National Australia Bank Limited (NAB) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Good morning, and welcome to National Australia Bank Limited's Annual General Meeting. I'm Louise Thomson, Group Company Secretary. Before commencing this Annual General Meeting, I would like to invite my colleague, Eveanne Liddle, to acknowledge the traditional owners of the land on which we are hosting today's meeting.

Thank you, Louise, for the introduction. Good morning, shareholders, NAB leadership and NAB people and anyone else joining the AGM today. As a First Nation, Central Arrernte and Luritja Pertame woman from Central Australia and Head of NAB's Indigenous Affairs, on behalf of the National Australia Bank, I would like to acknowledge the traditional custodians and owners of the lands of Melbourne, the Wurundjeri and Bunurong peoples of the Kulin Nation. This is a beautiful country, and we are grateful to be here. And we pay respect to your elders past, present and emerging. We would also like to pay respect to the traditional owners of all the lands that you are joining us from today. And in doing this, we acknowledge the continuing connections of all indigenous and First Nations peoples' traditional ownership of land, rights and their law. Thank you.

Thank you for your acknowledgment, Eveanne. We had hoped this year's AGM would be a physical meeting. While some restrictions have eased here in Victoria, there are still many uncertainties and risks regarding the pandemic. The health and well-being of our shareholders, colleagues and communities remain important to us, and we felt that a virtual meeting would deliver the best experience for the greatest number of shareholders relative to the risks of a large gathering. As a result, today's meeting is being held virtually through an online platform. A significant number of shareholders have already voted, appointed proxies and submitted questions ahead of this meeting, and we thank them for doing so. As outlined in our notice of meeting, shareholders and proxy holders may vote and submit questions during this meeting using the online platform. I'll explain the procedures. But if you require technical assistance during the meeting, our AGM guide is on the AGM page of our website, and our technical support teams contact details are shown on the screen now. If we experience significant technical difficulties during the meeting, the Chair may decide to adjourn the meeting to later in the day or another day, and we will notify you of the proposed time to reconvene via our AGM page of our website and an ASX announcement. If technical difficulties are less significant and the Chair will consider the number of shareholders impacted and the extent to which shareholders reasonable participation is affected before deciding whether to adjourn the meeting. On questions, shareholders and proxy holders may ask questions on any item of business using the online platform, either in writing or orally. If you wish to submit a question in writing, we encourage you to do so now, and the Chair will respond at the relevant item of business. Written questions put to the meeting will be read out by one of my colleagues before they are responded to. You may also ask a question orally using the live audio function on the online platform. We want to address questions from as many shareholders as possible during the meeting to ensure that all shareholders have an opportunity to participate in the meeting. [Operator Instructions] Written questions will be moderated and we may group questions when they are on the same topic, so as not to duplicate questions. Questions related to a customer or shareholders' individual circumstances will not be read out as this is a public forum. Out of respect for all attendees at today's meeting, questions or statements that contain explicit, abusive or threatening language will not be read out. The Chair will take all questions on climate-related matters at Item 5, so that related questions are discussed together. [Operator Instructions] Now to voting. All resolutions to be considered at this meeting will be decided on a poll. Votes can be submitted at any time from when the Chair declares the poll open until 10 minutes after the meeting closes to provide ample opportunity for shareholders and proxy holders to submit their votes. When the Chair declares the poll open, a voting icon will appear on screen and the resolutions will be displayed. To vote, simply one of the voting options. Your response will be highlighted. To change your vote, simply press a different option to override it. The number of items you have voted on or are yet to vote on is displayed at the top of the screen. You may change your vote up to the time the Chair closes the poll. Christina Piccolo from Computershare will act as the returning officer for the purpose of conducting and determining the results of the poll for each resolution, and the results will be announced later today on the ASX and the AGM page of our website. I would now like to introduce our Chair, Mr. Philip Chronican.

Good morning, ladies and gentlemen, and welcome to this meeting. It is just after 9:30 a.m. This is a properly constituted meeting and a quorum is present. I therefore declare the Annual General Meeting of National Australia Bank open, and welcome shareholders, proxy holders and guests. I'm joining you today from Melbourne and I, too, acknowledge the traditional owners and custodians of the land on which we are holding today's meeting, the Wurundjeri and Bunurong people of the Kulin Nation. I pay my respects to their elders, past, present and emerging. Before delivering my address, I'll make some introductions. On stage with me today are our Group Chief Executive Officer and Managing Director, Ross McEwan; our Group Chief Financial Officer, Gary Lennon; our fellow Non-Executive Director, Anne Loveridge, who stands for reelection today; and our Group Company Secretary, Louise Thomson, who spoke earlier. As well as Ross and Anne, other Board members here with us today are David Armstrong, Peeyush Gupta, Ann Sherry and Simon McKeon. Joining us by telephone today are our other Board members, Doug McKay, who is also Chair of our Bank of New Zealand subsidiary. Good morning, Doug.

Thanks. Good morning, everyone. Pleasure to be here.

And Kathryn Fagg. Good morning, Kathryn.

Good morning, Phil. Good morning, everyone.

Sarah Lowe, the lead engagement partner of our auditor, Ernst & Young, is also in attendance and is available to answer questions related to the conduct of the audit and the auditor's report. Assisting us today is Virginia Porter, a senior member of the NAB team, who will be reading out written questions and introducing audio questions. As Louise said, all resolutions in this meeting will be decided on a poll. I now declare the poll open on all resolutions so that shareholders can start to vote. Thank you again to those shareholders who submitted questions in advance of the meeting today. We received 82 questions, all of which I've read. Many were on similar topics, and I will respond to the most common themes during my address. I also want to acknowledge the terrible tragedy that occurred in Tasmania yesterday. Our thoughts are with the families and everyone in the community during what will be an extremely difficult time for them. I will now deliver my address. This morning's meeting is an important opportunity to reflect on our performance for our shareholders and to discuss the future of our business. A little over 2 years ago, the Board took accountability for ensuring the necessary changes were made at NAB and that our customers, our people and our shareholders would see the benefit. That work continues. However, I'm pleased to say we are now well progressed. We are finishing 2021 a better bank. In a year characterized by continued challenges requiring resilience and the ability to adapt, NAB has demonstrated a strong focus on customers and on colleagues. We've also shown the ability to grow safely. Our Chief Executive Officer, Ross McEwan, together with his executive leadership team, has created stability and clarity of strategy with greater discipline and stronger execution. There is clear evidence of this plan in our business results, and we are well placed to deliver improved performance over the long term. In a little over 2 years, NAB has grown from the fourth to the second largest Australian bank by market capitalization. We have increased the dividend over last year's reduced levels. We know that these are the core performance outcomes that you want to see as owners of the bank. The successful exit of MLC Wealth earlier this year was a major milestone in the simplification of NAB. It has enabled more focus and investment to be directed back into our core banking business. NAB's acquisition of the neobank, 86 400, and the proposed acquisition of Citigroup's Australian consumer business will enable the bank to quickly build scale in our digital and consumer bank offerings. Meaningful and sustainable change has been made to the way the bank operates. This is a result of the reforms put in place in response to NAB's own self-assessment into governance, accountability and culture in 2018 and following the Financial Services Royal Commission. Implementation of the applicable and actionable recommendations from the commission is on track. Actions to address the root causes identified and our self-assessment are largely complete. We are now engaged with APRA on the assessment of their impact. Several regulatory matters have been concluded: the introducer payments program, planned service fees, consumer credit insurance products and fee disclosure statements matters are closed, and customer remediation is complete. In total, we have returned $1.3 billion to customers since June 2018 and are on track to have the bulk of the remaining legacy issues behind us by the end of 2022. We have made it a priority to deliver higher standards of governance and accountability, and we've driven a reorientation of the bank around customers and colleagues. Products and services have been reviewed to improve customer outcomes. In the 2021 financial year, NAB's strategic Net Promoter Score increased by 4 points to minus 7. This is equal first among our major bank peers and marks a 10-point increase from minus 17 in 2019. Investments in NAB colleagues are showing up in our employee survey results. NAB achieved staff engagement levels among the top quartile of global employers during the financial year 2021. We are changing the way we pay colleagues to ensure remuneration supports our desired culture. 12,000 bankers are moving to 100% fixed pay to ensure that people are rewarded for serving customers well, not for selling. Senior leaders will still have some pay at risk, reflecting their levels of accountability for when things go right and wrong. While we are finding and resolving issues faster, some work remains. We are acutely aware of the important role that the bank plays in monitoring and reporting suspicious and potentially criminal activity. In June, AUSTRAC commenced an enforcement investigation of NAB. At that time, AUSTRAC commented that it was not considering civil penalty proceedings. We have not been notified of any change to this position. However, we note the investigation is ongoing, and we will continue to fully cooperate. The Board recognizes the focus and diligence shown by management in improving financial crime and fraud controls and the imperative to get it right. We are determined to ensure that NAB meets the highest standards. We will continue to make investments to keep the bank safe and to drive performance over the long term. The Board has high ambitions for NAB, and it's pleased with the direction now set and being acted on. In a challenging environment, the Board is encouraged by NAB's 2021 full year results. They reflect good momentum across all businesses, capital strength and sound credit quality. We are pleased to have increased the dividend across the full year to $1.27 per share compared with the reduced level in 2020. This outcome is closer to the level of shareholder return that the Board is targeting going forward. Future dividends will be guided by a target payout ratio in the range of 65% to 75% of sustainable cash earnings, subject to the circumstances at the time. The business delivered a cash return on equity of 10.7% for the 2021 financial year. This was 2.4 percentage points higher than last year. Although we recognize that it is still lower than 2019. Our capital ratio at the end of September 2021 was 13%, and this is above the target range of 10.75% to 11.25%. Strong capital supports growth, but the Board also looks at returning surplus capital to shareholders. Our preference is to continue to reduce our share count so that we can deliver better earnings and dividend per share outcomes over the long term. This is underway now through a $2.5 billion share buyback, which we started in August and is approximately 40% complete. Executive and employee remuneration outcomes for 2021 have been set by the Board at a level that reflects the strong progress that we have made on the strategic repositioning of the business and the resolution of legacy issues. It reflects an assessment of performance against the targets set in NAB's 2021 financial year plan as well as greater employee engagement and significantly better outcomes for customers. This contrasts with the remuneration outcomes for the past 2 years when the CEO and executive team received no short-term incentive payments. Looking ahead, I am cautiously optimistic that the worst of the economic impact of COVID-19 is behind us. I am confident the Australian economy will rebound in 2022, with the protection of having one of the highest rates of vaccination in the world and a booster program now well underway. The pandemic has accelerated generational shifts in technology. Customers are choosing to bank with NAB in new ways. Today, 94% of customer transactions are online, and more than 40% of our home lending appointments are done through video conference. We are supporting our customers as they make this change. Through the investments made in recent years, NAB has strengthened its technology foundations. This enables us now to place greater emphasis on using digital, data and analytics to deliver faster, better and more personalized experiences to customers. We're also strengthening our defenses against the growing global threat of financial and cyber crimes. More broadly, new technologies will be central to the decarbonization of the Australian and New Zealand economies. This will be the greatest economic shift of our lifetime. NAB's primary contribution to limiting global warming to 1.5 degrees is through the financing that we provide to our customers. We are facilitating the investment required to realize the immense economic opportunity for Australia and New Zealand in a low-carbon economy. Our goal is to align our lending portfolio to achieve net zero emissions by 2050. We were the first Australian member bank to sign up to the Collective Commitment to Climate Action, which was established under the United Nations Environment Programme's Finance Initiative. We now have also joined the associated Net Zero Banking Alliance, which together with the CCCA set out concrete and time-bound actions for member banks. NAB is winding down our financing of fossil fuels over time, while at the same time, growing in renewable energy finance. We have made clear statements regarding our targets and approach. We will support an orderly transition of Australia's energy system. NAB is the only major Australian bank so far to have set an up limit on oil and gas extraction and production exposures, and to put restrictions on lending to greenfield gas projects. We will not directly finance any greenfield oil extraction project or onboard new customers, predominantly focused on oil extraction. We will not lend to new thermal coal mining projects or take on new thermal coal mining customers. We've set a target for our exposure to thermal coal mining to be effectively 0 by 2030 aside from some residual performance guarantees to ensure site rehabilitation. Since 2003, we have lent $11.5 billion to fund more than 150 global renewable energy projects, more than any other Australian bank. We are also well progressed in our target to source 100% of our own electricity from renewable sources by 2025. According to the Business Council of Australia, Australia needs a further $50 billion invested in renewables to get to 100% green power generation. That investment alone would still not be enough to take the Australian economy to net zero. It would only address about 1/3 of our carbon emissions. To get to net zero, every business and every industry will have to evolve. Every household will need to make changes. And that is where a bank like NAB can help. As a priority, we are working with 100 of our largest greenhouse gas emitting customers to develop or improve their low-carbon transition plans by 2023. We are supporting customers to decarbonize and build resilience to climate change. Electrifying transport, heating and cooling systems will further reduce reliance on oil and gas. Deloitte analysis shows that this could reduce Australia's emissions by up to 80% by 2050 once electricity generation reaches 100% renewable. The remaining 20% of Australia's emissions will be harder to abate. As an agricultural nation, our farmers and foresters will play a role. Some cutting-edge Australian farms are already using methane capture technology and livestock operations to halve waste-based emissions. At the same time, there is also increasing recognition of the importance of protecting and restoring natural environments to mitigate the worst impacts of climate change. At NAB, we have finalized our work to baseline the estimated attributable financed emissions of 8 key sectors of our Australian lending portfolio. These are residential mortgages, commercial real estate, agriculture, power generation, resources, heavy manufacturing, transport and small and medium enterprises. In the next 12 months, we will disclose how we will be aligning our lending to these sectors against the 1.5 degrees scenario. The commercial opportunity to finance the climate transition is significant. Developing and deploying low-carbon solutions will require meaningful backing. Partnerships between business and government is critical. Disruptive innovation involves some risk taking. And history has shown that only a small percentage of inventive concepts reach commercial viability. The federal government's $20 billion technology investment road map and the New South Wales state government's $3 billion in grants for green hydrogen projects are good examples of partnerships and action. Before us, there's an opportunity not just to keep up with the world, but to become a leader in renewable resources and low-carbon technologies. NAB is backing businesses to realize that opportunity. In this ever-changing environment, ensuring that your Board is equipped with the right skills and experience is critical. We anticipate appointing at least 1 new director in 2022 to achieve our target board size of 10, including our Managing Director. We are prioritizing experience in transformation using digital technology and greater diversity across all dimensions. Anne Loveridge, who has been a member of your Board since 2015, stands for reelection today. Anne as Chair of NAB's People and Remuneration Committee and a member of the Customer and Nomination and Governance Committees. I can say with confidence that NAB is focused on the right things, serving customers well and helping our communities prosper. That is how we are building long-term value for shareholders. I want to thank our team of 32,000 for their hard work and challenging circumstances this year. And I'd like to thank you, our shareholders, for your trust and support to build a better bank. I will now hand over to our Group Chief Executive Officer, Ross McEwan.

Thank you, Chair, and good morning, everyone. Like Phil, I'd also want to express my deep sympathy to the families impacted by the tragic loss of young lives in Devon Port yesterday. I'll now share more about your company and its performance over the past 12 months and the year that Australians and New Zealanders have again faced more challenges, I've been particularly encouraged by the resilience of the economy and our communities. This is being demonstrated by the strong business-led rebound underway. And while some COVID-related uncertainties remain, I'm confident that 2022 will be a very good year. My confidence is supported by the fact that Australia and New Zealand have 2 of the highest vaccinated rates in the world. And as we enjoy more freedoms, major CBDs such as Melbourne and Sydney and the businesses that serve them are coming back to life. More broadly, most businesses are in good shape. They want to borrow, invest to grow and create new jobs and opportunities. We are consistently lending more to businesses every month than we have in a decade. We recently had our largest business lending month on record. It is our role to be there for our customers. By serving them well, we will support the economic rebound and help our communities prosper. When our customers do well, our business does well. It's now 2 years since I started in this role and around 18 months since we refreshed our strategy, giving us a clear plan for our bank. In that time, we've progressed ahead of where I expected us to be. Our investment in customers and colleagues is delivering better service outcomes, higher engagement and growth across every part of our business. We're making progress on the 4 key areas we want to be known for, that is being relationship led, easy to do business with, safe and thinking long term. We are improving our execution and we're getting the basics right more consistently, all of which is delivering improved performance. At our recent full year results, we announced that NAB had delivered a solid financial performance including a 39% improvement in cash earnings, driven by increased momentum across our bank and strong asset quality. Importantly, we again had no large one-off charges. This improved performance is reflected in returns to shareholders with total dividends for the full year of $1.27 per share, up from $0.60 per share last year. At the same time, we have retained a very strong balance sheet. Our customer outcomes, our Net Promoter Score reached equal highest of the major banks this year, and we have scored well into the positive territory. We know we have more to do. It has been a good year in our largest division, Business & Private Banking, we've extended our market leadership despite intense and targeted competition. Small and medium-sized business lending increased 7%, growing our market share by 40 basis points over the year to 26.43%. Agricultural lending improved 14% with market share up 160 basis points to 32.8%. Personal Banking has increased share, having made good progress in simplifying home lending processes. We've been able to speed up unconditional approval times on home loans to give close to 2/3 of retail network customers an answer within a day. Our Corporate & Institutional business had strong disciplined growth and the higher return in targeted segments of infrastructure and investor, although it has been a difficult period for our markets income. Of course, there is much more to do. Our priority is to better use our data and making lending decisions much faster and improve our customer experience in an increasing digital and automated world. We want to make unconditional home loan approvals within an hour, the standard for NAB customers. It starts with having the right technology foundations in place. During the last 4 years, we've invested significantly to make our systems more modern, flexible and reliable. This enabled us to innovate faster and respond to customer preferences. About half of our $1.3 billion investment spend in the 2022 financial year will be discretionary and will be directed to key strategic initiatives such as further simplification and automation of our systems as well as enhanced use of data and analytics to help customers and our bankers. Partnerships in Australia and globally are helping us innovate faster and develop world-class products and services for our customers. We are working with international noncompeting banks, big tech and fintech to access global scale and ideas, looking beyond domestic peers as a competitive benchmark. We're investing heavily to protect customers, the bank and the broader financial system from the growing threat of cybersecurity, fraud and financial crime. There are areas we need to improve to play our role in the prevention of financial crime. Phil acknowledged earlier that AUSTRAC has initiated a formal enforcement investigation into our anti-money laundering and counterterrorism financing compliance. We take this work very seriously. It is an absolute priority to get it right. There are about 1,500 colleagues dedicated to managing financial crime risk and remediation, but let me be clear that every person at NAB has a role to play in identifying and reporting potential criminal activity. Across the board, we're investing in colleagues to help them succeed. Over 7,000 colleagues have enrolled in our Career Qualified in Banking program and a single leadership program is in place for every leader at NAB, creating consistency and discipline in how we work. Leadership is key to having clear, capable and motivated colleagues, the most important asset to deliver on NAB's strategy. Angie Mentis has completed a very successful period running BNZ in New Zealand and hit the ground running in a new position of Group Chief Digital Data and Analytics Officer. Dan Huggins has replaced Angie as Managing Director and CEO of BNZ. He is a high-quality executive who I'm sure will continue BNZ's momentum. Les Matheson, who has deep experience in banking globally joined the executive team in January as our Group Chief Operating Officer. I'm proud of what every one of my 32,000 colleagues at NAB have done to help customers and each other through the last 12 months. I'm grateful for their dedication to their roles and their customers at a time when they have been dealing with the significant impacts of the pandemic on their own lives. To them, I say a big thank you. Looking ahead, our future depends on acting now for the long term. NAB is embedding sustainability in how we support our customers and do business. These efforts were recognized last month when NAB became the highest scoring bank in Australia and within the top 10 banks globally on the Dow Jones Sustainability Index. NAB has also been the only Australian bank recognized at the UN Climate Change Conference in Glasgow with the Prince of Wales Terra Carta Seal for our progress towards a sustainable future. Clearly, there is a long way to go, but these acknowledgments are testament to the people at NAB who are working to make a positive difference for future generations. Colleagues have rallied around customers and communities faced with floods, bushfires, cyclones and other natural disaster. NAB has provided more than $4 million in disaster relief packages. In addition, we have awarded $1.2 million in NAB foundation grants in the past year to help more than 100 communities better prepare for and recover from natural disasters. More recently, we have responded quickly to support customers impacted by floods in New South Wales and Queensland and cyclones in Western Australia. Climate change is an area that all Australians need to engage in. We all have a part to play, and we certainly recognize our role. As the Chair said, we're the only major Australian bank to have released a detailed policy to cap lending to oil and gas industry and reduce exposures in line with net zero 2050. NAB has a strong history of leading on climate action. Our Corporate and Institutional Bank team has been at the forefront of the development of sustainable and social bonds, ESG-linked derivatives, sustainability-linked loans and asset-backed securities. While removing and reducing carbon emission is the primary objective, creating a transparent and liquid marketplace for voluntary carbon credits will play an important role in achieving net zero emissions by 2050. NAB has joined with 3 international banks to develop a global carbon platform using distributed ledger technology. We have provided transparency around the decisions and actions we are taking to support our customers and communities as they make the transition to net zero emissions by 2050. Our policy is informed by science. We see significant opportunity for the bank to work with and support our customers to decarbonize while also building resilience to the worst impacts of climate change. As Australia's largest agri bank, we're also focused on helping our farmers reduce their emissions, manage physical climate risks and biodiversity and support the use of natural capital. With a twin focus on the needs of customers and colleagues, NAB will achieve consistent performance over the long term. We are doing what's needed to achieve these ambitions. And I'm pleased with -- for shareholders that we were able to again increase dividends this year, as Phil has indicated, continue to -- and we also continue to look at reducing shares on issue to deliver greater returns. To conclude, I thank all shareholders for your investment in and support of NAB. Your support has helped us be there for customers as Australia embarks on a period of business-led economic growth. Thank you to NAB's executives, leaders and colleagues throughout the bank who have supported customers and each other over the last 12 months. And I also wish to acknowledge the work of the Chair and the directors that both challenged and supported me and my executives to make NAB a better bank. As Phil said, we are pleased to have grown from the fourth largest bank in Australia by market cap to the second largest bank. NAB has good momentum as we continue to grow. Thank you for being here today, and I'll now hand back to our Chair.

Thank you, Ross. I'll now proceed with the formal business of the meeting. The notice of meeting was made available to shareholders in November, and I propose that it be taken as read. Voting on all resolutions today will be carried out by way of a poll, and Computershare will act as the independent returning officer. I have already declared the poll open on all resolutions. Items 2, 3, 4A, 4B and 5A are resolutions to be voted on at today's meeting. Item 5B is a conditional item and will only be put to the meeting if Item 5A has passed. For Item 5A to be passed, at least 75% of the eligible votes cast on that item would need to be in favor of that resolution. During the meeting, we will display the direct and proxy votes for each item received in advance of the meeting. In the spirit of transparency, we will show the votes on the conditional item even if that item is not formally put to the meeting. Where the Chair of the meeting has been nominated as a shareholder's proxy, all open and available proxies will be voted in favor of Items 2, 3, 4A and 4B, and against Items 5A and 5B. There are voting restrictions for some resolutions as outlined in the notice of meeting, which apply to those who have an interest in the resolutions and certain of their related parties or associates. The poll will be closed 10 minutes after the end of the meeting to allow time for those who did not vote earlier in the meeting to do so. A reminder of this effect will be given just before the meeting is formally closed. As the poll on all items will remain open until then, we will not be able to show the final voting results during the course of the meeting. As Louise said, we will announce the results of the AGM on the ASX platform and on the AGM page of our website later today. If you haven't already done so, I encourage you to submit your questions now. I ask you that you hold questions related to climate change, including on our policy positions and our disclosures until Item 5A so that we can keep related topics together. I turn to the first item of business, the consideration of the financial statements and reports. The Corporations Act requires that the directors -- requires the directors to lay before the Annual General Meeting the financial report, the directors' report and the auditors' report for the last financial year. Virginia, do we have any questions for the Board or the auditors on the first item of business, consideration of the financial statements and reports?

Thank you, Chair. We have a question from [ Christine Hayden ], volunteer monitor on behalf of the Australian Shareholders' Association. We would like to congratulate NAB on the work they have done this year. We believe meaningful change has taken place and is reflected in the financial results. In terms of acquisitions, we note that NAB paid $261 million for 86 400 Holdings Limited, which we understand links the UBank business to the 86 400 technical platform. Can you please expand on the acquisition, particularly where the platform fits with NAB online banking?

Thank you, Christine, and thank you for your compliments to the NAB management team. It's much appreciated. The acquisition of 86 400 was an opportunity to give some more critical mass and momentum to the existing NAB UBank business. It will not be integrated with the traditional NAB branded retail business. But rather, we will be merging the UBank business 86 400 to be a digital-only bank and one that we expect to be quite agile and prepared to take on the emerging neobanks in this sector. So that is the role of it. The legal position is that we have converted the 86 400 business to now trade under the NAB license, and that was done on the 8th of December. And in the first half next year, we expect to launch the integrated business under the revised UBank brand, by using the 86 400 technology. We have a very strong executive, Philippa Watson, who's leading the integrated business and we're expecting strong progress there. So it's a good and strong business. UBank was growing in any event, but the momentum that we get from 86 400 should propel that further and position us well. And that's the strategy that we're pursuing. Virginia?

Chair, we have a question from Christine Hayden, volunteer monitor on behalf of the Australian Shareholders' Association. We understand that 94% of customer activity is now online and 48% of home lending on video. What is the current state of the branch network? And can we expect more closures? Also, please comment on ATMs and the take-up of digital wallets.

So thank you, Christine. Your observation, of course, is quite correct, which is our customers are making a very rapid migration to digital banking. And that was accelerated, of course, during the various COVID restrictions over the last 18 months. As at now, we have around 566 retail branches in Australia and 108 in New Zealand. Of that 566 Australian branches, about 283 are in regional areas. Now those numbers are down over the last couple of years. But I think importantly, and hopefully, you've noticed, our customers will have noticed that in many cases, we've been able to refresh the look of our branches, many of which were looking quite tired a year or 2 ago. And I'm very pleased, as I've gone around both Sydney and Melbourne to see the number of new and refreshed branches. Even though in many cases, they will have a smaller footprint, of course, because of the lower numbers of people that are coming into those branches. Even though there will continue to be changes in the network and more likely to be closures than expansion, I would remind customers that we have a relationship with Australia Post, which allows for the bank at post service to be accessed at 3,500 outlets around Australia. So that's the shape of the network and what we're doing with the network. I think you can also expect a similar pattern with ATMs. We have reinvested in recent years in new ATMs. But of course, with a declining use of cash, and of course, the access to other banks' ATMs at no cost, we are finding a lower need for large numbers of ATMs out in the network. In fact, even the number of ATM transactions has declined by over 50% in the last 3 years. Hopefully, that resolves or answers those questions. Virginia, do we have any other questions?

Chair, we have a further question from Christine Hayden, volunteer monitor on behalf of the Australian Shareholders' Association. The PayPal and new payments platform facilitates a money transfer from PayPal wallet to any Australian bank via NAB. Is that correct? And can you please expand on this new initiative?

I can, although I'm not sure I'm the best person to expand on that one. And Ross, is it okay if I ask you to comment on the PayPal wallet initiative?

Yes. Thank you, Phil. PayPal has effectively become a very interesting and good way of people making payments. It can be made between PayPal and to other banking systems, just like a credit card does for be it a Visa or a Mastercard. And at this stage, I'm not sure about the piece around the wallet, but it's certainly a very strong payments vehicle now that is picking up quite a bit of market share from a payments perspective in this marketplace. But I don't know the answer about the wallet, Phil.

Yes. Look, I believe it's true, but I don't have enough details to go any deeper into it, I'm sorry. But perhaps, Christine, you can approach the Investor Relations people, and we can get a more fulsome answer for you there. Virginia?

Chair, we have an audio question from [ Johanna Chris Gardner ], shareholder. Please go ahead with your question.

My question is about our exposure to energy and resources. Page 36 of our annual review shows our lending to coal mining and oil and gas extraction. Having read through the annual and supplementary reports of our major competitors and the CBA and Westpac, it's apparent that our disclosures are quite limited by comparison. Compared to us, CBA and Westpac both disclose the exposure to the energy value chain. For instance, these banks not only disclose exposure to coal mining but also to coal ports and rail. All 3 of the other banks also disclosed exposure to not only oil and gas extraction, transportation, refining and retail, including LNG terminals for example. So my question is when will NAB publish its exposure to the energy value chain as our major competitors have done?

Thank you. I think I indicated in my opening comments that we would be inviting questions on our climate-related exposures at Item 5A. And I'd just refer you back to the comments I made in the speech about the plans that we have over the next year to increase our exposures across a whole range of industry sectors, not just energy and resources. Virginia, do you have any questions on Item 1?

Chair, I have a question from the Finance Sector Union of Australia. The Finance Sector Union has released a report titled, "Working for Nothing, how NAB robs employees' pay, health and family time." The report details the experiences of over 1,200 NAB employees, suffering severe health and well-being consequences as a result of exploitative hours of work practices. One respondent noted, I almost self-harmed one night driving home. I drove my car off the road deliberately to try and have an accident to stop the insanity, but not so much to die. The NAB Board of Directors has a duty of care to their employees and ultimate responsibility for providing a healthy and safe work environment. How then do you explain the lack of due diligence and failure in governance, resulting in the hardships experienced by so many NAB employees? Will the Board today acknowledge the harms caused to these workers by the bank's pursuit of profit and agree to remove the risks from workplaces and to the hundreds of millions in financial compensation owed to these workers?

Thanks. Thanks, Virginia. And let me just say from the outset that the Board places the health, safety and well-being of our employees as an absolute highest priority. We have a legal duty to do so, but that's not why we do it. We do it because we want to provide a healthy and productive work environment for the 30,000-plus people that work for us. We are concerned by the statements that were included in the report. And I can assure all of our shareholders that this week, the Board has spent extensive time with the management team, working to ensure that we can provide the work environment that our employees expect. And Ross, I'm going to ask if you could just make a couple of comments yourself about the work that we're doing in that regard.

Thank you, Phil. And can I just reiterate, we do take absolutely seriously the health and well-being of all of our colleagues at work. We have noted the report and have responded to the union on their report, seeking more information as well. We do our own surveying to make sure that we're keeping very clearly in touch with what the thoughts and feelings of our staff are. And in that survey, there are many health and well-being questions that actually don't reflect exactly the same results, but we take it absolutely seriously. Over the last 2 years, it's been very difficult for our colleagues. Many of them or the vast majority of them have been working from home in circumstances where they have their own family members, they're looking after as well as working and we have acknowledged that and also put in place many services for them that have been put in place to help them with health and well-being over this very trying period of time. We have many services in place. We also have a monthly meeting where it's regularly attended by -- on the -- 1,000 to 2,000 of our colleagues who are leaders of the business. And we emphasize at those sessions, the services available to them. We also have many areas that they can take up their concerns if they feel that workload is just too high: one, their leader; two, our HR division; three, they can take them through to our whistleblowing service, which has an internal service as well as external if they don't feel comfortable with that. And we do monitor every one of the inquiries we get and look to help our colleagues. We take this very seriously, so Phil.

Thanks, Ross. And if I can just also preempt the question on pay. This is also an issue that we have spent significant time on this year. And I think shareholders will be aware that we have provided for well over $100 million to fix some payroll errors that have been uncovered. Virginia, do you have another question?

Chair, we have a question from [ Henrik Kay ]. What is going to be done to crack down on the use of unpaid overtime in NAB? I strongly believe that these staff must be paid and that management be told that this practice is abuse of staff and will not be condoned?

Thank you. And I think, again, I can say that the Board is also concerned at allegations that excessive overtime -- excessive unpaid overtime is being worked. And I won't get Ross to expand further because I think many of the comments that he's just made on the previous question apply also to this one. But just I want to make very clear to our own people and to our shareholders that the Board and the senior management team do not expect excessive unpaid overtime to be a natural part of the working environment at NAB and we are actively seeking to ensure that it is not. So we do take that issue very seriously, and thank you for raising the question, Mr. Kay. Virginia?

Chair, we have an audio question from Jack Bertolus, shareholder, please go ahead with your question.

I'm Jack Bertolus from Market Forces. Earlier this year, the International Energy Agency found that reducing emissions to net zero by 2050 leaves no room for new fossil fuel supply projects. Yet when NAB updated its oil and gas policy last month, it left the door wide open to continued funding for these sorts of projects and the company pursuing them. In fact, as NAB was announcing the updated policy, it was also reportedly arranging funds for the acquisition of Pluto LNG Train 2. That acquisition enables Woodside to press ahead with the Scarborough gas project, the largest greenfield gas development in Australia in a decade. Over its lifetime, emissions from the Scarborough-Pluto project would total 1.6 billion tonnes of CO2, equivalent to 15 coal-fired power stations running for 30 years. In light of the overwhelming evidence that there's no room for new fossil fuel projects is whether we achieve the Paris Agreement and net zero by 2050, what evidence can NAB produce that enabling an additional 1.6 billion tonnes of CO2 is in any way compatible with limiting global warming to 1.5 degrees? And I'd just make the point that NAB's financial reporting states that the bank recognizes climate change as a material business risk. And therefore, this question is entirely appropriate for consideration at Item 1.

Thank you, Jack. And despite your assertion that it's entirely appropriate for Item 1, it is entirely appropriate for Item 5A, and that's where I'll be dealing with how we reconcile our oil and gas position, which, as you'll appreciate, has been made very clear, and it fully reconciles with the IEA, and I'll be dealing with that at 5A. Thank you. Virginia?

Chair, we have received a question from [ Mr. Raymond Kenneth Michelle ]. One part of his question has been excluded as it referred to an individual. These questions are on behalf of current and former staff. How many whistleblower transcript complaints have been erased over the last 5 years? How many staff have gone on stress leave in retail Victoria in the last 5 years? Do you have confidence in the Executive General Manager, Retail, for NAB? If one of your senior leaders says they don't -- they have not sent an e-mail and 2 affidavits says she did, would NAB's IT department investigate to see if the senior manager was dishonest?

Thank you for the question. As you can appreciate, this is very difficult for me to answer on the spot because I have no idea of the circumstances of the underlying incidents you referred to. But can I just say anything involving an e-mail trail, we are -- well, we do and we are required to retain all e-mails. And on many occasions, we have to search e-mails for support, for example, for discovery actions for court cases and so on. So yes, the answer is that NAB's IT department is able to investigate e-mails. I don't have specific answers to how many people have taken stress leave in retail Victoria. And -- but I can assure you that it would be highly unlikely for a whistleblower transcript to have been erased because that simply would not be allowed for. So the answer is that the circumstances, really don't lend itself to being dealt with in a meeting like this, but I'm certainly happy that these issues can be taken up. And of course, whistleblower items can be raised with anyone, including myself or a Chair of our Audit Committee or our internal auditor. Any of them are happy to receive whistleblower complaints. Sorry, I can't do anything more with that question at the moment, Virginia, so perhaps you could move onto another one.

Chair, we have an audio question from [ Sherri Carlyle Ritchie Lowe ], shareholder, please go ahead with your question.

With regards to our target to provide $7 billion in environmental financing between 2015 and 2025, I understand the definition of environmental finance includes funding for a variety of activities, including waste management, industrial [ waste treating ] and water treatment. How much will be directed towards renewable energy?

Thank you for the question. Your assertion is correct, it includes a wide range of sustainable financing initiatives. And my belief is that, so far, $11 billion has gone into renewable energies and significantly more is planned. Virginia?

Chair, we have a question from Mr. Henrik Kay. In relation to the purchase of the Citibank, will products be rebranded as NAB?

Yes. Thank you for that question. The intention is that the acquisition of the Citibank businesses, that all of those products will be fully integrated with their NAB counterpart products and will be rebranded as NAB products. That transaction has been approved by the competition regulator, but are still waiting approval from -- I think, from APRA and from the Treasurer. So it's unlikely that we're going to have more clarity on the certainty of that transaction until the New Year. But the answer to your specific question is yes, it will be.

Chair, we have an audio question from [ Karen Lage ], shareholder, please go ahead with your question.

Thank you. I have 2 questions, which relate to material business risk. The International Energy Agency stated earlier this year, that no new fossil fuel projects should be approved in order to achieve net zero by 2050. In light of this, when will NAB continue to provide no further finance to companies such as Woodside and BHP, who are planning to develop the controversial Scarborough gas field off the Western Australian Coast. And my second question, which is related to the first one. NAB's recently released oil and gas policy includes a commitment to only consider financing greenfield gas extraction in Australia where it plays a role in underpinning national energy security. Can you confirm that this means NAB won't provide financing for Woodside and BHP's controversial Scarborough gas development, which is predominantly for export? Thank you.

Thank you, and I will provide answers to those questions at Item 5A. Thank you.

Chair, we have a question from [ Mrs. Natalie Camino ]. My question is regarding the remediation of employees and conflict of interest of the auditors. The first part of my question is about the wage theft of NAB's long-term part-time working women due to a payroll system error. And the second is about KPMG having a conflict of interest as the adviser to NAB regarding not fully remediating these employees, while also being responsible for NAB code of conduct investigations into this matter. NAB states publicly, it will pay its employees fairly and it has a basic social obligation to do so. However, NAB decided to only remediate for 8 years, despite knowing part-time working women have been incorrectly paid and denied their full superannuation benefits for more than 15 years. KPMG advised NAB on this decision. It was raised as a breach of code of conduct. KPMG is the adviser on the code of conduct hotline and has not investigated or even responded to this case in more than 5 months. Would the Board please comment?

Thank you. Can I just make a point, the first line of the question referred to the conflict of interest of the auditors. KPMG is not NAB's auditor. However, I think it's right to say that KPMG administers the hotline.

The hotline.

Yes, It does. Thank you. So I do appreciate, but I just want to make it clear that KPMG are not the bank's auditors. I'm unaware of the specific allegation that's being made in this question. But what I can say is we've had an extensive review of payroll errors over the course of the last 18 months. And we've paid $109 million out to staff, which included 22,395 current staff and 26,623 former staff. We've been regularly updated on that review. And if there are continuing issues with that review, the Board would be very happy to acknowledge those and address those. And if you have got specifics, I would invite you to send them in either to the Board or to Susan Ferrier, the Chief People Officer at NAB. Thank you.

Chair, we have a question from Denmark Dream Proprietary Limited. A couple of weeks ago, the news reported an ex NAB business manager was jailed for stealing $437,000 to pay off his debts and to fund his indulgent lifestyle. This was described as a carefully managed and premeditated fraud. He was able to create 51 accounts and business loans using current clients' names without the clients' knowledge or authorization where he successfully transferred funds to himself over 172 unauthorized transactions. The Crown prosecutor said, he exploited the trust placed in him, and he went to extreme lengths to set up the loans. He devised sophisticated methods to avoid detection and he was unable to do that -- he was able to do that due to his senior position within the bank. How did these unlawful transactions go undetected by NAB's own systems? And has NAB investigated if there are any further circumstances like this within the bank?

Thank you. I believe that came from Rita. Is that right?

That's correct.

Rita, thank you for raising that issue. The Board is very concerned at issues of this and very concerned where we see areas in which our systems let us and let our shareholders down. I think if I can go back to the self-assessment document that we published in 2018, we identified a range of issues where there was not enough rigor or discipline in our systems and processes. And progressively, under Ross' leadership, the team has identified a whole range of areas where we've been able to improve our controls environment and to improve our control, in particular, around fraud and financial crime. It is an ongoing piece of work and our systems are not yet perfect, but you can be assured as a shareholder that we are doing our very best to improve and to make our control environment as industrial strength as we're able to do so. So thank you for the question. Virginia?

Chair, we have an audio question from [ Dr. Mary Ann Heath ], shareholder, please go ahead with your question.

Thank you. National Australia Bank sustainability statement says that National Australia Bank is working with its customers to support their implementation of low-carbon transition plan so that NAB will achieve a net 0 emissions lending portfolio by 2015. Can you explain how National Australia Bank supports the implementation of low-carbon transition plans when it continues to support new fossil fuel projects, for example, Whitehaven Coal?

Thank you. I intend to deal with that section or item 5A. So Virginia, do you have another question?

Chair, we have a question from [ Rob Roseby ]. It's an audio question. Please go ahead with your question, shareholder.

It's Dr. Rob Roseby and I'm the children's chest specialist and my question is driven by concern about the many excess cases of asthma in the Tove Valley in Victoria due to coal-burning power stations. In the light of such health risk, the World Health Organization has called for coal to be phased out in OECD by 2030. And I worry about the bank's supporting investment in potentially stranded assets. I note the Chair's comments, we're not supporting new thermal coal investments and thank you for the work thus far regarding decarbonization and NAB's future focus. My question is, will NAB rule out financing Xcel Energy if it sticks to its plan to continue running Loy Yang A until 2048?

Thank you for your comments. And I think you've answered the question yourself. So normally, I'd have asked you to wait until Friday, but I think you've already identified that we are not going to be lending on thermal coal past 2030. So I think that answers the question in any event. Virginia, do we have another question?

Chair, we have a further question from Denmark Dream Proprietary Limited. The financial crimes regulator, AUSTRAC, launched formal investigations into the bank in June. AUSTRAC highlighted potential serious and ongoing noncompliance relating to customer identification procedures, ongoing customer due diligence and compliance with NAB's anti-money laundering and counterterrorism financing program. AUSTRAC expressed doubts that the bank has the necessary systems and processes to comply with its AML/CTF obligations under its financial crime risk capabilities. AUSTRAC is not considering civil penalty proceedings at this stage, but said it could take actions such as civil penalty orders, enforceable undertakings, infringement notices and remedial directions. On speaking to the House of Representatives, Standing Committee on Economics in September, the CEO said NAB will be responding to AUSTRAC shortly. Could you explain why the significant breaches and failures to continue throughout NAB, which unfairly impact shareholders. When will the continued wrongdoings stop? This question is from Rita.

Yes. Thank you, Rita. And thank you for raising this because this is an issue which I think is of interest to -- should be of interest to all shareholders and has received considerable attention from the Board over the course of the last couple of years. We were concerned that our AML control environment was not at the standards that we would expect or the community would expect and considerable effort has gone into that over recent years. I think as part of the information disclosures that we published at the time of the AUSTRAC investigation being launched, we articulated that around $800 million have been spent over the last 2 to 3 years to improve that environment and to remediate weaknesses that have been identified. The AUSTRAC investigation consisted of a significant request for information that came from AUSTRAC. And over recent months, we've gone to exhausted lengths to ensure that all of AUSTRAC's requests have been met. And I can advise shareholders that we have now fully answered all of the questions that have been raised by AUSTRAC, and AUSTRAC is considering our responses to that. We're not waiting for AUSTRAC. We've made a number of commitments to AUSTRAC to upgrade our environment even further and ongoing work is underway within the company. We are determined to get leading standards of financial crime control in our company. It's the best way of keeping our customers and our shareholders safe from financial crime. And I expect that work to be ongoing. So thank you for raising the question because it is of significance.

Chair, we have an audio question from Peter Star, shareholder, please go ahead with your question.

In light of the bank executive who was charged with the 51 counts, what has been done to fix up customers' names that were damaged and their identity?

Thank you. Peter, thanks very much for your question. We do investigate every one of these cases similar to the one that was raised, and we do go back and put right with customer wherever we possibly can and including making sure that the security and identity is put back into place for them where it is -- has been compromised. So we do work with each of the customers on that basis. And we put them back in the place that they should have been. Some of these, as the court said, these cases are very sophisticated. And they're very complex, and it does take time, but we also take the lessons out of each of these and read across into other situations in the bank, as you would expect us to do.

Chair, we have a question from [ Mr. Stephen David Mayne ]. CBA recently completed a $6 billion off-market buyback at a 14% discount to the market price with the fully franked dividend component being 74.6% of the buyback price. It was flooded with almost $30 billion worth of stock tendered into the offer. Westpac is also attempting a similar $3.5 billion off-market buyback, but it has bombed so far because the dividend component was set to be less than half. Has NAB investigated an off-market buyback? And given our franking credit balance, what proportion of such a buyback could be a fully franked dividend as opposed to a capital return as this seems to be the key metric driving whether these off-market buybacks are worthwhile and popular with shareholders?

Thanks, Stephen. So the point you make is correct, which is that the value of an off-market buyback to shareholders is made up of the franking credits that are made available, and that depends on the deemed dividends and the capital return component. And the biggest driver of that is the franking credit balance. But I'm going to ask our Chief Financial Officer, Gary Lennon, to explain to you why we chose to do an on-market buyback as opposed to an off-market buyback, and it's very much driven by these reasons.

Thanks, Chair, and thank you, Stephen, for the question. And it is a relatively complex area. But we certainly considered the best mechanism for shareholders to execute on the buyback. And this takes into account cost of different methods of execution. And as you've highlighted, Stephen, franking credit balance is a key part of this as well. The optimum approach for buybacks we've determined at this stage, albeit we leave the door open to change down the track for our $2.5 billion buyback we have announced, is an off-market buyback. And we see that as the most optimal approach, and it does have limited impact or no impact on franking credits by using this method. But sometime down the track, where we did see the opportunity because we did have excess franking credits, then that's something we would also look at.

Thank you. It's an important question, but it is all about the available franking as Gary has indicated. Virginia?

Chair, we have a question from [ Mr. Christian Beauregard Langeberg and Mrs. Ding Ding Sun ]. I refer to the statement that NAB is prioritizing and investing in improving security. Why then has the bank ceased the storage of safety boxes, which allowed customers to store personal papers safely away from home?

Thanks for the question. And this has been a difficult issue for us for many years. Sadly, the safety box as a service was a very unsatisfactory one for many of our customers and for the bank because it was very hard to control. We had many abandoned security packets over the years. People would leave and never come back for the items, and it created a very difficult control environment. So I'm afraid that this is an area where it's highly unlikely we would want to reestablish that service. And importantly, as we're making the changes to our retail network to modernize it for the current environment, there simply isn't a place for us to be able to offer this service. Now I know that there are commercial operators who are providing safe custody services outside of the banking system. And if you do have a requirement for such a service, I'm sure that you'll be able to access one of those. But I'm sorry, this is not something that the bank is going to be able to do in the future. Virginia?

Chair, we have a question from Mr. William Wong. On 7 December 2021, there was an article on the Australian Financial Review, which revealed that NAB has formed a culture of forcing staff to work excessive hours and workers were expected to work additional hours to meet the excessive demands of their employer. As employees, our shareholders and internal stakeholders, can you please explain how NAB is going to meet its duty of care of its employees going forward?

Thank you. And I think I indicated earlier when I answered a similar question that the Board does take its obligations to its employees extraordinarily seriously. And we do not accept that we should have a culture of working excessive hours in the company. And as I think I indicated, even this week, we've been in conversations to make sure that Ross and his management team take all due steps to ensure that we have a healthy and productive working environment and not an impressive working environment. And we'll continue to work on the culture of -- that work culture environment to ensure that we do not have staff working excessive hours and not in your question but one of the earlier questions, the allegation that these were excessive unpaid hours, neither of those are acceptable. So thank you for the question.

Chair, we have an audio question from Glenn Walker, shareholder, please go ahead with your question.

The United Nations and International Energy Agency have both clearly said that Australia needs to stop burning coal for power generation by 2030 to meet the goals of the Paris Climate Agreement. But NAB, unfortunately, has the worst coal power generation policy of all the banks with just a very small 45% emission reduction target by 2030 for power generation customers. Now this is different to the thermal coal mining policy. Given the bank supports the Paris Climate Agreement, will the Board now commit to urgently updating NAB's climate policies as soon as possible and commit to not funding companies burning coal beyond 2030 in Australia? And specifically, will the Board commit to not funding AGL, Australia's biggest climate polluter or its proposed spin-off company, Xcel Energy, unless that company brings forward the closure of its coal burning power stations from 2035 and 2048 to at least 2030. And I just started asking this question now because climate change is a big material risk to the business. And just yesterday, the Reserve Bank, like cyber attacks and climate change are the top 2 financial risk to the banking sector. So I don't think it's right to just push it back to an item about a separate shareholder resolution.

Thank you. But there is a shareholder resolution on the water paper. And that shareholder resolution is about our climate disclosures and our climate plans. So it is the appropriate place with which to deal with that item. So thank you.

Chair, we have a question from National Nominees Limited. This question is from Stuart Palmer of Australian Ethical Investment. The bank's November 2021 announcement and culture review report noted that meaningful culture change takes time, but that the Board considers the right foundations to be in place. With new compliance and regulatory issues and action continuing to surface, how does the Board and management assess whether it is on track with its change program?

Thank you. Culture change has been a very important part of our program over the last 3 years. And again, I'll refer back to the 2018 self-assessment document where we identified a culture change was required in the company. We have been monitoring through regular staff surveys and through other measures, particularly focused on customer feedback as well to ensure that we have the right culture and the right foundations for that culture. So yes, we are finding new issues. And frankly, I hope that we continue to find new issues because part of the culture change that we have been driving is encouraging people where they see things that aren't right to raise them and raise them very openly. And with that, you have to accept that -- expect rather that you're going to find new issues. The real challenge is how we deal with them. And that's what I expect of the leadership team of this bank, which is that we'll continue to hunt for issues on any front where it doesn't meet the standards that we aspire to, and we'll raise those issues and we'll get them resolved. So we believe we are making progress. We have not declared victory in that sense because we do appreciate the culture change is a long-term project. But we are very encouraged at the progress that's been made, in particular, over the last 2 years, under Ross' leadership. Thank you for the question. Virginia?

Chair, we have a question from [ Erebor Proprietary Limited ]. NAB's results no longer include reporting of economic profit. What was NAB's economic profit in financial year 2021? Will NAB commit to reporting economic profit as ANZ does?

So economic profit is not a recognized accounting measure, but is a useful measure that investment analysts do sometimes use. We've not embraced it as a measure for our purposes. We could do so, and we might have a conversation about that. But at the moment, we have no plans to publish economic profit. I would encourage any financially capable shareholders who wish to calculate it themselves that it's easily done yourself by using the earnings data that we provide. But it's not something that we're intending to do ourselves. Thank you.

Chair, we have an audio question from [ Dr. Jenny Wang ], shareholder, please go ahead with your question.

I'm Dr. Jenny Wang. I'm a General Practitioner. And as a doctor, I have been seeing worsening heart and lung health and excessive deaths in all ages in my patients. Related to the coal and gas projects, and yes, these projects are net polluting gases causing inflammatory disease processes in all of our bodies. We can now see that. It's actually publicly widely known that NAB is investing in these. And as a shareholder, I am increasingly concerned about the financial risk and the reputation of NAB. And more so now that I'm realizing these projects are so widely known, can the Board clarify please your conflicting value commitment?

Thank you. We have a very clear policy on these items. We've published updated targets, and we'll be discussing them further when we get to item 5A on the order paper. Virginia?

Chair, we have an audio question from [ Austin Catano ]. Please go ahead with your question shareholder.

I'm Austin, a young person from Melbourne. I'm from School Strike 4 Climate, a national organization that has young people from all across Australia, with our biggest strike getting 300,000 young people involved. I, like so many young people from all of Australia, are concerned about climate change. Young people will see the effects of climate change caused by fossil fuels. In October, School Strike 4 Climate wrote a letter place in the Australian Financial Review.

We have 2 related questions from Erebor Proprietary Limited. Chairman, you have noted that the AML KYC processes were not in accordance with community expectations. However, isn't the issue that NAB's AML KYC processes were not in accordance with the law? NAB failed to find these breaches of the law despite having told the market, it undertook a comprehensive review of processes following the CBA independent risk review and issues reported to the Handrail Commission. Why are any executives being paid bonuses when NAB is not able to do something as basic as complying with the law?

Thank you. We have a comprehensive anti-money laundering policy framework and the -- which is what we are required to do by law. And the issues that were identified where we were not fully compliant with our own framework. And that work of resolving this commenced at around that time that you've identified or, in fact, commenced before the [ Handrail Commission ] and is well advanced. And I think we are hopeful that within the next 12 months, we will be largely complete on some of that involved remediation work of going back of customers that had been onboarded historically, and that's why it's taken some time to remediate the old. What we should be assured of is that our ongoing onboarding of new customers and ongoing transaction monitoring is of a very high standard as we speak today. Thank you for that. Virginia?

Chair, we have an audio question from Peter Star. Please go ahead with your question, shareholder. Shareholder, please go ahead with your question. As we haven't heard from Peter Star, I'll proceed to the next question. Chair, we have a question from Erebor Proprietary. Congratulations to NAB for becoming accredited as a data recipient under CDR. When does NAB expect to become an active data recipient and what benefits will be offered to customers as a result of becoming an ADR?

Thank you. That work is still relatively formative, but I will on this occasion ask Ross to comment.

Thank you very much, and great question given that data is such an important issue for both customers and the bank. Our view in becoming a data recipient meaning we can take data on the approval of customers into our systems to actually use that data to help them with their full picture and how do we help them with their financial needs going forward. I think that is going to be very important to the bank, but it's got to be focused on needs of customers and helping customers put them in a better position. And that's what we're working on with all of our systems and processes. It's also why we've had all of our senior team focused on what data do we need to help customers make quicker decisions for customers. For example, for home lending, you can take the data in and make a decision much faster than if you're having to extract it manually. So we will be an active participant in use of data, but only as it meets the needs of customers.

Thank you. Virginia?

Chair, we have a question from [indiscernible] Proprietary Limited. Thank you, Phil, to you, the Board and the bank staff for the progress made on NAB's transition. Could you comment on the bank's level of impaired assets, please, which appear to be trending higher?

Thank you. I think the -- in fact, I think over recent months, the impaired assets have actually trended slightly lower, but that's largely because as we've come back out of lockdown, some of the consumer arrears have been falling. Nonetheless, I should be cautious here because what we do expect is that there will be some business impairments come to the fore, simply because of the size of the shock to the economy that both last year's and this year's lockdowns, particularly in Sydney and Melbourne, will have had on a number of business customers. So it is something where we are cautious. You will note, of course, that we raised our forward-looking provisions last year. And in the main, we have not released those as of yet. So we do hold provisions against expected losses going forward. But that is something that we're keeping a very close watch on. So thank you for the question. Virginia?

Chair, we have a question from Denmark Dream Proprietary Limited. ASIC states during COVID-19, banks provide consumers deferral of mortgage repayments to 6 months and agreed extensions and they must do all things necessary to ensure that credit activities under their license are engaged efficiently, honestly and fairly and to deliver consumers appropriate and fair outcomes by contacting consumers prior to repayment deferrals, expiring and providing consumers critical information to assist their decision-making. ASIC advisers contract variations of repayment terms as opposed to new contracts on different terms, also capitalization of interest may result in an increase to credit contract balance, but does not necessarily increase the contract credit limit. Home loan debt consolidation to reduce repayments across the credit portfolio likely increases the home loan credit limit significantly increasing the consumers' risk exposure to loss of their home, which responsible lending applies. What is NAB doing where it has not acted efficiently, honestly and fairly during COVID?

Thank you. We had -- through the whole COVID period, dealing with loan deferrals, we were acutely conscious of the potential for deferrals to increase the risks to our customers. And it's one of the reasons why when the first lockdowns were being lifted last year, we took the view that we should not automatically extend deferrals because of the effect that it potentially would have just as you've identified, so we have reached out on an active basis to ensure that we have dialogue with customers so that customers are fully informed of the risks of extending deferrals where that has been unnecessary. So this is something, in fact, we take very seriously. And we -- as you say, we do have an obligation to act efficiently, honestly and fairly, and we take that obligation very seriously. But it is a case where every customer situation is different, and we've tried to have that connection with the customers. So I think that answers the question. Virginia, do we have any other questions?

Chair, we have no further questions on this item of business.

Right. Well, if there are no further questions, then I declare the financial statements and reports have been received and considered at the meeting. The next item of business is item 2, which is the reelection of Anne Loveridge as a Director of National Australia Bank. This year, one director, Anne Loveridge, retires at this meeting in accordance with the company's constitution and being eligible offers herself for reelection. If reelected, this will be Anne's third term serving you on the Board. Details of Anne's qualifications, career, experience and other interests are set out in the notice of meeting and in the directors' report. Anne will speak to you shortly about what she brings to the collective capability of the Board. The Board has undertaken an evaluation of Anne's performance and fully support to reelection. The Board considers that Anne's extensive financial, regulatory reporting, risk management, remuneration and people leadership experience are valuable contributions to the Board's existing skills and experience. The Board has also concluded that Anne is independent and has sufficient capacity to undertake the duties expected of a director of the company. Anne, would you like to address the meeting, please?

Thank you, Chair. Good morning, ladies and gentlemen, fellow shareholders. As I offer myself for reelection to the Board, I thought it would be useful to speak about 2 things: my experience and how I contribute to the Board. I have experience across a range of organizations small, medium and large as well as the not-for-profit sector. I am a Nonexecutive Director at 2 other ASX-listed companies, nib health funds and Platinum Asset Management. And I'm on the board of Destination New South Wales. Prior to joining the NAB Board, I had a 30-year career in professional services, largely focused on the financial services sector. This included working as an audit partner, a business leader and 6 years as Deputy Chair of PwC. Through these roles, I gained extensive audit, risk and regulatory perspectives. I also developed the business and provided leadership and development for partners and emerging leaders in the firm as well as focusing on reward recognition and diversity for the firm more broadly. In my 6 years on the NAB Board, I have served on the audit, customer and remuneration committees. I chaired the People and Remuneration Committee, which supports the Board on remuneration matters. This committee has taken an active role through focusing on capability, leadership, accountabilities and consequence management in addressing the rebuilding of the culture at NAB in the aftermath of the 2018 Royal Commission and the NAB self-assessment. This committee also has oversight of NAB's broader colleague strategy, which is aimed at strengthening people's capabilities, leadership, inclusion and diversity and culture to support NAB's overall business strategy. My experience on other Boards and as a professional services partner and leader enables me to bring perspectives from other places and industries and has provided me with the skills and experience to listen and constructively question and challenge management. Over the last 6 years, I have been able to devote the time necessary to the important work of the NAB Board and committees. And I am confident that I will continue to do so. I would be honored to receive your support. Thank you.

Virginia, do we have any questions in relation to the reelection of Anne Loveridge?

Chair, we have a question from Mr. Stephen David Mayne. There are no issues with Anne Loveridge's election. But on the question of director elections, could the Chair please provide more detail on what happened with the announcement and then withdrawal of James Spenceley's appointment to the Board. Was this due to proxy adviser or institutional shareholder concern? What was the recruitment process for James Spenceley? Did we use an external headhunter?

Thank you. And Stephen, thank you for raising the question. The appointment of James Spenceley, which was announced back in October, November -- October, I think it was. We were looking for somebody to come on to the Board with experience in technology, digital and data-driven transformations, business disruption. And identified through the use of an external headhunter -- to answer the last part of your question, yes, identified, James is having such experiences. After the announcement, 2 separate things happened. One is that we received feedback from some institutional shareholders who had experience of James from earlier businesses that he had been involved in some years ago. And he received feedback from shareholders and proxy advisers in respect of his other directorships. And after a conversation between us, came to the mutual conclusion that it would not be wise for either he or us to pursue that appointment, and we subsequently announced that he had withdrawn from that process. So that's the background. I hope that answers your question. Virginia, are there any further questions?

Chair, we have an audio question from Peter Star. Please go ahead with your question, shareholder.

Yes, Phil. Given that Ms. Loveridge is standing for reelection and given that part of her focus is supposed to be on customers. I thought that the other Director on the Board, Ms. Ann Sherry, was looking after legacy cases and an update on legacy cases would be to the point you, Phil, please?

Yes. I'm happy to take the question. I don't think it strictly relates to Anne's candidacy, but I'll take it in any event. We've resolved working here off my memory of these numbers, I think we identified something like over the last 3 years, it was around 60 or 62 total legacy cases that were being reviewed under the supervision of the customer committee. And as far as I'm aware, we've reached a point where effectively, I think it's 32 of the 62 have been resolved. There's one that's currently still being worked on. And I think the situation is that the remaining 29 that have been reviewed again are not being worked on any further because it doesn't look like there's any possibility of resolution. So I hope that answers your question. Essentially, that's where we have reached. So we have closed consideration of the remaining 29 in the absence of any new information. So thank you for your question, Peter.

Chair, we have no further questions on this item of business.

Great. All right. Well, as there are no further questions, I will now formally put the motion that Ms. Anne Loveridge be reelected as a Director of the company. Direct and proxy votes received in advance of the meeting for this item are now being displayed on the screen. So please record your vote now if you have not already voted. Thank you, Anne. The next item of business is item 3, the remuneration report. The remuneration report is contained in the 2021 annual financial report and sets out the performance and remuneration of the company's key management personnel being the Board, the Group Chief Executive Officer and members of the executive leadership team during the financial year ended 30 September 2021. I'll make several remarks regarding remuneration during my address. Virginia, do we have any questions on the remuneration report?

Chair, we have no questions on this item of business.

Well, as there are no questions, I'll now formally put the motion that the remuneration report for the year ended 30 September 2021 be adopted. Direct and proxy votes received in advance of the meeting for this item are now displayed on the screen. Please record your vote now if you have not already voted. The next items of business are items 4A and 4B, which relate to deferred equity to be provided to the Group Chief Executive Officer, Ross McEwan, as part of his remuneration arrangements. Item 4A seeks approval for the grant of deferred rights to the Group Chief Executive Officer under the company's annual variable reward plan. Item 4B seeks approval for the grant of performance rights to the Group Chief Executive Officer under the company's long-term variable reward plan. Both are described in detail in the explanatory notes and in the remuneration report. I'll now invite questions on both items 4A and 4B. Virginia, do we have any questions on the deferred equity to be provided to the Group Chief Executive Officer as part of his remuneration arrangements?

Chair, we have a question from Mr. Stephen David Mayne. When disclosing the outcome of all resolutions, including this LTI grant, will you publicly disclose how many shareholders voted for and against each item similar to what happens with the scheme of arrangement. This will provide a better gauge of retail shareholder sentiment on all resolutions and with a disclosure initiative recently adopted by Metcash, Dexus and Altium after their AGMs. If the for and against detail is too much, can you at least advise now approximately how many of your 620,000 shareholders voted either directly or by proxy before the meeting commenced?

That is a difficult question to answer because we're not disclosing the number of shareholders. As you appreciate, these votes are based on the number of shares voted. And it would certainly add significant increased complexity to try to calculate the number of shareholders. And I say that because, for example, often that we won shareholders with multiple holdings, so we wouldn't even know whether or not we had the right number. So I don't think that, that's something that we would be really likely to do. It would certainly be a more complex process and would delay things. And I'm not even -- as I said, I'm not even sure that any answer we could give would be reliably accurate. So that's where we are. We have got the votes in, and the votes are based on the numbers of shares. So thanks for the question, but I'm afraid I'm not able to help you there. Virginia, do we have another question?

Chair, we have a further question from Mr. Stephen David Mayne. Congratulations to NAB for publishing a full video archive of every NAB AGM since 2013. However, you have never produced an AGM transcript. In order to provide a fuller record of today's debate, including this important discussion on the LTI grant, could you please follow the lead of Afterpay, AGL Energy, ASX CIMIC, Domino's, Freedom Foods, Lendlease, Mineral Resources, Mirvac and Nine Entertainment by producing your first AGM transcript in 2021. It is not easy scrolling through videos to find out what was said and politicians are not asked to do instead getting a hands on transcript of all parliamentary debate. Can't we do the same?

Let me just make 2 points. One is that we don't do a transcript of the AGM. But there are organizations that can make transcripts. Indeed, I think for the cost of $100 to $200, you could probably get one done yourself. And if we were to provide the one that we get from the service that we use, my experience with them is that they are error prone in that they're put together by people who maybe can't hear us clearly or don't understand some of the terminology used and therefore, to make it an accurate transcript requires reworking. And I think you refer to the hand-side process, which, from my recollection, gives members the opportunity to go back and re-edit their comments to make sure they're accurately reflected. So it's not our intention to add to that work. We do make the webcasts available online, and people are welcome to have the service go and make their own transcripts of them if they wish. But it's not our intention to do so. Thank you.

Chair, we have no further questions on these items of business.

Fine. Well, if there are no further questions, I'll now formally put the motion for resolution 4A that the grant of deferred rights to the Group Chief Executive Officer, Mr. Ross McEwan, under the company's annual variable reward plan as described in the explanatory notes be approved. Direct and proxy votes received in advance of the meeting for this item are now displayed on the screen. Please record your vote now if you've not already voted. I now formally put the motion for resolution 4B that the grant of performance rights to the Group Chief Executive Officer, Mr. Ross McEwan, under the company's long-term variable reward plan as described in the explanatory notes be approved. Direct and proxy votes received in advance of the meeting for this item are now displayed on the screen. Please record your vote now if you have not already voted. The next item of business are items 5A and 5B, which are resolutions requisitioned by a group of shareholders promoted by market forces. These resolutions relate to an amendment to the company's constitution and climate change transition planning disclosures. I'll explain the resolutions and the Board's position before inviting questions from shareholders on these items and on NAB's climate change policies and disclosures. Jack Bertolus, a representative from Market Forces, will also have an opportunity to speak before I invite questions more broadly. Item 5A is a special resolution. As noted earlier, a special resolution requires approval by at least 75% of eligible votes cast on the resolution. Resolution 5A is not endorsed by the Board. While the Board respects the rights of shareholders to requisition a resolution to amend NAB's constitution, the Board believes that the proposed resolution is not in the best interest of the company and shareholders as a whole and recommends that shareholders vote against it for the reasons outlined in the notice of meeting. Under the constitution, the power to manage the business of NAB is vested in the directors who are required to make decisions and manage risks in the best interests of the company and shareholders as a whole. In order to discharge that duty, the Board must consider a range of issues having regard to the nature and complexity of NAB's business and its operations in a global environment. The proposed amendment would provide a platform for groups of shareholders to promote any number of matters that may not be in the best interest of the company and shareholders as a whole. The Board considers it would be inappropriate for any one issue promoted by shareholders to be given increased prominence over other equally relevant issues. NAB encourages transparency and appropriate shareholder discussion and provide shareholders with a number of avenues to raise issues or concerns. NAB has a comprehensive Investor Relations engagement program, which aims to facilitate regular and extensive engagement between the Board and senior management and investors. Environmental, social and governance considerations, including climate and biodiversity risk regularly form a significant part of this engagement. And NAB's progress on such matters is reported through its annual public reports. These include the annual financial report, which contains disclosures aligned to the recommendations of the task force on climate-related financial disclosures. The annual review, which includes a comprehensive update on sustainability performance, investor presentations and the sustainability data packs. In addition, at each AGM, the Chair encourages shareholders to ask questions and make comments about NAB's performance on any issue that's relevant to shareholders as a whole. Shareholders are invited to submit questions before the AGM, which helps us understand shareholder issues and concerns and to address key areas of shareholder feedback at the meeting. Item 5B, which relates to transition planning disclosures, is conditional upon item A being supported by shareholders. The Board does not endorse item 5B either as we do not consider the resolution to be in the best interest of the company and shareholders as a whole. Our ongoing goals and progress delivering against our climate strategy, including our updated coal, oil and gas policies, and our risk settings, reflect what we consider to be an orderly and considered approach to responding to climate change while acknowledging the important role we play as a bank at providing finance to businesses as they transition to a lower carbon environment. The Board supports the continuation of the current orderly and considered approach that NAB has adopted with respect to climate action. Accordingly, the Board recommends that shareholders vote against the proposed resolution for item 5B. I would like to address a number of inaccuracies in the Market Forces' explanatory statement before asking shareholders and proxy holders to vote. Firstly, Market Forces claims there is a gap between NAB's action and the requirements under the IEA's Net Zero Emissions 2050 Scenario. This scenario outlines a path for the global energy sector to limit temperature rises to 1.5 degrees Celsius by 2050. NAB is using the IEA's Net Zero Emissions 2050 Scenario as the reference point to guide its decarbonization pathway for its energy sector exposures. This has been made clear in NAB's 2021 review. Secondly, Market Forces asserts that NAB is being left behind when compared to other financial institutions domestically and abroad. In fact, NAB is the only major Australian bank to have capped oil and gas extraction exposures. We're the only major Australian bank to put clear restrictions on direct financing of greenfield oil and gas extraction, and we are the only major Australian bank to have set a goal to reduce our oil and gas exposures from 2026 through 2050 aligned to that IEA scenario. This provides for a measured reorientation of our clients' activities, ensuring that NAB can continue to support clients committed to transitioning while also making sure that we continue to support national energy security, Australian jobs and communities. NAB has also updated its target to reduce thermal coal mining exposure by 50% by 2026 and to effectively 0 by 2030, apart from some performance guarantees to ensure the rehabilitation of existing thermal coal mining assets. This is consistent with the actions taken by our global peers with respect to thermal coal mining finance. In Item 5B, Market Forces requests that NAB disclosed and subsequent annual reporting information demonstrating how we will manage our fossil fuel exposure in accordance with the scenario in which global emissions reach net zero by 2050, including targets to reduce fossil fuel exposure consistent with net zero by 2050. Work has already well progressed at NAB in this regard. As outlined in my opening remarks in the next 12 months, NAB will disclose how we will align our lending to 8 key sectors against the 1.5-degree scenarios, including for power generation, residential property, manufacturing, transport and resources, among others. This is consistent with the requirements as a secretary to the collective commitment to climate action, of which NAB was the first Australian bank to become a member as well as the associated net zero banking alliance, which NAB has now recently joined. Australian bank to become a member as well as the associated net zero banking alliance, which NAB has now recently joined. NAB recognizes that achieving net zero emissions is a whole of economy challenge. NAB's climate strategy, therefore, seeks to support and work with all customers across all sectors to decarbonize and build resilience to climate change. Before asking shareholders and proxy holders to vote on these items, I'll invite a representative of market forces to speak to their resolution by way of the audio line. Virginia?

Please go ahead, shareholder.

I'm [indiscernible] from market [indiscernible]. We worked with shareholders to coordinate items by, and I'll speak briefly today in favor of the resolution, specifically calling on NAB to commit to no longer finance new fossil fuel projects and to disclose targets to reduce fossil fuel exposure consistent with net zero greenhouse gas emissions by 2050. NAB supports the net zero by 2050 goal. Final clients and energy modeling make it abundantly clear that achieving this goal leads no room for new fossil fuel projects and requires rapid declines in the production and use of coal, oil and gas. Yet NAB continues to provide funding for new fossil fuel projects and the company is pursuing them. Notably, its recently updated oil and gas policy contains an array of loopholes and allowances, permitting the bank to continue funding new oil and gas projects through a mix of corporate and project finance. Meanwhile, the bank's cap on oil and gas exposure covers only the upstream sector, allowing continued unrestricted funding for midstream and downstream oil and gas infrastructure. This resolution, therefore, presents a necessary opportunity to bring NAB's fossil fuel lending into line with its stable support for global climate goals. Failure to bridge this gap would leave NAB expose to needless financial climate change transition risks as well as reputation and legal risks as the world moves to rapidly decarbonize. Shareholders do not want to see this company exposed to stranded fossil fuel assets being publicly called out for funding climate companies or being -- inconsistencies between its statements and actions. We, therefore, ask shareholders to support this resolution with the long-term interest and sustainability of the company in mind and thank those that have already cast votes in favor of the resolution.

Thank you. Thank you, Jack. I just want to make a couple of comments for the benefit of our shareholders. NAB has taken a whole of economy approach to the issue of the net zero transition. And as we indicated earlier, we'll be coming up with sectoral policies in relation to 8 critical sectors next year. So we are well progressed on that work. So Jack, in particular, relating to your comments about midstream and downstream. By next year, I think you will see that we have covered those issues because we'll be covering transport energy production and so on. But we're going a lot further than that. And to put it into context for our shareholders, we have total credit exposures in the bank of around $1 trillion. That is 1,000 billion of total credit exposures. Our total exposures to the whole of the resources sector, including energy generation, represents approximately 1% of that amount. And within that, only 1/3 of 1% relates to coal and energy, either coal extraction or coal used for energy production. The much more important issue that shareholders should be concerned about is the other 99% of our lending portfolio and the carbon intensity of that and the transitions that are required in areas like the built infrastructure, for example. Commercial real estate, where we have a large footing. Agriculture, which, of course, is an important part of it. So it is much more important to us at NAB that we look at the climate transition as a whole of economy transition and not something specifically relating to a very small part of our business, even though it is obviously a significance in terms of its climate impact. So I just wanted shareholders to have an understanding that we're taking a much broader approach to the whole issue of the energy transition than just some sort of tokenism about oil and gas. But Virginia, do we have any questions on the proposed amendment to the company's constitution, climate change, transition, planning disclosures or climate change matters more generally?

So we have a question from Ms. Diana [indiscernible]. At last year's AGM, I noted that commonwealth bank has disclosed an assessment finding that the Australian grains livestock and dairy agriculture sectors faced declines in productivity and profitability of 40% to 50% out to 20 60 as a result of climate change impacts unless mitigating steps are taken. And I asked what the anticipated change is to the default rate in our agribusiness loan book under scenarios of unmitigated climate-related losses. In response, I was told, we don't have a number, but that this is an issue, we have spent a lot of time on. Given we market ourselves as Australia's largest aggregate business lenders and that we've had another year to spend on it, I expect we now know the answer. So where am I able to find it? The whole point of the task force for climate-related financial disclosures is about investors like us knowing how secure our capital is. We need to know if our money is safe with this bank.

Thank you. Thank you very much for that question. And I think in respect to the comments I've just made, you'll appreciate that I think this question is of considerable importance. The agricultural sector is a large source of emissions. It's also a large source of potential abatement of emissions. And it's a significant part of our business. And it's exactly for sectors like this that were embarked on the serious work, of looking at climate impacts. I'm sorry, we haven't been able to come up with an answer to the question as yet, but there is considerable work underway through the international bodies that I've been referring to previously, such as the collective commitment to climate action and the Net zero Banking Alliance, to agree on methodology so that we adopt an industry standard approach to how these things are measured. And that's why it's taking a little bit longer. But we are concerned that this is an important area. And we're also required by our regulator, the APRA to do climate vulnerability assessment. So there will be a regulatory overlay as well. So Ms. [indiscernible], I can assure you that this is something that actually we do take very seriously. And I appreciate your drawing attention to it because clearly, it's a much more significance to the bank than as I've mentioned earlier, they're relatively small exposures we have to industries like coal, oil and gas. So we are looking at that very seriously. And I can assure you that we'll be cooperating, particularly through the -- task force on financial disclosure pilots that are underway now. Virginia, do we have any further questions?

We have an audio question from Kara [indiscernible].

I'm Kara. I'm from Narrabri, Northwest New South Wales. Also [indiscernible] traditional owner and custodian. My question is, when will you stop financing coal and gas companies like White Haven Coles and finance renewables as a major energy source in Northwest New South Wales. Thank you.

Well, I think I've indicated that we'll be exiting our thermal coal exposures by 2030, and we are putting considerable effort into financing renewables, wherever we can. I don't intend to get to business of naming every individual clients, indeed, I have no intention of doing so. And the reason that we put the caps in place, so net zero thermal coal by 2030, USD 2.4 billion of oil and gas exposures out to 2026, and then down to zero consistent with zero by 2050 is so that shareholders and other concerned individuals can be assured without having to pour over individual names that the aggregate of our exposures are in decline, and it's not particularly productive to name customers in that regard. So it is something we take seriously. And Kara, thank you very much for your question and your concerns. We absolutely agree with your proposition that we should be financing more renewable energy, and we'll be looking for every opportunity to do so.

There, we have an audio question from Chief [indiscernible].

As shareholders of the National Australia Bank, you should know that your company is not upholding its own commitments to respect indigenous and human rights. Bank proposed that your financing follows the United Nations declaration on the rate of indigenous people. And at your low CAD 117.5 million to Coastal Gaslink, a pipeline that has never received free prior or informed consent from the title owners of the land that the pipeline was across. The Supreme Court of Canada recognized in 1997 [indiscernible] plan landmark case that there were certain hereditary Chiefs, as myself and 6 others have never ceased to hold rates over the [indiscernible] land. Coastal Gaslink is illegally constructing on our land and now my people are being forcefully, violently evicted by police forces from our own territory. How do you reconcile your company's supposed commitments to un-group on financing a project that is illegal and committing human rights violations and perpetuating the operations of indigenous people for the purpose of [indiscernible].

Thank you, Chief, for the question. For the shareholders who aren't familiar with it. This relates to my understanding as it relates to an oil -- sorry, gas pipeline in Canada. And all I can say is that we do look into environmental and social risk on projects. There's a set of principles, known as the Equator principles that set out how that is done. But I can also assure shareholders looking forward that we have no intention of doing any further greenfields, gas or oil, as I've said, extraction outside of Australia. So this is a historical issue only. Virginia, do we have another question?

There, we have an audio question from Josi [indiscernible].

I'm Josi. I'm a traditional owner of the [indiscernible] of Murujuga. The Murujuga rock art in WA is slowly being destroyed by acid rain, produced by a local industry. What is happening to the rock art has been referred to as Juukan Gorge in slow motion. Woodside's proposed expansion of its Pluto facility would only exacerbate this process and lead to the loss of this ancient and important part of my heritage. That is arranging this finance for global infrastructure partners to partner with Woodside and fund this expansion. Is the NAB Board comfortable with this involvement in facilitating the destruction of 40,000 year old cultural heritage. And will you come to Murujuga, so that I can show you what's at stake, and I can show you my journey that is going to be ruined and wrecked.

So thank you for the question, Josi, I just referred to the comment I made earlier, which is we fully intend to scale down our lending in the oil and gas sector. We've formed a view that we will do no further aggregate lending, i.e. we'll cap our exposures to the $2.4 million that we currently have. And after 2026, we'll be reducing it. I'm not going to comment as to which individual customers or projects set under the $2.4 billion cap, it would be unproductive and it changes frequently. But that is a limit. And it is a clear intention by this bank to help the process of the decarbonization of the Australian economy towards a net zero by 2050. And we take that seriously, and we'll continue that work. But thank you for raising the important sensitivities in Northwestern Australia. Virginia, do we have another question?

Chair, we have a question from Abigail Sheppard.

Good morning, everyone. Can you hear me?

Yes, we can. Thank you.

Good. Sorry, there have been problems. I was disconnected earlier. My question is specifically about legal risk issues in connection with the sort of climate issues that have already been put to you this morning. It's 1 question, but it's in 2 parts. If you just bear with me. The first question is whether or not you're aware of the advice of Noel Hutley SC that's been published by the center of a policy development about corporate legal obligations in connection with climate issues. If you are -- the second part of the question is that on the basis that if you are. Mr. [indiscernible] most recent advice, and he's issued several pieces of advice clearly identifies how important it is for companies to have a reasonable basis for their statements about climate goals and targets and about the risk of the legal consequences of greenwashing, that is making inaccurate commitments or without a reasonable basis. Now clearly, you've been referred a number of times today to your statements that NAB is helping the transition to a low-carbon economy and its plan is to support its customers to achieve net zero emissions and to achieve net zero emissions portfolio by 2050. And you've also referred to the international Energy Agency and others have referred to its recommendations this year, that there is no need for investment in new fossil fuel supply. You've also been referred to the fact that NAB has continued to support fossil fuel projects, including some new ones, that in the light of these matters and the matters raised by Mr. [indiscernible] advice, are you concerned about NAB, having engaged in green washing?

I think the approach taken by NAB, which is to work with the internationally recognized bodies on a whole of bank approach to the net zero transition is exactly to avoid greenwashing. And as I said, the -- we don't want to embark on any form of tokenism. We want to look at what the real implications are for the Australian economy of moving to a net zero emissions world by 2050. We've, in fact, the -- a lot of focus has been put on the nature of the disclosures and in the nature of commitments that we have made for the very reason that you've articulated, which is that we should not be making any commitment or making any disclosure that we cannot support. And one of the reasons that we're taking our time and take a couple of questions earlier on were asking why we couldn't provide some more information earlier on 1 or 2 sectors. And the reason is that we are ensuring that we have a proper basis for any disclosures that we make. Or any commitment that we make. And it's very much driven by the risk of misleading our investors and therefore, the legal risk that, that would open us up to. So yes, we take those issues very seriously. And it's one of the reasons why we're taking the audit approach of focusing on the frameworks that come out of the bodies that we've been joining, such as the collective commitment on climate action and the net 0 banking alliance. And working with the task force on climate-related disclosures to ensure that we properly manage these issues. So thank you for raising the point because it is an important point to be made. But you may rest assured that the reason that we're focused on the whole of economy or whole of business approach is very much to avoid any suggestion of Greenwashing. Virginia, do we have another question?

Here, we have an audio question from Sally [indiscernible] on behalf of Caroline [indiscernible]. Please go ahead with your question, Sally.

Hi. I'm Sally [indiscernible]. I'm calling in from my farm in Northwest New South Wales in [indiscernible] country. I grew up learning about money from signing checks with the National Bank. We were a traditional farming family who would visit our local national bank branch frequently and with family friends at the bank manager. For this reason, NAB has a special place in my consciousness around family values, agricultural values, honesty and integrity. Myself and 4 of my neighbors met with the NAB sustainability team earlier this year, and we really did appreciate them hearing our accounts of the impacts created by Whitehaven coal, and this was a much better response than we had from other banks. So I thank you for that. What coal, along with its associated entities have so far had 46 breaches, fines, official cautions and penalty notices in the last 9 years. 46 breaches is not a normal way of doing business. This is a systemic calculated and planned method of operating. It's a conscious decision to choose to break the laws to their legal activity and accept the fine as part of the cost of doing business. This is not how the rest of us run businesses. One tiny -- is an example of the way that this company treated my community, I take you back to 2019 in the height of the worst drought in living memory. My family lost our income, we sold down our herd and asset base, and we all tried to hunker down against the unrelenting dust storms, the heat and the dry out Rivers and dams. We stopped doing business as dictated by the conditions. At the very time, Whitehaven was illegally stealing surface water out of the catchment that they have since been found. They were also buying up more of my neighbor's land that were never supposed to be bought out for the projects. They just needed the water licenses. So they built illegal pipeline that they were also -- just to keep operating despite the fact that their conditions state that if they do not have enough water, operations need to change to suit the availability of water, just as we did as. We have did not wrote multiple. By providing finance to an environmentally and socially reprehensible company likewise happen, the NAB Board, staff and shareholders are part of the problem. The standard that you walk past is the standard that you accept. I once again invite NAB members to the northwest to be able to see firsthand these issues because there are more coal mines expanding and new cold projects proposed for this region. A lot more. My question to the Board and shareholders of NAB is, when will you hold financing environmentally and socially reprehensible companies such as coal and its associated entities that are continuing to expand and seek no approvals in this region. Thank you.

Thank you. Thank you, Sally. And actually, I quite like the idea of heading out to rural New South Wales. I was limited to 5,000 radius from home for so long. It sounds quite attractive together. I'm not sure if I'll be able to do so, but it's pleasing that our sustainability team are able to meet with you. I hope you appreciate that it's impossible for me to speak about another company at our AGM. But can I just draw your attention to the process that we're underway at the moment, which is we're reviewing all of our largest emitting customers or top 100 of the largest submitting companies to understand what they are doing to improve the sustainability of their businesses. And it is our expectation that if we're not able to get satisfied that companies have credible transition plans that we would progressively, I guess, bank with other people or have them bank with other people. But I don't want to make any specific comment about any specific customer in that regard. So thank you for the question. Virginia, do you have another question?

We have a question from Glenn Walker. NAB has the worst coal power generation policy of all Australia's banks with a very weak target of 45% emission reduction by 2030 for power generation customers. This is different to the thermal coal mining policy and is completely at odds with the UN, IEA and IPCC called for Australia to stop burning coal by 2030 to meet the goals of the Paris Climate agreement. Given this, will the Board commit to urgently updating climate policies to ensure no funding is provided to companies burning call beyond 2030. And I'd like a specific time commitment, please?

Well, electricity generation is one of the 8 sectors that we'll be committing our plans for -- or creating our plans for over the next 12 months. So by this time next year, we should be able to satisfy you by having a clear, coherent and well thought through position in respect of electricity generation. And in line with one of our earlier questioners, we'll be making sure that it is fully auditable, i.e., that any commitments we make can be supported. So thank you for raising it. And I guess it just draws attention to the work we're doing across all sectors. It's not just about extraction of coal or extraction of oil and gas. It's the much more important downstream and midstream uses of all of the climate submitting products or -- emitting products that we need to consider. And I think it's good that our shareholders are able to see that there's a broad range of issues that we need to take into account outside of just the extracted industries. So thank you for that. Virginia, do you have another question?

Chair. We have a question from Mr. Stephen David [indiscernible]. I've never understood why Australian boards continue to resist opinion based resolutions when these are standard in the U.S. What is so wrong about a group of shareholders putting up a resolution that expresses an opinion. Instead, we effectively have a board monopoly over what resolutions are put up. Shareholder resolutions are a great way to gauge shareholder sentiment. Climate campaigns are now getting around this restriction with the contingent resolutions model. So why not just embrace this constitutional amendment. You won't get deluged with resolutions because it will still have the significant obstacle of requiring support from 100 shareholders or 5% of the ordinary shares, whereas in the U.S., any single shareholder who has held 2,000 worth of shares for more than 12 months can put an opinion based shareholder resolution.

Thanks, Stephen. I think I've articulated, but I'll give my reasoning and perhaps and plain a language. The Board is charged with governing this company. And it is not useful to move to an environment where it looks like we're being a referendum based organization. So we take soundings from our shareholders on a whole range of issues. And I think our shareholders have spoken very conclusively. I think today, the resolution 5 A has being opposed by something like 95% of the direct and proxy votes already lodged. So I think we've got overwhelming support for the Board's position, and I don't see any reason why we would change that. Frankly, it's not that hard to get 100 shareholders to put up a resolution as we've seen over the last few years at NAB. So I simply don't accept the proposition, Stephen, and 95% of our shareholders by value support that. Virginia, do you have another question?

Chair, we have an audio question from Jack [indiscernible]. Please go ahead with your question. Shareholder.

So it's Jeff from [indiscernible]. I'm just circling back around to ask the question that I posed at item one. So that is in light of the international energy agency finding that reducing emissions net 0 by 2050 leaves no room for new property supply projects and also given NAB updated policy last month, which left the door open to continued funding for these projects company is pursuing them. I noted that NAB, at the time that it was announcing the policy update was also reportedly arranging funds for the acquisition of Pluto LNG train 2. That acquisition enables Woodside to press ahead with the gas project, the largest greenfield gas development in Australia in a decade. Over twice time, the emissions from the Scarborough pluto project would total 1.6 billion tonnes of CO2 equivalent to 15 coal-fired power stations running for 30 years. So in light of the overwhelming evidence that there's no room for new fossil fuel project require to achieve the Paris agreement and net 0 by 2050? What evidence can produce that enabling an additional 1.6 billion tonnes of CO2, is in any way compatible with limiting global warming to 1.5 degrees.

So the reading our reading of the IEA report envisages that electricity production will be increasingly reliant on gas in the near-term in order to retire coal-fired power stations. But when we reviewed that increasing use of gas, we formed the view that we would not be increasing our gas exposures. And hence, the capping of our exposure at $2.4 billion for the period between now and out to 2026. So the important thing here was that we have kept that exposure even though the IEA envisages gas usage increasing in the near term, and that's how we came to our landing. i.e., as I've already indicated, the individual customers' exposures that make up the $2.4 billion is not something I'll be engaging in dialogue around at the Annual General Meeting. So that's about all I can offer on that one, Jack. So thank you for your question, and thank you for your contribution earlier on the -- introducing the resolution. Virginia, do we have another question?

Chair. We have an audio question from Dr. Mary Ann Heath. He thank you.

I'm a former professor of law, and I'm interested in National Australia Bank's compliance with its own sustainability statement, which says that National Australia Bank is working with its customers to support implementation of low-carbon transition plans. So that National Australia Bank will achieve a net zero emissions lending portfolio by 2050. Can you explain how National Australia bank supports the implementation of low-carbon transition plans, while it continues to support new fossil fuel projects such as that put forward by Whitehaven Coal and referred to in some of the other questions.

As I indicated earlier, we take a very broad approach to working with our customers on transition plans. And I appreciate that many of our questioners today want to talk about coal and oil or coal and gas in particular. But actually, we're taking a much more wide-ranging approach to the transition. Our corporate institutional team have been meeting with the companies, the top 100 companies that have significant emissions footprint. And we have had education sessions for the Board with representatives from the United Nations environment program. Those that have worked on the IEA transition documents. We've had dialogue. I had a session with the chairs of a large number -- or a large number -- a number of large Australian companies across diverse industries. And we're looking at the much more important issue of how the economy as a whole -- that transition. So we do take it very seriously. And you bring up the issue of our legal compliance with our commitments. We take that very seriously. And that's why we are taking the whole economy approach, and that's why we are using the framework that we get from the -- collective commitment to climate action and the Net zero Banking Alliance, along with working on the various working parties set up under the fast force for climate-related disclosures. So shareholders can rest assured that we are taking a very serious and measured approach to our climate transition planning. Virginia, do we have any more questions?

Chair, we have an audio question from Molly Wickham.

This is [indiscernible]. I am the spokesperson for the [indiscernible]. I was arrested at gun point on November 19 on my own territory, and removed from my territory by the RCMP under Supreme Court instruction by "gas lighting" this project, which is just trespassing on our territory. I was in prison for 5 days and at Coastal Gaslink's request, I was given conditions of my release, not to enter my own territory, and I'm also restricted from accessing my own territory. I was removed by RCMP from my own territory violently at gun point with RCMP [indiscernible]. Is the kind of reputation that your bank is willing to take this kind of direct action against indigenous people on their own land, contributing to the genocide of our people to [indiscernible] used and are you willing to take on those for that in Europe and [indiscernible] of the National Bank.

Thank you for the question. I guess this is the same as the question earlier here, the other -- be inquired. I just relate to the point that this project was evaluated on ground sort of environmental, social risk climate was undertaken. And I have nothing further that I can add at this point of the meeting. Virginia, do we have another question.

Chair, we have a question from Mr. Glen Walker. The chair has referred to the percentage of the business funding fossil fuel companies. But the fact is that even a modest amount of funding for one of these businesses helps make these polluting operations viable and therefore, leverages substantial greenhouse gas emissions. Has the bank fully quantified the greenhouse gas emissions it facilitates through its funding. What is that figure? And how is this calculated?

Thank you. And thank you. It's exactly the point I was trying to make before, which is we are trying to move to a model where we look at our finance emissions. And that is that transition I was talking about and why we are undertaking the important work of doing the 8 industry evaluations over the next year because the point you make is exactly the point I'm trying to make, which is that our emissions intensity of our agriculture business, our commercial property, heavy industry, transport. Under any measure, will be much more significant than the emissions that we have financed through oil, gas and coal. And I thank you for drawing attention, Mr. Walker to that because it's extraordinarily important that this point is made that our finance emissions is how we should be thinking about this going forward. And once you see those finance emissions, you'll understand why we think it's important to move the focus away from oil and gas and coal and onto the broader transition for the Australian economy. So it's a very important point and. Virginia, do we have another question?

Chair, we have an audio question from Karen Large. Shareholder.

I'm just putting forward the 2 questions that I had put forward earlier under item one. There are 2 questions, but they're both related. The first one is the International Energy Agency, stated earlier this year that no new fossil fuel projects should be approved in order to achieve net 0 by 2050. In light of this, when will now commit to provide no further finance to companies such as Woodside and BHP, who are planning to develop the controversial Scarborough gas field of the Western Australian Coast? And my second question is related to NAB's recently released oil and gas policy, which includes a commitment to only consider financing greenfield gas extraction in Australia, where it plays a role in underpinning national energy security. Can you confirm that this means NAB won't provide financing for Woodside and BHP's controversial Scarborough gas development, which is predominantly for export. Thank you.

Thank you. Now I think I have actually answered these questions to other questioners. But I will just repeat that we have a clear policy on oil and gas, which caps the exposures. We've set out that we're not going to do greenfields, gas, although there are potential carve-outs for integrated LNG and for national energy security. But I do need to reassure concern shareholders that even where those carve-outs are applied, they will still sit within the $2.4 million exposure. And therefore, the be no net expansion of our financing of emissions in that regard. So -- and as I've already indicated to other questions, I have no intention of discussing individual customers or individual projects because we'll be communicating a financed emissions framework as the basis for our disclosures. So I think that answers it as best as I'm going to be able to Virginia. Next question.

Chair, we have a question from [indiscernible] Proprietary Limited. Congratulations on integrating climate change risk into your credit risk assessments and the actions planned over the next 12 months to which you have referred. These issues have been raised by shareholders over the last decade. What lessons has the board drawn from the fact that it has taken a decade to adopt these policies?

Thank you for that. In the last turn a bit years when I've been chair and even before that, we have been working to develop a coherent approach. We signed up to the collective commitment on climate action in 2019. So it's certainly over 2 years since we've taken these issues seriously. When we made that commitment to the ACCA, we set out that over the ensuing 2 to 3 years, we would be coming up with sector policies, and that's the timetable that we've been following. So thank you for recognizing the work we've done, but we fully appreciate that there's a lot of work ahead of us for us and for our customers as we help the Australian economy transition to a low-carbon future. So that work is far from done. But the Board has been quite deeply engaged. As I said earlier, we've had significant sessions over the course of this year, understanding the frameworks, understanding what the IEA report serves what it means. And then working with the frontline bankers who are having the conversations with customers to understand these transition plans. So I appreciate your comments on that. Virginia, do you to have another question, please.

Chair, we have a question from National Nominees Limited. These questions are from Stuart Palma of Australian Ethical Investment. Does the bank's commitment not to fund greenfield gas applied to all bank finance, would the bank make a new or refinanced corporate loan to a company, which is implementing a strategy of developing greenfield oil and gas extraction projects? What is the scope of the exception for gas projects, which help underpin national energy security, given the alternative technologies and investment opportunities available to deliver energy security.

So thank you, Mr. Palmer. The first part of your question, I guess, gets me back to where I've been saying about needing to have the finance emissions intensity or financed emissions framework implemented, which we're looking to do over the coming years. Because ultimately, we need to get out of the measurement approaches that we've used historically around project financing and direct lending to talk about the total financing that we have to companies engaged in various industries. And it cuts to the comment I've made about working with the top 100 customers in terms of the emissions work to understand their transition plans. So the answer to your question is that, over time, you should progressively see us adopting an approach where we will be directing our financing towards those companies that have credible transition plans. So that's the first part of it. The second part, the exception for gas projects that underpin national energy security is intended to deal with an extreme situation only. And while -- and I guess I'm agreeing with your point, we believe that there will be alternative technologies to deliver energy security, but they are not sufficiently scalable or robust as at today. But as those technologies improve and as the management of the electricity grid in Australia has improved, we envisage that renewables can and will be able to make up 100% of the energy needs of the country, and therefore, we should not be needing to rely on the national energy security carve-out. And I'll just reassess or reaffirm here, even with that carve-out, anything we did would still be under the cap that we've indicated. Virginia?

Chair, we have a question from [indiscernible] So do I take your last comment to mean that some shareholders' opinion should not be heard or expressed, although they financially support the company.

No. I'm going to guess here that the term last comment refers to an earlier comment I made about the 95% of our shareholders who voted against the resolution. I think that let me know if I've got that wrong. No, I hope you realize by my patience here today and listening to questions that I'm very happy to listen to our shareholders' opinions on a range of issues. And I hope you'll have seen over the last couple of years, I've been happy to hear and welcome questions on our policy. I'm here to explain it as much as I can, and we're here to take your questions. So now that you should not take any suggestion that voices should not be heard or opinion should not be expressed.

Chair, we have an audio question from Johanna, Chris Gardner. Shareholder.

Thank you. My question, which I asked in the first section. So I'm just asking it again. And my question is about is about our exposure to energy and resources. Page 36 of our annual review shows our lending coal mining and oil and gas extraction. Having read through the annual and supplementary reports of our major competitors, ANZ, CBA and Westpac, it's apparent that our disclosures are quite limited by capacity. Compared to us, CBA and Westpac both disclosed their exposure to the energy value chain. For instance, these banks not only disclose exposure to coal mining, but also the coal ports and rail. All 3 of the other banks also disclose exposure to not only oil and gas extraction, the transportation, refining and retail, including LNG terminals, for example. So my question is when will NAB publish its exposure to the energy value chain as our major competitors have done. Can you give me today.

Thank you. Yes, and thank you. I do remember the question now. So I think I've indicated in response to a couple of other question is that we are doing the 8 sector emissions intensity exposure plans or, in fact, our energy intensity plans for those sectors over the next 12 months. So the date that we should have, the type of information that you're requesting is for this time next year. And we've just been working through with our global peers to make sure that we've got the methodology right to do that on a globally consistent basis. But we absolutely intend to do so. So thank you for the question, Johanna. Virginia?

Chair, we have no further questions on this item of business.

Well, if there are no further questions, I'm now formally going to put the motion 5 A that NAB's constitution be amended to insert into the constitution in clause 8 general meetings. The following you subclause, 3 a advisory resolution that the company and general meeting made by ordinary resolution Express an opinion or request information about the way in which a power of the company, partially or exclusively vested and directors has been or should be exercised. Such institution -- such a resolution rather must relate to a material risk identified by the directors of the company and cannot advocate action that would violate any law or relate to any personal claim or grievance. Such resolution is advisory only and does not bind the directors of the company. Direct and proxy votes received in advance of the meeting for this item are now displayed on the screen. Please record you right now, if you've not already voted. Based on the results of direct voting in advance of the meeting and the proxy votes, we are able to determine that this resolution has failed. Item 5 A was -- as Item 5 A rather was not successful, Item 5 B will not be put to the meeting. As I said earlier, in the spirit of transparency, we will now share the direct and proxy votes received in advance of the meeting in relation to this conditional item. They are now displayed on the screen. That now covers all of the formal business before the annual General meeting. I'll now open the meeting to any general questions, which have yet to be addressed. Virginia, do we have anything further?

We have a question from Denmark Dream Proprietary limited from. Chairman, could you confirm the banking code of practice continues to form part of NAB's relevant lending contracts, which provides consumers safeguards and protections that are not set out in the law?

I believe that the banking code of practice has specific coverage, and I'm trying to end its business customers up to a couple of million. It's for personal care systems. Do we voluntarily to small business customers. And that was a voluntarily compliance issue. I recall that. So that does, therefore, by extension, to form part of our lending contracts. And the code then becomes the basis on which a customer can go to the Code compliance committee, if there's any concern that the code has been breached. So by extension customers that are covered by the code can rely on the code as an extension of our individual -- our credit contracts. So yes, that's the answer to that question. Virginia, another question?

Chair, we have a question from Mr. Dennis Silvan [indiscernible]. Why are there no subtitles or a signed language interpreter?

Thank you. I do not know the answer to that question, and I'll look at that as an opportunity to improve the function of our Annual General meeting for future meetings. So a very good point, and let me take that on that to sort of deal with it. So if there are no further questions, then on behalf of the Board, the executives and staff of the company, I'd like to thank you for joining us today. I'd also like to thank our customers and shareholders for their continued support of National Australia Bank. I now formally declare this Annual General meeting closed and confirm that voting will remain open for a further 10 minutes to allow ample time for shareholders and proxy holders to submit any final votes. Voting results will be released to the ASX and will also be available on the AGM page of our website. Thank you.