Medtronic plc (MDT) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Hey, good morning, And welcome to Goldman Sachs healthcare conference virtually this year. I'm Amit Hazan, the medical technology analyst. And we've got a full day of medical technology presentations today, and we're going to kick it off with Medtronic. Before we do that, just because it's the first session and before I introduce Geoff, maybe read a couple of disclosures and get that out of the way. We're required to make certain disclosures in public appearances about Goldman Sachs' relationships with companies that we discuss. The disclosures relate to investment banking relationships, compensation received or 1% or more ownership. We're prepared to read aloud disclosures for any issuer upon request. However, the disclosures are available on our most recent reports to you as clients on our current portals. Disclosures and updates to those disclosures are also available by ticker on our website. In addition, disclosures applicable to research with respect to companies, if any, mentioned herein are available through your investment representative. Also, the views stated by non-Goldman Sachs personnel do not necessarily reflect those of Goldman Sachs. That's the disclosure. I'll also remind people there is a survey as we've done in years past. We have a very quick survey being hosted on the conference page and in your e-mail in lieu of live polling this year, and we'd love to get your feedback and really appreciate your participation. So with that out of the way, we're really excited to kick this year's conference off with Medtronic. And we've got Geoff Martha, President and Chief Executive Officer joining us. So first and foremost, Geoff, thanks for joining us in what are obviously very challenging times for you.

Thanks for having me. Looking forward to it.

Yes. Great. And I actually want to start with you, Geoff. And just obviously, you know the company extremely well. You've been groomed to take over and had one strategy to start the year, and then the world changes. And we know a lot about how Medtronic has responded so far, but I think investors are still getting to know you as CEO at least. So I thought we could just kick it off by just asking you to give us a sense of what it's been like for you in your new role as you've gone through this. Geoff, can you hear me okay?

Amit, are you there?

I am. Did you hear -- we've got...

[ So I know what you asked there ]. We had one strategy to start and the world changes and then the -- it seems like the Internet dropped here.

So the crux of the question is basically we know how Medtronic has responded so far. I think investors would love to hear, get a sense from you of what it's been like for you in your new role going through this crisis in these first months as CEO.

Well it's certainly been intense, right? I mean there is -- I find that in times like these, the amount of communication that needs to happen is quite a lot, all types of stakeholders, your employees, your leadership team, your customers, your Board and investors. And so the amount of communication is one thing. The other is just the -- you have to be decisive and clear. So clarity of thought at times like these are important because there's really no playbook. And so those are -- this is -- in many respects though, I feel actually pretty fortunate, as crazy as that sounds, because the -- I'm getting a lot of support. I'm getting a lot of support from the leadership team, from my predecessor Omar. He's been very active. He was very active all the way through the end of April and still is very supportive and mentors me on a number of issues and still Chairman of the Board so he's able to help with a lot of this communication to stakeholders that he's have relationships with, like government officials. So that's been very helpful. And look, we're fortunate to have a healthy balance sheet going into this thing so we could focus on playing -- on our employees and our key stakeholders and playing offense. So in many ways, the crisis, like I said, it's forced me to be more decisive than maybe otherwise would have been. Maybe I would have been a little more tentative. I don't have a choice now. And so I feel like the kind of the transition period has accelerated, and for better, for worse, I feel more comfortable in the job than I otherwise would have. So a lot of bad things have happened because of COVID-19. In terms of -- first and foremost is the impact on people's health, in our economy and Medtronic's financials. But there are some -- so there have been some benefits which I'm sure we'll get to throughout the day here.

Yes, yes. So let's stay big picture for a little bit before we get to some of the recovery questions that everybody wants to know about and just ask you -- it's been a few months now. And so just thinking about your medium-range plan, the next 3 years. What's changing so far in your strategy as a result of COVID? Is there anything that's evolved for you?

I think even like immediate and over the next couple of years as well would be this whole -- this concept of remote and virtual capabilities, so remote -- like for us, remote case support. So today, as you know, our reps are in the hospital and in the OR supporting the procedure. Can you provide that level of service -- because the hospitals and the physicians want the service, but can you provide it remotely and there's technology solutions for that? And then remote device management, so like implantable cardiac devices. Can you do -- device checks that are, in some cases, quarterly, can you do those remotely so the patient doesn't have to come in to the hospital? Can you do remote patient management in general beyond the devices? Can you do high-quality digital medical education, so do that virtually? So this whole concept of, we're calling it, remote everything, I feel that's like an irreversible trend. And it's something that -- it's always been a key element of our strategy, but I think we're accelerating it. And we're fortunate though because our -- particularly in our Cardiac Rhythm business, we have a number of product launches. So there's a timely convergence of our product launches and those features around distance programming and remote programming and remote patient management. All these features that these products have is coming out at a time when hospitals and physicians are valuing them most. So I think this is an area where Medtronic -- we are talking to other technology companies outside of the medtech space because I do think there'll be a convergence of digital technology in the medtech. And we're -- one of the benefits of being big and having a good reputation is these partner -- these companies are willing to partner with us and try new things. And so I think this is an area we'll be investing in at the company level as well as bottoms-up at the business unit level.

Okay. And I'd probably get back to a couple of those things, but taking a different angle on just how things might evolve for you as a company. From manufacturing and a supply chain perspective, we've actually gone through the tariffs now and now the virus. Does Medtronic need to evolve towards regionalization or even domestication of the supply chain?

So we got a -- back in Hurricane Maria a few years ago, we learned that we were too concentrated in certain areas of our supply chain and our manufacturing, and that was a real wake-up call. I mean it hit Medtronic maybe harder than other companies because of this concentration, and so we started to rethink the whole balance between growth and efficiency and resiliency. And resiliency kind of went up in our calculation in terms of importance. And so we started putting together business continuity plans and going away from single-source suppliers, going -- or not going away from them, I should say, but providing secondary sources. And where we had single source, like we had a lot done in Puerto Rico, especially for our implantables businesses in cardiology and neuromodulation, we put business continuity plans in place and alternative sites. And that's something that you have to manage from a margin perspective because you lose a little bit of economies of scale but it helps your resiliency. So that has helped us a lot. The other area in terms of regionalization -- and that was more just kind of business continuity. But in terms of regionalization, that's another theme. And we are going down -- we've been going down that path, like for China, for example, for different reasons, but you get the same benefit. I mean I believe that the Chinese health care system, for example, and many other emerging market health care systems, but China being the biggest, the differences in the health care system are meaningful enough versus like the United States. And they're big enough of a market that the Chinese health care system, the physicians, the hospitals are asking for certain features that are customized to their health care system. So we've been working on our local innovation capabilities and localizing products there for that reason. Plus, the Chinese government provides a series of incentives and sticks as well to incent you one way or another to localize. And so that's the path we've been going down. Quite frankly, I'd like to accelerate that. It's another kind of 1- to 3-year like accelerate the investment in localization in China for multiple reasons, right? Because that's what -- I think that will be a competitive differentiator in that market. I think it also derisks us from certain shocks to the system and/or potential tensions between China -- trade tensions between China and the United States.

And then capital allocation, you mentioned that your -- you've got a pretty healthy balance sheet coming into the crisis. And we certainly thought 2020 we would see maybe more activity from you when the year started. Just given the market environment, how long realistically before you start thinking about doing deals? Is it too uncertain at this point of an environment for us to think that you could strike a deal? What's -- when is the right time? How much visibility do you need before we could actually see you do some form of M&A again?

No, I don't -- I think there's enough certainty in the environment, quite frankly. And there are -- we do feel the market is coming back. And we can debate the speed and what segments are coming back faster, what regions are coming back faster. But overall, the recovery is there and we believe the market is going to get back to pretty -- very healthy levels. And so it's less of a certainty thing. And if there is a second wave, we believe not just us but the whole health care ecosystem is better equipped and the economy is better equipped to handle it. So it's not -- we don't anticipate another shutdown of the economy like this. We don't anticipate another shutdown of elective procedures. It may slow the recovery down, but it won't shut it down. And so we feel there's enough certainty to do M&A. And like you said, our balance sheet is strong. And I still think innovation is going to get paid for and create value for the company. And so we're going to augment our organic innovation with inorganic innovation. And some of the assets -- you might think there'll be a lot of depressed assets, but the ones that we're interested in, most of them, their valuation has maintained. I mean they've gotten access to capital. But there are a couple that maybe the prices were out of range and now have come in range, and so we're taking another look at them.

Okay, okay. That's good color. So one more question before we get into some of the recovery updates, and that is bulk orders and just the discussion around the evolution that you've had prior to the crisis and now into the crisis. So obviously, there's this long history across medtech for end-of-quarter bulk purchases. It's just -- it's not unique to Medtronic.

Right.

And so the big question, we get it from investors a lot, is why now, why Medtronic. I mean customers clearly like this for the leverage that they get. And how do you take that away from them and at the same time, differentiate yourself in a positive way versus your customers versus...

Well, we're not going to totally take it away, okay? I would say 30% or so -- maybe 25% to 30% of our quarter-end deals or bulk deals are customer pull, where they like buying that way, they like buying in bulk, they expect a certain discount from buying in bulk. But a large piece of this was Medtronic also pushing these in order to maintain a certain growth level or what have you. And I just think in certain segments of the company and with certain customers, it just got too big, and it impacted our ability to execute because there's a lot of logistics that have to happen at the end of the quarter. It makes it more difficult to really understand your market share position in these customers because that's a big focus area of mine, is pushing our team to focus on market share. It makes it harder to hold your reps accountable because when you go in and you're addressing what you think might be a performance issue, there's all this confusion around the bulks, the quarter-end deals. And so there's a lot of issues that, that caused us because it gotten to a certain level. And so our goal is not to sacrifice market share here. And our customers that want to buy this way, we'll continue to support them. But in doing that, we can eliminate quite a bit of these. And I think it's going to make for -- I know it's going to make for a healthier business. And I think I mentioned this publicly before. When I mentioned this on the Q3 -- our fiscal Q3 earnings call, I got a lot -- I got besieged with e-mails from reps saying thank you. I didn't even know our reps listened so that was a lesson. I didn't know that our reps listened to the earnings call. But apparently, they do because they're looking forward to it. And I think it's going to help us. And -- but we're not going to give up market share for this. We could still bring this down quite a bit and not -- we won't lose share.

But you had to give up something, right? I mean it just -- the comment about the reps, too, I mean, it's challenging for them, I'm sure, because of the pressure on them, but that's the leverage that the other side has. So is it just not material enough what you're giving up, whether it's price or something that -- okay. All right. So let's go to the recovery. You set expectations for Q1 -- your fiscal Q1 to be lower than 4Q for you. Many medtech companies that are talking about procedure recovery continuing ahead of plan all the way through their latest updates, which -- conferences up to last week. I think you've indicated that if the early May trends you saw were to persist, you'd be looking for better results than what you guided to. That seems pretty intuitive. How much can you say about May and early June procedure recovery versus what you anticipated?

I would say that they've continued to outpace what we anticipated pretty much across the board. There are some segments that are more in line with what we've anticipated. But our cardiovascular businesses, parts of our neuroscience businesses, including spine, have outpaced what we thought. And so I'd provide an update and say, look, instead of Q1 being worse than our Q4, I'd say that it should be in line and -- with Q4. And look, if these trends consider, it can continue to go up. But the trends we saw in early May, which we talked about in our earnings call, have continued and, in some cases, even improved. And again, it's not totally across the board. It tends to make sense with emergent procedures versus more deferrable procedures, although spine, I got to admit, surprised us a little bit. That is doing much better. And it's hard for us to determine also where we're taking share and how much is the recovery because our Cardiac Rhythm business has a lot of momentum with their ICD launches that have the remote technology that I mentioned. And our spine business continues to build momentum just in general with robotics and everything. But yes, things are -- things continue to do better than what we had thought.

Yes. That's good news and good to hear. Let's talk about the regions maybe. Let's focus on the U.S. first, and then we'll come back to Europe and maybe Asia. And in the U.S., I thought what we could do is talk a little bit about high-risk patients in particular coming back to the health care system. We still -- we're also thinking about a recovery from a trough, but at the same time, the CDC released data last week that emergency department visits are still down 26% last week of May. Psychologically, that tells us something, I suspect, about high-risk patients and how they're interacting with the health care system, the new patient funnel. I'm curious in particular what you're hearing about new patients coming back to clinics and getting into the referral funnel for procedures. So it's a different way of asking is the recovery that we're seeing now mainly folks that have deferred coming back? Or are you more confident about where you might have expected new patients coming back into the clinic as a rate as well?

Yes. It's hard to tell exactly, but you're clearly seeing, in addition to this bolus of patients that have put off their care for several months now or several weeks at least, they're moving through this. They're going into the health care system. And the hospitals have figured out a way to maintain a safe environment, social distancing and whatnot, and still be pretty productive. And so I think that's what we're seeing. But in addition to that, clearly, patients are going back into -- new patients are going back into the queue. So it's a mix of both. What we're trying to figure out now is once this bolus of, I'll call them, more desperate patients gets through, does the -- do we see a step down and then a recovery from there or do we just keep going because new patients are going in. And I just talked to -- I'm talking -- one benefit of Zoom and all this and less travel, I'm talking to customers a lot more. And so I got to figure out how to keep that going because I'm learning a lot, and I think it's helping them, it's helping us. And it's not just me, it's our whole leadership team. But look, they're -- when they're talking to patients, they're saying, look, if you put off scheduling, it could be a while. Patients -- they're telling me patients are entering the queue, but it's hard to quantify it at this point. So because of that, we're more bullish than we were even a couple -- like 2, 3 weeks ago.

Okay. And I'm just curious. If we take that bullish comment, if we think about elective patients in particular against high risk, could you envision how these elective procedures coming back to 100% of normal before a vaccine or treatment is available?

Most of them, yes. Most of them, yes. I think that what we're seeing and what we're hearing from hospitals -- I mean look, they're working aggressively, and we're partnering with them, with medical societies as well. We just launched a program with American Heart Association regarding coronary procedures and stroke and things like that. There's a lot of creativity and effort going in to build up patient confidence. And so yes, I think that even without a vaccine -- now it's different than the office, right? People going back -- like you and I and our colleagues going back into the office, I think there's a lot of -- a number of people that's saying that companies and local governments will continue to hold back normal activity in society until there's a vaccine. But I think -- I do feel like their health care, you'll get back to fairly normal. There are some procedures, for example, that have a more challenging referral path like bariatric procedures. We participate in those. And before you get a bariatric procedure, there's all kinds of activity, psychological work that needs to be done and nutritional guidance that needs to be done, and some of that can be done via telemedicine. But those longer referral pathways, I think, are going to -- maybe those don't come fully back until the vaccine, but the lion's share of them I think will actually.

So let's touch on hospital CapEx in the U.S. before we move to Europe. And maybe just remind people generally what capital is as a percent of total Medtronic. And a key question here is just how you're thinking about the recovery in capital versus what you just described for procedures and what you're expecting for procedures.

So for us, we do expect capital to lag a little bit, okay, the rest of our business. It's about 10% of our -- let me check. It's 10% of our overall revenue. And it's mainly in our -- today, a lot of it's in RTG and our neuroscience business units. And -- but I -- it might -- it will lag our more emergent procedures. But I wouldn't lump that in with like general capital equipment, like general imaging equipment and things like that because the benefit we have is our capital is tied to profitable procedures. So we don't -- we're not a general capital equipment provider like GE, Siemens or Philips. We're more very specialized imaging, navigation, robotics that are tied to specific -- integrated into specific procedures, and typically, our products work better with this capital equipment. And that's why we're in that business, is to enhance the procedure. And they -- what we're hearing and what we anticipate is that they will not -- they won't dip down as far as maybe some of these other players that don't have such a clear line of sight to a reimbursed procedure as we do. Okay? And so the other thing that we'll do -- because there's a linkage with the procedure and the consumable products that we sell, we have different business models that will enhance this, and we'll use our balance sheet as well. This is one of the ways, I think, we'll use our balance sheet, to help our customers get through this to the extent their capital budgets are constrained.

And we'll get to robotics, hopefully, in a few minutes and talk a little bit more about this, but just sticking with the recovery kind of theme. In Europe, you obviously weren't impacted as bad, but the numbers were still pretty -- down a lot, 20% in May, I believe. Has that -- have you -- your comments previously about procedure recovery, does that apply to Europe as well? Is that recovering faster than what you expected?

It is. I'd say Europe and U.S. in particular are the 2 that are coming back faster. China has been a steady -- more of a steady recovery. And I would say, compared to initial thinking -- because, remember, this started in China a lot sooner, and compared to maybe my initial -- our initial thinking back in the, I'll call it, January time frame, China has gone a little slower. But since -- it's been on a steady recovery since then. I think we underestimated and didn't fully understand some of the social distancing and the quarantining requirements. The way the Chinese health care system is set up, look, basically, the more advanced procedures are done in these Tier 1 cities. So if you're going to go to Beijing for a procedure from an outlying rural city, you have to self-quarantine for 2 weeks afterwards. And so it's just -- and plus, it's just -- and plus in China, they put maybe 4 patients to a room, and now it's only 1 because of social distancing. So it's impacted their productivity, and it's a patient hassle factor of having to self-quarantine. So it's been more of a steady increase there. But Europe -- but nothing surprising over the last month or 2. It's been steady. And then Europe and U.S., both faster than we anticipated.

Okay. Just one category-specific comment, and then we'll move on. TAVR is obviously just something that investors care a lot about. So I'm just curious how that fits into what you described. Has that -- it didn't seem to decline as much as some other categories, but just how do you think about that recovery versus your comments? And then looking forward, is TAVR one of those referral patterns that should recover fast, age-related as well and high-risk patients, but at the same time, a very necessary procedure? Just how are you thinking about that recovery versus, broadly, the comments you made about procedures for Medtronic?

Well, look, the hospitals are working through their already referred patients. And we're seeing, again, there, too, patients entering the referral pathway. And so I wouldn't put this on the fastest recovery. It's more in the middle to fast. And we have a couple of things factoring in here, right? So we've got the data that we talked about at ACC, and that's helping us. We've got a bunch of new reps that -- because, if you recall, we didn't -- we underestimated, I think, the amount of reps we would need for this as the low-risk indication came to be. And so those reps are now getting -- gone through their training, they're hitting the market. Plus, we have the -- all the hemodynamic data, the information that came out at ACC. So that's helped us as well. So I would put the recovery on TAVR to be somewhere between the medium and the fast, probably closer to the medium side of things. And we're seeing some other tailwinds relative to like our Q3 performance.

Okay. Let's go back to the regions, for a second, I didn't ask before. Obviously, Latin America and Brazil in particular is a developing story since the last time we talked. Do you want to just remind people what percent of revenues Latin America is for you guys? And just color on developments there. Is that an area that you're getting more concerned about? Or what's the impact to Medtronic?

It's not huge. I mean it's 3% of our revenue, Latin America, and I think Brazil is roughly like 1/3 of that. And so clearly, it is in more the heat of the -- or the peak, if you will, of the pandemic impact, and -- but we're continuing to work with our customers and our team down there. But it is relatively small for us.

Okay, okay. So one of the things -- we're obviously encouraged to hear everything you said. Hopefully, we'll hear that throughout the day in terms of the recovery. But we're all thinking about the uncertainties of what could happen in the second half of the calendar year. So you guys, I'm sure, look at all kinds of scenarios, and I'm curious what the downside case looks like for you. So you're obviously looking at some of those uncertainties as possible, so whether we think about that as infection rates rising, what have you, in the U.S. and Europe, again, in the fall. Can you just talk through your preparation for a downside case and what incremental actions you would take as a management team if that were to develop?

Well, I mean, first, we learned a lot from the first go around here and so has the health care system. So if there is a "second wave," like I said earlier, I don't -- I think everybody, the hospitals, physicians, industry, patients are better equipped to deal with it. And I don't anticipate a shutdown again. And our approach would be largely the same. I mean besides the lessons learned, which I think will make it more efficient, we want to continue -- we have -- look, we have a pretty healthy product cadence coming, hitting the market now. And we've been working on this for a number of years, and the team is focused on making it count, making it count and driving incremental share for us. And so I want to keep our team focused on that, keep -- all the way from operations in terms of making sure that the manufacturing plants are opened up and running smoothly to our distribution centers, through our sales team, that they can focus on the customer. And then working with customers on -- because the other thing that we're preparing for here is customers have to do more with less. I mean -- and that means less vendors. I mean they just can't understand like kind of "audit" so many vendors coming in and out of the hospital. And so you have to work with them and make sure your reps are tested and they understand the protocols. And so the safety is a big deal, and they just are more careful about what vendors they're going to let in. And so this is an opportunity for companies like Medtronic, that, one, we have the scale and the breadth of portfolio; but two, over this crisis, we've been able to work with them proactively versus -- our reps versus having to worry about their jobs or whatnot. And so I would largely take that approach. Now the other thing that we'll constantly look at here is expenses. If we think there's -- we are having contingency plans. If we're caught by surprise in this and we need to kind of rightsize our expenses, we'll do that. And we've got experience from the Covidien acquisition. That integration, I personally was involved there, taking out over $1 billion of cost in a way that you can keep the organization going. So I think we're putting those contingency plans in place. But our thinking right now is that this is an opportunity for us to -- even though revenue is lower than -- and EPS is lower than I've ever thought it would get, it is -- we do think it's coming back, and it's an opportunity for us to change our competitive -- improve our competitive positioning.

Okay. Let's talk about a couple of product categories that folks are interested in, the surgical robot obviously being towards the top of the list of exciting new product opportunities you have. What I'd like to do is just first kind of make it clear what the most recent delay was about. Is this all about COVID related? Or is this also an issue around software? And if so, how much more can you tell us about the challenges as software has been something that has come up in prior delays as well, about just the challenges this time around as it relates to software? And we all get this is a very complex system, but just would love a little bit more color on what's going on specifically with the delay.

Yes. The software -- again, we're just addressing head on the software delays that we've experienced over the last year or so. Those, I would say, we believe, are behind us now. And I can see -- I just had a review. And this is an area that I've asked Omar because, if you recall, Omar is an engineer by training and is very good at this project management, and he gets a lot of energy from this. But he's working with Bob White and our robot team on a project basis. And they -- I was with those guys the other day, and they've showed me the -- you could see where -- as we are burning down software risk, there's a graph. The lines weren't going down. The risk wasn't going down for a number of months earlier in 2019, which caused delay. But it's been a steady reduction of the risk. And we've gotten over several internal hurdles here, milestones, if you will, in our development process and are feeling very good that the software issues, which had been the ones that have been causing delays because it is, like you said, a complicated system and we want to make sure we get it right. So we do think those are behind us, and now we're into this preclinical testing. And unfortunately, the preclinical and the clinical work is -- and that tends to involve more face-to-face and bringing people together, including third-party physicians, not just employees. That is the primary delay here and, I hate to say it, the most recent. I mean I'm going to just own it, that we've -- this robot, we've had the delays on and underclub some of the development requirements. That's -- the legacy Covidien, this is the biggest R&D program they've ever taken on, and it is very complicated. So -- but that being said, we're feeling good about it and excited with this clinical work going. But that is really the bulk of the delay. And it was also exacerbated a little bit by the fact that a lot of this work is up in the Northeast, in the Boston area, where coronavirus and the restrictions were much tighter than like what we were experiencing in the Midwest here. So -- but that's how I'd provide the color. We feel much better. Not that we didn't feel good before, it just wasn't certain. And we're feeling -- you're never 100% until it's -- you see it out there working on patients, but feeling pretty good about things now.

Do you have enough visibility to say -- kind of like you did prior to the crisis, we all had kind of a sense of timing for CE marking at least and action with the FDA. Are you able to say today what are the time lines we should be expecting for...

We haven't really changed those time lines. I was just looking at these. We really haven't changed. I think we said on our third quarter earnings call that despite some of the delays, we felt like we would be able to hit our regulatory time frames. And so we haven't updated those yet because of the preclinical work. So we haven't moved them from that Q3 earnings call because when we give you new dates, I want to make sure that we have a high degree of confidence, and we'd love to just see how effective we are in this COVID time period before giving you dates on that.

Okay. We just have a minute left. Let's just hit Diabetes. It's another area where people are excited about some of the products you've got coming. And the 780G is kind of maybe most imminent in terms of impact. So here too in -- as best you can in a minute, apologize for that, just give us a sense of what exactly happened there to cause a little bit of that delay and what you can tell us about timing of getting the 780G out?

Well, we'll be going through the 780G data this week at ADA and as well as the CE mark data, and we just got CE mark in Europe. And so we'll be talking about it this week at ADA. And the reason we decided to accelerate the 770G is really there was a lot of -- quite frankly, a lot of pressure to get something out there for that younger age range. And it does have this -- you're basically getting the 780G device without some of the algorithms, which we can now do kind of over-the-air updates, so in order to get this out there to serve a certain younger patient cohort. As you know, the diabetes patients are pretty vocal. And so we wanted to take care of that because the 780G data, we just weren't ready. So we'll talk about that this week. But we're excited about this. We think we've got the best clinical outcomes you're going to get here, and I feel good about where that -- where the whole team is headed with Sean Salmon there running that business. He's probably, if not the best, one of our top product development guys in the company.

Great. Well, we're just out of time. And so Geoff, I want to just again thank you for your time, for taking the time to be with us today. I know it's busy out there. And best of luck to you today, and we'll talk to you soon. Everybody else, we'll talk to you in a few in the next presentation.

Yes. Thanks, Amit. Thanks, everybody. This has been fun. Thank you.

Take care, Geoff.

Bye-bye.