SkiStar AB (publ) (SKISB) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Thank you very much, and good morning, everyone, to this quarter -- first quarter presentation of SkiStar's result for ’22/’23. And I would like you to show next page and the agenda. So we will talk about -- give you a short introduction. We will give a short quarter 1 summary and, of course, give you an outlook, how it looks going forward for this upcoming season. So please, next page, introduction, and then we go directly into the page after that with our business concept. So for you who don't know about SkiStar, we are a large operator of ski resorts within Scandinavia. We are running Salen, Are and Vemdalen in Sweden; Hemsedal and Trysil in Norway; and also the city destination in Stockholm. And of course, we would like to give our guest a memorable Alpine experiences and also develop sustainable destinations. Please, next page. We had a fabulous last year with a strong position in Scandinavia with 4 billion in revenue with 28 million visits on our digital channels, which we will talk about later on today as well. We had 6 million skier days and super happy to have many shareholders. Today, we're up to 60,000 shareholders, and we're also very glad that 8 out of 10 of our guests are very satisfied. Please, next page. SkiStar started the journey in 1975 and have had a great development since then. And this year, we are very proud to also continue the development. And please take next page. We are in a strong transformation of SkiStar where we are really working on 4 fronts. We are working to continue the digitalization of the company. We are all the time improving our sustainability, and we will also talk about some great effort this year. We are transforming the company into all-year round business and also have simplified the structure and are really ready for continuous growth. Please, next page. So now I will go into the summary of the quarter, and I will start off with highlights and then I will hand over to my CFO, Anders Ornulf. So the highlights of the quarter for next page. It's our smallest quarter where we are very glad to see an increased revenue of 15%, and the strong revenue increase comes from our retail side where we are running both our skistarshop.com online business with plus 55%, and also our physical stores which have an increase of 35%. And here, we can really see a strong connection with ski stores' other customers who both used to book ski holidays and also -- connect that with also buying clothing online with our businesses. Even though we have high energy prices, we have managed to save SEK 8 million in this special November, but also the beginning of the quarter. We're also very glad to have all destinations open since mid-December, and personally, I've been visiting all of them, and I arrived back from Hemsedal, Norway, yesterday, and we have fabulous conditions, and we are really proud to open up fully for our guests now entering for the Christmas period. I'm also extra glad to visiting already last week where this new Stjarnliften was running in an -- excellent conditions. And even though we had a quite windy weekend in Are, Stjarnliften really showed its best and running in a very strong performance. So we look forward for a very strong winter, and we will go into that later on during the presentation. But first, let's spend some time on the quarter. Anders, and over to you, and the next page showing overview EBIT.

Thank you, Stefan. Before commenting on the first quarter, we will start with an overview of the financial development. Here, you will see a graph that shows historical development of EBIT and EBIT margin, and also the underlying EBIT from the operations were in the gray area. You see the capital gains from our property development. It's also -- it's important to understand that in the previous year's full year results, a substantial part has come to -- from capital gains, which is not that sustainable. So more happy with the situation that we show last year and this year, the last 12 months that is. The 2 financial years, '19, '20 and '21, of course, heavily affected by the pandemic. We couldn't carry the loss of revenue, but we did maintain a strong operating profit for the period, which was crucial now. Last 12-month figure to the right showing an EBIT at [ SEK 767 million ], of course, affected by last year's fantastic results, but we hope that it's a new starting point for us in this historical level you see in front of you. And the underlying effect last 12 months of the capital gains is around SEK 50 million. It's also important -- if you look at the operating margin at --between 19% and 21%, you must also remember that the new hotel division contributes with approximately SEK 400 million on the full year, but with not the profit we want and plan for. Moving into Page 11 with the revenue then. As Stefan mentioned, it's a very quiet quarter for SkiStar, a very operational focus starting on the winter season in a safe and efficient way. 2 takeaways on the revenue side is that -- Stefan also mentioned, the retail business, really strong development, fantastic Black Week sales, and we are now looking forward to even more volumes from our physical stores in connection with the winter season, and the resorts, of course. And we now have a Hotel and Lodge division that had a tough start previous year when the pandemic was well present until January, and among other things, the sales of alcohol in restaurants was prohibited in Norway. Moving into Page 12 and EBIT by segment. You can follow our changes in EBIT. Worth mentioning in the quiet quarter is that the cost increases are mainly linked to the income for the winter season. For example, we have a significantly higher pace, and during the pandemic with repairs and maintenance at our resorts as well as consumables. We also have high costs for advertising and marketing as part of being more aggressive in the marketplace. In profit development, we had a minor sale with capital gain previous year. Otherwise, nothing to report there. And finally, our hotel lodge business have an even higher seasonal variation in the core business [ SkiStar ]. We also have new rental costs for the SkiStar Lodge in Hundfjallet, Salen, and SkiStar Lodge in [ Salfjallstorget ] in Lindvallen, which we did not have previous year. So we have some profit to make up for when the list opened in December, but of course, we already knew that. So for the summary, first quarter -- Page 13 -- summarize the small quarter with the timing effect of several cost items according to plan. We got an effect from the fact that 1 year ago, we were still living with restraints due to the Omicron virus, and with our Hotel division, we get an even bigger swing between the quarters. Our balance sheet is still strong with an equity ratio of 47%, excluding IFRS 16 debt. And the net debt is well below 2, and the liquidity focus is satisfying partly due to the responsible actions in the pandemic, but also our record year when it comes to sales and profit last year. We have invested more than SEK 600 million for the coming season this winter and following summer, and we financed a high CapEx level from our own generated cash flow, which shows that our business model works and that the guests will benefit from all of the modernization and upgrades at our resorts. Stefan will talk more about our plans and outlook later on. Deep dive into Energy, Page 14. We would like to take a chance to [ assist ] you on the issue which is high on the agenda for most people and companies, the electricity and energy crisis we live with at the moment. Operating a ski resort is, of course, very energy intensive with the single largest activities, no production. Since this has been important historically, we work with the portfolio management of [ purchases ] where we have a 3 to 4-year perspective, of course, with the strategy of having as much of next year as possible at fixed prices. We have between [ 1,700% ] of this year's forecast in fixed prices, which means that we are well equipped to cope with electricity prices in the short term. It also accounts for a limited part of our cost mass, although it will certainly rise for the coming years, just like for everyone else. What we have done is that we have launched our own energy project linked to our own consumption to reduce that part of the equation for the total cost going forward. We're focused on smarter snowmaking and smarter energy consumption as our properties. As also Stefan mentioned, we had a successful start in the first quarter, which is promising. But of course, we are aware that the decisions are made before and the battle, it began for the Q2 and the higher volume. But it's important that the temperature was very cold and with dry air, which means that the snow production has been very efficient. Before handing over, we should also dive into the sustainability results for Q1. An update of our efforts. Overall, satisfied with our progress in our sustainability work. You can read all about that in our annual and sustainable report we presented more than -- I think it was 1 month ago. Yes. But we want to take the chance to take -- kind of a couple of highlights during the last quarter as part of our interim report. Starting with health and well-being. What is good to highlight in the quarter is that on September the 7th, we opened up summer skiing, well, I guess in Hammarbybacken. During the quarter, we had roughly 9,000 guests in Hammarbybacken, and we sold 2,000 ski [ days ] in the summer skiing product. The total number of rides was just under 40,000 including all our activities in Hammarbybacken. We have had a long-term collaboration with the Swedish Skiing Association named Alla pa Sno. This is nothing new for us, but when we'll renew their agreement, we'll also include the summer skiing in Hammarbybacken. We had several school classes visiting us with children that has never seen before, and just in a couple of hours, they learn how to ski down the hill, and we did this as an important part of recruiting new skis, and also creating a lifelong interest in skiing and mountaineering. Moving on to ecosystem and impact. During the quarter, SkiStar was the first company to place a pre-order for 50 electric snowmobiles. Snowmobiles will be the mobility. In addition to pre-orders, we have also started a collaboration where we support with our experience and knowledge during the development phase. Production of [indiscernible] Pre series is expected to start in the fall of 2023, but the construction of the prototype will already start in January. We have also launched the Pre Used product, that's [indiscernible] where we sell used ski. The outcome of Pre Used has been very good. Of the first 148 skis, 147 has been sold already, which is significantly -- also show great potential, and now we wait for next release of 500 new pairs of skis to be sold at [ dot com ]. Finally, dialogue and interaction with the community is also essential. During this quarter, we carried out our annual recruitment process. There has been a high level of interest in working with us this winter. For the coming winter season, we are hiring more than 2,000 positions spread across over 80 different positions in the Swedish and Norwegian mountain destinations. We see us being -- [ Norwegian ] destinations as one of the most important parts where we have the opportunity to give young people the first job on the labor market. As part of SkiStar's financing, together with one of our banks, DNB, we have included a sustainability link in one of our major credit facilities. We are doing this to link clear incentives to achieving our sustainability target, which is -- in the long run leads to more efficient financing. And then, of course, we start achieving our targets. Stefan, over to you and the outlook going forward, and we're moving to Page 16.

Thank you, Anders, and I really understand from many questions we have got also from journalists this morning is very much about the outlook, how does it look for the season and what is some consumer behavior. So I would like to take you through a couple of slides. So we move over to next slide, Page 17, where we look into this winter upcoming season '22, '23. First of all, I'm really glad -- like I said in the beginning, I have been visiting all our destinations the last week, met fantastic condition, and an extremely effective snow production. When we have this cold temperature, as we have had up in Scandinavia now up to minus 15, it really helps us to produce much more efficient snow production than we do when we have the temperatures around minus 5. It's actually 50%, 5-0, better output of the production of snow when you have the cold temperatures. So from 1 cubic meter water, you go out with 2 cubic meter snow when it is like minus 5. When it is like minus 15, like we have had right now, it is 1 cubic meter water and it's actually 3 cubic meter snow, and the snow, it's in a much higher quality, which, of course, has helped us to be almost 90% ready with the snow production already in December, which is, of course, extremely glad -- extremely good now when we open up for the Christmas, New Year's period. So the conditions is there. If we then look into the bookings -- and we can see a very interesting pattern and that is that, all the beds we have close to the slopes are almost fully booked and in pair with how it looks actually last year. And the beds which is further away from the slopes are the ones who is not booked firstly. So it's very interesting to see that pattern. And then, if we go into the booking situation, I'm also very glad to show you this graph. We normally don't show you this graph, but I really wanted to show you in a way where we can be more specific in how it looks on each period. So please move on to Page 18. So you can say that we split our period into different -- or our season into different periods. So if we look into the Christmas period between week 51 and 1, we see that we have an increased booking pattern of 3%. If we then look into the smaller period between week 2 and 3 -- 2 and 6, we can still see an increase of 1%. And then we had the very important winter break period between week 7 and 10, we have plus 1%. So if we look into those isolated 3 periods, it looks extremely well, and it's also extremely good booked into the season. If we then look into the period after week 11 to 18, we are behind that period, and that is the new pattern we see, that our consumers are booking much closer into when they will travel. So just as an example, we increased our booking the last week. So when we when we made a stop in reading how much is the booking look like when we're going into this report time, we had minus 13% compared to last year, if I read the numbers in the report. But then, when I look at today, this Monday morning, it's only minus 12%. So in 1 week, we have gained actually 1%, and that is clearly statement of how the booking pattern moves very quickly into our favor moving on into the season. So if we move on to the next page, Page 19, I really would like to show you also some numbers around our digital activities -- so from the consumers' digital activities. So in the yellow field, you can see the number of visitation -- digital visitation in skistar.com last year. And if we then look at the numbers, we are slightly below visitation at our web page, skistar.com. We have the same conversion. But then we can see that the SkiStar app is moving much quicker and it's also increasing the conversion, and the reason for that is that -- much more active app and also higher conversion due to much more purchase into the ski passes in the app. We can also see what Anders showed you in the revenue growth we have in the quarter -- is very much related to the visitation in SkiStar shop, and we are highly driving that traffic right now, and the retail business is going extremely well. And here, I would like to underline also that SkiStar owns the first-party data compared to many other companies in the e-commerce business right now. We are sitting on a very strong asset, and that will help us going forward into the future as well. I move on to Page 20, because it has been a lot of dialogue and questions around what is the price on SkiPass, et cetera. And we are very glad to show that we are the largest player in Scandinavia, and we also have the largest number of slopes and also largest number of lifts. Of course, that relates to also the highest price per SkiPass since we are the largest destinations. But if you then split it into either per slope or per kilometer we have in our [ list ], we are actually the 3 most valuable destinations in Sweden, and also the 2 most valued destination in Norway, which makes us really proud. And when people ask us about price increases over the year, yes, we're also very proud to say that if you include living, which means the house you rent, the SkiPass and the ski rental and the ski school, we are up between 3% and 4% versus the inflation around 10%. So we have really managed to also take out -- cost out of our business and to really make sure we can deliver a strong result for the upcoming year. Also what's important is that the slow currency we have in -- with the Swedish krona, also helps us very much into the upcoming season, especially since -- if you look into this slide with SkiPass prices in Europe -- take an example of the Mont-Blanc, Chamonix year SkiPass as -- before costed SEK 12,000, and now it's SEK 22,000. So you have a very high increase in Europe and in the Alps, and that will also help us to have Swedes, Norwegians and Danes stay in the Scandinavia and Alps instead of going abroad and traveling abroad. So this will help us, and also gain for a good season. I move on to Page 21, and I really would like to highlight around business development and innovation, and it really continues. Anders mentioned Hammarbybacken, which has been our year round, but that's also our innovation hub, and in the innovation hub, we are testing, we are trying things, and we have tried these pop-up stores, and now we will move out 15 stores, smaller stores out, or ski store shops into the slopes, so very close to the slopes. We will open up special [ EQPE ] stores very close to the slopes, and we can also see that the [ EQPE ] brand is growing faster also than the retail business in average. So we will continue to develop, and we will continue to innovate, and we are very proud of that. And we move over to Page 22 and really talking about the readiness for growth. So, again, Anders show you how it looks like from our financial statement, and we have a very strong balance sheet, and we have a very low net debt, and that will help us now going forward when we're coming into tougher times. We have a very strong financial situation and also very strong financial relation with our banks, and that will help us now when we have presented a very clear vision and future plans about 2030. And also -- and it's interesting to read in media how quick they are to hang up with [ minus 3% ] in booking situation. But we are very glad to have a very stable and very solid business. We are not actually afraid at all of this situation. We have actually the opposite feeling. We are very proud to actually, in these slow times in consumer behaviors, see that we have this strong booking numbers, and we are super satisfied with that. And it also shows that having holiday in the Scandinavia and Alps is something that consumers are prioritizing, and that you can also stay in a cabin. You can live there together with your family, you can cook yourself and you can also have a very good time with the family and friends. So we see that, that will continue, and we can see it's a very strong part of Scandinavia's DNA. And again, I really would like to highlight also that we have a lot of experience now from the pandemic how we could handle tough times. We have shown that -- during the pandemic that we can handle our cost base. And since we now are down a bit in bookings, we, of course, are working with our cost structure. Anders mentioned that when he showed the numbers. But of course, we are handling our staff. We work on the schemes, how they have the plans. We also work hard with the energy efficiency and also other costs in our operations. So we are very proud of how we are going to deal with this upcoming season. So with a big smile from us here, we move over to Page 23 and open up for Q&A from the audience. So thank you from us. Thanks.

[Operator Instructions] Our first question comes from the line of Fredrik Lithell of Handelsbanken.

Thank you, Stefan, and Anders for a very good presentation, and especially on the explicit outlook presentation where you provide us with more details, is always very helpful. On that note and on your outlook discussions, can you -- I have a few questions. One is domestic and international guests. Do you have the same kind of statistics so that you can anyhow comment on it to us and say that you have more of the bookings from international guests this year compared to last year? Would be very interesting to see how that trend is developing. And also on the statistics, I mean, the thing you show is -- it's good that you show that the first part of the season is similarly booked. So we have that clear for us. But the thing -- this is accommodations, and how is that relating to the SkiPass bookings, if you like, or ski school bookings? Do you have that kind of insight as well on how that has developed so far? Would be very interesting to hear.

Fredrik, that was a lot of questions. I will see if I remember them, and please help me and -- continue. But I would like to start with the international guests and so on. So we can see actually a very similar pattern like we did last year, that we have around 70-plus suites visiting us. We have around 20% Danes, and then the rest [ 10% ] is split between Norwegian, British, German and Dutch people. So, in general, we can say that we are in a similar guest pattern as we had last year. And what we can see more is that the Swedes and Danes are now moving into Norway in a much quicker pace than they have done before. So Norway is really taking off back again, you can say, and Trysil in specific is coming out as our second largest destination of the Salen, which was the pattern before the pandemic. So Trysil is really back on track, which is also helpful from a profitability point of view. Then you asked about the SkiPass prices and the booking situation there, and there we could see also that we have actually a very strong booking pattern, I must say, pre-booked, both of seasonal tickets, which is much higher revenue than we had last year at the same time, and we also have a similar booking of the weekly passes as we had last year. So even though that booking is below from -- so night booking is below. The SkiPass sales is above or in line with last year. So that is a very interesting pattern. So now I remember 2 of the questions, and I forgot the third one. Which one was that?

It was also -- it was 2 questions, but...

Yes, it was 2 questions.

Do you feel okay with that Fredrik, or was that helpful?

Absolutely. Yes, very much so.

And I could also just help all of you on this call with the booking as well since we now have decided to show you the different periods, just to also relax the margin a bit for -- like that because we feel very comfortable with the situation. And since we also see that the consumer book a little bit -- not in the same pre-booking as before, but we can say that this season, we have booked this also -- 80% of the season is already there and it's booked, which I think also is very important, that the end of the season 11 to 18 is not so -- it's important, bear me right here, but the most important part is really there, and it's continue to be booked all the time. So there is more upside than downside actually in the booking, I would like to highlight in that period. Just on that note, I can tell you, last week booking was 80% booked between week 51, 52 and week 8 -- week 1, actually. So we can really see that consumer still books up to very late arrival. Just as a comment on that note as well.

And currently, we have one further person in the queue. [Operator Instructions] The next question comes from the line of Karl Johan Bonnevier of DNB Markets.

Just to continue on the last thing you talked about, that 80% of the season is already booked. When you look at that period, 11 to 18, that seems to be the delta, so to say, compared to last season. How did that look when it came to in-season bookings earlier and then being pre-booked, so to say, with this kind of long duration -- it's -- Because I guess that period should be one that is more to be booked in season, or am I wrong there?

No, you are completely right, K.J., and that's why I'm saying we are not worried about that. Neither it's -- from 2 perspectives. Normally, it is booked during the season and then also in connection with this late booking pattern. That's why we are quite comfortable with the situation. And I also would like to highlight, even though that we have this really bad calendar for us in the Christmas period, we are actually up compared to '19, '20, which is something we don't talk so much about in this call, but I really would like to highlight that as well, that the Christmas period also looks in a favorable -- in favor for us.

That's very good. When you look at the -- what you have to -- say, the inventory you have on your booking system, I think you in the annual report talked about around 39,000 beds across your resorts. Have that number moved up dramatically this year with, say, property owners wanting to be in your system?

Yes, it's actually started to move up. Anders, when was it? Was it...

It was 2 months ago.

Yes, 2 months ago, it actually started to increase dramatically. So we have seen a couple of thousand more beds coming into our system lately, and we see it's coming in all the time. And we believe that, that is a pattern of -- that house owners want to get support with the energy bills or also maybe the interest rate, et cetera. And before maybe you have decided to only have this house for yourself, but now open up for us to take care of that booking as well. So we believe that, that could be helpful for us also going forward to get more attractive stay at our resorts, because we are very careful of what beds we are taking into the system. Because we cleaned out some beds last year, to be frank, with beds, we don't want to have in our system, because we really would like to have high-quality beds and also closer to the slopes, et cetera. So -- and that now number starts to increase back to -- in our favor again. I don't know what's the long answer, K.J.

Then going back to Q1. Obviously, a small quarter for you, but quite a bigger loss in this year compared to last year. If you just could give some more color about -- when you talk about repair cost, marketing cost, the personnel costs and these kind of things, but how much of those costs are, you can say, more related to phasing that you should normally have seen them in maybe Q2, Q3 and they now ended up in Q1? And how much of them are, say recurring phenomena also go in Q2, Q3, so we should expect them being a burden then as well?

I would say more than 50% are linked to coming with the season, so repair, maintenance, consumables and -- which are more of a periodic effect or timing effect of the cost and not -- should be looked upon as a cost increase. But of course, we suffered also from the inflation at the moment on some of our cost items, of course, but more than 50%, I would say, 60%, 65%, or 2/3, I would say, maybe are linked to a different timing effect of the costs.

And then looking specifically on the hotel operation, obviously, a big number in a small quarter for you. They're looking at the loss as well. How do you see the hotel operation in a full year perspective with the booking situation you have for the moment? Do you still expect to see a smaller loss this year than last year or with the start of the added costs you now have? Should we expect a weaker performance in the hotel operation this year than compared to last year?

Absolutely. We think we will improve the result [ bottom ] now when the year is over. So it's more linked that 2 of the hotels are new and not accounted for last year to quarter 1. So -- but with the booking situation and the cost projects and the synergies we run now through the 7 hotel lodges, I think we're optimistic.

Yes. And I can build on what Anders just saying there, because I really like your question, K.J. because it is very difficult for you to follow this hotel operation because -- just a year ago, we didn't have -- we opened up Hundfjallet, and that cost we bear with us now, of course, in the quarter. We also made an acquisition of Vemdalen, which has been the same. So they have been [ ambitious ], so to say, during this period of time, and of course, that gives us only cost in the quarter. However, since we now have created this hotel division, we also really started off with an improvement of both cost but also how to run a much more efficient year-round business in the hotel division where we started to do more and more events to fill up the hotels. Since we are paying a fixed rent, every night we could add in to the hotels out of peak season is, of course, revenue to the money on the bank, so to say. So that will help us, of course, as well. And I just want to also build on what Anders said about the cost in the quarter. I mean, to go from only working on 6, 7 months business to go to a year-round business also help us, of course, to create -- we also want to strengthening our brand for a year-round business, and that cost us also in your marketing when you want to do that positioning movement from, you say, seasonal business to a year-round business, and we are really proud of that, actually. And I think it is, of course, hit us hard in the quarter, but it gives us a long-term view. And I think -- since you also could see on the digital visitation, that has helped us also to improve our retail business a lot going forward.

And when you look at the hotel operation, I guess, this year, you have -- you should have a positive delta in the Norwegian operation. And maybe if you could just indicate as well this [indiscernible] operation that you added. Was that a profit-making operation before you took it over?

It was, yes. It was. So we should hopefully only get better. We're not running the show, of course. But on the first part of the question, yes, you tend to forget that 1 year ago, we lived with Omicron virus. So we had a really rough start for the Norwegian to the huge hotels in Trysil, Radisson Blu and Radisson mountain resorts. So hopefully, now we can sell alcohol and the restaurants are working fine. I think the restrictions we had in Norway was up till week 6 to week 7. So yes, there will, of course, be a good benefit for us this year.

And just to also understand the Q1 development. You're looking at the free cash flow or the operating cash flow. Is that mainly related to the retail operation? Or how does that play out in the quarter?

No. Some -- a bit of the answer is doing the retail business and the -- our investment in that division. And you can see also top line, but of course, when it comes to stock and warehouse management, you can see an effect of that. But it's also -- the lower booking situation versus last year is also an effect when it comes to -- since we have a lot of pre-paid and the booking pattern is earlier last year than this year. So those 2 explanations.

And just on that, when you look at the risk in season, so to say, when you look at cancellations, how does that work for you? If the consumer confidence suddenly should turn more negative again, is there a big risk for increasing cancellations?

I must say, I'm really proud that we have no cancellations actually, and it's -- we had one conference group in Norway who canceled from one hotel, but they move to another actually. So it was back in the books again. So we haven't seen any cancellation. And for all in the call, we don't know our rules. It is -- if you have bought an insurance, it is 20 days before arrival. And if you haven't booked any insurance, it is 40 days before arrival. And that means that actually, we are close into the -- this holiday season is over, of course, the Christmas, and then also this [ sport law ] and the period of time when people -- school holidays it's called. So again, we don't see any signal of cancellation. I must really underline that. It's a good you asked that question.

And one final from me. Looking at the exploration development operation, obviously, with what's going on out there with uncertainties and so on, have you adjusted your own kind of pipeline in that operation? Or how should we see this and next year, maybe from an exploration development operation perspective?

I can start the numbers, maybe, fill in. And what I really like is that we show the picture for you of how our development has looked like the past couple of years when we have got less and less independency out of our development situation. However, though, the creation of [ Skia ] is helping us to get almost a stable development every year from a dividend perspective. And then also, we have decided to slow down production in the beginning of last year where we could see that the high prices was there for -- rebuilt and built. But now when we see that the price started to go down, it opened up again for start production of sell. So we are confident in that situation. And then we have also already before said, get used to a lower number in development but a more stable situation, so to say, from the core business. Anders, would you like to add that?

I mean SkiStar is not exposed to the private housing market. I mean, of course, second home sales in the Scandinavian was going to be slower in coming years, but it doesn't change our strategy. We will then focus on other type of projects for the next 2 [ years ]. So there's one good part also being -- have a long-term perspective of the business.

And I guess you don't have a big pipeline that is coming into harvesting during the season either. Do you?

No. We have one in [indiscernible], but that moves on according to plan this winter in Are, so, no worries.

And I guess Are is one of the resources that has really kept up the best when I look at, say, agency statistics.

[indiscernible] Better than us. Let's focus on the [indiscernible]

And as there are currently no further questions in the queue, I'll hand back to our speakers for the closing comments.

Okay. I really would like to give all of you a big thank you for listening to our call today and also glad for the questions because that's also helped us to be better in our clarification and presentation. So thank you for that. And by that, we would like to wish you a really happy holidays and hope to see you in the slopes. Both myself and others will go there in a short period of time. So if you see us there, say hi. And again, happy holidays to all of you. Thank you very much.

Bye-bye.