Marqeta, Inc. (MQ) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Great. Thank you, everybody. Welcome to the Marqeta fireside chat at the Goldman Sachs Communacopia and Technology Conference. I have the privilege of introducing Jason Gardner, Executive Chairman, CEO and Founder of Marqeta. My name is Mike Ng, and I cover Marqeta and fintech here at Goldman. We have about 40 minutes for today's presentation inclusive of audience Q&A. So if you have a question at the end, feel free to just raise your hand, and we'll get a mic runner over to you.

So not Executive Chairman yet.

I'm sorry. Yes.

Still Chairman.

Still Chairman. But we will get to that specific point during the conversation. So Jason first thank you very much for the time and participating in our conference.

Thanks for having me.

It's a privilege. To start things off, would you just describe the opportunity for modern card issuing processors like Marqeta, how Marqeta differentiates itself from peers and the path for continued market share gains over the next several years?

I mean, most people know the story, got -- the company got started back in 2010. This is after co-founded another payments company and what did they figure out how to put a bunch of Groupon coupons on a card. If we all remember what Groupon was like. And they had to go build an issuing processing system from scratch and felt -- after actually talking to banks and talking to other issuer processors, they just said, you can build whatever you want, it just needs to look like this, which is the same card that everyone had. So why I decided to go build an entire issuing processing system from scratch to deliver that the open API so that companies can build really purpose-built cards to solve either commercial or consumer use cases. And we invented a category called modern card issuing, which allowed a company to come in, whether it was Instacart or Cash App or Expensify to build these cards to operate in a very, very specific way, and no one had ever done that before. If you look at what Visa and Mastercard have done, they've interconnected the world for merchants that want to accept payment cards, whether online or off-line. And that's a massive, massive business. I mean even electronic payments globally is about $80 trillion. You have anywhere from $7 trillion to $8 trillion in the U.S. around carded volume. And today, Marqeta processes less than 0.5%. So if you think modern card issuing and the ability for companies to build card products, whether commercial or consumer use cases, is going to continue to grow in the coming years, which is, as I think we've seen over the last 10 years, a bank had a card and now a card brings a bank. We see that with companies like Cash App and Chime, where the card is really the tip of the spear and then all the services behind that. So that's going to be continuing to happen around the world. We're going to capture that market opportunity amongst many other market opportunities, even continuing like on-demand delivery and expense management. So if we think about the future, within both debit and credit and the services that are being built around it, we're pretty excited about the opportunity that's ahead of us. And there's so much more that we have planned to do and plan to announce in the coming months and years, but there's still a general sense within the company that we're only scratching the surface.

That's a fantastic overview. Why don't we talk about some of the news that was announced this morning? Marqeta's Board of Directors authorized a $100 million buyback with no termination date. Maybe you can talk a little bit about why now and the plans there.

I think like when I announced that I was going to move from CEO to eventually Executive Chairman, I wanted to be very transparent. It's one of the core values when I started the company, as I told every Marqetans, you should know as much as I do about the business, not the HR-related stuff. So I announced, obviously, this morning that every Wednesday, we had the all-hands meeting, and I would tell everybody how much time we have left based on how much money we had in the bank. And people actually loved it because it was so transparent that they understood how fast they have to work and how fast they have to build to get to generating cash. And then obviously, my job was as a private company CEO to go out and raise money. So when I announced the stock went down 25%, like I was kind of shocked. Like I thought it was going to go down maybe 10% to 15%. But we, as a management team and a Board, felt like we've just been simply dislocated from our peers. And we believe we're just massive our valued as the stock. I mean, just based on how the market is operated, we're excited about the prospects in the company. And we decided it's time to go and begin buying back just to begin to put us in where we should be amongst our peers. And then obviously, the execution that we continue to have, is strong, and we want to show that we not only believe in the company, but we believe that we're dislocated, and we should be -- the stock should be obviously at a different price point.

Great. As Marqeta's Founder and CEO, you've obviously been incredibly integral to the story. As you step into that soon to be Executive Chairman role, it feels like there might be some sort of inflection or change in Marqeta's business. So what does that next stage look like? Is it any different from the current stage and phase that we're in?

Well, there's not a change in Marqeta's business. There's a change in me. I started the company by myself. I took the company public on June 9, '21. I was getting lots of questions from Martha Cummings, who runs nongov and about my succession plan. And I was -- I didn't want to engage. Like I was really -- like I'm overwhelmed. We just went public. This is a whole new world. I mean being a private company CEO and being a public company CEO is vastly different. And the -- a lot of the questions I was getting around succession planning. I kind of blew it off until January of this year, and then the question started coming up again. And I was asking like -- my friends like going to other public company CEOs, going to other founders, who took companies public and then moved to an exec chair role. People like Scott Cook, and then talked to Brad Smith as well and got really excited about that dynamic duo. I mean look what Reid Hoffman and Jeff Weiner did, look what Brad Smith and Scott Cook did. I mean that became really exciting to me because I'm a product person. I like to go build things and building things and focusing on people are in culture within the company and then focusing on our customers is where I'm the best in the world at. And I felt, over time, I was drifting away from that and becoming far more of a day-to-day operator. And if I can partner with somebody, I actually referred to it as I need to find the co-founder for the next stage of growth, and me and that person can partner together to drive a lot more growth within the business over the coming years as we operate in 39 countries today and growing. There's so much we can do for some -- for me as an entrepreneur, but then also someone who's been born, bred and trained for this job. Like this is probably one of the most enviable CEO jobs available in fintech. So when I announced we -- there's a lot of people who want this role. I've interviewed a number of people already, and I know that the market wants me to find somebody as soon as possible. We don't have a time frame on it. But my goal is to find the best person that myself, the management team, the Board and the company can work with to drive even greater value for not only our customers but our shareholders.

Great. And maybe you can expand on that just a little bit more. As you go seek that next cofounder for Marqeta's next leg of growth. Are there any certain characteristics that you're looking for as you work on the CEO search? I know you mentioned there's no time line. And then similarly, I know that Marqeta is trying to fill other executive roles like the Chief Revenue Officer, Syed. Maybe you can provide some updates on either what you're looking for or a timeline there.

Yes. So Simon Khalaf, who joined us from Twilio, is an amazing GM. He's also been a CEO before. He understands revenue so he's stepping in on the interim basis to really drive revenue for the company. It's like even in a short period of time. He's done an amazing job. We have a strong presence in the market, so he's taking over a strong team as it is. I believe that you can find a really good CRO until you find a really good CEO. So that's the CRO. We haven't even begun the search because we want to focus on the CEO first. And so the CEO for Marqeta, like you need to have a good understanding of financial services, specifically payments. It's a very, very nice to have. I'm not declared that you have to do that because I didn't know anything about issuing and processing when I started the company and I brought people into the company who know nothing about issuing and processing and has done an incredible job. Randy Kern being one, our CTO. So as I look to it, sort of the payments and financial services because I think operating in a space that's very regulated. This is not a software business. This is payments. When you move people's money based on instruction, whether it's commercial or consumer use cases, they are -- there's OCC, FinCEN, FDIC, the CFPB, and then there's all the counterparts of all those types of organizations in every country that we operate. That's just a different way to think about a business. So that's one. Number 2 is they have either been a CEO of a public company or an active currently as a CEO of a public company or have been on an executive team of a public company reporting directly into the CEO. It's very, very different. After you go public, it's kind of like getting hit in the head by the bat. It's very different than as a private company, CEO, you can really do whatever you want. You can't necessarily do that as a CEO of a public company. So you need to find someone who has operated within that environment because it's very, very different. And I'm actually really excited about it, to find somebody that I can partner with, and I can do my best work so they can do their best work, and I can see how the market thinks. The market is going to think all sorts of different things in regards to my announcement. But for me, I'm sort of giddy about the whole thing, like to find that person that I can really work with and partner with to drive even greater value and greater heights within the business. For me, after 12 years, I'm very ready to do that.

That's great. Let's pivot a little bit and talk more about the business. Marqeta has a deep long-standing relationship with several start-ups in fast-growing categories like on-demand delivery, Buy Now, Pay Later, expense management. Could you talk a little bit about what made Marqeta stand out in these verticals and have as much success as it has to date?

Well, like the early days. So I think about sitting with Tony Xu from DoorDash and his team, and they were giving prepaid cards to their to their drivers with $2,000 to $3,000 on them and the driver is basically going to Nordstroms and shopping for groceries themselves and buying a pack of smoke at a bar across the street. They had no control over these transactions. So we sat down with them. And at the time, we were inventing something called JIT or Just In Time. This is the ability so when you swipe card, it generates what's called an ISO 8583 message at the point of sale. So when any of you travel around the world and you swipe the card, it works because that terminal is generating the exact same message that every other terminal in the world is generating. We took that message and we said, like, what if we send you the message? So you can use the lat long data of the app in the phone with the amount in the merchant. Because if you know they're going to buy $100 worth their groceries, it's going to come through at $100 worth of groceries, you would be able to authorize that. So that allowed them to take off and scale. Like we believe that, that space wouldn't be able to be as successful as it was in the beginning without us. So that was Instacart and then DoorDash and Favor and like all the host of companies in that space. So that was the beginning of our strategy to go after verticals. So we focused on these verticals and use cases where what can we do to allow these companies to scale and not only know their [indiscernible] To on a minute-by-minute basis because we're sending them these transactions, they can -- we have obviously a rev share with them so they can figure it out. But we've reduced risk down to near 0. So they can hire hundreds of thousands of people across the world that would have Marqeta cards and be able to go buy groceries and food and begin to scale. So we did that for expense management, obviously, on-demand delivery, e-commerce and then Buy Now, Pay Later. Sitting with Klarna at the Money20/20 conference back in 2015, they needed to understand how they could scale. And we said, "Well, we can do this thing called what's called a virtual card." We inserted into the checkout flow behind their pay with Klarna page and then allow them to go and scale and the speed to market as now they can onboard merchants incredibly fast without the integration. And now we see with Klarna, like we're powering them through 14 different countries. We've launched the Klarna card now. And that's how we've always worked with our customers as we think about whether use cases can Marqeta be bringing to your constituency and then allow them to scale. And then we went into, obviously, digital banks, large tech giants and now large financial institutions.

That's great. And then among those key verticals that we just talked about, as you think about the next leg of growth, is that going to be driven by expanding the share with these existing customers or perhaps signing new customers in these existing verticals are going into new verticals altogether?

All of the above. Yes. So there's these new verticals. There's a number of different verticals and use cases we're looking at today. In fact, the last 2 days, we had a Board meeting yesterday, but the day before that was a full day of strategy. And we have a lot of -- there is -- at Marqeta, there is no lack of opportunity or verticals or where we want to invest our time or our money. It's about saying no to the things that we believe will be good at and saying yes to the things that we believe will be great at. So it's verticals, it's use cases, it's new technologies, it's how -- new geographies, how do we spread our wings. Like we are operating in 39 countries today, but there's a ton of opportunity, say, in South America and Central America. We still believe that there's a ton more opportunity even in the U.S., and we'll continue to invest. So the question is one where it's all the above because there is so much opportunity for us and where we want to go. It's down to execution and then making sure that our customers are adopting more and more of our platform and new technologies that we're introducing.

Great. I was wondering if you could talk a little bit about how Marqeta fits in relative to traditional financial institutions or traditional card issuers. Is there a certain use case that you think may resonate more with traditional FIs?

Yes. So traditional FIs, so a large financial institution wins a portfolio from another large financial institution. It's $50 million just to get started, and that's probably another $200 million just to bring that portfolio online. So if you think about the size of a portfolio based on the $250 million investment needs to be incredibly large. And if I'm going to start a new card product, I have this on-prem solution, whether it's FIS, Fiserv or TSYS, that cost an extraordinary amount of money. So with Marqeta because everything is natively in the cloud, it's APIs, you can literally launch 10 different card products in a matter of a couple of months. And then 80 test that and see what creates the stickiness and then end up using our technology to further differentiate that product to market. So we believe there's just a little lower total cost of ownership of using us for large financial institutions as they begin to go and build. Now large financial institutions are very, very long sales cycles. And we've done pretty well already. So we've announced Citi with tokenization as a service. We've announced JPMorgan. We've announced Marcus. There's more coming, and that's our foot in the door. So we can prove that this company and our technology of tokenization of services is going to provide value because TSYS doesn't do it. And that was we were looking at how do we get our foot in the door. Our foot in the door was -- if I'm a bank that uses TSYS like Citi and JPMorgan Chase, I can't even use the card until I get it in the mail. But what if I can instantly issue it into Apple Pay or Samsung Pay or Google Pay and use it immediately? That automatically increases the likelihood that the consumer is going to begin to engage, and that was our foot in the door, and even getting that is a long sales cycle. So we're proving ourselves, proving our technology. And then obviously, the sales strategy is to look for other opportunities, eventually new card products.

Great. Let's talk a little bit more about new card products. Marqeta is primarily debit today and it's increasingly looking into new products such as credit. Could you just talk a little bit about where you are on credit today? And what points of differentiation does Marqeta offer that gives them the right to win in that product and vertical?

Yes. So in the card world, you have 2 major components. You have the issuing and processing system itself. So all of the technology to sort of manage the ISO 8583 messages, whether this is credit, debit or prepaid. And so prepaid and debit are pretty much the same. Prepaid is kind of the bastard child of debit. Credit is very different because you're dealing with what's called Reg Z compliance. So this is when you log into a website to look at your credit card if you have a Chase Sapphire card like I have. Everything is formatted in a very specific way. So that's why no matter what credit card you're using, when you log in, all the interfaces look the same because they're actually legally supposed to go look like that, even down to the font size. So that's what's called Reg Z compliance. So when you build a credit card issuing and processing system, everything needs to be able to support that interface. The next step of that is what's called program management. So you have program management within debit. So we refer to this as MXM and PXM, so managed by which is program management and then powered by where we're not providing program management but more sort of a la carte like disputes management or fraud management for the different products that we have. It's the same within credit. So within credit is when you -- when a consumer pays part of their bill, how does that money get allocated against the purchases that were made? When someone does buy a product or they do a cash advance, those are different APRs associated with. So all the calculation around that, a lot of that is within the program management space. So today, within credit, we do only the issuing and processing. So this has been a 4-year journey for us. Four years ago, decided let's go build a brand-new credit cards. We thought the turning credit cards out today all look the same. We want a different experience. So it's 2 years or 18 months of like planning and then 2 years of building to get to where we are today. We even just -- we launched 40 new APIs within credit a couple of months ago. So we're just scratching the surface within credit, but now we have like the Greenlight card. We have the M1 card. There's more cards coming out. And then today, we partner with both Deserve and FNBO, First National Bank of Omaha, which is one of the largest credit issuers in the world. They were up 20%. We leveraged their program management, but we've been very open that we're either going to buy or we're going to build our own program management system because in the program management world, there's just a lot of different features and functions you can build to drive revenue.

Great. That was very clear. I'd like to talk a little bit about Marqeta's customer base. Block is Marqeta's largest customer. It made up 69% of revenue in the second quarter. Can you talk a little bit about the scope of the relationship with Blocks, Cash Card, Square Card, Afterpay? What are the most common use cases that Marqeta helps with?

Yes. So we -- so first off, we do a lot. Like Mike Milotich, our CFO, said where the best analogy is really going to zipper. We're so tight to each other based on the work that we do, which has been -- we actually built the first block, card with them as part of a Hackly project back in 2013. And then IO, who was running product at Cash App, reached out in 2016 to go build the next card based on people who are sending money in the P2P space, and there's just money sitting in accounts because people didn't have bank accounts. So today, we look at it like within the Cash App card itself, we have ATMs and accounts in ACH and the teen card and the Cash App card itself. Within Square Card, we have the account infrastructure, the Square Card itself, money movement, ATM and then now with Afterpay. Afterpay is obviously one of the many by now, pay later companies we work with. Even that acquisition, how do they implement Afterpay at the point of sale, they work with us to go and do that. So we're very, very tied together in the work that we do. And at the same time, like they're an incredible business. Like what they've built even in the Credit Karma and the massive amounts of deposits we saw in the first and second quarter where just people receiving their checks from the IRS. Then cash loads and then obviously adding buy now, pay later to the point of sale. So we have been working together for a long time. There are lots of people at Marqeta who have counterparts within Block and Block counterparts working with Marqeta. I'm close to Brian Grassadonia, who is the CEO of Cash App, and I've been working together for years. So that is the perfect relationship. That's the relationship I think any company wants to have it of a customer, which is the customer is taking advantage and using the entire surface area of the platform. And part of that is because they know how to build products and are just crushing the rest of the market in regards to how it builds. This is where we see the concentration problem, which was 63% in the first quarter and then went to 69% because they've added a number of things to their products, like the Credit Karma piece and Afterpay and the cash flows where we saw the increase in volume while we made a big bet on crypto. I felt very strongly in crypto. That was really beginning to take off and then the change in the market just depressed other parts of the market, like buy now, pay later and crypto, why we saw the concentration grow. We expect that, and our goal is to make sure that goes down over time as we do only build within existing verticals with new verticals.

That's great. I think it's very clear you guys have a very tightened and expanding relationship. But just given the importance of Block as a customer, naturally, the upcoming contract negotiations and exploration is in focus. Cash Card, I think, expires in March of 2024. Square is...

End of '24.

Yes, end of '24. And Afterpay also comes up at some point in 2024. So maybe you can talk a little bit about what you see as the key points of focus during the negotiations and whether there's any opportunity for that time line to change at all?

Yes, there's opportunity for the timeline to change. It's the #1 question I get asked all the time, which is very natural. We have concentration and the -- our public company investors want to reduce that risk and the way to reduce that risk is to sign a long-term contract. I know that. We talk about it all the time internally and with Cash App in regards to how do we -- what is the next stage of our relationship look like. And in many ways, the relationship with Cash App has been like 0 to 1. So what does 1 to infinity look like? And how do we talk about all kinds of different things like new products and credit and new geographies? And then obviously, to get a longer-term agreement, economics is a natural part of that. If there's any vendors in the room, we all know that when we go and do contracts that the best way to sign long-term contracts is better economics. So all of these will be discussed. And when we have news around the renewal, everybody will find out at the same time. But it is a focus, I hear it all the time. I completely understand it. And we work with Cash App on a literally minute-by-minute basis. Like the amount of business that they do on a daily basis is extraordinary. I mean even last quarter, 20% of the days of the quarter, we did greater than $500 million in volume. So if you think about the technology and the scalability and the infrastructure it takes to go manage that and then all the people it takes to manage that is incredible, so that's because of the collaboration we have with companies like Block and others to be able to support that at scale.

We're approaching the 10-minute mark. So before I open it up to investor Q&A, maybe I'll just sneak one more in on competition. Card issuing and processing is obviously a competitive space. We mentioned some of the legacy or traditional card issuer processor before. But there are also some more tech-enabled entrants, like Stripe, Adyen, Galileo. Maybe you could talk a little bit about the competitive landscape. Who do you see as most directly competitive with Marqeta? And what do you see as the moats and points of differentiation?

Well, probably yes. I mean it's funny, we don't see Galileo that much, but they're a pure issuer processor like us. On the Adyen and Stripe side, like they're both amazing companies. Like Peter and then John and Patrick over at Stripe, they built an amazing businesses, but 99% of their focus on revenue is on the acquiring side. There's thousands of acquirers across the world. I mean even we've seen companies like dLocal go public in the last 1.5 years. So there's tons and tons of competition, and that's where they're focused, right? Issuing and processing is not the battlefront for them. It's the battlefront for us. They're great competitors. They build great technology, but it's -- they're not a pure-play issuing a processing system, and issuing and processing absolutely demands focus because the technology and the scalability of the platform is immense. And they're operating in an incredibly complex business around the world in the acquiring space, which is most of the revenue. So they can move their resources to a different battlefront, which means they give up on what's happening here, and they need to defend that with everything that they have. So this allows us to go and scale and grow to where we are today, and obviously, well beyond that.

Great. Why don't I pause there and see if there are any questions from the audience? We got one right there.

In terms of Square and Cash App on retail state. Just talking a lot about kind of commerce and how that's scaling up. How exactly do you get kind of the revenue model? How do you benefit from that, please?

So our revenue model is based on usage. So we generate -- especially here in the United States, we generate interchange on every single card transaction, and then we share that interchange with cash out of the Block. We actually do that with every single customer. And it's an interesting model. So -- and when we were going out and even as a private company raising capital, I would always say as companies come to us to make money, and it's actually true. So companies -- because based on volume they deliver, we deliver revenue to them. So the more volume that were delivered by a customer, the more share of the interchange that they get, and Cash App and Block is not any different than that. Obviously, the amount of volume they deliver to us is just quite significant, so they get the majority of the interchange -- of interchange pie versus Marqeta. Does that answer your question?

[indiscernible]

You can ask me whatever you want. So don't hold back.

Yes. One over here.

I already get started.

Yes, yes. I just get the mic over to you.

Just going to thinking about main pain points for your customers that you're trying to solve kind of longer term. How are you thinking about that? And what does that kind of landscape look like?

Well, actually, the pain points for our customers is they know they need a card. They don't know exactly how to go about doing it. So over time, we've been providing more and more professional services in regards to how they think, and we've been doing this for years already. And we found this out even the early days when we went and launched as I assumed, okay, we're going to come out with an API and it's going to be so well documented, we don't need to speak to anybody. And it was like, it didn't happen that way. So people needed to know about compliance, what a card load is, how do it order a card, what do even the 16 digits mean. I mean we got a myriad of questions. So we've been really good at. And I -- and still this way today, like treat every customer like gold, like treat them like they were our first customer ever and educate them because you build tremendous trust, especially in a -- with a product that either supports their core business or is their core business. So we spend a lot of time educating them on things like risk control, which is one product around fraud, what's disputes management. So as you have a card product, you're going to find that people ordered the red dress, but they wanted the black dress. So they're going to return it, that's a dispute and then all of the manage. So there's tons of education. So we're finding like as they go into, say, a credit or they're here in the U.S. and they want to go to Australia, they're in Australia and they want to come to the U.S., is how to really educate them on what they should be taking advantage of. And as I said the company, part of our job is to like point to the moon and say, "Mr. Customer, Mrs. customer, this is where you need to go, and we're going to help you get there, " and then provide basically all of the products and education to help them achieve that. That's worked really well for us, and that will never change because it's in our culture.

We got one over here.

Just jumping back to the interchange piece for a bit. Given your sort of revenue share structure as opposed to some of your other peers that are just sort of clipping a fee on it. With your concentration in Square and companies like Square, if that gap on the debit interchange ever closes for them where they're sort of getting around the larger bank cap, how does that then flow through on the revenue impact for you guys? Do you see a big sort of cliff if they sort of have to pinch that interchange really hard? Or is there anything to mitigate against that?

Yes, a couple of things. So you're probably referring to -- so when you talk about the big bank cap, there's something called the Durbin Amendment, which happened after 2008, which if you're a bank of $10 billion assets and below, debit interchange is still unregulated. So it's anywhere from 200 to 300 basis points, which is the share of the pie, above $10 billion is it's capped. So -- and that is what we refer to as sort of a large financial institution. So that's capped. There is nothing we see right now in regards to that potentially changing. I mean even Dick Durbin had his meeting several months ago to talk about this, and nobody showed up because you have 5,000 mid-market banks and no representative of a state or a senator is going to come in and want to hurt the banks in the small towns throughout the United State. So we don't see that happening. Like it's pretty low that debit interchange is going to change. So we're still operating as if debit interchange is going to remain the same. Credit interchange, whether it's a large financial institution or a mid-market bank or a small bank, it's still just completely unregulated. And even around the world, I mean you have a debit and credit interchange. And even Europe is the 20 bps for debit, 30 bps for credit, but commercial interchange is still unregulated. So there's tons of opportunity around change, and that will continue. But there are parts of the world like Australia and Europe where the interchange pie is not there. We figured those models out where we get obviously paid by our customers to go operate. So we've already figured that out. But in the United States, we just don't see the debit cap changing where our customers would have to adapt.

Maybe just refining that more so just on the Square piece. Right now, they're -- from my understanding, they're getting around that debit interchange cap.

Well, they work with Sutton Bank, which is a -- which is below the $10 billion cap.

Yes. But Square is seemingly looking to scale that quite rapidly. What sort of the risk with that being such a concentrated player seemingly they're going to get through that $10 billion cap at some point?

Yes. So the way -- so -- and this is not different for companies like Chime and Dave and like all the other neo banks out there. And I mean there's obviously Block, but there's also Instacart and DoorDash. Like so the way it works is banks work with other correspondent banks where they basically move money to stay underneath the cap. That system has been operating for a long time. Nobody is disputing that. That's just simply how it works, how they can stay below the cap.

We're just about a minute out. So in closing, I guess a 2-part question. Maybe you can talk a little bit about how you balance long-term profitability and growth and also talk about what elements you're most excited about over the next 3 to 5 years?

Yes. So I -- this is part of the reason to bring in someone who's been born, bred and trained to this stage is like our focus is to build a sustainably profitable company and one that's very efficient at scale. That is a pure operator, and we have a plan to make that happen. We were free cash positive even in the last quarter. So we're still operating towards the goal of becoming profitable -- EBITDA profitable. So we're able to do that because we still see massive space within the market for us to continue to grow and that's around the world. So as we think about the products and that we want to go build, we want to have products that focus on interchange, we want to focus that are non-interchange products that are at a much higher gross margin to allow us to go build lots of tools and lots of features and functions that companies can take advantage of around the world as we build towards being a profitable company. That is ultimately the goal.

Great. That's an excellent way to cap off the session. It's been a privilege to share the stage with you. Would you please join me in thanking Jason for his time and thoughts? Thank you.