T-Mobile US, Inc. (TMUS) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

All right, everybody, thank you for joining us again for our penultimate presentation here at the 2021 Bank of America Telco Media Conference, ordinarily in LA, currently in my daughter's bedroom. And I wanted to say a special thanks to T-Mobile for kind of coming in to be the last telecom presentation of the day. Obviously, next is going to be Lockland Murdoch from Fox in the next session. So I encourage everyone to stick around for that. But we're really pleased to have Peter Osvaldik, the Chief Financial Officer and EVP for T-Mobile, join us today. Peter, thank you so much for coming.

Absolutely, Dave. Thank you for having us and let us round out the telco experience for you.

Yes, exactly. Finally, kind of a full house. So look, there's been a lot of news out recently. T-Mobile has been in the news, and there's been a lot of conversation about a lot of things have been going on. I think the first thing that people want to know is -- we saw there was the state of breach issue that emerged. T-Mobile tried to be very proactive in responding to it and being communicative with both the customer base and the investor base about it. But I think people need to know where do we go from here. How do we tie this thing off? And I know there's some class action lawsuits, and there's -- maybe the FCC is contemplating action. What do we need to know about this and where we stand right now?

Yes. Thank you, Dave. And first, before I jump in, just as typical, one of the highlight that we'll potentially make some forward-looking statements that involve a number of risks and uncertainties and encourage everyone, of course, to review the risk factors in our SEC filings. And of course, given that we're in a quiet period for Auction 110, I won't be commenting on that. So look, with respect to the data breach, it's certainly highlighted and unfortunately, we're not immune to criminal acts, but we have a responsibility to keep customer information safe. And we take that responsibility tremendously seriously. As you know, just as a brief summary last month, our systems were compromised through a cyberattack and exposed some customer and noncustomer information. And we acted quickly to shut down the attack and launch a full-scale investigation and, of course, coordinating with law enforcement as well. Right now, we're working to diligently ensure and rapidly to get in touch with the consumers that were impacted and ensure that they have knowledge of that and, of course, the tools in hand to best protect themselves. And we believe at this point, we've notified every current customer accounts that was impacted and are working to diligently notify noncustomers and respective customers, as we highlighted in our disclosures. I think, certainly, as it relates to the quarter in financials, we definitely saw some temporary customer cautiousness, as you would expect, both in terms of gross adds as well as churn immediately following that breach. Now that we're a couple of weeks past that we've seen consumers have moved past it, and our flows are beginning to normalize. And that likely reflects the unfortunate reality that data breaches have just become all too common in recent years. But we are seeing the flow normalize. And from a financial perspective, you highlighted some of those things that could be long-tail items, regulatory investigations. The cost associated with immediate actions that we took, including the experts that we hire, the protection that we're offering to consumers are not expected to have a material impact to both -- either Q3 or the second half results. And I did want to highlight that we do, of course, have a sizable cyber insurance policy that should cover certain expenses as well as we work through, as you say, some of the potential regulatory aspects or any class action lawsuits. I think it's -- what is important is, at the end of the day, despite all of this, we remain confident in delivering our full year results and the guidance that we issued on our Q2 earnings call, which included postpaid net additions of 5 million to 5.3 million. As well as core adjusted EBITDA, which, at this point, we actually believe will come in at the high end of our previous range of $23 billion to $23.3 billion. Of course, in addition to just how we responded to the incident and our ongoing notification of noncustomers, we're taking, as you saw from Mike's notes and his blog, significant steps to enhance our security and fight back against criminals and really build a future forward strategy to protect T-Mobile. And this includes our announced expanded partnerships with both Mandiant as well as KPMG and a multiyear commitment and part of a substantial investment to adopt best-in-class practices and really transform into a leadership approach from a cybersecurity perspective. So thank you for hitting that head on. I know it's been top of people's minds. So I just wanted to address that.

Great. No. Thank you for that. Appreciate it. And my takeaway is high end of the EBITDA guidance range?

Yes.

Okay. That's helpful. So another topic out there is the relationship with DISH. And there's been a stern letter from the DOJ that I think called out both parties in terms of having to kind of come to a resolution that doesn't negatively impact consumers. There's been some activity at the California PUC. I think the New York Attorney General has made some comments. Obviously, Charlie has been effective at stirring up a conversation about the fate of the 3G network. And I think the people are a little less, I think, concerned necessarily about the impact of some portion of the Boost wholesale revenue moving over to AT&T over some time line. You've stated that in your guidance, you assumed it would go to 0 over some period of time, I guess, is this is maybe potentially sooner than expected. So we could address that. But then the bigger question that people have is if this disagreement impedes T-Mobile's ability to shut down the Sprint 3G network and realize the synergies and get to the EBITDA and the leverage that will allow the company to do the stock buybacks, et cetera, et cetera. There's a concern that this is a risk to the business and to the synergies that were originally targeted at the Investor Day and as a justification for the merger itself. So could we kind of talk about that whole conversation?

Yes, absolutely. So you're right. As it relates to the MVNO, and I think I highlighted in the Q2 earnings call that the current expected run rate even for 2021 is less than $2 billion. And we'll see. As we said in both our midterm and our long term, we do expect that to go down to effectively nothing over the long term. And this may accelerate some of that. We don't know. We'll see how things work out with DISH from that perspective. And they reiterated on their previous earnings call that they continue to view T-Mobile as an important counterparty. And we certainly look forward to supporting DISH as a customer and making sure they receive what they need. And so from that perspective, while there's potential risk in terms of MVNO revenue falling off quicker, we did reiterate in Q2 as well that we're still on track to deliver the midterm guidance as well as the long-term guidance that we shared at our Analyst Day. As it relates to CDMA and customers, our #1 goal has always been to get customers on the latest and greatest network and the latest technology so that it affords those customers the ability to keep up with the technology basis and really get the benefit of the network that we can deliver. And that continues to be our goal. And that certainly seems to be the DOJ's goal as well. And that's something that we're working towards and certainly continuing dialogue with DISH on how best do we migrate all of those customers into the latest technology and give them all the benefits that, that affords.

I mean a long the related vector, not necessarily related to the DISH perspective, but Verizon looks likely to acquire TracFone. TracFone has 21 million customers, 13 million are already on the Verizon network. There's 8 million, roughly the same number as the DISH has on Boost that are not Verizon customers. And some portion of those are T-Mobile. T-Mobile's have the longest relationship with TracFone. I think most of us expect the majority of that 8 million resides in the T-Mobile family. And those are likely to also go away. Is that in your guidance as well, the expectation that those wholesale revenues, not just the AT&T also revenues, but the TracFone wholesale revenues -- sorry, the DISH and the TracFone revenues go away?

Yes. The TracFone revenues in the mid- and long-term guidance that we provided at Analyst Day, we assumed the roughly $750 million annual revenues would go away in the mid and long-term guidance. And so while it's too early to gauge all of the impacts if Verizon is successful in acquiring TracFone, TracFone is an own competitor to us today. And we feel good about our competitive position in that space, particularly with Metro by T-Mobile, really the leading prepaid service provider. So it's hard to tell exactly how quickly those revenues will fall away, depending on when the close of the transaction happens. But again, it was fully contemplated that they would all go away in our mid- and long-term guidance.

Okay. Got it. That's helpful. And then, sorry, the last kind of just news item that kind of came out was the announcement that you guys are coming back into the big box retailer, Walmart, with your brand. My guess is that it probably has something to do with your push into the -- into your nontraditional kind of more rural market footprint that you've been expanding into as a distribution channel. Could you kind of elaborate a little bit on why you did what you did, what your expectations are and the costs you might incur because selling in-house in your own retailers has been a very profitable approach.

Yes. Well, there's a couple of things that we would feel about announcements of the stores and the distribution with Walmart. One of those, certainly as you mentioned, are smaller markets in rural areas. And the push to drive distribution into those areas as the network build continues, both via things such as our innovative hometown agent program. But also such as with Walmart, right, that has a presence in a lot of these areas and helps to be actually very cost-effective from a distribution perspective because in a lot of these places, it might not make sense to have a direct company on store given the size and the population density, but it may make a tremendous amount of sense to utilize and partner with a distribution agent like Walmart. And now that we have the size and the scale of a combined company, I think the economics and the rationale makes maybe a lot more sense than it did for standalone T-Mobile. So that's a lot of, I think, what's driving the distribution and the partnership. I'm really looking forward to that.

Got it. And do you foresee some -- I mean, I guess you have this hometown experts, the strategy. This is kind of like moving in that direction, augmenting that. But again, I think that there's historically has been -- and the reason why you haven't done it is in recent history has been it's a very expensive channel to use. So kind of how do we have -- were you able to kind of negotiate a good deal this time around? Or is it just kind of like the old school, we understand that it's going to cost $150 to sell a phone inside Walmart, and that's just the way we're going to do it?

Yes. Well, I'm not here to disclose the terms exactly of the arrangement. But again, we do things that we believe are accretive from a distribution perspective. And again, like I mentioned, a lot of these times, it may make tremendous sense relative to actually having a company-owned store or having an exclusive a third-party relationship because of the density in these areas. And also, Walmart is a very established brand, particularly in rural areas. And that's something that can benefit us because we'd love to enhanced distribution and enhance the network and really grow in those areas is one of our segments of potential significant growth over the horizon of the Analyst Day guidance that we gave.

Got it. Got it. Okay. So I want to step back, I've been asking everybody this question. And you know that it's been kind of a topic of conversation in the market really since the first quarter. 2Q '20, there are about 4.6 million LTM postpaid phone net adds in the market in total, wireless cable, everybody. In 2Q '21, that number was 8 million. And so somehow magically, the industry nearly doubled in the space of 12 months. And T-Mobile, in 2Q '20, did about 250,000 net adds. And 2Q '21, did close to 600,000 net adds. The explanations have centered on combination of the usual, right, population growth, devices per account, prepaid to post paid migration. Although that's not obvious, that's in the numbers. And so you're kind of left with some other force and a lot of it seemed to boil down to a lot of the stimulus checks that were going out to EBB fund that was going out there. And so there's a sense that maybe second quarter, third quarter, we're going to see this continue. But at some point, that 8 million is going to turn into a smaller number. And the people who benefited from that growth number going from 4.6 million to 8 million are going to have to have a reckoning and that, that growth number is going to slow. So you've obviously given postpaid that guidance for the year. And as -- but just as a philosophical point, where do you see the normal in the postpaid phone net industry being? And as we get back down to normal, how does that affect T-Mobile? And how does that affect the growth outlook for the company?

Yes, Dave. Great questions, and I know it's been on people's minds. And certainly, if you compare to Q2 '20, of course, you have significant depression in Q2 '20 from COVID and the pandemic just hitting. So may be better to look back a little bit further than Q2 '20 in terms of normalized run rates. But there's a number of things, I think that people have been saying and that we've clearly seen across the industry. You mentioned prepaid to postpaid migration. That's definitely why there's growth in business that has happened. There's expanding age demographics. And there's no doubt there's been a clear benefit from stimulus, the enhanced unemployment benefits, of course, tax refunds in the first half of the year. And many of those are temporary. And so I do feel there probably be a bit of a normalization relative to some of those temporary boosts to the extent they don't continue. But the way I look at it is I can't speak to the entire industry, but I can speak to what T-Mobile has done in this period and in prior periods. And what we've really seen is industry-leading growth in postpaid accounts. And you know that our plan is very much over the mid and long term, focused on how do you drive growth in accounts and then how you expand that relationship to be growth in ARPA. So I'm very proud in what we've seen in postpaid account growth, including in Q2, where we saw a record 349,000. We saw significant quarter growth in T-Mobile for business, which is, again, one of the focus points and the growth opportunities for us. And key wins, as we said in Q2, across numerous industries. We saw, of course, prepaid-to-postpaid migration as well in Q2, which actually makes the growth that then we've seen in the Metro by T-Mobile, even more impressive. And I think what's really interesting is we delivered all of this in a period where we knew we would have heightened churn, particularly as T-Mobile. As we continue to grow through the integration of Sprint customers and work through that journey, we knew we would be carrying around the highest churn in the industry as a result of that highest churning base. And of course, that's mitigated by the fact that we've seen the lowest churning base in the industry on our Magenta brand. But we're working through the integration and bringing the full value proposition and power of this network and all that supports it to the Sprint customers. And while we've been doing that, I think it's been a little bit of a tailwind to perhaps the competition as they benefited from the fact we drag around that high churn base. But it's something that as we move and get the full value proposition to Sprint customers on, we see it as a potential tailwind to us in the coming future as we get through that full cycle because, as we say, when you bring the entirety of the T-Mobile network, the T-Mobile value proposition and all that, that entails, how that manifests itself is in the lowest churning base in the industry on the Magenta side. So that's what we see as the prize that we're chasing. And despite having the highest churn in the industry because of that Sprint base, while we work through it, we've been delivering the kind of profitable growth we've been delivering. So that's something I'm tremendously proud of, of this team. And we see it as real profitable growth in terms of accounts with the potential for even further ARPA expansion as we grow that, which is how this plan is really predicated.

Okay. So thank you for that. So let me ask another question, which is we've seen -- one of the big pivots in the industry, not in addition to having this multimillion subscriber [ perma ] boost in postpaid phone net adds over the last year has been AT&T, John Ledgers favorite whipping boy, go from share loser to share taker. We've seen that now for a full year. We're going into the next iPhone cycle. Presumably, this iPhone cycle will be a much more active cycle than a year ago, more switching, more retail, more openness across the country. And traditionally, that would be -- that would play to T-Mobile's strength, I would imagine. But I kind of -- as we look at that year that we've dealt with this AT&T posture on free phones for everybody, and knowing that Verizon is going to come back into the market with something and presumably, you're going to come back to the market with something, I think that there's a level -- there's a degree of anxiety that despite the fact that we've got a 3-player market in the U.S., we're on the precipice of maybe something bad happening from a competitive climate. What do you -- how do you -- what do you say to investors about that?

Yes. Look, the way I look at it is this market is always competitive, right? And it changes in terms of how that's potentially expressed. There used to be rate plans, probably now more heavily reliant on phone subsidies. And yes, you're right, I think the way AT&T has chosen to approach it, it is a little interesting and has hung up a significant amount of future discounts on the balance sheet, I think, over $4 million now as of Q2. But in all of that, what we see is T-Mobile, again, continues to deliver and in a profitable way. And that's the discipline and the targeted setting in a way that we approach growth and how we go execute against our internal aspirations every quarter. So we've been talking -- it seems like this is another topic that we talk about almost every single quarter. Boy, it's so competitive. How is it going to continue? How can you really execute against this? And we always do. And we always deliver significant profitable growth. And again, the way I think we're very much differentiated with both the synergy fuel growth as we unlock those, but also how we're driving scale is that we're the ones who can really translate that service revenue growth into industry-leading core EBITDA and free cash flow growth. Not through margin dilution, not through hanging up a bunch of discounts that will be future dilutive to ARPU on the balance sheet, but the way we approach every single quarter with this management team is set an internal target for profitable growth of customers and accounts with future potential to grow that. And that's how we execute against it. And that -- Q2 was no different. And that's the plan for this management team, and we've proven that we can compete in a variety of environments. When every quarter, there's a question, every quarter, this management team delivers in the right way. Which is not growth at all costs, it's profitable growth and achieving our plan.

So the -- there's just some much to kind of continue to talk about. But I want to ask another question along this vector, which is the idea behind the Sprint/T-Mobile merger was very strong, right? You've got a company with a lot of spectrum and no money. You've got a company with a very profitable business and not as much spectrum as it would like. Put them together, and you could be first-to-market with this kind of large amount of spectrum, a national 5G footprint, et cetera, et cetera. But now the question is out there, which is, is the T-Mobile network better enough that if I can get a free phone over here or I can get a modestly better network experience over here, which of these 2 things I'm going to take? And I think that people are asking themselves yes, there's no doubt that T-Mobile can be first -- is first to market. Yes, it does have a time to market advantage. But what do you do with that? It's -- you had good subscriber performance. But what does it take to get to great performance reflective of the differential between what your network can do and what others can't?

Well, it's -- you bring up a very good point, and that is it's not just about what potential spectrum assets you have, but also how you deploy them to the benefit of customers. And not only do we have a lead, but I think you've probably heard, and by the way, that lead is recognized now this year through already 9 independent third-party reports as having the best 5G network across a multitude of elements that you can measure. And it's also at a time when 5G is becoming more and more relevant to consumers, and that will only continue to grow. We saw the same transition happen from 3G to 4G, and where you're seeing the same transition from 4G to 5G. And as new iconic devices come out, such as today's announcement, the network experience will become more and more important from a 5G perspective. It's always been the important driver of churn across the industry is are you satisfied with your network. And as the network differentiates itself more and more and more for the duration of the 5G era, I think it will become even more compelling to customers. And again, it's not just the assets, how you deploy them, that's so important. And yes, we have a headstart, but it's going to continue to grow. Our commitment was to cover with our mid-band ultra capacity, 200 million covered POPs by the end of this year, 250 by the end of next year and 300 million covered POPs by the end of 2023. That's leaps and bounds above where AT&T and Verizon's commitments are. And it happens to coincide with a lot of the areas that we're looking for significant growth. We talked about smaller markets and rural areas. Well, that scenario where that delta between what AT&T or Verizon may be at by the end of '23, with 200 million roughly covered POPs and our 300 million. Think about the differential network experience for those 100 million customers that happens to coincide very well with opportunities for growth areas for us in smaller markets or rural areas. That is a significant delta. You're going to be living on what is all effectively almost an LTE-like experience, if you don't bring mid-band 5G there versus our Ultra Capacity experience in those areas with over 300 megabits per second targeted speeds at a massive capacity that, that brings. So I think we're in exactly the right spot as we take these assets and deploy them in a differentiated way with Neville and his team running at neck break speeds in a way that nobody has seen a rollout in this country happen before. That coinciding with just at the time when 5G is more and more important to consumers and consumer choice and more and more third-party recognition that we are the 5G leader, and that is just going to continue to grow. So I'm very excited about where this network build is going to take us and how it will translate in consumers' minds to differentiated experiences. And of course, network being the #1 reason to churn, I think, gives us a lot of opportunity for growth.

And Peter, could you just be, maybe if it's possible, just a little bit more specific, what exactly are people going to get that they don't get today that they can't get from someone else that they actually can use to make mobile value proposition better than it is now?

Well, let's start with just day-to-day experiences. And you see that in, for example, our Magenta Max plan, right, which is really an early manifestation of the network and the fact that we were first to bring a truly differentiated rate plan that cannot slow you down. And we are seeing tremendous engagement with that plan from our consumer base. For the people that have adopted and taken Magenta Max, we see significantly higher engagement and data usage certainly over LTE but also over regular 5G. So it is an important element for consumers already in their day-to-day. And of course, in the dawn and the era of 5G, the next thing is going to come, just like it did from 3G to 4G, things that you didn't even have ideas of yet, and we will be the best positioned network to take advantage of those as well.

You mentioned -- and obviously, you can't have a conversation with T-Mobile without having to talk about Neville's initiatives on the network and whatnot. I guess I don't think a lot of people question how well things are going right now. But there is a question on the supply chain. Obviously, we heard AT&T dial back expectations for fiber build growth because of issues around availability, chipsets and whatnot. I think speed is probably the thing that's most important for T-Mobile, probably more important than others, to maintain your lead. Is supply chain an issue? I think we wanted to talk about that.

Yes. Certainly, from a network perspective, we're not experiencing any supply change delays. And I think that's the advantage of being a first-mover and, of course, securing the multiyear agreements with our most significant vendors that Neville and team did. So we're off and running at the pace that you would expect of Neville and his team and not seeing any supply chain issues on that front. From a whole broadband perspective, we highlighted in our Q2 earnings that sometimes, demand did exceed supply as we saw a ramp-up of supply vendors and build of that product. And we are already seeing increasing supply there as we head into the second half. And so we feel really good about our momentum on the home broadband side of the house. From a phone side, we continue, of course, as everybody does, to work closely with all of our OEMs. And I think that you can see as you look across the digital properties of all 3 of the carriers, we're all having some sort and some degree of impact with supplies on phones. And I would say maybe we're a little bit more disproportionately impacted from the mix. And that's really given that our customers historically have skewed more towards mid- and higher-end Samsung devices. And I feel Samsung has really fallen behind the 8 ball relative to other OEMs on the global supply chain issue. First, they discontinued the Note device, of course, that many of our customers just love. And their S Series smartphones are in very short supply. So others that have a more Apple-oriented base are probably less likely to be impacted by this. But a lot of our customer base is also very significant Samsung lovers. And so we probably saw a little bit more of a supply chain issue there. And again, reiterating what we expect from a postpaid net adds guidance, but something that we closely watch as an industry and of course, as T-Mobile.

Okay. That's interesting to hear. Okay. An impact but maybe not a big enough impact to affect the guidance outlook?

Right, right, right. Exactly. We're confident with our guide.

So let's -- so just in terms of thinking about growth vectors, obviously, we talked about Magenta Max, we talked about subscriber growth. I think [ fixed pro ] access was a new product that got launched last quarter. I think there was a target to hit, I think, 0.5 million subs or so by the end of the year. So let's talk about that. Actually I get these e-mails with a summary of tweets from various things. I actually saw something tweeting about their fixed pro broadband product from T-Mobile for $50 a month with 100 megabits for life or better. And it sounds like a good deal, but it's in the wild, I can tell. But I just don't know how big a deal is it really for you guys right now. And are you going to break it out separately in your reporting?

Ultimately, I'm sure, as it grows, there will be a point at which we'll break it out. And again, I think the demand that we're seeing puts us on track for our target. We put out there 500,000 home Internet customers this year. From a speed perspective, as you say, we're seeing average download speeds of 100 megabits per second and continue to see the potential to increase that as the network build continues. Certainly from a tweet perspective, great feedback, but also third-party recognition, including, as I'm sure you saw recently, PCMagazine and its Readers Choice awards awarding the T-Mobile home broadband product higher than every single cable provider. And that's by actual customers. So we're seeing great demand across that product. As you mentioned, the target for us by the end of 2025 was 7 million to 8 million customers, which still only represents a mid-single-digit percent of total U.S. households. And we see a lot of runway in this space and excited about the momentum that we're seeing in the second half.

Comcast earlier today took down expectations for broadband connectivity in the second half. I'm presuming it's not because of T-Mobile's fixed pro access program, but tougher comps and probably high expectations. Are you seeing any issues related to kind of returning to work or anything affecting that market, pro or con for the fixed pro access product?

I think the fixed wireless access product is doing very well and seeing significant demand, seeing third-party recognition and on track. And we're confident that we'll achieve our target this year. So very pleased there. I certainly have nothing to pull back on.

Okay. And another growth vector has been the enterprise. I think some expressed a concern that the data breach would impact your ability to kind of waltz into these places and say, hey, we're the best in the market. I'm assuming you've reached out to your kind of key counterparts to try to kind of do a damage assessment, if you will, or take a temperature read on in-process negotiations. How is the enterprise exercise unfolding in light of data breach but just in general?

Yes. Absolutely. We definitely have discussions with our large enterprise customers. And I think they see the commitment that we have and the responsibility that we assume, that we take very seriously around customer security and data security. And our commitment with the engagement of really third-party experts to help drive best-in-class protection for customers and data. And so I think that has resonated well. We certainly want to see some of those details and progress reports as we go. And I think enterprises as well as consumers understand and have read into just how seriously we take this and the commitment to a multi-year significant investment really a lead in this space and in the industry.

And on the flip side of that, obviously, there was this -- the news came out around the data breach, and that was the news of the week. The following week, my wife logged into my office, my daughter's bedroom, and told me that Al Roker was telling America that the AT&T network wasn't working in New Orleans. And I have to imagine that, that has some issues for them in their FirstNet network and the first responder opportunity. That's been something, again, you flagged as a growth opportunity. How has that endeavor unfolded?

Yes. It's -- as we said, it's part of a tremendous growth opportunity for us encompassed under all of T-Mobile for business, both from the large enterprise that we talked about, but also government. And I think we're seeing very good success over -- really since the merger occurred, in a lot of cases, accelerated with discussions that happened as a result of our ability to pivot and deliver tremendously during the pandemic, particularly in needs around educational spaces as well as other needs of large governments. And that's helped open one thing, their understanding of our network capabilities, their understanding of our team's capabilities and the ability to pivot and really deliver solutions quickly when they need it most. And it's opened up a lot of conversations with governmental entities that I think will be very, very significantly accretive to our growth goals over the course of the guidance period that we gave. So very pleased with the traction that we're seeing, both in large enterprise but also in the government space.

All right. We had a bunch of client questions come in at the end here, and I apologize to you, if we didn't get to them. We ran out of time, but I'd like to say thank you very much to Peter for being a part of the conference. Hopefully, if you do have questions, you've been able to or will be able to get a chance to sit down with them on the one-on-one group sessions. But for me, this will be my last presentation as part of the conference. So it's been wonderful and terrible, and I'm looking forward to doing this for real next year in LA. So thank you, everyone, for being a part of this, and I really appreciate it. And please feel free to reach out to any of us on the team if we can do anything to follow-up in the rest of this. We're going to do a follow-up call with key takeaways on Friday with Jessica's team, so we can kind of do the whole round-up. And hopefully, you can join us for that as well. So thank you, everybody, for doing this. Thank you, Peter. I appreciate it.

Thank you, Dave. It's been a pleasure.

Cheers.