TMBThanachart Bank Public Company Limited (TTB-R.BK) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Good afternoon, everyone, and welcome you to full year 2020 performance for TMB. Today, we have presenters, Khun Piti, CEO; Khun Prapasiri, CFO; Khun Naris, our Head of Strategy; and also President, Khun Praphan joined us for this time. May I pass the presentation to Khun Piti first? Thank you.

Good afternoon, everyone. Thank you for your time. Today, we will separate session into the performance and strategy and then provide you the guidance on what we see for this year. But first of all, before passing the Performance section to CFO, I would like to clear up understanding about the debt relief situation and how we how we managed this because it seems to be the most confusing part because each bank defined this differently. There is no right and wrong because this is new to everyone, so I would like to share our thinking and how we track and how we manage this, including how we provide provision and overlay based on our own framework. Let's go back in during June, right after the lockdown in, I call it, global lockdown in Thailand. During second quarter BOT issue the general that relief that would be applied to almost everyone that get into trouble. So that global debt relief result in high number of debt relief requests up to 40%, where SME, almost 100%, get automatic debt relief moratorium for a different period of time. When come to September, many customers can't go back to normal. And normal mean, normal, normal, meaning that they do not need to take any extra mitigation at all. So they go back to original term. So that number becomes 80-20 from 60-40, as you see on September '20, 80% back to real normal. And we continue to track that some during September, start to get certain type of mitigation. That is on the dark gray area. And when come to December '20, we show the number of 15%. Let's bear with me for a minute. This is a bit complicated. On this 15%, we separate between 20% who the customer, who is still order original debt relief offer since March/April 2020. We call that Phase I. So 20% of 15% is 3%, right? And 80% of 15% is 12%. So the 3% who are there. They are mostly large corporate, like hotel, big shopping complex that we give them very long period. Debt relief package because we know that things will not get recovered that fast, where the rest of the -- this 15%, the 13% that, that you see here, they take mitigation. So we [ call it ] debt relief Phase 2. And what are the mitigation that we gave to them? We have 7 type of mitigation starting from just [indiscernible] to very strong mitigation. The first one, customers can come back and pay a principal interest normally, but they ask that please help me on the accrued interest that they ask for a moratorium during the last 3 and 6 months, may they installed debt not pay in full or the accrued interest. So we consider this group very good one because the regular P&I normal installment, they can pay normally, but they just want to make installment on the accrual interest. The second time mitigation, they can still pay P&I, principal and interest, but their request for some reduction in monthly payment. The third group is the one who say that because of COVID, may I postpone principal, but I will continue to pay interest only. The first group pay P&I fully or partially, represent 70% of the 13%. Expand to mitigation, Slide #3, altogether, 1, 2 and 3, represent 90% and we consider this as a low risk to very low-risk group because they come back and pay on different level of payment. Then the rest #4, mitigation is pay only interest. And then #5 skip payment for short term, meaning that they cannot pay anything, maybe for another 3 months that want their request. #6 is skip payment for 6 months and #7 is up to a year. Fortunately, so far, we do not give anyone on 6 to 12, meaning that we still do not subscribe mitigation level 6 and 7 where 90% is on level 1, 2, 3. Why this is important? Because when come to PD shift, you see how calculation overlay that we will put in place, we will use this logic. The more critical needs requested by the customer and given out by us, we will put more overlay, higher ECL will be applying because of PD shift. That is the framework that we use. So all in all, for banks that report to you about what remain under debt relief, our number would be this 2% because the original debt relief remain on December is around 2% and the 13% is the new package that we offer. Again, 90% of those 13% take the weak mitigation, meaning that they are not that bad. They need some help, but not to deploy that they cannot pay anything. That is the way that we track, manage and apply provision, ECL calculation and overlay onto that. Because we don't know what will happen next. At least, that is the most scientific approach that we can apply and make sure that we will not anticipate the situation upfront. Move to next page, zoom in, what I just explained and separate into commercial and retail. Maybe start from the retail first, that is the easier one. The blue is different, meaning that this is a mix between original debt relief and no mitigation that we give out. For simplicity because this 99-point-something percent of the blue under December is a new blue, meaning that almost all the customers in retail, hire purchase, mortgage and unsecured already came out of the original debt relief and as for the second phase of debt relief, which I already explained that majority, they come back and pay on the modified, not that they still start in the original debt relief. And 90% of the modified terms are those who are still paying fully or partially. Contrary on the corporate side. On SME mostly, they are on the modified term. On the corporate, as mentioned, the 2% on the page before, those mostly are the corporate that as original we decide to give them very long that relief where they can pay only interest and postpone principal for a year or even longer because we anticipate that the industry will not come back that soon. For example, a company that provides support to a reagent business. Company that do commercial shopping complex or hotel in Bangkok, that the local tourism will not help. Those -- we anticipate that it will not get recovered as soon, and they have strong enough cash flow to pay just interest. So why don't we just postpone principal for a year or even more, those are the type of 3% that -- sorry, 2%, that's still under the original debt relief. I'm more than happy to provide you with the answer that -- on the question that you may have, but let CFO share with you what happened in 2020, and then we can definitely come back to this part again. CFO, please.

Thank you, CEO. Good afternoon, everyone. I hope you all stay safe and sound amidst of this COVID spreading. And maybe I will go to the next slide. On this slide, I would like to share that in -- from the bird's eye view, we have the flat loan growth and we also have the 1.8% deposit balance declining year-to-date. This is on intention. I'll explain to you later why. In fact, that the 2% strategy is the result that our NIM for the year stay at 3%. And our non NII income is 0.81% as within the guideline. And cost income ratio is 46%, Stage 3 is 2.5% below the guidance that we have given. Nevertheless, the credit cost has increased slightly beyond the guideline of 179. We have the reason for that. Maybe I bring you to the details. First, into the loan portfolio. On the next slide, the effectiveness of the balance sheet optimization that we have shared when we make the plan to do this integration with the Thanachart Bank has produced the result. We leveraged from the TBANK strength on the high-yield hire purchase portfolio. Hence, at the Merged Bank level, we can choose to de-risk the portfolio and run that low-yield portfolio. As a result, our total loan balance year-on-year stays flat at THB 1.4 trillion. But of course, with the better quality portfolio that we do have, with the mix of retail portfolio of 56%, 90% of this retail portfolio are asset-backed portfolio. And they've been 44% corporate. And in this 44%, only 7% is SMB portfolio. In Q4 of this year, the new booking has started to pick up particularly in the mortgage portfolio as well as in the hire purchase. We see that we achieved growth in new booking of new car in the hire purchase portfolio because of the motor -- as a consequence of having done motor show in Thailand. And from the total car sales year-on-year, this year compared with last year, the declining in the new car sales has dropped lower than the industry has expected, okay? The other thing that I would like to share is that the repayment, as CEO has mentioned that, most of -- most, if not all, of our COVID customers come back to repay. Therefore, the repayment that we are receiving has been -- out beats the new booking because we are focused on derisking our loan portfolio as well. When we look into the non-COVID customer, we also observed that the payment behavior of the non-COVID customer has been better than expected. Maybe I move on to the deposit side. On the deposit side, we also leveraged from the TMB deposit franchise. So we could reduce the high-cost TD. If you see on the graph, our high-cost TD NCD has now been accounted for only 14% of the portfolio. We have increased the balance of the hybrid product, which is the no-fixed and ultra. The balance increased despite the fact that we have adjusted the interest rate that we are paying to them now to be in align with the market and the liquidity management. Remarkable on this deposit that I would like to share is our growing CASA transactional deposits, particularly in the [indiscernible] account, we see new customer as well as the increased balance per customer. And this trend has been on the increasing trend since Q3 and Q4, we are seeing that. And we have the plan to grow this portfolio even further. We also observed that our affluent segment customer has used the convenience in transferring their balance into the investment in mutual fund in Q4 to increase their return on investment. This is the strategy that we have adopted, and we see it has been put through in Q4. Therefore, in conclusion, all strategic directions in loan and deposits has worked well as we planned. On this slide, you will be seeing that the challenges during the COVID pandemic is really managing liquidity vis-a-vis managing the negative carry in the portfolio. We have seen on the slide on the cost of deposit. You will be seeing that our cost of deposit has been decreasing from 1.5% to 0.84%, which is 67 basis points declining. On next slide, you'll see that our liquidity on the LDR and LCR are well above the required and the mixing into our funding is in a good position as we have planned. So move on to the next slide. I would like to talk about the loan yield a little bit. We have been covering the cost of deposit already. Graph to the right-hand side, first of all, I would like to share that the loan yield year-on-year '19 -- 2019, 2020, the yield has been increasing 8 basis point year-on-year. This is after the impact of the PPA amortization. Without the PPA amortization, which is particularly the premium that we have acquired from the hire purchase outflow of TBANK, which we need to amortize that premium as our expense. The difference into this amortization impact on the year basis is 12 basis points. I would like to touch a little bit for the loan yield of Q-on-Q. You can use the Q4 loan yield as a proxy for forward-looking because if you remember, in Q3, I've discussed with you that there has been 1 adjustment in this PPA amortization, because of the COVID customer has extended their payment terms of approximately 4 to 6 months. Therefore, the amortization period has been extended. Hence, there is a reduction in the loan yield in Q3, which is the catch-up of the first 9 months. Now in Q4, it's normalized. So you may use this loan new trend for future forecast. On the next slide, as a result of the balance sheet optimization enhancements on the cost of deposit, our NIM has been at now 3%, which is 19 basis points improved year-on-year. Our net interest income has been showing a good trend in Q-on-Q also. In Q4, it's 2.2% growth Q-on-Q. This will be on the non NII. On a yearly basis, the non NII has been growing 16% and Q-on-Q, the aggregate non NII is 44% growth. But the core fee income that I would like to focus, grow Q-on-Q at 13%. On the right-hand side graph, the key contributor in the growth of the fee income is the BA fee contributed by the auto BA because of the incremental new bookings that we have seen in Q4 as well as the new product launch in Q4. Second run-up is really the mutual fund. The mutual fund fee growth is 26% Q-on-Q. This has been our activity that our fund we issue new IPO in late Q3 and Q4. Hence we have been gaining the fee mutual fund. On loan-related fee trend, Q-on-Q is stabilized, but do not mistaken on the year-on-year in 2020, we have using the amortizing fee approach in accordance with the new accounting standard. Therefore, comparison has to be taken in this 2021 forward-looking. We also see a growing fee income in the trade finance and FX 12% Q-on-Q. Next, move on to the total operating income. In aggregate, Q-on-Q, total operating income increased 10%. But on an annual basis, it's increasing 73%. Nevertheless, even though our income increased 73%, but our operating expense increased only 53%. This is due to our effort in cost efficiency. And we also have accelerated the integration activity. Key contributor in this cost efficiency is in 4 items. First is the HR cost. We have offered a voluntary departure package, and we're also seeing the natural attrition, which has bring out the annual cost for the year. Also in terms of brands, we accelerate our co-location brands and closure of the brands. In terms of marketing management, we focus marketing on the product and grouping to company. Therefore, we also see cost saving in terms of marketing. Last, but not least, is we are leveraging our negotiation power in terms of IT that we are now a bigger size. Therefore, we're doing the rationalization and also have a cost saving in this domain. On the next slide, you would see that total cost savings for the year is THB 3 billion. Out of this THB 3 billion, we have to pay the integration cost of approximately THB 1 billion. So we are having net cost savings from this in this year. On the next slide, our cost income ratio of the total year is 46%. But if we exclude the PPA impact, it would stand at 44%. In our 5-year business plan, we are seeing that we will continue on the cost synergy exercise, and we are targeting that our cost income ratio will be low 40s in our 5-year plan. On the next slide is the PPOP. I will not be spending time on this. You see that our PPOP growth is growing Q-o-Q. Well this may be the slide that everyone is waiting for us to discuss about. But before I move on into the real figures, I would like to remind you of our strategy in this managing our provision. As CEO has mentioned, 98% of the COVID customer has exited the program. And we said that we would need to observe that payment behavior, and we have done that. In Q4, with the clearer direction and seeing the payment behavior, we have put in more provision. We see the flow to [indiscernible] from certain portfolio in hire purchase, in [indiscernible], but we're also seeing the upstaging of the customer from stage 2 to stage 1, particularly when they have completed the payment conditions. This is highly concentrated in the hire purchase portfolio. As a result, in Q4, we have put into our expense of THB 8.2 billion risk cost or 238 basis points risk cost, leaving the entire year of THB 24.8 billion provision expenses, which is 179 basis points. Do we really need to come up this high? The answer is not really, but what we would like to do is that we would like to prepare for this coming year, 2021, because we have observed the second pandemic -- second COVID spreading in Thailand. As a result of putting this provision into our account, our provision -- the aggregate provision at December is THB 53 billion, which is 134% LLR coverage ratio. This increased from the 106% in Q1. And because of this strategic direction, we are now reporting THB 10.11 billion in net profit. On this slide, I would like to share, first on the customer profile before I explain the graph. As CEO has mentioned that 2% of our COVID customers are still in relief, 12% choose the 7 packages that we have offered. I would like to share with you more on that. 90% of this 12%, who took the 7 packages in full interest payment has partial principal or full principal payment. And 93% of them are in having no DPD or DPD less than 30 days. So we believe that this is a good payment behavior that we have observed. On the other hand, what we have done with our model, is that in terms of model parameter, we have updated the PD and LGD into our model. We observed the behavior of our customers prior to the COVID that means until February or March this year. We do not took the behavior we observed during the debt moratorium because it would not be a true pattern of the payment behavior. Having said that, we also took the position of the customer who have flowed up the stage in December, and that produced the ECL result. The result that we have observed is that the model that we have engineered in have picked up the pattern of non-payment. Hence they impose the PD shift. Even though the customers are in the same stage, their PD increased. The model also picked up that of the DPD. When they have the DPD dynamic shift, the bucket will shift, which means that the ECL, the risk cost will increase. On the 7 customer bucket that the CEO has mentioned, we also add on additional PD for those customers because they are not the real customer in that stage. So we have engineer, put this mechanics into our model. We also put provision for the actual interest that of this customer. We also do the forward-looking and put management overlay into the provisions. As a result, you can see from this slide that the Stage 1 customer, the ECL that we have put in has increased 40 basis points from Q1 to Q4. Stage 2 have been increased 500 basis points and stage 3 increased 304 basis points. So we believe that the provision that we have is sufficient. I'm sharing with you as if I'm doing my manifesto with the BOT, the regulator that I have to sign off of the provision sufficiency. Now move to the next slide. On this slide, we will also observe that the Stage 2 profile has been decreasing from 9.2% to 7.6%. And the balance of the Stage 3 remained 2.5% in December last year and December this year. So the -- and the aggregate Stage 2 and 3 has been declining 60 basis points year-on-year. Next, we'll see that our capital, CET1 stand at 14.4%. Our Tier 1 is 15.4%, and our car ratio is 19.5%. This is well above the regulatory requirement, and we have confidence that this is sufficient for us to move through the storm that we are seeing in 2021. We'll hand over to Khun Naris for the next session.

Thank you, Prap. Good afternoon, everyone. For this part, we would like to share with you all in terms of what would be the strategic direction of the Merged Bank. And I guess if we go to the next page, I guess before we discuss the future, I think it's worthwhile to really look back at the past year. You have heard Khun Piti and Khun Prapasiri already in terms of the bank effort to really help the customer and while managing the bank asset quality, as well as how we deliver the business as usual performance. But on top of that, I would say that in 2020, we essentially try to balance between the short-term priorities that we have discussed as well as the medium-term priorities in terms of merging the 2 banks together as well as setting up the new bank for the new strategic direction. And I guess we must not forget that I think the financial closing of the merger transaction just happened 13 months ago. And I guess the management of the 2 banks have spent 2020 doing a lot of things to try too much with the 2 bank. And as the senior management as well as the Board of Directors, we also spent a lot of time in terms of crystallizing what would be the directions of the Merged Bank after the expected entire business transfer which we hope to have in mid-2021. So if we look ahead, I would say that 4 priorities [indiscernible] of 2021, right? I think, #1, we still expect high volatility going into 2021. So maintaining healthy level of capital and liquidity is something that we keep an eye on. Also, we also are in the process of servicing the customer who are affected by COVID-19 and which may need some help. And of course, doing that in parallel to also making sure that we highly manage our asset quality. On top of that, as I said earlier, we expect the entire business transfer, which is essentially merging the 2 legal entity into one. That have to happen in July this year. And I guess we are essentially -- this is 18-month journey when we started at the financial closing and after 12 months, we still believe that we are on track to achieve this milestone. And the last step is, as I said earlier, we also will track ahead. At the end of the day, it's just not just simply merging the 2 workforce, the 2 office building, things like that, we also want to really shift the way we operate the bank, the direction, the strategy, and that's what I would touch on a bit into the discussion. Okay. If we move on to next page, I think to live by the new directions that the top management and the Board spent a lot of time discussing. I think we have decided to make revisions to the vision, mission and the core proposition of the Merged Bank to really reflect the latest thinking up and also reflect the strength of both bank. For the vision, we highlighted the recommended bank of choice as something that we want to be. And I think that clearly reflects the core belief of the 2 banks that have. Also for the mission statement, I think we have shared with the analysts earlier in terms of our belief that the financial wellbeing would be something that we want to put at the core of our directions. So we reflect that into our mission statement that at the end of the day, we want really the bank to really help improve our customer long-term financial wellbeing. And the last aspect, which I will discuss a bit more detail in terms of why we think this is important and how we come about with this core proposition. But at the end of the day, I would say that the core thinking would be first. We want to shift away from a kind of product category champion to be of a personalized solution that really address the live stage or live event of the customer at a holistic level. On top of that, I think we want to deliver the experience, do the humanized digital platform as one of the key transformation of our channel and how the way we interact with the customer. So this is kind of the highlight and the high level in terms of how we think about the direction of the Merged Bank. If we move on -- to achieve this vision, it is a multi-year journey. The financial closing of the merger transaction in December 2020/'19 is a catalyst for us, where we spent the past 13 months on the beginning part of the journey. And I guess when we look into 2021, I would say that trying to manage the short-term priorities, right? COVID-19 is still with us. We still need to achieve EBT in mid next year. I think that's something that we need to continue focusing on. And on top of that, I would hope that, I guess, we would be able to come back and share with the analysts community in terms of the key building block that we start putting in for the medium-term strategy. At the end of last year, we already launched the new version of the Commercial Banking Mobile Banking platform that are for our commercial customers. So that's one part of the building block. Also, the bank is working on the new mobile banking platform for retail customers, and we hope to be able to launch it later this year. So that's another building block that we think revamping existing digital platform is one of the key enabler. And if we look ahead a bit beyond this year, I would say that at the end of the day, we really believe that the 2 banks have a high-quality customer base. We have about 10 million customer base that we don't think that we really maximize the value of this high-value customer yet. And with the right digital platform, we -- and comprehensive product suites that we already have, we think that we really -- can really maximize the value from this group of customer. And on top of that, to us, the new digital platform is not just an app, right? It's a new way of work for the bank. It's a new operating model for the bank. So hopefully, through the new digital platform, then we can achieve what we call digital-first operating model to the bank, which would give us hopefully, a better customer experience, more agility in terms of launching new product and service. And also, ultimately, a lower cost to serve, a lower cost space for the bank as a whole. So this is how we think about this transformative journey to really help us achieve the new vision. So if we go into the detail on the next page, this one just want to give a bit more flavor in terms of the details that we went through, right? As I said earlier, this is an 18-month journey that we start in December 2019. We've been through alert update already. But the last 6 months, I would say that a lot of work will need to be done. We have hundreds of our staff involved in this part. Essentially, the whole bank will need to really help us push through this important milestone. But I think most importantly, after the EBT we hope that I think a lot of synergies that we envision when we contemplate the merger transaction, it would be much easier to realize post EBT network. Also another important milestone which I haven't touched on it yet is we expect the rebranding to also happen at around the time of the EBT, so that would really help from the customer point of view to really integrate the 2 very strong bank, TMB Bank and Thanachart Bank into one. On to next page. Just want to say, I think many of you may have seen some of this already. So from the customer point of view, I think, rather than waiting for the EBT to be a big bang event, right, we don't want to -- we did not wait for that, right? Gradually, we start merging the customer journey in many touch point already. We launched what we call a co-location brand throughout 2020. Actually, right now, there's 114 of those, right. This is a location whereby we merge the customer-facing counters of the 2 bank together, so that customers can get a more seamless experience, interacting with the 2 bank while we wait for EBT. Also things like merging the ATM or allowing the customer to do transaction across ADM. I think that's something that we have done already without waiting for EBT. Next, I guess, just want to touch base on synergy realizations. The graph on the left-hand side is what we share to everyone here back last year. And if you may recall, I think this is what we plan as the 5-year synergy realization. And I guess as CFO already touched on it a bit, right, I would say that after 13 months, at least based on the target shown on this page, we overachieved the overall synergy realization against our target. And if I go into the detail, I would -- the part that we did a great job is really balancing synergy and cost synergy as shown on the page. There's a lot of tangible action that has been taken and result in the value creation that we managed to unlock through this journey. The part that may be -- we haven't really fully captured, it is the revenue synergy. But that's more or less in line with our plan as well because I think since last year, we were upfront with the analyst community here that the revenue synergy would take a bit longer time to capture. Hopefully, after EBT, which is the point where the 2 legal entities merge into 1. The 2 customer base will be merged in Q1, and we go to the market with 1 brand. I think that's the point where, hopefully, we gradually see more impact on the revenue synergy realization. I guess, at this stage, maybe I think the momentum in terms of synergy realization, we expect it to continue into 2021. As I said earlier, hopefully, we see more contribution from the revenue synergy as we start to merge the touch point, the brand, the customer base, the portfolio of the product offerings. So hopefully, there will be more of that. But at the same time, I think the cost synergy realization, we expect the momentum to continue. In 2021, we plan to have about 100 branch closures. But I guess this brand closure is more or less the overlap branch. So I hope that, that wouldn't impact the customer experience so much. So moving on. In terms of the directions, medium-term directions of the Merged Bank. I think at the end of the day, if we look at the strength of TMB International as individual banks, I would say that the 2 banks, 2 medium-sized banks have a very strong product portfolio in their own niche market. TBANK, as everyone know, is a leading auto franchise, very strong auto lending portfolio and products. TMB through the deposit-led strategy. We have one of the strongest deposit product in the past. For example, our offering on non-fixed, as I think we have shared this to analyst community in the past. But I guess, when we look ahead, right, the strategy of being a strong bank, a strong player in certain product category may make sense for a medium-sized bank. But as we merge, after we merge, become a big bank, we think that maybe we should hope to be more than that. So at the end, the key shift would be try to build on the strengths that we have in this product category. And through that, deliver an end-to-end solution that really answers the needs of the customer at a holistic level, try to be just a bank that customer used for specific purpose to be something of their main bank. This is I guess what we aim for the Merged Bank. And as I said earlier, I think one of the key enabler to become a main bank, having a very competitive digital platform is something that minimum requirement. And I guess, realizing that requirement, we are in the process of really revamping this part, which hopefully will allow us to achieve this very important shift. But at the same time, just want to ensure to everyone here that not everything will be changed. We still think that there is a core part of our DNA, both bank DNA that are very valuable, and we don't want to change it. Things like sense of forecast, we don't want to be everything for everyone. At the end of the day, we want to set up our target customer, and we don't want our target customer to be everyone or the business. We are very targeted. And also things like challenge status quo, agile way of working, focus on execution. These are the attributes that we believe in the bank DNA already, and we want to service and maintain that. So moving on to the next page. I think this one, I just want to give some stat or fact a bit in terms of why we think trying to become the main bank of the customer and offer end-to-end solution would make sense for us after the merger. I think [indiscernible] that many analysts may have heard about the merger is that we #6 and #7 bank merged. After the merge, we become #6 bank. So maybe not that difference, right? Not a tangible change that really changed the game here. But when we look into the detail, right, why the ranking may not have changed much, right, after the merger, it is still #6 bank. But we look into the spread out between retail and commercial, you will see a big shift in the commercial -- in the retail space. After the merger, we have about 15% asset share that have ranked #4 in the industry. And when we look at the product that I mentioned earlier, as our strength, 18% -- 28% share in auto, 12% share in mortgage, 16% share in non-CASA or high-yield saving. So these are the strengths that we truly believe that we can build on. And with the right enabler that we put in, we can really capture the value that maybe today is left on the table. So on the next page, I just want to build on to that a bit further. The graph on the left-hand side is what we shared to analysts in the past that we have about 10 million customer base. The 2 banks have very little overlap, that's up about 10%. In the past year, we look at this customer base analysis a bit deeper. And as I said earlier, a car owner, homeowner, high-yield depositors add a customer base that -- a group of customer base that we did a good job in the past. And when we look at the overlap between the 3 customer base, there's not much overlap yet today, meaning the customer base that the bank has strong positioning in largely untapped from the cross-selling point of view. And we think that digital platform is a key enabler to help us achieve that. That's why we think we really need to revamp the digital platform to really tap onto this potential. On the next page, I guess the way we think about the customer base, essentially we look at it as 2 engines. On one hand, we have acquisition engine. So churning products that bring the customer to the bank. On the other hand, we have engagement engine. So once the customer becomes the customer of the bank, how we engage the customer with a customer on a day-to-day basis. I must say that on the acquisition engine, our assessment today is that we have a very strong acquisition engine. Things like auto-lending loan or even payroll, I think this engine is working quite well from our point of view. It doesn't mean that we stop enhancing it. We will focus on also enhancing it. But I think the key task that we need to do better is our engagement engine. Today, this 10 million customer base is still not fully maximized in terms of its potential, and that's where we will focus on it at least this year and next year. And also, if we move on to the next page, I think the key part for us to really maximize this group of customers potential as well as the engagement engine, as I said earlier, is the digital platform. Today, I guess -- while, I guess, TMB may be the pioneer of digital banking, we must say that our mobile banking platform is a couple years old. So we are at the end of the life cycle of the platform already. And for us, to really make this shift from a branch-first operating model to a digital banking first operating model, we need new capabilities in our digital platform, and that's what we're focusing on at the moment. So moving on to the next page. Just want to share a bit stat, right, in terms of where we are when it comes to digital transformation. I guess why I keep saying we need to enhance the digital platform. It doesn't mean that we are not at a good job level. When we look at the service transaction, today we actually have 99% of the transaction through our online channel already. So in terms of migrating low-value transaction to online platform, we have done a good job already. Although transfer payments is largely on the online platform already have today, but what we maybe have been focused on in the past and maybe is constrained by the way our application clearly decide is the sales part. From the transaction wise, number of sales transaction, maybe the percentage is more than this. But from the value point of view, we must say that less than 5% of the sales value happen, let's say, on the digital platform yet, meaning the large ticket sales still happening in the offline will now happen. But on this, when we look at the customer behavior today, we think the market is ready to really move things to the digital platform. So I think that's what we intend to do, to the revamp of our new digital platform, that is clearly an ongoing effort by our management. So moving on to the last page. I think at the end of the day, if we manage to really achieve this transformative journey, I guess, to the customer, as I said earlier, we really hope that the improvement in our main bank financial will be -- would be something that we can tangibly deliver to our customer. For our employee, I think employer of choice would be something that we want to promote. We want to make sure that we are able to retain talent and cultivate, grow them, develop them to be a senior position within the bank. For shareholders' ROE at top peer level is what we have been communicated to everyone here. We hope that we might be able to maintain strong capital base. And hopefully, through this new operating model, our C/I will go down to the low 40 level. And lastly, in terms of contribution to the society and the environmental aspect at large, we think that sustainability is still something at the core that we believe in. And the result has been announced a few days ago. I think this year, we have been ranked #1 again in the Fair Finance assessment. So hopefully, this is something that I really confirm that the bank really promote this sustainability aspect as one of the core principle that we believe in. So I think that's it for my part. I hand over to Khun Piti on the guidance.

And on the last section, from what we early presented on what happened in 2020 into long-term plan, I think the job for this year is first, to make sure that the integration will be completed on time, on budget so that we can pursue the strategy as Khun Naris just mentioned. And as you all know, that the second wave of COVID has hit Thailand essentially end of December. Where last year, we still enjoyed good performance on the first quarter because the COVID start to hit peak in second quarter. Besides the rate cut happened not full year last year. So we start off the year with COVID from the beginning of the year. We start off the year where this year, we will order van, we'll get the full impact on rate cuts. Meaning that our job is to protect, preserve the franchise and the book value under this perfect strong condition. That lead to the thinking of what we should do this year. Since we still have room to improve our balance sheet mix, there is no point to aggressively play to grow the book at all. If we can still further refine the mix of our loan part, we can further push down a bit more on our deposit cost and deposit mix to have a more optimum balance sheet, instead of trying to grow balance sheet to improve net interest income. Therefore, we plan to have flat loan growth, flat deposit growth and rebalance the portfolio of term. So that we can continue to keep NIM at this good level without adding additional risk onto our portfolio under this difficult environment. On the noninterest income, we can make it last year, but if we're cyclical quarter-by-quarter -- first quarter, we have done it well. And as expect, the underpenetrate customer at TBANK, via TBANK have a lot of good customer, good deposit base, but do not buy bancassurance or mutual fund product that much. We have done very well last year, new high on board bancassurance and mutual fund business on the TBANK side. I just know that, if you look at the aforementioned, it varies, is now quarter-by-quarter, not because of the seasonal tax season. But because, as Khun Naris mentioned, is due to COVID, because majority of the volume still need face-to-face dialogue, not through digital. And this year, starting off from the first quarter, customer would be very hesitant to go out and meet with our people. And vice versa, so the sales would be difficult for this type of product, not just for us, for everyone. That's why we think that even we see good recovery on Q4 is going to be difficult again this year because of the COVID impact. So the longer it takes, the more pressure to the bank industry on generating fee income. On the CI ratio, we had done it very, very well. We can accelerate cost reduction more than what we planned. However, this is the last corner of integration work. There will be cost that we need to pay. For example, once we move to the new IT platform, then we need to write off the one that we do not use. Even the new platform, we do not need to rely on [ our software vendor ], the cost will be coming down, which will generate positive NPV from synergy, that will be onetime written off. We need to adjust look and feel of the branch. Yes, we cut down a lot of branches. It will save a lot of cost. But again, we have to write off those that we are not going to use on physical space. We do not want to let people go at this point. Those will stay, but we do not have task for them to do. We need to redeploy within the organization. But of course, it is their choices, but we must be fair to them. Those who decide not to continue on with the merged bank. Because of the redundant reason, we must pay them fair and generous enough. So this time around, it will cost more than normal early retirement package. Those who will still have job in the same job family, but they do not want to stay anymore, we pay them the normal ER package. But those that we force them to upskill, re-skill and will be redeploying to other job, we must be fair to them. That if they decide not to continue on, we should pay them enough money for them to continue their life. So that would push up the cost. More than that, we have to do rebrand. This is very important for protecting our franchise. Last year, we can cut a lot of marketing expense. Because if there is no business activity, why pay for marketing money. But this year, we need to build, not only protect but build our new brand. That result from EBT. Customer must remember both banks after integrate as a new 1 bank, then there will be additional marketing expense for rebranding, one-off expense. And lastly, there would be a cost that cannot be avoided. Even the bank merger laws already saved us a lot of normal fee. If it were to be at the time of M&A, which is the asset transfer mortgage reregistration, even it is way a lot, we still have to pay some, the car registration transfer and things like that. So there will be onetime cost that we already do with the account when we do diligence. That cost will be the onetime impact. But the NPV of saving and benefit from synergy would outweigh this onetime cost. However, we will see the onetime cost spike this year. Come to the risk aspect. I think we have done well, meaning that only around 3% left in the original debt relief. But we cannot be complacent about the situation. As mentioned, the second wave has hit, and we start to see customer coming up again for second round of debt relief. Even last time, they went out back to normal without seeking for any medication, some customer under that group start to come back and say, this time around, I may need some medication. And those who already went out from debt relief with very light medication, this time around, they come back and say, maybe I need a stronger one. That group is still small so far. That is good news, but we cannot expect that -- that number will stay low, if COVID lasts longer than we expect. If vaccine, that is the only hope that the whole world expecting is not that effective as we expect. That's why the guidance that we provide here, I mean that it is quite conservative, [indiscernible], why it would rise if this last year, we will see a big comp, but we can manage to have NPL on Stage 3 and 2.5 because we can sell NPL and we decide to sell still quite heavily at the extent of P&L because this is what we expect. And this year, there will be a flood of NPL to the market where there are limited number of asset management company highly in Thailand. So this will be the buyer market. Then we should not be cornered by the situation to drive Stage 3 down at the expense of best-selling price. So we may need to let this Stage 3 go up and [indiscernible] come down to preserve the value of this NPL. We should not let the market corner us and sell beyond real economic price because of this short-term pressure. That's why we believe that the credit cost will remain elevated and it's a range between 160 and 180 because we don't know how long COVID would last. And that is the thinking that led to this performance guidance. So I would like to give the floor back. So that if analysts, investors have question, please feel free to do so. Thank you.

[Operator Instructions] However, while we're waiting for the live questions, I got the questions in bulk. From Goldman Sachs, Khun Melissa. First question from her. Your new vision is to become bank of choice by customers of main bank, what metrics would you be looking to track this?

If we can go back to the page, that Khun did show on the way that -- we acquired customers in the past. You can see that we have on Page 33. We are very strong on stand-alone product. We have good high-yield saving. We are a top player on car loans. We are #3 then on home loans. We have sizable payroll market share. But product holding per customer is one something to do, meaning that we have to be very much more known product to many banks -- many customers. If we can have customer hold more than 1 product because it's a clear benefit of holding multiple products, their life can be better because reward from 1 product can flow to another product. That would help both customer lifelong well-being and also our profitability, it costs. Say, for example, what if we reward customer to pay loan partially with certain points, and that point can be used for buying insurance product or convert into investment product and vice versa. There is no bank in Thailand that really seriously look into this kind of proposition because most banks are very product-led, not customer-led strategy. And why is that because bank structured that way internally. With the next page that we -- if we become digital-first, and being digital-first we can really become segment of one. Because it's very difficult to serve by using branch contact center to see customer clearly and personalize that offer and package, individualize lifelong solution based on [indiscernible] behavior. But with the [indiscernible] that we start to have more and more, with digital tools that can be much better engaged with customer, they can get much better benefit by using more products with 1 bank, multiple products with 1 bank and the benefit can cross back and forth between multiple products. That is the idea. However, we have to pass the first milestone first, which is EBT by the middle of this year, while we are building the new mobile banking platform, that will serve stuff like that, and we can start to more utilize and fully utilize this new capability in the year to come.

Another question from Goldman Sachs. You mentioned your customer will be targeted, and you are not doing everything for everyone other than your current customer base? Is there any other target segment that you're looking to penetrate to?

A high level thinking is balance sheet synergy when TMB has only TMB platform, meaning that high-yield saving and home loan, and we have more money that we need, we have to redeploy that money somewhere. It normally goes to large corporates, and that has very low yield with low risk. Those are one of the segments that we will target less and less because business has returned. It's not just [indiscernible]. When the risk is low, expected return is very low, then we can forecast our resources, be it liquidity, people and everything more to the mid-income segment and mass affluent, upper affluent that's the area that we feel that they are still very much underserved. No bank ever reward customer for their good behavior or lending. The protection level that Thai people have on different life stage is not enough. Thai people still do not have enough investment saving for retirement. And this become clear when COVID hit Thailand. We see that a lot of people do not have safety net just to pass week by week. And this is good crisis for us because before this, it's like everyone is in the party, never ending party, so no one really feel the need to think about their future financial wellbeing, if bad things happen, because Thai people never see bad things happen at this magnitude. This is a wakeup call. So we believe that we cannot waste this good crisis. This good crisis is opportunity for us to wake them up and provide comprehensive solution and lifelong solution for them. So basically, TMB International will become more retail bank and be the retail bank that focus on middle-income and up. So mass, micro finance is not our focus. Super high net worth is not our focus. Super large corporate is not our focus. Our focus is the simple product, through simple service. The value for money product to average Thai people, that is the key.

Yes. So it seems like there is no more question. [Operator Instructions] The next question is from Khun Suwat. Can you share some color on SME segment that's still under moratorium program? What is the expectations on default rate of this segment? And for ones that are further restructures, what are the term that you are giving, just for the SME segment is okay?

Yes. As you can see on this page, it's very obvious that those who still need medication and continue to need medication is small SME. And this is not our arena. I see this coming. If those who follow TMB for a while, I keep repeating this message, de-risking, de-risking. I think SME is very much handicapped by situation. The global trade war. Large corporate, when they cannot expand globally, they start to compete into SME space, high cost, ability to change and many other things. So we have been de-risking SME to deploy that. We have only 7% of the total pot right now on the small SME, particularly after we merged with Thanachart Bank, maybe have to look at the focus at the government level. Basically, all the stimulus package that came out is mainly to make sure that money that go to the hand of Thai people will go to the hand of small businesses. So it will not be simply [ selling off ] their money, but it will be digital money that would only allow Thai people who get that money from the government to spend at small business, particularly a small business owner that is not registered as a company, which is the large chunk of Thai SME. Hopefully, that will help give some oxygen to those people. Secondly, the pretty current thing [indiscernible], soft loan and things like that. So it will help them to prolong situation a bit. But fundamental wise, it's going to be difficult. So for the bank -- for country is one thing. But for the bank, we need to continue to support them and trim this portfolio. Basically, if competitiveness of SME Thailand remain weak, there's no point for us to continue to expand into this area. So we have to be very selective. And being selective, meaning that there will be no growth or very small growth in SME. So the forecast short term is to make sure that they will survive through this difficult time. Medium term, we will not grow. Long term, let's say, that if Thailand can provide environment to SME to compete in a more healthy way, in a more competitive way, we may consider go back to this area. But if not, this is an area that we need to continue to shrink the portfolio. And if we look into ECL provision, this is an area that we allocate most into it.

The second question is from Khun [indiscernible]. Can you share some color on the integration cost you will experience in 2021? When will it peak for integration costs? And will it continue until 2022?

No cut, the peak will be in this year. And we will start to get more and more savings for the year to come. For instance, we only cut the branch last year, and we will continue to cut the branch this year. And once we have digital -- we have digital banking up and run, we can further cut the branch. As Khun Naris mentioned, the first bit of cutting the branch is to found a branch that's so obvious that we must cut and it will help us quick sale win. For example, why have 2 branches in same, big shopping complex. We can cut right away. Next, why should we have branches on the same street, which is a few 100 meter away, we can cut right away. But then next, why should we have a branch in a low-density area. But today, we still have customers, and we can still sell product. But maybe in '22, '23, we can start to cut those branches when mobile banking does not serve only as a tool for transaction, but also a selling tool with remote advisory for people. That's why we call digital with human touch. That will create another wave of cost reduction, breakthrough processing, do more of the robotic process would help cut and change the way we operate the bank. So cost rationalization will be done first. So again, the integration will be key this year, and then not only the cost will come down, the positive impact from the synergy will start to be realized more and more in the year to come.

The next question is from Morgan Stanley from Khun Selvie. The transaction value through digital platform is still below 5%. Did you see any technology accelerations because of COVID? The 5% number looked like a relatively low side?

Just can you go back to the place that we said that digital centric and omnichannel strategy. On this one, on the left, where we presently [indiscernible] when customers think of buying products like insurance, mutual fund, they would walk to the branch. Or the branch approach the customer and explain products. And when customers have issues, they pick up the phone, call the contact center or we have sales going out. The new world is a world where mobile banking will act as a center of universe. And other channel will all be around mobile banking because in reality, when you walk to branch, will you be able to get top-notch advice on for an investment fund about the trend of should I buy U.S. share or Chinese share or which kind of trend fund. It's difficult to deploy it, impossible, but with mobile banking and with chat capability, [indiscernible] that we have, we can have specialist support through mobile banking to give the expert advice on a particular topic. So it will not be just the emerging tool, it's the current technology, but with the support, with different format. Then the bank will have lower costs and the customer will also get better experience. And this is the way that modern banking should be operating, not that we try to replace everything we bought, mobile banking and keep our people. No people will give high value-added advice. And it should be like a doctor that you have general doctor and specialized doctor come in and serve customers on different symptoms, different issues. That's how bank should separate professional and team up to serve the customer by using mobile banking as a full [indiscernible] as engagement tool, interaction tool. But mobile banking should not only act as a transaction platform.

The next question is from Morgan Stanley again. How much of that around 179 basis points this year credit cost is additional or management overlay? Was it only THB 4 billion?

I'll pass this to CFO. But you can see that normally, our credit cost should be around 120 basis points, but it's more complicated than that. So I pass the complicated issues to CFO.

Thank you, CEO. As I've shared, we had build up the ECL model and the model fits up the PV, which, in fact, we see that we have sufficient. Nevertheless, when we do forward-looking and predicting the trend of the second wave of COVID, we have decided that we keep the management overlay of approximately THB 8 billion for both banks. And that is included already in the THB 53 billion provisions that we have shared with you.

The next question is from JPMorgan, Khun [indiscernible]. So he has a couple of questions. The first question is what GDP growth assumptions are baked into your ECL model? What is the lag between actual GDP number and that reflecting the model?

Okay. Maybe I have to read between the line of this question. I'm not sure that what you are looking for. The GDP, we -- it's difficult to forecast, first of all. If -- asking about the GDP forecast, we think that it would be around 2% to 3%, maybe even at best. But what that 2% or 3% would impact our thinking, probably nothing. In the [indiscernible] way, GDP would drive the ECL model and so on. But under the COVID situation, I don't think that we should link GDP to our loan growth plan to our ECL model because it has nothing to do with GDP. That's what I believe. But we can use better things than GDP forecast to calculate our level of provision, which I already explained. The medication level that customers seek, that's the first step. Second, we can use the result from the medication that customer requests to the actual day past due result, let's say, they seek for very, very simple medication, and they cannot pay. That is something wrong, right? Meaning that we need to prescribe stronger medication. If that is the case, then the risk cost will start to rise. That's why as CFO mentioned, we need to engineer different tools to measure, predict, access and calculate the right level of provision needed as situation evolve. So we must access situation, prescribe medication, look how medication react to the patients or patients react to the medication. And if things go well, we do not need to put more provision. If things do not go well, maybe we have to prescribe stronger medication to deploy that, no more medication would help, then it falls. This is how we use this approach to adjust the plan, develop new medication and adjust ECL model as situation evolve. So GDP has very little to do or almost nothing to do with our guidance, our thinking or assist us in managing this year business direction.

The second question is about cost saving. Going back into paid synergy cost savings. Out of those THB 10 billion to THB 12 billion of synergy cost savings, about THB 3 billion is done this year. Do we expect similar pace of cost synergy realization this year and slow down through 2022 to 2023?

Not really. The cost synergy have to separate cost -- because that is expense from integration and cost saving from integration. We have to look at the plus and minus. Extra expense from integration would continue to decline. As I mentioned, it will peak out this year and we will be less or nothing on the inflation next year. But on the cost savings, once we cut, let's say, if you look on this page, a branch, we will save cost and continue to remain that way. It's not onetime saving. If you cut 160 branches and you cut 100 more, so it becomes 260. The cost that we have to pay for 260 branches in the past will be forever saving. ATM, once we can move more and more to cashless so there will be less and less ATM. So that will be permanent and growing. Staff, we do not need to further grow staff. But of course, we will have less staff. But hire pay per staff because we need different type of staff. But net-net, the staff cost will come down, and that is permanent, right? Marketing, it would depend. But traditional marketing where you need to spend a lot of money on 15th -- second spot at Paramount Television is gone. That's why television business has gone as well. We will do more and more through what personalized segment of 1, marketing through things that always in their hand. So things will change. And the cost saving will be permanent and hopefully growing.

The next question is from Khun [indiscernible]. He has many questions. First of all, could you provide detail regarding the performance, specifically on auto loan portfolio? What percentage of THP loan are rescheduled? What NPL you anticipate here for auto loan as the resale value must be challenged from now on? Second question, outside SME and hotel that you mentioned. Within the Corporate segment, which segment are you most worried?

Okay, maybe start from auto loan, may we need Khun Praphan to help me on this because he is the real expert. I think auto loan, you can look at bank that have, say, a bigger portion of total auto loans. We see that is very much in line with other banks who mainly operate in auto loan business. It's very good news that majority of the customer went out from debt moratorium and pay normally or close to normally. At Thanachart, we do not encourage customer to take long-term skip payment. So at most, we provide a modified term that they will pay less per month, but longer. And of course, when we provide that, we have the projection on the asset value. That's how the car price will drop to determine the level of LTV so that we can properly offer the new term while protecting the risk to the bank -- to balance out, meaning that if customers pay too small amount per month, where the asset value will come down faster. At a certain point, the value of the car will exceed the value of the loan. And maybe forever, then customers will have no incentive to continue paying. However, if we put too much to deploy that they cannot pay monthly, then they will also stop paying as well because they cannot afford. That's why we have the model, that's when we say that we can lower monthly payment. We have to strike balance between ability to pay and LTV that we must preserve and take the balance between the 2. Again, the one extreme is protect the bank at ability of the pay of the customer. Well, keeping that aside, it helped increase ability to pay at bank risk. So we have to balance that out. And pricing is the tools to help stay adept because customer would be [indiscernible], but of course, not beyond the original EIR to discourage them to take too strong medication. On the repossession and resale value, maybe I pass to Khun Praphan. It's not that bad so far.

On the resale value on the -- before COVID is, the loss is around 38% on the principal in the COVID situation and that is get the benefit from the -- like the car supply in the market, [indiscernible] to allow 30% of the loss of the principal. Now it's turned on [ quite dramatic ], supply should go to the market, that is nearly a normal situation, now the resale value [indiscernible] is 36%.

Yes. So in sum, it's still very much in line with the model that we see. We get small period windfall benefit because of the shorter supply. So basically, we benefit from -- get a better recovery for short period, but we do not interpolate that how that it will stay forever. The resale value at this point is still in line with [indiscernible] the model that we put in. And on top of that, last year, we put extra provision for the long hedging...

And maybe I can add that when I shared that we have updated the PD and LGD model. The LGD, particularly in the auto portfolio, we have looked through the cycle of the previous financial crisis as well as the first crisis a couple of years ago, and we had a premium on the loss even before into that. So our model has been updated, and this factor has been put into the engine already.

Yes. And to your another question on which industry we worry the most. Of course, it's the hospitality segment, hotel, and their value chain. Fortunately, the [indiscernible] have only 0.7% of the total portfolio, is quite small. And another good news is we are very conservative in lending to this segment. So the LTV is very low. So we think that we can continue to support them and support meaning that allow them to hibernate [indiscernible] hibernate and give them long enough runway to come back. And other than that, I think we have to observe as things develop. Now Thai government started to allow certain sector to come back to operate as normal. But of course, with tight control. So hopefully, once we can push the COVID curve, the economy will come back and operate more and more as normal. So industry that we should worry about will be less and less because it would be the short-term worry and long-term worry. Hotel, of course, will be a more longer-term because I don't think that tourists will come back to Thailand quickly. Now sector that we do not have to worry much, which is the food producing, seafood, I think they will get the short-term impact. But they are quite strong. So I think they should be able to withstand this short-term impact. As you may know, the food -- seafood production base in the province near Bangkok get impact because we use a lot of foreign workers, and they are required to shut down operations temporarily, that create a short-term impact. But all in all, I think we should be able to withstand the second wave, but of course, it will be a bit of a bumpy road for Thailand and Thai economy.

Due to the time limitations, I got the last request [indiscernible] investor. He would like CFO to share the Page 19 again, when you're discussing on the ECL and how we calculate the ESL for each state.

So on this slide, what I'm not sure on particular question. But what I have shared is that in coming up with these ECL calculations, we have updated the model, we have put into the PD the ODR rate that we have observed and we adjusted the PD. And I also just shared that in terms of the LGD, we also have updated the loss given default into the model. And what we have put into our machine is that our machine has been trained to observe that if there is no payment pattern, even though the customers stay in the same stage, they pick up the non -- touching base point. So we do the PD shift. When we shift into the master scale, the risk cost will be escalated. We also look into the DPD, the past due. And if we are not seeing them because they have failed to pay, we move the bucket and as a result, there will be additional risk caused into. And for the 7 customer package that CEO has mentioned, we know that they are not a normal customer. Even though their pattern, their behavior seems to be the same, for example, in terms of the bucket of the program number one, they come back and do the normal principal and interest payment. But because of the accrued interest that they have been hanging out and will be paying on amortized basis, we add actual PD for this customer, because they are not the normal customer. So we put the flag into the system and system identifies this and the model, the machines will produce the higher risk cost. And in aggregate, we also top-up from the forward-looking in terms of the industry, the segment, the 5 or now becomes more provinces of the customer. So we put management overlay specifically into that bucket also. In aggregate, the results shows that we have added the ECL per stage as I've mentioned. In the stage 3, the ECL has been -- the ECL of previous year stands at 45.5%. But now in December, the aggregate ECL risk cost plus overlay stand at 48.5%. This is as an example.

Company has suggested after the meeting, we put metrology into 1 page, so that it would be easier to do.

Okay, in fact you [indiscernible].

All right. I think that is the last request from investors. So I think I would like to conclude the presentation of full year results. Here, anything else, Khun Piti, you would like to add?

Yes. Lastly, I would like to thank you all the investors and analysts. Your question, your comment is very much valuable and always appreciated. I think this is our privilege to have you following our results and give fruitful comment and help insert thinking for us to sharpen our strategy to prepare for difficult term, and to sharpen our strategy to serve customers in a better time or we appreciate your following and your participation. Have a good day and stay safe.