Meghmani Organics Limited (MOL.NS) Q3 FY2026 Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Ladies and gentlemen, good day, and welcome to Meghmani Organic Limited Q3 FY '26 Earnings Conference Call hosted by Arihant Capital [Operator Instructions] Please note that this conference is being recorded. I would now hand the conference over to Mr. Ayush Chaturvedi from Arihant Capital. Thank you, and over to you.

Thank you. Good afternoon, everyone. We thank Meghmani Organics' management for providing us the opportunity to host the company's Q3 earnings call. From the management, we have today Mr. Ankit Patel, Chairman and Managing Director; Mr. G.S Chahal, Chief Financial Officer; and Mr. Nishant Vyas, Investor Relations. Without taking further time, I would like to invite Mr. Patel for his opening remarks. And following that, we can proceed to the Q&A. Over to you, sir.

Thank you, Ayushji. Good afternoon, everyone, and thank you for joining us on our quarter 3 FY '26 earnings call. I believe you have got a chance to go through the financial results and investor presentation uploaded on the stock exchanges and the website. Broadly, our export volume in the quarter 3 are generally softer as overseas customers follow calendar year. In quarter 3 FY '26, export volume witnessed additional pressure due to ongoing uncertainty around U.S. trade policy. This uncertainty has not only impacted demand from the U.S. market, but also led to softer demand across other export geographies. Raw material prices remained broadly stable and the price realization remained largely stagnant. On a stand-alone basis, in quarter 3 FY '26, revenue stood at INR 485 crores and our EBITDA stood at INR 51 crores. Profit after tax for the quarter stood at INR 22 crores. EBITDA margin on a stand-alone basis stood at 10.6%. If we talk about the revenue mix in quarter 3 FY '26, Crop Protection constitutes about 79% of the total revenue, while the balance 21% comes from the Pigment segment. Now let us look at our segment-wise performance in quarter 3 FY '26. In Crop Protection segment, the production stood at approximately 9,283 metric tons and the capacity utilization for the segment stood at 66%. Revenue and EBITDA for the segment stood at INR 382 crores and INR 58 crores, respectively. EBITDA margin for the segment stood at about 15.3%. For Pigment segment, production stood at about 3,144 metric tons and the capacity utilization for the segment stood at about 38%. The segment reported the revenue and EBITDA of INR 103 crores and INR 0.7 crores, respectively. For the 9 months ended 31st December, revenue stood at INR 1,635 crores compared to INR 1,502 crores in the corresponding previous year. EBITDA grew by 75% on a year-on-year basis to INR 203 crores compared to the EBITDA of INR 116 crores in the corresponding previous year. In our Crop Nutrition segment, alongside ongoing field trials across few countries, we are actively developing new international markets for Meghmani Nano Urea. Sample consignment are currently being dispatched for further field evaluation. Parallelly, we are also expanding our product portfolio, which will further strengthen our market position. In titanium dioxide, profitability remained under pressure due to elevated raw material cost and the weaker price realization. The price realization was further impacted following the withdrawal of antidumping duty by the Finance Ministry. The DGTR has taken up the matter again and the new notification reimposing the antidumping duty is expected shortly. We anticipate raw material prices to normalize in coming quarters, which, along with the reimposition of antidumping duty should improve the market dynamics going forward. On a consolidated basis in quarter 3 FY '26, revenue stood at about INR 509 crores and our EBITDA stood at about INR 38 crores. EBITDA margin on consolidated basis stood at 7.4%. On 9 months basis, our consolidated revenue and EBITDA stood at INR 1,700 crores and INR 157 crores, respectively. And the profit after tax stood at INR 21 crores against the loss of INR 30 crores in the corresponding previous year. As of 31st December 2025, on a stand-alone basis, our total debt stands at INR 573 crores, comprising of INR 455 crores in short-term debt and INR 118 crores in long-term debt. Debt-to-equity ratio on a stand-alone basis stood at 0.33. On a consolidated basis, our total debt stands at INR 783 crores, which includes INR 464 crores in short-term debt and INR 319 crores in long-term debt. Debt-to-equity ratio on a consolidated basis stood at 0.51. Year-to-date, we have made a debt repayment of approximately INR 128 crores. So to conclude, while macroeconomic uncertainties posed near-term headwinds and impacted our quarterly performance, we remain confident in our long-term growth trajectory given our state-of-the-art infrastructure, plant compatibility, diversified product portfolio and strong geographic presence. With this, I hand over the call to the moderator to open the floor for the question and answers. Thank you.

[Operator Instructions] First question is from the line of Ankit Gupta from Bamboo Capital.

In this quarter, we have seen -- on the crop protection side, we've seen a decline in volumes of almost 14%. So if you can talk about that and what has been the reason for it? And is it primarily because of the U.S. tariffs, but the main competitor here again is China and they also have similar tariff as us.

Thank you, Ankitji. So particularly in the Crop Protection segment, yes, there has been drop in the volume in this quarter. Normally, we have seen this trend in the third quarter because typically globally, everyone follows the calendar year. And -- but still because of the tariff uncertainty, there has been reduction in the volume in the U.S. market. And also, there is an indirect effect of the tariff on the other markets as well. So we see that is one of the major reasons. And there is a demand in the market. At the same time, the inventory at the customer level is also not very high. It is at moderate level. So going forward, we see the demand should improve.

Despite the tariffs continuing, you see improvement in demand is what we can say there or...

So particularly from the U.S. market point of view, now the customer has become very pragmatic, and they are buying the material as and when they need and again, in a small, small quantity, not in a big volume to avoid any kind of tariff-related uncertainty. So let's hope that there is a good trade deal between India and U.S., which will help Indian exporters. But if at all, it doesn't happen, then also based on the demand, there will be improvement.

Okay. And on the TiO2 side, you have said that the ADD has been withdrawn on the imports and then there has been appeal. So can you elaborate on that? There's hardly been any time since this ADD was imposed and now it has been withdrawn?

Yes. So the antidumping was imposed in the last year in the year of 2025, somewhere in the month of May, middle of May. Following that, the order was challenged by the Paint Association of India, Indian Paint Association, IPA, in Kolkata High Court. And in that court case, it was not represented properly somewhere and the court order came in the favor of Paint Association that there was a lapse in the -- following the process of antidumping duty and the antidumping got withdrawn and DGTR accepted the order rather than challenging it because if you challenge it, then it will be a very long process. There will be a lot of rounds. Rather than doing that, DGTR accepted the order and worked on the lapses of the process, antidumping imposition process. And that has already been done. And now we are awaiting for the new order for the antidumping duty from DGTR side. The work has been already done by DGTR now. So very soon, we should get the order. Following the DGTR order, there will be order from the Finance Ministry. So again, this is a matter of a few months now.

The next question is from the line of Madhur Rathi from Counter Cyclical Investments.

Sir, if I look at our stand-alone and the consolidated revenue from our Pigment segment, sir, we made incremental revenue of INR 20 crores and we booked the EBIT loss of INR 20 crores. Sir, so from a capital allocation perspective, sir, this TiO2 business doesn't seem to be operating at any kind of profitability for us. So if you could just help us understand regarding this segment?

So Madhuji, as a titanium dioxide as a segment, it is one of the very good product. Indian market is close to 5 lakh tonnes. And going forward, this segment is growing significantly because in India, our domestic market is also growing significantly. So we believe that this is a good product, but it's only the time which has created the problem because of the antidumping duty reversal. At the same time, the key raw material prices have shot up drastically, unrealistically. And in near term, again, there will be the imposition of antidumping duty. And we believe that the raw material prices should come back to the normal in the next few quarters. And that will bring the project back on track. So yes, there has been a loss coming on titanium dioxide as a business, and we have been working and we have been applying all different strategy to come out of it.

Sir, but if I -- sir, so is it prudent to operate such a business where incremental loss is equal to the incremental revenue? So for this quarter, we made an incremental revenue of INR 21 crores. We made a loss of INR 21 crores on this business, sir. So till the time, the dynamics or the business either from the antidumping duty or from the raw material side, sir, can't we just shut down this business for the time being and avoid losses?

Yes, Madhuji, for the time being, we have taken shutdown of the plant, looking at the market condition to reduce the loss.

Okay. Got it. Sir, again, on this titanium dioxide, sir, we did a CapEx of INR 600 crores. Working capital is additional. And we have incurred a total loss of around INR 225 crores on this titanium dioxide and more is to come. So now if we add this INR 600 crores plus INR 225 crores, so INR 825 crores we have already put here. Now this plant will even in the best case scenario, make a INR 70 crore EBITDA. So what kind of return on capital can be expected? I mean the downside, every quarter, we see the downside, it is like INR 30 crore quarterly loss and upside anyway is a single-digit return on capital, sir. So what's the wisdom of just carrying on with this that project?

Madhuji, as I mentioned, this is one of the very good projects as far as the market condition is there, but only -- only the current scenario is not the right. And yes, we invested more money into it, looking at the future capacity expansion keeping in mind. So by doing further very small CapEx, we can increase the capacity, looking at the future market condition. But currently, the things what we planned from the antidumping point of view, from the raw material point of view, that is not coming in our favor, and that is creating a problem. It has been a tough time for the company as well. And no promoter or no company would like to shut down any manufacturing plant. But it is very tough to do it and this is kind of a very long process manufacturing plant where we have taken the shutdown looking at the current market condition point of view. And we'll restart only once the market conditions are reasonably okay or in our favor. So this will help to reduce the loss.

Right. So what kind of losses can be expected if the plant remains shut for the full quarter, then what is the expected loss?

So definitely, there will be some amount of loss because there is some fixed overheads, manpower costs, certain things are already there, basing infrastructure point of view, but it will reduce drastically.

Sir, also, if we operate at full capacity utilization across all our segments, so what kind of revenues can we generate?

Across all the segments?

Yes. For example, in agrochem, what is the peak revenue that we can generate in pigments and in titanium dioxide separately?

So the kind of the infrastructure, what we have created in the agrochemical segment, that can create revenue of close to INR 2,500 crores in total. In the pigment, we already have the capacity, which can go up to INR 700 crores to INR 750 crores. And in titanium dioxide, again, if we run at the current capacity, which is 16,800 tonnes, so with that and by doing some small bottleneck changes, we can take the capacity to nearly almost double capacity, we can take it. And by doing that, that can generate revenue optimally based on the market price, the revenue will be there. But the current market price due to no antidumping duty, the prices have gone down drastically. If we consider on an average INR 200 price, then also it can generate revenue of close to INR 650 crores -- sorry, about INR 300 crores, INR 400 crores.

So basically, INR 400 crores in titanium dioxide from doubling capacity. So otherwise, current capacity would be INR 200 crores, and that too on some hypothetical realization when antidumping comes and I mean, Chinese can still lower the prices. I mean the other titanium dioxide players are saying that until Chinese economy revives and paint demand revives. So basically, construction has to revive in China for titanium dioxide prices to go up. So I mean...

Madhuji, the INR 350 crores to INR 400 crores revenue, which I mentioned was based on the first phase only. Second phase, based on the expansion, it can increase further revenue.

Right. And sir, in agrochem, how far is in percentage terms from our steady-state average realization, how far are we below from average realizations? Are we 5%, 10%? Like any ballpark number?

I'm sorry, can you repeat your question?

Sir, the agrochem realizations today, how much below the average realizations are there today in terms of percentage?

See, here, there are various products in agrochemical segment. We normally don't calculate on product to product. It is product mix. So it is difficult to calculate the average realization.

Okay. So if we talk about margins, what kind of steady-state operating margin in each of these 3 divisions in -- once the situation improves, shareholders can expect?

In the agrochemical segment, on an average, industry generates EBITDA margin of 15% to 17%. And we will maintain that kind of profitability in this range. In the Pigment segment, currently, it is under a lot of pressure. Going forward, we have been improving on operations. We believe to take our EBITDA margin close to 8% to 9%. In titanium dioxide, it can -- on titanium dioxide, on an average, in the reasonable market condition point of view, it should generate about 17% to 20% EBITDA margin.

And sir, in your best judgment, by when can we reach these kind of margins in agrochem, we are not too far away from the steady-state margins in pigment as well as in titanium dioxide, in your best judgment, when do you foresee everything considered us reaching steady-state margins?

So Madhuji, already -- as you already mentioned in agrochemical segment, which is almost 80% revenue generating, we are almost near to the -- what we have been talking right now. In the pigment is the next target. We have been taking a lot of corrective actions in the operation level to improve the profitability. We believe somewhere from the first quarter onwards, we will see the numbers of improvement in the Pigment segment. In titanium dioxide, we need to wait for the antidumping duty as well as for the raw material prices to get normalized. We believe it will take nearly 2 more quarters for both the things to happen.

Sir, in titanium dioxide, the raw materials are already -- I mean, they are down. I mean, if you see Kochi Mineral rutile, the synthetic rutile prices are at multiyear lows. So I'm not able to understand how raw material prices are high.

One of the key raw material is sulfuric acid. Sulfuric acid price used to be in the range of INR 4 to INR 5. Now it is in the range of more than INR 15 to INR 18. So that is -- and that is getting used substantially in a huge volume. So that is impacting a lot.

And sir, what would be our total CapEx requirement for the next 2, 3 years?

For the next -- at least for the next 2 years, there is not going to be any significant CapEx. Only routine minor CapEx is going to be there for some debottlenecks or some maintenance CapEx.

And sir, any thoughts on demerger, sir, you told us some time back that there is no correlation or no synergy between pigments and agrochem and both are totally independent sales force infrastructure, manufacturing. So any thoughts on demerger?

As of now, no, but we have been taking advice from a few people. But as of now, no.

The next question is from the line of Nipun Sharma from VLS Finance.

So I want to ask about the Crop Protection segment. So first of all, can you provide me the bifurcation for technicals and formulations for crop protection, sir?

Yes. Nipunji, so we have been focusing more and more on the formulation now to improve our profitability and the growth point of view. So here on, there has been improvement and increase in the formulation business. And so as of now, if we consider about 60% is the technical and about 40% is the formulation.

Okay. So are there any plans for increasing the contribution from formulations considering they are of high margins, sir, relatively?

Yes. So even going forward, we would like to increase more volume from the formulation side. And definitely, formulation has got a little better profitability. So that will help in improving the profitability further.

Okay. And one more question from the segment is that as I have seen from the investor presentation, the EBITDA as well as the profitability margins for 9 months for stand-alone results, they have reduced. So is there any reason behind this apart from the U.S. tariff for Crop Protection segment? Or is there any other reason for that?

One of the main reasons is the U.S. tariff. So that is impacting a lot, and the sales is under pressure because of that. And Europe, particularly from the pigment market point of view, European economy is also not doing good. So that is impacting the pigment business also.

Okay. Understood. So sir, I wanted to ask you that you said that from first quarter of '27, pigment segment would be having a recovery and you will start to see improvement from them. So can you elaborate more on that? I mean what -- I mean, how the improvement would happen for pigment? Because as far as I can see, pigment has been stagnant for quite some time.

Yes. So Nipunji, there are -- so the market condition is not in our hand. The operation, which is in our hand, we have been working on it. So to reduce the energy cost, particularly the power, electricity and the steam cost, we have been taking a lot of corrective actions. We have been modifying the plant and improving our process that will improve the consumption of the electricity and the steam, which will reduce the manufacturing cost. At the same time, we have been rationalizing and doing some small, small automation, which -- by which we want to reduce the manpower -- overall manpower also. So that is also going to work. At the same time, we have gone for the group captive power policy, which is the renewable power, which will come -- that power will start somewhere from the second or third quarter onwards in the next financial year, which will further help to reduce the electricity cost. And it will also help to work towards our aim to reduce overall our burden on the fossil fuel and focus more on the renewable energy. So by doing that, I think by next year end, we will be reaching close to 60% of our requirement will be renewable energy.

Okay. Okay. Understood, sir. Understood. And one last question from titanium dioxide part. So as I have heard, I may be wrong because after the DGTR when Indian Paint Association, they challenged the ADD on titanium dioxide, and then it was temporarily removed, I believe. So because of that, I believe that a lot of companies did stack a lot of TiO2 from China at low prices. So when do you think that it will liquidate?

So that is the problem, Nipunji. Somehow people in India challenge the government here, the paint association challenged the DGTR -- now we believe that they worked very hard for more than 1 year. And after doing all detailed investigation, the court order came against them. So they reworked on the process. And again, the reimposition of the antidumping duty is expected very, very soon. But in this period, in between period, again, the importation has taken place. And the volume is also reasonably good. So even after the antidumping imposition, it will take another 2 to 3 months at least to liquidate the inventory.

Okay. So the titanium dioxide segment will start to show improvement from the first quarter of financial year '27 or the second quarter, I mean, maximum by second quarter?

From second quarter onwards only, not before that.

The next question is from the line of Sunil Jain from Nirmal Bang Securities Private Limited.

Yes. Again, on titanium dioxide. So you said that you had taken the plant shutdown. So when it was taken, sir?

It was taken somewhere in the November end.

Okay. So the 1 month has gone in that?

Yes. So basically, what happened, these are the long process plant. We need to remove all the in-process material step by step by doing the maintenance and cleaning activity, we can shut down. If we don't do that, then it creates a major problem while restarting the plant, and it creates a problem in shelf life of the plant as well. So shutdown and restart is always a painful.

So we can assume like you had done around INR 20 crore EBIT loss in this plant. So it can come down to single digit, maybe less than INR 10 crores?

Yes.

Okay. And sir, second thing about the agrochemical. Agrochemical, we had shown weakness. So how much is in agrochemical export to the U.S. market?

It is close to 24%, 25%.

Okay. So because we had seen other agrochemical companies reporting comparatively better number and are indicating that there is an improvement in even some cases, prices also. So are we experiencing anything in that or still the products are different?

So company to company, the product range may vary and the geographies may vary. But as overall, as the agrochemical segment, as I mentioned, the year '25 started with a good hope. And even first quarters, you have seen the numbers, it were very much aligned. Somewhere after September, because of the tariff related once the Trump administration imposed 50% tariff on India, it got impacted drastically. And it affected not only the trend between India and U.S., particularly in our case, but in some other markets also, there were indirect effect. We believe that these things will be recovered from somewhere from the February, March onwards, we see the good things should start happening. And going forward, we see very good growth potential, particularly as a make money agrochemical division is concerned, we see very good growth potential.

So nothing seasonally down in the margin means you reached to almost around 18% and then down to 14%. So that was mainly because of the weakness. Otherwise, you would have maintained the margin...

Yes. So overall, on an average, we believe that we should be in the range of about 15% to 17%. Quarter-on-quarter, there may be some variation. But on an average yearly -- year as a whole, there will be 15% to 17% EBITDA margin.

So we -- these were having some advantage on account of [indiscernible]. So is that advantage still there or no?

So that was related to the antidumping imposition in the U.S. on to woody manufacturer from China and India. So among all the manufacturers, Meghmani got the least antidumping duty. So we were having the advantage. But after that, the tariff came, which is significantly high. So ultimately, to whom we sell, the end customer is farmer. And if the farmer has to buy any commodity, any agrochemical having 50% extra cost, their agro commodity like corn, soybean, those prices are not going up to that extent. So it is difficult for them to absorb such kind of price increase. So either they reduce the consumption or they go for some other product where there is a less cost. So there is a lot of volatility.

Okay. Great. And sir, last question regarding Nano Urea. So we are trying for -- with the sampling and all in the international market. So any breakthrough, any firm order we had supplied or it's all up till now sampling only is going on?

Positively, there has been some commercial order has already started taking place in a few markets. And a lot of positive trials result has already come. So we expect in the year of '26, '27, there will be further more improvement in the export orders in several other markets. So there is a lot of positivity in different markets about this product.

Sir, any target you can give on the Nano Urea export sales basically, which you may achieve in the next year?

Sunilji, it is a little early because for us, also, it's a new product. And there are certain typically new products. So sometimes we get the challenges in different market, which is -- we have never seen the first mover. So -- but as far as the product is concerned, the results are good. The customer sentiments are positive. And we need to just click the product with the regulatory approval.

[Operator Instructions] The next question is from the line of Rohit Sinha from Sunidhi Securities.

So most of my questions are already answered. Just a couple from my side. One is, obviously, now if we look at the business, I think Crop Protection and Nano Urea are the 2 segments which are basically driving the growth for us. So in Nano Urea, what kind of margin right now we are making? And in the best case, what kind of EBITDA margin we can expect?

So in the case of Nano Urea, the margins are in the range of about 20% to 22%.

Okay. It can go up once the volume increase or it will remain more or less in similar range?

Yes. If the volume will increase, then there will be a certain percentage improvement in the profitability.

Got it. And in Crop Protection, as you said that 15% to 17% kind of margin is what we are expecting in the best case. So with our MPP plant, first of all, what kind of utilization we have reached in the MPP side? And I mean, I believe that MPP volume growth or utilization growth will be the key to expand our margins further. So how we are shaped in that segment?

So in agrochemical segment, the multipurpose plant, which we did the CapEx is improving the utilization year-on-year basis. So this year, there has been a reasonably good amount of utilization. And next year, we believe it will even further increase. And those are relatively new products. And for those new products also, we have been doing now formulation development activity. In certain markets, we have already got formulation approvals. So that will add to sell more formulation product, and that will help to utilize the MPP plant in a better way by -- and that will help to improve the profitability as a segment overall.

So can that lead to -- I mean, margin in excess of 18%, 19% or it will remain at 15%, 17% be a conservative number for us?

So Rohitji, our expectation would be always higher than the average market price and average market profitability. But in the current market dynamics, it is very difficult to give very high hope. So we would like to say that we will be in the range of 15% to 17%, and we'll -- we would definitely try to have a better profitability.

Sure. And sir, in TiO2 as the -- again, I mean, reinitiation has been, if at all done, I think it will take almost 6 months. So next 6 months, we would be shut down for our TiO2 site. Obviously, that would have some fixed cost till that time. And once we will be, if at all, recommissioning, that will also add some cost as the -- I mean, the initial phase, it will take some time to get it to that optimum level. So -- or would it be in a quicker note that once we restart, we can again touch up to the optimum level at a quick time or it will take a few months to reach to that? And I think if that all -- if that would be the case in more than 6 months, we will take to get some profitability in that side, if at all, that [indiscernible] comes into that.

So Rohitji, let me divide it into 2 parts. First of all, regarding the antidumping duty. Now DGTR has already did their work. The meeting, which has to be called for the industry representation that has already been over. Every company has made their representation and submitted their reply in physical format. So that has already been done. So I think very soon, we should get the final order from the DGTR. After DGTR comes up with a final order, then it will go to the Finance Ministry. And in a few days, again, the Finance Ministry should come up with the final order. So that is the case as far as the antidumping duty is concerned. As far as the restarting the plant is concerned, again, the key raw material, which is the sulfuric acid, that price has significantly increased. We hope that, that price should come down somewhere in the middle of this year by June, it should start coming down reasonably. And by that time, we also will start to -- we'll plan to restart the plant.

The next question is from the line of Nipun Sharma from VLS Finance.

So my one question is, sir, can you provide the revenue and margin bifurcation for your 4 segments?

Revenue and the margin for all the 4 segments. So in the third quarter, the Crop Protection segment did the revenue of INR 382 crores with the EBITDA of INR 58 crores. The Pigment segment did the revenue of INR 103 crores with the EBITDA of INR 0.7 crores. And for the Kilburn, we did the revenue of close to INR 19 crores with a negative EBITDA of INR 13 crores. And in the MCNL, which is the Crop Nutrition segment, we did the revenue of INR 5 crores with an EBITDA of negative INR 0.4 crores.

Okay. And you said that your current margin is around 20% to 22%. So why has the EBITDA margin for Nano Urea negative?

So currently, the utilization is at very, very low level. So there are a lot of fixed overheads for the plant. So we believe that once we utilize the plant at a reasonably good level, once we reach at about INR 10 crores, INR 12 crores revenue level, then it will have about 20% EBITDA margin.

Okay. And one last question, sir. Sir, can you comment upon the PAT for this quarter because it's negative. So I mean, is it expected for the fourth quarter as well? I mean what exactly was the reason for the negative PAT? Are these taxes or any other reason?

So the negative PAT on a consolidated basis is mainly on the account of the Kilburn Chemical.

Okay. So it was because of titanium dioxide?

Yes.

Okay, sir. And can you explain the tax effect as well, the tax has increased a little bit.

So there is no increase as far as the tax is concerned. So because in the stand-alone, it is a profit. So we have to provide our rate of tax is 25%. And certain provisions which are allowed based on the payment basis, so those are based before filing of the return, so you can claim. So like new provisions and all that. So due to that, it shows as a 28% because absolute number is low. Otherwise, it is -- rate of tax is 25%.

[Operator Instructions] The next question is from the line of [ Pravin Sharma ], an individual investor.

It has been a very long painful period as an investor in Meghmani Organics. My question is on this titanium dioxide, when the antidumping was introduced, it was around INR 43, INR 45 a kg, if I am correct. And it was there for quite a substantial period of time. And it was noticed and you pointed out in one of the con call that despite the ADD, Chinese actually reduced their prices further, and we continue to bleed. Now my question is on -- our hope actually hinges on this antidumping duty coming back. Now will this duty be much more or it's just a procedural lapse, which the DGTR is correcting and the prices, dumping duty will remain same? And assuming it will remain same or increase, what prevents Chinese from further reducing the prices? I mean it has been a drag for quite a considerable time of time and in a very painful period. It's an investment which has gone wrong, and I think we should all accept it. So I would like you to throw light on that.

So [ Pravinji ], as far as antidumping is concerned, so it was in the range of $460 to $610 depending on the different companies from China. So this was the procedural lapse, and that has been getting corrected. So as an industry, we have made the representation that even after the antidumping duty, there has been further reduction in the prices by the Chinese companies. But if we need to work on it, then it has to be completely different new process. So as an industry, we have decided to do it only after first, we get this basic, whatever was the earlier, $460 to $610. And then again, if the Chinese companies reduce the price, we need to collect the data for a certain period of time, let's say, a few months, a few quarters or months, year. And then we need to resubmit that they have further reduced the price. And again, based on the data analysis, there can be further increase in the antidumping duty. But...

We had noticed in the past period when the ADD was there, this INR 460 to INR 600, which corresponds to around INR 45, INR 50 a kg that they reduced the price much lower. And even then we were not profitable, correct?

So yes, at that time, because there were 2 reasons because there was a lot of channel inventory, which was not getting liquidated, so which took almost 3 months' time to get liquidated, which happened by somewhere in the August, September. And by that time, the order came against us again in the court. So that was the case.

So what are the prevailing prices of TiO2 in the market? And what is our cost of production ballpark?

So currently, we have stopped the production, as we mentioned. And currently, the price is ranging somewhere in the range of INR 170 to INR 180.

Okay. And on this agrochemical, if this tariff from the U.S. continues, what impact will it have on our revenues and margins? Because as you said that farmer will not buy end customer. So can this impact our margin?

So first of all, if the tariff continues in the U.S., typically, customer buying will go down drastically. So we have already started focusing on the other geographies and the other markets. And in the coming months and coming years, we expect good amount of revenue growth from the other markets other than the U.S. So if this tariff goes, then it will add extra benefit. If it remains, then also we have worked on the strategy to overcome it.

But apart from us and Chinese, there are no other suppliers. So I mean the end cost farmer is -- there is no other cheaper supplier to the -- a farmer cannot buy a cheap -- from a cheaper source ultimately. That is my understanding, correct?

Absolutely correct. So the customers, they are not ready to take risk because who will have the extra 50% burden on their inventory. So people are afraid that you never know that someday this person will remove the extra tariff. And if you have paid the duty and whether there will be reversal of the duty, whether they will get back the duty portion or they will not get back the duty portion. So even at the customer end, there is a lot of uncertainty. So they buy only as and when they need the material or they are confident of passing on to the customer, to the farmer. So it is going step by step.

Okay. And my last request is we should seriously consider demerger of agrochemicals segment. That is what I wanted to...

Thank you very much, [ Pravinbhai ] for your suggestion. We'll definitely consider it.

The next question is from the line of [ Anand Sharma ], an individual investor.

And I think most of the questions have been answered, but still I would like Mr. Ankit Patel to let us know when this court has passed this order for TiO2 antidumping duty. So that will help us to understand since how long we have been suffering and there was no proper disclosure from the company and I believe. So could you..

So the order was passed on somewhere 22nd September by the court. And then the Ministry -- Finance Ministry took action somewhere in December, 5th December.

And there was no further disclosure from the company and informing the investors about the same, I believe, isn't it?

I think it was there in the public forum. Everyone knew it.

I hope the company does well in the future. And I further hope that the new prices which come for the antidumping duty and the supply line should be cleared enough so that the company could do better in TiO2.

The next question is from the line of Madhur Rathi from Counter Cyclic Investments.

Sir, I wanted to understand, has there been any capacity closure in the blue or the green pigment in India?

There has been a few small, small players who has stopped manufacturing it.

Okay. So no major player has gone out of the market. Sir, what will -- okay, you mentioned that cost -- so what is the renewable cost reduction from the solar that you expect from next year?

I'm sorry, can you repeat your question?

Sir, the renewable power that we are expecting to commercialize in Q2 or Q3 of FY '27, what is the cost reduction expected from that?

So typically, the power which we get it from the grid, government, it is in the range of about INR 9 to INR 9.5 and the power which we'll be getting from the renewable source will be in the range of after adding all the expenditure, close to INR 5. So there will be per unit that will be saving of about INR 4 to INR 4.5.

And sir, what is the total amount of capacity of these renewable are we adding?

So it is close to 3.5 megawatt and the unit generation because there is a renewable energy, so there is no constant unit. It varies.

Right. Got it. Sir, can we manufacture Azo pigments from our current pigment capacity or that requires additional or altogether a different kind of a setup?

We need to create because this -- the setup, what we have it is for the green and blue pigments, and these are kind of a dedicated setup. If we want to convert into Azo, then some modification, new equipment has to be done. So it's better to do a new CapEx and a new plant. And even we have evaluated the Azo project, it is not making sense in the current market condition as well.

Got it. And sir, regarding sulfuric acid, sir, there was -- it was mentioned by some of our competitors, [ BMCC ] that with Kutch Copper commissioning its plant, the sulfuric acid would -- prices would reduce by a lot, and that was expected by this year-end. So why are we expecting it to be higher until the June of this year?

Madhurbhai, we are also waiting for the same thing that they should start increasing the copper production and the sulfuric acid price should come down. That is impacting every company, not just in TiO2, but sulfuric acid is one of the basic raw material, which is getting consumed in all the industry. So everyone is getting impacted of it and everyone is waiting that it should start coming down very soon, but it has not been happening. So from the industry expert when we speak, then people say that somewhere from the middle of this year, it should start coming down. That's what the feedback we have been getting. But you rightly mentioned, once the Adani's copper plant, which is Kutch Copper, once it gets stabilized, when they will have a good production, then there will be a huge amount of sulfuric acid coming into the market and which will help to reduce the price.

As there are no further questions from the participants, I now hand the conference over to the management for the closing comments. Over to you, sir.

On behalf of the management, we thank you for joining us today. We appreciate your trust and support on us. With this, we hope that we have been able to address most of your queries. In case of further queries, you may reach out to Mr. G.S. Chahal or Mr. Nishant Vyas, and they will connect with you offline. Thank you.

Thank you. On behalf of Arihant Capital, that concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us, and you may now disconnect your lines. Thank you.