Parque Arauco S.A. (PARAUCO) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Good morning, and thank you for taking the time to connect the Parque Arauco First Quarter 2025 Earnings Call. I'm Lauren Brown, Head of Investor Relations, and I am joined by Francisco Moyano, CFO; and Matias Silva, Director of Corporate Finance. I would like to mention a few things before we get started. [Operator Instructions] Please note that this call is being recorded, and the recording will be used for internal purposes. To start off today's call, I'm going to pass the conversation over to Matias.

Thank you, Lauren, and a warm welcome to everyone joining us for our call. So this quarter marked an eventful beginning for the year for the company. We are kicking off the year with strong momentum. At a consolidated level, revenues grew nearly 14% and EBITDA was up by 16%. Most notably, our funds from operations, or FFO, increased by approximately 22%. This growth reflects both the overall strength of our portfolio and specific dynamics across the 3 countries in which we operate. We'll go into more detail later, but to give you a quick snapshot, results were driven by a continued strong performance at Parque Arauco Kennedy and our Premium Outlet in Chile as well as notable growth from MegaPlaza Independencia in Lima and Parque Fabricato in Colombia. Also worth highlighting is Parque La Molina in Lima. This quarter marks the first time we are seeing its full impact. As in previous quarters, we continue advancing our growth strategy with a clear focus on value creation. We closed the quarter with a net debt-to-EBITDA ratio of 4.5x, in line with preparing for our announced 700 -- sorry, $737 million growth pipeline. Specifically, we announced 2 new deals this quarter. First, a new greenfield Premium Outlet in Buin, just south of Santiago. This will be our second outlet in Región Metropolitana, and it involves a $24 million investment, 11,000 square meters of GLA and is expected to open in the second half of 2027. It will serve more than 3.5 million people, including travelers, thanks to its location on Chile's main highway. Second, we signed a binding agreement to acquire the Minka Shopping Center in Callao, Lima's Northern District for $104 million. This is a key commercial asset in the area with over 54,000 square meters of space, 47,100 in modern retail and 7,000 in a traditional market. Assuming all conditions are met, we expect to close that deal in the third quarter. Finally, on the growth pillar, and although this happened in April, it's worth mentioning here. We completed the acquisition of Open Plaza Kennedy for $173 million. We are now in the process of integrating this asset into the Parque Arauco Kennedy complex. Turning to the right side of the balance sheet. In March, we tapped the capital markets and issued a new bond with 12 years duration, raising a total of approximately $84 million at UF + 3.35%. The strong demand reflects investor confidence in our balance sheet, the quality of our assets and our reputation for financial prudence. Regarding our advances on our sustainability strategic pillar, we were rated as low risk by Morningstar Sustainalytics in the ESG risk ratings with a score of 14.2. We see this as a recognition of our high degree of accountability to investors and the public regarding sustainability issues and places Parque Arauco as the company with the lowest ESG rate -- risk among the 30 companies that comprise the main Chilean Stock Index, the IPSA. Lastly, I invite you all to have a look at our 2024 integrated report, now available on our corporate website. It's a comprehensive look at the progress we've made across all 4 of our strategic pillars during the year. Now moving on to tenant sales. This quarter, we saw a consolidated increase of 11.8%. The main driver was the strong performance of our assets, particularly in Chile and Colombia. Starting with Chile, tenant sales were up 16%, driven by more than 20% growth at Parque Arauco Kennedy and over 34% growth across all our -- sorry, across our Premium Outlet portfolio, which continues to exceed expectations. While it's difficult to pinpoint one specific cost, several factors have contributed to this strong performance, successful lease negotiations, consolidation of our areas of influence, a continued focus on enhancing customer experience and finally, strong tourist figures in our -- in the country. Moving to Peru. Sales increased by about 5% in Peruvian soles. This was mostly due to a recovery in private consumption. Strong performers included Outlet Arequipa, Parque Chincha and MegaPlaza Barranca. The full opening of Parque La Molina in the last quarter of 2024 also played a key role. In Colombia, tenants sales rose more than 10% in Colombian pesos. Both Parque Alegra and Titán Plaza were standouts, each delivering sales growth of approximately 25%. And finally, I want to highlight the occupancy cost. Those occupancy cost remained stable across all 3 countries. We continue to operate within levels we consider healthy and sustainable for both our tenants and us. Now let's have a look at revenues. Consolidated revenues for the first quarter increased by 13.6%. Much like tenant sales, this was mainly driven by the overall strong performance of our portfolio, although in this case, it was particularly in Chile and Peru. In Chile, revenues were up nearly 18%, and the growth was quite broad-based across our assets. A standout here was the Premium Outlet portfolio, which grew more than 35%. The highest growth came from Arauco Premium Outlet Coquimbo near La Serena. Over in Peru, revenues rose more than 14% in local currency. A big part of this was due to the strong performance of MegaPlaza Independencia, which continued to deliver excellent results despite only limited interventions as part of its master plan. As I mentioned earlier, the full contribution for Parque La Molina also helped strengthen the country's results. In Colombia, revenue growth was a bit more moderate, about 5.5% in Colombian pesos. This was mainly due to a higher comparison base from the same quarter of last year. That said, Parque Fabricato and Parque Caracolí still delivered the best top line growth within the country. Lastly, I want to touch on occupancy levels. They remain very strong at 96.4% across the portfolio. That's supported by the high quality of our assets, the natural maturing of our newly developments and the strong starting occupancy of Parque La Molina. Now let's move on to tenant sales and revenue per square meter. If you've been following Parque Arauco for some time, you will know that one of the cornerstones of our success is the quality of our portfolio. So this slide puts some numbers behind that claim. When we say quality, we're talking about productivity, and the data shows that our assets consistently rank at the very top of the industry, either first or second in both tenant sales and revenue per square meter. And as you can see, more than often -- more often than not by a significant margin. So all in all, when we look at the portfolio as a whole, there's no doubt Parque Arauco's portfolio is undeniably Tier 1. And this level of performance is what gives us the confidence to keep pushing forward with our growth and profitability strategies. Now let's have a look at leasing activity. During the quarter, about 3.3% of our gross leasable area was involved in some form of negotiation. That includes changes to tariffs, lease terms, tenant mix or a combination of these. While this is a slightly lower -- this is slightly lower than we saw in -- than what we saw in the first quarter of last year, it's very much within the range of what we consider a normal and healthy level of leasing activity. We expect this trend to continue, especially as we keep adapting our tenant mix and lease structures to evolving consumer preferences and market dynamics. Now turning now to EBITDA. Consistent with the revenue growth, our EBITDA grew more than 16%, driven mainly by the factors I mentioned earlier, but supported by EBITDA margin expansion as well. On the cost side, our cost of sales rose by about 9%, largely due to inflation. But here's the good news. That increase was lower than our revenue growth, thanks to our ongoing efficiency efforts, all within our zero-based budget initiative. SG&A expenses increased by almost 14%, explained partially for IT-related expenses, something we flagged in previous quarters. On a more positive note, bad debt provisions fell by roughly 77%. This drop wasn't so much about improvements this quarter, but rather the comparisons to a higher impairment level in Q1 of last year. That said, we're not seeing any significant -- any signs of significant deterioration in our accounts receivable portfolio at the present. It is worth mentioning that just as in previous quarters, the tarifa simplificada or [indiscernible] effect on EBITDA margins was very significant. In absence of the [indiscernible], this quarter's EBITDA margin would have been 340 basis points higher, while for the last 12 months, it would have been 310 basis points higher, reaching 74.2% and 75.3%, respectively. So moving on to our non-operational results. First, our financial expenses decreased by almost 10%. This improvement came from refinancing some of our debt on better terms as well as shifting some of our CLP-denominated debt to UF-denominated debt. Now on the financial income side, we saw a decline of about 8%. This was primarily due to a reduction in the returns we are getting from our cash investments as well as a decrease in the overall duration of our investment portfolio, which was part of our preparation for the Open Plaza Kennedy acquisition a few days ago. Finally, our loss on indexed assets and liabilities increased by more than 80%. This is mainly due to much higher inflation in Q1, of this quarter, compared to Q1 2024. And that same inflation impact explains the 10% decrease in profits from associates accounted as well. Now moving to funds from operations. We saw growth of almost 22%. A significant driver of this growth was the increase in EBITDA that we already discussed. But it's also worth noting that the reduction in financial expenses I mentioned earlier, played a major role in driving FFO growth, surpassing EBITDA increase. As expected from the better results, though, this better scenario was partially offset by higher current taxes. Additionally, we saw an increase of about 7% in associates accounted FFO. This growth was driven by strong operational performance, much in line with the performance we observed in Parque Arauco's portfolio. Thank you very much. And now I'll pass the call to Lauren.

Thank you, Matias. Now I'm going to move over to our asset-level results. Let's turn to the performance of our retail assets in Chile during the first quarter of 2025, starting with Parque Arauco Kennedy. The asset closed the quarter with an 18% EBITDA increase year-over-year. This strong performance was primarily driven by a 12% increase in revenue, reflecting ongoing sales momentum across the mall. Notably, the base rent grew by 10%, supported by the onboarding of several premium and lifestyle brands such as BOSS, GUESS, New Balance and On. Sales at Kennedy grew 23.5% in the quarter as a result of our active efforts to optimize the commercial mix, supported by continued consolidation of its direct area of influence as well as a sustained increase in tourism activity. Anchor stores were particularly strong with sales growing 40 -- over 40% year-over-year and foot traffic also increased by nearly 2%. Moving to Arauco Chillan. This asset continues to benefit from its strategic repositioning of tenant diversification. EBITDA grew 28%, driven by a 21% increase in revenue after the reconversion of a supermarket into 20 smaller format stores. The sales of these smaller format stores also performed exceptionally well with sales growing nearly 20%. Our Premium Outlets portfolio in Chile continues to deliver robust performance, supported both by local demand and a sustained inflow of tourists. One standout this quarter was Arauco Premium Outlet Coquimbo located near La Serena, where revenue grew by 56% and sales increased by 47% year-over-year. Overall, the Outlet portfolio saw EBITDA growth of 43% with total revenue up 29% and a 34% increase in sales. Key contributors to this performance included stores like Nike, Puma, Levi's and Under Armour, especially in locations such as Buenaventura, Coquimbo and Curauma. Lastly, in Arauco Quilicura, we saw solid growth across key indicators. EBITDA increased 15% and base rent increased by 17%, supported by the addition of new tenants as part of the expansion. These tenants include Tricot, Express Lider and SuperZoo, which enhance the retail mix and appeal of this shopping center. In summary, our Chilean retail assets are showing strong and consistent performance, driven by a combination of strategic tenant curation, continued consumer spending and a sustained rebound in tourism. Moving over to Peru. MegaPlaza Independencia continues progressing in its expansion of the gastronomic district, which has not significantly impacted its performance. Revenue for this asset grew by 15% with strong performance from both anchor and midsized stores despite a slight decrease in overall GLA. NOI for this asset also increased about 15%. Our Outlet format in Peru is also growing and in sales by over 5%, driven by the conversion of Outlet Arauco Arequipa, which experienced an increase in foot traffic by 5% and sales by 11% compared to the same period in 2024, with most growth in entertainment and the gastronomic segment. In the slides about our CapEx development, I will highlight more information about the expansions at MegaPlaza Independencia, MegaPlaza Ica in the first few months since opening La Molina. In Colombia, compared to 2024, there is a notable reduction in uncertainty among both brands and consumers. Across the portfolio, tenant sales surpassed expectations at several key assets. However, revenue has not kept pace. This lag is largely due to the stabilization phase that we're currently in for some of our recently acquired or repositioned assets, particularly Parque Alegra, Parque Fabricato and Titán Plaza, which continued to follow the normal maturation process curve. Starting with Parque Alegra, this asset continues to mature strongly. Sales grew by 26%, largely driven by midsized tenants, especially after the arrival of El Gigante del Hogar. Net operating income increased by 23%, supported not only by stronger revenues, but also by the reversal of bad debt provisions. Additionally, in July 2024, Parque Arauco acquired full ownership of this asset, giving us greater strategic control and operational efficiency going forward. Moving to Parque Fabricato, we saw a drop in occupancy of 6% due to the departure of the anchor store Flamingo. Despite this, the asset showed resilience with revenue and sales up over 11%, driven primarily by smaller and midsized stores and a solid performance in the entertainment segment. Titán Plaza had a strong quarter with sales increasing 23%, again, led by smaller format stores and restaurants. This performance helped offset the impact of Forever 21's departure. Notably, the occupancy rose 12% compared to the fourth quarter of 2024, reflecting the successful leasing of vacant space and adjustments to market aligned rental rates. As part of our strategy, we've made targeted tenant replacements that are paying off. For example, Forever 21 was replaced by KOAJ, a brand with a rent structure more aligned with the location's market value. Similarly, other stores were replaced by ones that are a better fit for the mall's demographic, such as the entrance of Lili Pink, leading to a stronger performance. Lastly, a quick note on [ Parque La Colina ], which reported a 14% year-over-year increase in EBITDA, driven by a 9% rise in revenue. Overall, sales grew 13% with a significant contribution from anchor tenants. Falabella, in particular, stood out with an over 50% increase in sales. In summary, we are seeing consistency, improved sentiment and clear progress in asset stabilization. We continue to optimize tenant mix, capture market-aligned rents and support our tenants through this next phase of growth. Now I'm going to move on to development. In MegaPlaza Independencia, the new gastronomic district we're developing will be the largest in the north of Lima. We're going from a 9-unit food hall to nearly 26 restaurant and food hall options. Such -- and they're also in a more modern space with sun coverage, addressing the demand that we identified for our clients. Construction should be completed by the end of the year, and stores will begin operating in Q1 of 2026. In Ica, we are also doing an expansion, and this project has 2 subphases already completed, the gym on the third floor and the new area on the second floor where we've added banks and new stores. The next phase, which we're calling Boulevard, has already begun construction. This includes putting the parking underground and creating a greener open air area with restaurants, making the mall much more iconic. We will also internally connect the Sodimac Maestro to the main mall corridor as this anchor was previously separated and operated almost as if it was a stand-alone. The project is expected to be completed by the end of the year with some units opening by Christmas and others starting in early 2025. As Matias mentioned, we opened Parque La Molina in December of 2024 with over 90% of the GLA leased, which is extremely successful in our business and marks an important milestone. Approximately 60% of the GLA was open on the inauguration date, and the rest of the stores have been opening gradually day by day. However, the restaurants have taken a bit longer to open for 2 main reasons. One were licenses and the other is availability of the main gas line connections. However, restaurants will begin opening in the next few weeks. It is worth noting that we did open with a selection of cafes in complementary spots such as Freddo, Häagen-Dazs and Frutix, which have been well received. Foot traffic is performing well and in line with the plan. We anticipated a slower season at the beginning of the year due to the summer months when residents of La Molina typically head to the beach, but this tends to pick up again with the return of school. Sales should increase with the opening of the restaurant. And additionally, it is worth highlighting the success of the cinema, which is already drawing people away from the cinemas in other nearby malls. This inauguration has been supported by a strong marketing campaign focused not only on restaurants, but on the entire mall offering, the excellent brands it hosts, its cozy atmosphere, which the public has warmly welcomed as an oasis in the city. Now on Page 32, I would like to highlight our CapEx table. The new CapEx table includes the recent acquisition of Open Kennedy. On the top right-hand side of the slide, you can see a pie chart showing the breakdown of our total CapEx investments by type of project, expansions, the Open Kennedy acquisition, other new malls, and multifamily. As you can see in the table, some of these projects were already incorporated in the first quarter of 2024, while others will be incorporated between now and 2028. By the time all of these projects are completed, we will have expanded our total GLA to over 260,000 square meters and our own GLA to over 250,000 square meters with a total investment of USD 737 million. While Page 32 highlights the total CapEx, on Page 33, we take a look at the remaining CapEx. You can see the breakdown by type of project of the remaining $495 million in the pie chart on the left-hand side. On the right-hand side, you can see the investment distribution by project. This investment pipeline totaling $737 million is a historic figure for the company, representing almost a quarter of the total value of investment properties as of the end of first quarter '25. The remaining investment associated with this pipeline represents 15% of the total. This robust growth plan reflects the company's commitment to the sustainable development of its assets and ensures a strong and sustained growth outlook for the coming years. Additionally, on the following page, you can see the announced projects to be incorporated and that they represent a 20% increase in the company's GLA. In 2025, we expect the opening of 149,000 square meters of new space, representing 12% of our portfolio, driven by the acquisitions of Open Plaza Kennedy and the Minka shopping center. On Page 35 through 37, I would like to highlight our case study about safety and security. Safety and security is an important pillar for us. In fact, it is also a KPI that is even incorporated into our bonus structure. It is a reflection of continuous effort and small changes over time. Since 2019, we have invested over $20 million in safety and security -- since 2019, we have invested over $28 million in safety and security, which includes hardware, infrastructure enhancements, specialized software and training. To highlight some of our efforts in marketing, during the first quarter, we had many activities throughout our malls. During March, we developed a series of events, thanks to a free strategic alliance with leading media outlets such as Panamericana Televisión and national radio stations. This collaboration positioned MegaPlaza Independencia as the main stage of the iconic program, La Súper Movida de los Sábados, achieving a massive national audience in addition to increasing traffic by 7,000 people. These types of events illustrate how the malls often act as cultural centers, building community and bringing people and families together. Another example of this is in Colombia, together with the Instituto de La Conversación, more than 230 people participated in 140 cultural activities in Parque Alegra and Parque Fabricato, accumulating 200 hours of training in dance, music and reading. Customer experience and innovation is an important strategic pillar at Parque Arauco. During the first quarter of 2025, Parque Arauco Peru division forged a partnership with Mercado Libre, while in Chile, we continued strengthening our omnichannel strategy with the addition of new shipping points in partnership with Blue Express, available in Parque Arauco Kennedy and Arauco Maipú. We are proud to mention that we continue to make progress in the certification of our assets, integrating energy efficiency, responsible water use, emissions reduction and indoor environmental quality criteria into our design and construction processes. And in 2024, we added 78,000 square meters of LEED Gold-certified GLA. Now we will move over to the question-and-answer part of this presentation.

[Operator Instructions] To start off today's discussion, I am going to pass the call over to the CFO of Parque Arauco, Francisco Moyano. Let me see which questions we have. Okay. I have here a written question from Eduardo Ramirez of BICE Inversiones. It seems that occupancy costs decreased year-over-year in first quarter '25 in Chile and Colombia. Could you please provide a short-term and midterm guidance on the evolution of company of occupancy costs?

Perfect. Eduardo, thank you for the question. Regarding the occupancy cost, what has happened is that our portfolio is doing very well. And we have been experiencing very high consumption levels in Chile, Peru, and Colombia. But at the same time, we are seeing our negotiations of rents also doing very well in the previous quarters. In fact, in new negotiations, what we are seeing is renegotiations around inflation plus 1%, inflation plus 2%. And with that, we are putting some pressure in the occupancy cost that was decreasing because of this higher sales that we have been experiencing in all 3 countries. So at the end, in this business, what we see is that when sales are doing well, that gives you room to increase rents. And at the same time, with the high occupancy that we have in our portfolio of 96.4%, the negotiation process is doing very well for Parque Arauco. So for the future, what I am expecting is to have occupancy cost stable around the same figures that we have today. Please remember also that the different levels between countries is due to the proportion of anchor stores that we have in each country. But at the end, what we see is that occupancy cost should maintain stable even when sales are doing very well because the revenue side is also increasing very well in the 3 countries. Any other questions?

Any additional questions? One came in, and then -- okay, here we go. Jorel from Goldman Sachs.

I have 2 questions. So I wanted to get a sense of, you closed on Open Plaza. And I just wanted to get a sense of color on a general sense of how you think about the integration of these assets? Like, what is the time line? What are the changes that you're expecting to make, when we should be seeing a stabilization, or are you achieving your goals for that asset? Is it like you acquire it today, and it's going to take you a year or 2 before it gets to the point where you want to get it to? Or is it like right off the start? And then the second question is around Chile. Chile sales have been very robust, particularly in Parque Arauco Kennedy this first quarter. I just want to get a sense of view of the durability of these sales. Do you expect to maintain this very strong clip throughout the rest of the year?

Okay. Thank you, Jorel. Yes. Regarding the first question, Open Plaza Kennedy, we are working very fast on some of the work that we are planning. The first thing is that we see a high opportunity moving traffic from Parque Arauco Kennedy, our asset, to Open Plaza Kennedy because the traffic flow that goes to Parque Arauco Kennedy is much higher than the one that is reaching Open Plaza Kennedy. So to do that, what we are doing is to work on signaling in order for the people that visit us to understand what is the full commercial offer that we have in both assets. And the other part is taking control of the operational side of Open Plaza Kennedy. And with that, we have some cost synergies in the short term. But at the same time, the commercial team is taking control of the commercialization of Open Plaza Kennedy, and during the whole process of due diligence, we were very careful on not sharing the information of the transaction with all the teams. So just recently, the commercial team is having more information about all the tenants and the contracts and everything. So they are working today on understanding the next steps in order to renegotiate some spaces and improve -- and try to improve the commercial offer of Open Plaza Kennedy. What we are seeing is that, and to put you this information in the cap rate level, in this transaction, the cap rate was 6.9% and with the short-term synergies, it should increase to 7.34%, and aiming to reach more than 7.5%, probably to get to 8% at the end of next year. That is kind of the time line that we are seeing for the short, medium-term synergies. Obviously, after that, what we are building is that it is a huge asset in the best location of Santiago. So we are very optimistic also about the commercialization and the strength that this asset will have in the future. So we are not seeing that scenario today. We are working on the short term and medium term to get to this 7.5% to 8% cap rate at the end of 2026, but probably this asset will keep improving in the future. And regarding the Chile sales, we are not having today signs that the sales are going down. The sales during the first quarter were very strong, as you can see in the figures. Parque Arauco Kennedy and the outlets has -- had all the sales coming from tourism, but if you see the rest of the portfolio, it also has very good figures above inflation by 300 basis points, 400 basis points. So Chile at the end is doing well in the consumption level, and we are not seeing signs that this is going to decrease in the short term. It's difficult to say what is going to happen in the rest of the year. But as of today, we are doing very well in Chile.

A follow-up, if I may. So basically, the idea here is you see 100 basis points plus expansion in NOI yield for Open Plaza. But what I want to understand, would this imply further CapEx going into this asset?

The only CapEx probably that is going to happen that is the important one is going to be trying to build this bridge that connects the 2 assets. We are working on that. Today, it's a project that we need to pass with a -- have the approval from the municipality. It's going to be a medium-term project. It's not going to happen in the following months or anything, but probably that is the only relevant CapEx in the future with this integration.

Now passing over to Jonathan from JPMorgan.

Congrats on the results. So my question was back on the Minka acquisition that Matias referenced during his explanation. So it was announced back in January and should add another 50,000 square meters in Peru of commercial space. So I just wanted to get a sense of the timing of the approval for this deal and what are your rationale as well in terms of the integration and the opportunities you see at the Minka deal?

Yes. Well, it's difficult to say -- to give a time line here because today, we are working with the regulators, with the antitrust regulators in order to get the transaction approved by them. It should work well. Our expectation is that, is not to have any problem with that. But having said so, it's difficult to say how long it will take. In our scenarios, we are considering Minka to be added to the portfolio in the second semester of this year, but it's difficult to say. And regarding the integration with the portfolio of Parque Arauco, this is an asset that is working well today. It's operating at full capacity. So it's an asset that will be added to the portfolio with not much trouble. There is no CapEx involved in the integration. And our idea is to -- we are working in order to have this transaction complete as soon as possible in order to add the EBITDA coming from Minka that, as you know, had a cap rate of 10% in the transaction. The asset value was $100 million. So it would add $10 million in the annual EBITDA of Peru.

Now I have a written question from Macarena of Credicorp. Can you give more details on what the revenue growth and EBITDA margin would have been without the simplified tariffs?

Sure. Yes. Give me on second. All right. So as I mentioned, without the tarifa simplificada effect, we would have had an EBITDA margin this quarter of 74.2%, which is 340 basis points higher than what we have from an accounting perspective. And that's only for the quarter. And for the last 12 months, it will have been 75.3%. And for revenue growth, sorry, I don't have that number.

In the revenue side, yes, the tarifa simplificada, as you know, works. What we are doing is charging for rents. all in one rent. So the revenue costs are growing. And at the same time, the costs are growing by the same amount. I don't have the figure here of what is the impact on revenues and costs since the EBITDA doesn't change. The EBITDA is the same with the tarifa simplificada or without it because in the net effect, the growth in revenue and cost cancel each other. So what we think is more important here, is the increase in the EBITDA margin because of the -- in the accounting effect, you cannot see what is the real or comparable EBITDA margin with the regular rate. So I think the important thing is to see -- to understand what is the effect of the EBITDA margin more than the revenue side or the cost side.

Absolutely, absolutely. So I was just doing the numbers here because when you have the margin EBITDA, you can isolate the effect. So the effect for the quarter is about [ COP 3,500,000 millions ]. So that's the effect that you have on both revenues and costs. If we haven't had this in tarifa simplifica, revenues would have been, as I said, [ COP 3,500,000 million ] less and the same goes for the costs.

Thank you very much. And now we have a final question from Guillermo Edwards of LarrainVial. Do you have any plans to issue a USD bond following the recent international rating?

Yes. Well, we were very pleased to hear -- to have this notification from Fitch with investment-grade rating. As you may know now, we got a rating of BBB, which allow us to enter to the capital markets in the U.S. Our idea is to have all the financing sources open in the future. Today, we are issuing bonds in Chile and in Peru, but we are ready to issue bonds then in Colombia, where we have a rating of AAA and in the U.S. with this investment-grade rating. But in our projections and plans today, we are -- we will be probably issuing only bonds in Chile and Peru and maybe Colombia. We are not planning to issue a new bond today in the U.S., but we wanted to have the doors open to do that.

Great. Thank you, everyone, for all of your questions. And thank you, Francisco and Matias for the answers. As a reminder, at the beginning of this month, we published our 2024 integrated report. This is available to read on the website in Spanish and is in the process of being translated into English. We invite you to read this report for an in-depth look at 2024. Additionally, next week, we'll be sending out invitations for our 2025 Investor Day, which will be held in Santiago on June 17. Please save this day in your calendar. If you have any questions about any of these announcements or would like to schedule a call, please feel free to reach out. And thank you very much for attending the Q1 2025 conference call. We will see you in July for our Q2 2025 conference call. Thank you, everyone, and have a great day.