Poxel S.A. (POXEL) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

October 1, 2020

Euronext Paris FR Health Care special 57 min

Earnings Call Speaker Segments

Operator

operator
#1

Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to Poxel PXL770 Phase IIa Trial Results Announcement. I now hand over the call to Mrs. Jonae Barnes, Senior Vice President, Investor Relations, Corporate Communications and Public Relations. Madam, please go ahead.

Jonae Barnes

executive
#2

Good afternoon, everyone, and welcome to our conference call today to review the results from the PXL770 Phase IIa trial. I'm Jonae Barnes, Senior Vice President, Investor Relations, Corporate Communications and Public Relations. With me on the call, Thomas Kuhn, CEO; Pascale Fouqueray, Executive Vice President, Clinical Development and Regulatory Affairs; David Moller, Executive Vice President and Chief Scientific Officer; and Julie Dubourg, Medical Director, Clinical Development. They will all be available for Q&A after our call is complete. Earlier today, we issued a press release for the PXL770 Phase IIa results. For those of you who don't have a copy, you can access it in the Investor Relations section of our website, poxelpharma.com. As part of this presentation, we will be using slides for this discussion. You can access them on Poxel's website in the Investors, Company Information section under the name of PXL770 Phase IIa results. Before we begin, I would like to read our forward-looking statement. Some of the statements contained in this presentation constitute forward-looking statements, which are statements that are not historical. These statements are based on the company's current strategy, plans, objectives, assumptions, estimates and projections. Investors should therefore not place undue reliance on those statements. The company makes no representation, warranty or prediction that the results anticipated by such forward-looking statements will be achieved. And such forward-looking statements represent, in each case, only one of many possible scenarios that should not be viewed as the most likely or standard scenario. Forward-looking statements speak only as of the date that they are made, and the company does not undertake to update any forward-looking statements in light of new information or future events. In the context of COVID-19 outbreak, which was declared a pandemic by the World Health Organization on March 12, 2020, the company is regularly reviewing the impact of the outbreak on its business. As of the date of this conference call and based on publicly available information, the company has not identified the occurrence of any material negative event on its business due to the COVID-19 pandemic that remains unresolved. For today's call, Thomas Kuhn, our CEO, will provide opening remarks. Dr. David Moller, our CSO, will review the Phase IIa results. We will then move to the question-and-answer portion of the call. I will now hand the call over to Thomas.

Thomas Kuhn

executive
#3

Thank you, Jonae. Hello, everyone, and thank you for joining us today. So today, we achieved a very important milestone when we announced the encouraging results of the PXL770 Phase IIa trial for the treatment of NASH. Before I hand the call over to David, I would like to take a few minutes to provide a brief overview of the company for those of you who are not familiar with Poxel. Beginning with Slide 3. Poxel is focused on developing innovative drugs for the treatment of metabolic disease, including type 2 diabetes and NASH. We have a strong foundation in this therapeutic area dating back to the company's inception when it was spun out of Merck Serono. We have a mid- to late-stage pipeline as well as earlier-stage programs from our direct AMP kinase and deuterated TZD platforms. Please go to Slide 4. Our pipeline includes our most advanced drug candidate, Imeglimin, which is globally partnered for the treatment of type 2 diabetes. Through our partnerships with Dainippon Sumitomo Pharma, a new drug application is currently under review in Japan. Sumitomo is currently targeting a product launch in their fiscal year 2021, which is April to March. They also have developments and commercialization rights for China and 11 other Asian countries. Metavant, our partner for all other countries not covered in the Sumitomo agreement, has ongoing dialogue with the FDA to finalize Imeglimin Phase III plan for the U.S. and Europe. The Phase IIa results for PXL770 for the treatment of NASH that we announced today support the potential to advance the development of this molecule into a Phase IIb biopsy-driven trial. For our second program in NASH, PXL065, we initiated DESTINY 1 early September. It's a streamlined, dose-ranging Phase II trial for the treatment of NASH. As a reminder, PXL065 is a new chemical entity derived from pioglitazone, specifically deuterium-stabilized single stereoisomer, which has been shown to retain NASH efficacy without triggering PPAR gamma-related side effects in preclinical studies. This mechanism involves modulating non-genomic pathways such as the mitochondrial pyruvate carrier. We also have an agreement with ENYO Pharma for FXR agonist, which is currently in a Phase IIa program. For our earlier-stage preclinical programs, we are advancing work related to our direct AMP kinase and deuterated TZD platforms. Today's results give us further conviction related to AMPK and its utility for several metabolic disease. I will now hand the call over to David.

David Moller

executive
#4

Thank you, Thomas. Good afternoon, everyone. Before diving into the results, I'd like to first briefly review the AMPK mechanism as well as earlier results for PXL770 that led to the positive outcome reported this morning. Let's turn to Slide 5. AMPK is a master regulator of several important metabolic pathways, including pathways also linked to the control of inflammation. Importantly, we know the conditions associated with overnutrition are also associated with reduced AMPK activity in key tissues like liver in the case of NASH. Thus, direct activation of AMPK is an approach to restoring normal AMPK tone and a compelling and novel target for NASH and a range of other chronic and rare metabolic diseases. Turning to Slide 6. The downstream effects of AMPK activation lead to PXL770's potential ability to address each of the key hallmarks of NASH, which we define as steatosis, inflammation, ballooning and lastly fibrosis. Unlike some other mechanisms which act primarily to reduce steatosis, several lines of evidence, including our internal data, show that AMPK activation can independently affect inflammation, fibrogenesis and hepatocellular death. In addition, root causes, including insulin resistance, can be ameliorated. Here, you can see how our data in rodent models and human cells are beginning to align with and translate into emerging clinical results in the target population. Significant effects from the Phase IIa study that we report today are highlighted in red in the right hand column. I'll review these findings in subsequent slides. Overall, the profile is very encouraging for the future, specifically anticipating the potential for further efficacy when histology data would be available. Turning to Slide 7. More specific results from multiple preclinical studies are depicted here. These studies have shown consistent and promising results with respect to each of the core elements of NASH. I'd also like to note that PXL770 may also be differentiated from other compounds in development for NASH since AMPK activation also has the potential to treat major comorbidities by specifically targeting cardio-metabolic risk factors such as hyperglycemia and insulin resistance. Moving now to Slide 8. Our preclinical data and evidence from the literature also highlights the potential of PXL770 to show even greater additive or synergistic benefits to treat the root causes of NASH when combined with other agents in development. We've studied several combinations in a classic rodent NASH model. These include PXL770 with semaglutide, a GLP-1 receptor agonist; obeticholic acid, an FXR agonist; and MGL-3196, a thyroid hormone receptor agonist. As shown in the example on this slide, co-administration of PXL770 with semaglutide resulted in further improvements in several key disease-related parameters, including hepatic steatosis and plasma ALT. Additive benefits were also observed with other agents studied to date. These studies highlight the potential for complementarity of use with a broad range of other classes in NASH. On Slide 9, we have summarized here the cumulative prior clinical experience with PXL770. In over 130 healthy subjects, we observed suitable PK properties and good safety and tolerability. In the more recent 4-week PK/PD placebo-controlled study in 16 likely NASH patients, we met our endpoint and objectives. PXL770 demonstrated a PK profile that was similar to the one observed in healthy volunteers and was also observed to be safe and well tolerated. Notably, PXL770 also induced a statistically significant suppression of de novo lipogenesis, which is linked to AMPK and known to be an important contributor to the accumulation of liver fat or steatosis that underlies the pathophysiology of NASH. Despite this also being a nondiabetic population, we also noted a greater effect on de novo lipogenesis in patients with more severe metabolic dysfunction. A statistically significant improvement in glucose tolerance during a glucose challenge test was also observed in this study. Moreover, we observed additional significant improvements in several indices of insulin sensitivity. This trial then confirmed the target and pathway engagement with PXL770 and its potential utility in other metabolic diseases. These results also represent the first human experience with a specific AMPK activator, and they support our hypothesis that this novel mechanism could be safely harnessed and have a beneficial role in controlling key pathways that lead to liver injury in NASH or utility in other indications. Turning now to Slide 10. STAMP-NAFLD, the trial's name, is a Phase IIa 12-week randomized, placebo-controlled, parallel group trial which enrolled 120 presumed NASH patients with or without type 2 diabetes. The trial was conducted at several sites in the U.S. The primary enrollment criteria was evidence of hepatic steatosis or NAFLD based on the percent liver fat mass greater than 10% as measured by MRI-PDFF. The trial evaluated 3 different dosing regimens of PXL770 versus placebo. This included 4 groups of roughly equal size. Patients who received PXL770 at 250 milligrams once daily, 250 milligrams twice daily, 500 milligrams once daily or patients who received placebo. The primary endpoint of the trial was the relative change in liver fat content based on MRI-PDFF, an imaging-based biomarker that allows for quantitation of steatosis in the entire liver. Other secondary measures on multiple disease-related parameters helped to confirm efficacy in NASH as well as to shed light on other related indications. Slide 11 depicts baseline patient characteristics. Patients were overweight or obese and 41% to 47% of each group had type 2 diabetes. Patients with diabetes were well controlled and treated with monotherapy or diet as reflected in normal mean fasting glucose levels and mean hemoglobin A1c, HbA1c values for each group, which averaged around 6% or below the 6.5% threshold for diabetes. Liver fat content was 16% to 22% at baseline and generally balanced across the groups. Importantly, mean ALT levels at baseline were also nearly normal, either at or below the upper limit of normal, which is 41 international units per liter. Moving now to the Phase IIa results on Slide 12. MRI-PDFF was used to measure effects on liver fat mass. PXL770 was observed to produce dose responsive effects with a statistically significant relative mean decrease of 18%, a p-value of 0036 from baseline at 12 weeks in the 500-milligram QD group and 14% in the 250-milligram BID group. Both placebo and 250 milligrams QD of PXL770 produced negligible effects. The proportion of patients who achieved greater than 30% relative fat mass reductions in the 500-milligram group was also substantially greater than in the placebo group. In addition, some patients were highly responsive and were observed to achieve up to 85% relative reductions in liver fat mass. As shown on Slide 13, a more pronounced effective PXL770 on liver fat mass was observed in the 41% to 47% of patients who also had a diagnosis of type 2 diabetes. In these patients, a dose-responsive decrease in relative liver fat content was observed with an effect size averaging 27% in the 500-milligram QD group. This key subgroup represents approximately 47% of all patients with NASH and is known to be at higher risk of progression to more advanced stages of fibrosis and end-stage liver disease. It's also known that endogenous AMPK tone is lower in tissues from animals and humans with type 2 diabetes. Slide 14 displays the effects on ALT levels. Although baseline ALT levels in each group were within the high normal range, we did observe a significant 6.3 IU per liter change in the mean absolute ALT levels at the top dose of 500 milligrams QD. In addition, the pattern of changes in ALT suggest that we have not reached a plateau at 12 weeks. We are performing further analysis of this data to assess these findings and to examine effects on other related parameters. Slide 15 shows effects on hemoglobin A1c in each group, including both patients with and without diabetes. Here, we observed a dose responsive and significant decrease. Not shown here was a parallel strong trend towards reduced mean fasting glucose that was also observed. As a reminder, baseline hemoglobin A1c values for each group were within the normal nondiabetic range, consistent with the presence of mild, well-controlled diabetes in those patients with a diagnosis. The placebo-adjusted effect of negative 0.3% at 500 milligrams QD is therefore clinically meaningful. By comparison, the landmark diabetes prevention program also studied nondiabetic glucose-intolerant patients. After 6 months of treatment with metformin, a mean placebo-adjusted decrease in HbA1c of approximately 0.15% was observed in 850 patients. Slide 16 summarizes the safety findings from the STAMP-NAFLD trial. Treatment with PXL770 was observed to be very well tolerated in all 3 treatment groups. The number of patients in each group who experienced treatment-emergent adverse events was very similar to the number in the placebo group. The most common AEs included mild to moderate GI symptoms, infections and headaches. There were 3 patients with serious adverse events. Two had AEs classified as unrelated to study drug. In one patient, increases in ALT were classified as a serious AE. In this specific patient, the increase began before randomization and was persistent with substantial elevations in ALT that were also observed several weeks after discontinuation of therapy. This case is, therefore, unlikely to be related to treatment with PXL770. Overall, the safety profile is consistent with that observed in greater than 140 subjects studied in the Phase I program, both health subjects and NAFLD patients. Let's turn now to Slide 17. In summary, results from the STAMP-NAFLD Phase IIa trial lead us to conclude that PXL770 has a good safety and tolerability profile, as I described on the preceding slide. This oral first-in-class agent was observed to produce significant efficacy with respect to reduction of liver fat mass and to improve other key measures, which included reductions in ALT and hemoglobin A1c. The greater response observed in patients with type 2 diabetes is noteworthy since this is a high-risk subpopulation accounting for nearly half of all patients with NASH. Along with preclinical data showing independent effects on inflammation and fibrogenesis, including in human cells, the results of this study support the potential to advance PXL770 for the treatment of NASH. As a key next step, we are considering a Phase IIb biopsy-based NASH trial, which could confirm safety and further evaluate important histologic endpoints, including inflammation and fibrosis, which were not assessed in this Phase IIa trial, and to confirm its potential in the high-risk subpopulation with diabetes. Based on the clinical results obtained to date, its distinct mechanism and preclinical combination results, we believe that either monotherapy or co-administration of PXL770 with other agents could provide broad treatment for patients with NASH. The results also support potential for PXL770 and the AMPK platform in other chronic and rare metabolic diseases. Finally, Slide 18, I'd like to briefly mention our efforts to examine other indications and potentially leverage other molecules from the platform. The results announced today for PXL770 pave the way for potential pipeline expansion. We envision that PXL770 or other AMPK activators could be harnessed to treat a range of disorders, including rare metabolic diseases such as adrenoleukodystrophy or mitochondrial disorders, rare and common forms of chronic kidney disease as well as additional endocrine disorders. We have strong preclinical efficacy data for several of these conditions, including diabetic nephropathy, adrenoleukodystrophy and polycystic kidney disease. Thanks for your attention and interest in our results. Operator, you may now open the line for questions.

Operator

operator
#5

[Operator Instructions] The first question comes from Jason Butler from JMP Securities.

Jason Butler

analyst
#6

First off, based on the data you have today and the prior Phase I data and preclinical data, is there any rationale to consider higher doses or different administration frequency? And then you talked about the fact that some patients had really good responders, up to 85%. Beyond the type 2 diabetes population, were there any other attributes that describe this patient group? And I guess, can you give us a sense of how many patients were in that higher responder group?

Thomas Kuhn

executive
#7

Yes. Maybe I can start, David, and then please add anything there. So with regards to the first question, I think you're right. We factor the analysis that we do, so we will have to look at various options there. One of the key goal we had from this trial was really to assess whether we want to go on a twice daily or on a once-daily regimen. And as you've seen from the data and as you've heard from David, the once-daily regimen seems to bring really a more significant efficacy with a good safety there, which is good. We'll then now have really to look at the pharmacokinetic profile. We'll then have to correlate that with the pharmacodynamic profile there. And so I mean, we will need to wait for the remaining data to consider this. But all options are really currently on the table there. David, then, do you want to take the second question on this highly responsive patients there?

David Moller

executive
#8

Yes, I can start and maybe Pascale or Julie would want to add. Yes. It's an interesting question. Obviously, we just received this data recently. We're analyzing it as we speak, and we'll potentially have some additional parameters to look at that may or may not be able to help us identify the more responsive patients. But we do think that what we have seen so far, and it's consistent with what I mentioned from the PK/PD trial, is that patients with more severe metabolic dysfunction, in this case, patients with type 2 diabetes, seem to be clearly more responsive in general. And that to us is kind of interesting and encouraging results. Anything to add, Pascale, Julie?

Pascale Fouqueray-Grellier

executive
#9

No, I think what you say, David, is what we have as data today. But well, we will wait to have the full data to look deeper into difference between type 2 diabetes and nondiabetic patients.

Jason Butler

analyst
#10

Okay. That's really helpful. And then just 1 more for me. As you think about the Phase IIb trial design, obviously, the type 2 diabetes population is a relevant consideration. But other things that you're thinking about? And maybe give us the context given your Phase IIb trial design for the 065 program?

Thomas Kuhn

executive
#11

Pascale, do you want to answer this one?

Pascale Fouqueray-Grellier

executive
#12

I'm sorry, I didn't get the question.

Thomas Kuhn

executive
#13

It's on the Phase IIb. So maybe I can rephrase and start to answer. So Jason wanted to have more detail about what we're planning for the -- what we're planning really for the Phase IIb. Is it going to be in diabetic patients there? Or any other detail that basically we believe could be important for the Phase IIb.

Pascale Fouqueray-Grellier

executive
#14

I think this study, this proof-of-concept study, was really important for us to get a sense of the size of the effect of PXL770 and to confirm the previous data that we have observed in the PK/PD related to the better effect even in more severe insulin-resistant patients, which seems to be the case here. I think it also gave us a lot of information of the dose regimen and the dose with BID or once-daily and dose range. So I think we really have to first get the complete view of all the data before moving forward with the Phase IIb design. But well, honestly, the design might be very classical with biopsy and -- but I think we need to get all the data before...

Thomas Kuhn

executive
#15

Maybe you...

Pascale Fouqueray-Grellier

executive
#16

Getting too much on that. Yes.

Thomas Kuhn

executive
#17

Maybe one point of clarification, Jason. I think in contrast, as you know, for PXL065, we can benefit from the 505(b)(2) pathway coming from pioglitazone. So that's why we designed this streamline Phase II program, still with the aim to assess the efficacy, however, with the primary endpoint to be the liver fat mass reduction and to be correlated as a secondary endpoint with the histology data. Here, for 770, as you have understood, we believe that there is much more than the liver fat mass that we've seen here during this Phase IIa, given that the drug hit really the target. And it's been demonstrated that by activating AMP kinase, we could also benefit from additional efficacy independently from the metabolic benefit. We can benefit from inflammation benefit and fibrogenesis benefit. And so that's why I believe that histology data will be really pivotal in this Phase IIb. And as you have understood as well, maybe treating longer, could be also very important to have the long-term efficacy data. So as Pascale said, it would be more like a classical Phase IIb in biopsy-proven NASH patients treated for 9 months, 12 months or more. And then, of course, around this, there could be a multiple option. But really, this is going to be the core component of this trial.

Operator

operator
#18

And next question comes from Lucy Codrington from Jefferies.

Lucy-Emma Codrington-Bartlett

analyst
#19

I've got a couple. Firstly, am I right in understanding that these were per protocol responses? And if so, did the ITT population differ at all? In terms of the safety, were there any discontinuations due to the treatment-emergent adverse events? And then lastly, I do appreciate you still need to analyze the full data set and think about the Phase IIb, but is the plan to include a broad NASH population initially in the Phase IIb with some subgroup analysis or could you actually consider focusing on subpopulations sooner rather than later? And then actually, I have one more. I just noticed that there was quite a much higher proportion of female patients in the 2 higher dose groups. I wonder if there are any implications as a result of that.

Thomas Kuhn

executive
#20

Thank you very much, Lucy. Pascale, maybe you want to take these questions, starting with the per protocol versus the ITT population there?

Pascale Fouqueray-Grellier

executive
#21

Yes. This is the per protocol population, but we also have data in the ITT population, which are very close to the data observed in per protocol. We believe that this per protocol was more accurately representing the data for this study.

Thomas Kuhn

executive
#22

For the second question, Pascale, on the safety, any discontinuation due to adverse event?

Pascale Fouqueray-Grellier

executive
#23

Yes. There was some discontinuation, but 1 or 2 discontinuation per group and without any specific, I would say, reason in terms of safety.

Thomas Kuhn

executive
#24

For the third question, I think, Lucy, yes, I think we definitely have different option on the table because this broader benefit that we've seen on type 2 diabetes is not just coming from this trial but also from the PK/PD trial. And we know, and David described this well, we can expect really a broad benefit targeting NAFL in diabetic patient. So do we want to really solely focus on this population for the Phase IIb or the rest of development or include a significant number of this? I mean, that remains to be fully analyzed there. But certainly, it would be a key area of focus. And maybe I don't know whether David or Pascale, you want to elaborate on this?

David Moller

executive
#25

Yes. I think it's a very interesting and attractive concept, and it's something that we're actively discussing with our expert advisers and also continuing to look more closely at the data. So we don't have any definitive answer, but that's definitely on the table.

Thomas Kuhn

executive
#26

And so for the last question...

David Moller

executive
#27

And last question would be for females, the imbalance of males and females, maybe Pascale, you could?

Thomas Kuhn

executive
#28

Pascale, on this last question on the imbalance between -- on the 2 top dose for female and male there?

Pascale Fouqueray-Grellier

executive
#29

Yes. We don't believe that this made an impact on the result because, honestly, in terms of PK, there is no evidence of any difference between male and female. So there is no currently reason to believe that this may influence the result.

Operator

operator
#30

Next question comes from Andy Hsieh from William Blair.

Tsan-Yu Hsieh

analyst
#31

Congratulations on the encouraging results and finishing the trial. So my question has to do with the trend line. So I think, Thomas, you mentioned a little bit about the ALT trend, which is that it has not plateaued after 12 weeks. I'm just wondering if the same observations could be said about the liver fat reduction and also potentially glucose sensitivity, HbA1c, just curious if you can comment on that.

Thomas Kuhn

executive
#32

Yes. Thank you, Andy, for this question. Pascale, do you want to answer this one?

Pascale Fouqueray-Grellier

executive
#33

So yes, well, we have only 1 MRI in this study as it was a very short duration study of 12 weeks. So we don't know whether all the effect has been captured after 12 weeks or if we can expect more deeper decrease with time. What we have observed is that the decrease in ALT is not something immediate, but it's a little bit delayed. So this may also get deeper with a longer duration of treatment. As far as the glucose control and A1c, well, the patients were at very low A1c baseline to start with. So well, I think that the decrease that was observed in this study for these kind of patients and this glucose control, I think it's already a very meaningful decrease.

David Moller

executive
#34

Maybe I could just add to Pascale, a couple of comments on these questions, Andy. So as you know, HbA1c is an integrated measure of glucose. It takes time, no matter what the mechanism, to reach a steady state. And with most glucose lowering agents, you're nearly there but not all the way there by 12 weeks, and it usually takes 24 weeks to reach a steady state. So we would expect potentially some further effect on glucose. But as Pascale said and as I said earlier, what's remarkable here is that the baseline HbA1c was really not in the diabetic range, and yet we still see significant reductions. So that's very encouraging to us. And then as far as the ALT is concerned, again, as Pascale said it and I mentioned it, we don't think we've hit a plateau there yet either. And many of the other NASH studies similarly show that, in some cases, depending on the mechanism, you don't reach a steady state until you get out to 24 weeks or beyond in ALT.

Tsan-Yu Hsieh

analyst
#35

Got it. Got it. Yes. So I also have a PK question, if you don't mind. So just curious if there's kind of an explanation in terms of the BID dosing and the QD dosing. So 250 BID, 500 QD, there seems to be a difference in terms of potency for those 2 dosing schemes. Is there some sort of scientific explanation or PK explanation for that?

Thomas Kuhn

executive
#36

So maybe I can start and please, David and Pascale, feel free to add on this. So clearly, the aim at the beginning when we designed the trial was to assess whether -- so when we analyze the data in animal and with some allometric scaling there, we model that really once-daily regimen would be the dose regimen to go for in human. However, again, coming back to the mechanism of action because it's really related to our mechanism of action, we see that in line, whether having twice-daily regimen could add because there are various ways to activate AMP kinase. And we wanted to test this with a similar dose, which is this 500 milligram, either the once-daily or BID. And here, well, I mean, we've seen that and that you've seen in data that the once-daily regimen seems to be more appropriate than the BID regimen. We don't have, as you know, as I mentioned earlier, we'll have to do the full PK analysis to correlate that really with the PD to see what options really do we have going forward, but that's really the basis for this analysis. And I don't know, David or Pascale, whether you want to add anything there?

David Moller

executive
#37

No. I would just say that it's a typical profile for an oral agent. We have a long terminal half-life that's described on Slide 9. But despite that, we have more drug exposure during the first 12 hours. So there is a difference between giving it once a day or twice a day, maybe not in terms of AUC but in terms of Cmax. So we're trying to sort through that, really understand it. But I think it's very important that we have defined what appears to be a preferred regimen so far.

Tsan-Yu Hsieh

analyst
#38

Got it. And then last question has to do with the kind of the type 2 diabetes subpopulation. Just curious on your views in terms of kind of the placebo response in that healthy subpopulation. You do see placebo patients doing also a little bit better. So if you kind of correct for that, the absolute placebo-adjusted difference is actually pretty similar. So just kind of want to get a sense of your interpretation on that. And also in discussions with NASH experts, is there a subpopulation where you can kind of define kind of the diabetes/NASH patients as like a clinically definable indication from the regulator's perspective?

Thomas Kuhn

executive
#39

Yes. David, do you want to answer this one?

David Moller

executive
#40

Yes. So regarding your first question, we were actually pleasantly surprised that the placebo response in the trial as a whole was minimal. And if you look at the data that's on Slide 13, there's a slightly greater placebo response in the patients with diabetes. But also, I think we take into account the fact that we have an essentially ineffective dose, the 250-milligram daily dose, which, in this sense, could be considered more like a placebo. So we do believe that at least the data strongly suggests that there is a substantially greater response in patients with diabetes overall, and that's consistent with what we've seen in the PK/PD trial. Your second question was around whether regulators would accept a subpopulation. I think they would. It has commercial implications and safety implications, but there are certainly precedents for this in many different disease states that I can think of. And it's a black and white definition. You either have diabetes or you don't as a diagnosis.

Operator

operator
#41

Next question comes from Benoit Louage from Degroof Petercam.

Benoit Louage

analyst
#42

Congrats on the readout. Actually, quite a substantial amount were already answered by -- during this call. I still have a few left from my side. So most of them relate to the Phase IIb design. Could already be confirmed that at this stage the Phase IIb would still, at this stage, be focusing on the monotherapy setting rather than already exploring certain combination with other mechanism of action? That's my first question. And then the second and final question is also related to the Phase IIb. So could we confirm at this stage that the primary endpoint of this trial would really be more focused on histology endpoints rather than MRI-PDFF or anything like that? Yes, that's it for me.

Thomas Kuhn

executive
#43

Thank you, Benoit. Maybe I can start with an introduction. And Pascale, please add on this there. So I think, again, I'm going back to what we said, which I think is a very important key point for this program. By targeting AMP kinase, we believe that the metabolic benefit is really one piece of the global efficacy of the products there. As David illustrated on during his talk, AMP kinase activation could lead to much broader benefit in terms of inflammatory and fibrogenesis benefit there. And so that's why to really answer almost the 2 questions in parallel, we believe that as a monotherapy based on the data that we have today, we believe that as a monotherapy, 770 could really deliver a very attractive and interesting really benefit because on top of what we've seen today, there will be more really with this direct effect on inflammation and fibrosis. Not to say that the combination is not important, not at all because, indeed, that's the second lesson learned from this trial. While, I mean, the product is safe as we've seen there, it's a new mechanism. And again, I highlighted, we know that it can be safely combined with other products. So I think it's part of our plan as well to investigate early on really the combination there to the most common class that are currently under development there. And so clearly, really, histology will be the next logical step there in terms of endpoints because as you have understood, I mean, there is more than this benefit on the liver fat mass, thanks to the activation, thanks to this innovative new mechanism activating AMP kinase there. Maybe, Pascale, do you want to give some more thoughts there?

Pascale Fouqueray-Grellier

executive
#44

No, no. I think you answered the 2 questions, Thomas. But for sure, this proof-of-concept, we use MRI-PDFF to look at the liver fat content because the duration of the study was pretty short and it was really the first experiment of this AMP kinase activator in this indication. But for sure, the Phase IIb study will have histology as endpoint because we absolutely need to characterize the effect of this drug on inflammation and fibrosis and ballooning. So yes, we agree.

Operator

operator
#45

Next question comes from Bertrand Delsuc from Biotellytics.

Bertrand Delsuc;Biotellytics;CEO, Founder

analyst
#46

Yes. To start with the safety side, could you tell us if you had seen or observed some weight gain? I'm just thinking about that with the increased insulin sensitivity. And the second point, if you could just provide us with the rate of moderate AEs because you say that the TEAEs are mostly mild or moderate, but if you could just have a little bit more granularity on the moderate. And then I have a follow-up.

Thomas Kuhn

executive
#47

Thank you. Pascale, do you want to take these 2 questions, please?

Pascale Fouqueray-Grellier

executive
#48

I will do it. Yes. So well, so far, we don't have all the data on the weight gain, but we don't believe that there is any -- that it is -- we believe that it is weight neutral. We haven't seen any signal towards weight gain. And the second question is regarding the adverse events. So yes, as we mentioned, and most of the adverse events were mild, some of them were moderate, but they were very well balanced between the group. And to give you a little bit more granularity, most of the adverse events were from the gastrointestinal tract with a slight increase in the incidence of patients presenting those adverse events in the PXL770 group, whatever the dose. And most of them presented some diarrhea or some flatulence, but nothing outstanding and perfectly in line with what we have seen in the Phase I. An additional adverse event was [indiscernible] but also fairly balanced between all the group, including the placebo. So there is really no specific finding in the moderate adverse event.

Bertrand Delsuc;Biotellytics;CEO, Founder

analyst
#49

Okay. But just about the rate, it is -- what the order of magnitude, 15%, 20%?

Pascale Fouqueray-Grellier

executive
#50

It was around 20%.

Bertrand Delsuc;Biotellytics;CEO, Founder

analyst
#51

Yes. Okay. And then a follow-up on the dose, which is, let's say, something that comes to the mind when one looks at the data. I looked at the data during your single ascending dose and multiple ascending dose in the Phase I. And what you described in there was a dose proportionality up to 375-milligram and then an inverse dose proportionality from this point up to 500-milligram, which was the maximum dose that you had characterized and that you used here also in Phase IIa. And I was just wondering how one should interpret the data we have now with Phase IIa as compared to the data you had in healthy volunteers during the 70% window. And also, I was wondering if the 250-milligram BID was not some sort of proxy for this 375 milligram? So if you could have some more insight on how one should think about that.

Thomas Kuhn

executive
#52

Yes. Okay. So basically, so just to acknowledge that we don't have the full PK data of this trial, just the top line, and we focused on efficacy and safety. So of course, we need to look at the data. But from what we know really from the Phase I and the PK/PD, which was in this NAFLD population, is that the PK is roughly similar really between the healthy and this NAFLD population. So it should be also the case for this Phase II. Then you are right, so there was a linear absorption really up to 375 as we saw in the Phase I, and then we started to see really a saturation of the absorption. Still, you had a higher AUC and Cmax with the 500, but not, of course, disproportional to what you could obtain at the lowest dose. So this is why when we assessed the dose to be used in this trial, we thought that still it would be worth really going up to 500 just based on the correlation that we did, and we feel that this would be in the range of the most efficacious dose there. And then going back to BID and once a day, again, there were, of course, some key consideration because we tested this BID regimen in the Phase I. And of course, we saw, as you can imagine, some difference, as David explained, with most of the AUC being between 0 to 12 hours there. But really a big part of the consideration, as I mentioned earlier, was that the fact that with this mechanism, where you need to activate AMP kinase and you've got multiple ways to activate it or to prevent its deactivation, we really wanted to test whether a twice-daily regimen from a mechanistic standpoint could lead to a different benefit. And so that's what really has driven the decision to test 2 different doses or to test the same daily dose with 2 different dose ratio.

Bertrand Delsuc;Biotellytics;CEO, Founder

analyst
#53

Okay. But in your opinion, with respect -- with the data, okay, you didn't have -- you didn't have all the data and you didn't analyze all the data, but well, as you said, the option for further exploration of higher doses remains on the table, right?

Thomas Kuhn

executive
#54

Well, for the PK/PD, we have all the data, and of course, we model the PK/PD analysis. Then for the Phase IIa, of course, we need to have the data. And then going forward, of course, we can think about different options there. But clearly, the 500-milligram OD, I think -- or sorry, QD, so once-a-day has really delivered really good results with a good safety. And so that will definitely be one of the dose to be considered going forward.

Bertrand Delsuc;Biotellytics;CEO, Founder

analyst
#55

Okay. Sure. And about the exposure this time, well, I didn't have the time to parse all the posters, but do you have some preclinical data that could describe a bit more the therapeutic effect through a longer exposure?

Thomas Kuhn

executive
#56

So you mean...

David Moller

executive
#57

Longer-term exposure, like multiple weeks?

Bertrand Delsuc;Biotellytics;CEO, Founder

analyst
#58

Yes. Yes, because your mouse experiment in your NASH mouse were 8 weeks, something like that, if I'm correct. And then it's hard to really interpret the potentiality with longer exposure in human this time.

David Moller

executive
#59

So maybe I can take that, Thomas. Yes. I think it's an interesting question. I think it's -- many mechanisms in NASH require multiple weeks of treatment in rodents to see substantial benefits. So we're basically starting with the sort of model from what other people have done. But with this mechanism, as with several others, it does take on the order of, say, 4 to 8 weeks to have strong effects on NASH in the preclinical rodent models. What that translates into in terms of the duration of treatment you need in humans to see histologic benefits is not really known, and it may differ from one mechanism to the next. But I think it does suggest that because rodents are not humans and things may happen faster in rodents, it does suggest that you would need to go out beyond, say, 24 weeks to see substantial efficacy through this mechanism as well.

Bertrand Delsuc;Biotellytics;CEO, Founder

analyst
#60

Okay. And the last one for me. About the results on HbA1c, well, you presented the data, okay. But I also notice that in the placebo group, among the patients that had type 2 diabetes or diabetes, there was a lower proportion of patients under therapy, 70% versus 85%, 90% in the PXL groups. And I was wondering if there could be any impact of this imbalance on the interpretation of the data.

Thomas Kuhn

executive
#61

Pascale, do you want to answer this one?

Pascale Fouqueray-Grellier

executive
#62

Yes, there is a very slight imbalance. I don't believe that this may have an impact on the result, but we need to look at individual data for that. And so far, we don't have the data. But yes, that's a good comment. But yes, we need to look at all individual data, yes.

Thomas Kuhn

executive
#63

I should add here that despite patients were diabetic or not, I mean, all of them were very well treated and controlled because you've seen that the baseline A1c, so that's why I think Pascale said that it's likely that there will be no impact because clearly -- and we have the data on SPG as well. They were at roughly 110 at baseline. So showing to us that, I mean, this was extremely well-controlled patients in any case.

Pascale Fouqueray-Grellier

executive
#64

Yes. And as well, we have exactly the same profile for the SPG, which is also a good sign, SPG being much more variable with A1c. But when you have both parameter moving in the same way, I think it gives a lot of more consistency to the data. So honestly, we don't believe that. We will look at it, yes.

David Moller

executive
#65

Yes. If I could just add. I think the most important point, if you look closely at the Slide 15, is that the baseline HbA1c is really the same across all these groups despite the fact that there might be some slight differences in the percent that are treated versus treated with diet only.

Bertrand Delsuc;Biotellytics;CEO, Founder

analyst
#66

Yes. Yes. Okay. And yes, just perhaps a last one. The patient populations were patients likely with NASH. Do you have, let's say, just a rough idea of what could be the equivalent F score in this patient population? Would it be only, I mean, F0/F1 or F2?

Pascale Fouqueray-Grellier

executive
#67

Well, I think it is pretty difficult to speculate on that. Based on the data that we have, I think it's very difficult to speculate on the, well, histological status of the subject.

Operator

operator
#68

Thank you. We have no more question for the moment. [Operator Instructions] No more question by phone.

Thomas Kuhn

executive
#69

Okay. Well, I think we can now close the call. So thank you very much, everyone, for your attention in this call, and thank you for your continued support. I think it was a significant milestone for us and for PXL770. We will, of course, keep you up to date about our progress going forward. There is also more to come, as you have understood from our pipeline with our other products there. And so we're really looking forward to update you on all of this because we're going to have a busy end of the year, so happy to report that to everyone. In the meantime, I wish everyone a good afternoon, a good evening there. Thank you very much. Bye-bye.

Operator

operator
#70

Thank you, ladies and gentlemen. This concludes the conference call. Thank you all for your participation. You may now disconnect.

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