Novus Holdings Limited (NVS) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Good morning, ladies and gentlemen, and welcome to this presentation on the Novus 2021 financial results. I'd just like to, before we begin, draw your attention to the little white block on the screen, which gives some protocol for the meeting. [Operator Instructions] And we will consolidate the questions and then deal with them right at the end. So please feel free to raise those questions as we go through the presentation. I'm Neil Birch, the Novus CEO, and I will be joined in my presentation with -- by Harry Todd, our CFO. The financial year was largely within the lockdown period and the subsequent slow unlock of the economy, which is still actually underway. This period was truly unique and incomparable to anything which we have experienced before. As such, these results reflect the efforts to mitigate the effects of the pandemic and to reposition the business for sustainability under a new normal, which is actually still fully to be determined. The format today will be executive overview, running through a financial review, some look at operational aspects. And then we'll spend some time on the outlook, and then we'll conclude and finish off with questions. Investors may recall that at the time of presenting the interim results, we rather boldly shared our views on how the balance of the year might unfold for Novus. We felt that an effective breakeven was achievable, and notwithstanding the further subsequent alcohol trade restrictions, we're rather pleased to have managed that. In the midst of the difficult trading and restructuring exercises, the group continued to demonstrate significant cash generation capacity. We look at the salient aspects of our performance. You can see that the revenue was substantially impacted by the trading losing close to ZAR 1 billion of normal budgeted turnover in the Print area. So we're down 31% as a group. As I said, we're getting very close to a breakeven, so operating profit was sitting at approximately ZAR 20 million minus, which translates into headline loss per share of ZAR 0.054. Free cash flow under the circumstances was good at ZAR 362 million, up nicely on the prior year. And then we're very pleased to resume a dividend payment as well. So we have declared a dividend of ZAR 0.50 per share and that will be coming out in a format, which will have an [ interim ] flexibility and may include the opportunity to take up some strip instead of a dividend -- the cash dividend. As we move on to the financial, I'm going to -- review, I'm going to hand over to Harry Todd, who will take on this part of the presentation for us.

Yes. Good morning, everyone. Yes. As Neil said, the past year will be remembered for the wrong reasons, and this applies to the Novus group as well. During the past year, our business was devastated by unprecedented challenges, challenges that necessitated the closure or consolidation of 4 print plants, retrenchment of more than 400 staff members and the loss of 5 precious lives. Trading was severely disrupted and revenue declined by 31% for the year. This was similar to the turnover reduction in the first half. The year-on-year reduction in turnover amounted to close to ZAR 1.3 billion with over ZAR 1 billion lost in the Print division. Volumes were down across all the Print categories, but worst affected in newspapers and magazines and to a lesser degree, retail inserts and books. In the Packaging division, the beverage market was severely disrupted and wreaked havoc with our labels business, which also shed revenue of 32%. ITB was less affected as it supplies flexible packaging for the food and pet industry. The H1 versus H2 historical revenue seasonality was maintained at 46% in H2. The reduction in gross profit to ZAR 540 million was similar in magnitude to the revenue decline. A small improvement in gross profit percentage can be attributed to a reduction in depreciation but also lower maintenance and other production costs. Raw material prices in print were negatively affected by higher than inflationary increases on imported paper that proved difficult to recover from many print customers. Margins in the Packaging and Tissue segments were mostly static and/or increased compared to last year. The ForEx rates were highly volatile, but our forward-buying policy effectively softened the impact of any severe fluctuations. This led to a mostly stable GP of 19%. Given the disrupted trading conditions, overheads and expenses were addressed aggressively and reduced by ZAR 81 million to ZAR 560 million, a drop of 12.6%. Included in the overheads were certain once-off costs. Retreatment costs were ZAR 18 million. COVID-related expenses were close to ZAR 2 million and the inevitable load shedding costs amounted to ZAR 4 million. And these can hardly be considered to be once-off anymore. The drop in overheads was also assisted by the nonrecurrence of tissue expenses in the second half, which amounted to ZAR 10 million in the prior year. The overhead reduction was insufficient to counter the reduced revenue and margin and resulted in an operating loss of ZAR 20 million. This excludes the impact of impairments. The reduction in operating profit is similar to the decline in headline earnings per share, which dropped to a loss of ZAR 0.054 per share. In the prior year, impairments to plant and equipment amounting to ZAR 438 million were accounted for. The similar exercise was undertaken this year and resulted in a further impairment amounting to ZAR 39 million. Earnings per share, including the above-mentioned impairments, resulted in a loss per share of ZAR 0.083. Move to the next slide. Thank you. The highly disrupted trading conditions led the group to intensify its cash preservation strategy, which focused heavily on the reduction of net working capital, capital expenditure, avoidable spending and the unfortunate cessation of dividends. The poor trading conditions discussed in the income statement yielded a reduction in cash generation from operations of ZAR 89 million. The highlight of a dismal year was the focused reduction in net working capital, which harvested much needed cash of ZAR 250 million. Net capital expenditure amounted to an inflow of ZAR 26 million. Proceeds on disposed assets amounted to ZAR 59 million and exceeded the capital expenditure of ZAR 34 million. Taxation paid was negligible and contributed to free cash flow of ZAR 362 million compared to the ZAR 336 million in the prior year. The investment in associate refers to the deconsolidation and sale of 51% of the Tissue business, and the related party loan advanced to essentially fund our working capital share on an equity basis of 49%. Dividends were suspended in the prior year but will recommence later this year. This resulted in a favorable net cash position at year-end of ZAR 443 million, which assisted immensely in negating the dire cash flow consequences caused by the lockdown. Consequently, the gearing long- and short-term debt as a percentage of equity in the group remains low at 5%. Loans in the group essentially consists of capitalized lease obligations related to IFRS 16 amounting to ZAR 105 million and asset-based finance of ZAR 13 million, making up the ZAR 118 million reconciliation to net cash. Move to the next slide. The cash flow movements for the year are more easily illustrated in a waterfall graph, showing the opening cash balance of ZAR 175 million plus EBITDA of ZAR 90 million, which is operating loss together with depreciation. The biggest inflow was from the reduction in net working capital amounting to ZAR 250 million. Capital expenditure was meager and difficult to undertake in a restricted travel and lockdown environment. The cash inflow from the disposal of underutilized print assets amounted to ZAR 59 million. The repayment of loans and net finance costs amounted to ZAR 38 million, resulting in a favorable closing cash balance of ZAR 443 million. The past 2 years has yielded over ZAR 0.5 billion in net working capital reduction. Our biggest focus was on reducing inventory, which is halved over the 4 periods. Trade debtors dropped as a consequence of weaker trading conditions, but collections have been disciplined in a very difficult environment. The net working capital reduction was partly assisted by the disruptive year, and the small reinvestment in working capital can be expected as trade normalizes. Capital expenditure has been constrained over the past 4 years to assist cash preservation, but equally so, growth opportunities have also been difficult to initiate in a soft economy. CapEx maintenance will continue, will require some catch-up in this year but will remain below depreciation costs. Thank you very much, and I hand over to Neil, and we'll be present for questions at the end.

Thank you, Harry. We'll move now into a bit more detail on what happened within the operations in the segments. We take a look at the group to start with, and a lot of this is repetition from some of the numbers that Harry shared with you. But effectively, from a dominance point of view, printing still is our major source of revenue and income, and that's still contributing to 75% of our revenue. The print reduction was pretty severe across all categories of Print, and in a later slide, you'll see to the extent it may have moved between different segments, but it was material across all. Strangely enough, our gross profit margin managed to improve slightly and again, as highlighted by Harry as it relates to a reduced depreciation charge. But there was an element of pushback against that reduction with an improvement in margin from some of the product mix issues and some fluctuations in some paper prices. What we have seen in recent months and towards the end of the financial year was that the resurgence in the rest of the world economy and the demand for commodities has pushed the pressure on supply of international commodities, and we have found certain amount of difficulty sourcing paper at the level that we normally would, but we're hoping that will settle down shortly. Packaging was the least affected by the whole lockdown, very much in the ITB side that we managed to sustain the business quite well. A fair amount of what they do is deemed essential and continued under the rather difficult conditions. Whilst, of course, the labels business took a severe [ hit ] really from the alcohol brands and our high dependence on the production of beer bottle labels. So if we look at the gross margin, it was a bit of a mixed picture, but the net effect was in fact a slight improvement in group gross margin, which we're rather pleased about. And of course, we talked about the operating loss coming out at approximately ZAR 20 million, which, under the circumstances, we think was well contained. The operating expenses were reduced by ZAR 81 million compared to financial year '20, and we do expect that to improve. So on a year-on-year basis, we would anticipate in the 2022 year that our expense structure will decline by in excess of ZAR 100 million per annum, and we will be looking to maintain that level of cost reduction irrespective of a bounce back in revenues. If you look more specifically at Print, and thereto, we managed to sustain a margin, at least actually slightly improve the margin. But you can see the severity of revenue loss dropping very close to ZAR 1 billion in overall revenue across all the categories. And as we've said, the depreciation saving due to the prior year's impairments did help the gross margin. And of course, the only essential maintenance was carried out, and in some instances, the essential maintenance had to be delayed due to the inability of foreign technicians to travel. We look at the final operating profit in the Print segment. They obviously were down to a small loss, a bigger loss than the group loss. Obviously, that was compensated by the operating divisions. But under the circumstances, considering the difficulties and some of the additional costs being incurred as part of the restructure, I think this was a very good result and an acceptable result. As you can see in the final bullet point, we had retrenchment costs this year and the prior year, but in this year, they exceeded the prior year loss of nearly ZAR 7 million. Harry also alluded to the fact that we had some ongoing unusual costs, and that was obviously in terms of load shedding. And this is really a little concerning because that was only in a portion of the year. It wasn't at the extent of the load shedding which we're experiencing at the moment in the current year. Packaging, and it's important to understand that Packaging consists of both the ITB operation and the labels operation. Labels had a very, very difficult year, as alluded to, whereas ITB, I think had a very responsible year. The situation in the ITB product environment was the competitiveness. As much as there was the continued demand for product, the overall slow economy that we've been dealing with for the last couple of years and still persists is making conditions in the packaging sector competitive. And therefore, we're having to respond with improved efficiencies and running the business on a very, very careful basis. Effectively, we did have some very good expense containment, which allowed us to still extract a reasonable operating profit out of ITB even with a slight decline in volume. So ITB had a revenue decline of 10.2% and against a volume decline of 7.8%, which obviously suggests a bit of margin pressure, which again was recovered through the expense management. The Tissue segment, which is -- this will be the final time that we comment in detail about the Tissue business due to our [ disinvestment debt ] from. As of 1st of October, we became 49% shareholders in this business, and it was quite a long drawn-out protracted transaction, certainly not assisted by the COVID pandemic, which did delay quite a few of the processes. But ultimately the effective date was the 1st of October. And while we're saying we managed to finalize the deal post year-end, that was really relating to certain cash flow items and normalizing of the financing of the business between the 2 current shareholders. What is good to see is that, in Tissue, they managed to move the gross margin up year-on-year, and the loss at operating level was only ZAR 2.6 million compared to ZAR 19.1 million in the financial year '20. It is pleasing to see that, effectively, that business is running on at least a breakeven from a cash point of view. And we think the prospects for that business will continue to improve as it has very focused and more integrated management team involved in that business. So at this stage, we're very pleased with the transaction and look forward to contribution coming from our reduced shareholding. And ultimately, the prospect remains for us to exit that business completely over time. We go now to what I was referring to across the segments and look at the revenue contribution. You can see the subsets of Print being magazines, newspapers, which had inserts and catalogs, books and directories and publishing. And what that does show you is that we've really taken a significant reduction right across the board with the most significant impact being in magazines; newspapers also very substantial; and of course, the least being the books and directories, which includes the work we do for Department of Basic Education, which obviously gave us some hedge against that reduction. So that have reached now to just over 30% -- 35% loss right across all the segments. You'll see the publishing is a very, very small contributor and in real term, shows a very, very small part of the group. Publishing was severely hit as it's obviously a subset of magazines, and we've had certain magazines, which just haven't yet become published again. And I don't know if people are aware, but we are responsible for production of a number of in-flight magazines. And obviously, the in-flight magazines have been privy to the -- and remain privy to -- under the COVID protocols. We move down to Labels, and we see that has a fairly static share of group revenue because they had a similar decline to what the group did. So they maintained the 4.2% share of group revenue. And we see that the flexible plastics went up because, in real terms, they had a lesser decline, so flexible packaging at 16.3%. And then Tissue, again, I must point out, this is only 6 months' worth of trading, so it's a little bit skewed by the fact that this is only half of the group's -- of the company's revenue that gets consolidated in for the last time. The net effect, obviously, will be that out of the overall pie, Tissue will remove and Packaging will then obviously become a slightly larger percentage of the total group currently going forward. We move on to the outlook. This template should be familiar to most people. Let me take a look at Print in simple terms. The rightsizing of our Print operations, we think bodes well for the future. And I think what's important is that we've entrenched the philosophy of quick reaction and quick response to market changes. So what we've done so far is really, based on our own view and our expectations of what's going to happen in the market, that's by no means cast in stone, and therefore, we have to retain this ability to respond in short notice to any changes that actually happen. We are anticipating a level of COVID-19 volume return but not across all the segments. Unfortunately, the Magazine and Newspaper businesses seem to have been somewhat permanently damaged. And our view is that those will be very slow if ever to recover. I think Magazines has a greater chance of recovery than what Newspapers do because a lot of this has been replaced by digital alternatives. We continue to adopt a conservative view on foreign exchange. So while we might have supply issues on paper and pulp, we do have access to it, and we do cover ourselves to try and smooth any impacts of sudden changes or extent of volatility thereof. The Labels business has really been decimated by this stop, stop, stop. So irrespective of the volumes that we actually achieved, we did actually have quite inefficient processes because there were gaps in production demand. When the demand came back, it came back at sort of really lumpy levels and we had to respond very quickly. So the efficiency of production that which we did do was undermined, and we would welcome the return of some stable volumes with a reasonable outlook on forecasts that we can actually get to a stable production. It's a very competitive product, and if it's not produced efficiently, it's very hard to make profit. So what is happening in both those businesses is to continue to innovate. ITB is looking for packaging, which is innovative. It's based on use and the functionality of plastic as opposed to high-volume plastic, which is seen as negative from a pollution point of view. They rather focus on the products, which actually have great functional value, and we see good market growth in those essential products. Tissue, as mentioned, it was closed out, and I say closed out just really in terms of financial cash flows, after year-end will be equity accounted for in the future. And we do anticipate that it's going to improve under the new JV management. If I look at the strategy and in terms of this, I don't have to read for everybody under the financial '21 progress, which has been fairly obvious. We've taken an aggressive look at trimming our structure and as Harry mentioned, some plant changes and reductions. The closure of the KZN plant was initiated prior to COVID, and that has continued and been successfully completed. We chose to consolidate our 2 Johannesburg facilities into 1, and that has largely been completed. There's some equipment still moving between the plants, and that will be completed probably by the end of the calendar year. And then, of course, we've talked much about optimized our -- optimizing our net working capital, the stock reductions, good debtor management and of course, using the creditor funding to the extent that we can. So now we are sitting with what we believe to be appropriately sized facilities, streamlined against what we believe the market demand is likely to be. So when we move into financial '22, we're going to now obviously have a heightened focus on the return on assets per facility. That understanding is now being pushed through as a culture, and we will continue to see where we are not doing a good enough job and to take whatever actions necessary. As much as the working capital is down from now, there is an anticipated small bounce back. And it actually will be welcomed if it's driven by greater revenue. So the funding of debtors with the greater revenue means that it was not bounce back in net working capital, but we will be doing our best to keep it under control and obviously to avoid too much of an inventory spike. We continually look at what we produce and make sure that it's rightly -- correctly priced, and that goes into current products and obviously, any future contracts we get into. And we have a careful view now of the broad value that has to be invested to deliver those products. And to the extent that the investment is too high, we have to address the margin [ of presses in producing ] the product. In terms of market shares -- and it's a very mature market and it's difficult to, in fact, expand one's market share when you have the level of share that we currently have. What has happened and I think has been surprisingly well done during this COVID period is we managed to sustain our customer relationships and kept our relationships up with a very remote way of interacting. And we continue to understand our customers' needs, and I think that has well informed our view on the outlook and our sense of where our customers are going and therefore, how we can budget to be part of their near future. So we have to live and walk this life together with our customers because without them, we don't have a business. So I think we've been quite effective in how we've worked with our customers in understanding when the lift might take place or when the recovery might take place and have predicted that reasonably well together with them. So going forward, we also need to enhance and work continuing on our customer service levels. We think we've developed a very agile and responsive culture, which we wish to sustain and maintain. We've shifted back towards some opportunities in the African market. If you look at the nature of the product, we do believe that paper-based solutions still have a longer future in the African market, in South Africa. And therefore, that becomes a good hedge against market decline and maturity. And then again, we're taking a careful look at specific printing operations, and if the margins are inappropriate and we're not getting an adequate return on investment, we're taking some tough decisions. One of the areas of what we're turning near market diversification is there are some add-on products, which are paper-based, and we have fundamental capability of producing different products. We're looking for opportunities to maybe repurpose equipment and see if we can extend both customer and product ranges into some of those areas. And then, of course, I'll move into the African market, is more of a focus on what we call transactional export, which is much more commercial and as opposed to -- we've typically relied on ad hoc project work, which is traditionally lumpy from a revenue point of view and a capacity requirement point of view, and we would hope that we'd get into some longer-term relationships with some African clients. In terms of operational efficiencies, much has been said about that, and I'm very conscious of over laboring the point. However, the point is that we have worked pretty hard to retain the right skills. We've reduced our head count, as Harry said, just over 400 people over a period of about 14 months, which is substantial, and it's regrettable under the circumstances because we would rather be contributing to employment than to contributing to unemployment. But nevertheless, it does translate to efficiency and it's essential to the survival of the business. So the removal of both headcount as well as particularly equipment means we have improved our press utilization with the underlying push on efficiencies, waste normalization and the likes. And again, the focus is on exactly the relevance of each particular print plant and to establish the profitability on a plant-by-plant basis to make sure that it's covering its own cost and contributing fee. And then the final point under efficiency is with the rationalization of the market, we need to make sure that we have a rational group of products. We cannot unfortunately be offering such a wide range of variants into the market on a smaller base. It's not justified. It becomes costly, and we need to drive the market down to taking more cost-effective standardized products than forcing our hand to carry a lot of variance and to respond to unusual requests. So that is an ongoing exercise. It wasn't easy to implement June 2021, and we hope that we get back to that in 2022. If we go back to our workforce and the human element of our business, we are pleased that we've contained or continue to maintain our empowerment ratings, which for us is important for 2 reasons. One is the credentials are important, but we also have a fundamental commitment to transformation. And this is part of our transformation offer. The COVID-19 was obviously very disruptive, and it impacted normal training programs. So that will be resumed in the future year. We will continue and we believe we will maintain our Level Two status of B-BBEE. And what is important with the reduced staff pool is flexibility of staff and, of course, development of talent and of course, we need to retain. So as much as one has scraped away a level of staff, we need to make sure that the staff that are left behind are multiskilled, motivated and highly efficient and productive. In conclusion, Novus is today substantially different from what it was 14 months ago, and management will remain vigilant and responsive to further changes, which will most likely arise. Our asset base remains strong, and the continued focus will be to match earnings to our capital employed. And on this point, we do believe we've got somewhere to go on that. It's been a very difficult period, not just the last year, but we've had a sustained period of having to tackle some unusual challenges in the business and adapt and scale down to it. So at this particular point, we, as management, are not particularly proud of our return on our employee base, and we'll be moving to optimize that going forward. It is appropriate, I think, to express my appreciation at this stage for the actions in support of all our management, staff, the Board and our business partners during the period. Our sympathies must go to those whose lives have been so severely disrupted by this pandemic. And at this particular point, I'd like to invite you to submit any questions you may have to the questions addressed, and we will consider those. And we will then come back and answer them to the best of our ability. Thanks.

All right. Folks, thanks for your patience, and we have got questions from a few people and I will add that some of them are duplications. So to the extent they're duplicated, I will try and filter them out. Otherwise, I'll see them as I come to them. And I'll go through and start with this 1 question, says cash holdings post the dividend will still be circa ZAR 300 million, and then the KZN sales should add ZAR 65 million to that number. What's required for operation needs? And thus, what is excess cash holdings in present? Yes. Obviously, technically, we do have some more cash coming in, and we have some further asset disposals planned. So there are assets up for sale, and we are being a little cautious because we do end up with some unusual delays in things like final transferability on capital assets, was for people to have time -- foreign people to come and inspect the assets before they could in fact be sold from a transaction point of view. So we do anticipate a release of further cash from sale of assets and obviously the biggest asset, which is -- which will be held for sale will be the Linbro property. So I'm going to side step the question on exactly what the surplus cash will be as at -- after the dividend. But I will also add that we have traditionally -- you will see from our normal working capital spikes, is that our funding of the large DBE project runs from now through to our collection period, and we would rather fund that out of cash than to go into overdraft facilities as we traditionally have to fund that spike. So certainly, once the assets have been realized in or liquidated, we'll be in a better position to look at our cash and we'll obviously be in a position to communicate that to shareholders by the interims because that's not far away. So I'm going to slightly duck that question on giving you exact surplus cash. We do believe that the dividend that we're offering now, which has a cost of about ZAR 140 million, is very affordable, but we are remaining cautious. The other issue is that this COVID third wave, which has statistically been declared today, is of concern, and it is of concern, one is in terms of our own safe operating to continue business but obviously what happens to the economy if there should be any related lockdowns. So we remain cautious, and for the same reason as we held off on our dividend prior year, we've been cautious with allocation of additional dividend. But that doesn't mean that if it's stable, it won't possibly be available for shareholders. In terms of recovery of the Print and Packaging and in normal print, the request is can we comment on the recovery. I must say that the budget that we've put in place is a conservative budget because we have made a decision that a number of the volume margins will not return. What we've also done is we've taken a look at the work we have performed traditionally in the rationalization of the 2 Johannesburg facilities. It is anticipated that a certain volume would, in fact, be -- I wouldn't like to use the word discarded, but treated as a -- if the margins are acceptable, they were going to be continued. So our budget is a conservative budget, and it probably estimates it will get a similar gross revenue into Print to what we had in the current year. However, it will be better quality revenue, and it will be managed to a much smaller infrastructure, which I think is positive. With 2 months of the new financial year behind us, the budget assumptions appear to be quite sound, so we're quite pleased that we're tracking the current budget for 2022 after 2 months in. Then there's a question, just to confirm the impact of the retrenchments and the plant closures this year should produce any saving. Does it include depreciation? Of that ZAR 100 million, most of that is a cash saving on expenses. Of the ZAR 100 million, about ZAR 10 million would probably be depreciation. So those are meaningful cost reductions and expense reductions and very much cash related. And then there's a question which said when is the repayment date to the related party loan in Tissue. And I think the important thing is that related party loan is not at the extent that it's shown, that it was a temporary process just because when it fell either side of the financial year, we have already received a portion of that loan repaid. So we're now, on an equitable basis, where the 2 parties fund only in proportion to their shareholding so that loans are relatively largely reduced. We will continue to have the obligation to fund 49% of the working capital in that business. And as we reduce our shareholding, the working capital responsibility will reduce with that reduction as well. What is important is we have options in place for being a shareholder to acquire the remaining 49%. And there is also an option for the acquiring party to purchase the building price. If they do not take up the option, we obviously have the right to dispose of that building at a later stage. What is important for this transaction, and the comment is made that it really hasn't been a technically good transaction. We were losing a substantial amount of money every year. Those losses have been curtailed and have started to cover some capital out of that business. So the fair value was not a huge transaction. We have the remaining 49% still to be collected, and of course, the reduction in working capital from our responsibility has been successful. And then ultimately, we can exit and dispose of the building and there should be a decent cash recovery for that transaction. We do have a horizon of about another 2 years for this to play out unless there's a party, which wishes to step into our shoes, and we would obviously consider that seriously. There's a question here. What's the Board's plan to improve return on capital going forward? We certainly would take a look at our total capital and think it's quite a large number relative to the operating income. We do believe that, along with some of the liquidations we've spoken about, we will reduce that lower base. And we will be taking a very, very crucial look at every single thing we do. We've got -- we have a lot more clarity and as much as it has been a tough year, has been very inward, and I think we've developed yet a further depth of knowledge on our operations and where we do and don't make money. So we are scrutinizing every operation, and we'll continue to either improve the profitability or failing that would have to reduce the denominator, which is the capital items of nonproductive assets. Commentary, I welcome the sale of some divisions and the value released, including the recent Natal property, the ZAR 66 million. And what I did mention there as well, it's a duplicate point, is that the Linbro facility is a large asset, which is on the market. Are there any plans to rationalize or close unprofitable and unviable businesses as to conserve working capital towards better internal assets and development? I think I'll answer that. Yes, we will be scrutinizing a number of our operations as we can do. And what's important, we do this against normal circumstances. To have a knee-jerk reaction under these unusual circumstances, I think we would be disadvantaging ourselves. Whereas I think if we have the opportunity of a little bit more organized economy, we can make better calls on that. So there's been a comment on the Tissue and the suggestion was it wasn't a great deal. I think that the deal will settle down. It was particularly difficult to execute during the COVID period for all sorts of reasons, whether it be financing reasons and the likes. It's not easy to just have a loss-making business, and I think that to have exited as we did was in fact beneficial. ITB, suggests as a stand-alone business and question whether it was a good or bad acquisition. Again, we will continue to see what return we get on that, and if it's not suitable, then we'll take the appropriate decisions on that one. The Label business, as we've said, is particularly competitive for the amount of resource that's invested, from the amount of margin that's achievable. That is certainly under scrutiny at the moment. And again, if actually it's appropriate, then we'll take that [ appropriation ]. The Linbro property we're anticipating would be disposed of by the end of the calendar year. Again, with the property transactions, the transfer is not always registered immediately. But we like to believe that it's certainly by the end of the calendar year, if not by the end of the financial year, we should have exited completely and be realized most of the value in that particular front. Comment on Paarden Island, whether there's an opportunity to consolidate with Montague Gardens. No, it's not a practical suggestion because newspaper presses are significantly different from the heatset web presses, and the cost to relocate would make it prohibitive. The Paarden Island actually is a rather successful business as it stands at the moment, and we'll obviously keep monitoring that. So as it stands at the moment, a good business. It's getting good throughput, good utilization. And again, should that change, we would have to take the necessary reaction at the time. There's mention of an independent media contract being up for renewal or when it will be up for renewal. That's not something we wish to disclose in this forum. And again, the Paarden Island property is actually with a reasonable carrying value, not that long ago tested the market value and it seems to be achievable. But it's earning its keep at the moment. There was a question of the transfer of printing work to City Deep facility with the closure of Linbro. We basically, as I said, are retaining probably the right work. So we're creating something of a hybrid plant in City Deep, which will able to produce both coldset and heatset print production, and we're keeping the best work for that particular plant. Some work might find its way back into the Montague Gardens plant. But ultimately, we are prepared to [ stall ] some of the volumes, which we don't feel are that attractive or at attractive margins. So part of the consolidation is to obviously pick the better turnover to produce on the remaining assets. By and large, our capabilities, that remains very, very similar. The capacity is obviously trimmed, but the diversity and the capabilities haven't been undermined by our rationalization exercise. I hope I haven't missed any of the questions, and we had to say something a bit convoluted in terms of repetition, but I do believe we've covered those. And I hope that everyone has found value in attending today. I'd like to thank you for your attendance. And obviously, we do normally follow up with individual discussions with the interest of shareholders, and obviously, that invitation remains open. But for now, I thank you for your attention and for joining us for the session today, and I look forward to sharing more information with you as we break into something of a new era and hopefully, an exciting era where we can get some recognition for some of the hard work done in this past year. Thank you, everybody, and enjoy the rest of your day and weekend.