Spir Group ASA (SPIR.OL) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Good morning. My name is Nicolay Moulin and I am the CEO of Sikri. I'm joined by our CFO, Camilla Aardal. And during these next minutes, we aim to present our quarterly numbers, news and highlights and a description of the Sikri organization. What we do, what our ambitions are and we will answer any questions you may have. Before going into the quarterly itself, I'll take a step back and talk a little bit about Sikri. As such, our customers, proposition and our strategy. Camilla will give you all the details on financials before I'll come back towards the end to wrap up with a summary and some words on the outlook. I would encourage you to submit questions during the presentation by clicking the button in the webcast player. Camilla and I will answer questions after the presentation. So let's go. Sikri is a technology company that based on unique data, a modern technology platform and deep domain expertise contributes valuable insight and seamless digital services for the public sector, private businesses and citizens. The group services are delivered through different segments: Public, Private, Consumers and Metria. The various products and services are well connected and will create synergies for both the public and private sector. The Nordic market are among the most efficient when it comes to real estate and real estate transactions. This is, among other things, due to the advanced technology. The life cycle of property is hugely complex and diverse. And in every step of the journey, technology, integration, data solutions and software plays a crucial role in lubricating the market. And this is one of the finest jewels in the Sikri crown. Our solutions plays a role in almost all of the -- all of the different phases, you can see on the wheel on this slide. From the early stage of property development, in searching for an optimal location through planning and new building, applying for building permits, inspections, documenting, financing and to completion. In all of these processes, one or more of our software and data solutions are involved. And important to emphasize, we develop our solution based on the principles of open APIs and increased ability to share data across solutions and platforms. With our complete portfolio, we have gained a tremendous valuable position in the prospects space. We will continue to develop new services for automation and integration and innovation, innovate solutions that address the challenges in flow of data and information. PropTech is a huge growth area, and I hope I have given you a little bit more insight in why we consider ourself a Nordic PropTech champion. The Nordic market is a perfect place to be for a company like Sikri. Digitalization is top of the agenda, both for private and public sector. Saving costs is one reason, but also increasing expansion for digital and swift processes. We also see regulations being tightened, creating new needs for digital efficient solutions. In fact, most of our services provided to all our segments are based on not nice to have but need to have due to high regulations. Sikri Holding has an active approach to M&A and a proven track record. We see that acquisition and consolidation is a great driver for value creation. As this slide illustrates, we have made significant acquisition since the launch of the company back in 2019. The acquisition in 2020 were smaller, adding very important products and technology with great synergies. The acquisition of Ambita in 2021 and the Metria in 2022 were transformational as they gave us leading position, both in Norway and Sweden. We will continue to be active in the M&A and a consolidator of the market, seeking bolt-on acquisition in order to complete our portfolio with products, technology and customer segments where there is a synergy potential. There are many opportunities out there. But as always, we will be patient and prioritize capital discipline. At the same time, we have an active approach to portfolio management. As I've talked about, we are a software house rapidly moving more services towards pure software-as-a-service models. Recently, we divested Prognosesenteret, which was outside of this strategy core. Let me now talk about the strong market position in Norway and Sweden. The Sikri Group delivers value-adding services through public sector, private businesses and consumers. All of these 4 segments enjoy very strong and market-leading positions. The Public segment delivers delivering document management system for the public sector in a highly regulated market. In Norway, there are 3 main players in the market, and Sikri is the leading one. There is an increased demand for more efficient digital services, both for public and private sector. One example of this is how we have digitalized the process for building site permit application from up to 12 weeks, processing time down to 1 minute and 50 seconds. Within public sector, we have a higher level of recurring revenue through long-term software-as-a-service agreements with municipalities and governmental agencies. Subscription revenue are growing, supported by our consulting business that partners with customers to implement and integrate our solutions into their document handling process. The service with our Private segment are indispensable for incredible many players in real estate life cycle. Let me mention real estate agents, banks and insurance company as key examples. 90% of all real estate transactions are touched by our service. We help our customers with necessary information and services for performing property transaction. The Norwegian property transaction market is one of the world's most efficient property markets, and we strongly believe this is adaptable to the other Nordic markets. Metria is a leading force in the Swedish market when it comes to property and geo data with many similarities to our offerings in Norway. Their customers spans from large banks to municipalities and governmental institutions. Within the Private and the Metria segment, we focus on using data to create digital services. We have a deep knowledge with a broad spectrum of data sources that are needed within real estate, banking and insurance, driving a high share of reoccurring revenues in the segment where the numbers of services, both by each customer is increasing. Infoland is our most well-known offering within this space, which carry a high share of COGS, explaining lower profit margin compared with the Public segment. Finally, in the Consumer segment, we are delivering a service booklet as for a car, for your home under a brand, Boligmappa. Our aim is to facilitate the ability of all relevant information about our property in one place. This is also a regulated space with their requirements for having proper documentation drive the need for a solution, which we provide through the platform, Boligmappa. The Consumer segment is still in an investment phase, but growth is strong and the potential is vast. As you see, everything is connected. So by delivering services with the mentality of sharing and making data flow with open APIs across all our solutions, making us an attractive supplier and partner. But let's look at some numbers showing why we love this business model so much. A very large part of our business is based on Software-as-a-Service concept. As an example, in the Public segment, almost all our new contracts are cloud-based and subscription based. This gives us a predictability and stability in the revenue base that many envy us. 75% of our revenues are recurring and recurring alike. Our annual recurring revenue is now at NOK 359 million. Gross margin are high and the EBITDA margin are high and rising. In the public sector for Sikri, we have a low churn, and here, we win 60% of the contract we compete for. Especially in troubled times, public sector revenue is valuable and 45% of our revenue comes from the public sector. Our growth strategy is simple. We aim to realize the commercial synergies across borders and create a strong sales culture throughout the group. Within real estate and within public sector, we will continue the development of new solutions and value propositions, both to existing and new customers. But as I mentioned earlier, We will also continue to use M&A as an active vehicle for driving continued growth and development, finding companies that will give us access to new markets or providing Software-as-a-Service solution that we could introduce to our existing customer base. So thank you for listening to this run through of our position and strategy. As you hopefully notice, I'm incredible, enthusiastic about Sikri, our products and what we can achieve going forward. Let's now return to today's main topic, the third quarter. We are really satisfied with the third quarter of 2022. Overall, we have seen solid financial and operational development in a period with lots of focus on integration, structural change in our portfolio and capital-related issues. It makes me particularly happy to see good underlying revenue growth across all segments. In the Public segment, the driver to cloud and Software-as-a-Service revenue models is finally paying off. We are back with an organic growth of 8% and a 19% growth in recurring revenue. This will improve profitability going forward, and we expect to deliver a 30% EBITDA margin going forward. The Private segment is driven by a volatile real estate market, but we are sustaining a strong market position and delivering growth within our e-commerce platform, Infoland, and new products. Synergies from acquisitions lead to improved cost base and improved profitability, which is expected to be lifted further as we introduce new products. The Consumer segment fortifies its position as the leading provider of property documentation, experiencing strong growth in recurring revenue, aside by Avhendingsloven, investments are expected to translate to an accelerating growth in 2022 -- sorry, 2023 with high margin. The Metria segment is refreshed with a new management and have identifying significant synergies across border and cross-segment sales and margins improvement opportunities. Ready for profitability growth expense to -- expected to accelerate during 2023. Looking at Metria, we acquired this fantastic Swedish business late spring 2022, and a big part of the case was to obtain synergies with the rest of the group. We have now worked intensively with this and identify a range of products and services that we can cross sell or sell to new customers in Norway. In fact, we see 15 products and services with large cross-sell potential. After what we really can call an exceptional period, Metria is now moving into an execution phase with focus on sales, margin improvement and further product development. Let me show you one example of a product that we are now bringing from Sweden to Norway, Markkoll. Markkoll is helping infrastructure developers to survey, map and plan new infrastructure project like power lines. Sweden as well as Norway will in the coming years, invest several billions enhancing their power grid. Integrating with geo data and a range of other sources, the tool can come up with suggested routes for a power line and automatically generate data packages and maps for procurement of land to reduce labor-intensive work with more than 90%. It is easy to understand that this has huge efficiency effect. And Sikri is in an unique position to use the software developed in Sweden, link it to our Norwegian data sources and systems and offer it to Norwegian customers. This is a whole new opportunity opening up here in Norway. Sikri is the leading provider of case management system for public sector in Norway, and the countries more than 350 municipalities are important to us and we have above 40% market share. We are working hard to shift to deliver it on to cloud-based models. This is better for the customers and for us and one of the growth driver for the Public segment in Q3. During Q3, we signed a landmark contract with Trondheim kommune, the third largest municipality in Norway with 180,000 citizens, implying cloud-based delivery. The contract is launched with NOK 8 million of value over 3 years, and we have NOK 1 million of add-on services in addition. Let me also point to the strong and continuous development of Boligmappa, where we now have signed up all the major electrician change in Norway as customers. Electricians as well as carpenters, painters, plumbers and other craftsman, experienced people from their end customers in the private market to provide tidy and completed documentation of the work they do. And many end customers want them to use Boligmappa. Boligmappa integrates well with craftsman's business system. So this is a win-win solution. Boligmappa grew its revenue with 28% in the third quarter. Penetration and monetization still have a long runway, and we will continue to invest in products development and customer penetration. Let me wrap up with some section here with some quick comments on the divestment of the Prognosesenteret, which was made in the fourth quarter. The sale means that we took another step towards being a pure Software-as-a-Service player with a strong position in PropTech and case management in the Nordic market. The sale was also financially very attractive for us, and we are realizing a financial gain of approximately NOK 40 million and freeing up NOK 71 million of cash in Q4, in addition to a sellers' credit of NOK 38 million due in 2024. Let's now move over to operational and financial review. And for that, let me hand the word over to Camilla Aardal, CFO of Sikri.

Good morning. Please remember to continue posting questions to us with the question function in the webcast player as we go along with the presentation. Q3 2022 was a strong underlying quarter for the Sikri Group. We are a software house rapidly moving towards the cloud and SaaS models. We're happy to see that our ambitions are materializing in an increase in annual recurring revenue of 9%. This is based on our ability to utilize unique data, create modern technology platforms and leverage our deep domain expertise. Our annual recurring revenue, which is measured in pure subscription-based SaaS revenue, is now at NOK 359 million. These are pro forma figures so Prognosesenteret is neither part of Q3 nor the historic numbers. Reported revenue grew by 1% in Q3 2022 compared with the same quarter last year. However, the reported growth was negatively impacted by currency effects as well as pass-through revenue in Q3 2021 tied to the Norwegian election, which is expected to happen every second year. Adjusting for these impacts, the underlying growth was 8%, making this the best quarter so far this year in terms of growth. All segments delivered organic growth this quarter. The Public segment saw a strong development in recurring revenues, while the Private segment experienced recovery in the real estate market in Norway, and Metria had more projects and consultancy work on customer solutions. In terms of profitability, the revenue growth has a strong positive impact in the Public segment, while higher cost in Metria due to usage of subcontractors lead to a lower margin. As our segments have different drivers, we will detail this picture a bit further to provide more clarity around the revenue development for the quarter. Our financial figures, both actuals and pro forma have been updated to reflect the divestment of Prognosesenteret. New pro forma revenues for Q3 2021 were NOK 269 million. This included NOK 10.5 million of pass-through revenue with low margins on the election project in the Public segment. As elections in Norway are performed every 2 years, this revenue did not reoccur in 2022. Furthermore, currency fluctuations led to a difference of NOK 6.4 million between reported figures in Q3 2021 and 2022. Adjusting for these 2 impacts, operational revenue growth was 8% in Q3 2022. Public revenues grew by 12% in Q3, while subscription revenues grew by 19%. Private revenues grew by 7% in Q3 due to the higher activity in the real estate market in Norway. The Consumer segment is performing well on all KPIs and revenue grew by 28% in Q3, driven by a growth of new agreements. Finally, Metria also experienced 4% growth measured in local currency, driven by a higher volume of project and consultancy work. As our financials indicate, we're making good progress. The growth in SaaS revenue in the Public segment translates to a higher profitability, with an EBITDA margin above 30% for the quarter. For Private, the growth in Q3 came mainly from the sale of property data, which is a low-margin area. Thus the impact on EBITDA is smaller. The Consumer segment has received tailwinds by the new property transaction law Avhendingsloven. We continue to invest in the solution and the Boligmappa.no service was augmented with several new features focusing on property condition and radon measurements. Our newest segment, Metria shows great promise, but there's still work to do to realize the full potential. Currently, we utilize a higher volume of subcontractors due to a tight recruitment market, which impacts EBITDA. Let's dive into more detail in the 4 key segments of the Sikri Group. Starting with the Public segment, our strategy has always been clear, and we're pleased that the transformation to cloud solutions continues to materialize in higher annual recurring revenues. Annual recurring revenue is at NOK 170 million at the end of the third quarter. And subscription revenue this quarter grew 19% from Q3 2021, as was the case also in the second quarter. This is driven by a high win rate, which is 60% so far this year and our ability to implement new agreements. We bid on all relevant bids in the Norwegian public sector and through a dedicated focus on sales and bid process, investments and improvements in our solution and expansion of our offerings with acquired technologies, we've been able to grow steadily. We're also very pleased that the Public segment delivered EBITDA margin above 30% for the quarter, mainly due to the underlying increase in revenues. The Private segment saw accelerated growth in the quarter due to an increase in the number of properties put up for sale in Norway. This is a main driver for the sales from the e-commerce solution, Infoland. As of H1, there was a decline in the number of properties put up for sale of 8% against last year. However, the number of properties put up for sale increased by 9% in Q3 compared to the same quarter last year. Some of our other products driven by real estate developments have halted a bit during the last -- during the past quarters. Developing new services and increasing our product footprint toward our customers is an important strategic priority for the Private segment. As a result, we're happy to see that 9 out of 10 customers have increased their use of our services during the past 12-month period. The EBITDA margin development is mainly a result of the product mix as other costs have remained quite stable. Although there have been some increases in travel, sales and marketing costs in 2022 compared with 2021. We value our clients highly and being active in the sales space is very important to develop and defend our positions. Going forward, we will continue to invest in other services that we expect to improve the overall profitability. The Consumer segment is showing growth through a strong increase in new subscriptions and annual recurring revenue has grown by 13% from Q1 -- sorry, Q3 2021. The revenue growth was primarily driven by new sales. Boligmappa signed yet another enterprise deal in Q3 with Elkonor, one of the market leaders in Norway within electro and the new regulation Avhendingsloven introduced in January has provided a good tailwind for the service. The EBITDA margin is improving from Q1 and Q2 this year, but still some behind Q3 last year. This reflects increased cost due to user and license growth, increased marketing focus and our investments in development of the solution where we are broadening functionality, improving user interfaces, increasing focus on market visibility and preparing for future new revenue models. The Metria segment also experienced growth in Q3, measured in local currency. Revenues were negatively affected by the slow real estate market in Sweden, which impacts Metria sale of information related to real estate transactions in a slightly different way than for the private segment in Norway. Metria sale of real estate information is based on properties sold or renegotiated loans. In addition to real estate information and geo data, Metria had an increased number of projects and consultancy work on customized IT solutions during Q3, driving growth in the quarter and Software-as-a-Service revenues continued to develop positively. Annual recurring revenue for Metria is now at NOK 114 million and new solutions such as the Markkoll platform are expected to contribute to increased annual recurring revenues going forward. The Sikri Group is in an intensive period with regards to integration of Metria with the rest of the group. Maintaining business as usual during this period is key but some degree of operational impact is as expected. We have already seen that several of Metria's services may be relevant for the Norwegian market. Thus, we're looking further into how to make the necessary adjustments to create synergies between the entities. It is our ambition to improve Metria's financial results going forward, and we believe that we will be able to translate synergies and opportunities into above 20% EBITDA margins over time. Moving on from our 4 segments. We also want to highlight our income statement presented as actuals. The Sikri Group saw revenues increase in Q3 by 53%, mainly driven by the acquisition of Metria earlier this year. Personnel expenses increased accordingly as the Sikri Group now has over 500 employees as of quarter end compared to 300 at the end of Q3 2021. EBITDA for the quarter is also affected by M&A and integration costs as well as uplisting costs from Euronext Growth to Euronext Oslo Børs. We capitalized development costs for the quarter of NOK 17.3 million, lower than the 2 previous quarters, mainly due to vacation periods in the Nordics. Depreciation and amortization expenses have increased due to the increased amortization of intangible assets from acquired businesses. The increase in financial expenses is mainly explained by the increase in borrowings due to acquisitions and some minor increases in interest expense on lease liabilities. Profit from discontinued operations is the profit from the divested Prognosesenteret. So far this year, the Sikri Group has had a positive cash flow of NOK 74 million from operating activities. It's important to note the seasonality in cash flow development, and I will highlight 2 specific factors. Firstly, working capital is significantly more negative in the first quarter of the year as the Public segment still invoices 60% of its customers on a yearly basis in January. Secondly, both in 2021 and in 2022, the second quarter has carried acquisition costs for Ambita and Metria, increasing the negative cash flow in these quarters. When taking into account M&A costs and listing costs as well as increased interest cost in addition to investments in capitalized development, cash flow is mainly in line with profit levels. The Sikri Group's cash balance was at NOK 69 million at the end of Q3 2022, where NOK 31 million consists of cash assets held for sale which is an adjustment for the sale of Prognosesenteret. Adjusting from -- for the cash inflow from the divestment of Prognosesenteret which will happen after quarter end, however, the cash balance is at NOK 140 million. In addition, the group has available credit facilities of NOK 70 million, not included in these figures. Assets consist to a large degree of intangible assets, where NOK 1 billion is goodwill and the remainder is capitalized development, customer contracts and trademarks. Intangible assets have increased during the year, mainly due to the acquisition of Metria. Equity is at NOK 996 million, leading to an equity ratio of 41%. Net interest-bearing debt is at NOK 770 million at quarter end. This includes lease liabilities of NOK 64 million. We expect our leverage ratio to improve further through proceeds from the sale of Prognosesenteret. And in regards to outstanding debt, the NOK 44 million due in 2022 have already been repaid in October and we fully expect to remain within our covenants in the upcoming periods. Nicolay, would you like to summarize the quarter and make some remarks about what we can expect going forward?

Thank you very much, Camilla. So to a quick summary. In Q3, we reaccelerated our growth with continued strong profitability. We have confirmed our synergy case related to the acquisition of Metria and now moving rapidly ahead with execution. We are streamlining our portfolio, focusing on Software-as-a-Service, PropTech through the divestment of Prognosesenteret. Our financial position is considerably strengthened following our equity raise and sale of Prognosesenteret. Looking ahead, we do expect continued volatile markets. However, with our product mix, high degree of recurring revenue and strong market potential implies stability and predictability. We are set for a very exciting and positive period with the following key focal points, reinforcing the sales organization across the group, realizing synergy based on the Metria case, optimizing our organization. And that is the end of our prepared presentation. We will now pause for just a few seconds before we are back and ready to answer your questions.

Thank you very much. And let's go over to some questions. Camilla, the first one, I think that's addressed to you. So please.

Yes, we're very happy that we have received some questions this morning, and we will try to answer them as best we can. The first question we would like to answer is -- we have a question asking how should we think about the potential for extracting cost synergies from Metria in 2023? Well, in regards to Metria, we have several things that we're working on at the moment. First of all, and most important, we will focus on synergies in sales, the cross-selling of ready-to-market products. As Nicolay mentioned, now we have 15 products we've already identified that are either soon ready or at least have a very both short- and long-term potential in both markets. And exploiting, of course, the bigger market that we now have across the borders between Sweden and Norway. So that's definitely the biggest potential that we see.

And I think it's also important to remember that we both have products that we would like to introduce to the Swedish market and also products that we have in the Swedish market that we would like to introduce to Norwegian market. So it's on both side of the border.

Definitely, definitely. And then, of course, we need to address the question of margin improvement, which we mentioned and was asked specifically about cost synergies. And of course, it's now that we're a bigger organization, we can leverage our organization in a totally different way. For example, sharing sales efforts. We know that the bid machine that we have built in Sikri is something that we can use, hopefully to bid on public bids in Sweden.

Yes.

We can look at -- we already are a common agreement. We're 500 employees now. We can get better terms on everything from ERP system to supplier agreements on smaller things. And last but not least, I think my experience so far is that we are releasing energy in both the organizations which will make us more efficient and effective and being able to work in a totally different way. So it's very exciting, and we're very excited about what we've learned about our Swedish colleagues so far.

Let's see another question. The question is, have your property development products as such PropFinder been impacted about more uncertain markets and macro elements now? Yes and no. You can say that when we introduced especially the PropFinder product that was addressed to the property developers, it was at the same time where you saw an increase in building costs in Norway. So we haven't felt that we're still growing in this market. We haven't felt that we have had a setback on it. And I think also, we got to remember that the product biggest competitor is actually XL. So from our point of view, we know that introducing those kind of software solutions to the market is reducing a lot of time spend on doing manual work that could be done more automatically by using Software-as-a-Service solutions as PropFinder towards this market. So I hope this answered the question. Another question that we got in. Markkoll seems interesting, what do you think is the long-term revenue potential for such product? The revenue potential, it's definitely in the millions from my point of view. And this is also, of course, that the market research that we have done. But I think it's important to understand what this Software-as-a-Service platform is doing. As we talked about earlier in the presentation, we've talked about how this solution was used towards the power grid system. So as I said, Norway and Sweden is going to use billions in developing a better and more efficient grid solution in those 2 countries. But this is a solution that could be also used in other infrastructure elements. So what we do is actually then with 3 of different types of information and especially in the geo space, trying to find the best way of how to roll out different types of infrastructure. This could be used also into roads, railways, et cetera, et cetera. So -- and that's an important thing. And of course, one of the things that I also really like about that product is the environmental impact of it. This product is constructed in a way so you can actually leverage different types of level of how much or how small impact on the environment, that could be everything from where there are crops. Should the power line go over crops or should it go into the sides, all those kind of things that I think it's going to be even more important in the following years to be -- one thing is carbon neutral, but another thing is how this affects our general environmental situation in our countries.

Yes. Great.

Some other questions, Camilla?

Let's see. Well, one very clear question, whether when we look at Sikri, we should expect any large negative one-offs going forward? It's very important to be clear, and I know that none of us like to have these adjustments for one-offs in the figures. It's important to be very clear that the one-offs that we have that we adjust for are very specific. It has been listing costs, M&A costs connected to 2 quite large acquisitions that we had in 2021 and '22 and some integration costs connected to those. And there's no operational running costs in those costs. So as far as we can say right now, there's no known one-offs that we would take but it also depends on our M&A activity, which I think is also a couple of questions that we have in here. How are we thinking about M&A going forward? And that's always a question that's difficult to answer very concretely, but we are still -- we are keeping -- standing steady on our M&A strategy. And I think we're definitely looking on bolt-on technologies, companies that we could use to augment the solutions that we have whether or not we see any acquisitions in the size of Metria and Ambita. Well, it always depends on what exciting companies are out there, and we have dedicated shareholders. We have an ambitious strategy. So this is not something that we're going to start with. But other than that to the question of one-off costs, there's nothing like in the works like in a normal type of structure.

Yes, yes. Another question is who is competing local provider of the products and services on Metria you expect to sell in Norway? It's a very good question. And one thing I have learned during the last year is how and especially if you look at Metria and the geo space, geo space is quite large. And in the area we are looking at and what Metria is known for in the Swedish market, we don't see that -- those same elements in Norway. So of course, there are competitors. There are elements that we are unique on looking at the Metria solutions and there are elements that we have some overlaps with the Norwegian existing companies and competitors in Norway. But I believe that this is a space that's going to grow even more in the following years. So we would like to, as our whole mentality, our ability to create solutions with open APIs, so we are able to get data to flow. So I would like maybe to use more of the words, frenemies. Yes, we are competitors on some areas and other areas, we are partners and are driving the digitalization in this space.

Yes. This is an interesting question because let's see, how will you prioritize organic growth versus profitability going forward? And of course, there is a desire for updated financial targets so that we can better understand how the business will grow and track your own expectations. And I know this is a question that we get a lot. One of the reasons, of course, we follow up our business internally in segments that make sense to us within the prioritizations and what the organization needs. But also one of the reasons we report on those segments in that way is to be very clear that there are different drivers. And although we work as one organization, when we do integration of acquisition or acquired companies, we don't just put everything together in one soup. We look at where can we integrate like finance, HR, common functions, where can we get the cost benefits and scalability, but we also keep the uniqueness of each segment, which also means that we are able to have different targets within the different segments. So definitely, the Public segment, we are prioritizing the growth. We are working on -- that's the business strategy, the whole time, working on our annual recurring revenue, working on our sales, continue to be better at bids. When it comes to the Private segment, we have worked a lot with cost. They did a lot in the first couple of years that -- or the first 1.5 years since we acquired Ambita. And there, we're looking at new products, where can we develop new exciting things like PropFinder and other solutions. So there, I would say it's more a growth case. And in Metria, we're still working together with the organization to see what can we do on a short and long term, but there's no doubt the growth there will be the most important thing.

And I think one of the things that looking at what we have done so far in the Sikri organization. I think that the focus on sales and creating a large sales culture is one of the things that is looking at all the companies now, something that we're going to focus on, also for the Metria organization because they have great products, they have great knowledge and domain knowledge of what they are doing, but maybe be a little bit more sales sassy and get the message out in the market.

Yes.

Very good.

Well, I think that was very interesting. Thank you for your questions. And actually, Nicolay will very shortly be on [ Version One ]. So for anyone who wants to hear some more about Sikri, I think that will be about 9 or 5 minutes after 9.

Yes. Thank you very much.

Thank you so much.

Thank you for all your questions, and have a good day. Thank you.