MannKind Corporation (MNKD) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Good morning. I'm Sam Jones from the Morgan Stanley team. I'm excited to have joining us today, Mike Castagna, CEO of MannKind. Before we get started, I'll read a disclaimer -- so this is research disclosure. For important disclosures, please see the Morgan Stanley research disclosure website at www.morganstanley.com/researchdisclosures. If you have any questions, please reach out to your Morgan Stanley sales representative. So Mike, thanks very much for being here today. To start off, it would be great if you could provide an introduction to MannKind, maybe a quick overview of the great progress that you've made over the last few years and where you stand as a company today.

Yes, thank you. Thanks for having us today. MannKind has been around 32 years this year. It's been a long time coming. It was originally an inhaled insulin company platform that really was repurposed back in 2017 when we decided to fund Tyvaso or at that time was called treprostinil TreT for a Phase I study. we moved quickly into orphan lung in 2019 and purchased our first company back then. And we've really pivoted the whole company to focus on orphan lung with kind of a diabetes optionality and Tyvaso DPI got approved last year. And that's really brought in a new revenue stream into the company to help fund our innovation. So it's been a storied company, had a long history. Unfortunately, a lot of people still think of us as an inhaled insulin company. And I think day by day, as we see our revenue grow that becomes a smaller part of the company, still an important part of the company that I'm sure we'll talk about today.

Great. And your recent Q2 earnings were a great example, I think, of the progress that you've made, achieving revenue contribution from 3 separate products, obviously, strong growth from Tyvaso DPI and reaching positive operating income. We'll come on to the products in a bit, but I think just first on profitability. It's been a big focus, as we mentioned, you've reached a positive operating income. Kind of how are you thinking about the plan going forward in terms of investing in the business versus a focus on profitability?

Yes. I think our #1 focus is to ensure we don't need to raise capital. So we have a pretty robust pipeline coming. We've kind of committed to -- the Street that our diabetes business will be cash flow breakeven roughly by the end of Q4. And as we look forward, our #1 focus is making sure that we can fund our nintedanib program and our clofazimine program. Those are 2 important products if you're really going to want to try to 10x the company in terms of revenue and market cap, you've got to invest in innovation. And I think that's really where we are now is we feel the cash flow positivity, the investments we've made in diabetes will start to come off the P&L next year in terms of the research studies and then clofazimine will kick in and then nintedanib kicks in. So we have a nice segue of opportunity to kind of continue to manage the expense base, fund our growth and maintain our cash balance as best as we can. But we have no intention of raising money and I won't sacrifice the long-term growth of the company for profitability. But it's not going to -- it will be important to be profitable. Our shareholders have hung in there a long time and they want to see us continue to grow that profit, but that's not going to come at the sacrifice of growing the company. But we definitely to make sure we're self-sufficient and independent versus relying on the capital markets, which have been pretty tough for the last couple of years.

Great. That makes a lot of sense. I guess, shifting into the technology in the portfolio, could you maybe start by giving an overview of the Technosphere technology kind of how it's used, how it differentiates, how that translates into benefits for patients?

Sure. So as you can see here, we have an inhaler all proprietary platform to MannKind. It has cartridges that are proprietary to us to filling the finish, all the manufacturing is all proprietary. We spent a couple of billion dollars to get to this point. And now we're added Bluetooth technology to our inhaler. I've been playing with this app, our team built called BluHale [ Vis ]. And we're using it in our new -- in our diabetes strap called INHALE-3. It's the first time we're seeing real live data on patients, how is the CGM work and how is your correction sugars, what you're dosing and then you could print out a report and send it to your doctor and your loved one. And just for me, for example, we think about the platform, taking digital information and insights. So start looking at my own sugars. And I realize like everyone saying Friday, things are a little awful. Why is that? I pick up my kids, we have pizza on Friday night, it's probably fast food when picking off from sports. So you're starting to get insights. It's like, okay, I can probably increase my insulin a little bit better on those days and then make sure I'm having better coverage. And ultimately is about how do you use technology to improve your sugars. We're not winded by our platform as [indiscernible], which is a diabetes patch pump device and delivers basal-bolus is doing great. That's another example of how do we continue to bring innovation, how do we help more patients, how do we make sure our sales force is efficient. And that was a really exciting acquisition for us, a very small one. But meaningful, I think it was almost $22 million over the last 12 months revenue. And the same thing like we bought [ Quorum ] years ago, which had a nebulized product called clofazimine, we hadn't built a whole new capability around nebulizers and manufacturing, suspensions and things like that. So we continue to expand the company, not just from an inhalation platform, but just purely technology and capabilities, but we do have a pretty large infrastructure dedicated to making inhaled therapeutics. And the good news is for shareholders, they've already paid for that infrastructure. So our ability to move another asset quickly through the pipeline in terms of manufacturing, CMC risks, building out equipment. That's a sum cost in this company. So that does make some efficiencies where other companies have to build all that and we went through all that time. It took a lot of time to get this factory built and now we can actually just put more products in which also makes the company more efficient.

Great. Yes, no fantastic progress. So maybe, yes, moving to the programs and maybe first focusing on orphan lungs, Tyvaso DPI in particular. And there's been a lot of focus on that and obviously the launch over the last year. For those unfamiliar, could you maybe just provide a quick intro to the product, kind of where it's currently approved and the relationship with United as well?

Sure. For those who are another product that we used to call TreT United Therapeutics license in 2018. And that was a large upfront payment plus milestones over the last couple of years, which really helped Mannkind, United Therapeutics has been an incredible partner, they're a leader in pulmonary hypertension and orphan lung and trying to grow lungs in the future in organs. And the launch of DPI has done phenomenally well. We had a forecast. We worked with our partner. We make sure we try to deliver that forecast. And the more we looked and the more the demand came in, the more new patients came in, the more conversions happened. And so it's been a great success story. We had to work our butts off to keep the head of manufacturing this year. But we've done that. We've done a really good job. The team has worked 9 days literally to keep ahead. And we're helping a lot of patients. I mean there's a lot of great stories on Tyvaso and how it has helped them get off their nebulizer, how it has helped them to live their life, go visit their family. A lot of these patients can't leave their house, right? They're very sick. They're free to go too far. And this has really given them a new lease on life. And then you combine that with [ United Cut ] new indication ILD last year. That's been a lot of growth for them as a franchise and ultimately for us in DPI. And that continues to do well. And that's a new population with no therapeutic options. So it's really cool to see our innovation now in thousands of diabetes patients, thousands of PH and ILD patients, and it's going to keep going. I mean the hard part is saving the company like we did. The better part is now launching products, saving lives, making people's lives better and success breeds more success. And I think United Therapeutics has done an amazing job. And the next big study they have is IPF, right? So we're in the middle of a very large expansion in Danbury, Connecticut, where we're building a $60 million scale-up facility to handle the future demand of the product that should be coming online, will finish later early next year, I'll say, in the spray drying capacity next year. And so that's going to continue to supply Tyvaso to the upside scenarios that we can see in the short term. And then United Therapeutics is building a duplicate facility, which I think is important if you're going to have a multibillion-dollar asset, you don't want one single point of failure, which would be our one factory option. And while there's multiple parts of the factory for them, [indiscernible] mid-light instructs, you want to be able to save as many patients as you can. And I think having that duplication is going to be important. So they've announced a $500 million investment and really to get ready for IPF. I think we can handle the future demand in the current facility we have. But for IPF, that could be 100,000 patients, which is extremely huge and beneficial to people and MannKind.

Right. Yes. No -- congrats on all of that and the successful launch as well. I guess maybe just thinking forward in terms of IPF, kind of, can you kind of outline the time lines that we should be thinking about that?

Yes. I don't want to give guidance on therapeutics time lines, I mean that's their role. I think they've said that they expect to finish up enrollment late next year. so 1 should double check that, but that's what I've heard, and we're gearing up to make sure we can supply. And that because these patients have no options, 80% die in 5 years. So I think if there's good data, people are going to be clamoring to get a hold of it because they really have no options. And the current treatments out there, as we'll talk about in a second, is just they did a very high tolerability that 50% dropout rates. And so there's a lot of side effects. And so I think these people need something else, right, whether it's single use or combination use, it's going to be important.

Great. Maybe kind of switching to the pipeline still have been orphan lung. You've talked about there being a focus on R&D over the next few years, you obviously hired a new head of R&D. And you've mentioned kind of aiming for one launch per year starting roughly in 2025. I guess maybe kind of start off, talk about the general strategy with the pipeline and kind of how you see the pipeline developing going forward?

Yes. In 2019, we pivoted the orphan lung and then COVID hit, which unfortunately is going to create a lot of lung disorders in the future. The other thing I learned I was meeting with one of the IPF experts dealer day is a lot of these immunotherapies in oncology are causing interstitial lung disease and IPF longer term. So people are surviving cancer, but now they're getting another downstream effect. And it's probably related to the whole immune system and what's causing some of these things in lung. But we pivoted orphan lung. And so when you look at our pipeline now today, first up is clofazimine, which is nontuberculo-mycobacterium that had a slight delay in -- we had a fire, unfortunately, our partner in Germany. But we've now moved all the equipment. We've inspected everything. We've installed it. We had a clean room available fortunately, so that saved us a lot of time. So now it's -- we're running test batches and hopefully, that leads a lot of stability next month. And if all goes well, we will plan to launch this in Q2 for a clinical trial. And the good news with the delay, Insmed announced positive data last week on their quality life questionnaire, which was critical for us and FDA feedback about can this tool be validated, is it going to work and that just derisked our program, that news that it did show a correlation with sputum and quality life. And then the other parts, we look at the program to enhance its a new head of R&D. So Burkhart is looking at everything top to bottom, where do you see gaps? How do we continue to derisk the programs. And we're super excited about the overall pipeline. But clofazimine is going to be -- I think, a really meaningful opportunity for patients. The FDA has been very supportive. In fact, we're really activating sites next year and getting ready and hopefully still warehousing patients for the trial in Q2, so that when the trial does turn on. The contracts are done. We're not arguing with finance people to get contracts, and [indiscernible], which could take 6 months. The next thing in the pipeline is nintedanib, which is [indiscernible] a multibillion-dollar product. But the big challenge is half of people can't tolerate. It's really at the max dose from the GI toxicities, and most of the family members suffer, it's really a tough disease. We believe the inhaled version will be able to dose higher end to the lungs and hopefully minimize any GI. And these are 2 big benefits that are unmet needs. And even though there is -- United Therapeutics will be probably next up in IPF readouts. [indiscernible] just had some positive data this year, even their new asset has about 40% GI side effects. So we see that population still continue to be an unmet need, even in pricing in that environment changes. I think we have a unique product that really helps patients in a simple-to-use dry powder version. And the good news is -- when you think about the platform, thousands of patients and doctors using it on PH-ILD. Now by the time we come with IPF, it's going to be the same platform, so I have some familiarity with it, how it uses, how it works, how it trains. So that's exciting. So that nintedanib. And then the third asset in our pipeline, that's up is Pulmozyme. And we made inhaled version of that. We just got some good stability data that now we can feel confident around moving it forward. That was a hard molecule to make, but we feel pretty good about where that's going to go as well.

Great. And I guess maybe just back on inhaled nintedanib kind of what gives you confidence around potentially removing some of those side effects and the GI side effects in particular?

No, that's a great question. I mean -- and what people don't realize is we made some of these decisions 3, 4 years ago, that's just how long it takes to do dosing studies, tox studies, formulation work, stability work. And so people don't realize what's coming so fast, even the thought as we just met with last week, he said, "Oh, when you're going to go in the humans and I said early next year, and they said, what, like you're that close? I said, "Yes, I mean, MannKind is -- if you take a step back, whether it's Tyvaso DPI, hopefully, in the TETON studies that read out positive for UT 1 day, we'll be there with nintedanib and then we have an early-stage asset called TGF-beta ALK-5, which is what we call 501 at MannKind. We got 3 shots on go for IPF, which is a huge unmet need. It's litter with failures. But you ask why, why I believe this product? And I think we've already done the animal models to show you we impacted bleomycin along -- it's really the best model you have, even though they all are that good. And we saw the impact of our inhaled version versus the oral we went head-to-head. And so that gave us the confidence to dose it into the lung and then the one thing that we think is that we can dose higher. And the reason is if you look at the PK and the bioavailability of [ OFEB], 95% of it does not even get in the body. It just goes through the gut and causes all these side effects. Only 5% is bioavailable. And of that, even less if it gets to the lung. So we are taking the dose and our technology delivers deep lung penetration. And we're going to spread that asset across the lung all through and get really deep lung penetration. So you're going to want to the patio and the other. And we think that being able to dose much higher and cover the lung versus an oral formulation that's very hard penetration. They're night and day. And so we're trying to minimize the systemic side effects and maximize the lung exposure, and that's really what you want ideally for this disease.

Great. And how should we think about you kind of developing these programs? I know you talked a little bit about partnering in the past, kind of how should we think about how you make those decisions in terms of kind of taking things forward yourself potentially partnering?

Yes. I mean I think if you take a step back and say, if you wanted to 10x this company from a valuation, you need to launch a multibillion dollar asset at some point, right? And we look and I'm really happy for Tyvaso, but that's also an opportunity we look back and say we could have kept that ourselves and our shareholders could benefit. I'm really happy at that time we're making choices on trade-offs. And so I believe we got to be able to self-fund clofazimine and nintedanib. I think both of those programs have high shots on goal, high probability success, high unmet needs and real good high probability of launch success. And I think if you take nintedanib, I see this being used in combination treatment. So whether Tyvaso gets approved, I see them being used together, right? So people like, "Oh, how are you guys are going to compete? I'm not worried about that. These patients die. And so if we can -- I think I want to work to HIV, we evolve the combination treatment. We've really seen this in other diseases as well. So I'm not too interested in partnering. I think if you think about clofazimine realistically, we're not going to go to Japan. Japan is the second biggest market or Asia Pacific, I'll call it. So we'll look for a partner there, and we kind of paused some of that work because we wanted to make sure we can manufacture it, if someone comes into those due diligence. We couldn't do that with what we had set up in Germany. So that's a good thing. So we'll continue to expand that opportunity. We plan to launch about 75 sites around the world and about 20, 30 will be in Japan. So that -- we believe that asset will be fileable with the trial we're designing for that market. Nintedanib, again, there's an ex-U.S. market to someone who is interested in ex U.S. rights, we would think about that. And in Pulmozyme is one that is kind of like [indiscernible], which is it's a great product. I think it's going to make a huge difference for people living with cystic fibrosis. But we're at a point now where Roche is the market leader, should they take on this development from here on out? Or should we keep doing it. And I think that's where we were with UT and we felt that UT was the best partner for as a DPI in order to really help those patients as quickly as possible. Now we've seen that conversion. We've seen the uptake. We've seen the strength. And I think the same thing is true of Pulmozyme is our partnership with them one day, that would be great. And if not we're at the crossroads where I got to spend money now doing the next cell line development, and we can do it, it will take us about a year. But if we can save a year in development by coming with a great partner, we'll be open to that as well. So generally, that's where we stand. And the TGF-beta, so really, we're not it's kind of 1% probably success, but if it works, it's huge. So that's where we are.

Great. That makes a lot of sense. So I guess shifting maybe to endocrine at this point and Afrezza. Could you maybe just provide an intro to Afrezza kind of position in the market where you see its differentiating itself?

Yes, I'm getting a lot of questions on diabetes because of all the GLPs. And so I think when you take a step back and look at the macro environment, like GLPs will be great. There's always these weight loss crazes that happen and they eventually die down and the world sits in a different spot. I think what we're seeing today is amazing for patients that people really come with 50 pads, that's great. They're very hard to tolerate drugs. And I think at the end of the day, when you fast forward, we already know insulin was delayed 7 to 10 years in type 2. From the time somebody needed mealtime insulin to when they got it. I think all GLPs are going to just push it back an extra 2, 3 years. So someone need in 7 years are going to need 9 years. At the end of the day, the very first thing that goes to your real-time response. GLPs are not going to cure you for 5 years, right, look for long-term data, it's hard to find on these products. They have huge benefits. But at the end of the day, your body is missing a hormone. It went back to hormone, give it back to harmone, right? And so I try to make it simple. So we have positioned Afrezza mainly for type 1 now. So if you look at what we're doing, the PEACH trial is the pivotal moment for this company next year. It's something I've been working on for 5 years since I got here. And we're working with a great partner named [indiscernible] diabetes innovator down there and doing research. And the trial, we'll know in the next earnings call in terms of that we fully enroll and are we wrapping it up in the next 6 months? Or do we need more patients. It could be in fetal or non-fetal, I guess, but we think that's a low probability that the trial has been enrolling nicely, dropout rates have been manageable, probably half of what we expected. So that tells you people are properly dosing for once. And when you look at diabetes innovation and technology, Al Mann built the insulin pumps in kids, Dexcom built CGM in kids. We believe [indiscernible] will be the next innovation for kids and parents who really do not want to run around all day and chase their kids and try to stick with injections or attach pumps to them or pods. And we think this is a real opportunity, even if we're a fair choice for kids. That's where all type 1s are diagnosed pretty much, right? And so how do we help that population and be an equal choice. And that study is going to be important to prove that out and get that indication. That would be our first launch as we think of 2025, that will be when we expect to launch that year. The other study we just kicked off for type 1 is INHALE-3. And that's -- if we keep looking like who's going against the grain and switching away from insulin pumps? Nobody. You got everybody pushing type 1 insulin pumps, whether it's kids or adults. And all you've seen in my last 6 years here is we've gone from Medtronic being a great company, [indiscernible] being a great company to Animas getting out of this to Omnipod. And we just see patients going from one pump to another pump to another pump. And why are they doing that? They just want better control. They think the larger one was better. But when you look at the data, take a step back over 20 years, A1Cs are the same today as they were 20 years ago, despite all the advancements in AID despite all the advancements of CGM. So what type 1s really need is a real-time insulin that works. And hopefully, with this app that I'll show you in the BluHale is now just doctors show you, you can see your insulin, you can see your sugars almost in the hour, what's happening and fix your insulin, right, and fix your sugars, and that's really important. So INHALE-3, we told you we want to switch people off insulin pumps, and they said we were crazy. And last year, we did a small study called ABC. And we show that you can safely get off an insulin pump, switch to Afrezza, Tresiba and [indiscernible] outcome. Now that was a short study, very small. Now we scaled that study up to 20 centers around the country. And we kicked out the investigator meeting in June. No one believed their patients would switch off a pump, but they know that was the goal of the trial. You fast forward 60 days later, this trial is almost halfway enrolled in 60 days. And the doctor's are shocked, like, hey, my patients aren't as happy as I thought they were. So that tells you like we have a real opportunity to change the game with Afrezza. But it's been 9 years. It's been a long ride, mostly is what to kill this program by now. But the patient stories are amazing. The dosing has been off and we're hoping between the PEACH trial and INHALE-3 that these 2 dosing will really show you when you properly dose your mealtime insulin, you get better control. And no mealtime insulin has ever be another mealtime insulin in 100 years. So maybe we'll be the first one. So we'll find out next year.

Great. Yes, yes. No, definitely love to kind of look forward to as those 2 trials progress. And I guess you mentioned kind of BluHale earlier. Kind of how does that fit into the Afrezza offering maybe thinking about from a commercial perspective as well?

Yes. I mean I think you see -- I'd say like I never forget one day 15 years ago, I'm with my [indiscernible] Starbucks and he pulls out the app to pay for Starbucks. I'm like, do they even happen. He's like, yes, where are you? Like you're 20-years younger than me. And it just shows you that was version 1.0. Now they've gone to carrying like tons of cash and making money on cash balances and order on demand. And I think we are at 1.0 in our BluHale business, taking us a long time to get the prototype through the system, get the architecture done. But once this thing is up and running, then you innovate from there, right? How do you make the system feedback loop, how do you do predictive AI and dosing, things like that. When I was in New York this week, I met a young gentleman who's starting a company on, "Hey, what dose should I take today? It's just going to tell you, well, last Friday you did this and you're ready here, and you should take 20. So he's trying to get AI to really predict what dose you should be based on your location, based on your history, based on what you're doing that day, your activity. So it's pretty cool where this is going. And it's like how do we take those types of models in either open source or API so that people can connect to them or we bring to like that to help us, right, and bring the journey along. So that's where I think digital health is really a big important part of the future, especially when you have a feedback loop like CGM. And so that's where [indiscernible] will really help. And it was also nice just playing with the real last week is seeing good reports, what's my average dose? And how do I send that to my doctor, to say, "Hey, here's how all I'm doing, and here's my dose response curve. So that's pretty cool. And then V-Go, which I don't know if we're going to talk about, but I'll leave that to you.

Yes. No, I think that's a good segue into V-Go as well. Yes, maybe talk about kind of how that fits into the whole offering.

No. There was a question on -- I've gotten from shareholders on Cipla and what's happening over there. And I think the trial results are in, they're intending to file that for approval. And I wanted to just clarify that because since we are here talking about the trials for Afrezza. So that trial has been done and that's on track.

That's the INHALE-2.

Yes. So we'll hear more about that sometime in the future. On V-Go, obviously, it was a new product for us. We've watched it for a long time. They actually used to have BluHale. I mean, a Bluetooth-connected device on the back of the device. And it got lost in the transition. But as we play with our platform, it's like, hey, is this stuff that we have to bring back and we look at because I do think connected device is very important. But V-Go itself has been a great device. We've positioned that for type 2. So I talked about Afrezza for type 1. We think that's going to be differentiating and the GLPs aren't really going to majorly impact that despite a small study coming out this week saying GLPs may impact type 1. I think that's going to be a minimal impact at the end of the day. The type 2 market, most patients are still going to be basal-bolus. V-Go has 90-plus percent of its use in type 2. The majority of that is probably Medicare, maybe 60%, 70%. And that's where we really position our V-Go device. At the end of the day, if you're going to go from GLP to basal to bolus ultimately, you're going to find you're not taking your doses, you're missing them and V-Go is really going to help you. And so that's how we position that product and our sales force is out there. They're not going to write inhale insulin, then you've got plenty of patients that have type 2. Let's try to help those patients. And that's really our focus is making sure our sales force is efficient and effective and bring in as many offerings to customers as we can. And that product stabilized and grew in Q2, we're ramping up Q3 soon, so we'll see how finishes strong. But now we've integrated that to all 80 reps that we have in the field. And so you got everyone selling V-Go and Afrezza on one team, one voice, one vision.

Great. Yes. No, I think it's just over a year since you made that acquisition. So congrats on the turnaround with the program. I guess maybe kind of thinking just forward plan for the company, we talked obviously a lot about the pipeline programs and the programs that you have with Afrezza. Kind of how would you characterize the evolution of the company going forward? Kind of what are the -- obviously, the strategy and how you think the company will develop over the next 5 years?

Yes. I think back in my career back in the day, I took a job at a company called Pharmasset. And I said, guys, your name, what is it and he said, well, originally, it was a Pharmasset. We were taking assets developing and collecting a royalty. So that model didn't succeed, they ultimately pivoted and [indiscernible]. I think the same was true here. We went through our growing pains and saying, what are we? Are we a platform company, are we a licensing company, or we are just going to develop products and formulate and sell them off. And I think the way you really create value is to become a self-sustaining biotech pharmaceutical company. And you look at the margins and you look at the -- while we can get royalties, that's great. At the end of the day, if you're a CMO, you're stuck in a very low margin business and you're on high-risk failure and assets don't come along fast enough to sustain your company when you see these models. And so we really did pivot in 2019 to say we are going to be fully focused -- leverage our technology, help those patients. We felt that was the biggest unmet need out there. And the Tyvaso data gave us some conviction that clofazimine data gave us conviction. And so I think when you look out there, part of people say, why do you still have Afrezza? Well, part of it is you need a marketing team, you need a sales operations team, you need data integration teams, IT. We have all that infrastructure now. So while one could say get rid of some of those expenses, at the end of the day, if we're going to be launching 2, 3, 4 products, we need all that backbone infrastructure. We need that talent base. And it took us many years to hire the right people and go through the cycle of building the best talent and now our people are looking to grow the company, and they want to jump into the next launch in the company. So it's exciting. We have a great group of employees, great sales reps, a great management team. And they really care about patients. And so when you look at the company, we're really focused on driving innovation, launching our own brands and helping as many people as we can.

Great. And maybe just quickly on kind of capital structure. You kind of -- I think you referenced earlier, you think you're kind of capital sufficient going forward as kind of anything to kind of talk about just in terms of kind of how you set up from a capital.

Yes. I mean I think if you took last quarter, when I got here in 2016, I think we were doing like $1.7 million a year or something. And so last quarter, we did $50 million in revenue. So that put you on a $200 million run rate as you go forward. We don't see -- I mean something could happen. I can't control. But at this point, Tyvaso is going gangbusters, Afrezza is having a great year because of Medicare coverage. V-Go is stabilized and growing. The pipeline is advancing. Everywhere I look is about growth. And that is going to create a decade of sustainable growth or more. And we have IP going into the 2030s and 2040s. So huge runway ahead of us. Everything is doing great, thank God. Lots of clinical data readouts, lots of things going in the clinical trials. So there's a lot of upcoming milestones that we look at over the next 12, 18, 24 months that people are very excited. I mean, to speak of, I probably met 20, 30 investors and most of our discussions around our pipeline, which is great because that's kind of what we thought this year. As everyone is going to get over Tyvaso, what happens to manufacturing. Once you get over all that, what's next? And the pipeline is what's next? And that's been very exciting to see some new investors we just met one last night, took a pretty big position in our company and you listen to them and you want -- they want to hear what's going on, and you want to hear from your investors and how they perceive things. But it's just exciting. You look at our cap table and our people I think 70-plus percent of our shareholders now are institutions, money who's going to be stable. They want to see a nice return. They've seen our 5 years, they want to see the next 5 years. That's exciting. So our stock is down a little bit this year that bothers me, but hopefully, by the end of year we will close strong. It's been a hard sector overall. But MannKind is in a really good spot. I think we closed Q2 with roughly $145 million. And if you look Tyvaso alone did 19 million of royalties that drops to the bottom line. So that gets paid in the next quarter. So as you look at it and keeps growing, that cash burn will continue to decline as we go forward as Tyvaso keeps growing. And we're going to minimize the rest of the expenses in the company. So we should start to see cash flow positivity in not too distant future as we keep going.

Great. Yes, no, fantastic progress. Lots of exciting things on the horizon. So we look forward to those progressing. Thanks very much for your time today, Mike.

Thank you for having us. Appreciate it.

Thank you.