Reece Limited (REH.AX) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Good morning, everyone. I'm Peter Wilson, the Chair and CEO of Reece. Thank you, Kim, for sharing your acknowledgment of country with us. A quorum of members is present, and the meeting is now open. With us today is Independent Director, Angela Mentis, Andrew Wilson, and Bruce Wilson. And in the studio with me is the Chair of the Audit and Risk Committee, Gavin Street; our new Chair of the Remuneration Committee, Jacqueline Chow; our Company Secretary, Chantelle Duffy; and our Group President and Managing Director, Sasha Nikolic. Our audit partners from KPMG are also here, and happy to answer audit-related questions. I'll now hand over to Chantelle to go through the procedures for today.

Thank you, Peter. The instructions for the online platform are contained in the Notice of Meeting, where you will find the agenda and explanatory notes. Today's resolutions will be decided by a poll. David Squires from Computershare is the Returning Officer for this meeting. Voting on all items of business is now open. Voting will close 5 minutes after the meeting closes. Only shareholders, proxy holders or authorized shareholder representatives may vote. If you are eligible to vote, press the vote icon and all resolutions will be activated. To cast your vote, select an option: For, Against or Abstain. And once submitted, you will receive a confirmation notification on your screen. You can change your vote at any time during the meeting until voting closes. Please note voting exclusions apply to some of the resolutions today, which have been outlined in the Notice of Meeting. We will ask all shareholders to hold all questions until the end of the meeting. Once we have completed the items of business, we will then address questions before voting closes. Online questions can be submitted at any time. Select the Q&A icon and type your question into the text box. If we receive multiple questions on one topic, we may consolidate them. Verbal questions can also be asked by following the instructions in the platform. If you have any difficulties voting or asking questions, please consult the online meeting guide or call the help number in the Computershare platform. I will now hand back to Peter to deliver his chair address.

Thanks, Chantelle. I'm pleased to deliver my first address since moving into the Chair and CEO role a year ago. Many of you will be familiar with the Reece's history from humble beginnings in 1920 as a hardware business. In 1969, my family became the majority shareholder in Reece. At the time Reece had just 2 stores in Corfield and Clayton. We saw rapid growth through the '80s and '90s, and I joined Reece during this period in 1993, and worked across many parts of the business as we expanded through Victoria and then nationally. In the 2000s, we kept growing, I became the CEO at the end of 2007, and we transform Reece into a more professional business and a world-class brand. Fast forward to today, we are a business with sales of $9 billion, $900 million in EBITDA, over 900 branches, and 9,000 team members across Australia, New Zealand and the U.S. We've achieved this by doing things The Reece Way. We take a very long-term view and we are driven by doing what is right for our customers because when they succeed, so do we. We are unique, and it's something we've always been proud of. As Chair, I'm passionate that we continue to run the business with an entrepreneurial spirit. Everything we do at Reece is guided by a blueprint, from purpose to promise. Our purpose, building a better world for our customers by being the best inspires us. And together with our values is how we live The Reece Way. Our 2030 vision is to be our trade's most valuable partner. We'll achieve this by delivering on 3 strategic priorities: operational excellence, accelerating innovation, and investing for profitable growth. Together, these help us deliver on our customer promise, which is always at the heart of our business. FY '25 was a challenging year for Reece. Group sales were down 1% to $9 billion, EBITDA was down 11% to $901 million. EBIT declined 20% to $548 million, reflecting soft end markets and increased competitive pressure. The Board declared a final dividend for the year of $0.1186, taking the total dividend for FY '25 to $0.1836 per share. We've had a challenging period, but our strategy and focus on the long term remains unchanged. We are well capitalized to continue building a stronger business as we've done for many decades, and we operate in large, attractive markets supported by positive long-term fundamentals. Our strategy is supported by a well-defined capital management framework. Our first priority is to invest in the growth of the business. Our second priority is to maintain a strong balance sheet and flexibility for growth. And our third priority is to provide returns to shareholders with a range of options on the table in line with this strategy. We recently executed a $365 million share buyback program, purchasing approximately 4.3% of shares on issue. This enabled us to return excess capital to shareholders whilst maintaining a strong balance sheet and flexibility to fund future growth. Turning now to the Board. Over my first 12 months as a Chair, we've begun to reshape the Board for the future. To become the business we are today, we've benefited from our unique ownership structure, which provides a multi-decade time horizon. Our focus is on maintaining the benefits that this ownership structure has delivered whilst bringing in new skills and expertise in our independent directors. In practice, this makes us look quite different to many other ASX-listed companies. We embrace this uniqueness proudly because it is one of the reasons for our success. During the year, we saw long-term serving board members, Tim Poole and Megan Quinn retire, along with Ross McEwan who left to take on the role of Chair at BHP. This provided us with the opportunity to consider the skills and experience we need from our independent directors to guide the business through its next phase. Since then, we've welcomed new directors, Angela Mentis, and Gavin Street to the Board, and recently announced Jacq Chow's appointment. Jacq is a former ASX50 executive with over 30 years in leadership roles in blue-chip multinationals, and we are continuing our search for a lead independent director, who combined with other independent directors, can ensure a balance of views around the table for minority shareholders. Our focus is on finding directors who are the right fit for Reece long term. I'll now hand over to Sasha Nikolic to introduce himself and provide some further detail on FY '25 operations and a first quarter trading update.

Thank you, Peter. It's been a real privilege to serve Reece as the Group President and Managing Director over the past 12 months. What I love most about this role is the opportunity to see up close the incredible work our team does every day across our three regions. Whether it's supporting customers, helping communities or living our purpose, I've seen firsthand how our people bring the Reece promise to life. It's inspiring to watch our team at their best, backing each other, solving problems, making a real difference. While we may not yet see the impact of this work in our current trading period, we are confident that the work our people are doing is making Reece a stronger business so that when the market turns, we'll be in a better position because of the foundation our team is laying today. And that is the real difference that Reece makes and why we are a standout company. We always strive to be the best. With that, let's turn to our FY '25 numbers. This was a challenging year economically. At the start of the fiscal year, interest rates were expected to come down and drive housing market activity. That did not eventuate and impacted our results. Starting with group sales, we were down 1% to $9 billion, reflecting lower demand settings in both regions. Australia and New Zealand sales delivered positive growth for the year, up 1%, supported by M&A activity in a flat volume environment. In the U.S., sales were down 5% to USD 3.3 billion, impacted by 2 key factors: Our higher exposure to the soft residential new construction sector, and the competitive landscape. Group costs, excluding depreciation and amortization, were up 3%, largely driven by higher salaries and property costs, resulting in EBITDA being unfavorable at 11% down prior year to $901 million, with EBIT down 20% to $548 million, reflecting elevated depreciation and amortization across both regions. Our CapEx to sales ratio was 2.9% for the year. And the group's return on capital ratio decreased by 365 basis points. While the FY '25 results are disappointing, we are confident in the long-term strength and resilience of our business. Softer earnings also reflect Reece's deliberate choice to invest through the cycle to serve customers better and position Reece for the future. We are built for the long term. And that focus guides every decision we make. Our network now spans more than 900 branches across 3 countries, Australia, New Zealand and the United States, giving us the reach to support our customers wherever they are. In Australia and New Zealand, our network remains a key competitive advantage underpinning our market-leading position and helping us deliver our promise. In the U.S., we continue to make strong progress in the expansion and upgrade of our network, adding 24 branches in the year. And despite a challenging period, the team has invested significant efforts into the U.S. rebranding project, driving momentum and consistency across our group network under the One Reece banner. In addition to the network expansion, we continue to make solid progress against our 3 strategic priorities in FY '25. The team has shown resilience through a challenging period and remain focused on what we do best. Over time, we've seen that investment make us better, and we continue to invest in our people through training and development programs that build the expertise and capabilities that our customers depend on. At the same time, we're investing in innovation with the aim of bringing new technologies that enhance productivity and improved customer-facing tools to our trade partners so that we can grow their business as well. Now turning to Q1 of FY '26. The macro environment remains challenging across Australia, New Zealand and the United States. Despite that, we've delivered 8% sales growth for the quarter, driven by network expansion. Like-for-like sales, which excludes new stores, were up 2%, which reflects the challenges of the current economic environment and the competitive market. EBITDA declined 8% for the quarter as we've continued to invest in our people through total compensation packages and training and development needs. Our EBIT was down 18% for the quarter as we continue to open new locations and support growth for the future. Over the first quarter, we have opened 15 new branches. While these results aren't where we want them to be, we are confident in our strategy. Our approach has always been to invest through the cycle to build long-term strength. We have done this before. With that, I'll hand it back to Peter Wilson.

Thanks, Sasha. Now we'll start the formal business. Voting is open. If shareholders have nominated the Chair of the meeting as proxy, I will direct all open usable votes in accordance with Board recommendations. The first item of business is to receive and consider the financial statements for the company and its controlled entities, together with the director's report, and the independent auditor's report for the year ended June 30, 2025. These documents are now tabled. There is no shareholder resolution required for this item. Just a reminder, we will respond to questions after running through the formal items of business, and before voting closes. Moving now to Items 2 to 7, which relate to director elections. This year, we will present each of our Board members for election or reelection. Given the number of items, the directors will not make individual addresses and their biographies are included in the notice of meeting. Displayed on screen as I read out each item are the proxies received. The Board supports each election. Item 2 is to elect Angela Mentis as a Director. Item 3 is to elect Gavin Street as a Director. Item 4 is to elect Jacqueline Chow as a Director. Item 5 is to reelect Andrew Wilson as a Director. Item 6 is to reelect Bruce Wilson as a Director. Item 7 is to reelect Sasha Nikolic as a director. Moving now to Item 8, the election of Stephen Mayne to the Board as an independent. Stephen has nominated himself to the position. The Board has given careful consideration to the existing mix of skills and expertise on the Board. The skills will require for the future and what Stephen will bring. Having considered this, we have respectfully chosen not to endorse his self-election. We welcome Stephen to contribute to Q&A at the end, if you like, the opportunity to be heard at the meeting. Displayed on screen are the proxies received in relation to this item. Now I'd like to welcome our incoming Remuneration Chair, Jacq Chow, who will introduce herself.

Thank you, Peter, and good morning. It's a privilege to join Reece Limited as Chair of the Remuneration Committee. I bring over 2 decades of leadership experience across various sectors, including my most recent executive role as Chief Operating Officer at Fonterra, where I led 11,000 team members across 80 countries, including the Americas and Asia Pacific. I'm currently a Nonexecutive Director at Coles Group, nib and Charter Hall. My focus at Reece will be ensuring our remuneration frameworks continue to balance Reece's long-term strategy, our performance outcomes, and your shareholder expectations. We're currently reviewing the structure of the FY '26 LTI to make sure it's effective for retaining our top talent. I will take the time to engage with you, our investors, and consider your feedback as part of this process. I do look forward to engaging with you and working collaboratively with the Board to uphold Reece's values and make sure we drive sustainable growth. I'll now hand over to Gavin to present Item 9, the adoption of the remuneration report.

Thanks, Jacq, and good morning, everyone. I'm the Chair of the Audit and Risk Committee, and I was acting Remuneration Committee Chair from the 1 July until 31 October. Before we turn to Item 9, we'd like to acknowledge that last year, Reece received a first strike on its remuneration report. We took this seriously, and we engage with proxy advisers and shareholders to understand their concerns, and we will continue to do so in the future. In response to the feedback from the first strike, this year, we made the following changes. We disclosed additional benchmark information for the internal -- international comparative groups. We enhanced STI outcome disclosures from prior year. We introduced a minimum shareholding for directors, which from FY '26 will include all KMPs and we adopted a policy where all directors stand for election on an annual basis. As a founder-led business with a different ownership structure and a significant footprint in North America, our remuneration framework is designed to support long-term growth and leadership continuity across diverse markets. We are committed to attracting and retaining high-caliber talent in a competitive global environment. We are committed to ensuring our remuneration practices remain fair, competitive and aligned to long-term value creation. Moving to the ninth item of business, which is to adopt the remuneration report for the year ended June 30, 2025, this is a nonbinding vote. The Board unanimously recommends shareholder vote for this item. Displayed on the screen of the details of the proxies received in relation to the adoption of the 2025 remuneration report. Our largest shareholder, the aggregated Wilson Family Holding, which represents 70.1% is precluded from voting on this item. Based on the proxy votes, we will receive a second strike on the remuneration report. I'll now hand you back to Peter.

Thanks, Gavin. I'd also -- I'd like to acknowledge the second strike. We take this seriously, and we'll keep engaging with our shareholders to understand their concerns. Because more than 25% of shareholders voted against the remuneration report, we are required to table a Spill Resolution. The Board recommends all shareholders vote against this resolution. Displayed on screen are the details of the proxy votes received for this item. Shareholders have voted against this item, meaning there will be no Board spill. And we'll now move to our Q&A. To give some time to submit questions, we'll play a short video on the Reece foundation, which we are all very incredibly proud of. [Presentation]

We will now open the meeting to all members to ask questions or make any comments. I will now hand over to Chantelle to read out the questions.

Thank you, Peter. The first question is from Mr. Edmond Qorri. Reece takes a long-term view. But given it was outflanked in the Waterworks area when the previous owner after setting up a new business to compete and the ongoing problems in the U.S.A., what makes you confident that difficulties are cyclical rather than structural.

Yes. Good question. It's -- look, further on from the full year results, this is not uncommon practice in Waterworks. It's that type of industry. We -- since that time, we've now appointed a leader for the Waterworks business. We've promoted from within. So guy called Keith Young, being well received by our Waterworks team. And -- we have backfilled every single person that we've lost in the last couple of months. So we're feeling a little bit better about that, and we are 100% up for the fight. So -- it's just the nature of the industry, and we like the Waterworks sector. Thank you. Next question.

Next question is from Peter Ed, a volunteer from the Australian Shareholders' Association. Today, I hold proxies from 28 shareholders for over 540,000 shares. It is now 6 years since you have held a face-to-face AGM. Last year, you said you would consider an alternative for meeting format. Please let us know what was considered and if you will hold a face-to-face or hybrid AGM in 2026?

Thank you again for the question. Look, every year, we do deeply consider what is the best AGM format for us, for Reece. So this time around we feel that this is the most efficient and the most effective format for Reece. It has wide reach. So each year, we'll consider it. But for the moment, we think that the virtual AGM format is the right one for us. So we do deeply consider it. We discuss it and we've landed on the virtual one, again. Thank you.

The next question is also from Peter Ed from ASA. Your selling and administration expenses have increased by about $80 million in the year of falling sales. Would you comment on this increase and tell us what cost saving measures and programs you have in place?

Very good question, and I'm going to hand it across to Sash. All I'd say to start with before we go into the detail, is that, we always talk about the fact that we invest through the long term. So you've got to balance the short term, long term. You're always doing trade-offs. But when we're in doubt, we are ongoing for the long term. So -- but having said that, we have got short-term measures. So I'll hand over to Sasha to go through what we're doing.

Further to what Peter was saying, it's 4% of our base that went up in FY '25. The bulk of that is associated with our people, with technology and property. We did open 39 branches in the year. And we do run ratios, and we look at our productivity all the way down to a branch level. And to reiterate, Reece is investing through the cycles. These cycles come and go. And we've had a history of always pushing on and investing through because in the long term, we know that's in the best interest of Reece.

The next question is from Peter Ed, a volunteer from the Australian Shareholders' Association. I note the significant fall in FY '25 profit, dividend paid to shareholders and the substantial fall in your share price. However, you still paid a substantial short-term incentive to your CEO, Group President and CFO, even though they missed 2 of the 3 financial measures. Given these circumstances and the pain felt by shareholders, did the Remuneration Committee consider intervening to adjust the STI payments by reducing them to 0? And if not, why not?

Yes. Good question again, Peter. Look, just -- I'll set the scene and I'll hand it over to Gavin. Look, we do have a really clear remuneration framework, and we endeavor to reward for performance as a risk component as well. The Rem framework is designed to attract and retain talent. We do benchmark in all our jurisdictions with an increasing weight to the U.S. because that's where the growth and the biggest part of the business is going to come from. So I'll hand it over to Gavin now to take the rest.

Thanks, Peter. And look, just to Reece, we do have a set process around scorecards and scorecard reviews. It's done with the remuneration committee independently of KMPs in the room. When we looked at it, there's a mixture of, as you mentioned, financial and nonfinancial metrics, predominantly financial metrics. And if we look at the reduction of the STI for KMPs was within 50% to 60% across the board. So when we look at EBITDA, it was down 11%. And we saw that the alignment was there and the reduction was there in the STI. So we thought that was fair, and we thought that was appropriate for what we had for the financial year.

Thanks, Gavin. Next question, Chantelle?

The next question is also from Peter from ASA. In the remuneration report, you discussed 3 comparative groups for setting executive remuneration. Wouldn't it be simpler and clearer to name the companies used as other companies do?

I'll hand that again to Gavin.

Yes. I appreciate that. Look, we'll take that feedback on board. We're constantly looking at the way in which we actually benchmark and look at our KMPs and we'll take that on board.

Thanks for the question.

The next question is also from Peter from the ASA. I understand that none of the executive KMPs reside in the U.S. Why then are you so concerned to link your remuneration to U.S. practices such as to have a service component in your LTI?

That is a good question. I mean, if I unpack that, 2 of the KMPs, which obviously myself and Sasha, spend a lot of time in the U.S. We both have houses in the U.S. Sasha goes 6 times a year to the U.S. and plays an integral part in driving the strategy of the U.S. He was based there. So we're spending a lot of time and a lot of focus in the U.S. So it -- and it's part of our future strategy. So yes, I think it definitely makes sense. And look, for what it's worth, just adding to it, when you compare the U.S. to Australia, there's a lot of magic to the U.S. because they do encourage risk, they do encourage entrepreneurship and they encourage outliers and then they reward for it. And that's why you get the magic of the U.S. In Australia, we obviously -- we have a different jurisdiction and it's all about fitting into the swimlane and into the governance and into the average. So I actually think the U.S. have got it right. So that may not be what you want to hear. But -- and then the other KMP, our CFO, also spends time in the U.S. So it's a big part of the business. Thanks, Chantelle.

The next question is also from Peter from ASA. With regard to the recent share buyback, I understand that none of the Wilson Family Holding was sold into the buyback. What percentage of the company shares does the Wilson Family now control?

Off the top of my head, it's just over 70%. I think 70.1% after the buyback. So before we did MORSCO, the family owned 77%. We gave opportunity for people to participate. We said at the time when people participated to not invest unless you take a multi-decade time frame. We're 7 years into that multi-decade story and the family now has 70%.

I think that's a good lead-in to the next question, Peter. This is from John Marston. We are very concerned about the Reece U.S.A. business. Bunnings entered the hardware market in the U.K. and failed. Can Peter Wilson give a more detailed update of how the U.S.A. is currently performing?

Yes. Good question. And look, it's exceptionally different, and we studied the Bunnings experiment, if you like, or the -- into the U.K., and I spend a fair bit of time with John Gillam on that. The U.K. is very different to the U.S. for a start. And if you follow -- you'll follow where the U.S. is going and you'll follow where the U.K. is going, and Europe is going. And the U.S. is powering ahead when it comes to productivity and innovation. And obviously, Europe's got it, and then the U.K. has got its challenges. So very, very different. Our model is -- when we went to the U.S., it was a -- like it was a long-term study. And we always felt that we had a chance because we have a point of difference in what we do. So I'll come back to what I said in the earlier question. It really is a long-term play. It's a large market. You do need scale to compete. We settled along, it's a multi-decade story. We're 7 years in. We definitely have a hiccup now. The market -- the end markets are soft. We've seen cycles before, but we're really committed to the U.S. And I use the analogy on everyone of my earnings calls, for those that have listened. When we bought MORSCO that was in 16 states, the foundational business was called Morrison, which is based in Texas. It's a 100-year-old business and it had a little investment. So my analogy was, what we're doing is like renovating a 100-year-old house. So we're restumping, we're rewiring, we're replumbing, we're reroofing. So we're building capabilities to start with. We're 7 years in. And we're doing that renovation whilst living in it. So if anyone's done a renovation of an old house and you have to live in it, you know how hard that is. So that's it. It's a multi-decade story. And what I would say is that success is not a straight line. Success is not guaranteed as well. We've definitely got a hiccup. Part of it's cyclical, part of it's competition. And we are still 100% committed to the U.S. And I think that's evidenced by what Sash said at the quarterly update when we announced how many stores we've opened for the quarter.

The next question is from Mr. Stephen Mayne. Will a copy of the AGM webcast be made available on your website for the benefit of a shareholder unable to watch live? Also, why don't you publish recordings of earning calls online? And why do you refuse to put a copy of the Reece constitution on your website? As an ASX 100 company, I'm puzzled by all this unnecessary secrecy. What other ASX 100 company refuses to publish its constitution online?

Thanks, Stephen, for the question. And yes, look, we've said this, and you know this because you've been to quite a few before. I mean we do it The Reece Way. It is unique. We do things a little bit differently. And we've got some -- we've got 2 key values out of The Reece Way. And 1 of it is keeping it simple and 1 of it is be humble. And we do this to keep it simple, and we also do it to be humble, and also we are doing it The Reece Way, which creates a little bit of mystery. So that's the reason we do it, and we plan on keeping on doing it that way. So thanks, Stephen.

The next question is also from Stephen Mayne. When disclosing the outcome of voting on all resolutions today, please advise the ASX how many of our 9,278 shareholders voted for and against each item similar to with the scheme of an arrangement. This will provide a better gauge of retail shareholder sentiment on all resolutions beyond the dominating Reece family on director elections and the institutional investors on remuneration matters. Along with insight on -- into the chronically low retail shareholder participation rate, which has plunged to below 3% since the move away from paper after COVID. Should I keep going?

I'll just answer that. Well, thanks, Stephen, for that question. And look, again, keeping to the way of keeping it simple. We share the proxy votes through the meeting. So I think we're being transparent. We've always done that. We're following ASX guidelines there. So I don't see a problem with what we're doing there. And on the second part. I mean, it all comes back to the unique nature of Reece. I mean our family controls 70%. There are a small minority. And we -- that may explain why there has been a reduction in the minority voting. But I actually don't know that answer, but that's the -- the first answer is the main one, I guess.

Okay. We'll go on to the next question from Mr. Brian Binger. Do you see any way for the share price to get back above $20 in the medium term? Was the expansion into the U.S. the catalyst for the Big 4?

Good question. And look, what I would say on this when it comes to the share price, we 100% focused on what we can control, and we definitely cannot control the share price. There's a lot of other factors that go into that. And no one can control the market, no one can control market sentiment. And -- what we are focusing on is executing our long-term strategy to the best of our ability. And as I've said earlier, multiple times, we are a cyclical business. We are right now in that period where the end markets are soft. The U.S. housing market, which we have a big exposure to is described as frozen because the 30-year mortgage rate really hasn't dropped to impact demand. So we are 100% focused on our long-term strategy. Next question.

The next question is from Mr. Stephen Mayne. What sort of access does our 84-year old former Executive Chair and Founder, Alan Wilson, get to Board papers. Now he has the title Chairman Emeritus. Does he get sent the Board papers? Does he attend the meetings? Will he interview candidates for the role of Lead Independent Director? And was he aware of the buyback proposal before it was announced to the wider market. I'll stop there because there's a follow-up question.

There's a lot of questions there, Stephen. Look, the role of Chairman Emeritus is a new role, and it's a respectful role because in a way, you know, Stephen, because you used to come to our AGMs in 2010, and you had quite a few battles with my dad. It's a respectful role, and it's a role which I've said to him that he can play to his strengths of being the -- almost a custodian of the culture that people love him, so he visits branches. He can float in and float out to whatever he likes. So he is an observer at the Board meeting. He doesn't come to ARC or REM because that does not interest him. He will go and visit -- went overseas, he's actually had a trip to the U.S. and it's always good to get his perspective. He's had a trip to Germany on a buying fair, which he loves doing. And yes, I think he's well loved in the play, Stephen, and he has the right to do whatever he wants.

The next part of Stephen's question is, well done for embracing annual director elections, but why isn't Executive Chair, Peter Wilson, putting himself up rather than using the Corporations Law exemption made available for one executive each year. Give -- CEO, Sasha Nikolic -- but Sasha is our Group President, a break from elections and put Peter Wilson up each year, please.

Stephen, good question again. And look, there's nothing sinister in this part. It's more procedural. So -- and I'm totally open to go into doing it next year, we can swap it out. It's not actually going to make any difference, Stephen. So 100% open, it's purely procedural and there's nothing to read into it.

The next question is from Janet Summerville. Will you appoint independent directors and will the share price move? It is a bad look when your management gets paid for poor performance when the share price plummeted. Please comment.

A good question. So the big priority for us, and we said this in the presentation is we are looking for a lead independent director. And so that's my priority over the next 6 to 12 months. I've met quite a lot of people. We are going to take our time. And we're certainly looking for someone who can fit the culture and can add capabilities. And I mentioned earlier what they were future-facing capabilities, ideally some U.S. experience, ideally logistics, ideally tech. And ideally, a recent CEO, so -- someone who's played on the field who understands what it's like to run one of a big ASX company. So whether we can, I mean, we had that sort of formula with Ross. He had to step away. So I think that will go a long way. So we're in the middle of a transition. I've only been in the role 12 months. There's a reset happening. And like everything these things take time. And sometimes you don't get it right, sometimes you do. When you get it wrong, you got to -- you just got to pivot and so you get it right.

There's no further questions.

Okay. No more?

No further questions.

Okay. As there are no further questions, we will close the meeting. Voting will close in 5 minutes and the results will be released on the ASX later today. Thank you for attending.