Man Industries (India) Limited (513269) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Ladies and gentlemen, good day, and welcome to the Man Industries (India) Q4 and FY '25 Earnings Conference Call hosted by ICICI Securities Limited. [Operator Instructions] I now hand the conference over to Mr. Pritish Urumkar. Thank you, and over to you, sir.

Thank you, moderator. Good afternoon, everyone, and thank you for joining us today for Man Industries Q4 FY '25 Earnings Con Call. First of all, I would like to thank management for providing us this opportunity to host the call. From the Investor Relations side, we have Mr. Vijay Gyanchandani, DGM. So without any further delay, I would like to hand over this call to Mr. Vijay. Thank you, and over to you, sir.

Hello? Hello?

Yes, sir. Yes.

Am I audible?

Yes, sir. Perfect.

Yes. Good afternoon, everyone, and thank you for taking the time to join our earnings conference call for Q4 and full year of financial year 2025. I am Vijay Gyanchandani, Deputy General Manager of Investor Relations at Man Industries (India) Limited. Joining me on the call today are members of our senior leadership team: Dr. Ramesh Chandra Mansukhani, Chairman; Mr. Sandeep Kumar Garg, CFO; Mr. Rahul Rawat, Company Secretary. I trust you had the opportunity to review our Q4 and FY '25 results and the investor presentation, which we have shared with the stock exchanges and are also available on our company's website. To begin today's session, our Chairman, Dr. Ramesh Mansukhani, will share some key business highlights and the strategic outlook for the company. This will be followed by our CFO, Mr. Sandeep Garg, who will walk you through the financial performance for the quarter and the full fiscal year. After that, we can open the floor for a Q&A session. With that, I would like to hand over the call to our Chairman, Dr. Ramesh Mansukhani. Thank you, and over to you, sir.

Good evening, everyone. We welcome you all. This is Ramesh Mansukhani. And again, I welcome you all to our earnings conference call for the fourth quarter and financial year 2025. Let me begin by sharing some key business highlights and our outlook. We have delivered a record performance for the quarter and full year. Our revenue for the year grew 12% in spite of 12% decline in steel prices during the fiscal. Our profit after tax has increased 50% -- sorry, 45% year-on-year, driven by strong operating performance. Our EBITDA margin expanded 70 basis to around 9.9%, approximately 10% EBITDA margin. As of 31st March 2025, our order book stands at INR 2,500 crores with a healthy bid pipeline approximately INR 15,000 crores. All announced projects are progressing well and based on the current execution visibility, we are confident of achieving 20% growth top line during this year. We are anticipating a 50 to 100 basis improvement in EBITDA margin driven by a more favorable product mix specifically, a high contribution from non-water infrastructure project and exports, as well as value-added execution areas such as bends and special coating. Export now account for around 75% to 80% of our total consolidation revenue and 80% of our current order book, underscoring our commitment to expanding our footprint in key international market. We are also seeking a good traction to our ER segment, which now contributes approximately 10% of the consol revenue. That is our new division started last year only. We got the API, all the accreditations to enable us to export. And we are -- we got some export orders also from Western countries with a mark of significant improvement in the ERW segment. In the SAW pipe business, particularly in the LSAW category, we are seeing continuous strong traction, primarily driven by robust international demand for pipeline infrastructure and a revival in large oil and gas transmission projects. The technical strength of our LSAW pipe, especially their ability to handle high pressure and long-distance transport make them well suited for these complex projects. This demand trend reinforce our confidence in sustained growth from this product line over the coming quarters. Yes. Now, I'm coming to our updation on the monetizing of noncore assets. I would like to provide an update on the monetization of our noncore assets of Merino Shelter Private Limited, a wholly owned subsidiary of the company. On 31st March 2025, Merino Shelter executed Deed of Assignment and granted development right for a land parcel of approximately 6 acres located opposite to DY Patil Stadium, New Mumbai to Paradise Green-Spaces LLP, part of the Paradise Group. A upfront consideration of INR 70 crores has already been received. The company will also be entitled to 30% of the total developed area equivalent to approximately 450,000 square feet of the RERA carpet, both commercial and residential. The estimated monetization value of our share in the developed property is expected to be in the range of INR 650 crores to INR 700 crores in 5 and 6 years. According to the total project monetization value, this transaction is estimated to be between INR 720 crores to INR 770 crores. New business. Both of our new projects in Saudi Arabia, Jammu are progressing well, remains on track to be operational by quarter 3 FY '26. As of FY '25, out of total CapEx around INR 1,150 crores of these 2 projects, we have incurred -- we are regularly incurring our CapEx, and most of the equipments, et cetera, LC is established, and it's a good progress. And we expect to spend an additional amount in the remaining year to complete the project. Recent vendor approval, which is very important, before I conclude, I'm pleased to announce that we have received the official approval from Qatar Energy LNG as a listed vendor. This is a significant achievement, further solitary our position as a trusted supplier in global energy sector. It also represents an important step in expanding our presence in the Middle East. With that, I would like to hand over the call to our CFO -- Group CFO, Mr. Sandeep Kumar, who will walk you through the detailed financial performance of quarter 4 and full year 2025. Over to Sandeep.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Good evening, everyone. Let me take you through the financial highlights for the results. Our company in the Q4 FY '24-'25 consolidated, total income is INR 1,233.9 crores, which is 50% higher Y-o-Y. And EBITDA is also INR 136.7 crores, up 88% Y-o-Y. The EBITDA margin has also increased to 11.1%, which is 230 bps higher Y-o-Y. And PAT for this quarter has been INR 68.1 crores, up 182% Y-o-Y. I'll take you through the FY '25 consolidated full year number. Total income for the full year is INR 3,557 crores, which is higher by 11% Y-o-Y and EBITDA for the full year is INR 353.2 crores, which is higher by 20% Y-o-Y. The EBITDA margin for the year as a whole is 99%, which has increased 70 bps from last year's Y-o-Y. The PAT for the year INR 153.2 crores, up 46% Y-o-Y. So this number, what we have achieved this year are the highest ever number company has ever achieved. And I also like to brief about good performance, good order which our Chairman has already highlighted. So we can open the forum for the question-and-answer now.

[Operator Instructions] The first question is from the line of Pritesh Chheda from Lucky Investment.

Yes, sir, one on the Merino Shelter inflow. So now this 30% of 450,000 RERA cut it. So what should be the flow of money? Will it be basically linked to you selling it regularly and based on milestone you get it, that's how it will be over the next 7 years?

The total estimation of the project, 5 to 6 years. All the approvals we got it and the work has already started. We got INR 70 crores year 2025. Current year revenue also will get -- every year, we'll get the revenue for the next 5, 6 years. We are estimating around INR 700 crores revenue will be there.

So that I understood. Now it will be linked to you selling that area, right?

No. We will get the area. And with our consent, as per the market condition, they have to -- developer has to sell the 30% ours and 70% theirs. We will get 30% revenue, no expenses, nothing is there. It's a net.

So it's now linked to basically selling of the area.

Yes. It is top line.

So we expect almost INR 80 crores revenue coming in first year and then INR 120 crores every year over the next 5 years.

So this INR 80 crores first year means first year is FY '26 or first year for you is FY '25?

I'm talking about FY '25 is already over where we have received INR 40 crores.

Okay. Okay. So basically, now this year from the developable area, you get the first tranche of INR 80 crores. INR 70 crores has already flowed in FY '25.

That is approximate estimation.

Yes, approximate. Okay. The second question is, on the order book that you mentioned at INR 2,500 crores and the bid pipeline that you mentioned at INR 15,000 crores. What was the same number last year, if you have it?

The last year sale was INR 3,500 crores of revenue roughly.

The order book, can you give the -- sorry?

Current year, our revenue has been INR 3,500 crores.

Sir, I am asking the order book number, this INR 2,500 crores which you have mentioned, you have to compare versus last year, what it would have been at the year-end last year, the order book and the year-end bid pipeline last year FY '24 end?

2025 end whatever we announced this time, we already achieved, but this INR 2,500 crores comfortable order position to achieve the new target current year because we have bid book very comfortable, and we are expecting order would be materialized very soon. INR 2,500 crores will be completed in this current year '26.

Okay. Sir, on the last question on the quarter 4 number and the margin. Is it that you have started booking some orders which are high margin and hence, we see what it is for quarter 4? And so, let's say, is it linked to the Southeast Asia order that you had announced the exchange? Is it linked to that and how much of that order is executed?

No. This is partly all the -- many projects are going together and mostly the exports and the realization has improved because we -- nowadays, we are more getting the high value-added products, very specialized products. The company objective and moto is get more value addition to reward to our shareholders.

And I would like to add here that I think you are referring to that Far East order, for which execution will start from this current quarter. Q1 FY '26, we will start executing this order and this order will be completed -- will complete full year FY '26 order will be completed.

So basically, we will see the H1 also on a higher growth note, unlike last year, FY '25, where your entire growth came in quarter 4, is it possible that this time around, the growth will be evenly spread in the whole year?

We hope and we expect that the growth will continue in all the quarters.

Okay. And my last question is this 12% top line growth, what is the corresponding volume growth?

Corresponding volume growth, if I estimate my steel price to be stable at current year rate. So this growth will come from the volume growth only.

No, I'm asking for FY '25, the year gone by, what was the volume growth?

2025 also, there is a growth and '25, '26 will be also growth in quantum, as well as the volume -- amount also.

The next question is from the line of Dhananjay Mishra from Sunidhi Securities.

Sir, am I audible? Hello?

Yes, sir, you are audible.

Yes. So congrats on good results. So just wanted to know how this accounting treatment has happened for real estate business. Like in this quarter, you have shown INR 368 crores revenue and INR 45 crores EBIT. So this is for 30% of our portion of area we would have sold in FY '25 and the INR 70 crores upfront money we have received, where it is reflecting?

I will take this question. This -- the deal which we have announced on 31st of March, there was an assignment of the land which we had with us and the certain [indiscernible]. So this sale which we have accounted as on 31st March '25 is part of that value. The 30%, which we are expecting further will be forthcoming in the next 5 to 6 years.

Okay. So this kind of revenue will not reflect in future. We only have this -- our share of, as you said, INR 700 crores, we are expecting over 4, 5 years.

INR 700 crores will be expected as a revenue and profit, which will come over the period of 5 to 6 years. Every year, around average INR 100 crores to INR 120 crores will be coming to our P&L.

Monetizing will continue.

Okay. Because we have received INR 70 crores and we have shown INR 45 crores as EBIT. So -- and you also said that...

There is no relation. Actually, this EBITDA, et cetera, is the -- our pipe business. That Merino was a noncore business, which we sold out, right, sold out. Yet we got INR 70 crores advance and the balance we will get INR 700 crores by way of 30% share in the property. That revenue will be additional revenue for coming years for the company. Yes. It will be the net receipt by the company in coming 4, 5 years.

You said that from FY '26 onwards, we will have INR 80 crores, INR 100 crores cash from...

FY '26 onwards, this will continue received of the profit, you can say.

And we will have no expenses and not even marketing costs.

Not our. Developer will pay everything. He paid everything, the work has started.

Okay. Because they will be selling our flats, so they will not charge marketing cost for that?

As per our agreement, we are not going to bear any marketing cost. It is on the account of the developer.

Okay. And secondly, on this Saudi CapEx, what is the status of this debt tied up?

Debt, we are working with the bank. Total project is INR 600 crores. INR 400 crores is our debt portion, and we are at the final stage of freezing the bank...

In principal letter we got it.

In principal letter we already got it.

And lastly, in the presentation, we have shown this breakup of 70%, 30% funding through debt and equity and already CapEx incurred. Like in case of stainless steel, we have seen -- we have shown INR 1.56 billion already incurred and INR 2.82 billion committed. So what is the committed -- I mean -- and CapEx incurred figure, difference -- what is the difference? Hello? [Audio Gap] Hello?

Sir, just a moment we'll try reaching the management, just a moment. [Audio Gap] We have the lines connected to the management. Sir, you may proceed.

My question is that, in stainless steel pipe, total project cost will be INR 564 crores, and we have incurred about INR 156 crores. And there is 1 more item you mentioned, INR 282 crores committed. So what is INR 282 crores committed in this slide?

Total our project is INR 554 crores. Correctly, you have mentioned. We have spent almost INR 250 crores on this project. Balance is committed, where we have placed order for the machinery, LC opened and machinery are getting [Audio Gap]

The next question is from the line of Darshil Pandya from Finterest Capital.

Can you hear me?

Yes, we can hear you.

Sir, my question is related to cash flow statement. So precisely, we have reported INR 300 crores of EBITDA. But if you see on the operating cash flow side, you just generated around INR 68 crores, which is primarily driven by receivables, inventories. And obviously, it is offset by payables. But could you help us understand what's driving this stretch? Is it something to a specific business cycle or a structural shift? What is it?

Normally the project which we are currently executing that has inventory, which is getting ready and getting shipped in next quarter. That is the only reason of inventory buildup. It is project-specific. As our business is very quietly, we make inventory only for the project-specific and all this will be shipped. And this current -- next quarter, which current quarter we are running, inventory and debtors both will be neutralized.

Got it. Got it. And sir, out of INR 1,100 crores, I just forgot to understand, how much have we totally incurred till date?

We have incurred almost INR 250 crores for both the projects.

INR 250 crores?

Yes. And balance is our commitment on LC and order placement.

Okay. And we had some plans to even raise funds. When is this expected to happen or any time line for this?

Time line [indiscernible] no comment.

And we will not comment on that.

The next question is from the line of Raman KV from Sequent Investment.

Sir, can you hear me?

Yes, we can hear.

Sir, I just have 2 questions. Sir, I just want to understand the INR 368 crores entry with respect to the revenue from real estate segment. Like you said that there was INR 70 crores upfront payment. I got that part. So where did the additional INR 290 crores come from?

You're talking about our Merino Shelter transaction, right?

The real estate -- revenue from real estate, yes.

So we have -- I think I replied this question just now previously. I will reply you. The total land and the CWIP in the Merino Shelter, since we have assigned the land right to the developer, that property item has been sold and booked as a revenue. And against that sale, we have received INR 70 crores upfront.

So you got against the sale of land right, you got INR 70 crores, right?

We know. I will repeat my statement again. We have the lease land available with us and CWIP, which was part of the construction. That has been assigned to the developer. And total value of that transaction as per the government guidelines is INR 368 crores, which we have booked as a sales revenue in our books. Now, INR 70 crores we have -- cash against that deal, which we have received, balance is expected in the next 6 years from the sale of the property development.

Okay. Yes, I understood now, sir. And my second question is with respect to the guidance which you gave. Sir, I just want to understand with respect to stand-alone, how much business can we do in FY '26 and '27? And in FY '26, how much incremental revenue is contributed through the subsidy and upcoming CapEx?

As already informed this time around our 90% revenue is coming from stand-alone. Out of INR 3,500 crores turnover current year, around INR 3,200 crores was our pipe business and then the rest of the real estate, et cetera. So we are expecting 20%, 25% growth as a stand-alone should reach around INR 4,000 crores as we expected. And the balance will come from the consolidated from this property, Jammu and from Saudi, that will be in the consolidation.

So INR 4,000 crores with respect to stand-alone in FY '26 or '27?

2026.

In '26.

The next question is from the line of [ Raghav Rathi from Condram Holdings ].

My question is regarding the interest cost that we have showed. So the interest cost is around INR 100 crores to us. And how much of the interest is towards the new project that we are taking around INR 800 crores of debt? How much of that has been used up? And what can be our interest cost after we have used the entire debt?

So I will reply this question. The total interest cost for the year has gone up from last year because we are taking high executive projects are going on for which we have given guarantee, we have used nonfund-based limit. So once we give our -- use nonfund-based limit, in that case, we have to keep deposit with the bank. So if you look at that, my income has also gone a little higher from the bank interest income because I have to keep margin there. So this amount is getting nullified from the income side as external if I talk about.

So around INR 14 crores that we had received as interest income.

And also, the new project which we are talking about, since the projects are still under the implementation stage, their interest cost will be appeared in the financial in the next year. Currently, it is part of the CWIP with CapEx.

The next question is from the line of Arpit Tapadia from IGE Family Office.

Congratulations on a good set of numbers. Can you throw some light over the EBITDA per tonnes incurred during this quarter over HSAW, LSAW and ERW separately?

In our business, since we are into specialized product where we supply product to the customer with different type of coating with a high-value coating, we don't monitor EBITDA per tonne. That is not comparable because every order is different depending on the specialized coating, which customer is asking and we have been providing.

Like our coating is 3LPE, CWC, FBE and different kind of pipe, different dia, so it's very difficult. You can see the overall EBITDA, which is approximately 11%, right?

Yes.

Yes.

Got it. Pardon my ignorance. How much CapEx on the Saudi plant has been already incurred?

Saudi, we have spent hardly anything, hardly 5 to 10 equipment. But we have a huge commitment against the orders for equipment and machinery placed.

Got it. And how soon we are expecting it to commercialize?

Land development is already done and construction activities are going to start so quickly on the approvals and the equipment we had. So that's why it will come during this year.

During this year. Okay. And what kind of asset terms we are expecting from the Jammu, as well as Saudi plants?

We already -- Mr. Garg already informed around INR 600 crores total CapEx.

So the INR 550 crores is for the Saudi project.

And what about asset terms? That is the level of investment we want to put in. What kind of revenue we will be generating? What is the potential of revenue from those plants?

Actually, the revenue will come in the full force once the plant is opened around INR 2,500 crores once the full fledged. And this Jammu will be between INR 1,000 crores to INR 1,200 crores.

At the full capacity running.

At full capacity, INR 1,000 crores to INR 1,200 crores from Jammu and INR 2,500 crores from Saudi. Is that understanding correct?

Full fledged around INR 2,000 crores.

Both combined together?

No, no, I will repeat again. Saudi will be around INR 2,000 crores revenue at full capacity utilization. Saudi will be -- Jammu will be INR 1,000 crores to INR 1,200 crores at the full capacity utilization.

Got it. And how do we expect to ramp-up those plants after commercialization?

Maybe in 2 years, we are going to get the good fruits.

Which is?

Roughly in 2 years' period we will be able to achieve the...

Able to achieve the optimum level.

The optimization.

The next question is from the line of Dhavan Shah from AlfAccurate Advisory (sic) [ AlfAccurate Advisors ].

Sir, my question is on the revenue side. I think you mentioned that in FY '26, the stand-alone business can do roughly INR 4,000 crores of revenue. But our order book right now is INR 2,500 crores. So are we in the final stage of negotiation of any big order, which may come maybe in the next 1 or 2 months?

Our bid book is around INR 15,000 crores, and we have some negotiations going on. And normally, this order book, which I'm telling is only as on April. We have full year ahead. And definitely, we are at the final negotiation of some good orders, which once we receive, we will be announcing that.

I'm asking this because if I look at the order book of since last 2, 3 quarters, it is already declining. It was only INR 3,200 crores, INR 3,300 crores, then INR 2,800 crores and then INR 2,500 crores.

No. I would more clarify. There is not a right indication. And every project is having evaluation process. It takes time. And we are very much confident to improve upon the order book position very soon because there is not any barometer to guess so many orders is coming in 1 quarter, the second quarter will be very less. It is not a right barometer for the market for this project because it's project based. And we are mostly in the export business. So these kind of things always happen.

But are we sure that the midsize order like we received last year roughly INR 1,800-odd crores, that kind of big order can also come?

By INR 1,800 crores, maybe more also, you are directly calculating INR 2,500 crores plus INR 1,800 crores. No, no, no. This is not the way. Maybe much more, I don't know at this moment. But we cannot say on this forum. But yes, good order book, good bid book, we are confident to achieve it.

And it is a rolling process. Every quarter, we get order, every quarter, we execute. So if I have always the order for 6 months for INR 2,500 crores, it will be around INR 5,000-odd crores order for year. But it's a rolling process where every time we are getting order and we are executing order every quarter.

Understood. And sir, in ERW, I think you mentioned that 10% of the revenue came from the ERW for the full year. Can you say how much is the overall volumes for FY '25 from ERW side?

Around -- this is more than INR 350 crores as we indicated 10% and we hope to continue with growth this current year also. We had after the initial problems of the accredation, now we got the lot of accredations, including API and some more complex accredations. And we got some orders from -- on export front with a better value addition. And we are going ahead in that direction, and we are hopefully to get the more capacity utilizations.

No, INR 350 crores is absolute number in terms of volumes, how much might be...

No, no, INR 350 crores approximately.

In volume terms in terms of...

I do not have the turn. I hear the only rupee volume this moment. That's why I'm giving the rupees figure, the turnout figure.

The next question is from the line of [ Prabal Jain from SM Holdings ].

Sir, I remember I think in the Q1 or Q2 con call, you mentioned that you have ventured into green hydrogen pipeline and you've got approvals from EU, European Union as well.

Yes, sir. You are right.

So, sir, I just want to understand where we stand here. Do we have any significant projects here in terms of your bid pipeline? Has something converted into actual projects?

Yes. We got the compatibility to produce the pipe of hydrogen, but not any project come out in India at this moment. Regarding export front, we are working in the few countries. But still, it is a nascent stage. And it is a future, but I can't say this moment, maybe 6 months, 1 year, maybe a bunch of projects will come in future. That's why as a proactive company, we got the approvals, and we are ready.

Okay. Okay, sir. Another question, sir. So you mentioned that your Jammu plant can do a top line of INR 1,000 crores to INR 1,200 crores at full capacity and Saudi can do INR 2,000 crores at full capacity, right?

Yes, sir. INR 1,000 crores to INR 1,200 crores.

Yes. So, I mean, going by this and currently, you are doing a top line of INR 3,500 crores. So if I add this INR 3,500 crores and INR 2,000 crores and INR 1,000 crores, so maximum top line that you can have with all of the infrastructure once it commercializes in Q3 FY '26 would be INR 8,000 crores, right?

No, no. I will again correct it. This number which we have given is at the full capacity, which is a time line of 2 years because our commercial production will start in Q3 FY '26 and it will take time to ramp-up the capacity. So you are right, the time we reach full capacity in India, Jammu and Saudi, we will be reaching those numbers, which was adding.

Correct. So that is what I meant. I think once you ramp-up because obviously, Q3, you will be starting, there will be some teething issues. So once it is at a very optimum or, I would say, at a capacity utilization of 90%, you can do INR 8,000 crores at the top line level, right? Real estate revenue is separate.

It's a good wish actually, and we are working towards the direction, although whatever you are saying, it should be, but we are a conservative company. That's why we do not announce it. But whatever you are saying as per the calculation, you are right.

Yes. So sir, just wanted -- because I listened to your interview also, it's very good today morning. You mentioned that this year, you'll be doing -- conservatively, you mentioned specifically you can do 20% this year. And next year, it is interesting, you said that we can also do 100%. So, I mean, how should we read into that?

Sir, whatever you are saying, I'm saying that both have the same thing. The next year means '26-'27.

'26-'27.

Yes. So there is a 2 year. So there will be 2 growth. One will be a year this one, which we are aiming 20% conservative, then another growth on the top-up date. Then I think so our estimation and whatever you are saying is going to match.

Okay. And sir, just to top it up on this part, because currently, we have an order book of, I think, INR 2,500 crores. And so, I'm expecting that, obviously, some order will flow in this year. But for FY '27, since you are operationalizing these 2 plants, Jammu and Saudi, do you have any pre-commitments at the order level? Because, I mean, that is where we get the confidence that FY '27 is going to be better than FY '26, right?

Yes, there are some pre-commitment over there, but still it is very premature to announce this moment. Let's start production and then there will be more formalized will be much better. The initial -- we are in same market, we know -- but it is premature to say something at this moment.

I understand. Sir, 1 last question. Once you operation -- because CapEx till the commissioning of the facilities is sorted. But once you operationalize it, would you be requiring any significant capital for working capital or something else or you will manage internally approvals?

No, no. Working capital will be separately assessed by our bank. On the right time before a few months of the production, maybe 3, 4 months, our banks in principle agreed to support, and we are very confident to arrange the working capital limits.

Okay. Great. Great, sir. One final piece, sir, your pledge, any plans of reduction or increasing anything?

This moment, no comment regarding what pledge?

What pledge you are talking about?

Stock pledge. The equity is pledged.

Our stock pledge, no, no, no.

Nothing.

Nothing.

[Operator Instructions] The next question is from the line of Anil Jain from Equipassion Capital.

Yes, I wanted to know the volume numbers of FY '25 and FY '24.

Volume number, we do not know at this moment. We are working on it, and then we will communicate separately. This moment, we do not have that right figure, different, different...

Okay. What else -- can you share the capacity utilization of...

Capacity utilization depends on product mix basis. This time, we are -- some plant -- we have 5 plants. You can say 3 plants are fully busy and 2 plant is partly busy. It depends on which dia, which kind of pipe, iron and gas, water, there's a lot of calculations, sir.

I understand. So can I know at the present product mix, what is the total revenue potential from the existing plants?

All is existing plants.

Existing plants only.

All the existing plants.

New capacity will be adding up in current financial.

Yes, I know that. I understand. But I wanted to know the total revenue potential from the present capacity, which we already have. Yes.

Okay. Potential. Potential, sir, if not increase the capacity, we can go more than INR 5,000 crores in the existing without putting any CapEx, without putting any much more efforts except the marketing combination of the product mix should be in our favor, which is no one's hands. Yes.

So like you are already projecting INR 4,000 crores of top line in FY '26 and we add 20% growth, it comes to INR 5,000 crores for FY '27 from the present capacity, right? So what are your CapEx plans?

No CapEx in existing, only CapEx in Jammu, which is going on and Saudi, which is also going on. So no new announcement, nothing only this, whatever we have taken the job on hand. First, we have to complete it. Maybe small capital expenditure, as a routine expenditure will continue.

That is around INR 25 crores, INR 30 crores on a regular CapEx...

Maybe upgradation of the plant and more modernization, et cetera.

The next question is from the line of Kushal from -- an individual investor.

Sir, I just want to understand the order book pipeline of INR 15,000 crores, how much of it is export?

My order book is as of now is INR 2,500 crores.

No, no. The order book pipeline of INR 15,000 crores, how much of it is export?

You can say very safe side between 80% to 90% of it is international because we are an international accredited company of the approvals are with us. We have 25 countries. That's why our aim is 80% out of INR 10,000 crores, maybe INR 12,000 crores, INR 13,000 crores export, maybe INR 1,000 crores, INR 2,000 crores in India.

Okay. So 80% is export out of the INR 15,000 crores of order pipeline?

Yes, sir.

And sir, do we do any work for Jal Jeevan Mission?

We are part of Jal Jeevan Mission. We are doing in India. Our water segment is very small. Water segment is our hardly 10% of our revenue. We have to see the flow of the money from the government. Accordingly, we can improve our contribution towards Jal Jeevan. Right now, we are doing 8%, 10% roughly.

Okay. Sir, and lastly, on this accounting entry with respect to the Merino Shelter, INR 300 crores -- around INR 300 crores was added to the top line. Am I right?

Mr. Garg is the right person to reply it. Please.

Yes.

Sir, around INR 300 crores, how much was the amount added to the top line?

INR 368 crores.

INR 368 crores. So -- and were there any expenses attached to this INR 368 crores? Hello?

Yes, slight expenses.

Okay. So it's -- most of it is percolated down to the bottom line.

No, no. I will say, total, if you -- I think somebody asked the question to me earlier.

Yes, it's a little confusing, sir, can you explain it again? I'm sorry, but yes.

There are certain cost of the land assigned CWIP, which has gone into cost of the P&L and EBITDA is around INR 40 crores from that business.

Okay. Only INR 40 crores has translated down to EBITDA. Rest of the EBITDA that we -- of INR 150 crores is from the pipes business. And sir, one more question...

INR 300 crores.

INR 300 crores.

INR 300 crores plus.

Okay. For the year, you're saying for the full year. Okay.

EBITDA from the core business is INR 328 crores. And consol level is INR 353 crores.

Yes, that's for the full year, right? You're talking about the full year.

Yes.

Yes. Okay. And sir, how do the raw material prices affect us? Our margins have been pretty consistent over the last 4, 5 years. But how do raw material prices affect us, like say, for example, if 1 quarter raw material prices were to shoot up. So how does it have an effect on us? And with what kind of lag?

See, our business is that, once we get the order confirmation, same time we get raw material rate also freeze and confirmed and hedged. So any fluctuation in the raw material prices doesn't affect our project and project profitability.

Okay. So you are confident of maintaining this 8% to 10% of operating margin going forward?

As soon as the order confirms, my customer confirm with the price, I get my raw material price also confirmed with my supplier. So that protects my profit margins and profitability is protected.

Okay. But sir, this is a little confusing. Out of the INR 368 crores, only INR 40 crores has translated to EBITDA. So where is the other INR 228 crores gone? Like what was the major chunk?

It was the cost which has been incurred over the period in the project.

Work in progress.

Capital work in progress, construction and cost of the lease, other expenses.

So in the balance sheet, where was it standing for all these years?

Yes, yes.

Yes, yes.

Where was it in which line -- in which item was it in the balance sheet?

Part of the inventory.

Okay. So the inventory. So you have written it off against that INR 368 crores, around INR 220 crores, you've written it off.

No. Repeat what you asked?

No. So I'm just trying to understand the accounting because there's some confusion. INR 368 crores went to sales and the INR 228 crores you're saying went to some expenses and INR 40 crores was EBITDA. So in the balance sheet, where was the INR 228 crores showing?

Since I told you the total profit is INR 40 crores, so around INR 368 crores works of work value has gone into expenses, which was part of my inventory, which I was accounting as CWIP and construction cost and other expenses.

So that's what I'm saying. So CWIP should have gone down, right? But CWIP from year-on-year has gone up?

No. It has been completely removed. Value is 0 now. Everything has been sold in Merino Shelter.

Okay. That is the new, okay. That is the new CWIP that is going on, okay, the Saudi plant and the Jammu plant.

Jammu and Saudi project CapEx...

Understood. So now for the remaining 5, 6 years, you will show more revenues of around INR 350 crores, roundabout?

No, no. Our projections roughly is around INR 700 crores from the projects. 2026, '27, '28, '29, '30, next 5 years. Every year, we are seeing INR 80 crores to INR 100 crores revenue every year will be there.

So then that makes the total saleable value as INR 368 crores plus INR 500 crores, right, upwards of -- okay.

INR 700 crores revenue will be in coming years. That will be the -- no expenses from our side.

So that we separate from this INR 368 crores.

Yes, that is in addition to that.

Yes, yes. Now you got it.

So the total sellable this thing is INR 368 crores plus INR 700 crores. Is that the right way to understand?

INR 700 crores is our expected revenue over the next 6 years and INR 368 crores is already booked.

Okay. INR 368 crores is already booked. So this is the accounting entry. Now in terms of cash flow, we have received only INR 45 crores from the developer.

We have received INR 70 crores from the developer so far upfront. Balance amount is receivable as the sales will happen, we'll be receiving those funds every year, the sale will come, but no SWIP. No expenses. Is that right?

No expenses.

So the sale that we have booked -- sir, I think I'll take it off-line actually. I'll take this off-line because it's a little confusing. So I'll get in touch with the IR and get in touch with you. I'll do that.

Get in touch with my IR, Mr. Vijay. And if you have any question, we can reply you off-line.

Yes. Valorem is the IR. So I'll get in touch with you because I'm a little confused.

The next question is from the line of Radha from B&K Securities.

Sir, I wanted to know the key geographies where we are exporting each of the pipes separately, if you could mention for LSAW, HSAW and ERW?

Yes, Madam, can you -- what is your question? Can you repeat, please?

Yes, sir. I wanted to know the key geographies wherein we are exporting for each of the pipes separately, LSAW, HSAW and ERW.

Yes. It cannot be mixed. Every segment is different and every usage is also different, for oil and gas separate, and for water and noncritical uses are different.

For geographical, we are -- MENA area is our biggest customer, which consists of North Africa and Gulf and Saudi. These are the biggest consumers, our biggest customer, but we export to other areas also like currently, we are executing a big order for the Far East. We supply our pipe to part of Canada, other part of the world also. Europe also, Europe, Canada, but those volumes are -- major business comes from MENA and Far East.

So is it safe to assume that 80% of the 90% exports would be done to MENA region?

No, no.

No, no. It depends on project.

It depends on project. And we cannot say geography always changes. Our projects in 25 countries, including Far East Asia, MENA region. So that's why we see where the more projects are coming. The geography can be changed, but 70%, 80% export is our objective, our aim, which we are achieving.

Sir, could you give us some light in terms of is there any tariff on either of the products that we are exporting or the current tariff scenario in these regions, in our export market?

We are not in the U.S.A., and there is no tariff rebate. And mostly oil and gas segment covered by government buyer most of the countries, the tariff is not going to make any impact. Not on us.

Here I'd like to add something here that from government, whatever tariffs they have put in U.S. is going to benefit manufacturer from India because they will become at par with supplier from other countries. So it opens a door opportunity for Indian manufacturers to export to U.S. because they become at par with the other country where they will have a duty-free export.

So currently, we are not exporting to U.S. And if in case there is any tariff situation, I think it would be a favorable situation for the company?

Yes. It will be better positioned for us.

Sir, what is the tariff rate, the current situation that U.S. and Europe are imposing on LSAW and HSAW?

There's no exposure to U.S.

There's no exposure to U.S.

Not for the company, sir, for the industry.

Sorry?

For the industry, sir.

I cannot comment on...

Just to understand the potential.

Very few.

The next question is from the line of Darshil Pandya from Finterest Capital.

Sir, from the previous call of Q3, additionally of above INR 4,000 crores, which you are targeting, INR 1,500 crores additionally is what something we are targeting right?

No. INR 4,000 is our goal. Yes. What is your question? Can you once again repeat it, please?

Sir, in the last call, we did mention that we are looking at around INR 1,500 crores of additional revenues once these capacities are coming live.

You're talking about Jammu and Saudi capacities?

Yes, sir. Yes, sir. Yes, sir.

That capacity will be operational from Q3 of current year. They will also contribute. Last time, we have told -- given some number, but definitely, we are hoping working towards to achieve those numbers.

The next question is from the line of Arvind, an individual investor.

Congratulations for good set of numbers, sir. Sir, I have 2, 3 questions. Is there any dividend declaration this year for FY '25?

No. We are not...

Not now. In future, I don't know.

Current year, Board has not approved any dividend distribution.

Currently in this balance sheet, no. But in future I don't know.

And the reason being we are into expansion mode. So we want to reinvest the profit into our CapEx project.

Okay. And 1 more question, sir, regarding this -- is there any update regarding the Man Infra?

Man Infra...

What is...

Man Infra? The old issue that and there is no update from company. So I'm eager to listen about it.

No, no, that is a matter of sub judice and that's why we do not want to comment -- particular subject we do not know. You are talking overall, you are talking specific and that's why there is a matter of sub judice, but that is a separate company and we are separate. There is no impact on this company, whatever they are doing.

[Foreign Language]

[Foreign Language]

[Foreign Language]

[Foreign Language]. No moment in few years. Yes.

[Foreign Language]

[Foreign Language]

Thank you. Due to time constraints, that was the last question. I now hand the conference over to the management for closing comments.

Thanks a lot, all good listeners and wish all the arrangers and to make the success of this call. Thank you. Thank you once again.

On behalf of ICICI Securities, that concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us, and you may now disconnect your lines.