ServiceNow, Inc. (NOW) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Well, good afternoon, everybody. Thanks for joining this virtual fireside chat with ServiceNow at the 2020 UBS TMT Conference. With us today are Lara Caimi, the Chief Customer and Partner Officer; and I think you all as well know Darren Yip, the Head of IR. In terms of format, we'll keep it to 35, 40 minutes. In terms of questions, happy to take them. You all have access to a question link, which I'll check towards the end of our conversation. Or if you prefer to e-mail me directly at [email protected], I can take them that way. So with that, Lara and Darren, welcome.

Thank you. Happy to be here.

I appreciate it. So Lara, maybe we start with you in your new role. I know you've been at ServiceNow for a little bit in a prior role, but you just moved into the Chief Customer Service and Partner role in July at around the same time that your colleague, Kevin, was tagged to lead the sales effort. So maybe it would be worthwhile to put your move and Kevin's into context. What prompted Bill to make these customer-facing leadership changes now? And in broad strokes, what are the key initiatives that you, in particular, are focused on in your role?

Yes. I mean, I guess, I don't feel like the changes are that dramatic. They were really more of a result of David Schneider's personal decision to retire, not any broader strategic move. He has had an incredible 35-year history in the industry, and he certainly earned the right to begin a new chapter of his career in his life. So I'm very excited. Sad to see him go, but very excited for him. From a sales perspective, Kevin Haverty, who's our Chief Revenue Officer, has actually been with the company for 9 years. And he's really been already doing this role for the last 6 years, leading our sales organization under Dave. And so as you can see from our results, I don't think sales has skipped a beat. And of course, during these past 3 years in ServiceNow, I've served as the Chief Strategy Officer and, in partnership with Kevin, co-architected the company's go-to-market strategy of $10 billion in revenue. So Kevin and I have already worked together quite a bit. I've spent a lot of time in our go-to-market work. So in that way, it's not a huge change as it might appear from the outside. And in this role, as the Chief Customer and Partner Officer, I lead all of our customer success activities, ensuring successful implementations, quick time to value for our customers. And then I also oversee the growth of our strong partner ecosystem, building strong strategic partner relationships and alliances to ultimately get our customers to value. And I believe that a core part of being the enduring enterprise software company of the 21st century, as I think you all heard Bill say, is our vision of defining a new gold standard for what is customer success and customer value at ServiceNow and really for the industry. I think it's clear for us, it's clear for our partners that our customer success is truly our success and that we all want to achieve enduring value for our customers. So in that light, you asked about my priorities in this role, and they're really kind of 4 key areas. First is, of course, force multiplying with our ecosystem. You may have heard earlier in the year, Bill talked about his top priorities. This was one of them. And I believe our ecosystem is completely critical in our goal to becoming the trusted innovator of the C-suite, embedding us in digital transformation conversations with our customer and, of course, to give us global scope and scale. Second priority is to continue to deliver really best-in-class services. Customer success starts during the sales cycle, not after the deal was signed. And so we're really focused on co-sell and co-deliver with our partners. It worked, and it drives a positive outcome for our customers and our partners and, to that end, focusing on both service sales and delivery excellence. And we truly are best at what we do in the ecosystem. We need to retain that expertise to train our customers and partners. And so as a result, we're driving multiproduct implementations down from 18 to 24 months to 9 to 6 months. And for single product approaches, it's really -- it can be a matter of weeks. And so we are really driving a lot of value in that area, and I want to continue to do so. The third area of focus for me is our focus on delivering enduring value to our customers through our Now Value methodology. For me, this is not just a post-sales or a partner effort. It really is cross-functional across the entire company from engineering to sales and then, of course, what we're doing in customer success and support. We all are focused on helping our customers envision the art of the possible with our platform and bringing that to life. And you can see that in what we're seeing with our customers. I know on the last earnings call, we talked about the VA, which is now our largest customer. And that expansion story is really what we're aiming for with customer success. And then my last priority is really more internal. It's about building out a world-class, industry-defining organization that really makes sure that everybody understands that their job is getting our customers to success and not just inside my organization, frankly, but across the company. And then I also have a personal goal of making sure that we're really raising the bar and leading with diversity, inclusion and belonging in our organization.

Got it. Ambitious goals. I like it. And I'd love to ask you, Lara, how has COVID complicated the delivery of this world-class customer support and customer experience to ServiceNow customers? I presume much of the deployment is now being done virtually. That's got to make life a little tougher. So it's intriguing to me that you were able to or hope to drive down the implementation time frames despite those challenges. So can you talk a little bit about how your life has become a little bit complicated post COVID?

Yes. I mean, pre-COVID and frankly, post-COVID, engaging our customers with a world-class go-to-market machine is one of our priorities, and that hasn't changed. Since COVID, we, like everybody, changed to an overnight virtual world, where everything was suddenly done by Zoom. And we've seen our productivity staying high. We talked about seeing our pipeline increase, and we've been successful in closing business with new and existing customers. We have a remote implementation methodology, and we're continuing to see our customers getting quick time to value even during the pandemic. And so I think COVID has created a real inflection point that's requiring every company to dramatically accelerate their move to the cloud. And it's really put pressure under enterprises to innovate faster, reduce costs, improve productivity. And so for us, we have a very prescriptive approach to helping our customers realize value and achieve business outcomes when implementing our products. And that's well beyond implementation. It includes success, support and training services. And what I've seen as part of the pandemic is that the desire to get to value quickly is consistent. And so what I've seen, frankly, because we had already invested in kind of remote methodologies, et cetera, that we're seeing our large multiproduct implementations happening faster, so faster than they were traditionally. Traditionally, it was probably an 18- to 24-month project with a lot of customization. And now we're seeing that happen in 2 to 3 quarters. And that's really driven from digital top-down mandate -- top-down digital transformation mandates. They want to stay within the box. They don't want to overcustomize, et cetera. And so Lloyds Bank is a great example. We had a full ITSM suite deployment across the entire bank in under 3 quarters from sales to go live. The State of Illinois did our full ITSM suite in under 6 months. There's a lot of examples that I could go into here. And then, of course, we also are seeing folks that are focused on really quick time to value in more agile implementation approaches. So instead of doing a full big transformation, they're doing -- they're slicing up the elephant a little bit and looking at individual products. So Humana did our entire HR service delivery suite in under 2 months. Our Safe Workplace application, which we've talked a lot about, that's happening in a number of days. Raymond James did it in 3 days. For Lowe's, they took our -- from ask to deployment, they took the Safe Workplace applications to over 30,000 employees. And so folks can now open cases, take leave, search knowledge base about policies, submit cases, resolve cases, et cetera. And that's incredible time to value at scale, and we're really, really proud of that. So again, we're seeing things move a lot faster. And of course, we're doing that along with the ecosystem. So I mentioned co-sell, co-delivery earlier. We're doing that with our ecosystem to continue to bring them along and and make sure that with our partners, we're delivering that kind of speed to value.

Yes. And I'd love to hear maybe, Lara, a little bit more about how you and Bill, who's obviously got a long history dealing with some of the larger services partners, plan to execute on making those partners that force multiplier you talked about. So maybe you could make that a little bit more tangible. How do you do that? How do you incent KPMG and DXC and Deloitte to scale their ServiceNow practices? And then you have a long tail of smaller boutique services firms that you need to keep engaged as well. So what -- how do you show them love to motivate them to scale their businesses? Do you toggle with the economics with the partners? Maybe you could add sort of 1 or 2 ways that you're trying to pull that off.

Yes. I mean I've learned a lot in the past 4 months or whatever since I've been in this role about the ecosystem. And I'm really excited about the potential. As you know, and certainly, Bill knows, SIs are incredibly important for us. They not only drive 90% of our implementations, but they bring us into conversations that we wouldn't be in on our own, whether that's bringing us into solutions for different industries or just bringing us into new C-suite buyers. And so what I've seen is a real inflection point. I think that we're at -- we've obviously, over the past couple of years, planted a lot of seeds in investing in our relationships with partners. We brought in David Parsons a couple of years ago, who rethought our partner program and how we cover partners, et cetera. And we've really been investing to drive that. And what I've seen is the flywheel really starting to move. And so when I meet with customers or with partners, we are talking about, okay, what's the $1 billion business plan or $2 billion business plan, how they're going to grow their businesses in a meaningful way with ServiceNow. And often, that is about them really leaning into taking us outside of IT in a meaningful way. And so that happens vertically within industry. So for example, Deloitte is a lead launch partner for our banking solution. And Accenture, which I think we -- you've heard, we just announced the business group is really helping us with our telco solution as an example. And what's happening there is we've invested in our -- in leading and building out our own vertical practices, starting with banking and telco. And then we'll move into health care and manufacturing. And being able to have a product as well as folks that like really understand those industries, start -- and having conversations with the partners is really moving the needle to kind of opening the aperture with them. And what happens is, obviously, many of the partners are organized vertically that their client directors are then having conversations about their plays, what they're doing to transform telecom, et cetera. And ServiceNow is built into the fundamental architecture that's delivering in the solutions. And that's a really exciting pivot that I'm seeing that's happening from an industry perspective. And then, of course, we see that horizontally, too, because, of course, these guys are organized in a matrix. And so not only do they have vertical practices, but they have horizontal practices. And so they're leaning in with their -- Deloitte, for example, is a huge partner for us in terms of HR. And we're leaning in with our -- with the customer service practice with many of our partners as well. And so it happens on both dimensions. And they're really starting to pull us into those areas and seeing huge opportunity to add value to customers ultimately and build big businesses around ServiceNow, which, of course, pulls us along as well.

That makes sense. And...

And so...

Yes, go ahead.

No. And I'll just say, like some of this does get formalized in the big announcements that we're making. So you guys heard us announce that business group with Accenture, which ultimately is a pretty significant multiyear partnership that has multimillions of dollars of investment behind it, that has like strong metrics around how we're going to grow together, where we're going to invest, et cetera. And that kind of formalized partnership is what we're driving with all of our major partners. And I'm really seeing a lot of exciting -- it's really top-down support driving the acceleration and growth together.

That makes sense. And Lara, if we think about your prior role when you were a Chief Strategy Officer, I'm guessing that, that may have included a responsibility to advise the leadership and the Board around M&A. I'd love to ask you about that because one of the interesting things about ServiceNow that's very different from most notably Salesforce, as we've all seen, is the absence of M&A over the years. So it's pretty unusual for a software firm your size. And I'd love to ask you, I actually, if you were listening, asked Bill on the broader earnings call question on the 3Q call. But from your perspective, why is that? And wouldn't it make sense actually for ServiceNow to acquire into some of the adjacent workflow automation areas that might help you get there faster?

Yes. No, it's a great question, and it's absolutely something that we thought a lot about. And when I was the Chief Strategy Officer, and frankly, we still continue to have those conversations in the C-suite. And fundamentally, we believe our differentiation -- part of our differentiation is in our single platform, where we have a single code base, single data model, et cetera, that creates an opportunity, we think, to differentially get our customers to value. And that's the big deal. And so we haven't not done M&A. We've done a lot of smaller M&A, which allows us to replatform the technology into our code base and stay that -- stay on that single platform story while we're acquiring key capabilities or importantly, key talent. The Element AI acquisition that we just announced has a huge amount of great data scientists that we acquired in Canada that we're super excited about. And so, obviously, that has played an important role. And I think what we've been able to do by focusing on that platform, those platform capabilities like AI and ML, et cetera, is be able to leverage the innovation across the platform in repeatable ways. And so for example, all of our AI and ML, AI/ML capability is fenced into our pro SKUs, which not only pay off ITSM but also are available in HR, CSM, et cetera. And so there's a lot of exciting reuse, given the way we've architected, and so that's meaningful. But we obviously have thought about big M&A. We've gameboarded, thought about which areas we'd like to go deeper in, et cetera. But ultimately, we're really thoughtful about that. We want to make sure we are leveraging our capital thoughtfully, but also that when we do make a bigger move, that we're really thoughtful about what the integration plan is because at some point, something -- it's just too difficult to maintain that single code base. And so we won't have that anymore. But we need to be really, really thoughtful, so we don't create a Frankenstein kind of scenario where we are putting the burden on our customers to get to value. We want to make sure we integrate in a meaningful way, both from a UI perspective as well as from a back-end perspective that we make it easy for customers. And so that's a key part of it. So it's not that we won't do something bigger. We certainly would at the right price, but there's nothing meaningful on the horizon at the moment.

Got it. Okay. That's very helpful. And Lara, another strategic question that I sometimes think about is just ServiceNow got its roots in the IT side as an ITSM provider and diversified into IT ops. But still, the workflow automation in the IT department still represents a very big part of ServiceNow. But at least when we talk to customers about where they would like to automate next and drive efficiencies, they often talk about extending ServiceNow outside the IT department or in some cases where you don't service that area using another automation vendor. So I think it would be fascinating to hear from you about ServiceNow's ambitions to accelerate the move outside of IT. Do you agree that that's a giant opportunity? And what's the strategy to expand perhaps faster beyond IT?

Yes. I mean we've obviously expanded outside of IT and -- already with our products, with CSM and with HR. And that is -- and that's been a smart move. I mean it started with, frankly, as you know, Fred Luddy built the company to be a platform to automate work for everyday people. And it turned out that it was challenging to sell that vision. And so we productized it in ITSM, which is a smart place to start. And then what happened was we just followed our customers, frankly, who did understand the platform vision and started to use it in other ways. And so Frank Slootman and the team ended up kind of throwing some spaghetti at the wall and expanding kind of multiple things the same year, and all of it kind of stuck. And so we really started by extending outside of IT following our customers. And so when I came in, we were really thoughtful to think about, okay, well, what's the market size? What's the opportunity, et cetera, around those different areas? And we find a tremendous opportunity in CSM, where we think we have meaningful differentiation in the marketplace to drive workflow automation for customer service or customer operations. The same with the employee. When you think about HR by itself, it seems rather small just on top of HCM. But ultimately, it's much broader than that because it's -- employees don't care about a function, right? They just want their stuff done. And so thinking about IT, HR, legal, facilities, whatever it is, we're seeing a lot of opportunity there. So I think the idea to expand ServiceNow is foundationally what we were originally designed to do, and that's what I think we're pursuing in our product strategy. And as you think about growth opportunities, there's expanding the perimeter around each of those areas and in new areas. And so a year ago, 70% of our net new ACV was from IT workflows. In Q3 of this year, it was down to 62%. So nearly 40% of it was coming from new areas. That trend will continue where you see those higher growth rates in those new areas.

That makes sense. Let's talk about a couple of those new areas. Maybe, Lara, the obvious one, given your role at the firm, is the CSM module. I suspect you know a thing or 2 about that one. It doesn't seem that ServiceNow's, in that CSM arena, bumping up against Salesforce yet. Gina told us after the last call that in CSM, almost all, if not all of the top deals for CSM, none were Salesforce displacements. There were displacements of legacy customer service technology. When do you think that might change such that ServiceNow will have to start displacing some of the cloud customer support service vendors? Or do you think the runway to displace the on-prem incumbents is so large that you don't really need to be bumping in the Salesforce in order for your CSM module to be showing terrific growth?

Yes. I mean, CSM, as you know, is a competitive market, but it's a huge market. So I think $25 billion is the Gartner-described TAM there. And we fundamentally do believe that there will be multiple winners there. From my perspective, I think that there is tremendous differentiation in what we do, and I don't see anybody else being able to do it. And I think about it in kind of 2 different ways. One is to bring together complex functions or department. So think about a big multinational company, or frankly, a good example is a state government or a federal government. If you're a citizen, you want to go into one single portal to ask your question or make a request. You don't want to have to figure out which department to go to and deal with their independent different ways of getting work done. You want to do that centrally and have all of that complexity resolved for you in the back end. That's an incredibly repeatable work -- use case that ultimately, we are uniquely designed to solve that. The other one, which is super relevant, given trends today, is supporting digital businesses. So Bill talked about supporting -- that we drive the customer service support for Disney+. And that notion of a digital business that's ultimately connected into your IT assets, right, that we can -- we're not just ask -- answering questions at the front end, but we're ultimately able to trace down and get to root cause and do proactive support. It is truly a differentiator that's linked to our core strength. And so I see a lot of opportunity in CSM that, frankly, I do believe there will be multiple winners there. I also think, frankly, the market -- in the same way that we see for a lot of our other businesses is that the market will expand because I think what people are realizing is that also serving a numerous amount of customer operations use cases as well. So it's not just necessarily customer-facing, but it's just -- it's driving the end-to-end management of customer operations. And so I'm pretty excited about the opportunity there. And I don't think we necessarily need to go head-to-head with the cloud competitors in order to do that.

Got it. That's encouraging. And Lara, I'd love to also ask you about the platform or app engine business of ServiceNow. How is that doing? And how is that contributing to ServiceNow's growth?

Yes. I mean the platform business is a really important one for us. And I started to talk about it in some ways that, that is the core of what our business is. And when you dig into the data, what you see is that customers who have adopted the platform meaningfully, they renew at a higher rate, they expand at a higher rate, and they have a better NPS. So there's goodness all around for customers adopting our platform. And so we're doing a lot to invest in those capabilities, both for existing customers. We've invested in low-code/no-code. We're investing in a lot of support and enablement, workshops to get people to understand how to build the apps on their own, how to build centers of excellence around it, et cetera, in order to ensure that customers are getting full value out of that investment. So I think it's an incredibly important part of our story and important enabler really to getting us to our ultimate goal of well beyond $10 billion.

Got it. And Lara, if we could flip over to the core ITSM portion of ServiceNow, which I think is still the majority of your revenues. One of the amazing things here is that we and frankly, others have been worried over the years that at some point in time, you're just going to run out of BMC and HP, ITSM displacements. And yet, ServiceNow keeps putting up strong ITSM results in terms of your net new ACV. So I'd love to ask you about that runway left in your core business. When will it run out of displacements? Or does it look pretty open from here still?

Yes. I mean, certainly, in my Chief Strategy Officer role, this is a question that I kind of looked at eight ways from Sunday to try to get a perspective on.

I'm sure.

And we haven't provided our own assessment of the market publicly, but Gartner has sized that at approximately $5 billion and estimated that we own about half of it. But when we look at it, we have -- we're sort of less than 50% penetrated within our own existing accounts for full potential ITSM. And we see a massive opportunity to capture new enterprise logos. So if we have 6,000-ish customers, there are over 28,000 enterprises globally. That suggests to me that the actual TAM for ITSM is much larger. I'd also note, which you guys are well aware of, that Gartner estimated the market when we IPO-ed to be $1.5 billion.

I remember.

And you can see the pie has grown significantly. And so I think there's a lot of opportunity to expand. But frankly, there's still a lot of opportunity to land new logos. And pro is a great example of where we're seeing the upside, the expand upside as an example. We only are about 15% penetrated into our installed base with pro, and that's up from 10% in 2019. And I think fundamentally, the innovation that's spent in that pro SKU is what everybody is looking for: ways to drive automation, efficiency, et cetera. And so we don't see any reason why that won't be at least 50%, right, penetrated into our account base. So we're very bullish on the ability for the core to continue to grow. That being said, it's certainly not growing as fast as some of our other businesses. And so we've spread our investment out to be able to make sure we have a strong portfolio approach to how we're thinking about investment in innovation.

Got it. And Lara, I'm sure one of the other focus areas for you in your former strategy role was helping the leadership think through the pricing model. I think we and investors remember under the formal leadership under John at one of the Analyst Days, he talked about ServiceNow's desire to take a fresh look at the pricing structure, did it make sense in a world of increasing AI. Bill hasn't talked about that so much. I'm wondering if you could give us an update on where that stands. Were those changes sort of put on the back burner while you work through the leadership changes, COVID and this amazing demand you've experienced? Or is that still under some consideration?

No, no. It's very much front and center. I own our customer experience, which includes our customer listening. And it is feedback that consistently comes back from our customers. So it's something that we are actively working on and have a big program around. And the opportunity, as I see it, is really around simplification. The feedback that we're hearing is -- suggest that we have too many meters and that we made some mistakes with some of our platform pricing in the past, and it was too complex. And so we've got a number of changes that, frankly, we've made and are working their way through the installed base. And as you know, it just -- it takes some time to get that. But we think we fundamentally have the right strategy. So the first is meter simplification. We've dramatically simplified the number of meters to just 3. We have an employee meter, a subscription unit meter and an application user meter. And we've reflected this kind of simplicity in our new -- in our existing products and any new products that we're launching, they'll all be under the structure. We have reworked that platform pricing, which I did say we recognize was a mistake, and we're making that simpler. And then we've rolled out a simplified enterprise agreement structure. So a lot of our larger customers do want a broader enterprise license agreement. And we now have standardized frameworks to simplify customer purchasing, enable the flexible usage that customers want and make sure that it's aligned to their value. And then, of course, we're doing a lot just to sort of ease of business, sales velocity, et cetera, and thinking about how do we roll out pricing discount guidance to our field and other similar initiatives. So there's a real pricing transformation underway. It started under John, but frankly, we're continuing to invest heavily. Bill is aware of it, and it is an important initiative for us. And so we think that ultimately, all of the stuff we do needs to be in service of customer value. So in addition to all of these pricing changes, we continue to make sure that we're investing in value, whether that's making sure that we're enabling our sales folks to really sell in terms of customer value and ROI. And then, of course, in post-sales, my -- I view my job and my responsibility as making sure that we have the machine at scale in place internally and through our customers to make sure that we're delivering that value.

Got it. That's very thorough. I didn't realize so much was going on behind the scenes. So that's super encouraging to take away that friction. A couple more for me, Lara. We talked a little bit about partnerships, but it was in the context of your SI partnerships with the likes of Accenture and Deloitte. What about on the technology partnerships that you've got responsibility for now? And in particular, maybe there's a broader range of technology partners, but the ones that I think intrigue us and a lot of investors, only because they're also chasing the workflow automation opportunity, are the RPA vendors like UiPath and Automation Anywhere. And I still think there's some lingering confusion as to whether you're rivals in the sense that you're alternative ways to get to that workflow automation or whether you truly are technology partners and not encroaching on each other's turf. So maybe I could ask you broadly about the key technology partners and then maybe the RPA vendors in particular.

Yes. Well, I'll start broadly with technology partners, and then I'll come to RPA specifically. Our partnership with technology partners is super, super important. In our positioning as the platform of the platforms, we recognize that this is an ecosystem play. And integrating and creating better together with the key vendors in the ecosystem is incredibly important. And so you all know about our integration hub and the investments that we've made to have easy out-of-box integrations. A lot of those are driven by partnerships with the ecosystem. But our big ones, which I'm super excited about and spend a lot of time on, are with Microsoft, which is, I think, increasingly strategic for various reasons. But we have partnership with them to expand in our regulated markets by using Azure. We have deep integrations with Teams and other parts of the Microsoft portfolio. We continue -- we have a mutual go-to-market. We're in their top 6 partners. And so we have favorable go-to-market economics with them. And we really are leaning into that partnership, as are they, in a meaningful way, and we're quite excited about that. The second is we just announced a partnership with IBM, which came out around last earnings. And that's exciting because it is a -- it kind of brings together our technology with some of their technology with Watson AIOps as well as our IT service management and ITOM capability. And as part of this, we will scale ITSM into new logos by turning over IBM's legacy on-premise service management solution. And so we expect that partnership to drive a lot of new logos for us. So again, technology partnerships, super important. We have a couple of really big ones that we're leaning into. And I'm sure you'll hear more about those going forward as we see the results. But in terms of RPA, our strategy is to partner with the leading RPA vendors to allow our customers to utilize that technology for routine task automation while managing the end-to-end work and maintaining the records in ServiceNow. So you've seen UiPath and others publicly announcing integrations into ServiceNow, and that's fundamentally part of that integration hub strategy that we have. As we've thought about it, companies embracing digital transformation means they're looking to replace, integrate or modernize existing systems and redefine core business processes. And this is where we think ServiceNow has a great -- has great modern solutions that are born in the cloud, can deliver modern and powerful end-to-end process workflows. And so we really are the ideal situation to drive those big transformations and drive real meaningful automation. In RPA, we view a little bit more of helping to connect the dots and automate in some of those kind of more legacy areas. And oftentimes, I think there is a better together where there are certain legacy integrations, et cetera, where you -- that you can leverage RPA to support a broader ServiceNow story. And so we have strong integrations in both -- in the various RPA solutions. And we see customers that are investing in both to be able to extend some of what ServiceNow does with some of those RPA-driven integrations or otherwise. So for me, it's an and. I actually don't think that they are doing the same thing. I also think RPA tends to be more focused on different buyers. You don't see it as much in IT. You see it a lot more in finance, et cetera. And there's a lot of legacy ERP systems out there that are hard to replace. And so on the edges, there's RPA solutions being applied. But we -- we're not in that market. And so we don't really view them as direct competitors. We view that as a complementing technology next to what we do. And in fact, you'll see some, in some cases, we're investing organically in some technologies to be able to make sure we have some of that natively in platform. So for those adjacent technologies, you have it all in ServiceNow.

That makes sense, Lara. And maybe I'll finish, given that we're -- we only have a few more minutes to go. Kind of an interesting question just around your views as a former Strategy Officer leader at ServiceNow, what a post-vaccine recovery scenario looks like. Most investors are now thinking about that, trying to position their stock portfolios for that. And I'm just curious whether there are certain ServiceNow applications or a certain type of sales marketing support motion that you think you'll have to pivot back to with customers back in their offices, sales reps back on flights, support reps back in call centers. So in general, how will ServiceNow look any different in a post-recovery world, if at all.

Yes. I mean, I think as I reflect on this, obviously, the pandemic created like, I think, unprecedented change management challenges to the world that end up changing the way we did work. And frankly, a lot of -- challenged a lot of the norms about how work could be done. And I think a lot of folks were pleasantly surprised at how productive they could be working remotely. That being said, there are obvious downsides to that in terms of collaboration and culture, et cetera. And so as we think about internally and also, frankly, how we think about interfacing with our customers, we are expecting a hybrid world. And so we're expecting more of our employees to want to be hybrid. And so certainly, we won't see our T&E go back to exactly the way it was. We're rethinking field marketing as an example. We'll be -- we won't -- there won't be as many in-person events because we realize that there's a lot of benefits, some of the digital events we're doing, et cetera. So that being said, we're -- we will -- we are a growth company, and we see lots of opportunities to reinvest that savings back into the business because we see so many opportunities for continued growth. We're really betting on ourselves in that way. And then from a sales perspective, I think customers will be the same. I think that they will go back to much more hybrid workforces. And it will depend a lot on the company and individual, but some folks will never want to see a software vendor in their offices again, and others will want to go back to having dinner and in-person workshops, et cetera. And so I think it will be really interesting to see how behavior kind of changes in second half of next year or whatever after a vaccine is widely distributed. That being said, I think there's a lot of opportunities from our application perspective to sort of help enable that hybrid world. I think that's kind of transitioning what we started with return to workplace into this broader suite that sort of thinks about how do you evolve into this new world. And so we're kind of excited about what's ahead and think that there's no reason why we won't continue the momentum that we've had in the pandemic and accelerate coming out of it.

That makes sense. Well, you, Lara, and your team have had amazing success helping ServiceNow power through this crisis well. Congratulations on that incredible effort. And Darren, quick thanks to you for making our TMT conference even stronger by having ServiceNow and Lara present and meeting our investor clients. So thank you both for spending time with us.

Thank you.

Thanks, Karl.

Appreciate it.

Okay. You got it. Bye-bye.

Bye.