The Federal Bank Limited (FEDERALBNK.NS) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Ladies and gentlemen, good day, and welcome to the Q3 FY '26 Earnings Conference Call of the Federal Bank Limited. [Operator Instructions] I now hand the conference over to Mr. Souvik Roy, Head, Investor Relations, The Federal Bank Limited. Thank you, and over to you, sir.

Thank you so much. Good evening, everyone, and a very happy New Year to all of you. Thank you for joining us today for our Q3 earnings call. Before we begin, a quick housekeeping note. In the last interaction, we had mentioned that we would try and avoid scheduling earnings calls on Saturdays, and we are glad we could keep this promise this quarter. As always, the entire senior team is here on the call with us today. We'll begin with the opening remarks from our MD and then Venkat sir, ED, would take you through the quarter, the main numbers actually and after which we'll open the floor for further questions. And given the number of participants on the call and the time available, we restrict everyone to restrict themselves to one question each, so that we can accommodate as many participants as possible. So with that, I'll hand it over to our MD. Manian, sir, over to you.

Thanks, Souvik. Before Venkat walks you through the numbers in detail, I would like to make a few introductory remarks about our -- some of the important events during this quarter. First, brand Refresh, this was one of the 12 strategic themes that we had listed in February last. As you are aware, we took on board Vidya Balan as brand ambassador and launched a media campaign Savings Ki Vidya. We took the next steps forward in this quarter. For decades, our customers discovered us by walking into the branch or by speaking to our people by experiencing our values in person. Today, the first interaction often happens on a 6-inch screen. The first judgment is formed not in our offices, but in our pixels. We are evaluated not just on rates or products or -- but on experience, simplicity and the quiet confidence with which we project in those early moments. That was the rationale for our brand refresh exercise. This is not a rebranding. At its core, this refresh stands on 3 ideas: Pride in a 90-year legacy while actively shaping the next chapter, retaining the colors of the brand is indicative of that. Openness to evolve how we work, communicate and collaborate while remaining anchored to what we stand for, make the brand -- new brand look familiar yet fresh, retaining the connect with our existing customers. And ownership, this is not a management's brand or a marketing brand, it is the bank's brand carried forward by every one of us every day. At the heart of this refresh and new visual expression of who we are, the Fortuna Wave, is a new visual expression of what we are. It brings more fluidity and freedom of expression to attract newer audiences. The Fortuna Wave represents 3 things that define our relationship with all our stakeholders: Authenticity, prosperity and togetherness, what we call APT. These are not aspirational words, they describe how we conduct ourselves with our customers, our investors and our employees every day. The intent behind this refresh is simple and deliberate to enhance recognition, to sharpen differentiation. Importantly, the refresh will go beyond digital identity. Also with this brand refresh, we have finalized our new brand design and aesthetics. We will gradually roll out that change as well. Confidence in our direction is also reflected in a significant development during the quarter. In Q3, we received Board and shareholder approval through an AGM for the proposed strategic investment by Blackstone. The transaction was also received -- has also received clearance from Competition Commission of India. This is a strong validation of our strategy, governance framework and execution capabilities. Beyond strengthening our capital base, it opens up avenues for unlocking business synergies and expanding access to global institutional expertise, reinforcing our long-term growth trajectory and deepen stakeholder confidence in our bank's future. Against this backdrop, our Q3 performance reflects a steady strengthening of underlying fundamentals, improvements in margins and ROA, reduction in funding costs through improved CASA mix, growth traction on chosen asset segments and sustained stability in asset quality are actually outcomes of disciplined balance sheet management and consistent execution over multiple quarters. We are beginning to see the benefits of stronger liability franchise and a calibrated shift in our asset mix towards segments that offer superior risk-adjusted returns. Cost discipline and prudent risk management remains central to how we operate and will continue to operate. While competitive intensity remains elevated, our focus is deliberate consistency over volatility, quality over headline growth. This positions the bank to deliver sustainable performance across cycles. With that, I will now hand over to Venkat to take you through the numbers of the quarter in more detail. Thank you.

Thank you, Manian, and good evening, everyone. Thank you for joining us to discuss our performance for the quarter. I trust you have had a chance to review our investor presentation and disclosures. Let me begin with a quick view of the macro environment for the quarter. Inflation remained well contained with headline CPI moving up 1.33% in December from 0.71% in November, reflecting some bottoming out in food prices and the print came in below market expectations. The key driver was a sharper-than-anticipated decline in vegetable prices. While core CPI edged up, this was largely driven by higher gold and silver prices. When we exclude these volatile components, underlying core inflation moderated to about 2.4% indicating that broad-based pricing pressures remain subdued. On the policy side, liquidity conditions remain supportive following the rate cut in December, which helped anchor interest rate expectations. In summary, the macro environment during the quarter remained broadly constructive, notwithstanding the ongoing global geopolitical uncertainty. Inflation was low, underlying pressures were muted and the operating environment will remain relatively stable. This provided a supportive setting for us to focus on execution, balance sheet discipline and prudent growth. Now coming to our performance for Q3. Q3 was a quarter of strengthening fundamentals and measured progress. We delivered INR 1,041.21 crores in net profit, representing 9% sequential growth driven by sustained margin expansion, disciplined cost management and continued improvement in asset quality. More importantly, these outcomes are the result of structural shift in our balance sheet, not short-term actions. On the balance sheet momentum, as at the quarter end total business stood at INR 5,53,364.49 crores, growing at 3.71% Q-o-Q and 11.4% Y-o-Y. Deposits closed the quarter at INR 2,97,795.82 crores, up 3.07% Q-o-Q and 11.8% Y-o-Y. More importantly, CASA balances grew at 6.59% sequentially and 18.86% Y-o-Y. And CASA ratio improved to 32.07%, an increase of 106 basis points Q-o-Q and 191 basis points Y-o-Y. This, we believe, is amongst one of the best in terms of CASA growth in the industry. This steady retailization of our liabilities is materially improving the durability of our funding profile, and it is now clearly reflected in our margin trajectory. Gross advances closed at INR 2,55,568.67 crores, up a very healthy 4.46% sequentially and 10.94% Y-o-Y. Again, importantly, the emphasis of growth continues to be led by the segments which we have consciously prioritized. Commercial Banking grew by 5.35% Q-o-Q, and close to 26% Y-o-Y, reflecting sustained traction in the mid-market and medium lending. Business Banking grew by 3.82% Q-o-Q, which, as you know, showed signs of turning around last quarter but was muted at the beginning of the year. So this gives us a close to 4% growth in this quarter gives us belief that the momentum will continue in the next quarter and going forward. Retail banking grew by 2.84% Q-o-Q and 14.76% Y-o-Y. Gold loan, which is another one of our medium lending portfolio, grew 12% Y-o-Y and 9% Q-o-Q despite a calibrated downsizing of a portion of the book in line with recent regulatory guidance. In addition to BuB, LAP is another portfolio which expanded quite strongly in Q3 at 4.47% Q-o-Q, with growth momentum expected to sustain and improve in the coming quarters. Corporate and Institutional Banking grew at 8.59% Q-o-Q and 14.46% Y-o-Y. The mix of growth remains intentional. We are expanding in segments that delivered superior risk adjusted returns while maintaining underwriting discipline. On margins and core income, our NII for the quarter was at INR 2,652.73 crores, growing 6.31% Q-o-Q and 9.1% Y-o-Y. NIM expanded to 3.18%, up 12 basis points sequentially. This was supported by a reduction in our funding cost, cost of deposits, cost of funds and cost of borrowing in addition to improvement in yield on investments and the CRR cut impact. The improvement in margins reflects the combined impact of liability mix optimization and asset repricing. As stated earlier, this was a quarter in which we had highest-ever NII, highest ever fee income and highest-ever OP. Our fee income stood at INR 896.47 crores, growing at 1.23% Q-o-Q and close to 19% Y-o-Y. Fee growth remains well distributed and continues to strengthen the quality of earnings. Our cost-to-income ratio improved to 53.92%, down 12 basis sequentially. During the quarter, we also added 6 branches aligned with our calibrated approach to network expansion. On asset quality and risk, our GNPA declined to 1.72%, an improvement of 11 basis points Q-o-Q and NNPA improved to 0.42%, down 6 basis points Q-o-Q and at an all-time low. Our provision coverage ratio, excluding technically written-off, increased to 75.14% and we continue to maintain around the 75% level. Credit cost for the quarter was at 0.47%, improving 3 basis points Q-o-Q. These trends reflect both portfolio seasoning and sustained focus on recovery and give us confidence in the resilience of our book. And our slippage ratio for the quarter was 0.7%. As a result of all the above improvement, our ROA increased to 1.15%, up 6 basis points sequentially and ROE improved to 11.68%, an expansion of 67 basis points Q-o-Q. You will notice that despite the 125 bps rate cut from last year December to this year December, we have -- our margins have expanded. Our ROA is also better than last year December level. EPS for the quarter was at INR 16.79 up 8.9% sequentially. Also during the quarter, we increased our stake in our associate company, Ageas Federal Life Insurance from 26% to 30% through the acquisition of 3.2 crore shares at INR 30.45 per share. The transaction was completed in November '25 after receiving all necessary approvals from RBI and IRDAI, and it strengthens our long-term strategic partnership in the life insurance business. To conclude, Q3 reinforces the fact that we are building a more stable, margin-led and buoyant franchise. Our priorities remain unchanged, strengthening the liability franchise; secondly, growing in chosen higher-quality lending segments; and thirdly, maintaining control on costs and asset quality. While competition remains intense, our focus remains on risk-adjusted profitability and consistency of outcomes rather than just pure headline growth. The balance sheet that we are building is more granular, more resilient and better positioned across rate cycles. Thank you, and we'll now open it up for questions.

[Operator Instructions] The first question is from the line of Mahrukh Adajania from Nuvama.

Congratulations. My first question is on your outlook on margins, right? You already expanded margins by 24 bps over the last 2 quarters. So where do we see margins from here on, given that the growth in mid and high segments is already very strong? So I guess it has stabilized from here on. So what is your outlook on margins for the next 2 to 3 quarters, assuming no further rate cuts? And even for the longer term, where do you see them stabilize? And my next question is on your fee income on the distribution income. If you could throw some light that wasn't very strong this quarter? So those were my questions.

Right. So just to talk about the NIM expansion, it's a journey. I don't think we are at the end of that journey. And as we keep changing the mix of our liability profile as our CASA percentage grows and our medium yield asset grow -- continue to grow faster than the low-yielding asset side. I think -- we hope to continue this journey for many more quarters to go. Of course, there will be -- immediate quarter, you will see the impact of the last rate cut play out. So we have to keep that in mind in the next quarter. A large part of the last rate cut will play out in the next quarter. Of course, we have to try and mitigate that as we have tried in the last few quarters. We will attempt to do our best on it. So -- but I don't think that journey is anywhere close to peak of what we want to get. Your second question was?

That you didn't reprice -- you did -- so you usually have a T+1 repricing except for new loans, right? So part of the repricing would have played out this quarter or no?

Yes. Yes, yes. For a month, it would have played out, the rest of the 2 months, it won't have played out. So 1/3 of that impact would have played out this quarter, 2/3 of that impact will play out in the next quarter, yes. On the distribution side, we do have a seasonal -- seasonality every year. Our insurance income is -- distribution income is usually better in the second quarter than in the third quarter usually. Having said that, there was also GST impact in the last quarter because the commissions were impacted by the change in GST structure. And last also, the product mix when the markets are buoyant, customers tend to choose ULIP products and where the commission percentages are lower. So it's partly reflective of that. In terms of volume, our traction continued to remain good.

The next question is from the line of Akshay Jain from Autonomous.

This is Akshay. So my question is on asset quality. So how do we look at asset quality for MFI segment going ahead? So if I reverse calculate your MFI credit costs, they come out to around 10%, 11%. So how should we expect this number to move incrementally? And on other segments, they are performing very well. The credit cost you have disclosed to be around 29 basis points. So assuming you build a moderation in MFI credit cost, how should this blended credit cost number move? So should we expect it to be much lower than your 50-plus basis point guidance? Or are we expecting some deterioration in other segments? So that's my first question. And secondly, on the loans -- loan mix, while you continue to state that you will be focusing on the mid-yield segments. Any quantitative number on how the mix should settle down maybe in 3, 4, 5 years? How much will be your high-yielding book, mid-yield book and low-yielding book? Anything on that?

So let me take the second one. I'll ask Venkat to answer the credit cost question, but I'll take the second one. The way I look at it is this is again a journey. It's too early to put a stable number to that. Our attempt is to keep working towards growing the mid-yield book faster than the high-yield book. And remember one thing that we have still not changed the composition of the high yield and very high-yield portion because that is the microfinance. While cards has -- you can see good growth in cards. Other high-yield segments, we have not pushed the accelerator on, whether it is personal loans or MFI because we have been waiting for pushing the accelerator on that to get more comfort on the potential credit cost of that. So I think this journey is -- we are too early in the journey to tell you how it will look 3 to 5 years later. I think the attempt is to keep working towards changing this mix favorably. How much it will reach, where it will reach too early to say. But clearly, our attempt is to improve yields on the asset side by changing this mix. On the credit cost...

Credit cost, see at the beginning of the year and in Q1 also, we said the full year guidance we gave 55 to 60 bps. And right now, for 9 months, we are already at 55 bps. So we should end the year somewhere between 55 and 50. 52, 53 bps for the full year. For the quarter, the credit cost was 47 bps, of course, lower than last quarter. So we'll continue to see the credit cost getting better in Q4 as well.

Sir, my question is like once MFI book settles down...

Sorry. Am I audible?

Yes.

Yes, you are.

Yes. On the MFI, like you said, yes, if you have seen the trajectory of slippages, it's coming down every quarter and the credit cost is also coming down. We are seeing it come down, and we expect even Q4 to be lower than what we have seen in Q3. So we should see the improvement being reflected in the MFI as well. Now have we seen a full recovery in MFI? We don't think so. We are still cautious in terms of growing the MFI business and it's being grown selectively. So we'll watch for one more quarter before we decide how much to press the pedal on MFI.

And just to add to that, in the medium term, we should also remember that as we build the medium yield assets, the credit cost on those will be higher than the low yield assets, right? For example, corporate credit costs are close to 0, whereas there will be credit cost coming out of the -- so as of now, we are not yet giving a significantly different guidance compared to our -- where we are today. We will evaluate that guidance as we go forward.

Understood. Sir, and just one more question on how is your MSME asset quality progressing? And any impact you're seeing from U.S. tariffs or you're hearing anecdotally from the industry?

No. Like Venkat mentioned earlier, if you see the -- what we call the BuB segment, the lower end of SME, we have actually begun to grow that in this quarter with comfort on the credit side. Actually, our credit costs are well in control and the portfolio is absolutely -- I mean, we haven't seen any deterioration at all. And in the Commercial Banking, which is the higher end of SME, again, our portfolio quality remains robust. We aren't seeing any stress in that portfolio. Actually, both these segments this quarter, costs are lower than -- credit costs are lower than what they were last quarter.

The next question is from the line of Rikin Shah from IIFL Capital.

I have 4 quick questions. The first one on the growth clearly...

I'm sorry to interrupt you, Mr. Shah. May we request you to please speak a bit louder.

Is this better?

Slightly.

Rikin, did we hear you correctly? You have 4 questions.

Yes. So I had 4 questions basically. So the first one is on the growth. So on the growth, you're clearly restructuring the mix towards mid yielding segment, which partly is reflecting in your margin performance as well. So when does this restructuring largely gets done, you reach your target mix and we can expect the bank to grow in line or maybe faster than the system? So that's number one. Second, if I look at the reported margins, they are up 12 basis points sequentially, but the lending spreads are broadly flat. So if you could just provide some walk-through of where this reported NIM improvement is coming from. Third is on CASA. So this is again second quarter of good CASA traction. Last quarter, we saw SA momentum was good. It sustained this time and this quarter, even CA has picked up. So I just wanted to check on CA specifically. Any period-end chunky balances that may get potentially reversed? Or this is a real organic improvement in CA as well that we saw in the quarter? And fourth and the last one, just wanted to get a sense on when do we expect the first tranche of fund infusion from Blackstone coming in? Would it be in 4Q FY '26 or maybe 1Q FY '27?

Thanks, Rikin. Rikin, this quarter, our asset growth is 4.5%, so close to 4.5%. And so I don't know, when you say that will it recover to industry levels, I don't know, which industry level you're talking about. So I don't have an answer to that question.

On Y-o-Y basis. No, no, SA I was talking in...

I'm assuming you are measuring momentum by the last quarter.

Fair enough. So you're saying that this momentum should broadly sustain going ahead as well?

I will qualify it partly. As you have seen, all our chosen segment, our run rates are quite good. And this quarter, of course, we got very good growth on corporate as well. So maybe the 8% kind of quarterly growth on corporate may have sustained, but even if you drop that lower, our run rates will be fairly healthy, right? So that is on the asset growth. On the NIM, I'll ask Venkat to take it, but before that, on CASA -- on CASA, first of all, there are no chunky stuff there. It is all reasonably granular, but I will just requalify it by saying that there are usually, of course, bump-ups that happen in the quarter end due to the nature of the business, but we should -- that is why we disclose our averages through the quarter. And if you see the average, growth in averages also are quite healthy. So therefore if you remain focused on the averages that we report, it will tell you that it is reasonably secular. CASA growth, of course, is -- there is no one silver bullet we have used. It is a factor of multiple things, including better productivity from branches, newer products. It's a combination of various things, and this journey, of course, continues. We can do more, and we will continue to focus on that. On the Blackstone, of course, we are awaiting final regulatory approvals on that. So we are hoping that this quarter, it will get -- in the last quarter we'll get done. That's our expectation. We'll keep you posted with the actual development on that. NIM, walk through, again, NIM, my broad comment will be NIM, again, is no one single silver bullet. It is a combination of multiple things that improve our NIM. We work on granularly on multiple things to make sure our NIM improves, but I'll ask Venkat to take the details of it.

Yes, in terms of NIM, like Manian said several factors both, on the downside, yield on advances has gone down by 9 bps. But on the upside, we have had several factors. One is cost of deposits is lower, our cost of borrowings has gone down. CRR cut to some extent has come. Better yield on investments as compared to last quarter and our own average own fund. A combination of these 5, 6 factors helped us in terms of getting to 3.18%. So several things. And we have to continue to work on all of them.

The next question is from the line of Piran Engineer from CLSA.

Congratulations on the quarter, and thanks for keeping your promise of not keeping it on a weekend. Just getting back on the NIM question, how much of your TD repricing is left?

As we had earlier indicated, our -- from the cycle started, we think it is about 14 months on an average. 14 months, it takes to fully reprice the term deposits, and that means we have about 4 or 5 months to go.

2 more quarters?

1.5 more quarters, yes.

Yes. Okay. Okay. That answers my question. Secondly, just in this quarter also the yield decline of 10, 12 bps Q-o-Q. Now 2, 3 bps would have come because you have immediately passed on the repo rate cut. But what led to the other 8, 9 bps of decline?

The total decline is only 8 bps or rather 9 bps, so...

Yield on advances 8.86% to 8.74%.

On NIM basis it's only 9 bps. There's a drop in yield on advances.

Yes. I mean I'm going by your reported numbers, 8.86% to 8.74%. Now out of that ballpark 2, 3 bps would be due to the repo rate cut.

Piran, but the incremental business also happens at lower rate, right? As the rates drop, incremental business, for example, MCLR repricing would have happened on other assets, non-repo assets. New business would come at lower rates because markets do pricing drop in rates. New corporate business would have come at lower rates. So all that also happens, right? So yes, the yields do go down overall. But of course, our costs also go down.

Okay. So then this NIM improvement this quarter, going back to Rikin's question is essentially balance sheet management, where we must have reduced liquidity on the balance sheet, more loans on the balance sheet, and that's why we see this 12 bp benefit. Is my understanding correct?

So when you say balance sheet management, CASA improvement -- CASA percentage improvement has an impact on cost of funds, right? Cost of deposits go down. Yes. So it is a mix of both. It's not -- borrowing cost is not balance sheet borrowing cost reduction is actual cost reduction. So yes, it's a mix. Like I said, this is not one silver bullet, which is solving it for us, right? We have to work on multiple parameters to improve NIM, and we'll continue to do that.

Understood. Okay. And just lastly, in terms of your mortgages and your auto loan books now those have been fairly stable for the last 4, 5 quarters now. So just wanted to get a sense of when we will start seeing these segments pick up?

See, right now, on the home loan, particularly home loan, as you can see, we have stepped up the pace on our LAP book. As you can see, the growth rate in the LAP is reasonably healthy this quarter. On the home loan side, we are not finding the risk rewards attractive just now. We feel that the pricing is below the optimal levels that we require. And therefore, as you can see, we have not grown that aggressively. We, of course, continue to serve our existing customer needs, but we are not going out and acquiring aggressively at those kind of rates. These are long-term commitments. This is a very long-term product. And structurally, you can lock the balance sheet on poor rate economics for a long time, and therefore, we are cautious. When we get comfortable -- so I don't have an answer as to when we will change that one. We will continue to focus on areas where we think the risk rewards are good. Auto, hopefully, we can -- we are working towards. We have made some structural changes internally to make auto work. Auto, we hopefully get back sooner. On the home loan, I will wait and see how the situation evolves, the competitive intensity evolves and how the pricing in the market evolves to see whether we can press the accelerator on that. But the way, Piran, I see is we have opportunity to grow the assets, other assets, as you can see, many of them are growing in their 20s, and we will continue to focus on that to build the balance sheet.

Got it. And just lastly, quickly, branch openings have slowed down a lot this year. Why is that?

As you know, earlier, we have addressed this issue. We have been working on multiple things on the branch side, like the “Free The Branch” initiative that we have been doing. So we are kind of reimagining the branch operating model. And we wanted on settling that before we push the accelerator on branch openings. We also wanted to -- we were working on the brand, brand refresh, branch formats, reformatting our actual physical layouts of the branches, branding. We are also -- we have also gone through evaluation of our branch network in terms of the efficiency of the network, whether we need to relocate some branches, whether we need to review some branch sizes. So various things are -- were in the pipeline. So we wanted to get a better handle on all that before trying to push the accelerator on the branch numbers. You will see better branch traction in the quarter 4 already.

The next question is from the line of Abhishek M from HSBC.

Congratulations for the quarter. So a couple of questions. The first is...

Can you get closer to the mic or -- you obviously not very audible?

Is this better?

Yes. That's better.

Okay. Sorry about that. So the first question is on OpEx. I just wanted to check that now since you're anyway going to grow mid yielding, et cetera, which is more granular business, what would be the run rate of OpEx? Would it grow at this 4%, 5% Q-o-Q range and that means annualized high teens maybe? Or does that taper off at some point of time?

Yes. Abhishek, this is Venkat. On the cost, as we had indicated earlier, the cost income ratio, if you had seen it has to do with both management of costs and the income traction. So this quarter, it's down because we have had strong income momentum. But our guidance we have said that over the 2- to 3-year period, it will be a range bound in the 53 to 55 because they will be reinvesting the sales in distribution, technology and all the other initiatives. So -- but at the same time, our endeavors to ensure that we try and get to a positive jaws so that the alignment of cost is in line with the income growth.

We had said earlier that this is a tightrope walk we will do. We will build income and we have always stated that. So we -- our guidance has been that don't build in benefits out of that. If we get that it's a bonus, but we will remain very focused on making sure that we are efficient. But just now, we don't want you to -- our guidance is don't build efficiencies out of that in the short term. We'll see in the medium term.

Yes, exactly because if you're in a build-out phase you will need to make those.

Yes. Yes.

Okay. The other one is on 2 or 3 segments of your loan mix. One, I wanted to check, gold loans, are you seeing any kind of yield pressure or pressure to raise LTV, et cetera? And -- or is the market largely rational at this point of time as well?

I'll ask Harsh to take that.

Hi, Harsh here. The pressure on yield on gold loans in general would be there because of the falling interest rates and some of the PSU banks offering rates, but the gold loan book has grown substantially. We have actually maintained our yields on our gold loan book. The challenges on LTV has actually not happened because our LTV has actually come off. If you look at from last quarter to this quarter, the LTV has actually dropped, and this is not just for us, industry-wide phenomenon because of the increase in the gold loan prices. So we are not going to push growth by targeting only LTV. So this is where it is. So at this point in time, I would say that the yields are being maintained and managed. I don't see -- growth has been reasonably good for us and LTV pressures are not there at this point in time.

In fact, the gold loan growth rate of 9% is in spite of the -- what Venkat mentioned in his thing, running down of our wholesale lending kind of a book we had, which is not allowed under the new regulation. So if you gross for that, it's another 2%, 2.5% higher.

It's actually -- it's almost 19% Y-o-Y -- and if I look at the beginning of the financial year, it's actually 22%.

Okay, okay. And most of it would be price driven, right, not really tonnage driven.

You mean the growth?

The growth, so basically more tonnage.

Yes. So our tonnage has not gone up this quarter, yes. So somewhat...

And on LTV, they are at 52, right? [indiscernible]

From LTV perspective we are at...

We have more headroom available if we have to do that.

Sure, sure. Perfect. The personal loan book, like MFI, you indicated that you're still looking at the environment and where the credit cost will settle. Is it the same in the personal loan book? Or are you seeing any kind of comfort there and you could start growing? I know you indicated that you're still watching, but what is that metric or indication that would make you start growing that book?

No. So compared to MFI, we are more comfortable in the personal loan space. Yes. And we are -- I would say we are in baby steps in terms of -- actually, we did highest personal loan disbursement in the last 12 months -- in the last month, actually in the month of December. So we are trying to build that, but slowly baby steps, I would say, yes. But we have more comfort in that space than the MFI space just now. But we are just now focused that product on our existing customers alone. We haven't gone out to acquire customers on that product, which is something that we are evaluating. We'll see the economics of that must justify. We are looking at the options there.