Pluxee N.V. (RV1.SG) Q1 FY2026 Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Good morning. Thank you for standing by, and welcome to the Pluxee First Quarter Fiscal 2026 Revenues Presentation. [Operator Instructions] I advise you that this conference is being recorded today on Wednesday, January 7, 2025 (sic) [ 2026 ]. At this time, I would like to hand the conference over to Ms. Pauline Bireaud, Head of Investor Relations. Please go ahead, madam.

Good morning, everyone. Happy New Year to all, and thank you for joining us today for our Pluxee First Quarter of Fiscal 2026 Revenues. So I'm Pauline, Head of Investor Relations, and I'm pleased to be here with you to discuss our first quarter performance. So Aurelien Sonet, our CEO; and Stephane Lhopiteau, CFO, will both lead the call and answer your questions. Let me walk you today's agenda, which you can see on the next slide. So Aurelien will start with key highlights and the key figures for the quarter, followed by an overview of our commercial trajectory, and Stephane will then walk you through our top line performance in more detail. And Aurelien will conclude the call with our outlook for fiscal 2026, and will provide an update on the regulatory development in Brazil before we open the floor for Q&A. And with that, I will now hand over to Aurelien.

Thank you, Pauline, and good morning, and Happy New Year, everyone. I'm glad to be with you today for the release of this first quarter of fiscal 2026. First, I'm pleased to share that the group continued to demonstrate robust business momentum in Q1 '26 and delivered a solid high single-digit top line growth, in line with our expectations. This momentum continued to be driven by low double-digit growth in Employee Benefits, driven by Latin America and Rest of the world. Second, our commercial engine continued to perform well with strong new client acquisition and a healthy net retention rate. Third, we progressed on our M&A road map, completing the acquisitions of Skipr in Belgium and France and ProEves in India. And we benefit from a rich and diversified M&A pipeline spanning geographies, deal sizes and strategic contributions, positioning us well for continued successful execution. Finally, looking ahead, we confirm all our financial objectives for fiscal 2026 amid the evolving regulatory framework in Brazil. Let's now turn to the figures. As just mentioned, top line growth continued to be robust during the quarter with revenues reaching EUR 308 million, growing organically by plus 9%, fully in line with our expectations. Operating revenue also continued to follow a steady trajectory, reaching EUR 268 million, up plus 9.1% organically, while float revenue continued to grow organically at plus 8.5%. Stephane will comment these numbers in greater detail during his presentation. Turning now in the next slide to our quarterly commercial trajectory, which remains firmly on track. Despite the challenging macro environment, the net retention rate remained healthy at 100% after adjusting for the cutoff effect related to the ordering of a large Employee Benefit contract in Romania. This performance was driven by consistently high client loyalty and a further tangible results from our portfolio management strategy, particularly through additional face value increases and to a lesser extent, cross-selling. Looking ahead, average face value is expected to remain a key driver of business volume growth, supported by the recent increases in legal caps across several European countries such as Belgium, Romania and Italy. Net retention was notably supported this quarter by the continuation of our long-standing strategic contract with Liverpool, a major retailer in Mexico. Since 2000, Pluxee has consistently acted as a trusted partner to this client, supporting its HR modernization and employee retention and serving now around 100,000 employees. Lastly, we've been encouraged by the early signs of stabilization in the end user portfolio in several European countries. On new client acquisition, we remain well on track to reach our EUR 1.3 billion of business volumes target for fiscal 2026, driven by robust momentum across the 3 regions and further supported by strong dynamics in Brazil and the successful public tender win in Italy. Regarding this win in Italy, Pluxee was awarded 4 regional lots in the latest CONSIP tender, CONSIP being the Italian government's public procurement authority. This success will allow us to progressively serve more than 200,000 Italian civil servants, multiplying by 5 our business volumes for CONSIP. This is a strong milestone for our Italian business and a further illustration of our ability to remain agile and client-focused in markets undergoing regulatory changes. I will now hand over to Stephane to comment in further detail our top line performance during the quarter.

Thank you, Aurelien. Good morning, everyone. Let me start by wishing you all a Happy New Year. It's really a pleasure to be with you today to walk you in more detail through our Q1 '26 top line performance, and I will start with the business volumes issued or BVI on Slide #8. In Q1 '26, we recorded EUR 6.3 billion in BVI, slightly down from EUR 6.5 billion in Q1 '25, reflecting the anticipated trend in Public Benefits. Focusing first on the Employee Benefits line of service, which represents around 80% of total volumes, BVI reached EUR 5 billion, up plus 7.2% on a like-for-like basis when excluding the one-off impact of a delay in a large program in Romania. Growth was primarily driven by Latin America and Rest of the world, which both continued to post low double-digit volume growth on an organic basis, while Continental Europe showed mixed dynamics. with robust momentum in Southern Europe, partly offset by improving but still negative evolution in the end user portfolio in several other markets. Turning to the other products and services line of service. Performance reflected temporary and expected headwinds in Public Benefits due to the anticipated termination, scale-down or deferral of certain large programs across Continental Europe. Let's now see how such business volumes issue translated into total revenues on Page #9. In Q1 '26, total revenues reached EUR 308 million, reflecting a robust organic growth of plus 9%, it was driven by a plus 9.1% organic increase in operating revenue, reaching EUR 268 million and a plus 8.5% organic growth in float revenue stable year-on-year in absolute terms at EUR 40 million. This performance reflects higher interest rates year-on-year in Brazil, offsetting a gradual decline in other countries, combined with a tactical and opportunistic investment approach tailored to local market conditions. On a reported basis, total revenues grew by plus 6.6% year-on-year, including a plus 1.2% scope effect related mainly to the integration of the recent acquisition of Cobee, Benefício Fácil and Skipr and a minus 3.6% currency impact moderating year-on-year and largely driven by the depreciation of the Turkish lira against the euro. Going into more details, I will now highlight the underlying trends by line of service that supported the operating revenue momentum as shown on Slide #10. Robust trend in operating revenue was driven by the continued strong momentum in Employee Benefits. Indeed, operating revenue from this line of service grew by plus 11.6% organically in the quarter, reaching EUR 234 million. This steady growth was supported by higher business volumes, notably related to the contribution of the last year new acquisition and additional increases in fair value and a slight year-on-year improvement in the take-up rate. In contrast, operating revenue from other products and services declined as expected by minus 5.7% organically to EUR 34 million reported, reflecting the anticipated termination, scale-down or deferral in certain contracts in Europe, notably in Austria, Romania and Belgium. As previously mentioned, fiscal '26 will be a transition year for the Public Benefits activity with some programs reaching their natural end and others being impacted by budgetary constraints in some European countries. This well-flagged base effects are expected to persist over the fiscal year, even if progressively fading and eventually resulting in an easier comparison base in the next fiscal year for other products and services. As mentioned earlier, operating revenue organic growth was mainly driven by Latin America and Rest of the world. Let's take a closer look at this on Slide #11. Over the quarter, all regions delivered organic growth, although performance continued to vary across geographies. Starting with Continental Europe, operating revenue reached EUR 110 million, up plus 2.7% organically. Reported growth stood at plus 4.9%, including a plus 2.2% scope effect. While positive momentum remains strong in Southern Europe, the performance in the whole region reflected: first, the challenging macroeconomic environment, which continued to weigh on business performance alongside an improving but still negative evolution of the end user portfolio. Second, the previously mentioned evolution in public benefits; and third, a temporary headwind from deferred ordering for a large Employee Benefits program in Romania. Turning to Latin America. Operating revenue reached EUR 112 million, up plus 14.3%, excluding a plus 1.1% scope effect and a minus 1.5% currency impact. This strong performance was driven by a strong commercial trend across the region, supported by a more favorable macro environment, including persistent inflation. Brazil continued to deliver a double-digit organic growth in operating revenue alongside sustained momentum across Hispanic LatAm. Rest of the world also showed solid sequential acceleration reaching EUR 46 million in operating revenue, up plus 12.6% organically, excluding a minus 12.8% currency impact, mostly due to the Turkish lira devaluation in Q1 '26 versus Q1 '25. While Turkey remains a key growth engine, we have also started to observe encouraging signals in the U.K. and the U.S. from the ongoing business repositioning following the management changes and the launch of new employee engagement platforms. That concludes my comments on the Q1 '26 top line, and I will now hand over to Aurelien for the outlook on Page #12.

Thank you, Stephane. I will conclude this presentation by a reminder on our financial objectives for fiscal 2026 before providing an update on recent developments in Brazil and the group's related action plan. Let's first move to our fiscal 2026 outlook in Slide 13. I'm pleased to confirm all our financial objectives for fiscal 2026 as announced on November 17, following the regulatory evolution in Brazil, meaning, first, stable like-for-like total revenues as we expect total revenues organic growth across all our global geographic footprint to offset the headwinds anticipated in Brazil and also assuming slightly decreasing float revenue like-for-like. Second, the slight organic expansion in recurring EBITDA margin, reflecting our ability to adapt our operating model and implement the necessary cost mitigation actions in Brazil in order to protect our group's profitability; and third, around 80% cash conversion on average over fiscal 2024 to 2026. As a reminder, these financial objectives are based on the most conservative assumptions regarding the content of the reform in Brazil and the time line for its implementation. It's worth mentioning that significant uncertainties remain regarding the scope, the operational feasibility and the phasing of the measures announced by the Brazilian government. And in this context, I would like to walk you through our clear action plan in Brazil that support these numbers. Since the publication of the decree, we have launched a comprehensive set of initiatives to be ready for each milestone of this regulatory evolution and to continue supporting our clients, our merchant partners and our end users in Brazil while preserving the group's financial performance. Our action plan is structured around 3 main workstreams. First, operational readiness. We are moving fast to roll out a competitive open-loop solution, leveraging our proven 4-corner 4C capabilities. We are also undertaking a comprehensive client commission renegotiation campaign within our Brazilian client base. And finally, we are deploying a multilevel efficiency plan to both adapt and optimize our operations, including mitigation action in Brazil and prioritization of some global initiatives. Second, our engagement with public authorities. We continue to sustain ongoing dialogue with the Brazilian government, proactively addressing remaining uncertainties, particularly around scope and time lines. And finally, on the legal front, we are currently assessing the options, allowing to challenge the legal foundation of the decree, possibly combining collective and individual actions within an optimal time frame. As you can see, we have a clear action plan in place and teams, both in Brazil and at group level are fully mobilized to address this change. Before we take your questions, I would like to wrap-up on the key takeaways of this first quarter for Pluxee. The group well on track for fiscal 2026, supported by strong commercial performance and robust revenue generation, fully in line with our expectations. Looking ahead, while the regulatory changes in Brazil require a transition period, our business model is proving its resilience. Together with our expertise and our agility in navigating evolving environments, this supports our commitment to deliver on all our financial objectives in fiscal 2026. Turning change into opportunity is part of Pluxee's DNA, and we are well positioned to adapt and emerge stronger. This is why we approach the remainder of the year with continued focus and confidence. And with that, Stephane and I are pleased to answer your questions.

[Operator Instructions] The first question is from Estelle Weingrod of JPMorgan.

The first question on Europe, you mentioned some parts remained impacted by macro headwinds. Could you just provide more color on the countries lagging the overall performance and what geographies, in particular, in Europe are showing a stabilization of the end user portfolio, as you mentioned. It would also be great to comment on France specifically within this. And the second one, I would -- just on Brazil, I mean, on the legal action, with the decree now to be implemented likely next month, what's the time line for the legal action? I guess there's not that much time left. And how likely to see this presidential decree actually not going ahead in your view?

Thank you, Estelle, and Happy New Year to you. Look, regarding your first question, the -- I mean, when we look at the evolution of the BV -- so Latin America and Rest of the world, I mean, benefit from a strong dynamic. They are taking advantage of a more supportive macroeconomic environment, including higher inflation. And it's fair to say that on the contrary, and as expected, the Employee Benefit activity in Continental Europe is currently affected by the effect of a less favorable macroeconomic environment and notably on the evolution of the end user portfolio that remains negative overall. And this trend is particularly pronounced in countries such as France, Germany and Austria. Now talking about France. So France has always been a highly competitive market. But at the moment, our main challenge is related indeed to the evolution of the environment that impacts the commercial performance and especially the evolution of the end user portfolio. And we see that currently, the macroeconomic and the political environment is pushing many organizations to -- many of our clients to adopt a conservative approach to recruitment and in some cases, to even reduce their workforce. And on top of this, these impacts are even stronger in the SME segment, which has been progressively weakened and which is, I would say, experiencing a steady increase in the number of bankruptcies. So as a result, in France, we see an increasing wait-and-see attitude in the purchasing decision, and a delay or a slowdown in the contract signing cycle. So this is situation. The countries where we see, I mean, an improvement are more countries such as Romania, Czech Republic. And we keep, of course, the very positive momentum in the countries of the South of Europe, i.e., Portugal, Spain and Italy. Regarding your second question and so for Brazil and the time line for the legal action, as I was mentioning, we -- so we are currently working on this action. Actually, what we are trying to do, we are trying to get some clarification through this legal action in order to succeed the operational implementation of the decree. And that's why in parallel, we are running a discussion with the government. In terms of timing, what we are doing is we had to take into account the summer holidays first in Brazil because this is currently summer holidays even for the legal system. And in terms of timing, we would go through a quite fast process, seeking again for clarification and potential suspension of some elements, and this can be obtained in a couple of weeks. So that's the goal. So by mid of February, hopefully, we should get a fairly [indiscernible].

The next question, sir, is from Hannes Leitner of Jefferies.

Maybe here just a follow-up on the Brazilian situation. Could you speak about the points where you feel a suspension or a reversal could be most likely? And then just in terms of the Romanian project, can you talk maybe about like public social programs? How do you see 2026 evolving in that regard given the macroeconomic situation in Europe? Do you expect that this year will be a little bit more compensated by government programs? Or is that somewhat related to the macroeconomic?

Okay. Thank you, Hannes. Maybe, Stephane, you want to answer regarding the Public Benefits program, and I'll come back on Brazil.

Hannes, so on the front of the Public Benefit program, so we are seeing and this was anticipated in our guidance for the year, a scale-down, an exit of some public programs in Europe, in Continental Europe. So you noticed, and this is one of the reasons why the organic growth in Continental Europe is low. We have the end user portfolio, as Aurelien mentioned, but we have this strong impact from Public Benefit program as well as the lower float revenue organic growth. But on this -- so we don't expect any recovery. It's more a slow scale-down in this fiscal year '26, which is again well anticipated. And so we are more counting on a kind of rebaselining in this respect for the coming years. So this year is more of a transition year in terms of Public Benefit. However, we are still considering this program as strategic. They are good opportunity for us to connect with public authorities, and they are profitable program for us, even though the economics are slightly different compared to the more standard Employee Benefit program. Referring to the very beginning of your question, there is just one of this program, but which is not a Public Benefit program. When we refer to a specific large program in Romania that has been delayed. This is an Employee Benefit program for a public client, but this is an Employee Benefit program. And on this one, we expect this program to resume later in the year in Q3. But this is going to be something providing growth for the Employee Benefit line of service.

Okay. Thank you, Stephane. And regarding the possibility of suspension and some reversed measures following our legal action plan. Look, it's -- what we've been doing is really running the 3 workstreams in parallel. So I mean, our top, top priority is to make sure that we will be fully operational in the given time frame, even though we consider this time frame as extremely challenging for the whole industry, not just for Pluxee. And so our priority is really the implementation of our competitive open-loop offer. And again, I'm building on our proven 4C capabilities because we already have an open-loop offer, but we want really this offer to be the best of the market and to be ready for mid of May. And we've been already engaging with our clients. So running negotiations because we cannot afford to wait for any decision from the court. Having said this, we are through the legal action, we would be seeking for clarification and potentially get some suspension. It might be some temporary suspension as well. It's too early to tell you this will be on this point or on that point. But we do have hope. But again, we don't put all, let's say, all our eggs in the same basket. And we understand what is the ambition of the Brazilian government. And actually, we are totally in line with their willingness to extend the system to a maximum number of Brazilian employees. But it's more the feasibility and the way to go that we found initially quite aggressive and not totally in line with the discussion that we were running with them.

Next question, sir, is from Pravin Gondhale of Barclays.

Firstly, on Romania, the cutoff effect that you flagged. Could you please elaborate what is driving this delay in ordering? And if you have any visibility on when ordering is expected to be resumed? And then if you can help us quantify the impact of this Romanian contract on organic growth and any other financial terms there?

Stephane, you would...

Pravin, this is, of course, as we said, a large contract, but this is not a significant contract. So we expect this contract to resume in Q3 of this year. The reason why it is delayed, this is related to budgetary constraints from the state in Romania and the country is facing some challenges. This is a contract for some public servants, an important contract, and we expect this contract to be placed in Q3. In case this was not to happen, there will not be a significant hit in terms of organic growth of revenue for the full year. It will be more impactful for the business volume. All these kind of Public Benefit contracts are significant. They represent significant business volumes, but -- and the take-up rate, this is not exactly a take-up rate. This is why we don't disclose the take-up rate for Public Benefit because the economies are organized differently with the public authorities. They are profitable, but the translation from business volumes to revenue is lower compared to the Employee Benefits segment.

The next question is from Justin Forsythe of UBS.

First, I wanted to ask on Brazil. Just at a higher level, your take rate when open-loop is fully implemented is going to be going from roughly 5-ish percent, I believe, down to 1.6% is the interchange cap. So I mean, we're talking about losing potentially when it's all said and done, 2/3, it seems of your Brazil revenue. Correct me if I'm wrong here. So -- and this is all very high incremental margin, I would assume close to 100% drop-through. I mean this seems like it could be a fairly material drop to your -- you gave us a half year impact-ish and there's some phasing challenges there when you cut the guidance. So -- maybe you could just talk a little bit about the full-fledged EBITDA impact that will hit in 2027 and what the change could be to maybe current expectations? And it would be appreciated if you could help us understand in a little bit more detail the mitigation actions you're taking. So I know you mentioned at a higher level that you're going to be taking cost actions in Brazil. What exactly is it? Or will be potential employee risks or marketing spend or what have you? And secondarily, on Brazil, another question. You spoke a little bit about having to do incremental work to implement the open-loop proposition. Could you just unpack that a little bit more? What do you or don't you have today that you'll need to build out to make that system ready to go from a technological perspective when the regulation is fully rolled out?

Stephane, do you want to start and I will follow on the action plan, the details of the action plan.

So Justin, regarding the impact, so your assumption on the current situation in the market is close to what we have. However, you said, if I'm not mistaken, that we are going down to 1.6% in terms of MDR. So the cap for us, so the cap is going to be 3.6%. And then at the time when the 4C is fully implemented, we will be limited to 2% as interchange fee. So this represents a significant downside, of course, in terms of revenue from merchants. At the same time, in Brazil, we are still providing our clients with some services, some kind of marketing services that will be reduced in order to partly compensate this downside in the merchant commission. Overall, we are not talking about a 2/3, as you were saying, decrease of revenue. It's more likely to be in the end when -- and if -- again if everything is implemented as currently contemplated and in the time line that is targeted by the local authorities. So if everything is implemented as contemplated, we're going to face in the second half of this year, fiscal year '26, 40% decrease of revenue compared to the year before in Brazil, and it will be a little bit higher than this in H1 of '27, something close to 60%. And why is it going to be a little bit higher, the impact in the first half of next year? This is because, first of all, we are still delivering growth right now in H1 of this year in Brazil. So the comparison base is going to be higher. And second, all the measures would have been implemented. And as explained by Aurelien, there's going to be a ramp-up in the implementation of those measures. So in the end, if you look because this was part of your question of the situation in '27, Brazil -- the revenue in Brazil is more likely to be reduced by something like 50%, so not 2/3, by 50%. However, we are targeting and Aurelien is going to elaborate more on this to keep in the end, our margin unchanged as we are going to implement some mitigation action plans, some adaptation to the new operating model in the countries. So overall, to make it short and fully answer your question, in the end, when everything -- and again, if everything is implemented as contemplated, 50% reduction in the top line of Brazil, but with an EBITDA margin that will be reduced as well by 50% because we will target to keep the contribution unchanged in terms of EBITDA margin.

And so to go into more detail regarding the action plan and what we have to build and what we had already -- because I mentioned that we already have an open-loop solution for the meal benefits in Brazil. Now what we are currently working on is how to optimize it on 2 aspects. First, to make sure that we are aligning the experience both for our clients and consumers so that it is at least as good as the ones that we've been delivering with our core product so far. And the second aspect is more making sure that we're going to work with the best technological partners. So we are currently renegotiating with all our partners involved in our open-loop solution. And we are taking advantage of benefiting from, I mean, much bigger volume. And we are also leveraging the expertise from Santander on this aspect, both from -- through their relationship with the scheme provider and Santander being also an acquirer in Brazil through their subsidiaries, Getnet. So that's the first thing regarding, I mean, the system itself. So we have no concern. We will be ready for mid of May. And so we'll be ready if it's confirmed that for mid of May, we need to be [indiscernible]. After in terms of mitigation action, so Stephane mentioned on the client side, so we -- and I told you that we started already the client renegotiations. So we are reviewing with them the condition of their contracts and some of them have benefited from concession. That we are currently, again, renegotiating. Some of them, we are benefiting -- their employees were benefiting or have been benefiting from value-added services around new specific benefits around health and well-being. This is also what we are rediscussing with our clients. So this is one element. And the other major element is the adaptation of the organization because our operating model, if we shift all our volume from a 3 corner model to a filter open-loop model, the operating model will be different, and we'll adapt our organization. So indeed, part of the organization, which is today related to the management of this 3C model and 3C offering, notably in the merchant department will not be needed anymore. So we do expect to see some -- indeed some optimization of structure in Brazil. And on top of it, both in Brazil and at group level, we are taking advantage of AI to keep on optimizing our processes and looking for efficiencies. So it will feed this mitigation plan as well. And finally, at global level, we decided to anticipate and to make sure that we would support the local efforts. So that's why we have reviewed our global priorities and making sure that we keep on investing in the ones that we will deliver good results, strong results in the short and the midterm.

The next question is from Ed Young of Morgan Stanley.

My first question is on the contract wins in Italy. You mentioned the lots awarded by CONSIP. I wonder if you could just give a bit more color around the innovation you've done there and the general sort of level of market competition given the change in the regulatory structure in the background. The second question is, you mentioned in the presentation and in your remarks, a diversified M&A pipeline across geographies and deal sizes. I wonder if you could talk a little bit about what kind of range of deal sizes you're indicating there? And related to that, there's been press reporting for a while now about food delivery companies potentially be interested in acquiring Employee Benefits businesses in Brazil. Would you also be open to disposals to recalibrate your regulatory risk profile or your overall business mix? Or is that not on the cards?

Stephane, you want to start and I will complete...

With the M&A pipeline...

M&A pipeline -- the divestment.

Okay. So Ed on the M&A pipeline, there are -- as we said and as we commented, yes, we have a large range of potential opportunities, but still looking at them with the same rigor and discipline. For us, this M&A pipeline is a good opportunity to feed further organic growth in the future with all the synergy that we might expect from this acquisition. But there are no specific thing that I can say, this kind of transaction of -- and there are different potential sizes from small to much larger. Cobee, if we leave aside, the Santander partnership has been the biggest one that we made so far, but we are -- we have in the pipeline some bigger potential acquisition than Cobee. And we have and we completed some smaller like ProEves or Skipr that we closed recently. So there is nothing I can say more specifically. We'll see what is coming. What I can tell you is that this is still for us a strategic lever to accelerate in terms of organic growth. And we are still rolling this strategic road map with the same rigor and discipline. And regarding your specific question on Brazil, Brazil remains for us a strategic country. As Aurelien explained, we are supporting the changes with the purpose to go on developing even further our market. Of course, we are considering that there are some measures that might be counterproductive. But overall, the trend is good. And for us, the country really remains strategic. And so we have no intent to dispose of our business in Brazil so far.

Definitely not. But it's fair to say that, I mean, in Brazil, we could expect some -- still some consolidation movement, some -- between other players because there will be a significant effect for all the industry in Brazil. Now regarding Italy, so the wins of the -- indeed, the 4 regions, the 4 lots with CONSIP. First, I'd like to remind you that this happened while we were renegotiating all our client commissions. So I'm very, very pleased that in the meantime, in parallel with this massive campaign, which took us a lot of energy and with the positive outcomes that we got, both development and the net retention trends have remained strong in Italy. And for me, the CONSIP success demonstrates a strong alignment of our solutions with the local client needs, so in this specific case, with CONSIP, but it goes further. And it confirms as well the solid commercial traction that we are experiencing in the market. So overall, for Pluxee in Italy, and we always said that it's -- even though it's -- in terms of contribution to the financial aggregate, it remains still small. We see it as a strategic country, and we are confident in our ability to continue to create long-term value for our clients there.

The final question, gentlemen, is from Andre Juillard of Deutsche Bank.

Two short questions, if I may. First one about France. Do you have some more color about the budget discussions that are just starting? And do you still hear about this potential tax improvement of 8%, first question. Second question about Brazil. When we look at the 3 main measures of the decree, -- but what are the main actions you want to develop on the legal case. Is it mainly the interoperability? Or do you focus on the other ones, slightly more colored picture would be appreciated.

Okay. Thank you, Andre, and Happy New Year to you. So regarding France, so first, this 8% taxation measures, which was a project back to September, it's no more the agenda because it was part of the project of the social security financial bill. So -- and this bill was voted before Christmas. And so there is no employer contribution measure anymore. So this topic is no more on the table. After talking -- I mean, elaborating maybe more on France, it's fair to say that for now, the meal voucher reform project has not been taken up by the new government, which is still fully focused on the 2026 finance bill, it was [indiscernible]. But having said this, we remain at the disposal of Serge Papin with the minister in charge of small and midsized enterprise and tourism and purchasing power to pursue the discussion. Personally, I'm optimistic that the discussion will resume, but the unknown at this stage is the timing. So this is for France. And for Brazil, again, I mean, I don't want to disclose the full legal strategies that we're going to adopt. But I mean, seeking clarification, it's indeed more about the feasibility of shifting the full volume of all the player from a 3 corner to a filter open-loop for the mid-May 2026 because it seems quite unrealistic. So those are the type of measures that we are questioning. Interoperability, indeed, the notion of interoperability and the way to implement it is quite unclear. This should happen mid of November '26. And again, we would like to know more about what is expected from us. So again, it's more about operational and time line-wise questions that we -- for which we are seeking clarification.

Gentlemen, Ms. Bireaud. That was the last question. Back to you for any closing remarks.

Thank you. So thanks, everyone, for your attention this morning. In closing, I would like to reiterate our confidence in the future, underpinned by a strong start to the year, a resilient and adaptable business model and, of course, our continued determination to deliver robust operating and financial performance over the long term. And with that, I wish all of you a very good day, and see you in April for our H1. Thank you.

Ladies and gentlemen, thank you for joining. The conference is now over, and you may disconnect your telephones.