Seeing Machines Limited (M2Z.F) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Good morning, ladies and gentlemen. Welcome to the Seeing Machines Limited Full Year 2021 Results Investor Presentation. [Operator Instructions] The company may not be in a position to answer every question received during the meeting today. However, the company review all questions submitted and publish responses where it appropriate to do so. These will be available via Investor Meet company dashboard and you'll be notified once they're ready for your review. I'd also like to remind you this presentation is being recorded. Before we begin, I'd like to submit the following poll. I'd now like to hand you over to Paul McGlone, CEO; Naomi Rule, CFO; and Kate Hill, Nonexec Chair. Good morning, Kate.

Good morning and thank you. Thanks, everyone, for joining us at our second Investor Meet company event to present our financial year 2021 results. We're delighted to see so many interesting people on the line, and I'm joined today by Paul McGlone and Naomi Rule, our CEO and CFO. While the momentum is continuing for Seeing Machines and on behalf of the Board, I can say we are really pleased with the progress that the business has made over the past couple of years. Driver monitoring system technology has become fundamental to safety across the world, much like the seatbelts and airbags that are now so familiar to us and were buoyed by the continued regulatory momentum that is underpinning a staggering increase in demand across automotive, but also in the aftermarket and aviation sectors. Management have done an excellent job of laying out a strategy that supports growth by ensuring that we maintain our leadership position in terms of technology and future development, but also in the way that technology is deployed in cars, commercial vehicles, simulators and I'm sure eventually, in aircraft. Paul and the team have worked meticulously to lay out our path to success. And while results can seem far away, we are starting to see that strategic thinking and hard work pay off. Seeing Machines is working with many of the world's biggest transport brands across every sector. And that in itself is a testament to our technology, but also to the reputation of the company and of our people. The successful placing early this week will ensure that we can deliver on our strategy as demand ramps and deliverables, too. But we are delighted -- and we are delighted to have a new cornerstone investor in Magna International, a leading automotive supplier, who will, I'm sure, be a great partner for our company. Also, it's very gratifying to see a number of our existing institutional and private investors who participated in this recent round. And of course, we also welcome some new investors to the register. Finally, I would like to thank all of our investors, whether you're new to the company or whether you've been with us for many years, for your support. This business does require patience, and we look forward to sharing good news as we are able to, that demonstrates that the wait is starting to pay off. Seeing Machines is well and truly entrenched as a leading DMS company. And I would like to pay tribute to Paul and the management team for the way they have steered the company and positioned it well to take advantage of the opportunities before us. So thank you again, and I'll now hand over to Paul, who's going to take us through the financial results.

Well, thanks very much, Kate. Okay. Thanks for joining. Just a bit of a summary, which frankly is old news. We provided this way back in July. But I think it's important for us to touch base here before we go into what's actually going on underneath these numbers. So for the last financial year, revenue up 18%, $47.2 million. With underlying growth, if we look at constant currency, 30%. And given the environmental backdrop or context, we are quite pleased with this outcome. And I think many companies, whether they're in technology or otherwise, would be pleased with an underlying growth rate at that level. Cash remains strong through to 30 June at just over $47 million. And an important metric in our business overall and one that is growing, is the annual recurring revenue driven from our fleet business. So an increase of 23% on the previous year at $17.2 million. So we're quite pleased with the headline numbers for the year that's -- the year that ended 30 June. Let's just go into a little more of the running history. I think this is important context also to demonstrate. We're not just talking about growth for last year. If we look at our business over the last 5 years, trend-wise, we're quite pleased that the momentum is all heading in the right direction. I mean clearly, the aftermarket business is the big revenue generator. And I think anyone that's been in register for several years, would be well aware of the problems that we had back in 2018, 2019 with that business unit and the product. All of those issues are well behind us. And you can see that in the underlying growth rate, demand for this product is very, very strong, and we expect it to continue to grow at this rate for some time to come. On the OEM side, and this is the part of the business that's currently being affected by the very positive tailwinds driving our technology into passenger vehicles, also into aftermarket and aircraft as well, literally every transport segment. But this is really a passenger vehicle story and OEM story. Now when you look at that revenue, it looks pretty flat. And so for a business like ours, that might cause you to conclude that while it's not really going anywhere, well, in those numbers, there are a couple of lumpy parts in terms of last year -- the year just passed and the year prior, where we received some license -- one-off license revenue. But the majority of the balance is what we call NRE, nonrecurring engineering services. Now NRE is the work that we do, and most of you know this very well in the lead up to a car hitting start of production. NRE is a very difficult business to be in. In fact, if that was the business, I'm not sure anybody would be in it. It's very low margin. And the name of the game here is to get to start of production. And what you're going to see in the numbers that we'll go through shortly as we get underneath these headlines, is that, that momentum is now very real. It's no longer a hypothesis. You can triangulate it from this year going forward and get a pretty solid view with some simple arithmetic as to where this business is going. So from a profit point of view, gross profit point of view, you can see that on a normalized basis, we've been increasing year-on-year. And certainly in terms of EBIT, also there's some long-term improvement there as well. So we're really pleased that we're not just running business here, but each of the driving metrics that are important to the sustainability of this business over a longer time frame, are actually heading in the right direction. And that's because we focused on them. So we're quite pleased with that picture. I'll hand over to Naomi now to take us through the financials in more detail, and then I'll come back and explain what's going on underneath.

Okay. Thanks, Paul. So 2021, we could really define it as a year of performance. Now performance in so far as growth in revenue, a reset in our cost base, which means our net margins have improved alongside strengthening of our balance sheet. Revenue for the Group, like Paul just mentioned, increased 18% from -- to $47 million from the prior year and our consolidated performance saw a 61% increase in royalties, 48% increase in hardware and 38% increase in software development or NRE to execute our DMS and Guardian programs. Now increases across all of these major revenue streams is a fantastic result and further confirmation of our growth strategy and trajectory. Now the Group gross margin significantly improved from the prior year because in 2021, we realized lower hardware costs for the aftermarket, increased OEM royalties, which attract very high margins. Now if we just move to our cost management strategies, I'm pleased to confirm that our COGS rate has reduced an average of 24% across our business. The restructure that we announced last year and cost savings initiative out of that, we've realized a total of $10.5 million to date. And while Seeing Machines' net position has improved, the company is now structured for growth. This year, we capitalized $8 million worth of technology development onto our balance sheet, predominantly due to the developments in automotive safety legislation in Europe and the U.S. So that capitalization means that the activities associated with the development of our intellectual property will be recognized as an intangible asset on the balance sheet. And then as the IP is amortized over its useful life, these development costs will then be aligned with the revenues associated with that IP in the same financial year. So if we move across to the right-hand side of the presentation, which looks at our underlying performance, as was highlighted earlier, our 2021 shows an underlying revenue improvement of 30%, which is significant in itself. Now this means that we've initiated a significant increase in revenues from a lower cost base, resulting in an EBIT improvement of 47% if we add back the inactive capitalization or 66% as what's shown on the presentation here. Now if we consider our business unit performance, Aftermarket is now profitable on a stand-alone basis. So Aftermarket itself grew 30% on the prior year, generating $35 million of revenue. Now I'm just going to step into some metrics here that I find quite interesting. 11,000 Guardian units were sold during this year, which represent 44% increase from the prior year and has contributed 55% increase in margin-generating hardware revenue. Connections on the other hand, also increased by 8,000 connection units or 36% during the year and has increased our monitoring revenue by 12%. Now when we close out the end of the financial year, our connected unit backlog was approximately 5,000 units that will be connected in 2022. Now why is this important? So our 31,000 connections, 5,000 backlog units, strong average revenue per year or ARPU, churn of less than 1%, actually results in annual recurring revenue and royalties of $17 million, which is 23% growth from the prior period. Now the majority of that growth is apparent across Asia Pacific and South American regions, which is very much in line with what happened in 2020. However, the key to our strategic plan for 2022 is accelerated growth in the Northern Hemisphere, which Paul will talk to in a bit more detail shortly. So if I jump to OEM, now remember that OEM covers our automotive and aviation businesses. It's very exciting in 2021 because 2021 saw the start of production for 3 OEM programs, delivering 120,000 vehicles and $2.3 million in royalties. We also increased our software development or NRE, which is a lead indicator for OEM and that increased 44% to just under $5 million, with the continuation of our OEM program that is scheduled to hit start of production in calendar year '22. So at 2021 marks the beginning of a transformation for OEM, and we're going to see a continued shift in the revenue mix from software development or NRE to high-margin, high-volume royalties and OEMs start production and more vehicles hit the road. This is going to significantly increase over the next few years, where we will expect to see 30 distinct car models with Seeing Machines' DMS. Now I'll just jump on to the balance sheet now. Our statement of financial position, as we're all aware, is quite heavily influenced by cash and working capital movements. However, with the capitalization of IP, this is going to enhance our balance sheet strength and demonstrate longer-term value that we're generating as an organization. Overall, our working capital increased 38 -- [ 38% ] sorry, to $60 million. And inventory reduced in the final months of the year, but that's in line with increased customer demand. And actual inventory itself, cost decreased in line with previously announced reduction in hardware costs of around 21%. Importantly, we don't hold any debt and the liabilities are reflective of our normal payables and entitlements. If I jump to the right-hand side of the presentation here on the statement of cash flows. Our customer receipts are 11% lower for the year at $38 million, and that's predominantly because our revenues, particularly in the later months of the financial year, have not converted to cash within the reporting cycle. The average monthly cash burn without grant is 18% lower than the prior year of $1.8 million and improving in line with top line revenue growth. If we combine the investment in IP and operating activities, the average monthly cash burn does increase to an average of $2.5 million. During the financial year, the company issued 440 million new shares, receiving $40 million net proceeds with 2 significant U.S. institutional investors. And then post balance date in the next week actually, the company will issue 277 million new shares, raising approximately AUD 53 million for investment into our technology, sales, channel expansion and delivery capabilities and accelerate our aftermarket growth. But again, Paul will talk about that shortly. One final comment from me to close out the financials, 2021 has been a performance year, and we are very well positioned to take advantage of the opportunities that we see ahead of us. Thanks. Paul?

Thanks, Naomi. Just go to full screen. Here we go. So just a bit of a skate around the whole park here for a minute. In automotive, as Naomi has alluded, the ramp-up of license revenue starts this year. And you'll see that in some graphs that we'll show you in a minute. And we have roughly 30 models that are hitting start of production over this next sort of 18 to 24 months. I think everyone knows where we started back in 2018 with Cadillac 7 OEM wins across the Northern Hemisphere. Really important, of course, is the regulations are unstoppable now. That's a meta trend that won't be stopped. And in fact, the requirements that are coming out of Euro NCAP, we believe will be formalized this calendar year. And we also believe that there will be a strong driver for high-performing camera-based driver monitoring systems. And we're very excited about that, closing out that first set of metrics that will define what good looks like. And as you know, NCAP will continue to develop their metrics over time. And now, of course, in the U.S., legislation is following the same path. So there's no doubt and that the way I think of this is that the automated business is our medium-term value driver -- medium- to long-term value driver, the metrics that underpin that business today, which will go into, are very, very significant. And my view is that the upside value of the automotive business in its own right is very, very significant. Our fleet or aftermarket business, very important. It's the primary revenue driver. It's now profitable in its own, as Naomi has pointed out. It's been validated in many countries by insurers and regulators. We have a very strong global distribution network, and we're starting to introduce a direct sales team as well, but for very targeted enterprise-level customers, like those that we've announced recently, Shell, in particular. So this is a short to medium-term value driver, and it's all about growing the top line and really we're trying to generate as much cash as we can out of this business over the next 3 to 4 years. So I'm also a big fan of the aftermarket business. And it's -- look, it's fair to say that some investors have differing opinions on automotive or OEM versus aftermarket. But one of the important things to always remember is the symbiotic relationship between aftermarket and OEM. The naturalistic data that we derived is really one of the cornerstones of our high performance, which is -- in software, which is one of the key drivers of our market price premium. So quite above and beyond the metrics of this business there is underlying value in here that's very, very strategic. On the mining side, we still enjoy our relationship with Caterpillar, and it continues to generate solid license revenues. We do see this as a repeatable model. And we have alluded to that over the last year or so. I think frankly that the area in which that model will be well-suited is in aviation. It's still a nice business, of course it was very heavily impacted by COVID. That's just no excuse. It's just a reality of last -- it's only just now starting to find its legs. But we box above our weight there. We have very, very large and significant customers. Some we've announced. And I think as everybody knows, the last announcement with L3Harris severely impacted by COVID and then there was a corporate transaction that really shifted that simulation business. So all kinds of things happen, but we're continuing to push forward. I think everybody would have seen that the new Collins collaboration, which they announced at the Dubai Airshow across all of their service lines deploying our technology is a testament to our position in aviation. Now without being too definitive, I mean, my objective would be to try and move towards a license style arrangement, where we can work with over the long term, a party or parties that really have the depth of expertise and capability in this area to be successful. So that's the plan there. Just a little on the regulations, I mentioned them just a second ago, so I won't sort of read it out. But what's going on in the U.S. now is very, very important. It means that the 2 major markets of the world are aligning. I think everybody would have noticed that in addition to the requirements of Euro NCAP, there's a very strong focus on intoxication in the U.S. And intoxication is a form of distraction. And we here, are very confident that as the due dates for that specific technology gets closer and closer, that we'll be well positioned to offer technology that isn't too invasive, can be accepted by customers and manufacturers alike, and continue to leverage the position that we've already set in place in the U.S. So Euro NCAP, this year, they'll put out the specifics on what it will require to get the 5 stars with DMS. And those requirements will continue to advance over coming years. And this is very important because this is a very strong signal that the requirements for more features, whether it be directly related to safety or more on the sort of customer/convenience side, the appetite for more features will continue for a very long time to come. And the reason that's important is because we have a feature-based pricing model, it's akin to a menu and the more features that are required, well, that drives our ASP, our average selling price per unit, and that's a very important ingredient in our overall business model. So I'll just turn to DMS now and just talk about where we think the market is going. So in the black bar, you can see vehicle production. And as we all know, it's been severely impacted by COVID. And if you were in the business of selling cars, that might be a great concern. It's not a great concern for us because we are currently in such a small number of vehicles, a 10 or 20 or whatever percent movement in overall production in a given year, doesn't really move the needle for us in any way, shape or form. And most of our production vehicles that start production are happening in '21, but it really starts to pick up pace by the time we get to '23. So that's not something I'm worried about, and I don't think it's something anyone ought to be too worried about. But this picture is really a third-party analyst view of the world. So this green line is the percent penetration by year of DMS and light vehicles on this scale here, percentages. And then the average shipments worldwide between the 2 researchers, Semicast and ABI. So this is really the starting point for us as we consider addressable market, as we consider market share, this is the anchor that we use to talk with shareholders and to gauge our own performance as we go forward. Now as we know, all forecasts are wrong. But we're using a forecast that are derived by third parties. So we think that's a useful way to go. Does the forecast mean much to us? Possibly not. And I'll come to that in a minute. So just in terms of our OEM business, revenue of $12.1 million, Naomi has already mentioned this, but I'll just recap it here. A 32% CAGR over 5 years, and that's if we take out the one-offs, the large license payments of last year and the year before. Now that's essentially NRE growing at 32%, which means the logic here is that, that obviously leads to cars hitting production. So with 120,000-plus cars fitted with our DMS technology today and around 30 over the next 18 months, this number and this number will dramatically increase. But as pointed out, what's important here is the revenue mix change as we get more license revenues as a percentage of total automotive revenue. That will drive up gross margin considerably, and that is a very, very important metric. In terms of the RFQ pipeline, so it currently stands at AUD 1.1 billion. Now that's -- I'll go into the breakdown of that in a moment. But this is more RFQs than we've seen in our existence, all on our desk at the same time. And most of those RFQs have been quoted or are in the final stages of quoting over coming months. So this business will be awarded, and it will represent the first very obvious step change in volume for our industry. And the raise that we announced yesterday is specifically to enable us to win with this level of RFQs on our desk. And the other thing is we do expect this to continue to increase, this doesn't cover but a fraction of the total market requirement according to that penetration forecast I showed you on the prior page. So before I go into the pipeline in more detail, the revenue mix stories I just wanted to call out by splitting out our revenue in these bars. So the important 2 colors here really are the light blue and the dark blue. And the dark blue represents the license revenue. And of course, we had a significant one-off in both of these years. It was a little larger in the year prior. But that mix change that has now begun, and it will be driven by the 30 models that we're rolling out over the next 18 months plus. You can now see that this is fact. So this is no longer our hypotheses on how good the business could be one day out into the future. We've hit start of production. Production volumes will increase. Our license revenues will roughly double year-on-year from here to 2025 on the back of business that we've already won, bookings that we already have. So that's a very strong metric to observe going forward. And we -- well, we know as these vehicles hit production, that this percentage of license revenue will increase, and that will drive margin and ultimately drive cash. So to the pipeline, the chart -- the first chart with all the multi-colors, this represents the 8 RFQs that we have. Each color represents an OEM. The chart that we're looking at is anchored at start of production. So it doesn't include the NRE component. We're just looking at production volumes as the most important part of the equation. So you can see that this picture here is a very, very steep increase. This is the AUD 1.1 billion. And this black bar in here is the first tranche of an award that we alluded to yesterday, and that verbal award has been given via our new shareholder at Magna International. So we're kicking off this period, this new period, this pivotal period of growth in DMS. And I'll frankly use DMS and OMS interchangeably here, and we've secured -- verbally secured a significant piece of business. And I think that augurs well for us as we explore the balance of these RFQs, which must be awarded over the next quarter or 2. Now if we take that number, and we transpose it to this picture, that aggregate $1.1 billion represents the light blue line on the bottom. And the black bar on top are the RFQs that we have visibility into that are coming next over the course of this year. And of course, we have visibility because we're in constant dialogue with the OEM. Often, we receive a request for information before we receive request for a quote. But the point is this is not just a one-off blip that will come and go. This is the beginning, the first wave of the mass market adoption of DMS. And already, we can see the second wave closely behind and continuing to drive up the potential volume. So this is the main story. This is the reason that we look to raise the money. And the underlying issue here is that on these RFQs, this might be someone had to believe, but those OEMs are requiring roughly an additional 40 features. Now all of those features were on our road map, I'm pleased to say. But we expected them to be required over 2 generations of tenders, not one. So the requirement for more features has been brought forward at the same time as we're seeing this significant increase in volume. So roughly 1/4 of the money that we raised will go into bringing forward the feature development on the 40 features that are required, not hypothesized, but required as part of these 8 RFQs. And so that's a very, very important point for us. Now we -- I've mentioned recently that we will also acquire other niche technologies, and I use the term acquired very broadly. I'm not saying that we're looking at buying businesses. But we are certainly actively exploring opportunities to license specific technologies that enable features that we don't consider noncore or we consider too unique and expensive for us to develop. We propose to bring those into our feature stack through a third party. And we have a range of those underway or either already done or underway or in our plan. And so we're looking to enable this a dramatic increase in our features that drives our future based pricing, the price of ASP, that's further leveraged by the increase in volume. It is the value creator for our automotive business. We're looking to do that in a way that is, I think, quite modest, but differentiates us from what others are doing. We're not spending hundreds of millions acquiring businesses that still require funding. We're focusing specifically on features that are on the statement of work from the OEM, and we make a decision as to whether it's in-house or not. And if not, we'll look to acquire that feature in a far cheaper and far more speedy fashion. And that is our core strategy for this whole sort of feature competition that's going on. I'll turn to Aftermarket. Again, very pleased, $35 million, up 30% revenue. The year-on-year growth is a little higher, almost 32,000 units installed, so 11,000 units last year, up 44% from the year prior. And as Naomi mentioned, a good chunk of those were sold in the last quarter, and in fact, the last 2 months. So our connected units in the line with our hardware sales, but it's catching up and will catch up. So that backlog is also a very important number because we'll see a continued growth in that recurring revenue business over coming months and throughout the course of this year. So pretty pleased with that. The other thing to note here is that as we slightly change the dial in terms of the mix between distributor sales and direct sales, that will naturally, lead to an increase in our average revenue per unit. And frankly, small increases in that mix change has a very important impact on our ARPU. And with the kind of growth rate that we're anticipating going forward, a combination of volume growth plus growth in our revenue per unit, we're quite confident we'll drive a better cash outcome for this business over the next 2 to 3 years. So quite pleased with fleet. And on the same vein, if you just look at the revenue mix, the hardware sales we've had ups and downs in certain years. But I think if we look from this year forward as opposed to the whole 5%, hardware sales are increasing. Obviously, the recurring revenue is directly linked to the hardware sale. You can see that the monitoring revenue is increasing as well. And look, it won't be too long before we're going to see monitoring revenues higher than hardware revenues. And similar to the revenue mix that's going on in auto, we'll then see a margin mix change. And it's the combination of this revenue mix change in fleet and this revenue mix change in auto that gives us a great deal of confidence that we're at a point of this business where the returns over the next couple or 3 years will be very, very strong indeed, certainly compared to the past. So to summarize, over 120,000 vehicles have our tech, which is great. That number is going to rapidly increase and will, in fact, on a license revenue basis, roughly double year-on-year up to '25, as I've mentioned. And that's really important. The underlying pipeline of RFQs, actual real business that will be awarded is very, very significant. And frankly 1 or 2 -- well, it's just 1 additional win actually doubles the book business of this company since our inception. So you can see that the top line growth rate for license revenues will continue way past '25. And in fact, this round of RFQs based on the start of production date will enable us very strong revenue visibility after 2030. And so I think as we come out of this full financial year, and we're now able to triangulate between the increase in license revenue based on production vehicles and the increase in IRE and we can look at that mix change in the same way as we will in fleet I think from the end of this financial year going forward, the outlook will become much, much clearer to all of the investors that aren't in our business. rather than those of you who have been in for quite some time. So that's a very important time frame for us. And of course, aviation continues. We're quite pleased. We're looking for a different model there. But overall, I'd say the journey over the last 2 or 3 years, although challenging at times in terms of the global context, but just also in terms of the complexity of our business, is really starting to show strong momentum in each of the areas that we're focused on. But also in the underlying management of the business. And hopefully, you could see that through the way in which Naomi talked about. Cost management, which is just one metric of many. But it goes to show -- I hope that we're not being frivolous with the money that we're raising. It's been deployed well. And this next round will be deployed to execute the maximum proportion of that AUD 1.1 billion of RFQs that are ahead of us today. So that's the presentation.

Thank you, Paul. Thank you very much for a comprehensive presentation. [Operator Instructions] And Paul, we received a number of pre-submitted questions from investors. And I wanted to start off the Q&A session with those, if I may. And then we'll just go into those questions delivered during the meeting just by clicking on the Q&A tab where appropriate to do so. I'd like to say thank you to all of those who have submitted questions. Just to remind you, due to the number of attendees on today's call, we won't be in a position to respond to every single question during the meeting itself. However, the company is going to review all the questions submitted and we'll publish responses where appropriate to do so. So back to you, please, Paul.

Thanks. Look, I think I certainly know, and I'm sure most shareholders know that our shareholder base is a very inquisitive bunch. So I'd be no surprised to hear that I've received many questions. So some of them I've tried to categorize if they're similar, and I'm not sure if we'll get through them all, but we will answer those that we don't cover in the time available more formally. So in aftermarket, I'll start there. How are we going to take to wrap up the Shell framework agreement? It was actually a lot quicker than many agreements that we work on and it is probably in the order of 3 to 4 months. But the bit that you don't see is that children there shaded their own third-party research with a university on a range of competing products over more than a year. And so they came to their own conclusion. And when they came to that conclusion, it was fairly quick for us to close it out. So that's what's happened there. Let's see what else we got here. Are we being used by telematics companies in actual vehicles? Well, the first is really EROAD out of New Zealand, and they're quite an interesting company. Of course, we've had soft integration with MiX Telematics for some time, and we have co-installed vehicles in all kinds of different places with them. We will continue down this path. And our objective for the next-generation fleet product is for it to be designed to integrate with other telematics platforms. So that's a very important part of our direction going forward. Look, there's a lot of questions in here about targets, forecasts, whether it be for fleet or for auto or for aviation. Of course, we had forecast and pipelines, and that's how we run the business. But we won't be providing guidance. We're going to continue to work through all of the things that we have before us. There's just too much variability. And whatever way I look at it, I think it's -- we're going to end up misleading somebody. By the time we get to the end of this financial year, though, I expect that we'll be in a position to be more confident in the level of variation in our longer-term forecast, and we will rethink that position at that time. But certainly, I have no plans to do that beforehand. But in terms of connections, I mean, we've called out that the fleet business is growing at almost 40%. And I expect that, that growth rate can be sustained over the next few years. So I mean, just pull out calculator and times one by the other, and that should give you a pretty good steer on what that looks like. There are quite a few questions in the corporate area around the valuation of our business, the fact that people think it's undervalued, how should it be valued. There's a lot of questions around what's the potential for consolidation for us to be taken over, would we consider a takeover, would we consider at what price and so on. Of course, look, we don't sit here thinking about at what price we would engage somebody. It's a free market. And everyone in that market has the ability to knock on the door and put forward a price. And on the discussions that we've had in the past, there have been nothing formal enough or good enough to continue with those conversations. Now my objective and the objective of the management team and the Board is to remain independent long enough to deliver what we think is actually potential. And if you look at those last couple of pages around how fleets turn around and what the OEM pipeline looks like today and furthermore, over the course of this next year, I'm certain of the view that there is significantly more value potential ahead of us. It's not really for me to suggest what that valuation is. We're just very focused on doing business, developing software, driving sales and doing all of those things. But if you look at those metrics today as opposed to just one year ago, I think it jumps off the page that there is significant value here, assuming we successfully win and implement those programs. And so that's what we're focused on, rather than imagining what might happen with a suite or we're trying to think through what we're really worth. And I'm not trying to be flippant about that, I'm just saying that's not our area of focus. Let's see. We've got some questions here around moving to the U.S. market. There are some questions around other verticals. So we are exploring options for our listing geography for sure. I think it's only sensible that we ought to do that, particularly if you see some of the valuations that are being achieved in the U.S. So our Board and management have been exploring what it would take in order to be successful, what should we look like, what the key metrics look like. And if you look at the -- I guess, those that have gone before us from AIM to NASDAQ, there's a pretty checked history for those that have just and for most, that's not to say it's -- there are success stories, but it is not a free kick. It's not a free valuation uplift on a NASDAQ side, IPO, the investor market is pretty deep sophisticated owners to cross there. So I think whilst we're looking at the listing geography and we're paying attention to market dynamics, and in the back of our minds, we think that is direction. Again, what's really important to us is that we get our house in order. We win our fair share at least of the RFQs are ahead of us, and to deliver a level of momentum and rent visibility that would give us the sense of security that changing our jurisdiction would be a success. I mean, I'm not really up for parlaying a new market risk on top of a business risk, on top of the technical risk. I mean, I don't see any point in doing that. But it's in our plan, it's only sensible that we talk about it. I imagine we will end up there. But I'd like to see some additional momentum before we flip the switch on that particular transaction. Okay. A couple of questions around market share and targets and the like, and there's some references to analysts that are put out some numbers that are different to the numbers that we talk about, and that's all good and well. And I hope those numbers come true, of course. The -- I think the key difference here is that in taking a long-term view and talking about the long-term market share outcome, I think everybody knows that we've not elected to participate in China. And as I sit here, I'm still very pleased with that decision. The ISPs are far lower already than what they are elsewhere. The competition is already much more intense. So despite the fact that they make a lot of cars from a business point of view, I'm more interested in the other 70% with ASP that's 2x. So that will remain our focus. And on that basis, we think the 30 share is reasonable. Could it be more? Well, yes, it could. And the plans that we have on features, bringing features forward, bringing in new tech to expand our moat, continuing with our differentiation strategy around system, not just software I think all of those things play into the possibility of us increasing share. So that's -- yes, we're not really chasing a share number, we're chasing the maximum position we can get. Yes. Okay. I've talked about the access technology -- also, the extra volume of sales and income, I think I'll address that in some of the charts for auto. There are some questions around DMS and OMS. Does one displace the other? No, it doesn't. I'm actually seeing them both as a linear expansion of in-cabin sensing, if you will, whether it covers the driver at the 2 front seats or all seats. So I'm not concerned at all that I'm thinking about that being a new technology that displaces DMS quite the contrary. I think DMS is the harder technology based on the requirement. So if you're going to be an OMS, I think having a strong position in DMS is mandatory. That's certainly our view. There are some questions around Qualcomm. Of course, they did a big Investor Day a week or 2 ago. Look, we continue to work with Qualcomm, and we're doing things together, and they will be communicated as and when they're ready. It's a big machine, doing big things in a big way. And we have a very, very strong relationship. I'm not really in a position to say from that relationship, this level of revenue will be derived. I mean that's kind of not where we are at yet, but it's very, very strong. Okay. Just looking forward here. Yes. So guidance, I've covered that already. And the quite a few questions about essentially a forecast, whether it be revenue, when can we hit a certain number? I've given the numbers in terms of the pipeline, I've given the growth rate of fleet. I think shareholders can triangulate against that pretty readily. Certainly, I expect the coming analysts to do so. But for me to break that down and make specific forecast at this point in time, it's just sort of not on a plan, but we'll revisit that at the end of the year. So I've got -- I'll switch now to some of the online questions. So tell me more about Shell and Collins. Well, Collins, after several years of working with us, have elected -- have chosen us as the high tracking technology that they'll deploy across their whole service line for their new strategy, which is their aviation mobility strategy. So this is a very significant relationship. But like others in aviation and where I normally get criticism is, what's the dollars, I don't know. And hopefully, we will find out, but you have to start with the big companies that are in the business with a 30-year product life, it's very difficult to jump straight to that question. Shell, on the other hand, we've got 15,000 or 20,000 trucks. But we expect our technology to be required not just in their trucks, but in their suppliers' trucks. So we're seeing demand roll in on the back of that agreement already. So I'm highly hopeful on Shell. There are some questions around the features. Look, there's a long list, fraud identification, smoking identification, phone use identification. There are also additional performance requirements on features that we already have. And the list goes on and on and on. Gender, weight, body mass, facial expression, et cetera, et cetera. Okay. There's a question about truck OEMs. When are we going to see our product? And well, that's just starting to happen actually. So I imagine it's going to take a while as these things do. But it is, in fact, a new conversation that we're engaging in right now. So look, we've got 2 minutes to go. Someone's asked me whether we will be celebrating the sushi or German beer on the contract that we just talked about, which is pretty cheeky. But because we're Australian, I suppose it will be beer and a meat pie perhaps. So I'm not sure that helps you, James, but that's about as much as I can say about it.

Paul, I know we're just coming up to time. I think you've covered off as many questions you can in the allotted time slot. And of course, the company will be able to review all questions submitted today and we'll get those responses published back out on the platform. Paul, just before we redirect the attendees to give you some feedback, if I could just ask you for a closing snapshot to conclude and we redirect them best as we. Paul, if you could start just for a closing snapshot before we redirect the attendees. That would be great. Just a little rough [indiscernible].

Well, look, we're really pleased with the last year. It seems a long time ago. Momentum this year is building very strongly. Hopefully, you can all see by what we presented today that the key metrics that drive value are now evident. And that's certainly how I see them. And that's the, I guess, the key message that I'd like to leave with you today.

That's fantastic. Paul, Naomi and Kate, thank you very much indeed for updating investors today. Could I please ask investors not to close this session and it should be automatically redirected for the opportunity to provide your feedback in order that the management team can better understand your views and expectations. It will only take a few moments to do, and it's greatly valued by the company. On behalf of the management team of Seeing Machines Limited, I would like to thank you for attending today's presentation. That now concludes today's session. Thank you, and good morning.