Regeneron Pharmaceuticals, Inc. (REGN) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Welcome to the Regeneron and Sanofi joint conference call announcing their expanded collaboration to include next-generation type 2 medicines. My name is Michelle, and I'll be your operator for today's call. [Operator Instructions] Please note, this call is being recorded. I would like to turn the call over to Ryan Crowe, Senior Vice President, Investor Relations, Regeneron. You may begin.

Thank you, Michelle. Good morning, good afternoon and good evening to everyone listening around the world. Thank you for joining today's call to announce the expansion of the collaboration between Regeneron and Sanofi. We have members from the management teams from both Regeneron and Sanofi here today. But before we get started with introductions and our meeting agenda, both companies will now read their forward-looking statements. For Regeneron investors, I would like to remind you that remarks made on today's call may include forward-looking statements about Regeneron. Such statements may include, but are not limited to those related to Regeneron and its products and business, financial forecast and guidance, development programs and related anticipated milestones, collaborations, finances, regulatory matters, payer coverage and reimbursement, changes to drug pricing regulations and requirements and our drug pricing strategy, intellectual property, pending litigation and other proceedings and competition. Each forward-looking statement is subject to risks and uncertainties that could cause actual results and events to differ materially from those projected in that statement. A more complete description of these and other material risks can be found in Regeneron's filings with the United States Securities and Exchange Commission, including its Form 10-Q for the quarter ended June 30, 2026. Regeneron does not undertake any obligation to update any forward-looking statements, whether as a result of new information, future events or otherwise. Regarding Sanofi's forward-looking statement, please refer to the language on the slide.

For Sanofi's investors, we would like to remind you that information presented in this call contains forward-looking statements, which are subject to substantial risks and uncertainties that may cause actual results to differ materially. We encourage you to read the disclaimer in the presentation, and we also refer you to our Form 20-F on file with the U.S. SEC and our French universal registration document. Let me turn the call over to Ryan.

Thank you, François. Now moving to today's speakers and our agenda. Joining me on today's call are Dr. Leonard Schleifer, Regeneron's Co-Founder and Board Co-Chair, President and Chief Executive Officer; Dr. Belén Garijo, Sanofi's Chief Executive Officer; Dr. George Yancopoulos, Regeneron's Co-Founder, Board Co-Chair, President, Chief Scientific Officer; and perhaps most pertinent for this call, the visionary and principal inventor and developer of Dupixent as well as for the technologies that have delivered not only Dupixent, but all of the new assets being added to the alliance today. And finally, we also have François Roger, Executive Vice President, Chief Financial Officer at Sanofi. For the presentation today, Len and Belén will begin with a high-level overview of the deal and strategic rationale, highlight the productivity of the Regeneron-Sanofi collaboration over the past 2 decades as well as how the alliance intends to leverage the R&D engine and commercial platform that companies have jointly built over the years. Then George will discuss the antibodies that the companies will now jointly develop as well as their development time lines. Finally, François will review the key financial and operational terms for the transaction. After prepared remarks conclude, the remaining time will be available for Q&A. Additional members of the management teams from both Regeneron and Sanofi will also be made available to answer questions at that time. With that, let me turn the call over to Len and Belén to begin today's discussion presentation.

Thank you, Ryan, and thanks to everyone for joining our call today. It's an exciting day for Regeneron and Sanofi as we extend our highly successful collaboration by adding differentiated assets that have the potential to address type 2 inflammatory diseases. For more than 2 decades, our alliance with Sanofi has been one of the most productive collaborations in the history of the biopharmaceutical industry. Together, we have developed and commercialized Dupixent, which we define what was possible for the treatment of type 2 inflammatory diseases. Like any long-standing partnership, our journey has not been without challenges, but we have worked through them and are now focused on the renewed momentum of our alliance and the opportunities ahead. Today, we are opening a new chapter. Our agreement extends our shared leadership well beyond Dupixent. Regeneron is contributing 4 fully human, next-generation, long-acting antibodies. The lead candidate targets IL-13 and is currently in the clinic for atopic dermatitis. Regeneron is also contributing 3 preclinical candidates, including an IL-4, IL-13 bispecific as well as antibodies to the IL-4 receptor alpha and interleukin 4. These are also long acting. George will provide more details on these opportunities later in his presentation. Sanofi in turn is contributing an option for lunsekimig, their IL-13 TSLP Nanobody to potentially be added to the alliance at Regeneron's discretion, pending Phase II results in chronic obstructive pulmonary disease. Together, we are combining both companies' development capabilities to bring forward this next wave of innovation for type 2 inflammatory diseases. Assuming successful development and regulatory approval, we will launch these medicines by leveraging our jointly built global commercial platform that currently serves more than 1.5 million Dupixent patients worldwide. The deal construct is also deliberately simple and aligns our shared motivations, to advance the standard of care for type 2 inflammatory diseases. Regeneron and Sanofi will equally share development and commercialization costs, while splitting any global profits 50-50. In addition, Regeneron will receive a $1 billion upfront payment from Sanofi, along with the opportunity to earn up to $7 billion in additional milestone payments upon the achievement of specified development, regulatory and commercial milestones. Moving to Slide 7. Together, Regeneron and Sanofi have built something remarkable. What started nearly 20 years ago as a modest collaboration combining Regeneron's antibody platform with Sanofi's global development and commercial reach has become one of the most predictive alliances in our industry. We now look forward to the next decade and beyond, building upon the success of Dupixent with the ambition to maintain our long-standing leadership within immunology. Briefly to Dupixent, the standard of care for type 2 inflammatory diseases, which is now one of the most widely used antibody medicines in the world. Invented at Regeneron by George Yancopoulos and developed by George and his team in collaboration with Sanofi. Based on second quarter 2026 global net sales of EUR 5.2 billion, as recorded by Sanofi, Dupixent is now annualizing above EUR 20 billion across 9 indications. In the U.S., Dupixent is the #1 biologic prescribed by dermatologists, pulmonologists, allergists and ENTs, and leads in total prescription share in 8 of its 9 approved indications. As we look to the next generation of type 2 medicines, extending the alliance beyond Dupixent is about more than simply adding new antibodies. It is about pairing this next-generation assets with a proven global development platform and the sophisticated commercial engine that has already established leadership in type 2 inflammation and is well positioned to sustain that leadership into the future. Let me turn the call over now to Belén to further discuss how we will build on our strong commercial position in immunology.

Thank you, Len, and hello, everyone. I am super excited with our announcement today since this is an important strategic step forward for both companies as we aim to sustain leadership in atopic dermatitis with a novel long-acting IL-13 antibody as well as the next-generation pipeline candidates. And let me tell you why we are so excited with the journey ahead. First of all, it's the market potential. While advanced therapy penetration has significantly grown over the last few years, [ sense ], in large part to Dupixent, only about 20% of eligible U.S. patients are being treated on advanced therapy today. There are many opportunities for growth, and we expect the market to nearly double over the next 5 years. Despite the very successful development and commercialization of Dupixent, there is still a need for meaningfully longer dosing intervals without compromising efficacy or safety, and this is what we intend to address with our novel long-acting IL-13. And we see an attractive opportunity here as we will leverage our established commercial footprint, the prescriber relationships that we have developed over many years as well as the patient support infrastructure to accelerate our next generation of Alliance products. Moving into Slide #10. Let's take a closer look at the atopic dermatitis market. AD is a large market with more than 2.5 million patients suffering from moderate to severe atopic dermatitis in the U.S. alone. We are projecting the U.S. market reaching approximately $20 billion in sales by 2032 and to continue to increase thereafter with advanced therapy penetration exceeding 50% by 2040, consistent with what we have seen in other mature immunological diseases such as rheumatoid arthritis or Crohn disease. AD is not a saturated market. It's a market in early stages of growth with a large untreated population and a significant growth trajectory ahead. Yet, there is a clear unmet need around treatment burden. For chronic conditions, this is the opportunity our long-acting IL-13 program is designed to capture, superior dosing convenience without compromising efficacy or safety. Let me now further elaborate on Slide #11, how we will continue to build on our successful development and commercial platforms honing in on each partner's strength. On R&D, Regeneron brings a pioneering highly innovative antibody discovery platform. We will also leverage our leading immunology and atopic dermatitis development expertise across both companies. We have built deep and trusted relationship with health care providers across dermatology, allergy and pulmonology, just to name a few. We operate a comprehensive patient services platform and have an industry-leading global supply and device capability that is serving patients across more than 60 countries. Our long-standing relationship with payers and our strong market access capabilities globally will serve as a competitive advantage and further support the acceleration of our next-generation medicines as part of this highly successful alliance. Finally, on Slide 12. It is important to keep in mind something that Len already mentioned, is that we have strengthened the governance of our expanded alliance and simplified the way we plan to operate this to further drive our successful collaboration. On development, Regeneron will hold final decision-making authority, while both partners have aligned financial commitments to support that development. On commercial, Sanofi will continue to have final commercial decision rights, including access and pricing, while Regeneron will now have increased participation in key payer engagements. I'm very pleased with the progress we have made to expand our collaborations with clear roles and clear accountability. This strengthened alliance setup will no doubt better position us to bring these next-generation medicines to patients. And last but not least, mutual trust will be the guiding principle in this extended relationship. Now let me pass it along the call over to George to discuss and build on this next-generation antibodies.

Thanks, Belén. Let's move to the next slide. Before I discuss the new antibodies being added to the alliance, I would like to briefly reflect on the incredible Dupixent development journey that Regeneron and Sanofi have jointly shared over the past decade plus. We used our VelocImmune platform to invent dupilumab, an interleukin-4 receptor alpha blocker, working from the hypothesis that interleukin-4 and interleukin-13 are the key regulators of type 2 inflammation. Over the years, we gathered more and more evidence that all these diseases share disregulation of the same pathway. And in fact, it is the remarkable and consistent efficacy of Dupixent across all these diseases that has definitively proven that IL-4 and IL-13 are the key central and share drivers of all of these interrelated diseases, from atopic dermatitis to asthma, to eosinophilic esophagitis and beyond. Dupixent has indeed proved to be a breakthrough for so many of these patients as I see every day with my own daughter. It took not only great science and technology to bring this remarkable first-in-class and best-in-class drug to so many diseases and to so many patients, but an innovative and creative clinical development effort that broke new ground many times, addressing disease populations that, in many cases, had never been studied before at large scale. To do this, Regeneron and Sanofi joined forces and study by study, patient by patient, indication by indication, delivered a series of positive pivotal trials. Dupixent is now FDA approved for 9 distinct diseases spanning the skin, gut and respiratory systems for patients ranging from infants as young as 6 months to the elderly. And in many of these indications in setting, Dupixent became the first and leading therapeutic. The clinical results across these 9 distinct diseases and age ranges have strongly validated the key central role of IL-4 and IL-13 in the underlying type 2 inflammation driving all these diseases. We will continue to apply these learnings and insights to design the next generation of medicines. On Slide 15, you can see the 4 molecules Regeneron is contributing to the expanded alliances. All are fully human antibodies, naturally derived using the same VelocImmune technology that delivered Dupixent and more than a dozen other approved antibodies, and all are highly and specifically selected to meet the goal of increasing patient convenience by dramatically extending dosing [ intervals ] for type 2 diseases. All programs are in expedited development path. Our long-acting IL-13 antibody is already in the clinic, where we have already confirmed its remarkable long-lived pharmacokinetic properties, and it is now being tested in atopic dermatitis patients, with registrational studies on track to begin in late 2027 or early 2028. Unlike Dupixent, our antibody to IL-13 is a ligand blocker with a substantially prolonged half-life with a target dosing interval of at least every 3 to 6 months. Our proprietary [ VelocImmune ] technology enabled us to invent the only fully human naturally derived non-heavily engineered IL-13 antibody with a naturally strong target affinity and a favorable pharmacokinetic profile that supports an extended dosing interval, positioning it to be potentially best-in-class. The 3 other programs are expected to be clinic ready next year. The long-acting IL-4 by IL-13 bispecific blocks both cytokines, and we believe it can produce a therapeutic effect similar to Dupixent in diseases requiring blockade of both. This bispecific was also uniquely enabled by our proprietary VelocImmune technology. This common approach resulting in shared biopharmaceutical property greatly accelerates development of clinical development of this bispecific as well as of all of our related assets. The IL-4 receptor antibody blocks the same target as Dupixent, but is expected to have a significantly longer dosing inflow. The antibody to IL-4 binds the ligands, and they have distinct applications with extended dosing opportunities as well. By targeting the IL-4 and IL-13 pathways at both the ligand and receptor levels and across monotherapy and combination approaches, we are building a highly versatile portfolio, providing flexibility to select the right molecule for the right disease while creating multiple opportunities for future clinical development and commercialization. And all were invented with the same VelocImmune platform, which we believe has proven that it produces the world's best fully human antibodies with the best biopharmaceutical properties. Moving to the next slide. With these next-generation programs, we are building on the successful development model that Regeneron and Sanofi have built over the years. By combining our complementary capabilities and deep expertise in type 2 inflammatory diseases, we intend to accelerate clinical development to potentially bring new treatment options to patients in the coming years. Importantly, these programs will advance on parallel tracks. Learnings from each program will inform the others, allowing us to apply insights across these programs as data emerge. Moreover, Regeneron and Sanofi also bring a distinct advantage with our vast clinical experience and success that led to 9 approved Dupixent indications across multiple age groups from infants and beyond. Our deep experience with these diseases, clinical endpoints, regulators and investigator networks gives us a meaningful advantage in designing and executing these programs efficiently. Let me now turn the call over to François to review financial terms for the transaction. François?

Thank you, George, and hello, everyone. Moving to Slide 18. Let me share with you the main financial terms of this transaction. Sanofi may pay up to $8 billion of total consideration to Regeneron. That amount includes an upfront payment of $1 billion upon signing as well as a certain number of milestone payments linked to development, regulatory and commercial achievements. The financial terms of this agreement reflects a genuine partnership of equals. Both R&D costs and global profits will be shared 50-50 between Regeneron and Sanofi for the new Alliance medicines. This means that there will not be any R&D development balance for the new antibodies since the R&D cost will be equally financed by both partners as they are incurred over time. That symmetry of the economics reflect a balanced partnership where both companies have aligned incentives around commercial success. Net sales will continue to be recorded as per our existing reporting practice, meaning that Sanofi will record net sales. The transaction will be reflected in both Regeneron and Sanofi fourth quarter 2026 financials. Let me add one final important comment about the prior agreement that covers Dupixent. The term of these original agreements remain unchanged, including the Dupixent for future [indiscernible]. Let me now hand over back to Belén and Len for their formal -- final remarks.

Thank you, François. Before I turn it over to Belén, let me offer just a few brief closing thoughts. We are excited about the future of Regeneron's strengthened alliance with Sanofi. First, it adds 4 Regeneron-invented next-generation antibodies to the alliance that is developed and commercialized Dupixent. It also establishes a simple aligned framework for sharing risk and reward. Global profits will be split 50-50, with an additional -- with additional payments tied to development, regulatory and commercial milestones. In summary, I am confident that this strengthened alliance gives our next-generation programs the best opportunity to move rapidly through development, reach patients around the world, extend our leadership in type 2 inflammatory diseases for years to come. Let me now pass it along to Belén for a few additional closing remarks.

Len, thank you very much. I'm equally pleased and enthusiastic about the expanded alliance and the opportunities that we will be able to create together. This agreement brings a stronger and more durable framework for our alliance, clearer governance, greater transparency, and the resolution of the litigation between our companies. It allows both organizations to move forward together and focus fully on advances, the science and importantly, delivering for patients. Finally, this extended alliance positions both companies to sustain our leadership in immunology, capitalizing on Regeneron's next generation science with the global development and commercial platform that we have built together over the years for Dupixent. And in relation to this, we have a very solid foundation to bring these potential new medicines to patients. This is also a first step into the transformation of Sanofi, and we are excited about the opportunities that lie ahead. We look forward to seeing the progress in the months and years ahead. And with this, I would like to turn the call back to Ryan to begin the question-and-answer session. Ryan?

Thank you, Belén. This concludes our prepared remarks. We will now open the call for Q&A. Before we go to our first question, let me first introduce additional members of the Regeneron and Sanofi management teams that will also be available to answer questions. From Regeneron, joining Len and George are Marion McCourt, Executive Vice President, Commercial; Chris Fenimore, Executive Vice President, Finance and Chief Financial Officer; and Joseph LaRosa, Executive Vice President, General Counsel and Corporate Secretary. And from Sanofi, joining Belén and François are Manuela Buxo, Executive Vice President, Head of Specialty Care; Paulo Fontoura, Executive Vice President, Head of Research and Development; and Jamie Haney, Executive Vice President, General Counsel. To ensure we are able to address as many questions as possible, we will answer one question from each caller before moving to the next. We also ask that you limit your questions only to the scope of the content covered in today's call. Michelle, can we please go to the first question?

Our first question comes from Evan Seigerman with BMO Capital Markets.

Congrats on the updated partnership. So a question for the Regeneron management team. So you clearly have a lot of cash on your balance sheet and adding $1 billion more only adds more to that. Why did you kind of accept the $1 billion upfront to kind of restructure this? Was there anything else that you could have done potentially to strengthen your position? I want further color on that.

Yes. Thanks for the question, Evan. Look, we do have a lot of money on the balance sheet. I'd like to say, because we're lucky to have George's genius inventing our molecules so we don't have to throw out money on poor business development discussions. But we're always open minded. And as far as the transaction with Sanofi, it was just a matter of creating a fair relationship, and that's what the payment was intended to be part of.

Our next question comes from Luisa Hector with Berenberg.

Congratulations. So my question is really on the sort of overlap in the mechanisms versus Dupixent and whether you considered other mechanisms, perhaps any thoughts on trispecifics, and whether there was any attempt to add external assets as you were renegotiating? Or is this, essentially, you're tied to the original mechanism from Dupi and therefore, that's the reason for that be persisting all the way through?

Well, we have done an enormous amount of science, biology, human genetics based on our data, our proprietary data set involving millions of humans that have been sequenced and characterized with multiomics and for their GHRs and EHRs and medical records. And I think the overwhelming data demonstrates the critical central roles for IL-4 and IL-13 in all of these type 2 diseases. And the evidence suggests that right now, there are not other pathways that are strongly driving or can supplement the remarkable efficacy and safety profile that we've seen with Dupixent. So our goal was to build on what we've learned, but to create molecules that create and give more benefit to patients, particularly by maintaining the efficacy and safety by providing more convenience. By creating all of these molecules using the same format that doesn't depend on human engineering that invariably results in compromising the biopharmaceutical properties of molecules, increasing propensities for antidrug antibodies and creating all sorts of other problems. By using the same uniform platform, but by creating agents that deliver much longer action, we think we really have an opportunity here to change the treatment landscape for -- already the diseases we've identified as well as more potentially. So I guess the bottom line is all the science suggests, and we're the ones who delivered it that these are the central drivers. Everything else in the history of the science here does not support that adding other mechanisms is going to further enhance the efficacy without also hampering the safety profile. Let me remind you. The safety profile of addressing this mechanism through Dupixent is really essentially unprecedented. Unlike almost any other biologics, we're not causing immunosuppression. We're actually, if anything, benefiting and correcting immune deficiencies or distractions that are seen in these patients. And so the science really supports exactly what we're doing. And we created the science. So we know it best.

As far as adding any outside molecules, I think the scientists feel that it makes sense, we, of course, are able to consider that.

Our next question comes from Tyler Van Buren with TD Cowen.

This is Nick on for Tyler. Congrats on the deal. $7 billion is a significant amount of downstream milestones, but I'm curious about the breakdown of the milestones over time because a significant portion of those be near term? Just a rough idea on timing for some of these would be great.

Yes. Those milestones are spread out over development approvals, sales. I'm not going to go through all of them. The most near term we'll mention is start of Phase III, that will be the first $1 billion milestone. François, anything to add?

Nothing to add. I think that you got access to the details of the milestone is very transparent anyway, but I agree with what Len has said.

Our next question comes from [ Victor Flock ] with BNP Paribas.

My question is -- [ Victor Flock ] from BNP Paribas on behalf of Peter Verdult. On lunsekimig, actually, it would be very nice if I can get Regeneron and Sanofi to comment on that. But so first, for Regeneron. I was just wondering why was lunsekimig not enter into collaboration at this stage given the Phase II data that we've seen? And secondly, for Sanofi management, what are the development plans for lunsekimig in asthma and CRS moving forward?

I think we were very sensitive as an alliance not to create situations where things -- where we'll be competing with each other on our own additional assets outside of the alliance. The molecule -- TSLP IL-13 bispecific or dual body tech [indiscernible] that referred to is in Phase III, and it does address one of the targets in the alliance. So it is -- there is an option for us to bring it into the alliance if the data suggests it's worth moving forward.

And just to build on -- this is Manuela, Victor. Just to build on Len's point, we felt that in the interest of the partnership and with the COPD program being the one that is already in Phase III and the most advanced, to give an option to Regeneron to bring that into the partnership makes a lot of sense. And then for other programs, we will wait until we see the COPD data and then decide whether we continue for other indications as well, but that will be a joint decision further down the road when we have more data. But we're excited about that potential, and we'll make that decision when we see the Phase III.

Our next question comes from Brian Abrahams with RBC Capital Markets.

This is Kevin on for Brian. I just wanted to ask maybe if you can comment -- for Regeneron management team, if you can comment on the kinds of targets that the agreement covers. I know you mentioned the IL-4 13 pathway. But if you can comment perhaps on whether any upstream or downstream targets to the cytokine receptor interaction itself could perhaps make sense, should any encouraging data be seen along the way?

Yes. We certainly can look beyond what the Alliance is now focused on, but I think as George eloquently said, focusing on IL-13, IL-4 or the IL-4 receptor is where our initial efforts will be. We will, of course, look at opportunities that could be complementary, downstream, upstream or left stream, right stream. But right now, we're focused for the reasons George said.

Well, if you're talking about targets, upstream or downstream in the same pathway, for example, a STAT6 or so forth. I think what we have to understand is that -- we find those types of targets interesting and exciting. But they are not going to be delivering any better efficacy than blocking the actual target molecules themselves. And of course, there's always going to be safety concerned with new modalities of action. And I think that what we have to consider when we consider potentially bringing in or discussing those sorts of approaches, in terms of -- really in terms of what's in the patient's interest, the medical health care systems interest and so forth and what is really more convenient, a twice-a-year subcutaneous injection or having to remember to take a daily pill. If, and it's a long way if, if it could possibly even be competitive in terms of both efficacy and safety. So of course, we're thinking about all these things and so forth. But it's not as if we're talking about new targets that are going to somehow enhance efficacy and safety here. We're talking about alternative ways to somehow treat something that is now so elegantly and beautifully and safely and effectively treated with the existing approaches. But now with these new approaches that may enable a twice a year or even less intensive dosing interval, it's hard for me to imagine convenience regimens that are going to be able to compete against, I think, what we may have to offer going forward.

I should just add that while we're not at the moment thinking about new mechanisms, we do have some really interesting ideas about new indications and new approaches using the same molecules. We'll have more to say about that in the future.

Our next question comes from Florent Cespedes with ODDO BHF.

Florent Cespedes from ODDO BHF. A quick one on the long-acting IL-4 combination. Maybe -- I know it's early days, but could you share with us what you have in mind in terms of potential targets and diseases with this product?

Well, as we all know and as our science has demonstrated, that out of the 9 diseases that we're already approved for, some of them might only need blockade of one ligand or another, while other ones require for optimal efficacy and safety blockade of both ligands. We have now put ourselves in the alliance in a position, as we outlined, to really specifically select and pick and put into the right position, the right reagents for the right diseases. But because they're all generated from exactly the same platform, sharing very similar biopharmaceutical properties. In fact, they all share extensive sequence identity amongst themselves and so forth. This will greatly expedite clinical development programs when you're dealing with more molecules that can be chosen and picked correctly for the right setting and the right indication that, that in many other ways, are very similar biopharmaceutically, allowing us to really learn from one and apply to the other. I also want to add to what Len said in terms of the playbook that everybody else is following. Everybody else is essentially following the playbook that we've been writing together with Sanofi over the last 10 to 15 years. They're just trying to do what we've already done. As Len said, we wrote that playbook, and we have a lot of ideas about how we can rewrite the playbook going forward, particularly by having these very unique and special assets from which we can specifically pick and choose for the right setting and the right indication. So expect a lot more innovation going forward in this field from Regeneron and Sanofi.

Our next question comes from Akash Tewari with Jefferies.

I think we're going to get -- we already saw some data with [ zumi ] in asthma, where we did see some pretty robust pheno reduction. And I think in the next couple of years, we're going to get asthma data with just a long-acting IL-13. Let's say that looks in line with what we've seen with Dupixent. How does that change your team's view in terms of prioritizing these 4 assets if it becomes a bit more clear that IL-13 alone would be sufficient in a lot of these Dupixent-like indications? And just for the Sanofi team. The confidence for the bispecific going into COPD given we've seen strong atopic dermatitis data from the Pfizer tri-specific this morning, and we didn't necessarily see the same signal with your drug.