Reddit, Inc. (RDDT) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Good morning. We're very thrilled to have Jen Wong, the COO of Reddit joining us today on day 2 of the 2025 T&T. Good to see you. Thanks for joining us.

Good to see you. Thanks for having me.

Let me do the disclosures. For important disclosures, please see the Morgan Stanley research disclosure website at www.morganstanley.com/researchdisclosures. If you have any questions, please feel free to reach out to your Morgan Stanley sales representative. New disclosure person. Anyway, some of the statements made today by Reddit maybe considered forward-looking these statements involve a number of risks and uncertainties that could cause actual results to differ materially. Any forward-looking statements made today by the company are based on assumptions as of today, and Reddit undertakes no obligation to update them. Please refer to Reddit's Form 10-K filed with the SEC for a discussion of the risk factors that may impact actual results.

So let's start with a big picture about the platform and sort of the last year. It's about -- we're getting to the point of a year anniversary on the IPO. You laid out a lot of revenue profit and user targets with the IPO. As a starting point, walk us through which areas have sort of gone better than you thought to date and from an execution perspective, what has driven the upside versus what you thought was going to happen a year ago?

Yes. I think it's been a great year. The team has been executing really well. I'll highlight a couple. One is on the ad side, where we've been investing in both ad tech and go-to-market. That team has been executing really well, and we've evolved into this very gradual investment process. We're not sort of an annual for them, but adding in quarters when we see an opportunity, and the team absorbs that quickly and that those investments show return pretty quickly. And so we've been able to accelerate growth by adding those investments on a continuous basis. That's sort of a new process for us over the last year that I think is really working well. The second is on the user side. I think the search and the ML work that we're doing is going well. And I think there's a lot more road map there. And that has resulted in really consistent and accelerated growth in our logged-in users, which is really important. They're the sort of bedrock of our impressions and business, and they have incredible engagement. But what I'd also like there is the teams in 90 days, were able to put out a prototype like Reddit Answers at the end of the year, which just gives us a taste of what search on Reddit could look like. And that kind of rapid prototyping, I think, was really exciting to see. I like how the teams are working there. And the third, I think, is just -- what you saw last year was kind of the power of our model. When we were able to accelerate the business, just think about how much fell to the bottom line, we're able to deliver that GAAP profitability, $0.70 on the dollar. And that was amazing to be able to demonstrate just the power of the model. So those are kind of highlights of like, I think, how things evolved last year and why we're able to accelerate.

That's great. Very rapid innovation, test and learn and then just the flow-through has been really impressive. So let's talk about maybe the other side of the coin. I mean, I know there are always areas where maybe you don't quite reach where you thought you would have or where you could execute it better. So any areas where you didn't quite get to where you thought you would? And what are sort of the fixes? Or how do you sort of make -- get you where you wanted to be internally at some of the KPIs?

It's a good question. We've been working on a developer platform, which I think we're really excited about because it opens the canvas for what Reddit can be. And I think our dream is if -- for those of you who are Reddit at users, you might have seen on April Fool's, we often do a big experience. We had one called r/place a long time ago where everybody -- users could place a pixel and they made a beautiful canvas. And there are over 10 million Redditors who engaged in that project in 24 to 48 hours, but we built that. I think what we want to see, and we haven't seen yet is our developers be able to make an experience that engages sort of Reddit wide at that level. The things that have come out of developer platform so far are maybe in a community, but certainly not at that scale. So we haven't seen that yet, that hit from the developer platform, not made by us, but made by an independent developer. We're evolving our approach here by partnering with -- sort of leveling up the studio, kind of independent developer grid we're working with. So they're a little bit more sophisticated, a little more experienced in making bigger experiences from the developer platform. So hoping to see some more spark there in terms of the development platform. But I'd say that one is one that we are hoping for like sort of a hit on the order of r/place.

Okay. Let's pay attention to the developer platform changes to come over the course of the year. Let's talk about Google end users. I'm sure you've had this question a few times. Last quarter, you had a little bit of volatility in the users, particularly in the U.S. user growth triggered by a periodic change from Google. It sounds like in the back half of the quarter. So maybe unpack for us as best you can what the change was and then sort of the adjustments that you made to get back to user growth now that we're sitting here in March?

Yes. So Reddit is unique and it has 2 different kinds of users. It has logged-in users and logged-out users. And I kind of think of logged-out users as a plus because most platforms like us, they have logged-in users and our logged-in users are -- they're incredibly high value, high retention, time goes over time. Just an incredible foundation and consistently grown over 27% year-over-year over the last 4 quarters. The logged-out users are -- is the traffic that -- most of it is what we get from Google. We like being a part of the open Internet that's sort of free marketing. And those people are looking for specific information in Reddit. At the end of Q4, we saw some chop from changes. And often, there are a mix, sometimes they can be an algorithm change, it can be a UI change. Sometimes it something that we change, like it can be an amalgamation of those things it. In fact in Q4, it was. And then we said on the mid-February earnings call that we saw recovery. Like basically, we saw some chop at the end of Q4, but in Q1, we saw a recovery, and we saw good momentum. I don't really have anything other than that to add to that, except I can give you some more color. In this case, I think our teams did a good job of identifying changes happened, and they work through it. Sometimes there are things that we can do. In this case, we had some changes in the UI that changed how we were being called and we adjusted that. In other cases, we don't know. There's a change and we don't have control. So it's usually a combination of these things, but I think our teams are quite experienced in dealing with it. We don't, I guess, over rotate on the chop and logged-out users. It's going to happen. That's just the reality. Google is a business, it's a platform. It will make changes. But I think we still believe that Google and Reddit have a very solid relationship. And I think you see this over time. If you were to enter Reddit into Google trends over many years, I can set the time back a decade, it just consistently goes up and to the right because I think Google appreciates the high-quality, relevant information on Reddit. And today, if you were to look at the search stats, in 2024, Reddit was the sixth most search term in the U.S., which means users are intentionally going to Google to get Reddit results. And so I think fundamentally, like I said, it's a symbiotic relationship because people are using Google to get to Reddit. And so it's important that Reddit results turn up when people are actually searching for Reddit. So when I think about this, like I don't view it as essential. We have these 2 sources of traffic. A lot of our product work allows us to develop and consistently grow those logged-in users, which are the bedrock of our impressions and inventory because of their very long engagement on Reddit. It's not existential for us, but it is some chop that we manage through. Look, there have been a lot of changes that are coming in the UI. There have been a lot of changes with AI overview since July. And our traffic from Google is up since those changes. So certainly, since we've seen -- everything we've seen to date. So look, they'll be chopped from time to time, but we managed through it. And I think the business is extremely healthy because again it's powered by the logged-in users.

I think that's -- actually, you hit on my very next question on logged-in users because you do have this funnel of you get the non-logged in users from Google or from Alphabet. And then the really important thing is if you convert those to logged-in because they're so important to your impressions, as you just said a few times. So maybe walk us through some of the key innovations that you've used over the last year to convert logged-out to logged-in? And what's in the pipeline for '25 to sort of keep that conversion rate high?

I think -- so those users are quite different in their use cases. And actually, we changed our mission this year to reflect that. So our mission now is to empower communities and make their knowledge accessible to all. So really acknowledges there's a core use case of coming for conversation and communities and sharing passions and interests. And there's another really important use case, which is coming to access the trove of human ideas and intelligence that's on Reddit, and get your questions answered. And we've gotten really excited about that opportunity. You can shorthand just call that search and we're doing a fair amount of work around that with Reddit Answers, et cetera. That tends to be the logged-out user, people coming in through the front door, checking with communities tend to be the logged-in user. Once upon a time, we used to pretty aggressively try to get a logged-out user to log in, in that session. And they're just very different use cases. And that was sort of a short-term game, I think, gained with no long-term game there. Instead, what we've done is just to focus on product quality. And so we view the logged-in user is just marketing for Reddit. You have a great experience. You have a great experience. You see how much amazing content there is, one day you come and you download the app and you join. And so what we've been doing is taking all the friction out of the joining process, the onboarding, the sign-up, the getting the user name, the ML that allows you to find the communities of interest quickly. When you join and you find 10, 20 communities that you -- that generate your feed and that you connect with, that's pretty much how we've got you from a retention standpoint. Now over time, you'll -- in the next 5 years, most likely the user -- the vintages get better and they'll spend -- they'll be in 50 communities and their time spent will go up. But that's what we've been working on. And that's been working for us, and there's more road map there.

The vintage comment brings me to one of my favorite questions. My favorite chart on the S-1 is the one that shows the users, when they start on the platform spending 20 minutes a day and then by the time they get to year 7, it's 45 minutes a day, good vintage. Where are you now on that? If you were to sort of update that chart from the S-1 a year ago on time spent per user per day as the people age?

Yes. That chart has held true even as we scale. And all we ask people who are Redditors, they don't just say I like it. They say, "I love Reddit." And I think the relationship with those logged in users is very deep. They start at around 20 minutes per user per day. And after the 5-year mark, they're at 45 minutes per user per day. And that's really unusual, right? And a lot of social media platforms, people age out. There's a moment at which is just not applicable to them or their friend group. It's different with Reddit, the vintages get better, they season. In fact, what happens is Reddit grows with you. So you might start out as a college student and trying to figure out how to live life on your own, then you become -- you start dating, you might get married, you become a parent, you're buying a house, you're buying a car. Reddit is with you the entire journey, helping you through all of these life milestones and you basically give explicit signal to Reddit as to what you're interested in as you join more communities over time. And that drives even more time and retention. And that has held true even as we've grown. It's been a very consistent pattern.

It's very good for engagement and very good for monetizable opportunities, which brings us to the advertising business. Your pipeline on the advertising front. My opinion has been really impressive in your ability to ship products last year to sort of really scale this ad business, you beat our numbers by a lot. So I would be curious to hear if you just focus on the ad business. Are there one or 2 areas where you really delivered better-than-expected return last year? And then let's talk about the pipeline for this year. I mean it started in '24. What works better than you thought?

We exited the year with 60-plus percent in what I would call performance advertising. There has to be an action, a click, a conversion measured, an app install. I'd say that we probably got to that proportion faster than we expected. And I think that's because we delivered some incredible efficiency to our advertisers, which came back to us in terms of the share of wallet. And so I think that happened even exceeded expectations, I would say. When I look at the road map this year, I think we have the opportunity to do more meat and potatoes work. So I always start with performance. Our goal is to be a multi-objective ad platform. That means we can work for an advertiser in terms of brand engagement, in terms of traffic driving and research, in terms of lower funnel conversion and app install. And so we want to be very diversified across all of those objectives. At the heart of that is all performance, is measured performance. And that is driven by a lot of ML work. It's increasing the data signals and it's larger models that drive ad relevance and drive those outcomes. So we will continue on that journey this year. There's still more road map there. The second thing that I'm excited about for this year, which we haven't done a lot of work. And in fact, a lot of ad platforms, they start with sort of formats work and then they go into the performance work. We've done the performance work on very basic formats, and we're actually going to do some work on formats this year. And we haven't done that historically because we had a lot of platforms, and we were consolidating. But we're excited about that because it's not only unique to Reddit, but we think it can drive incremental performance. So taking signals from the Reddit community, maybe even content from the Reddit community and having them in some of the advertising to create sort of community marketing formats, leveraging the intelligence from a company we bought Memorable AI that has a trove of intelligence on what works on ads and applying GenAI to that to generate creative variants that are ready and also, again, can drive performance in a scaled and automated way. So really excited about that. Those 2 bodies of work that I think will be prominent for this year. Look, we're always testing things for the future, too. I'd say there are a couple of things on our road map that are probably big multiyear projects that are betas that we really want to get testing. So one is our DPA and shopping or dynamic product optimization and shopping experience. So that's something we want to put out in a bigger beta way this year. And the second is end-to-end automation, which is a very big project in putting together all the modules of our ad stack to just make it much easier. And that's something else we want to, again, get to a beta test what that experience looks like.

Great. A lot of pipeline this year. Ahead of this discussion, I know Reddit solicited questions from its community and one of the subreddit, so we're going to ask a couple of questions from the community. The first one is on personalized ads. Personalized ads must be a critical feature to improve ROAS for customers and ARPU for Reddit. Reddit seems to have significant advantages in this aspect given the access to what a user is investing in through the user participation, specific subreddit, postings and comments made throughout his or her engagement with Reddit. The question is, is it part of your plan to improve the personalized ad features in the future, using AI, for example, to analyze user agent behavior?

I mean look, I think personalized ads are obviously where we want to be, I think they are a win for users, and I think they're a win for advertisers in terms of driving performance. On Reddit, we have 2 kinds of signals. We have one, which is your expressed interest based on the communities that you are spending time in and joining and then the second is the context of the page that you're in, in the moment that the impression opportunity becomes available. So you might be sitting right then in a -- what kind of ski should I buy comment post and conversation page. Both are incredibly powerful signals that we integrate into our ads platform. But there's still work to be done. We're still early in that journey. In the contextual relevance area there's still more that we can glean from the page in terms of sentiment, open-ended questions, where are you in the purchase decision journey based on the kind of post that you're in. Those are I think, factors that can drive even more personalization. And then the second is on interest. I think there's also, again, a lot more that we can bring together across the graph for ad targeting. The third piece I'll say is to get personalized ads is you need a high level of advertiser density, i.e., relevant ads to choose from and more advertisers. That's been growing nicely for us. We've had an acquisition drive over the last year. We'll continue to do that. There's just so many more advertisers that can be on the platform. But when you have that advertiser diversity, it also helps in the ultimate ad relevance for what you display. So that's also something that we'll work on. So that's absolutely where we're going to be.

That advertiser diversity point is a good one because one of the things that has impressed me is you've talked about having your ad verticals growing over 50%. It was 4 growing over 50% to now 8 of the top 10 ad verticals growing 50% year-on-year. Just talk to us about sort of the go-to-market, the sales force structure? What has driven that? And sort of how do you sort of think about continuing to have more verticals or keep the 50% going for longer?

You're thorough. Look, we are sort of original endemic verticals, our first verticals were sort of tech in the entertainment, those might be more mature verticals, although I think there's a lot of headroom there. And then what we did is we started investing in go-to-market teams in these different verticals. And that's specifically in North America. So we're configured in North America around large customers segment as well as a scale segment, which is mid-market SMB and those segments tend to have a vertical overlay. Outside of the U.S., we tend to be more geographically focused because they're just smaller teams. I kind of cover everything. But we invested in go-to-market teams in these verticals, and that's been delivering a lot of value to us because they're just acquiring new business lines and we're developing, in some cases, specific product features that are important for that vertical. So in the areas like pharmaceuticals, there are very specific regulatory requirements of how you click an ad and get the long list of fine print. When we do that, we're able to unlock more TAM for that segment. So we're still early. When I look at the penetration of a holding company or a multi-brand pharmaceutical company or multi-brand CPG company, we're just only partially way through the lines of business. And then when I look at the mid-market segment, there are just thousands of advertisers that can be in our platform that are not on our platform yet. Now we're making progress against acquisition. One of the things I like that we did last year is we moved an acquisition-specific team into every single mid-market pot. So they have an acquisition team that is just all they're doing is focusing on developing new business. And once they have that, they hand it over to a team that now nurtures that account and they keep doing that. And all the investments that we're making in productivity tools for our sales force that allows us to grow the productivity of the number of acquisitions per month that they can bring in. So I think that machine is working for us, and we'll continue to work on those tools to grow the productivity of those teams and acquire more advertisers.

Yes, that hunter farmer vertical-specific focus seems to be working. You've talked about some of the categories getting to always on, but it's always on sort of the holy grail of the platform to look for. Any way you can help us understand what percentage of your business now is sort of in that always on bucket? Where have you made the most progress from a vertical perspective? And where do we go from here on?

It's different by channel. So the customers that were the earlier adopters of performance and the earlier adopters of things like credit lines, and measurement like CAPI. They're the ones who will lean into always on first. And so that tends to be the more performance-oriented segments. Let's call that in the scaled area. Different -- there are different things that need to happen is a series of -- I think there's a series of steps that we're working on to get there. So particularly for large customers, what's really important is it is true for every customer, moving to credit lines. Number 2 is adopting measurement, so adopting things like CAPI and Pixel to make sure that we have really good measurement of performance because you want that always on. And then the third is automation. So automation becomes really important for ease of use. And I'd say we're semi-automated today, not fully end-to-end automated, as I mentioned before. Now some things we control, some things we control lens, right? So in terms of credit lines at CAPI on our calls, I think we've been talking about these things because we have teams focused on credit line and CAPI adoption. Now we don't have control of that in that the end advertiser actually has to do some IT implementation in order to get something like CAPI working. But once it's working, the benefit to a customer is a 25% reduction in CPA. It's real-time funneling of data into the models that allows them to optimize as an incredible benefit to the advertiser when that happens. But it still takes work to get prioritized and has to get done. Mike Romoff is our new CRO. He's a lot of experience in this area and their teams dedicated to supporting our sales force and making sure that this happens. He also has a history in working with the ads API and working with partners on the ad API, which also allows more always-on access to the Reddit ads platform. The automation, that's work that we control, right? So I talked about the fact that I want to work on that beta and putting things together and seeing how end-to-end, we can go with our different modules today. I'm excited about that. I think that will be a big unlock. If you want to be always on with an SMB, you need that. So that's the other step that we're working on. That I think is road map in our control from a build perspective.

So automation sort of '25 product? Or is it '25, '26? How do we think about that?

I think it's '25, let's see -- let's put this together and let's see how good this is and then hopefully impact after that. I mean we have to remember, we are building pieces of our ad stack at the same time as automating over them. And it's quite early in our journey to be thinking about end-to-end automation. If you think about Google and Meta who now are increasing their share that's covered in end-to-end automation, their businesses have been around for 10, 15 or 2 decades before they did this. So there's trust and there's mature modules that go into underneath the automation. We're doing both at the same time.

A lot of moving. Now one of your favorite questions around ad load that we've had many meetings together -- and I feel like ad load is -- it's going to keep coming back. When you open up your dashboard and your internal dashboard and you look at ad load. Where are you versus peers at this point? And as you sort of cut across the different surfaces, where do you see the most potential for ad load growth in '25?

Yes. We don't -- ad load is just not the top of my list or dashboard, totally honest. Look, our ad load is light, right? So if you were to compare the most comparable way to look at ad load might be the feed. And if you look at our ad load in the feed, it's about half of peers, like or closer one to 8, they are often one to 4. It's not a knob that we think about turning today. And the reason why is because our impression growth is driven by very healthy underlying user growth. We love that, right? The engagement from the logged-in user, obviously, those vintages are getting better. And some work that we have done to think about placements in spaces where we don't have ads today. So we have the ads and comments. I think we said it is about 3% of inventory today. I think that can grow over time. And by the way, the rest of the page doesn't have anything. So we think about designing formats for experience that are growing. There's more and more traffic going to that page. The logged-out traffic goes there. Logged-in users when the go in and they have a good visit, which is what we tune to our ML too, where people go deeper, they go to that page. So that page is becoming more important, and that's an opportunity because it's a minority of inventory. The feed is the majority today. So there's headroom, but we don't think about tweaking the ad load in the feed as our strategy. We think about underlying user growth, designing for spaces and then doing some brand safety, personalized ad load work that continues to just make the ads, I think, perform even better and find -- unlock pockets that weren't there.

Up to the next meeting, I'll ask ad load again. Let's talk about Reddit Answers. You launched Reddit Answers in beta now in the U.S. It sort of -- it seems like a precursor to what could be a broader search product. What events are of the early learnings or the search behavior from answers anything on commercial activity?

Yes. Well, it's very early for that. It's a bit. As I mentioned earlier, it's a prototype that the team built in 90 days. And the idea was we wanted to see like in pixels what a search experience on Reddit could look like? Because we've now evolved our mission. We have -- search has become one of our top priorities. Our goal is to have a search experience on Reddit and be the best at searching with it. right? Google is great at searching the Internet, and it gets you to certain things in Reddit but we want to be the best at searching across Reddit. And so if you've tested the Answers experience in an iOS and web, it's not even on Android yet, we're working on that. You'll see an experience that has summaries across multiple post across multiple communities. It shows you where you can get an answer to a question like what's the best backpack for a short person across all the different subreddits and the different perspective. So it gives you like this breadth across Reddit, that you don't get in broad-based Internet search. So the point of it was, do we see something here that's special, that's unique, that's differentiated? I think we do. And I think we've been excited by what we see. So that's sort of the point of Answers right now, and it's the first -- it's just one component of the multistep journey to get to the search experience, but there's multiple steps along the way.

Yes. Are there any other on the steps along the way? Are there any other search milestones or key things you're focusing on in 2025 to sort of get where you want to be in '26?

Yes, I'd say step one is about nailing the product and the engagement that we think is associated with the product. Today, a search is a win for everyone, I think, because core users want to use it to navigate Reddit. New users try to use it to, again, find their communities and content on Reddit. Advertisers, one of the best products in advertising. So it's a win-win moment across the board but there's different steps that it takes. So the first step is about knowing the product and the engagement. That's really the bulk of the work this year and the 2 pieces that are happening in parallel. Reddit Answers reveals what the possibility is from the UI and experience endpoint. Concurrently, we're doing a lot of work on the back end to improve the quality of search. So that's like retrieval, ranking, the algorithm, it's really meat and potatoes work and honestly, there's probably 100 different metrics that we look at. But in the end, it's around do we have a quality search and a quality visit. Is it increasing the engagement of our users when they use search? That's what it comes down to. Because with search, people vote with their time and their feed. So that's really the bulk of the work is here. And it's a lot of work. It's quarters of work to do those 2 things and bring those 2 things together. Once we see that, then we can promote it at scale at that experience and that behavior at scale. And then we can add in the monetization. So that follows these steps.

Maybe another question just about sort of the engagement pipeline leading to longer-term monetization is on international. You've talked about deploying machine translation to France. I think there are other countries in the pipeline as well. So what have you learned so far in France from machine translation? And as we sort of think about more countries, more users, how are you internally evaluating when the right time to flip the revenue switch on?

So international is one of our top priorities, top priorities is ad, search and international. Today, we're just slightly majority outside of the United States. And if you look at pure platforms, it's 70% to 90% of users are outside of the U.S. So it's a huge opportunity. And if I think about the future, I think a lot of our users will come from outside of the U.S. Reddit is worth. So in order to get the flywheel going, you need content and communities and moderators. So what we've done in France and actually now 8 countries is focused on using machine translation to translate post that we think have global appeal. Think about like global experience, like parenting, dating, like sports some pops in pop culture. These are really universal topics. And we've used machine translation to make them available in French, German and some of these languages. And we've done 8 so far, 1 billion posts and there's a list of languages beyond that, that we'll be working on. What that's done is help accelerate access to Reddit content. It's indexed in search. It's really -- is quite good. And those countries where we've been focused, where we've applied machine translation and applied local teams that are recruiting moderators and stimulating the growth of local communities those countries are growing 30%, 40% more than countries that haven't gotten that treatment. So I think we have found a way to accelerate the international growth with these levers. Now there's still more work to be done because the users for a long time we're seeing a Reddit app in English, not in their local language. So we have to reeducate the market, to go through that experience, maybe some marketing that we want to test, and ultimately, what we want is the local communities to thrive and generate content with local moderators that also feed the local market. So French communities, French moderators, that French users are enjoying because Reddit's great when it's global and it's local. So that's the next arc. But we're really pleased with what we're seeing. These 2 things have allowed us to accelerate the trajectory of these countries when we give them that treatment. So we'll expand that this year.

All right. And lastly, you have -- do a lot of investor meetings. You have a lot of conference calls. I just sort of want to close with a 2-part question for you. When you handle these meetings and analyze questions, 1 year post IPO, what do you think is the most underappreciated opportunity for Reddit? And what is the most underappreciated challenge that you have to sort of execute through?

So sometimes, I think Reddit can feel very niche because people's experience with Reddit is like pizza or the skiing subreddit or something really, really narrow that they enjoy or people talk about. And sometimes you forget how vast Reddit is and how extensible it is. Like it's a lot of small communities that add up to something massive. Right, over 0.5 billion users, $100 million, like it's massive. And the TAM is everyone in the world because we can cover every topic. And so we have this benefit of this unlimited TAM of users and I think an unlimited TAM of businesses and advertisers that can be on the platform. Really, really unique. How big we can be in our core of communities and conversation. And when it's so extensible, the model is words and words are really light in terms of hosting, I mean, think about our gross margin, 93%. Okay, there's another maybe not planned for number last year, which is incredible to see the team executing against. But Reddit also because of that has this business model where we can self-fund ourselves because we can be profitable so early in our journey. So Reddit is really special. It's very extensible. It's much bigger than I think and more vast than people think. I think the challenge is the discussion and the perception of the reliance on Google. I think we spend a lot of time on logged-out users and changes that -- yes, we don't have full control. We don't have control over, but it's not in the long term, I think, something that is existential for us because the things that we do have control over are the things that are our highest value like the logged-in users, the product improvements that grow the logged-in users that are the bedrock of our inventory. And even strategically, our position with broad-based search in Google, I think we have a really solid foundation there. That's been certainly over many, many years, I think, well established. So we spend a lot of time on it. Sometimes maybe I think we have to explain it a lot more than I think we spend time thinking about it in some ways.

All right. Well, Jen, thank you very much. It's been an exciting year. 2025.

Thank you.