Ocular Therapeutix, Inc. (OCUL) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary
February 13, 2023
Earnings Call Speaker Segments
Operator
operatorLadies and gentlemen. Thank you for standing by. And welcome to Ocular Therapeutics in term 10-month data update from the ongoing U.S. Phase I clinical trial of OTX-TKI for the treatment of wet AMD. At this time, all participants are in a listen only mode. After the speaker's presentation, there will be a question-and-answer session. [Operator Instructions] Please be advised that today's conference is being recorded. I would now like to hand the conference over to your speaker host Donald Notman, Chief Financial Officer. Please go ahead, sir.
Donald Notman
executiveThank you, Olivia. Good morning, everyone, and thank you for joining us on our conference call to discuss the interim 10 months results from our U.S.-based Phase I clinical trial of OTX-TKI for the treatment of wet AMD. The press release that we issued on Saturday and the slide deck with the interim results can be accessed on the Investors portion of our website at investors.ocutx.com. Leading the call today will be Anthony Mattessich, our President and Chief Executive Officer, who will also be joined by Dr. Rabia Ozden, our Chief Medical Officer; and Dr. Peter Kaiser, our Chief Medical Adviser, Retina. Following our prepared remarks, we will open the line for your questions. As a reminder, on today's call, certain statements we will be making may be considered forward-looking for the purposes of the Private Securities Litigation Reform Act of 1995. In particular, any statements regarding our regulatory and product development plans as well as our research activities are forward-looking statements. These statements are subject to a variety of risks and uncertainties that may cause actual results to differ from those forecasted, including those risks described in our most recent quarterly report filed November 7 with the SEC and our annual report on Form 10-K filed on February 28, 2022, with the SEC. As a reminder, the slides being presented in today's call by Dr. Peter Kaiser are available on the company's website under the Investors tab, Events and Presentation, Investor and Corporate Presentations. I would now like to turn the call over to Anthony.
Antony Mattessich
executiveThanks, Donald. And good morning, everyone. Before handing it off to Peter to take you through the presentation, I just wanted to say a few words that we believe that this data means for Ocular Therapeutix and more importantly, for patients suffering from VEGF-mediated ret diseases such as wet AMD, diabetic macular edema and diabetic retinopathy. In the case of wet AMD is well known that the vision gains seen when starting treatment are not maintained over time in the real world. The main reason for this is the lack of compliance caused by the injection burden of current antibody therapies like LUCENTIS and EYLEA. In the real world, patients tend to miss necessary injections for a variety of reasons. Wet AMD patients tend to be elderly and can find it difficult to get to rent offices on a 4 to 8 weekly basis. So appointments are missed or delayed and permanent vision loss occurs because of the damage caused when the medication wears off and the disease process returns. In the case of diabetic retinopathy, where patients are generally at working age, the lack of urgency from the fact that the disease may not have manifested yet and finding the time to get treated on a frequent basis create real compliance challenges. In this population, the result is that patients are not treated and frequently progressed to more severe vision destroying disease before seeking treatment, making diabetic macular edema a leading cause of blindness among the working age population. In short, we believe the promise of a drug like OTX-TKI is not only about convenience, but also about saving vision. If we can move durability from the current frequency of injections of 4 to 8 weeks and maybe at the outset 3 to 4 months, to 10 months and beyond, we believe we can keep people on treatment and preserve vision. Lastly, it is important to understand that OTX-TKI is a different paradigm than typical antibody treatments. Existing treatments like Lucentis and EYLEA, our bolus injections were a large amount of antibodies well above the amount needed for immediate treatment are injected into the vitreous and those antibodies are eliminated from vitreous until they drop below therapeutic levels, allowing the disease process to restart. Extending intervals is done by making the antibody larger and slower to eliminate or just by jamming more antibodies into the eye with each injection. Either way, you're still treating a chronic disease of pulsatile dosing. OTX-TKI is different. OTX-TKI is designed to deliver a continuous dose of axitinib, of potent inhibitor VEGF, keeping drug concentrations above therapeutic levels for extended periods without the drug peaks or troughs of pulse dosing. We believe that these results bear this out and demonstrate that we are keeping therapeutic levels of axitinib at continuous levels in vitreous for the duration of the study. If OTX-KTI works as it's designed to, it should work as long as we keep adequate levels in vitreous, which our hydrogel technology allows us to do. This new paradigm will allow physicians and patients the comfort of knowing the drug is always on board, like a security blanket. You can hopefully demonstrate that there is less variability in the retina over time, and more importantly, the vision games from anti-VEGF therapy are maintained in the real world. So what's next? We believe we have our proof of concept in wet AMD and by extension, have gone a long way toward proof of concept in other VEGF-mediated retinal disease given the impressive durability of OTX-TKI. Importantly, we also have a working formulation. We believe we are ready to enter our first pivotal trial in wet AMD as soon as the third quarter of this year. We have scheduled a Type C meeting with the FDA to discuss the pivotal study design within the next few weeks. We have also mentioned that commencing this trial is subject to financing, and we are considering a range of non-dilutive or minimally dilutive funding options, we have a strong preference to go forward through a potential strategic alliance. We have also stated our intention to begin a Phase III program for diabetic retinopathy in the first quarter of 2024, assuming positive top line data results from our ongoing Phase I clinical trial and subject to a follow-up meeting with the FDA. The diabetic retinopathy program is a separate program with much more modest resource requirements than wet AMD. Consequently, our plan to commence the first pivotal trial in diabetic retinopathy in the first quarter of 2024 is not contingent upon a strategic partnership. We believe both wet AMD and diabetic retinopathy could be blockbuster applications for the product profile we are building with OTX-TKI. We have a very valuable asset, and we believe a very clear plan going forward. So without further ado, I'll pass the baton on to Peter to go over the 10-month data. Peter?
Peter Kaiser
executiveThank you, Anthony. As was mentioned before, the slides I'm presenting are available on the Ocular Therapeutix website for viewing. So it's my pleasure now to present the U.S. clinical trial results we just presented at the Angiogenesis meeting, which show the up to 10-month interim analysis. Next slide. As was mentioned previously, there are forward-looking statements, and this presentation discusses an investigational product, which are in development. the efficacy and safety profiles have not been established and they have been not reapproved for marketing by the FDA. Next slide, I'm now on Slide 3. So the OTX-TKI is a hydrogel proprietary polymer matrix combined with axitinib, which is a multi-target Tyrosine kinase inhibitor, specifically with high selectivity to all the VEGF as well as PDGF receptors. If we look at the VEGF receptor 2, which is the most pathologic, the one that causes leakage in angiogenesis, it has the highest IC50 versus all other current clinical TKIs in development. This is injected as a rod through a 25-gauge or smaller needle into the vitreous, it completely bioresorbs over roughly 6 to 12 months. Next slide. So we are on Slide 4 to remind everybody about the U.S. Phase I study design. This enrolled patients with age-related macular degeneration with sub phobia choroidal neovascularization that has been previously treated with anti-VEGF injections. And in the investigator's opinion has controlled fluid. The patients are then randomized to 1 of 2 treatment arms, either the OTX-TKI arm where they received the OTX-TKI at baseline a month later than aflibercept injection and then that are followed on a monthly basis for rescue. The rescue criteria shown at the bottom. The most important rescue criteria that since this is a Phase I clinical study, the investigator had the option to treat the patient at their discretion. In addition, if the patient lost more than 10 letters of vision from the ETDRS eye chart, or if they had evidence of more than 75 microns increase on the OCT of their central subfield thickness combined with a 5-letter loss of visual acuity or the presidents of new macro hemorrhage. The control arm was aflibercept dosed on label every 2 months. Next slide. The baseline characteristics were well matched and it's important to understand matching in a small study such as this, but we were able to achieve very good matching in terms of baseline visual acuity, central subfield thickness, age, et cetra. Next slide. So we are now on Slide 6. And this shows the swimlane plot. And there are some very important things to note about this. First of all, these are not patients who are not receiving injections as shown on slide left in the pretreatment. These are patients who are receiving extensive anti-VEGF injections, the majority at a monthly basis before being enrolled in the study. If you look at the OTX-TKI arm, the majority of rescues were at the investigator's discretion. These are the purple squares and only a few patients at the month 8 and beyond actually met any rescue criteria and were treated according to rescue criteria. So 3 patients overall. This leads to a treatment reduction up to the 10-month time point of 92%, a dramatic reduction. Next slide. If we look just at the rescue-free subjects, so these are patients who didn't require any rescue, we previously reported at the 7 month time point, a 73% reduction or rescue free duration. And we're pleased to report now at the up to 10-month interim results of this study we have the identical 73% of subjects being rescue-free up to 10 months. Next slide. We are now on Slide 8. This shows both the visual acuity and the OCT results of the clinical study. There are several very important things to note about this slide. First of all, -- the -- if you look at the visual acuity outcomes and the OCT outcomes, versus a basically gold standard control of aflibercept dosed every 8 weeks. There was essentially no difference in visual acuity outcomes at month 10, 0.3 letters loss in the OTX arm and in the aflibercept arm, 0.8 letters lost. And if you look at the retinal thickness, essentially no change, minus 1.3 microns in the OTX and minus 4.5 microns in the aflibercept that's essentially within the error of the machine. The other thing I want to point out is aflibercept was dosed on label for every 2 months. And as Anthony mentioned earlier, if you look at slide bottom, there's that seesaw pattern that we've seen in pretty much every clinical study with EYLEA showing that some of those patients are having a lot of fluid fluctuations visit-to-visit, depending on if they receive an injection or not. In contrast, the OTX-TKI arm, shows a very stable OCT result. So fluid fluctuations are kept to the minimum. In addition, at the end of the study, so we're looking at the 8-, 9- and 10-month time points, we see the OCT actually improving over time with an uptick in the visual acuity at those same time points. Finally, if you censor the rescue subjects from these analysis, the visual acuity and OCT results are the same. Next slide. Since this is a Phase I clinical study, the most important outcome for investigators is safety. And we're pleased with the safety up to 10 months with no reports of drug-related ocular or systemic serious adverse events in either arm. If we look at adverse events of special interest, including elevated intraocular pressure, retinal detachment, retinal vasculitis an implant migration into the inter chamber. This was not seen in any of the patients in the OTX-TKI arm. There was one patient in the aflibercept arm that had elevated intraocular pressure and this was judged as a moderate adverse event. In addition, as previously described in the OTX-TKI arm, one patient had acute endophthalmitis, this occurred after the mandated aflibercept injection at month 1, was deemed to be not related to the study drug, but instead related to the injection of aflibercept. It resolved with standard treatment, which is intravitreal antibiotic injection. This same patient developed a moderate adverse event of a cataract after the acute endophthalmitis, which is shown here. So the safety at month 10 was very similar to the safety at month 7 and so far shows good results. Next slide, we're on Slide 10 now, which is the concluding slide shows that this Phase I clinical study at U.S. clinical sites in patients with previously treated neovascular age-related macular degeneration comparing OTX-TKI versus standard -- gold standard aflibercept injections every 2 months in the OTX-TKI arm, the safety was generally well tolerated. As I mentioned, there were no drug-related ocular or systemic adverse events, and adverse events of special interest for a TKI polymer, we're not seen in the OTX-TKI arm. Importantly, no subjects to date have dropped out of the clinical study in either arm. We're very excited about the efficacy that has been shown now. Recall that at the 6-month time point, 80% of patients were rescue free. And now at the up to 10-month time points, 73% of patients are rescue-free following a single OTX-TKI injection. The visual acuity results in the OTX-TKI arm were stable and comparable to aflibercept dosed every 8 weeks. And we showed a very clinical meaningful reduction in treatment burden up to the 10-month time point of 92%. Next slide. So this concludes my remarks of the U.S. Phase I clinical study. And I now turn it over to the operator to take your Q&A.
Operator
operator[Operator Instructions] Our first question coming from the line of John Wolleben with JMP Securities.
Jonathan Wolleben
analystMaybe two for me to start and then a follow-up if I can. Can you let us know the reasons for the three per protocol rescues, later on in month 8, 9 and 10? And then also, there's some discussion of the dissolution of the hydrogel over the weekend at Angiogenesis. Can you give us an update on what the distillation rates look like in the consistency and then an update on any of the formulation work that you previously have discussed?
Antony Mattessich
executiveSure. I think Peter, you want to handle the first question on that?
Peter Kaiser
executiveI'm going to punt the first question, Rabia. I'll take the second question.
Rabia Ozden
executiveSure. Those risks were for the visual acuity changes and also the -- like they were per criteria is described, and those were visual acuity changes. And I can actually just quickly go over the solutions, if that's all right, and then Peter can add.
Peter Kaiser
executiveSure, go ahead.
Unknown Executive
executiveSure. Okay. The -- what we have seen in Australia data, we have a very -- like our implants are very programmable. Only temperature and water contract -- would a sector is option of the implant. Again, for the data we have seen from Australia so far, we have seen a very consistent stable reduction of implant at around 8 months. There may be individual differences but we expect that would be still the case in most subjects. Currently, the trial is still masked for that, and we will have this data available at the end of the trial. Peter, would you like to add more?
Peter Kaiser
executiveSure. I've spoken with several of the investigators, both in Australia and in the U.S. studies. And what they see as basically there's bioresorption of the hydrogel and release of the axitinib is basically some white particles, very similar to what we'd see with a [indiscernible] alone. So this is very different than, say, intraocular inflammation, which is something we'd be very concerned about these particles are released, as Rabia said, roughly at the 8 months or so time point and then within a month or 2 are completely gone. An interesting thing is we're talking about a polymer here that should be bioresorbing anywhere from 6 to 12 months. We're starting to see it really around 8 months and to me, looking at the clinical trial results as a clinician, we want to kind of see patients start to get rescued in any study of this sort, because that would show that the drug is wearing off and the disease is indeed going back to being active. So when I start to see rescues in 8-, 9-, 10-month time points. That doesn't bother me. In fact, that's what I kind of would expect to see in any trial with a polymer releasing any sort of drug. If basically, there were no rescues that would concern me because that would indicate that maybe these patients didn't need any treatment at all. So we hope to see that over time in any study with the polymer.
Jonathan Wolleben
analystAnd is there any changes necessary to the formulation then that you'd like to get done before starting the next round of studies?
Antony Mattessich
executiveNo. We clearly have a formulation that works. And we've mentioned before that we are working on an additional formulation that would have a higher release rate but given what we've seen with the results of the current formulation, we have a workable formulation and certainly one that we would want to bring into Phase III development.
Jonathan Wolleben
analystFantastic. And then just one more for me. Before jumping back in the queue. The diabetic retinopathy trial. Any sense when we could see some interim data from that perhaps some time this year. And then as we're thinking about the translatability from wet AMD to DR, any sense of how what we've seen with visual acuity or retinal thing this translate to diabetic retinopathy severity score, just getting a sense of what expectations should be either in this first Phase I or moving forward?
Antony Mattessich
executiveRabia, do you want to do the first one and then Peter sort of follow up on the second.
Rabia Ozden
executiveJohn, would you mind -- I want to understand your question very clearly. Would you mind?
Jonathan Wolleben
analystYes, Rabia, just when we might see some interim data from the ongoing Phase I.
Rabia Ozden
executiveOngoing Phase I, U.S. Phase 1, you mean?
Jonathan Wolleben
analystDiabetic retinopathy study is currently enrolling...
Rabia Ozden
executiveOkay, yes. It is currently enrolling and we're going to just -- we are thinking now is seeing the interim results by the end of this year.
Peter Kaiser
executiveAnd taking your second question, which is how much can we use the data from both the Australia in the U.S. clinical studies and sort of extrapolate that to diabetes. Well, it depends on mechanism of action of a drug, whether you can extrapolate. So for us, the mechanism of action is targeting downstream activation of the VEGF receptor. We have two clinical studies: one in patients who are been previously treated, but more importantly, treatment naive in Australia. And then this study, which we just showed the U.S. study shows good activity in macular degeneration, which is largely VEGF-driven. Diabetic retinopathy is also largely VEGF-driven has been shown with both the EYLEA and ranibizumab approvals for the treatment of diabetic retinopathy -- so for us, the extrapolation is pretty easy. Obviously, we're not going to move forward until we have some results from our Phase I clinical study in diabetic retinopathy. But as a clinician and as a scientist, the MOA between the two are very similar, so we would hope to see a similar result.
Jonathan Wolleben
analystGot it.
Peter Kaiser
executiveI want to add one thing to your question about the axitinib being showing the terminal burst at about 8 to 9 months. To me, speaking with the investigators in addition, looking at the results. Basically, when you have that [indiscernible] axitinib we're seeing a bump in both the visual acuity and a reduction in retinal thickness. So in a way, one of the things that we were concerned about was what would happen with axitinib the when released and what we're finding is that actually is working great in these patients sort of the tail end of when the polymers are round. It's actually disappearing, but we're seeing improvements in our patients, not the opposite.
Operator
operatorOur next question coming from the line of Dane Leone with Raymond James.
Unknown Analyst
analystThis is Sean on for Dan. Congrats on the update. So actually, to put a finer point on the point that Peter just made, perhaps difficult to quantify, but do you guys think that you are kind of confirming that you're seeing visible release and having elevated vitreal effective concentration of axitinib, it kind of ask that like 8- to 10-month time point? And kind of how are you thinking about that going forward in terms of maybe potentially confirming a more durable effect due to that accelerating release towards the terminal dissolution of the insert. And it seems like you guys are now leaning more towards this formulation, potentially due to this effect confirming more durability. So kind of just to clarify, you're still going forward with the new formulation in terms of development, what you're thinking more about the current formulation moving towards the Phase II/III? And kind of how does that affect timing on the Phase II/III?
Antony Mattessich
executiveWell, I'll handle the first part. I mean we -- the last part, we're looking enough to know that we have a formulation that works and one thing that does seem to be suggestive from the data is that more axitinib is better. The formulation that we have currently in development actually increases the daily release rate of axitinib. So in the earlier periods, you'd get a higher concentration of axitinib you wouldn't have as much drug at the end of the life of the insert. So there may be some effect on the durability. So we really have two things to really choose from here that a higher release rate with potentially less durability, although we're well beyond the period that we thought we would be initially speaking about 8 months and longer initially, we thought we were going to go about 6 months. So it is -- we are definitely in the realm of a standard setting durability. So we intend to bring both of these doses forward and we will decide later on which one we want to bring to market or both, depending on which indication suits, which formulation better. But it's kind of an embarrassment [indiscernible] is because we have the potential for both, with neither one are on the critical path in terms of being able to start our wet AMD in the third quarter of this year. We've had great progress on the backup formulation. So we believe that, that will be ready in time for that trial to begin. So we're in very good shape. But your specific questions around the [PK] and what we're seeing in the trial. I mean, clearly, we don't get human data on the [PK] in the vitreous. And we have now collecting data on when we can see the insert go away, or the hydrogel bioresorb and then when the drug clears. And that all appears to be around the 8-month time that we see the insert, the hydrogel bioresorbing and then the 9-, 10-month period where we see the drug clearing. So in some ways, we're not surprised that our month 7 results were the same as our month 10 results because we are keeping axitinib in the vitreous at the same or higher levels than the earlier treatment. I think the interesting part is going to be the month 12 analysis where we see patients who are no longer on high levels of axitinib and Novitreus to see how long it takes the disease process to restart. I think we would kind of expect that to be highly variable, just like it is with the current anti-VEGF treatments, but it takes a while for the disease process to restart, but we would expect in that 10- to 12-month period, to have a number of patients with fluid starting to return to the retina, because they no longer have axitinib at therapeutic levels in the vitreous. I don't know if either Peter or Rob, would want to add anything to that.
Peter Kaiser
executiveNo, I think you said it well, right? To me, the -- we sort of have two formulas that we could take forward and plan, hopefully, to take forward. As Anthony mentioned, one of the things that's very interesting about this formulation is longevity. And one of the things that's interesting about the new formulation is sort of the higher levels early on -- and what we don't know and what we don't -- we can't tell you at this point is what we're planning to do in terms of Phase III, Phase II/III -- and one of the things the FDA usually requires is oftentimes two different drugs. So it's not out of the question to be able to go forward with either this or the other one. So I'm very excited about the results of this, especially in the later tail points. Basically, this drug is working up to month 10. I can't wait to see the final 12-month analysis of the full study.
Unknown Analyst
analystYes. That's helpful. And if I could have just one quick follow-up. How are you guys thinking about those two formulations in terms of patient populations? It seemed like maybe it could be more amenable for certain distinct patient populations. So how does that inform those Phase II/III as well.
Antony Mattessich
executiveWell, I don't think it's two populations, and we certainly don't plan to bring two drugs to the market that we're going to figure out which one is the better of the two. But as Anthony said at the beginning, this basically gives us options. This is a -- this -- many companies will be like, we'll just take this one forward. We have a couple to see which one is the best. I don't think in the future, it will be like, okay, we'll use this formulation for these patients in this formulation for other patients, we're only going to take one forward to the finish line.
Rabia Ozden
executiveI think if I can also add is that, again, none of the formulations are a critical path. This one is ready to go into a pivotal, and we mean to move this one to the pivotals. And the other one is needed, if needed, would be added as well. Otherwise, I just want to clarify, none of them are critical at to start a Phase III -- a pivotal trial in Q3.
Operator
operatorAnd our next question coming from the line of Joseph Catanzaro with Piper Sandler.
Joseph Catanzaro
analystCongrats on the data. So I just wanted to follow up maybe first on Anthony, your comments on the 12-month time point and follow-up. It sounds like that data point is going to tell us more about the disease and less maybe so about TKI, but maybe you can correct me if I'm wrong, and just speak a little bit more to sort of the data points you're going to get and what it will inform you with regards to TKI and perhaps even the formulation. And then on safety, so ocular AEs went up from, I think, 10 to 16 from 7 to 10 months of follow-up. So maybe you could help contextualize those a little bit in terms of whether there were any trends or specific AEs observed in more than one patient, anything along those lines would be helpful.
Antony Mattessich
executiveYes, I don't know if you want to handle the safety elements first. Rabia, you want to talk about the safety results?
Rabia Ozden
executiveSure. The -- when we look at the safety, and this is an ongoing trial, as you just go towards the trial. Of course, you expect your adverse events to be increasing in the number. We have not seen any safety signal most worthy to just hit like -- the -- all of the safety is you expect from a retina trial with intravitreal injection. That's why it's an expected phenomenon to see that they are increasing and the -- but none of them are not worthy at this point.
Antony Mattessich
executiveYes. And to handle the first part of your question, I mean I sort of think about it in terms of what we know and what we don't know. I mean what we do know, given the trials that we've had in both Australia and the U.S., is that when you deliver axitinib through our hydrogel into vitreous, you can get rid of fluid, so it actually can work to decrease fluid in patients that have active fluid in the retina and in the naive patients. We've also proven that it can extend durability when axitinib is present in the vitreous. This is a brand-new mechanism of action in the treatment of VEGF-mediated disease, and it's an intracellular point of efficacy. So we're not working in the extracellular space. It has to get inside of the cell in order to be able to bind to the receptors and working with a number of drugs that have an intracellular mechanism of action, it's very difficult to tell without clinical data. First of all, how much you need in order to get inside the cells. So we -- that's why we chose such a potent, a TKI, because even though you may have a very high concentration in the surrounding tissues, you may have a much lower concentration intracellularly. The other thing that is what we don't know, which we'll find out moving forward, is that once you get inside the cell, how long it stays in the cell and how long it will take when the drug is no longer visible or apparent in the environment outside of the cell, how long it takes for the disease process to regenerate. As I mentioned earlier, my guess would be that it's going to be highly variable that some patients may last quite a bit longer than you would expect there. But I would imagine a larger number of patients will start seeing fluid return within a relatively near time point of when the drug clears from the vitreous. I don't know if Peter or Rabia, you want to add a little bit to that, but it's going to be a very exciting data point in the 12-month time point.
Peter Kaiser
executiveYes. I don't want people to think that we're expecting to see this onslaught of rescues in the next 2 months before the final results of the Phase I study. To me, when I start to see some evidence of the polymer wearing off, I expect that but what we don't know is what Anthony just mentioned, the axitinib is intracellar preventing downstream activation. It's still present in many patients at 10, even 11 months. So we may not see any change in rescue at all. at the 12-month time point. But what I'm saying is a clinician and as somebody does a lot of clinical studies, it wouldn't surprise me either.
Joseph Catanzaro
analystOkay. Great. That's helpful. And I could just ask one quick follow-up. So appreciate that some interim DR data expected later this year. What length of follow-up will that represent? And maybe if I could ask it differently, what's the earliest you believe you could start to see some separation from placebo in that setting?
Rabia Ozden
executiveMaybe I can just start answering and Peter could add. The study is initiated in December last year. and the enrolling currently. Of course, the enrollment -- depending on the enrollment, our expectation is to have a 5- to 6-month data if the enrollment goes away. That being said, just that's -- we're going to see how that goes and make the right decision to look at the data. As you know, the data is mask. This is a mass dry. And Peter, do you want to add -- like the separation?
Peter Kaiser
executiveYes. It's hard to say what the separation would be. We know the results of the anti-VEGF studies in both for both EYLEA and for ranibizumab, but know that in those studies, the patients who are receiving injections either every month or every other month, but in the first 6 months, they were receiving injections even in the EYLEA study much more frequently. So it's really hard to kind of give a divine up what it will be. But to me, I'm really hoping to see good results and especially with the longevity that we are seeing in the AMD studies, this -- the idea of having a drug that last 10-plus months in DR is incredibly exciting as a clinician.
Joseph Catanzaro
analystOkay. Great. Congrats again.
Operator
operatorAnd our next question coming from the line of Chris Howardson with Jefferies.
Unknown Analyst
analystThis is [indiscernible] for Chris this morning. Congratulations on the data. A couple of questions for me. How will you consider CMC optimization specific formulations in the light of your interest to do strategic alliance potentially around the wet AMD program? And then as a second question, how receptive are ophthalmologists in prescribing TKIs, and what patients would OTX-TKI be best utilized in?
Antony Mattessich
executiveI'm not sure I got all of the second part of that question. I think the CMC issues are pretty clear. As we talk about a strategic alliance, I mean, nobody does what we do. We're the only company that's able to use these proprietary forms of hydrogels and be able to put drug in them and have them last for the time and elute at the rate that we need to for the period of time that we program them for. So we would handle all of the CMC-related issues. We would do all of the manufacturing. There may be a possibility of transfer, but there's nobody who could teach us anything about what we are doing, and we would really have to start a whole new platform with whatever partner we work with if there was a desire for them to manufacture. And I didn't -- I don't know if anybody else in the line caught the second part. It sort of felt like there was a little bit of a message delay issue.
Unknown Analyst
analystMy apologies. I'll just ask it again. How receptive are ophthalmologists in prescribing TKIs, and what patients would maybe best utilized in -- for OTX-TKI, specifically?
Antony Mattessich
executiveIn what disease, DR or AMD?
Unknown Analyst
analystAMD.
Antony Mattessich
executiveSo in AMD, it's interesting. These results, combined with our Australia results are very exciting. I don't think any TKI would completely replace anti-VEGF injections. So my thought as a clinician would be, I would give a patient my anti-VEGF [ dejour. ] Basically, you get them controlled like the patients in this study, and then put the OTX-TKI on board, and watch the patient over time. One of the nice things we hope to have in the future is Home OCT, which would be sort of perfect if you think about it, for this, where we would have the Home OCP. We put a OTX-TKI on board. And basically, as the patient starts to notice a change in vision, or if the home OCP starts to show that fluid is returning, that's when we bring the patient back in and either redose with an OTX-TKI or give a basically a fill-up of anti-VEGF to get -- to keep them stable. But I would see that us using this to maintain the vision and OCT findings long term. As you know, almost all real-world studies in wet macular degeneration shows a really nice improvement with the anti-VEGF, but that [ pales ] off over time because of both, physician and patient burn out to the injections. And this really solves that because we could use the injection to maintain the vision and OCT like we just showed in this study. So it's a straight line across as opposed to a declining line which most real-world studies of anti-VEGF have shown.
Operator
operatorOur next question coming from the line of Yi Chen with H.C. Wainwright.
Yi Chen
analystCongratulations on the data. Given the fact that the drug performed well in patients that does not have excess crude as screening, would you be able to speculate how the drug to perform in patients with active disease and excess fluid at screening, and whether you do have a plan to pursue the population of treatment-naive patients in the future?
Antony Mattessich
executiveWell, we don't need to speculate. We've actually studied it, and our Australian trial was in patients with active fluid. So we've used it as monotherapy in patients with active fluid which no other TKI company has done. So we actually have data in that population and are very confident that we can be effective in eliminating fluid. So I don't understand where the question comes from. We certainly do not plan to exclude patients with fluid in future trials. As Peter mentioned, we do see the TKIs is being used to take control-patients and have them maintain control, but we are certainly not afraid of patients with a little bit of fluid.
Yi Chen
analystDoes that mean your future pivotal trial will enroll of treatment-naive patients as well as treatment-experienced patients?
Antony Mattessich
executiveWell, clearly, we have to discuss with the FDA what that pivotal looks like. I mean, clearly, you also would want to ensure that there's a bit of a unanimity of the type of patient that goes into the trial, so you don't get confounding results. But I think it would be premature to speculate on exactly what the entry criteria would be for our pivotal trials.
Operator
operatorAnd our next question coming from the line of Caroline Palomeque with Berenberg.
Caroline Palomeque
analystJust a quick follow-up on the clinical trial design for the Phase II/III, and I understand maybe it hasn't been finalized. But just wondering in terms of the endpoint. Has that been -- are you planning to go on with the 9-month data? Can you just talk a little bit about that? And then just switching over to the business side, I'm wondering if you can just discuss maybe your ideal strategic alliance for this program.
Rabia Ozden
executiveYes, maybe I can take this question and Peter can add after me. In regards to endpoint, there is an FDA-accepted endpoint of visual acuity as a mean-visual acuity at month 9. is an FDA approved end point. And this is -- that's why we are absolutely excited with our results, showing the 9 month and 10-month visual acuity being a very similar to the [indiscernible]. And again, if Antony noted that we have an FDA meeting coming up, a type-C meeting, and we are going to have discussions that are how its clinical trial design should be. Again, as noted before, none of the populations are out of just -- we're going to discuss all and make an agreement with the FDA, how that population should look like and going forward with the end point.
Antony Mattessich
executiveYes. Concerning the other part of your question about the ideal strategic alliance that we would have. I mean, as a company, we realize what we do well, and we realize what we will need help with. I mean we are very good formulators, we're very good clinical developers of ophthalmic products. But what we do not have an ambition to be is a global commercializer of the products that we make. The ideal partner would be a partner that would have global reach, that would be able to sell commercialize OTX-TKI in all markets of the world. And that clearly is a fairly small list of companies that we can all probably can name off on one hand, they would have the ability to do that in the ophthalmology space. And we are having conversations with all of them. We've been very, very open that we realize the enormity of the market that we're about to go into. We also have been very public about our displeasure with the current stock price that we have. So I wouldn't expect any massively dilutive raise to be the way we fund our way through this program. As we take on, particularly wet AMD, that is a very resource-intensive indication to get and diabetic retinopathy much less so. But in order to embark upon that program in wet AMD, we would want to be able to assure that there would be funding all the way through to the end of that program. And by far, our most preferable way to move forward with that will be with a strategic alliance with a partner who would take on the responsibility of the funding of those Phase III programs and then, of course, the commercialization of the product globally.
Caroline Palomeque
analystIf I could just ask a quick follow-up. In terms of funding, how are you thinking about the cost of the trial, particularly Phase II/III?
Antony Mattessich
executiveWell, sort of wet finger in the air looking at wet AMD all the way to NDA, which is 2 pivotal trials. It's probably a little north of $300 million in total investment. Looking at diabetic retinopathy with 2 pivotals, 2 NDA filings is somewhere north of $60 million, depending on the FDA's feedback on what that trial should look like and whether we would need to be a 2-arm or 3-arm trial. So clearly, 1 of them is far more digestible than the other when we look at it from a funding standpoint. But I said, we realized that we're entering a very big lead with a very important product that has multibillion dollar potential. And we would want somebody who knows how to do this partnering with us going forward.
Operator
operatorAnd our last question in queue coming from the line of Georgi Yordanov with Cowen.
Georgi Yordanov
analystCongratulations on the update and on the data. So just a clarifying one on our end. As we try to understand the clinical and the regulatory path here, specifically for wet AMD, maybe can you just first confirm that you need to run 2 pivotal Phase III trials? And then is there a deal to run those sequentially, meaning you'll wait for the results from the first pivotal until you initiate the second one?
Rabia Ozden
executiveYes.
Antony Mattessich
executiveIt is premature to speculate on what the trials would look like because we are very, very imminently about to discuss those designs with the FDA, but we are definitely planning to do the pivotals in tandem with each other and not sequentially, which radically brings in the time to NDA filing for both, DR and for wet AMD.
Georgi Yordanov
analystAnd you mean -- sorry, just to confirm, you mean like the 2 pivotals for wet AMD at the same time.
Antony Mattessich
executiveYes.
Rabia Ozden
executiveI mean -- yes, it's exactly like Antony said, the -- one of them may start a quarter or so after the other one, just for the operational reasons, but they would be done at the same time.
Georgi Yordanov
analystGot it. And then in terms of -- just a follow-up question on the baseline patient characteristics. Maybe can you just talk about -- you kind of alluded to that, but how close to the real world were the patients that were enrolled in this trial? And then also, would you expect to enroll a similar patient population in those pivotal trials? Or do you think the FDA requirements would kind of like push it to a slightly different patient population?
Peter Kaiser
executiveWell, we're going to have a meeting with the FDA to discuss these types of issues. Our guess is basically similar to other clinical studies in this space. So for instance, the port delivery system, and REGENXBIO are both in patients who were previously treated. So we have [ pressed it ] from the FDA as to what they want us to be studying. We would expect it to be very similar to this cohort of patients, so previously treated patients. The towards the original -- one of the questions earlier about treatment naive, one of the reasons that treatment naive is difficult at this time as there's so few treatment-naive patients to enroll in the study. So it takes forever, whereas a study where you have previously treated patients. So the port delivery system, for instance, enrolled very, very quickly because as a clinician, I have thousands of these patients sitting around getting injections every week. So it's very easy to enroll that type of study and very quick to enroll that study compared to if we were to do treatment naive.
Operator
operatorI'm showing no further questions at this time. I would now like to turn the call back over to Mr. Antony Mattessich for any closing remarks.
Antony Mattessich
executiveGreat. Well, I want to thank everybody for joining us early on a Monday morning after the Super Bowl. So I hope everybody is clear enough thinking in terms of understanding the enormity of this data and the Q&A that we've just had. What I hope that people can expect from us moving forward is increasing clarity on exactly what the pivotals will look like for both, diabetic retinopathy and for wet AMD. And the other thing I think is really important to stress is that we have been very clear about our dissatisfaction with the current level of the stock price as it is. And we certainly have no intention of funding the programs that we see going forward with a painfully dilutive raise at the levels which we are right now. So the one thing to expect is greater clarity. The one thing not to expect is a painfully diluted rate at the levels where we currently are. And we believe we have a number of funding options with a preference towards strategic alliance, but there are a number of other levers that are possible to pull that are non-dilutive or minimally dilutive, that we feel we have very good line of sight on. So I'd say watch this space. And I hope everybody is as excited as we are about the difference that this can make with patients suffering from VEGF-mediated retinal disease. So thanks, everyone, for attending today.
Operator
operatorLadies and gentlemen, that does conclude the conference for today. Thank you for your participation. You may now disconnect.
Read the full transcript via the API
You're viewing the first half of this call. Get the complete Ocular Therapeutix, Inc. transcript — plus 251,000+ transcripts from 12,000+ companies, speaker segments, AI summaries and full-text search — through the EarningsCalls.dev API.
Get the API View API docs →This call discussed
For developers and AI pipelines
Programmatic access to Ocular Therapeutix, Inc. earnings transcripts and 251,000+ others is available through the
EarningsCalls.dev REST API. Plans from $24.99/month — full transcripts, speaker segments,
full-text search, and the recently-added /api/v1/transcripts/recent polling endpoint for ETL pipelines.