Lion Finance Group PLC (BGEO) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Hello, and welcome to Bank of Georgia Group PLC's Fourth Quarter and Full Year Preliminary Financial Results Conference Call. My name is Nini Arshakuni, and I'm Head of Investor Relations at Bank of Georgia, and I'll be moderating today's call. We will start with an overview of the Group's performance, which will be presented by the CEO, Archil Gachechiladze, and then we will move to Q&A. Please be aware that this call is being recorded. And now I'm handing over to Archil. Archil, you are -- you need to unmute yourself.

Hello. Welcome to our fourth quarter and full-year results. I hope that regardless -- I see the number of participants, which is quite impressive given the geopolitical news flow that we are seeing so much interest is very nice -- good news for us. So we had a very good and strong quarter as you saw on a number of measures. I think we had record year, and we can dive into it. And until then, I will share the presentation and follow that one. So a few words on the macro as a lot of countries are experiencing Omicron virus, we also had a pretty strong wave, which looks like we are on the downside there. And from the peak numbers of around 25,000, we are just about half of it. But most importantly, we see that there's some decelerating trend. And I would like to also say here that the Georgian government has chosen to open up and little by little they are opening up the businesses and taking away the restrictions. So it looks like we will see the remaining restrictions lifted soon. So although, we are still experiencing high number of Omicron viruses, the hospitals seem to have extra capacity and are coping with the current epidemic pretty well. The strength of the economic growth in 2021 surprised us on the upside. So it all came at 10.6%, which was higher than high single-digit number that we were projecting and it was higher than 2019, which was pre-pandemic levels, which was one of the stronger years in the recent past. So we were well above that. And as a country, I think we benefited from opening up the -- or limiting the restrictions pretty early on in the beginning of the year of 2021. And although, we had a couple of [ halts ], overall, I think the economy did much better. In terms of what drove the economy, you can see that in all directions in terms of the remittances, exports, imports and the tourist numbers coming up, we had pretty strong performance. Over the -- as you can see, this is monthly data on the tourism here. So it basically shows you that, although, throughout the year, we generated about 40% of 2019 levels of hard currency income from tourism. So still, there's plenty of room to grow there. As you can see, the trajectory was nice. And in December, it was 58% versus 2019 pre-pandemic level. January numbers are suggesting that we should be looking at about 70% of pre-pandemic level income from tourism, and we are estimating that our current economic forecast basically is relying about 75%, 80% of the 2019 level. And I believe that there's upside, obviously, in those numbers because the trajectory is very nice. In terms of the environment also, you may have noticed that the inflation number is very high, at 13.9%. And in fact, December and January were at the same level. Having said that, the core inflation is 5.6%, and it's on a downtrend. And that downtrend is caused by high monetary policy rate, which has been raised from 8% a number of times over the last year to 10.5%. And with that and with strong external flows, we saw Georgian Lari getting stronger over the last period of time. And in fact, we had a slight appreciation throughout the year and wide stability overall. The international reserves are at all-time high, above $4 billion. Next year, we're expecting growth of 5%. There's plenty of upside in that number. And in terms of the downsides, I think downsides are related to the regional political turbulence that we are all experiencing in this region. And we can talk a bit about this and what our assessment is about it after we talk about the numbers of the Bank. So a few words about our strategic direction and how we are progressing on that. So, we are the leading payment operator in the country. We have 51% of total POS payments -- of total card payments that go through our POS terminals. We have more than 11 million transactions executed through our mobile app, and we'll talk about progress there. Offloading from our branches is 96%. We represent 40% of all the deposit -- retail deposits in the country and retail loan share is 39%. We are most trusted Bank. And most importantly, I think we achieved a phenomenal growth in Net Promoter Score number and achieved 55%, which is historic high. And over the 4 years, we basically doubled our NPS score, which is quite remarkable. We are generating 20-plus profitability, and that is pretty consistent other than 1 quarter when we provide it for the full cycle of COVID economic impact. In November 2019, that was a bit more than 1 year ago we announced that this was going to be our strategic focus. A strategic focus was to make sure that we have the most frequent interaction with our clients on the financial front with payments, mobile app, loyalty and how would we achieve that would be on -- we should just focus on customer satisfaction and employee empowerment and through promoting and developing our data capabilities and relying on strength of the franchise. And all of that would be done while still maintaining 20-plus-percent profitability. And we are progressing very well on this strategy, namely. Our mobile bank and internal bank stats are presented here. We had a very strong growth of 21% year-on-year in terms of the mobile active users. And what made us quite happy was also the daily active users to monthly active users. DAU-to-MAU was 44%, which progressed in a healthy way about 3 percentage points over the last couple of quarters. In terms of number of transactions through our mobile app, as you can see, we are up 72% year-on-year to a very impressive number of 35 million transactions in 1 quarter. Growth here is quite phenomenal, I believe. And so far, we are seeing those numbers going up significantly. Similar trends we see in the overall transactions. But as you can see, the mobile is growing about twice as fast as the other channels, namely. So we have 34% growth of all transactions in our banking franchise. That does not include the card payments in POS terminals, which we'll talk soon right after. So year-on-year, we had 34% growth of transactions. And the -- as you can see here, the share of mobile transactions, mobile and Internet bank-wise, mainly mobile was about 40%, and it is more than 50% now. And mobile and Internet bank, as well as the Express Pay terminals plus ATMs basically represents what we call the offloading, which is 96%. And in terms of the -- in branches, what we are seeing, we are seeing that, let's say, 2 years ago, our number of transactions was 3.4 million, and we have 2.8 million here. So there's a seasonality adjusted where there is a slight decline, but there's more and more focus being done on selling of products and less on transactions, but they are too objectively -- we have an objective to switch to more sales on our mobile phone and there's significant progress there. So more specifically, about more than a year ago, we said that in mid-2022, we would achieve offloading of product sales at 36%. And that target still remains. By the end of the year, we achieved 30%. Midyear, we were pretty comfortable that we will be achieving our 36% target. But actually, I think the mind shift really happens when we are above 50% there, and that should happen relatively soon, let's say, I would say, 1 to 2 years. One of the products, which demonstrates progress in that was the remittances, which used to be cashed in, in our branches and our physical network, basically, almost fully 2 years ago. And by making it easier and integrated with our accounts and so forth, we have achieved [ an average ], which is around 50% of all the transactions now are cashed into our mobile phone, and we would like to see 100% there. But people are -- have their habits. And we are encouraging and incentivizing them to switch to mobile, but the progress is quite evident. Now, in terms of the card transactions or POS transactions, which are relatively separate business. The progress there is significant, and the growth rates are very good, and we've been focused on this business quite a lot. So our market share there, we achieved 51% in numbers and 49% in share of volume on our transactions. And as you can see that, although, the number of transactions has gone up by 50% on an annual basis, if you compare year-on-year, the last quarter, the progress is 62.9% in terms of volume, because transaction ticket has gone up as well. You can see that the progress here is more than 86% growth on an annual basis year-on-year, and that we are quite happy about these numbers, and we believe that this business has still way forward in terms of growth. Our mobile bank, which is built for businesses is progressing nicely as well. In terms of the number of active users, we have year-on-year of 32% growth, achieving 48,000 and number of transactions has grown nicely as well by 44%. We still believe that there's plenty of room for this mobile application to grow, especially for the MSME clients. This one I mentioned and I'm very, very proud of our team achievement of 55% NPS score. And as you can see, about 4 years ago, we had a low point of 27%. And since then, we have been progressing nicely. And over the last few years, we built a lot of systems internally within the organization to focus on customer satisfaction and 55% really demonstrates our strength. And then that translates into different numbers, which we already covered in terms of the payments, in terms of the mobile app and the pick up there in terms of transactions. So people are choosing Bank of Georgia more often, and they are choosing to interact with us more often through different channels. And I think this really represents the strength of our franchise and what it takes to really to achieve such good growth, a lot of systems, a lot of things have to work well, and I think the team has really come together to deliver improvement in the franchise quality. The employee engagement, which we measure through Korn Ferry's, one of the contractors methodology basically suggests that we are more comparable to what they call high-performing organization, which are similar to technology-driven organizations basically that are focused on innovation. And our ENPS score is also all-time high at 61%. We are increasing our focus on data, investing there a lot. And now, I would like to say a few words about our numbers, which you may have seen already. So the fourth quarter profit came to GEL 201 million with a return on equity of 26.4% for the quarter. And for the full-year was 25.8%, which is well above our guidance of 20-plus-percent, but we also enjoyed some extraordinary year there as well. Our net fee and commission income has grown by 36.5% year-on-year. And interestingly, on an annual basis, if you look at that, that was about more than 40% growth. In terms of the operating income, fourth quarter was up 26.4% and for the full-year, it was 25.2%. Cost of risk was negative in the fourth quarter by 0.2% and for the full-year, that came to 0%. Now, obviously, that is a result of a very strong recovery in 2021 after a very strong provisioning in 2020, as you may remember. But even given the strong recovery, I think the result of 0% cost of risk for this year was very positive surprise, and we're happy about that. Growth was also quite strong on a constant currency basis, it was 19.8% and -- because Lari got appreciated on a nominal basis, that was 13.9%. On deposit growth, we had similar trends of, not much growth this year, but on a constant currency basis, we still had strong growth there as well. I think it was 12% now. All of this is being achieved on the back of very strong capital ratios. Our core Tier 1 ratio grew to 13.2%. And we'll talk about it a bit later and a very strong profitability. As I said, we have a very good record of delivering 20-plus-percent return on equity, and that is historically the case, other than, obviously, the provisioning that we did for the -- for COVID. Operating income, we touched on, 25% year-on-year growth. On a quarterly basis, that was 26%. And when you look at the core revenue, which is the net interest income and net non-interest income. So basically, everything excluding the other income that grew more than 35%, which demonstrates the strength of our franchise in terms of the ongoing growth. So quarterly net income -- net interest income grew 34%. And net fee and commission income grew by 36.5% and net FX also grew by 30.4%. So, overall, I think a very strong growth in our revenue numbers -- in core revenue numbers and net other income declined slightly on a year-on-year basis, significantly, but overall, the numbers came to 26.4% growth there. Part of the reason we were able to achieve that was working and focusing on making sure that our margins stays healthy. As you can see, we have achieved 5.3% net interest income, which was mainly a result of our growth in loan yields and a slight decrease in cost of client deposits, as well as deploying some of the extra liquidity that we had. All in all, I would say that going forward, we expect to be in this range, let's say, between 5% and 5.5%. So broad stability in margins. And in terms of the costs, we had a growth on an annual basis of 17.4%, although on a quarterly basis, it was slightly shy of 27%. That was partly due to the fact that in the fourth quarter last year, we had a relatively low base, so it was a result of major cost-cutting in last 2 quarters of 2020. So it's a slightly low base, but also, we have experienced some inflationary pressures broadly, but more specifically on IT services that we are buying either through software or through this salary expense that we have on digital stuff. So that plus some of the marketing expenses, et cetera, drove relatively large growth in the fourth quarter of OpEx, but overall, I think our bottom line was very good. We touched on cost of risk, which was 0% after 1.8% last year. But something to highlight here is that, our NPL ratio declined to a very healthy level of 2.4%. And our NPL coverage was slightly higher than 95% with NPL coverage adjusted for collateral value, almost 150%. So a very healthy book and our assessment of it is pretty good. So basically, this strong recovery has helped our book throughout its entirety. Growth, as we said, was stronger than we expected initially. So it was just shy of 20% in terms of the constant currency and nominal was 13.9%. And deposits, as I mentioned, was 12.5%. But in terms of the nominal basis, it was 0.1%. The liquidity was strong with liquidity coverage ratio of 124% and net stable funding ratio of 132%. So all in all, I think very strong liquidity, and we have a lot of different lines that we have access to. And in case we need more liquidity or more growth, we're happy to access those. In terms of the capital ratios, we achieved 13.2%, 15% and 19% core Tier 1, Tier 1 and total capital ratios. And that is well above the minimum requirement. As you know, the Basel III loading is going on. And by December 2023, we expect, based on the current assessment that we have, that we will be looking at the capital requirements of 12.2%, 14.6% and 17.8%. So even with the fully-loaded ratios, we are above that and have plenty of time to build up buffers that will make us even more comfortable about those ratios. This is the numbers that I was referring to. Besides this, there's something that we ought to remember is that, these numbers are based on the local standard, which is stricter than the IFRS, and the local regulator has committed to switch to the IFRS numbers. And having said that, they have indicated that we shouldn't expect capital release for that, but rather introduction of extra buffer, which will absorb exactly that for the full sector. But I think investors will be more comforted to see that our core Tier 1 ratio of, let's say, 13.2% will look more like 15.5%, which basically provides -- demonstrates how much equity there is in the system and that basically indicates that the risks have been reduced significantly over the last number of years, given the regulators focus on derisking the system. So there's more capital and less cost of risk in the whole system. So that basically summarizes overall our results. As you can see, in 2021, we are back to good profitability levels, well above the target of 20%. Our loan book grew faster than we expected, but our expectations are based on normal growth for the country, which is around 5%, and as the country had a strong growth and high inflation, I think the nominal growth was good and that allowed us to grow on a constant currency basis at roughly 20%. But on a nominal basis at about 13.9%. And last but not least, on dividends and buybacks. So last year, as a result of the first 2 quarters, first half of 2021, we announced interim dividend, which was paid in November 2021, and we will be following up with that. And as we have announced, the capital distribution policy, we'll be targeting 25% payout in terms of dividends. And then that will be increased by buybacks, which will bring the total capital distribution to 35% to 40% this year, and then going back to the medium-term guidance of 30% to 50% in the future. So with dividend of GEL 2.33, which we'll be paying late in [ 8 ] months. That's pretty much it. Thank you very much. And we should go to Q&A, Nini.

Yes. [Operator Instructions] And we have the first question from Robert Sage.

I've got 2 questions, if I may, one of which is, obviously, very topical looking at the Russian troops going into the Ukraine today. I was just wondering whether that makes any difference to the comments that you've made? I noticed that GDP expectations for the current year are around 5%. Was that sort of factoring that in? Will there be particular elements of sensitive [indiscernible] tourism? So -- and also, I think sort of related to that, are there any sort of particular exposures you see on your balance sheet that you would tend to be more concerned about, in particular, lending sectors, which should basically sort of take your -- the sort of the guidance commentary as is? The second question is entirely unrelated, is just looking at the sort of the cost trends through the course of last year and we accept your commentary about why the costs have gone up. And I also appreciate that the revenue growth was significantly in excess of cost growth. But I was wondering whether we should see the Q4 level, there's a sort of a base from which to extrapolate into 2022 and whether you could confirm that positive operating jaws, i.e., revenue growth, more than cost growth is the central case for the coming year?

Robert, you asked 2 most anticipated questions. So you basically stole a lot of other people's question with that, I believe. So on Ukraine, the number 5% does not assume or base our [indiscernible] base case basically, that's not assuming the military conflict. So 5% GDP growth is without that. If military conflict happens, then there's some sensitivity there on the downside, we believe that the impact will be anywhere between 0.5% and up to 2% on the growth -- real growth in Georgia. So there's some trading, obviously, going on with Russia in terms of some remittances, as well as Ukraine. So we don't believe that all of it will stop. Well, with some sensitivities that we ran, basically this could be anywhere between 0.5% and 2%. Having said that, on the portfolio, we run different scenarios and short of a disaster scenario, which also exists, but it's less likely. We don't believe it will have any significant impact on our book. There are a couple borrowers that could experience some drop in sales, especially to Ukraine, but these borrowers are relatively under-levered or have alternative ways of dealing with their leverage. So we don't believe that it will have any significant impact 10, 20 basis points in terms of cost of risk, which is something, but it will not really change the overall situation or overall guidance [ as an example ]. In terms of the costs, the fourth quarter usually has its seasonality effect. So you have to keep that in mind. Having said that, for next year, we will be looking at higher than usual cost increases for next year. You have to also keep in mind that we are investing in the franchise, in this business, while at the same time, maintaining the full network -- physical network. Now, we can't really touch it unless the offloading of product sales becomes significant in our digital channels. And I think our progress there in terms of transactions offloading is evident. And as we go forward in next 1 or 2 years, we should have ability to revisit our physical presence in [indiscernible]. So that -- next year or this year, in fact, 2022, we will keep our cost-income ratios well under 40%. But in terms of what to expect exactly is, I wouldn't be able to provide the guidance right now on that.

We'll have the next question from Ronak Gadhia.

Congratulations on the great results, and thanks for taking the time today. Just maybe as a follow-up on the Russia question. You highlighted maybe the potential impact on asset quality. Could you maybe also maybe highlight the potential impact on your deposits because of the risk of are you seeing -- is there a scenario where maybe you might see deposits plunging from the region, in particular, Russia and flowing to sort of more safe haven countries? So that's the first one. And the second one is on your NIMs. I think I saw in your press release, you had indicated one of the positive drivers for NIMs last year was your cost of funding declined because of declining LIBOR rates. With LIBOR rates now reversing and maybe continuing to increase, what impact should we expect on your NIMs in the short-term, maybe in the medium-term as well?

Yes. On the Russia side, the deposits side, I mean, you could -- we don't expect basically any flight there. The Georgian banking system overall, I don't think is widely dependent on non-resident deposits because the policy is such that liquidity requirements there are significant. Having said that, we don't see any negative movement there. We don't see any dollarization of deposits going on. So overall, I think a pretty healthy environment. So we don't feel like there will be a major -- we don't expect a major deposit outflow. Having said that, expecting good results is not a reason not to be prepared and we are prepared in terms of the very large hundreds of millions of dollars of unutilized lines that we have. So in case if there's anything, we are very well prepared and liquidity overall in the system is very strong. So, we don't expect it quite frankly. But if there's anything that we should be prepared. Having said that, we don't, overall, even if this winter conflict in Georgia, it doesn't feel like we are in the middle of it, let's say, we are on the sidelines. We have experienced something similar in 2008, it was very painful. But right now, it's a very mutual position that the Georgian government has chosen. So, not provoking basically. So probably because of that, we don't feel our depositors being nervous at all. What was the second question, Ronak?

That was NIMs with the increasing LIBOR rates?

Yes. On the NIM side, a lot of our U.S. dollar and euro exposure is variable. So we should be able to pass that as it comes in. And while we have that, we expect our National Bank reducing the refinancing rate, which also provides -- which should be good as well because as it comes down, loans will take some time to be price, so we should be benefiting from it in the short-term. So you'll have these 2 counter movements. So we don't expect significant impact overall on NIM [indiscernible].

Okay. And so just one last one for me. On your capital redistribution, your payout ratio for last year translates about 25%. The guidance was 35% to 40%. You indicated that the payout will be complemented by some share buybacks. I was just wondering if there's any particular reason why the payout ratio wasn't increased to 35%, and why management feels that they should complement it with a buyback?

Yes. Well, that is a question about our overall capital distribution structure. So you will see that going forward as well. So there will be some dividends and some share buybacks about 2/3, 1/3 distribution because we think that that is the best way to distribute capital. And this is not just the management, it's the overall management of the Bank, thinking that given the -- some preferences for some people to see more dividends and others to see share buyback for different reasons, including taxes is the best way to return capital. So overall, I think that is in line with our capital distribution policy that we implemented 1 year ago.

Okay. Doesn't that create a negative impact on the liquidity of the shares on the stock exchange, given that it's quite [ liquidable ]?

We don't believe it's going to significant. I think, overall, as we continue delivering good results and we hopefully increase overall market capitalization that should solve the liquidity issue sooner than later.

I guess, we have -- we may have another question from Robert Sage because I see his hand. Rob?

Maybe he forgot to put it down.

Sorry. Yes, so I'm back on again. Yes. I just sort of quite interested in terms of the fee income trajectory, obviously, immensely strong moving into sort of through the course of 2021. I think one of your competitors has suggested there's going to be another 20%-plus growth in their fees for 2022. Is that the sort of level that you think would be achievable? Or do you think that you've seen more of that sort of pull forward into 2021?

Well, 2021 was extraordinary in many ways. I mean, there was a low base and inflation was high. So, overall, I think we had a situation where the nominal growth of the economy was about 20%. Having said that, 40% growth demonstration that we had for the full year was impressive by any measure. And 20% seems like a decent number, and we'll see. So we don't provide specific guidance on that line, but it seems reasonable.

Next question is from Andrew Keeley.

I guess, I just have a kind of a couple of follow-up questions on in terms of maybe some thoughts on the cost of risk kind of outlook for this year. Obviously, the last few years, it's jumped about a fair bit for obvious reasons. I'm just wondering if you can give us any more -- a bit more color in terms of how you see that for this year kind of within the context of your kind of broadly kind of upbeat macro outlook? And, I guess, connected to that, you've painted a pretty kind of benign picture for the outlook for this year, if we obviously step aside from Ukraine and any potential implications there. Do you see any other kind of possible risks maybe on the macro or the regulatory front that you think are worth flagging or not really?

On cost of risks -- so cost of risk, so you're absolutely right, so we believe that we expect -- other than, obviously, the Ukraine story, and let's see how that plays out short of major military conflict. Overall, we are very positive on 2023. With [ cost ] stability in the country overall, we don't see much noise, although, we are not the best predictors of politics overall, we still believe that, that plus currency stability and the government's focused on promoting investment, increased focus, I would say, we believe that 2022 and 2023 have a lot of reasons to surprise the investors on the upside. So in terms of cost of risk, this year, short of Ukraine, we should be just below our medium-term guidance, and then we'll see in the future. In terms of the risks, the regulator has provided guidance that we were experiencing a lot of changes to the regulatory environment and the regulator has provided more transparency what to expect over the next few years. And we will see if there are any surprises there. I don't believe there will be, but there's always that if there's anything that may have an impact. But otherwise, we don't expect anything major. We believe that most of the reforms have been put through already, and that is reflected in the lower-risk environment and higher capital requirements, which you already see. So that's pretty much it. So we are very positive, especially on the [indiscernible] 2022. We saw a lot of our corporate clients enjoying strong profitability, especially on larger -- on basically strong currency. So our corporates got used to currency volatility over the last few years. So I think their margins were larger counting that risk in. And while they enjoyed a pretty strong and stable currency, they are sitting on a lot of equity, plus I think banks are in position with plenty of capital and lines to really provide a lot of financing. And if there's stability overall, I believe it could be a very strong year for growth for the -- especially SME and corporates.

So we have a question in the Q&A chat from Donatas from LGM Investments. Any updates on Belarus given the situation? And would BGO (sic) [ BOG ] see any impact on remittances if sanctions are imposed on banks in Russia?

On Belarus, so basically, we have a small bank there. Most of the people don't remember. In fact, this is roughly 4% of our balance sheet. There, what we are doing is, it's an SME bank, and we are seeing what we can do there in terms of our digital offering -- digital retail offering, and there are number of finished [ ticks ] there. In terms of the sanctions, we are doing a super conservative approach. And in terms of remittances from Belarus, we don't see that as a big business. So, we don't know if there will be a reduction, there will be a reduction, but it's not a major number.

I don't see any questions at the moment.

Number of attendees are at record levels, but the number of questions are not. So that may indicate one thing that our storytelling is getting better, and we are covering all the things that our conference participants are interested in. But please do not hesitate, if there are any questions, let's give a couple of more minutes and --. I see. So Sulkhan is saying remittances from Russia was met, I think. So I don't know how that was linked to Belarus, maybe it was 2 separate questions. If that was the case, then I would say that with remittances from Russia, we believe that if there's a military conflict, even there could be some reduction, but it shouldn't be a major reduction. If there are any sanctions in terms of the foreign currency transmissions, et cetera, or remittances have shown characteristic that they find their way into the country. So they -- so people send money to their families, to their parents or to their kids regardless of the restrictions. And we saw that in the complete lockdown in Europe, in Georgia in first quarter of 2020 and the second quarter of 2020. Remittances, although, on official levels, we saw some drop overall, they found way of coming to the country. So, I think if there are that kind of very strict restrictions on Russia, I still believe that the remittances will find their way. So we don't think there will be significant -- it could be 10% drop, something similar, but not a major one.

I don't see any questions at the moment.

No more questions? Well, I can definitely -- maybe we can summarize it and basically say that we had a record year by many different measures, in terms of the revenue, in terms of the profitability. Our revenue growth was very strong at 25%. On a fourth quarter, we demonstrated a significant growth in our payments franchise, as well as our mobile bank franchise, not franchise, a channel, I would say. So, on all these strategic levels, strategic directions, as well as financial directions or measures, we have demonstrated a very, very strong quarter and a very strong year. And I would like to thank Bank of Georgia staff, all staffs, I would say, and whole management as well for really coming together to deliver superior experience for our customers, which little by little is expressed in significantly increased Net Promoter Score at the record level of 54.6%, which is almost double what we had a few years ago. So that basically highlights how our franchise is stronger, healthier and on a front foot and developing. So that's why we see very good growth in payments, in our mobile users, in overall active clients. And we will consider and see where the different growth areas may be, and we have some good ideas, as well as see what we can test in terms of our digital capabilities elsewhere. So with that, I would like to wrap it up. Thank you very much for your time, especially in this very volatile markets, given the geopolitical issues. And I would wish to all of us a stable and peaceful environment, which would be great. And we will talk to you in the next quarter. So stay safe.

Thank you, everyone. That does conclude [indiscernible].