistent with the 5-year launch ramps of other similar companies. Now there is upside not built into this model. We've not done anything in terms of dual use technology. In other words, any military orders because it's very hard to get our arms around that at this point. We've not talked about dispersing the or any of the aspects of disbursement either. This is primarily revyve the wound gel, the spray, the wound cleanser in the surgical gel in the civilian market. Now to do that, we need to make sure that we have supply chain ready and we're working on that now. Our partners Halo Pharma in Quebec are actually fill finishing right now, a batch of 3-ounce gel that we can get to the Canadian and U.S. markets to make sure we fulfill that demand. And then early next year, we'll be working with our partners, Aurena in Sweden to do spray field into bag-on-valve packaging of the 5-ounce spray. And as you know, we have a 3PL system set up both in Canada and the U.S. to deal with the logistics of shipping in each individual country. But as you also know, that means that we're going to have to embark on a capital raise of 1 kind or another to which would engage DNA advisers to help us. So we're targeting between a $3 million and $10 million raise. And to make the answer very similar to when people ask us, what is it fun? It's going to primarily go towards the commercial expansion of revyve in the U.S. and in Canada. We need to help our commercial colleagues who are experts in their field have the tools that they need to make sure that revyve is being adopted well used across the clinical space and across different hospitals and different touch points. And what happens if we had a smaller race. And we can either look at this in tranches. We've looked at nondilutive funding. We've looked at interim funding. We will do what is necessary to ensure that we have the right tools necessary for our commercial colleagues to do their job. And as I've mentioned, we have engaged D&A advisers who are on this call who are going to help us look at strategic partnerships, commercial collaborations financing initiatives and any other strategic opportunity that's going to be beneficial to both shareholders, patients and clinicians. And so we're excited to work with them over the course of this transaction to make sure we're carrying out successfully. So I'm going to end my presentation there. Ray Dupuis, our CFO, has been on this call. He's been taking questions in the background while this has been going on. I want to thank you for your time and attention listening to this presentation. And Ray, I'll stop here and turn it over to you.

Thank you, Robert. [Operator Instructions]. so we do have some questions. So we'll start with the first one, one moment, please. Is -- the first question is have sales improved since Q2.

Yes. I think sales improved in both in 2 areas, which are important. The typical initial sales of small sales and initial order and they see how revyve is working within their patient population. And then we're seeing repeat orders. So we're seeing not only time to first order shortening by the time between repeat orders shortening as well too.

Okay. The next question is, is revyve manufactured in the U.S. or Canada?

Great question. Ravin is manufactured in Canada right now through Halo Pharma. The reason for that is because it is a thermal reversible gel, meaning normally implants, you would heat things up to make it move through pipes quickly. In this case, we need to do the exact opposite. We need to cool it down it stays in its liquid form. We are looking at a secondary supplier in the U.S. who can accomplish those goals as well. And that may be something that we bring online to 2027 as we have the capital to move into a technology transfer.

The next question is, what is the shelf life of the gel and the spray?

Also really good question. Thanks. The shelf life for the gentle has spared the same. It's 3 years, and we have that shelf life approval.

Is manufacturing the spray in Sweden still viable on cost and logistics.

Yes. So the margins we have for the spray are good, and we're able to deal with the fill finishing of the spray in Sweden right now. We'd really like to find a landing manufacturer within North America. -- that would be obviously the best alternative, and we are doing that work trying to find that right manufacturer. But as of today, the answer to your question is, yes.

Another question has just come in. What is the temperature effect, if any, on this -- on the south life of the product?

There does not appear to be any impact of temperature on the shelf life of the product. We'll have to continue to find that data and the militaries have asked us for the data, so we'll continue to look at that along with the performance of it as an antimicrobial in those ouster environments, specifically very cold environments, -- so I don't have that data as well, too, but our R&D team are working with the military is to get that data. Again, great question.

Next question is why was distributor sell-through still limited at the end of Q2, despite partner shipments ramping?

I think Dr. Lantis said it best. Part of this is adoption by clinicians and showing them that we are solving a practical problem that they have today. And that practical problem is that dressing changes either involve extensive debridement or using products that don't work well. And so this is, in essence, like a push-pull approach. We are going to continue to exhibit at medical conferences, continue with new data, continue with practical presentations and continue with booth presentations so that clinicians are aware of this, while we work with finding new distributors in those therapeutic touch areas so that we can bring those 2 needs together at the same time. It's really about getting our name out there as often as possible as many times as possible and as many different venues as possible.

We've also received some questions in advance of this webcast. So I'll start reading those. When will sales increase materially?

Well, we're targeting for $400,000 through the tail end of this year. So we're expecting that to happen through this last quarter.

What needs to happen for commercial access to translate into repeatable product adoption?

It's a great question. Again, it's going to require 2 things. retention may be 3, but 2 things for sure. We need to make sure clinicians understand that there is a new way to treat wounds. What is remarkable when you look at the actual data for percent area reduction for revyve versus what's been reported for the competitive products. And remember, we don't have that data, but we do have their data. we're showing a much faster time to healing rate with revyve than has been seen with other products. So we just need to remind clinicians that there's a product out there that works well. We need to also remind distributors that this is a product that's going to make sense for them to want to carry because there is a financial advantage for them as well, too. And I said maybe 3. The third one may be actually getting more patients involved in this. When you look at these smaller diseases like HS, hidradenitis suppurativa, an adult skin disorder or when you look at the sickle cell disorder, for example, these are areas where we are now talking to patient advocacy groups and letting patients know that their physicians should know that there's a new treatment alternative for them. So I said 2, maybe 3, the third one may be getting the patients involved in this directly. So they understand that there is a way for them to be powered with their care by using products like Revyve.

Another question. Let's just come up with a Q&A panel is when are you planning to start the CE Mark process and whether you -- and do you have any -- currently have any partners in Europe?

Great question. Thanks. So the CE process takes about a year to accomplish. So we're starting that plans in 2027. We've already had conversations with groups that can help us through that regulatory pathway, whether that's through Ukraine directly or through the rest of Europe. Of course, remember, this does not include the U.K. and what happens. -- separate plan, excuse me, for the U.K. We do not have partners in the U.K. now. However, at conferences like SAWC, which I'll be attending shortly. -- we will have in conversations with potential partners and distributors in the EU.

Any details on the $10 million raise, equity or other?

No. And I would turn to my colleagues at DNA to provide any other comment, but we've not defined that at this point. We're looking at any and all alternatives. Daniel, I'm not sure if you have thoughts.

Sure. Well, good morning, everyone. Daniel Labrecque Brack, Founder and CEO of DNA Capital. So the objective of this strategic alternative mandate is to look at all the potential alternatives, one of which is to raise between $2 million to $10 million of treasury stock and this is something that we are currently working on. And of course, we were waiting for this presentation to be able to divulge our guidance on our business plan, so that is now done. -- and we're going to be working with this with a number of potential investors, some of whom are currently on this call. And that will be also a parallel path with the possibility of selling the business. We haven't had those discussions yet, but this is something we're going to have as well. So all these are even potential partnerships, mergers -- so all the options are on the table, and we are working with management and the business plan, which is now well in place. And so that's quite excited. We're very excited about the discussions we're going to have in the coming weeks and months. .

Thank you, Daniel. Next question is around -- have there been any impact on the company due to tariffs or the impact of -- on a company of any of the status of the Canada U.S. relationship has that impacted the company at all? Sorry, you're on mute, Rob?

Sorry, thanks, Ray. I apologize. We are obviously constantly watching what's happening south of the border with the U.S. At present, it's covered under CUSMA, and so there's no tariff applied to a product that's manufactured in Canada and shipped to the U.S. So that means that 3 ounces a gel and of course, the 1-ounce samples that we give. We are partners and we're part of medtech in Canada. So we have weekly calls at them sort of monitoring that situation. It's 1 of the reasons we're looking at a secondary manufacturer within the U.S. that will provide some comfort around not only supply chain management, but ensuring that we would have a manufacturer that would then not have to worry about the tariff situation.

Another question is, is it a lack of manufacturing or a lack of demand that has been the reason for the relatively poor sales so far?

Yes, I appreciate that question. I think it's a lack of awareness. Kane is a very small company and a large wound care arena. And you can imagine, we're competing against the companies like Smith & Nephew and Ergo Medical who have a tremendous number of employees. The one thing I've learned from my old life where we had the same issues of being a small company in a large company space is that I won't be able to outmarket those companies. We can't do that, but we can help a relationship with them, and that's an important part of what we do that we form these relationships with partners like Dr. Lantis in his institution and other institutions across the U.S. and Canada and have those relationships. We know that we are a trusted provider to them for the problems they experience with their patients and that we will do in spades. And so it's really lack of awareness. We're forming those relationships. We will continue to do that. And I think that will be in the routes success. -- if past history shows true.

Can you speak at all to the development and clinical plan for DispersinB? And is it dependent on raising capital?

DispersinB is dependent on raising capital. As you know, the initial plan was to look at that in an acne application. -- and we're still evaluating that as well too. There may be opportunity because it's an enzyme and works very, very quickly, even faster than revyve. There may be opportunity for a differentiated market approach. We always want to make sure that we're protecting the revyve because that is our primary franchise. So we want to make sure we're doing that. But we should also be aware that's under what's called the PMA approach, right, where we have medical devices like revyve drugs, which are different in PMA sort of fit somewhere in between. And so it will be a longer development cycle. So it is dependent on the amount of money we can bring to the company, and it will be a longer development cycle.

Another question that we received prior to this call is what are the measurable commercial milestones for the next 2 quarters?

Fair question. The target of sales for 2026, I think, is a fair, measurable target for us and a good KPI. In addition to that, we should see a national distributor for cannabis signed as well, too. That will be important for us. In addition to that, an order starting from the militaries, whether that's the U.S. military on the Canadian military, but in order starting from them that will show adoption through the military system and really validating the dual use technology.