Teleperformance SE (TEP) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Hello, and welcome to the Teleperformance 2022 Third Quarter Revenue Presentation. Please note, this conference is being recorded. [Operator Instructions] I'll now hand the call over to your host, Mr. Daniel Julien, Group Chairman and CEO, to begin today's conference. Thank you.

The very first point that is extremely important is that at the end of September for the third quarter, yes, we had a revenue of more than EUR 2 billion for the Q3 And in 9 months, we are already at EUR 6 billion. So which means that more or less, we are at EUR 2 billion per quarter. The like-for-like growth, including the comparison with the onetime COVID business is at plus 7%. But if you exclude the onetime COVID business, the like-for-like growth is in the Q3 at plus 13.8% and in the 9 months, around plus 13%, 13.2% exactly. So it's a solid growth. It comes from a very diversified client portfolio, from our optimized solutions for outsourcing, thanks to the digital transformation. Thanks to our global expertise by activity vertical, activity sector. I have to say that we had in 2022, and we have a strong momentum in travel, health care, specifically in the U.S., of course, financial service sector as well as in the digital economy in general. Finally, at the end of the third quarter, we have a pretty flexible organization, and we are more or less 50% brick and mortar and 50% work from home. Next, please. So on that, we just acquired a week ago, a company called PSG Global Solutions, and it's specialist in recruitment process outsourcing and specifically with proprietary intellectual property. It's a digital platform that recruits, support recruiting or define a range of services for its clients in full cycle of RPO. So this is a very profitable company, is growing, and very, very needed in our times where it has been so difficult for so many companies to staff. Next, please. Another point, just a few weeks ago, again, we have been awarded being in the top 25 best company to work for in the world. We have 97% of our employees that are in the country where we are certified best employees. And we have been ranked -- in fact, we progressed significantly because we have been ranked the top 11 company for all its consistent process versus 10,000 other companies. Next, please. So what explains our solid growth and also our resilience. Whatever is the environment is what we call the Teleperformance Cube strategy, which is made of being present all around the world, with 88 countries and more than 400,000 people. Second, to be very specialized by vertical with professional of the verticals. So it's not just general customer experience outsourcing. It's also the ability to design value-added solutions related to the vertical. And finally, the diversity of our service offering that goes from the customer citizen experience -- customer and citizen experience services, the back office services and also the knowledge services. All that with a systematic focus on omnichannel, digital and integrated business services. Next, please. So how do we feel versus our long-term objectives. I think that we -- first, we maintain and we expand our global leadership as #1 in outsourced customer and citizen experience management. And yes, we maintain our long-term objective, long term, not so long term because for 2025, we think that the revenue of the group will be above EUR 10 billion that on top of that -- and this is at constant scope of consolidation. On top of that, we probably are going to make external acquisition for more or less EUR 1 billion to EUR 2 billion. And we're committed to come to a group that is going to deliver an EBITA margin of 16%. Thank you very much. And now, Olivier, if you want to give the details of the results.

Thank you, Daniel. I'm going to cover for you the precise figure that has been explained by Daniel a minute ago. As you see, you'll find there the 9 months figure and the Q3 figure. I just wanted to highlight that in both cases, we are growing at 15% or 17% on a reported, I would say, figure, which is significantly -- significant. On top of that, this figure are also very good in like-for-like, whether it's for 9 months or for 3 months for the last quarter. I'm going to dig much more in detail in the figure to understand what's happened -- what happened in Q3. This is interesting, as always, just to start to bridge a figure of 2021 to the figure of 2022. If you start by 2021, we were at 5.2%. We have, of course, a currency effect of EUR 286 million that comes up to close to EUR 5.5 billion at constant exchange rate. I'm just stopping here a minute because we are following this approach for the very beginning, but you will notice with me that we are not putting 2021 at -- 2022 at '21 figure, but 2022 at '21 and '22 rates. So it doesn't help for the computation of our like-for-like growth. But if you start to look with that, we start with EUR 5.5 billion and EUR 472 million of which you have a decrease of close to EUR 400 million linked to the dig. Of course, impact of the COVID-support contract evolution, which is not a surprise, but it has been significant. And we have been able to out pass that with EUR 721 million coming from other business that is going to swallow this decrease, which is massive, in fact. On top of that, you have the change in scope with EUR 200 million, which are coming from Health Advocate for the first half. And for the full year, Senture, which has been bought last year in December. As you can imagine, the big impact of the currency effect is dollar, close to EUR 200 million. And in Q3 it's roughly close to EUR 130 million. I just wanted to stop a minute there just to show that we have been able to swallow this EUR 400 million loss -- decrease of sales which are going to continue to be higher in '22 for the full year. So the group is able to, I would say, overcome this hurdle and this roadblock, I wouldn't say easily, but have been done significantly. If we move now to understand how the growth is happening. As well I'm showing this slide for now close to 1 year to show the like-for-like growth in blue, which has been published and like-for-like, excluding COVID in red or in pink over the 2 years, excluding COVID. And you see classically the like-for-like growth, which is declining, of course, following the disparation or the reduction as expected, of the support contract of COVID, while the pink, I would say, or red, I would say, cube is roughly flat around 15%, 14% in the last 2 quarters. So we have a resilient trend, which is a good growth over the recurring businesses there. And this is, of course, supported by the point that Daniel made about the structural digital transformation and our ability to address the right verticals. Let's go now in detail to the front figure. I know it's long, plenty of figure. But what has to be understood there is that not only we showed the Q3 and the 9 months like-for-like figure, as it is, but of course, reported but without COVID. And what is interesting is to see that, of course, the 2 regions that have been impacted by the dispersion of the COVID are, of course, CMEA and EWAP. And here, you see the figures that has been delivered there. 13% growth in the core service, while the special service is close to 19% growth. Of course, you have an improvement again of the TLScontact business and a continued steady development of LanguageLine Solutions that support the specialized service growth, which is close to 20%. Let's go now in detail by region. EWAP, of course, on a like-for-like basis, it's roughly down -- slightly down in Q3. Of course, given the sharp decline of the revenue contribution of COVID support contract in U.K., we're close to 8.5% in like-for-like if you exclude this impact and close to 11% in 9 months. As mentioned a minute ago, the North American market revenue has been supported by social media, online entertainment, travel and financial service. And the offshore activity in Philippines enjoy also strong demand. Let's move to Ibero-LATAM. I would say little to say, 17% growth in Q3, 17% growth in 9 months, strong and steady performance along all the region. We mentioned here the top performance in Argentina, Peru, Dominican Republic and Mexico, but I should say that even in Colombia and in other countries, we are doing very well everywhere. And we have no specific things to say that things are doing well. Of course, I mentioned here, the multilingual hubs in Spain and Portugal that are also enjoying further rapid expansion. So as a whole, I would say little to say, except it's a very good figure, and this is steady, and this is going to continue. Let's move to Europe. Of course, Europe, you have an impact -- a significant impact of the COVID line. Again, if you exclude them, it's 11.5% in Q3, which is even accelerating versus the 9 months because in the 9 months, we are at 7.7%. That shows that the growth is there, also on the same kind of business that was mentioning earlier, meaning travel, automotive, financial service and online entertainment sectors that are growing fast. Let's finish for our core service by India. Again, 25 -- close to 25% growth in Q3 everywhere, very good growth all along the year, and the ability to offshore activities that are very interesting for some North countries. Let's finish by a Specialized Services, as I mentioned, again, 19% growth, whether it's Q3 or 9 months. Again, recoveries, strong recovery in TLScontact volume that continued in Q3. Again, growth of LanguageLine Solutions accelerated in Q3. And of course, we had from starting first of the H2 2021, Health Advocate that are coming in our figures today. So that are the figures. I'm going to leave to Daniel, the outlook to give you a much more precise information about our outlook for the full year.

Thank you very much. The first point is, as you see, the first 9 months have been solid. And of course, it's reasonable to be relatively cautious, specifically in the economic and political environment today. But we are very confident with the way we are going to end the word, which brings us to increase our recurring like-for-like revenue growth, except COVID, to more than plus 12%. Again, the initial guidance that we gave was plus 10%. And of course, the initial target of the like-for-like growth, including COVID and everything that we gave was plus 5%, and it will be exceeded. The EBITDA margin of the group for the year 2022 should be above 21%. And the EBITA margin will be around 15.5%, which is 40 basis point increase versus 2021, and it's 10 basis points versus the initial target that we shared with the investment community. So this is our situation. Thank you very much, and I think that we are ready for questions.

[Operator Instructions] Today's first question is coming from Mr. Simon LeChipre calling from Stifel.

Three questions, please. First of all, the obvious one, if you could give us an update on the case with TikTok and on the independent audit, but also the discussions with the U.S. senators. Secondly, what is the FX impact that you expect on your margin for 2022 and in which sector the slightly higher margin guidance reflects the strength of FX? And lastly, on 2023, basically, your midterm target points to sort of high single-digit annual revenue growth. Are you confident at this stage on maintaining this level of growth for next year?

Okay. Thank you very much. I'm going to answer the first, Olivier, the second, and I'm going to answer the third. Your question about trust and safety content moderation regarding a client is very much appreciated because it gives me the opportunity to clarify, and I hope once for all, what is the situation. First, let's be clear, content moderation is an essential first responder service that protects the public against the bad actors on social media. So it's very essential. Second, AI eliminates, so it's not at all what you are seeing in the articles. AI eliminates 97% of the egregious content. But leaving 3%, that is questionable and for contextualization issue, it has to be reviewed by a human moderator. Third, the content moderator, of course, our first responders like police, like first responder ambulance and so on. And so we take a special care of them. Higher salaries, much more break in the shift and constant psychological support. Now the egregious, the highly egregious content in the case that was mentioned and listen very carefully, it's more or less around 1 per 1 million reviewed content, 1 per 1 million. It has nothing to do with what you have read in the press. Now the reality check. We conducted 2 reviews, 1 -- 2 in-depth reviews, 1 internal audit and 1 in-depth assessment by U.S. nationally recognized third party. And both conclusions were that, of course, there were minor element that could be improved and it always happens when you make an audit. But I can tell you that the allegation in the press are really misleading. So finally, and I'm going to finish with that, there is a very interesting indicator on the addition of the content moderator to what they are doing. They are proud of what they do because they maintain the social media clean for you, for your kids and for everybody. And guess what? Typically, and I really check that again. In the case that is mentioned, the attrition of the content moderator is 3x less than the average attrition of the commonly customer experience service people. So if these people were not happy, I don't think we would have that. Thank you. Olivier, please.

So the FX impact on the margin. Again, this is a question which is difficult to answer. As you know, there are 2 issues. One is a transaction, one is translation. Let's start with translation, which is the easier -- easiest when you translate in euro, higher margin figure from U.S., which is the case from LanguageLine, it helped. It's not dramatic. As the size of the group, it's giving 2, 3 basis points globally. And after, you have the transaction effect. Transaction effect is because you have cost in currency. And you have, in the meantime, I would say, revenue in another currency, mostly dollar or euro. Of course, this is positive. This is positive but delayed because most of the coverage, sorry, the hedge is down 1 year -- or between 6 months and 1 year before, meaning that the increase of the dollar will be much more impacting 2023 than 2022 for the transaction effect. That's the first one. The second one is that it's difficult to add -- I would say, to take out the pure FX effect without taking into account the inflation effect in the country where you, of course, meaning in some countries like different countries, you are obliged to increase the wages. So I'm not sure if FX impact in 2022, I can tell you, the transaction effect is limited. It will be probably higher in 2023 should the inflation stay where it is in this country, which is not clear today. So you have the translation effect, as I told you. It's between 2 and 3 basis points on 2022.

Okay. And now to finish on 2023. Of course, you will get our guidance to 2023 when we are going to give you the full results of 2022. Let's first finish 2022, if you don't mind. But our perspective today is that if nobody sends a nuclear bomb, if the world doesn't fall into hyperinflation, if the current order of the world, poor order, is not totally disrupted, yes, Teleperformance should continue to grow strongly. And that's why we absolutely maintain the guidance 2025.

The next question is coming from Anvesh Agrawal.

Thanks for the clarity on content moderation and the outlook, that's really helpful. A few follow-ups from me. First, if I just look at the growth for EWAP, it looks like there's a bit of a slowdown in the run rate in Q3 versus sort of first half. Just wondering what's -- and that's ex COVID anyway, what's driving that? Secondly, in the LLS business, is there any benefit from the Hurricane Ian in the U.S. in September and that's sort of driven the growth? And then finally, just coming back on the margin guidance, is the upgrade really because of the PSG acquisition and the integration you're going to get 2 months in for this year? Or it's ex PSG, you still expect the margin to be better than where you were expecting before?

Thank you very much. Again, in the details on EWAP, Olivier is going to answer because I don't have it myself, the answer precisely. Regarding LLS, you know what, I live in the U.S. and when you live in the U.S., every single year and specifically with the global warming, you have hurricane disaster, you have FEMA, and you have some of what should be exceptional activities that at the end of the day is a recurring activity. But it's not going to be major in the LLS LanguageLine Solutions profile at first. The second point, our rising of the guidance for 2022 doesn't integrate at all PSG.

Coming to your question about EWAP, I must confess that we have no specific reason to highlight in this potential reduction of the growth, which is roughly 2%. We are speaking of less than EUR 15 million on 3 months. So it's not -- this is not significant. So I wouldn't say there is a specific point to be made on that reduction -- potential reduction of the growth in Q3 versus Q2.

Now over to Karl Green from RBC.

Just 2 questions from my end. The first one, just thinking about some of the developments across your end market sectors. Can you make a comment about how the new economy sectors have developed through the quarter? Just obviously, people are cognizant to the fact that we're seeing the collapse that matter. Twitter are halving their workforce, Apple are cutting back on production volumes. Any comments you can make about any changes you might be seeing in new economy revenues. And I'm particularly thinking about the outlook going forward, any conversations you're having with those kind of customers? And then the second question, unrelatedly, one of your biggest competitors has referenced increasing numbers of first-time outsourcing conversations. Just wondered if that's something that you're experiencing as well? And if so, can you put any kind of numbers around that, please?

First, the economy is made of such a patchwork of activities that you always have some activities that go down, some activities that goes up. And for us, what is important is to take the right way at the right time. And the right way at the right time are not always the same in terms of activity sectors or even in terms of line of services. I'm not going to be too specific because I'm not here to give clues to my competitors. But for us, it's pretty clear that we are going to push more some elements in 2023 and less than before. It's always to be agile. I mean the role is in transformation, and you have always to be agile to be sure that you catch the right train. Clearly, the new economy, I think that I would really split the new economy between 2 subcategories. One is the new economy that is extremely profitable and tend to continue to grow, maybe doesn't grow as fast as much as when people were confined. But these are not companies that are deeply in trouble, these are companies that have to readjust their strategy. And in the readjustment of their strategy, there may be some services that we provide that are going to be reduced and some services that we provide that are going to be increased. Then, there are the companies of the new economy that still do not have a profitable business model and that has a cash burning rate. And those companies, of course, become extraordinarily careful and they are right. And for us, typically, it translates into geo strategy and very often moving the business that we do for them from one geography to another in which you are going to have a positive cost factor for them. For us, it's not just labor arbitrage. It's also to integrate more of robotic process automation for nonvalue-added interaction. So the whole service can be delivered, but we can do the same with less or more with the same. What was the other question?

First outsourcer.

You know what? The first outsourcer is always complicated because you see that after the fact rather than before the fact. Rationally, each time, each time companies are facing a contraction in their margin, they have to reduce their overhead and typically, they consider outsourcing. And so you always should see a jump in outsourcing. That's rationally. Practically in the real life, it takes more time. It's not just an immediate adjustment. But yes, we expect several companies to consider outsourcing. And we are ready -- or we are working on rebadging some businesses that are right now in-house, and that could be outsourced, for example in the BFSI.

The next question is coming from Mr. Patrick Jousseaume coming from Societe Generale.

Can you hear me?

Yes.

So 3 questions on my side. What was the exit rate for the organic growth in -- at the end of the Q3, please? So September compared to July-August. Second, is it fair to say that in the last quarter -- last year, you had something around -- maybe a bit north of EUR 100 million of revenue of COVID contracts. And this year, should we expect something close to 0? And third question, could you comment a bit the handling season, meaning that I think that starting in July, you have started to prepare 2023. So could you comment a bit that in the commercial side?

Thank you, Mr. Jousseaume. As I see, you continue to have super specific questions. You know that as a public company, we do not release our numbers month per month. So the activity is what it should be and there is no specific disturbing element, either positive or negative. So there is no surprise. Second, you spoke about the ending season for 2023 -- second, you spoke about closing fourth quarter COVID. What it was last year, what it was this year? You probably know the numbers better than I do. But yes, clearly, there is going to be significantly less COVID business in the fourth quarter of this year versus last year. So you are right. I don't have the exact numbers, and I don't know if Olivier has it or wants to give it. Then just to finish, the handling season for 2023, like you say, I would say the development season, I don't like so much these terms of ranking because at the end of the day, we are not there to kill birds, but partner with our clients. It's looking solid. We -- all over the world, in fact, we have been beefing up our teams quantitatively and qualitatively. We are going to continue to do that. And yes, we are extremely dynamic. We are not self-complacent with ourselves, but the things look solid.

For the COVID figure, Patrick, we are roughly in the same magnitude that what we have lived in Q3.

Next question is coming from Oscar Val coming from JPMorgan.

Daniel and Olivier, I have 2 questions. The first one is on the cost base and your employees. Could you talk about the magnitude of wage inflation you're seeing? And as well, could you talk about employee churn, has it become easier to hire over the course of the year? And do you expect that to ease in Q4? That's the first question. And then the second question is, you talk about Health Advocate in your slides. Could you make a comment on Health Advocate and Senture? How are those acquisitions doing? Are they growing in line with the group, above the group?

Okay. Okay. So yes, clearly, there are inflation trends everywhere. The fact is that for the business that we do domestic, we have renegotiated with all our clients to integrate a cost of labor adjustment clause. In fact, we are finding back the reflex -- the management reflex that we had maybe 20 years ago. And in the vast majority, everybody understands that we are in an inflationary situation. In the offshore -- nearshore, offshore, there has been a significant rise of the employees, and I don't have exactly the number, but because it change very much from one geography to another, from one currency to another from -- and so on. But typically, as these currencies have also weakened versus the dollar or the euro, which are the 2 main currencies for what, we do offshore and nearshore business, it has no significant impact on our margin. Olivier, is that correct?

It's absolutely correct.

Okay. The other point is the business of Health Advocate and Senture, it has been for both companies an integration year. They could have been stronger in development, but we have been very satisfied with the profile of the profitability of these companies. And it's difficult at the time you are making integration of people, culture, system that at the same time, the company are going to give their best in terms of growth. So it's going to be much more for next year, to my point.

We will now turn the call to Nicole Manion calling from UBS.

Sorry to press on this point, but if we can go back to the content moderation piece. I think there's a lot of sympathy obviously, around the idea and the concept behind the work, but it's also a newish area, and by nature can be difficult challenging work, clearly. So on that, just to clarify 2 points. Firstly, will you publish any detail around the internal audit and third-party assessment beyond the comments you've made today. It isn't referenced, I don't think in the press release, but it has been touched on briefly on the call. So just wanted to ask if that would be kind of formalized at all? And secondly, and relatedly, is there a plan to educate the market a little bit more perhaps around this business and your offering? It's clearly a new and fast-growing area, but it is getting a lot of attention and scrutiny for various reasons. And on that, could you maybe give us a rough indication of how big the business is? And what kind of growth you are seeing in it? That would be very helpful, if you could.

Clearly, we are not going to transform an incident like it happened every day to any kind of companies into a global polemic. So no, we are not going to publish the report of the internal audit or the external audit. We communicated them, to the adequate parties that need to know it. And that's for the first point. The second point is, yes, this is a new world. Right now, I have really the feeling that the media has not understood how much content moderation is critical, critical for the day-to-day life of the public and of the general population. It's a protection. And the responsible companies, large social media, who are very responsible companies have understood that very well. If I remember well, several years ago, the CEO of one large social media made a strong commitment to the U.S. Senate to do that, and this is what he has done. So I think that the whole topic is clearly not perceived as it is. It's exactly like if we would say, "Oh, my god, look at how disgusting is the work of a nurse. The poor girl, I mean, she has to see blood from time to time. She is going to -- come on." Yes, we are serious people. We take care of the people, but it's maybe time to open the eyes. Now to answer your question, yes, for what -- for Teleperformance in itself, we are going to try to have a much better education, all the different constituents, all the different stakeholders, so as not to be perceived as bad people when we do good things. And by the way, if there is a job that we are very proud to do is this one because this is a very critical service, essential service for the society. Now also, if you want to put in perspective, yes, it's a good -- it's a growing business. And by the way, I have numbers here somewhere. It seems that according to Everest Group, the trust and safety business should continue to grow in the near term by more or less 30% per year. So this is not Teleperformance, this is market analysis from Everest, first point. And right now, let's also come back to reality, this business, which is significant, represents 7% of the total revenue of Teleperformance Group. So please, let's not make the Teleperformance presentation of its results focus on media. We do not understand the critical positive aspect of an activity.

We'll now go to Mr. Laurent Gelebart calling from BNP Exane.

Daniel and Olivier, so I have 2 questions. On the first one, I will come back on this content moderation stuff. So when we sent to the adequate parties, your internal and external conclusion, what was the answer to what you've sent to them? The first question. And the second one, I think you have a very bullish road map in India as you want to double the workforce within 3 years. So is India going to be the highest growth area next year? And what are you going to develop there into the world [indiscernible]?

So it's very simple. The answer that we gave to the relevant parties, in that case, are exactly identical to what I'm explaining today with the specifics. That's point number one. Point number 2, India. In India, we are very bullish in India.

Daniel, give the answer to what you said to them?

By the way, if you look at the macroeconomic and the macro politics, everybody with some sense of wisdom should be bullish on India. 1.5 billion, growing middle class, strong potential to replace China for many activities that is going to accelerate the growth in India itself. And very high level educated workforce with a strong commitment to contribute. So for me, India ticks all the boxes for a company in which we want to have a major strategy development. We have already a lot of people in India. We have, at the end of the year, something like 90,000 people in India. We serve both the domestic market, which is a very interesting exercise because the -- all the price points, the costs are extremely low, as you know, and we need to be extremely smart to make a viable business in this geography. But in terms of size, I can tell you that one of our domestic Indian client has the same size in terms of number of people than our #1 client in the group that has not the same size of value by the way. In India, besides the fact that we are going to develop more and more India digital transformation center of excellence, we are also going to probably concentrate a significant amount of shared services, internal shared services in India. And we are also going to use our extraordinarily strong India footprint as a base for education of our growing managers worldwide.

Maybe the last question.

You line is open, sir.

Mind if I can -- hello?

Your last question, please?

Yes. Anything, we are going to conclude.

Mr. Gelebart, your line is still open. Do you want to ask a question or should we move on?

Yes. I just wanted to be clear once again on this content moderation stuff, Daniel. Do you see adequate parties providing an answer to your answer (sic) [ question ]? I mean is the item clear for them and did they understood perfectly what has been happening here?

You know We will see in the future, frankly speaking, as right now, it is becoming, a new topic to discuss. Probably we are going to see back-and-forth until people calm down and understand really what is at stake.

It's coming from David Cerdan from Kepler.

Just two questions. First, regarding your EBITDA margin improvement in 2022 by around 40 basis points. How do you expect this 40 basis points to be per region? And second question is regarding the TikTok. We have read certainly some press article in which we have some details about the salary of the employees, the pressure, et cetera. So what can you tell us about that? And secondly, have you investigated internally to check that the situation of the employees was not so bad as indicated in some press article? And had you have some discussion with the local unions in Colombia to take care of this issue?

We do what we have to do. I can tell you, I can give you an example. I told you that what was in the article, and I don't know why, but I mean, clearly, the people did not do a proper job, was strongly misleading, and we have the proof of that. Now regarding whatever typically in the content moderation business, the employees are paid between 50% to 100% over the minimum wage in every single country. They have 20% break time and they have 3x less attrition. And I will not say more because you are really, really misunderstanding Teleperformance if you focus on that. And the rest, we manage properly, we are a decent company.

On the margin, David, I would say 2 things. Of course, you have understood that India is growing and delivering good margin. The English world is back on track after 1 year, which was difficult. In the meantime, you have also TLS that is growing fast and hold that, not only deliver good margin but was able to swallow the reduction of the sales from COVID business that are significant. That is the reason -- that's the main reason of the increase of the margin.

If I may, I would like just to rebound on your answer. So you say something, some people say some other things. So at the end, what are the results of this campaign against Teleperformance? Do you think that it's a campaign of destabilization? What is you ration with UNI on which you were in a dispute in the past. So how do you expect to fix this kind of issue, if you could say that?

You know what, first, today, we speak about Teleperformance. Few months ago, it was another content moderation. Few months ago, it was another content moderation. And I don't know if you ask -- many of them are also publicly listed, I don't know if you ask them the same question. Because if you read the international press, you could have read in U.S. newspaper or in British newspaper topics, more or less of the same flavor regarding all the kind of companies. I would say that this come from very, very bad understanding of what is it. There is an education job to be done. It's not going to be transformed in 1 day, but it's going to happen. And the rest, we are managing. Fortunately, we have mature clients, and they continue to grow with us, as we continue to grow with them. And obviously, our orders and our books are open to any legal investigation, as we speak, extremely clear. Thank you. It was a pleasure. And I hope that you will remember that Teleperformance is not just about people who try to make polemics. Thank you.

Ladies and gentlemen, we have no further questions at this time. So I'll turn the call back over to your host for any additional or closing remarks. Thank you.

I just have to thank everybody for being here, and for having interest in the activity of our modest company. Have a great day.

Ladies and gentlemen, that will conclude today's conference. Thank you for your attendance. You may now disconnect.