The Platform Group AG (TPG.F) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Good morning, ladies and gentlemen and welcome to the earnings call of the Platform Group following the publication of the preliminary figures of 2025 and the outlook of 2026. We are delighted to welcome the CEO, Dr. Dominik Benner; as well as Head of Finance and M&A, Bjoern Minnier; as well as Investor Relations, Nathalie Richert who will speak in a moment and guide us through the presentation and the results. Afterwards, you will have the possibility to place your questions directly to the management. Having said this, I'm handing over to you, Dr. Benner. The stage is yours.

Yes. Thank you, Judith, and welcome to everybody on this call today. So first of all, we would like to give you a short update about the current development of our group. As you know that we published an announcement yesterday regarding our significant acquisition, we will also give you a short update on that acquisition and the strategy behind this acquisition. And after this, we continue with our financial figures for 2025, which we published also yesterday. So let us start. So currently, you see our management structure with the Supervisory Board and our management. Today, Mr. Minnier, Ms. Richert and me, will present the current status of the numbers and also our current strategic initiatives. And let us just jump directly to the current development. So I would start directly with Nathalie.

Good morning, everyone. Thank you for joining. The Platform Group is still a young company. We are on the capital markets since 2023. And since the end of 2022, our share price has increased by approximately 39% despite a challenging market environment where benchmark indices performed weaker. From a capital market perspective, we are supported by 7 active research providers and the average target price is clearly above the current share price, reflecting confidence in our long-term strategy. On the next slide, in 2025 and beyond, we are intensifying our dialogue with European and international investors. through targeted road shows, conferences and direct one-on-one engagement. Trading activity increased year-on-year. You see that on the slide, supported by more active investor outreach. We also see an higher engagement from international investors. Our objective is a stable, long-term oriented shareholder structure. On the next slide, you see our share and bond performance in 2025. We are not happy with that development. Our share price declined by 29%. The development was driven by market volatility, investor structure and specific one-off effects rather than a change in operational performance. It was driven by a fund redemption, what is now over, and we can move forward. Since January, we have registered shares. This provides us with an increasing visibility on our shareholder base. From an [ IR ] perspective, this is an important step towards more targeted, transparent and proactive investor communication. Alongside this, our focus remains on operational execution and disciplined capital markets allocation. Turning to the bond. Since December, we were technical in nature and largely driven by market structure, not fundamentals. Larger sell orders executed on German trading venues lead to following on selling in small ticket sizes across a highly fragmented and illiquid German market. At the same time, the bond stays stable on the Oslo Stock Exchange. There was no change in our operating performance. We fully acknowledge investor questions, and we believe the recent price movements do not reflect the underlying fundamentals on the business. We believe that better transparency and closer engagement will support sustainable value creation over time. I will hand over to Dominik.

All right. Thank you for this. And so we continue with the current status of our portfolio companies. Here you see our current status, which is segmented into 5 different segments. So on the left side, you see the Consumer Goods segment, the Industrial Goods segment. And since last year, since mid of last year, we also have the Optics & Hearing segment. Additionally, you find on the bottom line, the freight goods segment and the Pharma and Retail Goods segment. So those are segments which are quite important and which are growing on a very good development, and we are very happy to see this development in the last year. When we look a little bit more on the M&A detail side, you see that we have strengthened our existing segments. So in the last year, we have acquired 2 relevant companies in the luxury goods segment, one is Joli Closet. It's a company based in Paris. They are focusing on vintage luxury products, and it is 43einhalb. This is a shoe sneaker company in the luxury sector here in Germany, and we acquired them by January this year. On the pharma side, we will come to that later that you get an overview on these developments. On the furniture side, we already had 2 existing platforms. We acquired a third one. And with the B2B SaaS business, fintus, we acquired them also last year, a very successful SaaS software company, and they are making platforms for financial institutions in Germany. On the right side, if you see that we also entered new industries. For example, Optics & Hearing, that was one of our major acquisition last year. So we bought different companies. In total, we have 28 stores already. We have a successful online platform where we sell online glasses and sunglasses. Additionally, we acquired 2 companies, which are called Herbertz and Lyra Pet, both very much focused in the niche industry like pet food and like outdoor equipment. And on the right side, if you see one of our latest acquisitions, it is called Weconnect Work. It's a platform for construction businesses. And on this platform, you can book as a business company, construction operators. And yes, they have also a very profitable niche business here. When we go forward, you see also our luxury portfolio. As you know, since 2022, we are engaged in the luxury sector. By end of 2022, we acquired fashionette. And since this time, we made some additional acquisitions to go forward in this industry and to make sure that we get a bigger footprint there and also to find attractive niches in this luxury segment, for example, vintage goods where we can expand our revenues and our profits. On the next page, you see a very relevant overview of our partner development. Why we do show you this year? Sometimes people ask us, why do you grow in a stagnating market. And the backbone of our growth is always that we want to increase the number of partners. Partners means retailers, partners means the manufacturers. And when we have more partners, we get more products from them. And when we have more products, we directly increase our total number of customers because more customers are attracted to our online shops and to our goods. And so as you can see here in 2023, we started with more than 5,500 partners. We have increased it a lot since last year. So last year, we increased it organically to more than 7,000 partners. And additionally, we reached more than 6,500 new partners, and we did it with acquiring companies like Avocadostore, like Winkelstraat, just for an example, these are very successful companies in their niche segments. And yes, they are connected with local partners, retailers and online retailers. On the right side, you see the development for 2025. So here, you see that we have a very strong organic growth here. That means in our existing platforms, we attracted a lot of new partners. And you also see that we have acquired some new companies here like Joli Closet or like Herbertz, Lyra Pet, and they are also contributing to this growing number of partners. Well, that means with that strategy, we can also increase this year in 2026, our number of partners, and we expect to have more than 18,000 partners by end of this year just from an organic perspective. When I go a little bit further, you see our latest acquisitions. So here, you can see the acquisition of apothekia. This is a market leader for digital learning and digital education in the pharmaceutical sector. They are working for hundreds of different manufacturers, like Novartis, like Roche and so on. And they make it for almost all the pharmacies here in Germany. So they are quite well connected. On the right side, you see the acquisition of AEP, a company which we will present to you now for some more updates on that. And also important, you see that we made the acquisition of 43einhalb. This is a little bit strange name, but a very successful niche player in the fashion sneaker sector and with a very high price level on the average price. We also made the change in our organizational structure. So last year, we announced that we will change from AG structure to KGaA. We approved that by our AGM in the summer. And finally, we realized this strategy by end of last year. So now we are officially the KGaA. And we also have registered shares that we can work with that and have our control on all our shares and know who is the owner and know who is selling and buying our shares every day. And very important also to understand here is that we also have our organizational structure. You see below our holding structure, which is not operationally organized. You see below that, we have our operational holdings and sub holdings like the Platform Group AG, like fashionette GmbH and Brandfield BV and Fastylo BV on the right side. These are both located in the Netherlands, and they are in our company, in our group for more than 4 years already. All right. So we continue with our AEP acquisition. That's the deal what we announced yesterday. And it's -- I think it's very important to give you a better understanding on why we did it, what's our strategic rationale behind that and why we think that this is a good strategic move to continue with that and to make sure that we have a good progress in this industry in the future. So first of all, you see our overview on the companies which we've acquired in the last few years. So on the left side, you see ApoNow. This is a company which we acquired in 2021. We increased our share to 80% in the last few years, and they are connecting more than 38,000 pharmacies, local pharmacies with manufacturers. So it's really an attractive niche business. And we make sure that all the pharmacies which are connected to our system that they get online orders from all the -- where we sell. And so we can make sure that they all get the orders every day to the local pharmacy. On the right side, you see apothekia. apothekia is an online education platform, which is a market leader in Germany, as I mentioned. They have more than 8,000 pharmacies working with them, working with the system. And this is also quite important to understand that this is a perfect combination that we make all the online orders for the pharmacy, that we make the education for the pharmacy, and now it is the next step that AEP is the central order platform that we can work together with them. So here, you can see the structural chart on why we think that this is a very good strategic acquisition. On the left side, you see the sourcing platform. So the manufacturers in the pharmaceutical industry sell their products to AEP. On the bottom, you see the educational platform. In the center of this chart, you see the pharmacies, and we try to cover all the relevant services and needs of pharmacy to really become an important partner for them and to really complete the value chain in the sector. So this is our really strategic focus on how we can increase our footprint there, how we can realize synergies and how we can make sure that we are a good partner and supporter of local pharmacies. That is our intention here, and that is how we want to go further with this. So on this slide, if you see the question on, is it a good business to be in? Because, of course, we get questions from our analysts or from shareholders when they ask us, is this business healthy? Do you think that the pharmaceutical business is a good business? And can you really increase revenue and profit there? So overall, I think you know that this market is right now in a very much customer focused because new companies like dm and Rossmann, they are entering the market right now. For us, they are not a competitor because we are not an online seller here. So I think it's quite attractive to see this development, and we see that more and more competition is going to be there. And I think we can be proud to support the local pharmacies here and also to make sure that they have a stable partner and to really increase the revenue together with them. Because overall, this market is very attractive. You see increasing revenues here. And the regulation, of course, it is always a risk factor. So it's a downside potential that regulatory can change things here, that regulatory can change prices here. But overall, we think that this is a very attractive way how we can increase our numbers here and how we can make sure that we have a good progress in this business here. So let's start with AEP. On the right side, you see the headquarter of AEP. It is in Bavaria, very close to Schaffenburg and Frankfurt. And you see on the bottom how the headquarters look like. So they have a big logistic hub there. Additionally, they have all their offices there in Alzenau and the company was founded in 2012 as a pharmaceutical wholesaler, as a B2B platform, and they only have B2B revenues. So they are really a pure B2B player. They only have B2B revenues. Additionally, they had a very good growth perspective in the last years. So in 2021, they started -- they had a revenue level of EUR 500 million. Now they have doubled it within 4 years. And so you can see that there's a really high market dynamic and that you can see that they have a very good market position. They are not the biggest in the market. So they also have additional other competitors like the PHOENIX group, just to mention one. But from the cost-income ratio, from the cost ratio, they are best-in-class, and I'm more than happy that we would like to acquire them and combine a good pharma group together with them. On the bottom, you see the corporate structure. So currently, the Austrian postal company, which is a state-owned or state majority company, they have the majority stake here at AEP. And on the right side, you see that they have some minority shareholders. In total, they have, I think, 5 shareholders. Yes. And so this is our acquisition process, and I'm very happy that Bjoern Minnier take over for the next pages to give you some more details on AEP. Bjoern you're muted.

So hello to everyone. And in my position, I should be less emotional, but still, I'm very happy that we managed yesterday after a very long process in the acquisition to sign the SPA for AEP. And I believe that the extra about EUR 1 billion, Dominik probably mentioned that right before in sales, the approximately EUR 20 million in revenue, in profit, EBITDA profit will really be a great benefit to our group. So the AEP, and we have been conducting a deep dive and they are really is a jewel in the pharmaceutical industry. It has excellent connections to the pharmacies and also on the procurement side to the pharmaceutical industry. It is wholesaler, which is -- which has specialized in the industry. And you can see that by a very, very slim cost line, which it has all over the entire production, which is the logistics process, and we are looking right now here at the logistics process. So I'll keep this short. And overall, this is regular pharmaceutical logistics process. It's asset heavy. As you see, we have to procure the goods at the beginning then we take them in the warehouse. The warehouse is highly automated. It has special areas for different kind of medications. It has regular warmth rooms and also it has cold storage rooms. It has a highly automated picking and packaging process. Same is valid for the shipping, which is being conducted by certain specialty carriers. And the entire delivery is being performed overnight. And this is why it is important that the AEP is located east of Frankfurt, as you have been seeing on the page before because Frankfurt, as most of you might be aware of, is located relatively in the middle of Germany, and so we can reach all areas in Germany within specialized overnight process. As you see, the AEP partners with all major relevant pharmaceutical manufacturers. You can see it's Novartis, it's Bristol-Myers Squibb, it's Pfizer, it's Eli Lilly, it's GlaxoSmithKline, it's Bayer. So all the major brands are a supplier, respectively, a partner of the AEP. AEP managed a very, very strong growth in sales. From 2021 to 2025, sales have almost doubled from EUR 500 million to now almost EUR 1 billion in sales. The lever behind it is that the AEP in this business is relatively small. So it's not largely inflated. So this is why it has a chance to be a price leader. And it has a broad customer base with about 7,000 pharmacies. It has all the necessary licenses to be a major player in the pharmaceutical market. And we have a very strong educated senior management team and about 250 specialized employees in AEP. What I like if I look at the business is that the customer base is not too much concentrated on just a few small customers. And what you see here, this is actually almost ideal. You see a spread which is 1/3 each between A, B and C customers. And to have a relatively large group of A customers indicates that you are not depending on just a few and you have a lot of growth potential with the B and C customers. So that's a perfect base to start with. And you see that the development of the registered customers, pharmacies that is, has been rapidly growing from 1,800 2 years after the start to now 7,000, and there still is a lot of potential left over for further growth. So we can develop the number of registered pharmacies. The process is the signing, as I just mentioned, just happened yesterday. And then we have the cartel procedures, which we have to go through. This is going to be another 2 ideally, maybe up to 4 months. And then we will continue with the closing probably at the end of Q2 in 2026.

All right. So we continue with the financials. Right now, we just have the preliminary figures. So we do not give too many details right now because, of course, the annual report is not finished. We do not have our financial figures audited right now. So these are just an overview of our financials preliminary to the last year 2025. So overall, just to start with that, we had a positive development in 2025. So that means in total, we had 11 signings and acquisitions. And we also had 3 divestments in Q4. So we mentioned and we announced that we sell 3 very small companies, which are too small for our group, which are not suitable to our size already, and we divested it last year. And very important to underline is that we increased our profitability. So in total, we had an increase of the EBITDA adjusted of more than 65%. And I think this is quite a good result regarding the market circumstances and the increasing loan costs -- the increasing personnel costs in Germany. Also very important to underline is that we had a good decrease in the operational costs. So that means marketing did not go up, which we expected at the beginning of the year. Distribution is on a stable level. So we are very happy that this is not increasing all the time. And also HR costs, we really try to focus not to hire too many people and also reduce staff when we think that this is necessary and when we think that AI is a relevant driver here. Additionally, we see excellent conditions for new M&A activity. You saw that in 2025, we made a lot of acquisitions. In 2026, we will continue with that. That means we are very confident that we see good targets and that we will buy other companies this year for a very reasonable price and for good valuation levels. Very important to underline is that we have our TPG One software, and that means we can connect partners like local retailers in a very fast time. We expect on average less than 4 months when we adapt and integrate new partners on our platform. And so this is a very good basis how we can scale our business and how we can also enter into new industries. Our 5 established segments continue to grow. So in all our segments, we had a growth in the revenue and also the profits and the numbers of partners achieved a record level of more than 16,600. So this is the highest level achieved -- we ever had in our company, and we are a little bit proud of that because not in every industry, you see so many partners coming to us. But overall, we are on a very good track for that. On the right side, you see that we have increased our guidance 2x last year, and we achieved a revenue of EUR 728 million, and this was in the upper half of our own forecast range. And the EBITDA adjusted was EUR 55 million, which is an increase of 65%. So here, again, you can see the summary of the guidance for the revenue, for the EBITDA and the leverage. And I will go on the details on the next page. So GMV increased by 44% to EUR 1.3 billion. Revenue increased by 39% to EUR 728 million. Here, you can see the EBITDA adjusted, we increased from EUR 33 million to EUR 55 million. And on the right side, you see the net profit, which increased to EUR 46.5 million last year. And also when you see it on the long-term perspective, you see the 3-year perspective, we saw, I think, a very stable and continuous growth path as well as for the revenue and also for the EBITDA margin. As you know, we try to increase our margin. And so we are quite confident that we will also do it this year. When we go a little bit more into the details, you can see here our preliminary financial figures for the P&L statement. So right now, we have no full balance sheet statement, but you can already see our preliminary unaudited financial figures for 2025. So here you can see that our other revenue amount was less compared to last year. That is directly relating to the PPA effects. The PPA effects were around EUR 18 million last year. So it was less than 2024. And so it was less other revenues compared to 2024. The gross margin, also important, it was on a stable level Actually, we expected a little bit more, to be honest. But in the last quarter, in Q4, we saw lower margins and we saw a higher price volatility due to black week and cyber week, and so the margin was a little bit lower-than-expected from our side. Marketing cost was 5.9%. This is pretty much in line with our Q3 figures. Distribution costs were on the same level. So there was no change in the percentage and HR costs was a little bit less because we have some scale effects in the revenue growth. The EBITDA was EUR 55 million, which represents 7.6% compared to our net revenue. On the earnings side, you see that earnings per share was EUR 2.26, and this is a growth of 41%. This is pretty much in line with our forecast. And actually, we just had lower PPA effects compared to last year, so also this is affecting these numbers. Our minority results were EUR 4.5 million due to the new acquired companies in 2024 and 2025. As you know, we make a lot of 50.1% or 51% acquisitions at the beginning and increase our share over time. The debt leverage, also to show that, we have a range in our forecast. And last year, we achieved a debt leverage of 2.2, and we want to decrease it within the next few years. Here, also important to show you that is our organic and inorganic or nonorganic growth, because we always get the question on how do you grow organically? How much was from M&A activity in the last 12 months? Here, you see the overview. So compared to 2024, we increased our organic growth. So we had more organic growth compared to last year. Overall, in 2025, we had 63% organic growth and the rest was nonorganic. Why do we do that? Why do we get organic growth? This is very simple. You see it on the right side. So we have more partners. We have 24% more products compared to 2024. And we have also a good growth rate in the Consumer Goods segment and in the freight goods segment. Also, here you see the relevance of artificial intelligence. This is a thing what we did not really covered 2 years ago. So last year, we completely changed our strategy here. We implemented an own AI team, which are really much working for our subsidiaries, and they take care that we have cost effects here that we can reduce the cost basis and that we can increase the automation on our process here. And you see that last year, we only had 12% of our group-wide processes being automized or AI affected. This is going to be changed dramatically in the next years. So we expect an increase to more than 60%. That means 60% of our processes in our company will be affected and possibly changed with AI. And this is a huge impact in our organization and it is affecting directly the departments, the departments like software development, like online marketing, HR finance and content creation. All right. So coming to the last chapter of our call today, you see our vision for 2023. This is what we already presented to you last year. So it is not in your slide, but we just want to remember what was our starting point when we presented that. So our goal was that until 2030, we want to achieve a revenue of EUR 3 billion. We want to achieve double-digit margins and a leverage below 1.8 as a multiplier. And we want to be in 50 industries at least and to have more than 40,000 partners. When we look on the development on this path, you see that in 2022, we started with EUR 300 million. So this year, we expect stand-alone EUR 1 billion revenues. And for 2030, we expect it according to our last year guidance that we want to increase it to EUR 3 billion. How do we do that? If you have seen that we have different strategies, how to achieve that. And here you see that organic is quite the most important one. So with organic growth like new partners or new products, we see the most relevant growth coming to the EUR 3 billion. The second is the synergies. So we want to enter new industries and also want to enter into the North American market. And on the right side, you see that we also want to do M&A in existing segments. And that is what we do right now also this year. So AEP was an acquisition or is an acquisition, which is running this year. We hope that everything will go well and that we can acquire the company. And here, you can see a guidance on the one side without AEP and on the other side with AEP. So including AEP, if we close this transaction in the next month, you see that our pro forma revenue will go up to EUR 2 billion. Our pro forma EBITDA adjusted will be up to EUR 100 million and the GMV will increase up to EUR 3 billion. And also very important to understand, AEP has around 7,000 partners, pharmacies. And so the number of partners would also increase from this acquisition. Here, you can see also the charts regarding the stand-alone guidance and the guidance with AEP, so you see for the revenue and also for the EBITDA adjusted. All right, Nathalie.

Yes, Here, you see our financial calendar. We are on many conferences this year and actually scheduled some road shows in Europe. And yes, if you have questions, come back to us at every time we react very soon. And if you are actually not in our Investor Relations newsletter then please join our QR code is in the presentation, and I'm very looking forward to the exchange this year.

Thank you very much for your presentation and the dive into your numbers.[Operator Instructions] And I will give the word to you, Dominik.

Yes. So first question is if the stock dropped without any change in the operational business, why we don't see an aggressive buyback program? Absolutely. I completely agree with you. The issue is that according to our bond terms, we are not allowed to make a buyback program. So we are not allowed to do that as long as we have the current Nordic bond. Otherwise, of course, we will do that definitely. Next question. It is about the domains, which domains are most relevant for your results right now. I'm asking from a zero perspective. So this is a technical perspective on Google. So actually, we do not have a chart where we can show our most relevant pages. But of course, you know that fashionette is quite a relevant page. Chronext is a relevant page. 0815 is a very relevant page. And so you can see on our portfolio, which are the bigger Google domains and which are smaller Google domains. Actually, in the B2B sector, we do not work with online shops, which are public. So these are closed online shops and you see no Google ranking, for example. So HOOD group, for example, they have a really big revenue, but you see no online products available for you because it's only for B2B. Next question was about the -- could you give an indication on how much cash you spent on acquisitions in full year '25? Would around EUR 50 million cash outflow be a good estimate? So right now, we did not publish a cash flow statement because it's not finished at this time. We have to consolidate all the different companies and get the preliminary annual reports from them. So right now, we cannot give you an answer on that. The next question from you was the nature of AEP business? As a pharma seller is to have a high inventory position, how does it fit to the Platform strategy? Actually, yes, the inventory of AEP is between EUR 40 million and EUR 70 million. But on the other side, it is a very fast servicing product. So it is not there for 2 years or something. So every day, it is changing there. And so it is really a part of our pharma strategy to build a pharma group where the Platform Group is the owner and the pharma group should really give a whole perspective on how we can support local pharmacies and how we can cover the full value chain here. And so this is -- yes, you're right. The inventory is higher than other companies. But on the other side, it's very important for us to cover this value chain piece because this is a very relevant piece for our local pharmacies. The share price is directly tied to the market, lack of trust in the company, for example, Manager Magazin, why don't you mention it and give more transparency around it? So actually, we do give transparency, and we have an own website where you can see all allegations and our response on that so that we can give you a transparent overview on that. And I think this is a very important step to give you a better understanding on how our perspective is and why we completely deny these allegations. The number of offline pharmacies decreased by 2% to 3% per year in Germany. So why did AEP grow so fast in the last years? The answer is very simple. AEP is a very successful company and the number of pharmacies, which are connected and delivering every day, it is increasing. You are right, the number is decreasing, but the number of connected pharmacies is increasing from the AEP side. Additionally, also the revenue is increasing in the market. So the market is getting bigger, the population in Germany is getting older and older, and we spend more on pharmacies and not less. So this is also very important to understand why this is increasing. All right. Let's continue.

A small note in between, please understand that we are only accepting questions via chat box today. For a direct exchange, please contact Investor Relations, Nathalie Richert afterwards.

The next question, Bjoern, maybe you can answer that. The warehouse is owned by AEP or is it leased? Bjoern, you are muted.

Yes, it's leased.

It looks like an EBITDA margin of 2%, I suppose the net margin will be very low or even negative? No. We have a positive margin, it's a net positive margin. It's a net positive EBITDA, and so it is above the number what you have mentioned. Then there's a next question regarding the total transaction value. So for reasons of confidentiality, we have no public announcement of the purchase price of the company. So we cannot give you a detail on that. Okay. The next question about understanding of our group. So when there's a low stock price, why do you think investors do not understand your business or your business model and your future prospects? Yes, basically, that is may be right because maybe our business is a little bit more complex. We have a lot of different portfolio companies. And yes, you are right. Sometimes it's a little bit difficult to understand it. When we talk with American or North American investors, we see a very high understanding of what we do. They also have some peer group companies there. But you are right, in Germany, sometimes people just do not understand our business model. And it's not just a simple, yes, we buy and sell online products. It's more complex, and we have 5 different segments. This makes it even more complex compared to just one pure-play company, for example, in the fashion sector. So yes, you're right. And yes, we have to really give better understandings and better explanations on how our business model works. Next question. In the last call, you expected for the full year 2025 an adjusted EBITDA of EUR 58 million and an earnings per share of EUR 2.49. Your current numbers are below. So did the cost in the last quarters had an effect on that? The answer is very simple. We always communicated a range. We increased our guidance last year for 2x already. And this increased guidance, we met as well as in the revenue and in the profit. So I think we can be quite happy on this development. And the Q4 was okay. So we had a good Q4. And to mention that we had good Q4 numbers. But as every time, the Q4 is always the lowest margin in the full year because you have to give higher discounts, you have to participate in the cyber week and the Black Friday week and so on. So this is quite relevant for the margin effect.

Okay. And maybe I would like to add 3 more points why we believe that AEP can grow faster than the market. First of all, we plan to focus on specialty pharma, which is very, very high sales prices. This is, for example, in the area of cancer, oncology, it's immunology. These are Rx medi communications where you have very high prices and where you can rapidly boost your sales. Secondly, all cold chain products are growing faster than the market, and AEP is very professional with their cold chain logistics, which they have. And it's actually new areas. I mentioned earlier on blistering, for example, would be a service we are analyzing to offer. Blistering means that actually in the warehouse, you are packaging the single medi communication for patients in hospitals, for example, or for the pharmacies. And this is an extra service which is paid well.

Thank you. So next point was that we announced a raise an increase of our shares, you give us more details on that. So yes, we did 2 capital increases because 2 long-term investors contacted us and said, we want to invest in your company. We have a strong perspective on the future on that. And so we offer this opportunity. And it is also part of our strategy that we have long-term shareholders besides the Benner Holding. And so yes, this is the background for that. And it was a market price, of course. So when they signed a capital increase, it was a market price as of the days. Why was the EBITDA margin in Q4 was lower than in Q4 2024? Yes, so there was almost the same margin. So there was not a big difference. But yes, it was slightly below that because we had some companies with lower margins, which are more active in the Q4 this year, and they were not active in the last year. So for example, Lyra Pet and Herbertz, they are both companies, which came to us in 2025, and they had affected that a little bit in this last quarter. In sum, what multiplier did you pay for the acquisition? As you mentioned, we do not communicate the purchase price as reasons of confidentiality are in our contract. So we cannot give you the answer here. What. Is your goal for the EBITDA margin of the pharma business? Well, we expect between 2% and 4% of the EBITDA margin in IFRS. And this is currently our expectation in this market. And this is very similar to our competitors here in this market. And your next question is about the expectation after AEP acquisition? So currently, we have 2 business cases and 2 different guidances in the market. And right now, we expect 2% to 4% margin in the long term or a midterm perspective for the pharmaceutical group here. Is there any chance to publish main KPIs on a monthly basis? Of course, not because I don't know any company in the stock market who publishes monthly statements with KPIs. So next question is a question to Bjoern. How resilient are AEP's earnings under continued pharmacy pressures? Pharmacies are more and more under financial stress. How do you see the structural risk? It seems that in the business cash flow, it's working capital driven, it's not EBITDA driven. What I think this is not correct, but Bjoern, maybe you can answer that directly.

Well, you have to understand how the market works and the market is -- we indicated that it is low margin, but it is high volume. And if you take this into consideration, then you know why we still pursue that deal.

Yes. Okay. So we continue legendary compounders like Mark Leonard of Constellation Software and Warren Buffett view their shares not as a mere paper, but as an extremely prestigious currency. And are you concerned that the capital increase at current price level and a fire selling? No, we make no fire sale here. We have 2 long-term investors working together with us. And this is, I think, a very attractive way how we can really have a close relation with them. And if they would have asked us 2 years ago, we would have done it, and we also would do that next year if they would have asked us in 2 years or next year, whatever. So this is really a thing or we say this is a good and attractive way how we can work together with them. Next question, why didn't a PE buy AEP? I don't know. There was a bidding process. So there was a bidding process of a lot of companies and competitors and maybe also PE players were part of that. But at the end, we got this signing here. So there's a next question regarding the 2026 perspective on the forecast for AEP. You're right, for 2026, management expects strongly increasing revenues to around EUR 1.3 billion with an EBITDA margin of approximately 1%. Actually, I don't know where you got this from. I don't know this number. So I cannot confirm this number. In our business case, we have different numbers. So we expect a revenue of at least EUR 1 billion and a margin of at least EUR 20 million EBITDA. [ Harold Wolf ], mwb research. Two questions. How do Contracta GmbH and AEP compete with each other in a market worth? Very simple answer. They have the same clients. So Contracta is a very small company compared to AEP, but the problem is they also only work for pharmacies and there's an overlap, and this is quite critical when you work with the Catalent in Germany and when you want to get an approval there. So it was the decision from us and from the seller that we should say, okay, this is dangerous when we combine it together. And so we don't want to risk this control process with Catalent. Could you please provide further details regarding the financing structure of the deal? Yes, we will do. But as you know from our yesterday's announcement, we will give an update until March this year, how we can make the whole finance structure when we do the AEP deal and how it's going to look like in the future. So yes, we will provide you an update, but not now, we will do it until March this year. Next question. The audio wasn't clear. Please share why you can't do a buyback again. Yes, again, the answer is very simple. We have a Nordic bond and in the Nordic bond prospect, it is not allowed to make buyback programs as long we have the bond. So it is not allowed, basically, I would do it. I think it's a good investment, but right now, we are not allowed to do that. If we would like to change it, we have to do a written procedure with all the bondholders that we get allowance for that, and that is not so easy. Okay. We get so many questions. I think in terms of -- when I look on the time line, we should focus on 5 last questions. So there's another question regarding the stock decline and the bond price. Yes, I think Nathalie already mentioned that we saw a decline in the stock price and the share price in the last 4 months. And maybe you know that Paladin was one of our major investors and they sold all the shares. They reduced their fund also by a lot of amounts. And so that was the reason why we saw a big decline here. And regarding the bond price, Nathalie already showed you the difference between the Oslo Exchange and the German Exchange. And we saw -- she already explained that to you. How will the new acquisitions be financed? We always have a finance strategy from 2 components. So we have own equity, own cash and also debt with our banking partners, and that's also how we do our further and upcoming acquisitions in the next 12 months or 24 months. What is happening with your entry into the U.S. market? We prepared already. So we are on a very good track, and you can be sure that you get some announcements this year regarding our U.S. entry. Do you have a guidance on 2026 expected free cash flow? Very simple answer, we do not give guidance on free cash flow. Next question about the big 4 auditors. Do you want to change to the big 4 auditors? Well, we are generally open to that. So we've worked together with KPMG until 2019. We've worked together with Ernst & Young until 2022 or '23. And now we have a smaller auditor. But of course, we can imagine that on the next AGM, maybe we propose another auditor. So in general, we are open to that, and we are happy to discuss it with our investors. So 2 last questions. Is the purchase price of AEP still in the 2 to 5x range? Or did TPG spend more for this pharma acquisitions? Well, again, we did not disclose how much the purchase price was, but you can expect that we try to be in line with our general expectation, how much we pay for that. There's another important question. So when AEP has only 2% margin, how does it fit to your overall margin strategy in 2030? This is very important. Of course, AEP has currently 2%. Maybe we increase it to 3% or 4% margin, but it's not going to be more. And so if we would combine these businesses here, indeed, we would have lower margins, but total euro total higher margins. So it is, in fact, that if we merge and bring it together, the euro margins will go up and the percentage margin will be diluted because of the AEP acquisition, of course, this is just mathematically. Do you acquire 100% of AEP? Yes. We acquired 100%. What about synergies from AEP? This is a detailed question. We should do this maybe in the next call. This is too much detail for this discussion here now. And the last question was about the guidance for 2030. So the EBITDA margins with double digits are still valid. And how can you achieve that? It is the same answer as I did already give you in my last comment. Okay. So I think we've covered 80% of the questions in our time here. And Nathalie is always available for you for further questions, and we can also offer you direct calls, one-on-one meetings if you want. And I'm happy to answer then you up for your left questions here.

Thank you very much, Dr. Benner and Mr. Minnier. Thank you, Ms. Richert, for your presentation for answering the questions. Ladies and gentlemen, please understand that we are not able to answer all the questions during this call today as we had over 140 participants today. Yes. Ladies and gentlemen, please feel free to get in contact with Nathalie Richert afterwards for further questions and a wonderful day. Thank you.

Thank you. Bye.