Time Technoplast Limited ($TIMETECHNO)

Good evening, ladies and gentlemen, and a warm welcome to all those present for Time Technoplast Q4 and FY '26 Earnings Conference Call, hosted by Cavirat Securities Private Limited. Please be advised that this conference call may include forward-looking statements regarding the company's performance. These statements are based on company beliefs, opinions and expectation as of the date of this call. However, please note that such forward-looking statements are not guarantees of future performance and are subject to inherited risk and uncertainties. As a reminder, all participant lines will be in the listen-only mode. During the presentation, once the presentation concludes, there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions. [Operator Instructions] I now hand the conference over to Mr. Abhishek Puri from Cabira Securities. Thank you, and over to you, sir.

Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. Cabira Securities welcomes you all for Q4 and FY '26 Earnings Conference Call of Time Technoplast Limited. We have with us the management team, which is represented by Mr. Bharatkumar Vageria, Managing Director; Mr. Raghupathy Thyagarajan, Founder Member and Whole Time Director; Mr. Naveen Jane, all-time Director, Technical; Mr. Vishal Anil Jain, Non-Executive Director; Mr. Sandeep Modi, Senior VP, Accounts and Corporate Planning; Mr. Hemant Soni, VP Legal and Corporate Affairs; and Mr. Himanshu Upadhyay, Senior Manager, Finance and Investor Relations. Without further delays, I hand over the call to Mr. Raghupathy Thyagarajan for his opening remarks, post which we open the floor for questions session. Thank you, and over to you, sir.

Good afternoon, esteemed investors, respected members of the Board, Value stakeholders, and thank you, Mr. Abhijit for the gracious introduction. It is a privilege to address you today as we present our financial and operational performance for FY '26 and share our outlook for the coming year FY '27. Update on the current geopolitical situation. We continue to closely monitor the evolving global situation, including the ongoing West India conflict and other geopolitical uncertainty. Despite the tense geopolitical environment caused by tensions in West Asia and the Russia-Ukraine war, the company has successfully delivered its projected performance for the year FY '26, and this momentum is expected to continue going forward. In Q4 FY '26, polymer prices witnessed a sharp increase. However, given that 92% of our business operates under a B2B model with industrial customers, price revisions are implemented through mutually agreed monthly or quarterly mechanisms. This enables us to effectively pass on cost increases and maintain the stability of our absolute EBITDA. Our CNG composite [ casket ] segment emerged as a key growth driver during the year, delivering an impressive 22% growth and making a significant contribution to overall business performance, supported by sustained demand across our broader composite portfolio. Most importantly, our profit after tax registered a strong 21% growth and underscoring our continued focus on operational excellence, capacity optimization, cost efficiency and prudent financial management; our disciplined approach towards controlling finance costs and improving operational leverage continues to strengthen profitability and shareholder value creation. We remain highly optimistic about the opportunities ahead. particularly in the composite product segment, where demand momentum continues to be exceptionally encouraging. This is reflected on a robust order booking of approximately INR 195 crores. In parallel, our value-added product portfolio, including IBCs and composite products, continues to witness healthy at market acceptance and sustained growth. Our Industrial Packaging division has also maintained steady and consistent performance across markets. Further reinforcing our growth visibility, we are pleased to announce confirmed packaging orders of approximately INR 400 crores for the current calendar year, spanning both domestic and international markets. These achievements reaffirm the strength of our diversified business portfolio, the scalability of our operations and the strategic directions we have pursued over the years. As industries globally transition towards cleaner, safer and more sustainable energy and packaging solutions, we believe our company is exceptionally well positioned to capitalize on these structural growth opportunities. Looking ahead to FY '27 and beyond, we remain committed to accelerating sustainable growth, enhancing operational efficiencies, expanding our innovation-led product portfolio and delivering long-term value for all our stakeholders. With this, let's now move to the detailed review of our financial and operational highlights for the year. I invite you all to join us as we take you through the key performance insights and strategic development shaping our future growth journey. During FY '26, on a consolidated basis, an all-time high revenue, EBITDA and PAT level has been achieved. I would say that it is a lifetime high revenue EBITDA and PAT. Key highlights for the FY '26 compared with the corresponding previous year, are as follows: net sales, INR 6,114 crore as against INR 5,462 crores last year. EBITDA INR 901 crores as against INR 790 crores last year. Profit after tax INR 469 crores as against INR 388 crores last year. Net sales has increased by 12%, India, 11% and overseas 13%. Volume increased by 13.5%. India 13% and overseas 15%, EBITDA increased by 14%, and PAT increased by 21%. In FY '26, our EBITDA margins improved to 14.7%, up from 14.5%, reflecting a 20 basis point increase. During Q4 FY '26, on a consolidated basis, we have achieved the highest ever quarterly performance as well. Key highlights of Q4 FY '26 compared to the corresponding period previous year are as follows: net sales INR 1,682 crores as against INR 1,471 crores last year. EBITDA of INR 246 crores as against INR 216 crores; profit after tax, INR 132 crores as against INR 110 crores last year. Net sales has increased by 14%, India, 16% and overseas 12%, Volume has increased by 13%, India 14% and overseas 11%. EBITDA increases by 14%, and PAT has increased by 20%. I'm also pleased to share that our overseas subsidiaries have delivered robust performance both in Q4 and throughout the full fiscal year despite the global uncertainties. Share of business established products versus value-added products. In FY '26, value-added products recorded a strong growth of 18% compared to the previous year, while our established product lines grew by 10%. Notably, the contribution of value-added products to total sales increased to 29%, up from 27%, reflecting our continued focus on innovation and higher-margin offerings. Share of India overseas business in FY '26 was 65% to 35%. Last year, it was 66% to 34%. EBITDA margins in India and overseas are 14.9% and 14.4%, respectively. PAT margins in India and overseas are 7.4% and 8.2%, respectively. Net cash from operating activities in the year FY '26 stood at INR 156 crores. Debt net of cash in FY '26 was reduced by INR 409 crores. Total CapEx incurred during FY '26 was INR 370 crore, which includes INR 198 crores towards regular and maintenance, capacity expansion, reengineering and automation for established products and INR 172 crores towards value-added products that is IBC and composite cylinders. I would like to now draw your attention to a couple of interesting developments with -- the year has seen. We have already shared these all in our earnings presentation. But however, I just touched upon them. Dividend, the Board has recommended final dividend this year of 150% per equity share of face value INR 1. The company has been paying dividend consistently for the last 30 years and has increased the dividend payout in this year to 15.8% as compared to 14.6% last year. Sale of noncore assets continues as a part of our consolidation and automated innovatives. The company has identified total noncore assets worth INR 134 crores for disposal with a target realization over the next 18 to 24 months. Focus on improving ROCE. FY '26 ROCE is 18.9% versus 20% target, reflecting short-term impact of IP-led automation investments targeting 1.5% to 2% annual improvement, driven by automation and [ region ] of visionary. We remain committed to becoming debt-free. As per our internal calculations, we are estimating a time line in the next 12 to 18 months. There are other acquisition updates which have also been communicated. Regarding abulent Packaging Private Limited or strand Systoverse Private Limited as well. If there are any questions, we'll be quite pleased to answer them. Consolidation of products and manufacturing units, the company has made a decision to consolidate its products and manufacturing units. This includes brownfield expansion and adding new units in India and overseas which will better align with evolving market demands. Green energy, the conversion of electricity units consumed to solar power continues. The company is committed to transitioning 75% of its power consumption to green energy over the next 2 years through its partnership with solar power producers, Power purchase agreements across Karnataka, Taman Nadu, Gujarat and West Bangal have already started generating annualized benefits of about INR 11 crores, with additional benefits from Maharashtra and Nutrakan expected from quarter 3 FY '27, The payback period on these equity investments is close to about a year. Update on LPG cylinders, the company has been manufacturing LPG cylinders for over a decade. It currently has 32.68 crore active LPG connections and about 50 crores cylinders in circulation. This is the numbers for the Indian market. The company has a wide range of cylinders from 5 kg to about 22 kgs. Since 2022, company has been supplying cylinders to the government of India owned companies. Following a strong response 10 gas cylinder size, the company has been working towards 14.2 kg, which has already been finalized and accepted by the. Because of the ongoing shortages in terms of the LP market -- LPG availability due to the Iran Iraq war -- sorry, Iran U.S. war, there is a slight pause with regard to the launch of these new sizes as 14.2. But it is quite pertinent to note that the 10 kg sales continues to improve because the government is also able to see that there is a 40% saving in terms of the gas that gets distributed among its consumers. Considering geopolitical uncertainties, Board has committed pursuing joint venture tie-ups with private gas distributors to establish an independent LPG distribution network while continuing discussions with government authorities for approval and tenders. There are other product updates as well for the year FY '26 on hydrogen cylinders, fire extinguisher, air receiver tank and OPZ battery for the power sector. Products which are under development includes higher-capacity cylinders for CNG and hydrogen and the LPG, as I just mentioned. There are similar updates on other products such as the higher-capacity cylinders for CNG, higher-capacity cylinders for hydrogen. There are newer sizes being developed for which the respective [indiscernible] approvals are being pursued as per the demands that are being experienced from the market. Power [ build ] batteries have launched the Ops batteries for the power sector. We have received the CPRI certification for these new tubular batteries in transparent containers, covering different capacity. These [ flooded ] lead acid batteries are offer long service life, reliable [ flood ] performance and durability, making them suitable for infrastructure-grade applications. Power build batteries and [indiscernible] Europe. [ Powerwall ] batteries have entered a multiyear exclusive agreement with Bulgaria's Monet to supply advanced BRL stationary batteries India, targeting the fast-growing data center, IT, BFSI and other critical sectors by combining [ Monat ] technology with [ Powerbill ] manufacturing and service network. Fire extinguishers. The company has developed 2 sizes, namely 6 and 9 kg composite fixes that are significantly lighter corrosion resistance and offfer enhanced safety. We are engaging with suppliers and distributors to bring this product to the market. The initial target segment would be the oil OMC or oil refineries, which collectively require approximately about 800,000 fire extinguishers annually. Project-related updates, greenfield compose projects. This project is being located at [ Moraine Vapi ] Gujarat. We have set up a fully automated CNG plant at [ Mara ] with a total capacity of 1,080 caskets. The plant will consolidate the existing 480 capacity at Daman facility, along with additional 600 caskets being added to the same location. The plant has been commissioned after successful completion of trials, cost savings, availability of export manpower at 1 location, improved capacity utilization and freed up space at Daman for future expansion, Greenfield recycling plant. Time Ecotec Private Limited. It's a wholly owned subsidiary of Time Technoplast has been formed at a location at [ Billard ] in Gujarat, where we have completed setting up a fully automatic greenfield recycling plant at [ Ballard ] in line with the PCR compliance and the QIP fund utilization plan. This will be the first of the 3 planned recycling facilities across India with an annual capacity of 12,000 metric tons for captive consumption catering to the Western region. With the PCR compliance requirements and the recycling requirement that have been given by the pollution control boards, having our own capital recycling generation plant would be of tremendous importance to the company. The plant has been commissioned after successful trials that been completed. The benefits that it offers are its tenens backward integration, ensure steady supply of recycled raw material for captive use supports the regulatory compliance under PCR norms and enhances long-term cost efficiency. Brownfield automated IBC facility at Silvassa Phase 1, we have completed a fully automatic brownfield expansion of Silvassa to manufacture IBC cage lines. This facility will have an annual capacity of 150,000 IBCs. Phase 2 work has started and is expected to be completed by the end of 2026, 2027. Capacity post completion of Phase 2 will be 300,000 IBCs per annum. Phase 1 is completed and production has already started. This enhances manufacturing capacity strengthens our presence in the Industrial Packaging segment, improving supply reliability for customers and support future revenue growth. On the polythene pipes, at our facility at GuomriPundi, we have completed a brownfield expansion to enhance manufacturing efficiency and address base constraints. A second shed has been developed on the same land parcel to create a dedicated pipe manufacturing unit, while the existing shed continues to focus on packaging products. The plant has also commissioned after successful -- has been commissioned after successful completion of requisite trials. The commercial activity from the plant has also begun. This improves operational segregation enhance throughput, optimizes space utilization and provide scalability to support future growth. Regarding our overseas capacity developments, at USA in the state of Georgia, our fifth plant in the region of U.S. operate, this has been broad operational since May 2025. It features a fully automatic IBC manufacturing line. We are expanding the facility additionally to put over 1 more IBC line, along with a drum manufacturing line as well to further strengthen our presence in the region and enhance the basket offerings. The expansion activities are completed. It enhances production capacity, broadens product offerings in the U.S. market improves customer service levels with no impact on tariffs due to local manufacturing. This would be probably the -- this would be the largest factory in the states of U.S. when we compare the other 4 facilities that are already in operation. Projects that are being completed in FY '27 covers our units for PE pipes in [ Sanat ] Gujarat, packaging and PE pipes in [ Kutak ] Orissa for packaging products at Cipla for recycling of volume of products, additional units are being planned at North and South India and for packaging products, additional plants that are coming in place is in Saudi, Damam region. The growth drivers for the company continues to be the packaging products, which is about 11% to 13%; composite products with 25% to 30%; PE pipes 20% to 25%; and other products, namely MOX, Auto Products and Turf & Matting , et cetera, were 10% to 12%. We operate on a B2B model serving industries like specialty chemicals, FMCG and pharmaceutical with long-term industry relationships on a mutually agreed pricing formula enabling to us to maintain our EBITDA. Volume growth on a consolidated basis is targeted at 15% per annum. Revenue growth might differ based on key input prices as polymer is a derivative of oil and gas. EBITDA growth drivers increased in efficiency, consolidating more than machinery into centralized high-efficiency production system to reduce cost, maximize asset utilization. This will benefit in increasing ROCE and EBITDA margin levels of the company, consolidation of products and unit streamlining products and consolidating units to enhance operational efficiency and reduce overhead costs, lowering manpower costs to strategic work for optimization and process reengineering to eliminate redundancies and improve productivity and automation for cost reduction, reducing energy expenses through the adoption of green energy, solar solutions and implementation of long-term power purchase agreements, decreasing finance cost by reducing overall debt through QIP proceeds and strong internal cash flow generation, divesting noncore assets to redeploy capital into higher-margin value-added products that strengthen profitability. I hope -- I would like to open the floor to answer specific questions as may be. Thank you.

[Operator Instructions] The first question is from the line of Prakash Kapadia from Kapadia Finance Service.

Yes. So a couple of questions from my end, last many years, we've seen margins being in the band of 13% to 15%. You seem pretty confident of maintaining or even expanding that. You obviously talked about some of the newer initiatives in the PPT and on the opening remarks also. So directionally, is it possible to grow it 20%-plus PAT growth over the next 2, 3 years? And what kind of value-added product share can we expect in the next 2, 3 years? And what are we trying to grow that from the current 29%? Yes. And lastly, Barton the cash flow this time, second half, we've seen very poor operating cash flow in the business. So we've seen a lot of buildup in inventories, receivable, other assets because historically, we've always grown and we've seen very good conversion of EBITDA to operating cash flow. But this time around, cash flow has actually decreased substantially in this financial year. So when will that normalize? Is it one-off? Is it war? Is it anticipation of supply chain disruption, order book?

I think you raised a good question number one. You asked about the paid growth, which is when the revenue growth and volume growth is around 15%. We are considering the price level of the current, which is ongoing in the month of March or been -- on that, we have taken the volume growth is 15%. As my colleague director has mentioned, revenue growth, maybe depending on the oil prices and the other day. revenue. But one thing I get committed, you have seen the initial remark that we have mentioned the absolute Bitauto basis is not going to be reduced. because when we have a 92% business B2B. So EBITDA margin maybe don't see the percentage in terms of the absolute figure, you will find that the 15% volume growth, then definitely, EBITDA growth will be over and about 2% more than that. So percentage-wise EBITDA, maybe less or maybe up. But absolute figure, it is going to be increased. And you will find growth in the EBITDA. If growth in my volume growth is, for example, 15%, you will see the EBITDA growth is [ 6%, 7% ]. PAT growth minimum 21% may exceed further because as the interest cost is further reduced, okay? Now you are asking about this composite witness, which is currently in the range of around almost 22%. We have said in the last conference call also, in the 3 years' time, -- in spite of overall business growth is 15%, that product growth will have over 25% because certain new products developed in composite in addition to LPG, CNG, hydrogen, then this is called [ aerosol ] so many other products are under cotemporaneous where the margins are higher. So that will increase in the margins are also in the range of around 17%, 18% compared to other legacy product, where is 12% to 13%. So combined, you have seen in fact, I recall my discussion in the last calla also. So there you to 30 basis points higher in terms of the EBITDA because that for a number 14% reach to 44. Now again, because of these artisanal started in February, March to month uncertainty. So we have also increased the prices. So particular quarter March, we will see some of the company required to fund because whatever inventory I was there. But when I bought the inventory in the month of February and March and the prices have increased. So last quarter, [indiscernible] cycle time has also little increased because I need to continue on minimum inventory level to continue the customer service. So we were aware. Even in my last remark also I said when Asia Ukraine going for last 3 years. So we have certain inventory for the composite product, which is largely dependent on the overseas market because India -- nobody is manufacturing the inputs which are required for the composite number carbon fiber, for special polymers, some kind of special carbon fiber, glass fiber, some kind of was carry the inventory for 6 months. Whatever happen, I cannot disturb the supply to my customer. So inventory, yes, but that will be normalized. We have said my 3 years target when my working capital cycle time was 100 days. We said it will going to be next 3 years' time, 90 days. So I'm very clear, we are on that line only. But specifically, this March 2026 data is not comparable because 45 days includes on account of the artist, the price has substantially increased by 50% to 60%. Now better have an answer inventory -- now you are asking with the regulation time. Yes, you will find by December even I'm considering that mastication may be over in the next 30 to 45 days, whatever may be. But I'm expecting in this year, entire thing before March, it should come [ regulate ] everything what we have committed. kAs -- again, we have mentioned that we are not revising any guidelines. We are continuing our guidance, whatever been given because I'm very clear my international business company, international management has already given. They are not ready to give any guidance because somebody may ask in this West Asia war ongoing. Yes, I have 4 locations countries there. their business well down, but that will be compensated by other location in U.S.A. and the Southeast Asia. So overall guidance, we are not changing 15% volume growth. We are keeping -- still continue irrespective of the whatever ongoing situation. Yes, one segment and other segment will composite each other. And sure, as many times companies was asking, what your target for the next 5 years, definitely, we have also a target to reach in the next 5 years' time more than $1 billion business. We are continuing. We are not changing anything. And I think margin improvement, how will come? You know, IP rate in November only. Now we started investing that we have paid. So now investment will come in this complete completion will be due by September. So that result of that automation, consolidation, resulting we are getting some kind of noncore assets, which will be revised. So if overall ROCE will improve by 1.5% to 2% a year. Margin will also improve. And that margin when the company becomes deb free, definitely payout ratio will also be enthused by 1.5% to 2% year-on-year because competing required normal CapEx. After completion of the onetime this QIP investment, automation, veneering consolidation. My normal CapEx requirement is INR 250 crores to INR 300 crores. That is adequate for me to brownfield expansion than to take the growth

Right, right, right. Absolutely. Very, very heartening to your and reassure investors, that's very good Barata -- and then lastly, Bharat, on the composite cylinder tenders, anything from the side, you can share, is it deferred? Is it in pipeline? Anything from the government? Because we were doing the prototype that was under approval that was 2 quarters before. So any updates you have on that?

My colleague, I have said that government said, we are ready destinates continued supply, but government is doing the around work controlling the oil prices, controlling the desal resolve. There still new -- but continue buying 10 kg cylinders. But he has a anteing also the Board has recommended to go their own gas distribution line for which cylinder required we have the ready available okay? So we are also looking exploring the possibility to go for the retail market, along with the gas filling station directly also. So we're looking for the JV or our around, we will go, and we will submit in the next -- I think next quarter conference call, where we stand in that matter.

The next question is from the line of Karan from Guardian Capital Partners.

So my first question is polymer prices have moved up sharply after the West Asia crisis. So I want to understand what percentage of this increase has already been passed on to customers? And are you seeing any sort of volume depot or slowdown of demand because of higher prices? .

Yes. Number one, Yes. Next?

Sir, second question is on what kind of utilization ramp-up should we expect in the new composite CNG plant of 1,018 unit capacity? And the third question is, I just want to confirm one thing if our contracts with our clients are based on a fixed EBITDA per tonne basis or a fixed percentage margin basis. These are my 3 questions.

Once you have asked about the price in case you know until January and February, where the small price increase was there. In the -- particularly in the month of March, price increases are almost 50%. If for example, the polymer prices were INR 100, it went up to INR [ 150 ]. But now there is some slowdown in there now is average you can say I have as my colleague said, we have some monthly pricing, quarterly pricing. Certain contract multipricing, yes, if you ask me in the month of the March, we're able to get 50% of the increase prices because price increased 4x in a month. be able to get the price increase by 50%. If price increased by 50%, we're able to get a 25% increase from the customer. Balance of of 25% believed in the month of operate.[indiscernible] if there higher prices than we recover in mine. So as far as you will see stability if the same thing continues, you will find in the April, June quarter result there is definitely upside of the revenue part. There was a very 30 days effect was there that already accounted in my profitability. In spite of that, higher margin, higher revenue and high PAT is observed in the Q4. Utilization of new facility. Recently completed as we have committed to complete the composition in the facility in Murabahas over thing ready. It is fully imported plant is there now. . You know the composite would have we did 2 types of the composite, LPG and CI, we did a business of INR 600 crores. Now definitely, INR 600 crores, we are estimating this year business of more than INR 750 crores. it is almost more than 25% growth we are projecting. But yes, we are sure in the next 3 months -- next 2 years' time, we'll have to see further expansion because some of the new composite product development, which is hydrogen cylinder is just with this plant, we can -- very small quantity, we can manufacture. So we are watching very clearly, we are understanding the customer requirement for the hydrogen cylinder for the power project or the gas project, for the automotive sector. Another thing until I can say the March 2026, our CNG cylinder, as the cylinder, we are not selling, we were selling as a complete set. But now when the capacity is ready now, we can offer to the automotive sector cylinders separately. Every automotive OEM, they will start talking to them. But yes, in the next 6 to 8 months' time, visibility is there, how much -- because we have to develop their capacity. We have to develop the tool based on their retail capacity. CNG for Cascade is a tender 156 liter, then we have started now 250 and 350 under process. We will update market as we get the appeal on opesauthority. If you -- I use 156-liter stage surrender in my cascade, I need 60 cascade. 60 cylinders in 1 cascade. When I will use 250, it will reduce to 26 or something. Then if I will go back to 350 liters, it will go to. So my capacity number of significant more. So remaining capacity, I can use manufacturer automotive cylinder, and we can supply to the component. Yes. As far as -- currently, I'm getting the benefit of selling entire cascade at percentage EBITDA. Therefore, we are selling it. Then another thing, other saproducts also under development, as we have mentioned, already done a exchange we have done that Teribone done with a very big market in automotive sector. So we will update market as the business is there. Now yes, some of the tenders are under discussion, finalization, we will update to the market as and when it's finalized and agreed with the customer, right? Yes. [indiscernible] will add something

Very specifically addressing the concern questions that have raised, yes, to a very large extent or to a complete extent, whatever is the increase in the polymer prices, it is passed on to the user on a 100% basis. Maybe there is a lag, as Bart was explaining, maybe about 15 days, 30 days out of quarter. But definitely, these are all passed on to the customers on a 100-plus basis. Our understanding with the customer, therefore, would be that while they reimburse you the ups and downs of the polymer prices, the value addition or the margins or the EBITDA, they continue to be fixed. So your contract is always -- or ensuring that your margins are not really disturbed. Absolute EBITDA will be same. .

The next question is from the line of Bhagwat from Prosperity Wealth Management Private Limited. .

Question regarding the borrowing. Are the [indiscernible] company's borrowing 60s. Could you please provide an update on the utilization of the CITs? And what is the expected finance as for united .

I think QIP updated my compliance department have already submitted separately to BSE and already even what funds as they are very utilized, what are the remaining points that are reflected -- but now as far as we are talking, the main QIP portion, which was for the payment of the debt have been completed immediately as banks has agreed, and we repaid to them. And second, you have asked do you want see?

Finance cost for FY '27 .

Finance costs, which we have seen in the -- this definite, we are estimating after either Q3 point and after utilization of the asset in this year, finance cost were INR 30 crores. But as I mentioned in my last call also, even after the 3 company, there will be the minimum finance cost of INR 25 crores to INR 30 crores will continue on account of the nonfunding facility, which includes [indiscernible] composite products, we need to give the guarantees, customer, government companies, many semi government companies, we need to provide the guarantee of the products where I need to give the bank guarantee. Another thing, import documents, export document, some finance expenses will be there or the charges this thing. So minimum, I think it is going to be a continuation of the finance cost will be there to INR 35 crores to INR 40 crores will continue. And remaining will come by after-tax profit, and it will continue. .

Okay. And the financials, what is the borrowing side, so after the debt real -- . .

I think that is mentioned there, March. Alike as mentioned also in the base also mentioned that what is the current borrowing is there. .

I remember a satisfact it seems like the CP debt repayment has not acted. So is this post March that has been factored into the dip .

Yes, yes, yes. As I mentioned, I mentioned already, net of the debt, the deal by INR 409 crores, that have been reduced already. But net of the everything today, borrowing net cash into 60 crores. Because certain units, they have a surplus point I'm considering a net of everything is INR 60 crores only. .

The next question is from the line of Sal Gara from CCB Fund. .

Sir, may now what was the revenue contribution from the value-added products in FY '26? .

Yes, Value-added product contribution in FY '20 is INR 1,741 crores -- INR 1,741 crores right .

That is close to 29%, right? 28%,

29% Yes, .

And last year, it was close to 26%, 25-odd percent, .

EBIT was INR 1,476 crores 27%. Right .

So sir, when we have like any are saying that our overall contribution from the VAP is increasing year basis -- but if we talk about the margins during last 5, 6, 8 quarters, it remains same at 13% to 14% or 15%. So when we can see the margins to get improved if we are adding value-added products more into our overall business?

Of course, it's visible because you are looking at the percentage, I'm looking at the EBITDA margin. you see the higher per server because percentage maybe the revenue ups and down because of the input cost. But you see the absolute figure, definitely the absolute figure, the margins have improved with our margin is higher we are talking about the last year percentage EBITDA margin, composite product, whenever we'll do costing best around 17% to 18% EBITDA margin. Other products, we do Dias product, which is already there for a number of the years, more than 20 years, 25 years, 30 years, there we keep the EBITDA margin range of 12% to 13%. But as I mentioned, don't see the percentage, -- see the absolute figure in EBITDA, absolute figure in terms of the PAT because percentage is dependent on the input cost of everything. Now I tell you, one year back, it was maybe around 85%. So when $85, maybe the EBITDA margin was 15%. -- and the 95 may EBITDA margin 15% go back to 13%. But absolute figure, you will see there is an increase because I do the 92% business with the institutions and this business. The price in decrease, we have to pass on them. And if to maintain my wide margin or EBITDA in a folate terms, I will -- we are doing reverse engineering. You have seen automation, power cost savings. So that will give you the additional benefit who will improve my ROCE and the PAT margin. In our kind of a business, which is oil and gas [indiscernible] product in the current set of BC in the last 2, 3 years, there are not only much changes. But because of this [indiscernible], currently change have been taken place. So see the absolute terms were bigger. And you will see, you got that EBITDA, EBITDA in terms of the absolute figure quarter-on-quarter is going to be increased.

Okay. No, but absolutely should obviously definitely converting into percentage terms as well, right?

Today, today, raw material prices are $1,400. Tomorrow, it become $1,800. So percentage may become 13% to 10, okay? Because I passed on every increase, but revenue is up. Okay. But maybe an absolute figure, my bedevil increase.

Okay. Okay. And what is the current order book spread between Industrial Packaging business and the valuated product business, sir?

Wilmot the value-added products are combination of both various CNG, LPG hydrogen. you mentioned INR 400 crores packaging business. Indian oversea book is already there. And I remember that didnaround INR 194 crores composite product order is also there. Certain other products, which are under discussion because the prices have increased. So may be materialize in the next 30 to 40 days. It will be materialized because everybody is watching. For example, if I tell you, pipe business, I have order book INR 260 crores. But now I don't want to supply at this price because prices have increased. So government should revise the prices to the EPC contractor, then if they will revise, I will start to supply it. I'm not going to supply into all the prices which the government has finalized to the PG contractor. So if you ask me the -- across the segment in India, we may order booking of more than INR [ 100 ] crores.

And specifically for this Type 4 composite hydrogen? I mean I know that we got first order of approximately INR 2.5 crores, the trial order from Navratna PSU in 26. So any further progress.

That already supplied. -- is under their testing. There are a couple of projects which are are under discussion. And as the outcome will come because certain R&D with the government, with the other company or of the counter all will have to do that. is a time after getting a trial, they will wait for 2 or 3 months, get the upon, then they will come back and then we'll talk about that. And time to time, I will advise what kind of this thing. But the overall business prospect, composite product, which we did LPG CNG INR 800 crores last year, definitely, we expect a growth of more than 25%, which is -- because completed the [ comps ] on new line completely and whatever other capacity or automation required that we are doing it. So definitely, therefore, we are projecting growth of over 20% in composite products. And to meet our guidance, we have developed other many composite product we have already expanded in our earnings presentation. And during this call, also my partners told you like LHC, fire extinguisher, many compost would not be under developing.

Okay. Okay. Sir, just last question. So I understand that you are not giving any revenue guidance and you have given the volume guidance of 15% because there is still uncertainty about the raw material prices. So keeping the raw material prices constant, what they are today, can you give us just ballpark number, like what could be the revenue numbers for FY '27, just a range maybe?

That's the figure Okay. If you take the volume growth of 15%, right? Now if the current prices continue for whole of the year, then revenue growth, maybe 40%.

40% .

Because 50% prices increase, 15% volume growth already taken in revenue, but a 25% difference today. between that 40% price increases. So overall, you can take a revenue growth of 40%. If the percentage margins -- you know this -- But again, one thing I -- One thing, Andre, you know, yes, you have asked first thing whether volume growth is going to be down or what, of course, if somebody where you are present, for example, until everybody you are supplying the product like INR 125 a kg today, somebody to ask, I want 170 a kg suppase -- there will be a reduction in the requirement of growth, as I mentioned to you, in ATP business. Definitely, the degrowth will be there till government gives the increase, then no EPC contractor will put the loss in their money and they do. They've asked government to keep the extension of the contract period. No, there should not be any charges for the lead delivery and completion of the project. This government is also considering because government cannot afford any insight at the cost increase by 50% or something.

But on the other hand, you have also known that because of the LPG storage situation, government has advised that CNG pipeline should be increased so that they can replace the LPG demand. So there are avenues of growth that are also coming up in these difficult situations also. So overall, that is how we are reflecting a growth position.

But overall, if we are able to pass on the price increase in the price of raw materials I mean, it is good for us because we are able to command higher profits and higher margins in that. .

of course, no doubt because no doubt side because we are very clear. Therefore, we have selected the industry business now. We are not in consumer products. .

The next question is from the line of Anita Sahu from 3P Investment Managers Limited.

Hello, Bharat this was like a follow-up on the borrowings question that someone asked -- like if you look at the cash flow and in the section of increase, decrease of debt we can only see of 71 million, like there was -- should be around like more than 400 because they've already paid debt of INR 400 crores, right? Yes. -- like how has been accounted or have we taken another loan after the repayment of the earlier? I just wanted some clarity on that.

No, no. As you see, the total borrowing, which is as for the balance is on March INR 639 crores. As against because you know the certain things which is identified by QIP, I was required to give for the deposit. I cannot use that fund or other purpose because the CapEx expenditure, which is incurred already, that is fontinternal ever. . Number two, the INR 800 crore QIP fund which we raised, which is repayment to the bank to the INR 400 crores, which was identified at the time a bank, which has a higher cost, it is to be repaid first. Then if any new borrowings required, I will take from the new bank but at the lower cost. Whatever balance QIP point, I was required to give as for the separate the institution was appointed to monitor -- so I have a given deposit amount, that expenditure will be incurred in the current year. Therefore, you have seen the net borrowing, if you ask me any bank deposit and fixed deposit, everything, only INR 60 crores . So that big deposit, I will use in the current year for my balance QIP expenditure because I cannot change without permission or shareholders and everything. If any need be, I will bring to the Board the next AGM, I need the shareholder approvals also that are coming the next AGM. If any QIP fund left further, then I will leave for the other purpose. I cannot change the object of the QIP.

The next question is from the line of Saket Kapur from Kapur an Companies.

Only to have a further understanding as you were applying to the under participant much case Yes, hope might Yes, when we look Yes. Yes, sir. When we are looking at the closing balance, our noncurrent liability, that is the long-term borrowing stands at INR 149 crores, whereas our current liability stands at INR [ 419 ] crores. . So this is after the repayment exercise of INR 400 crores, that was earmarked for the repayment of outstanding or borrowings?

Yes, of course. Yes. Okay. yes,

Okay, So this is the closing balance post the payment to our borrowers?

Yes, yes. .

Sir, in your presentation, you have also mentioned about our acquisition of ebullient packaging sir. If you could just throw some light on how that is now -- what steps have we taken to sweat that asset [Foreign Language]. .

You know very well, everything was online, everything by and then we could have to take the decision. I presented my Board that this decision report, which is received up to the evident, which is report the March '26. My Board has suggested there is a current situation of the ongoing war or Asia. Prices have increased substantially. So let us study that situation normalized, then see what is the 3 to 4 months or 6-month revenue is there, how they are able to sustainable [indiscernible] put up again to the board, then we'll take forward with them because we can't get that exactly apple-to-apple comparison of the whole year in the current situation. And at the same time, you know how many months are going to be continued, how they are doing business in Aarey June, that I will come to know when the bridge is over. Okay. So -- and I appreciate my Board decision because [indiscernible] first thing, whatever business we have, what our production that we should continue in the present scenario. So -- and board is the right into giving this time to take decision because there's a larger investment, investment of more than INR 150 crores for the acquisition of [indiscernible] Yes. So -- and there is a [indiscernible] you already know. This is the flexible IBC over [indiscernible]. So that's -- we will -- again, we will update into my next tradition normalized and and my next conference call. Another is the sister of private private limiteds. That is, in any case, my small investment that in my existing line of the business, I have no presence in the [indiscernible] business. So I thought it is 1 investment, including the cost of the equipment biting, INR 125 crores. And that I will give immediate benefit to the my company because that company is presenting the maharashtra in place of [indiscernible] all near pipe manufacturing pace in Silvassa, I have a certain contract in the Maharashtra. So I can execute that contract from a by location. And you know high-feasible in this product, if I'm supply manufacturing in July and a bit supply, I will save that my transportation cost itself. Second, this company is already registered. They are having certain BIS. They are having some income tax, GST benefit, that also company. So we are doing investment, buying up the equity or something 76%, my board has straight told, yes, if it's existing plug, small investment, we are getting immediately payback period is very less, less than 2 years, I'm recovering whatever money I'm investing, so everyone with a clean approval. So we'll guitar the share purchase agreement, the duty process, and we'll come with the liquidation because [indiscernible] what is the size of the investment requirement on that they give us the approval. -- right?

Yes. So as of now, the affluent packaging is not consolidated with our numbers as on...

Foreign Language]

So we have not closed the transaction a .

No, no. Wait and watch. It's wait and watch it association normalize.

And we are paying 125 million and then we will owning some debt also is it 15 the enterprise value or I tell you this way...

For 76% equity, INR 150 crores, okay? So you take the 100% enterprise value INR 200 crore DAP cash for the company.

And second question is, sir, pertaining to the [indiscernible] of the market currently [Foreign Language ] are already 2/3 to the quarter -- so how well are our assets currently sitting for the interim quarters and how is this quarter business environment or setup is there? If you could throw some... .

[Foreign Language] As I mentioned in my comments, I'm not compromising on any of guidance. We will commit it to quarterly growth, and that definitely will continue in terms of the revenue and volume, both will be the plus side only. And you will see EBITDA margin also positive. .

Due to time concerns, we take this as a last question. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Raghu Pati for closing comments. Over to you, sir.

No, thank you very much. If any, my investor because of the shortage of time, he could not ask questions, disc -- he can send mail and he can come personally visit to the office. And further my request, if any investor would like to see my visit of the plant, which have been completed in 2027, especially the CNG composite product in [indiscernible],fully automatic plant in [indiscernible] plant, they are free, they can give their advance in demand schedule, which is organized for that we did. . Once again, thank you very much to listening company understand as, again, in last comment, we are not changing any guidance. We are going to fulfill our commitment for ROCE or margin, EBITDA. There is no change in any guidance margin in this time Thank you very much to all my were investors and Logan Igor this call.

Thank you, sir. On behalf of Cabira Securities, that concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us. You may now disconnect your lines.