Tracsis plc (TRCS) Earnings Call Transcript & Summary

Welcome to the Tracsis Interim 2022 Results Webinar. [Operator Instructions] All attendees are in listen-only mode. And at the end of the presentation, there will be the opportunity to ask questions. There's a PDF of the slides on the right-hand side, and this webinar is being recorded. I now hand over to Chris Barnes, CEO; and Andy Kelly, CFO. Chris, over to you.

Thank you, [ Tamzen ]. Good afternoon, everybody. We will -- Andy and I, between us, we'll share this presentation. In total, it's about 30 to 35 minutes in length. At the end of that, there will then be an opportunity for people to ask any questions that they wish. And therefore, I'll kick off now, and I'll then hand over to Andy once I'll give them the initial introduction. So this covers the financial period from the 1st of August until the 31st of January this year. And as a starting point, just as a reminder, this is a very common slide that we use in all of our investor presentations. It's to provide consistency and explain changes period to period in terms of capability that's being added into the Group. And you can see here, the biggest change in the most recent reporting period is that we've now got -- we're now 550 people in strengths following acquisitions in Ireland and in North America. And we've added 2 key areas of capability. One of those is by a North American acquisition, which is around yard automation and computer aided dispatch, and we'll explain more about that later. And the second area we've added is via Earth Observation, which is via an acquisition we've made in Ireland. And again, we'll provide more information about that later. Everything you see as we go through this presentation, if it's in green, it relates to our Rail Technology and Services division. And if it's in dark blue, it relates to our Data, Analytics, Consultancy and Events division. So as a starting point, so in terms of what were our objectives for the first half of this year, well, the first one was to maximize the return post the COVID pandemic. And as everybody that knows us well, will know that our Events and Traffic Data businesses were both hit very hard by the pandemic. The second objective was to convert our record pipeline of opportunities. And the third objective was to continue to expand the Group through targeted mergers and acquisition activity. So I'm really pleased with the progress we've made in all those 3 areas. So all of that has underpinned strong revenue and EBITDA growth in the period. And also due to the recent large contract wins that we announced this week, that will also underpin strong growth in recurring software revenue through the remainder of this financial year and then into subsequent years and beyond, both. So that's really important to us to underpin our objective, which is to put more and more recurring revenue into the business model. So alongside that, as we continue to grow, it's really important that we continue to integrate the Group. So in total now, we've made up of a historic history of 17 different acquisitions. And as we grow, it's really important that we have a real commonality of business process and structure that sits behind those acquisitions. So what we're trying to achieve is to make sure we keep the agility and the entrepreneurship that comes from buying the technology businesses that we've acquired, but then behind it a real structure that enables us to grow and expand really quickly, and we're making really good progress in that regard. With regards to expansion of the Group, 2 acquisitions have been made. One is into the really important North American market, which is through the acquisition of a business called RailComm, which enables us to actually now have a platform around which we can grow our Rail Technology and Services revenue in North America. And then the second acquisition was to expand our technology base, which was into Earth Observation, which is part of our growth strategy linked to Data Analytics and GIS. So at the headline level, really good progress made across the Group. We're on track to deliver our strategic objectives and there's some really exciting developments through the period. So I'll now hand over to Andy to talk you through the financial headlines for the period.

Thanks, Chris. So as Chris mentioned, the first half financial performance is characterized by strong revenue and profit growth. The total revenue for the Group was up by 31% to GBP 29.2 million, and I'll talk through the drivers of that on the next slide. We saw an increase in adjusted EBITDA of 14% with profit growth in both divisions and an increase in PBT of 16%. The Group continues to be very cash generative, and we closed the period with GBP 25.1 million of cash, which is very close to where we entered the period and that's after investing about GBP 2.5 million in the Icon acquisition and earn-outs. As Chris mentioned, we've completed 2 acquisitions, Icon during the first half and then subsequently, the acquisition of RailComm. We'll talk you through the details of RailComm in due course. But even after doing that, we're still left with a strong balance sheet position and cash in order to continue to invest in the growth of the Group. And as we're seeing that recovery from COVID, we have restored our progressive dividend policy and declared an interim dividend of 0.9p per share. There's a lot of information on this slide, but this really talks through the key drivers of the strong revenue growth that we've seen in the first half. As Chris said, anything in green is the Rail Technology and Services side of the business and the dark blue is the Data, Analytics, Consultancy and Events. In the top left corner, you can see that we've seen continued growth in our rail software revenue. So this is our recurring revenue from rail software licenses as well as our bespoke software development revenue. That's really pleasing to see. And during the period and subsequently to the end of January, we won a number of contracts that will continue to fuel further growth in this side of the business. And we'll talk through the details of those in due course. You can see in the middle on the top line, remote condition monitoring revenue in the first half was slightly lower than the first half of last year, which was a record performance. This side of the business can have a more cyclical revenue pattern, which reflects the investment cycle of our U.K. customer base. What we've seen in the first half of this year is consistent with those historic trends. And this is really the strategic -- one of the areas where the strategic value of the RailComm acquisition comes into play because opening up the North American market for remote condition monitoring not only increases the size of the market for a hardware and software offering here, but also will allow us to offset some of that cyclicality in the revenue where we're at the moment, tied to a total U.K. customer base. On the other side of the business, Data, Analytics, Consultancy and Events showed extremely strong revenue growth in the first half, up 72% to GBP 17.5 million. A big driver of this was the post-COVID recovery in Events and Traffic Data. As you can see on the bottom row, Events had a very, very strong revenue recovery and here, activity levels are back at pre-pandemic levels. On Traffic Data, the recovery is slightly more phased, but we expect that to get back to pre-pandemic levels during the second half of this financial year. And what's really pleasing here is the speed at which our businesses and our teams are able to respond to that pickup in demand as a result of the actions we took over the last couple of years to protect those businesses and safeguard jobs. On the data informatics and transport insight side, both of those businesses have shown organic growth in the period. They also benefited from the acquisitions we made in the last calendar year of Icon GEO and Flash Forward Consulting, respectively. The bar chart on the right-hand side of this slide shows the level of recurring and repeat revenue that we see in each side of the business. And our strategic goal is really to grow that light green bar, which is the recurring repeat revenue in the Rail Technology and Services side of the business. In the first half of this year, that was almost 80% of the divisional revenue. Now that ratio will jump around a little bit depending on how much hardware sales and how much bespoke software activity goes on during the period. We typically expect that to see that around the 70%, 75% mark going forward. But our goal is to grow the absolute size of that bar going forward. Just looking at the income statement in more detail. So you can see the strong revenue growth there. Adjusted EBITDA was up by 14%. And in the first half of last year, we were still claiming some support from the furlough scheme and that gave us about GBP 0.5 million of support to the income statement. So if you adjust for that, we actually saw adjusted EBITDA growth of about 26% on an underlying basis. The total Group EBITDA margin of 21% reflects us getting back to that more normalized mix of revenue and is much closer to what we'd expect to see on a sustainable basis for the business going forward. Just looking at the divisional performance. So Rail Technology and Services revenue in total was down 3% on the first half of last year. That was driven by the cyclicality we talked about on the remote condition monitoring side of the business. But despite that, we were able to grow EBITDA by 4%. And as I said, we've won a number of key contract wins in this side of the business in recent months, and that leaves us very well positioned to deliver further growth in H2 and looking further forward. On the Data, Analytics, Consultancy and Events side, strong revenue growth, which has dropped through to EBITDA growth. And again, in the prior year, we had about GBP 0.5 million of support from the furlough scheme. So when you adjust for that, the EBITDA percentage in that division has grown on an underlying basis from 11% to 13%, and that includes retaining some of the cost savings that we put through in the business in response to COVID. Our target was to retain about GBP 0.5 million of those on an annualized basis, and we're tracking to that in the first half. And then finally, on the cash flow. As I say, we had a strong cash performance in the first half of the year. Our working capital patterns reflect the normal trading patterns for the business, which is typically a little bit more cash generative in the second half of the year. And in total, we invested GBP 2.5 million in acquisitions, earn-outs and transaction costs. We don't capitalize any of our R&D. Post period end, we've invested a gross of GBP 10.9 million in the acquisition of RailComm and there's approximately GBP 4.9 million of contingent and deferred consideration that's payable in the second half of the year. Despite that, it still leaves us with a strong balance sheet and cash position, and we'll continue to look for opportunities to invest that in growing the business. So with that, I'll hand back to Chris to talk through some of the more detailed business unit by business unit performance.

Thanks, Andy. So in terms of talking to this sector, this follows a very familiar pattern, which any of you have attend these before [indiscernible] before. We go through 5 core areas of the business. Again, the green area is the Rail Technology, and the dark blue is focused around big Data and Data Analytics. And in each case, we'll give you an update on pipeline conversion, R&D activities and any other updates in -- that are relevant in terms of what's happened during the period. So if we start with our operational performance software sector. So this is dominated by a product called TRACS Enterprise. Again, for those of you that are familiar with us or have known about us for a while, this is our end-to-end hosted software package that covers everything from time tabling through to rostering of crew through to the rostering of rolling stock, through to on the day management of the railway on behalf of a train passenger or a freight operator. So this has been under development for quite a period of time. We have the first 2 passenger train operators going live this summer, and they're going live with the full end-to-end system. We're currently in the early stages of that go-live deployment as we speak, and that will then form -- follow through in the form of detailed user training as we move through to the go-live event. Importantly, we're really building momentum though with the pipeline conversion that sits behind that. So we have won our first freight operator contract. And this is important because moving forward, freight is going to get a bigger and bigger proportion of capacity on the U.K. rail network. And as a result, their operations will become more and more complicated to manage. And so what we're starting to see is a number of freight operators becoming interested in the systems that they now need to manage that complexity of that operation. So that first freight operator contract goes live in the early stages of 2023. We then won our next multiyear contract with a large U.K. train operator. It's a 5-year contract. That starts with immediate configuration and development in the next couple of weeks. So that revenue will start to flow through in H2. And that equally will go live in the early stages of 2023. And then we've won a 3-year contract with a 2-year extension opportunity with a passenger transport authority that has both light and heavy rail. So they have a metro system, and they also have an overland rail system. And again, this demonstrates that the flexibility of this software in the case that it can work on large complex geographic networks, it can work on much smaller, much simpler local rail networks, and it can also underpin future freight operations as well. So it's really pleasing to start to see that pipeline conversion and we continue to have a very strong pipeline beyond this in terms of new opportunities that we hope to be able to announce in future periods. If we then move on to our remote condition monitoring business. So as Andy has said, the challenge on this side of the business is that the cycle in terms of our sales cycle is driven by the investment cycle from our customer base. And if you look back historically, there's always a level of lumpiness year-to-year and period to period. So we have 2 key revenue streams here. One of those is selling the hardware, and it's the hardware that tends to be the most lumpy in terms of the orders that we receive. And we now have over 22,000 pieces of hardware now installed across the U.K. network. And the importance of the RailComm acquisition is we hope we now have a platform there that we're able to accelerate the rollout of that technology into the very large North American market as well. And then in addition to the hardware sale, we have a product called Centrix. We're the only approved supplier of hardware who also has a software platform linked to their product. And how Centrix works, it's licensed per device. So as many users as the customer wants to kind of access the data once they have a device license, but every device has to have a license. So what we're typically seeing is routes will place a license like the 500 device license here. Some of that will cover existing hardware that they want to transition onto the platform and some of it will provide the headroom that enables them to do future hardware procurement, which they can then hook back to the software platform. What we're finding is that Centrix is increasingly important because it enables the client to download, to analyze, to set full conditions and to track asset performance, which is a key part of how the industry is going to transition away from time-based maintenance to asset condition-based maintenance, which is a really important driver moving forward for the industry. What we're also seeing within the cycle as well is that -- what you typically see with any 5-year control period is you see big infrastructure upgrade programs. And what you tend to see is in the first phase of the 5-year cycle, there's a lot of planning, then it moves into procurement and then it moves into installation. So we are moving into the final 2 years of CP6. And as a result, we're now seeing more orders and more interest from the large system integrators that typically are responsible for the big [indiscernible] upgrade program. So lots going on. And then the move into North America, in particular, is really exciting here to balance out the lumpiness of the U.K. orders that we historically see. And then the third area is around a product called RailHub. So we announced last summer, a very large contract win here. That product is now midway through its rollout. And by the end of this year, 40,000 people in the U.K. will be fully trained on how to use the software product. And the software product has 2 main customer bases. One is in the industry supply chain, and one is with Network Rail, which is obviously the U.K.'s big infrastructure provider. And the overall objective here is that the whole industry is using the same tool to manage the way in which it deploys people onto the railway, the way which it manages competencies in which it signs off and approves work and the way in which it issues work to staff so that, that work is delivered in the safest possible way. So this is a great opportunity for this product to both expand its capability moving forward and also for us to support the industry with its agenda of saving lives and adopting more and more digital technology, but recognizing that, that needs to deliver clear benefits for the industry. So I'll now hand over to Andy just to talk to the other 2 sides of the business.

Thanks, Chris. So in terms of customer experience, so the smart ticketing was a key strategic goal that was outlined in the Williams-Shapps review that was published last year. And in the first half, we issued an industry white paper outlining our view on how that strategic goal can be achieved and particularly how our technology can help to deliver that. We're seeing increasing momentum from a pipeline perspective in smart ticketing. We announced a new contract win with our full year results, that's due to go live in the second half of this year and start to contribute revenue. And we've got another deployment with a large transport authority that's in the final stages of procurement. And the key thing from [ our side ], we provide the back office intelligence that deals with all the complexity of the U.K. ticketing landscape. And we're actually agnostic about the front-end offer in terms of how that's provided to the customer. So currently, it's rolled out with a smart card solution. We can do that with a contactless bank card solution, which we think is one of the forthcoming applications. And then through our innovation hub, we're also looking at other ways that we can get this technology into the hands of the consumer, including developing a mobile app and barcode deployment solution. The customer experience side of the business also includes delay repay, and we've won 2 new multiyear delay repay contracts. So really strong momentum on that side of the business. And clearly, we can offer a fully integrated delay repay smart ticketing solution for customers. This is a slide that we shared with the full year results, which shows what we believe to be a realistic addressable market for the U.K. rail industry. What we've added to it since the full year is the bars in blue, which show our assessment of how much of that space is currently occupied by our competitors. And in each of the 3 areas of our rail business have a slightly different competitive landscape. But in each of them, you can see that there's still a substantial amount of white space for us to move into and deliver future growth. On the Data Analytics/GIS side of the Group, we acquired Icon GEO in November. So there's been a lot of focus in the first half of integrating that with our existing data and GIS capabilities. And as a result of that, we've now got a data and analytics center of excellence that's based in Dublin, which is allowing us not only to uplift and increase the sophistication of our offering across our current product portfolio but also allows us to apply that across the Group to help us to generate the next generation of products. And then lastly, in terms of updates, as we continue to evolve our operating model from a business with 17 acquisitions now to a more integrated Group model that's more scalable, the focus in the first half of the year has been very much around our people strategy and a key part of that was launching what we're calling the OneTracsis leadership training program, which is to 100 employees right across the Group, an 18-month program, which is all about developing leadership capabilities in an entrepreneurial fast-moving tech environment. So very relevant for our organization, a key investment in our people and now developing the next generation of leaders for our business. We're also looking at expanding our shared services model into the IT environment, moving on to common group-wide IT operating environment that underpins all of the SaaS contracts that we've got in operation. And we continue to accelerate the maturity of our ESG activities with a particular focus on the S element of that in the first half, including diversity and inclusion and volunteering. And we'll be publishing a group-wide ESG scorecard with the full year results. So moving on now to consider the RailComm acquisition in a bit more detail. So RailComm is a rail technology business that's based in Fairport in Upstate New York been operating for over 20 years. Its key activities are around yard automation and computer-aided dispatch. So it forms a very nice complement to Tracsis' existing product that we offer to our U.K. customers. And we see exciting growth opportunities, both in RailComm's core products, but also to allow us to access an existing direct relationship with the key customers right across the North American market so that we can progressively move our existing portfolio of products over into North America. As Chris said, we see remote condition monitoring has been the first phase of that, but then we've got a detailed 3-year plan to move some of the software products over in due course. In order to implement this, we are moving one of our senior Rail Managing Directors is moving to North America, and we'll oversee Tracsis' activities here both in terms of delivering that organic growth and also looking for further opportunities to consolidate and repeat that successful model we've had in the U.K. in the North American market. And this slide really shows the breadth of the customer relationships that RailComm has. So these 4 categories make up the key component parts of the U.S. rail market. And RailComm has relationships and framework agreements with all of these key customers that you can see on the slide. So this is where it really gives us a quick step up in terms of accessibility and opportunity to engage right across the market and start to move our existing products over. So with that, I'll pass back to Chris to do the wrap-up and the looking forward.

Okay. Thanks, Andy. Okay. So overall, where are we. As I said at the start, we're really pleased with the progress we've been made -- that's been made with a number of the strategic priorities that we have as a group. We've got good momentum at the start of H2, driven really by the recent conversion of the new contracts that we've discussed in this presentation. We're continuing to look and grow our M&A pipeline. And an important thing we're doing differently with M&A now is that we -- anything that we class as a bolt-on has to be managed and delivered by an existing Managing Director within the business, which -- and what that means is that we, therefore, leave ourselves with plenty of resource and capacity at group level to continue to drive forward with the next deal much more quickly than perhaps we used to be able to do. And if you were to go and look at railcomm.com, for example, you will see that we -- within -- on the day we bought the company, the day we announced it, the website was already had fully adopted the Tracsis branding. It enabled users to immediately land on the site and to navigate themselves around the Tracsis Group without really recognizing that they'd actually move from one different part of the business to another. And that's a really important part of what we want to be able to do with future M&A is to ensure that we can integrate very early, we can get the maximum benefits from those acquisitions and really use that to drive accelerated growth. So alongside that, we are continuing to see a strong post-COVID recovery. We expect by the end of H2 to have every impacted business back to normal revenue levels. We -- so at this stage, that just remains to be the Traffic Data business, which is tracking back to normal levels. And therefore, that's fantastic news for us. And that allows us to now start planning for the future of those businesses rather than simply it will be about recovery. And then in addition, despite the recent conversion of so many new contracts, our software pipeline continues to grow. We're actively engaged in discussions with the industry about the future of Great British Railways. That transition is continuing to move forward. And there's -- we've been asked some great questions in terms of our engagement along the lines of how -- what is Tracsis' vision for creating a data-driven, customer-focused, safety-critical future for the rail industry. So if you think of those words in that data driven, that's what we're investing in with our Data Analytics and GIS investment. Customer-focused is -- it's at the heart of what we do. We're constantly trying to innovate and deliver projects and products that drive improvements in customer experience and then the efficiency of the operations that underpin them. And safety critical, that's exactly what all of our RailHub and remote condition monitoring and now the products that we have as part of the RailComm acquisition delivered to the industry. So we have a really strong set of products that are aligned to the direction in which we have traveled for the industry, and that really underpins our confidence moving forward. So if you look at the boxes at the bottom, we're going to continue to drive innovation and deliver the large ongoing software deployments that we have at the moment. We're going to continue to accelerate the pace of integration of acquisitions as well as focusing on the pipeline. And that pipeline of M&A is focused in 2 key areas. It's around rail software. It's around data analytics. So it's very focused. It has a wide geographic remit, but it's very focused in terms of the offering that we're looking for. And as Andy spoke about, we will have a fully implemented ESG scorecard by the end of this year, against which we can report on an ongoing basis, the success stories across our Group and the contribution we're making across these important areas. And so in summary, we're committed to our overall strategic growth objectives. We have a strong balance sheet, and therefore, we were able to execute very much so on the investment plans that we have ahead of us. So thank you very much for listening, and I'll pass back to [ Tamzen ].

[Operator Instructions] And the first question is, do you see the RailComm acquisition benefiting the U.K. proposition?

The -- the U.S. and the U.K. are quite different in regards of the size and scale of the freight operations. So in the U.S., the offerings that we have are very much targeted at the large scale yards that are very frequent across the U.S. market. So what you find in the U.S. is that there are short line operators that deal sort of typically a state level, they then feed into the Class 1 infrastructure that is nationwide. And what you find is there's very large yards where products are stored, shipped, moved across it from one train to another, and that requires a real level of automation and control to make sure that's done effectively. You don't see that same level of demand here in the U.K. So I think what we're likely to see is more of a transfer of our technology and services from the U.K. to the U.S. market than the other way around, although what we are encouraging other teams to collaborate and really understand where those -- where any opportunity might exist.

And I've got 2 questions about the competitive landscape in the U.S. for Tracsis' existing products. Can you outline the U.S. rail software competitive landscape and whether there's a similar amount of white space to grow into?

Yes, absolutely. It's a great question. So when I joined the CEO 3 years ago, we did a large-scale study of the North American market because we recognize that was a strategic target for us moving forward. And we wanted to understand was there a Tracsis like organization in that marketplace. So as part of that study, we couldn't find anybody that looked like us, and we still haven't been able to. So to summarize that, there doesn't appear to be a vehicle -- sorry, rail technology or a rail software consolidation play going on in the U.S. at the moment. But what we did find out from that study was we highlighted RailComm as our #1 priority in terms of the type of business that was at a size and scale where we could land in the marketplace and then look to repeat the successes that we've had in the U.K. in terms of then acquiring other businesses and then being a consolidator in terms of that type of technology. So there are lots of very small players that we found that are -- that do very specialist parts of what we do in the U.K., but we've not found anybody that has the breadth and scale of opportunity or those capabilities that we have. So we think when we go into things like remote condition monitoring, we do know some of the international competitors because they already compete with us in the U.K. But we think we've got something quite unique in terms of the breadth of the offering we're able to bring into the market.

And how much is the much-publicized supply chain issues impacting Tracsis?

So we have -- we have very carefully protected our supply position. So it only really affects our remote condition monitoring hardware business. So we've got guaranteed supplies for at least 2 years ahead of us. So we've [ got through ] all of the different components on our products. We've identified [indiscernible] that we think is a threat of obsolescence and we prebought those components. And anything else that we believe is at risk in the longer term, we've secured more than enough volumes to meet our future requirements. What's interesting now is we are starting to see some of the suppliers who buy from us asking whether they can prebuy and secure future volumes to make sure that they're not put at risk. So there will be some interesting conversations going on there around what's that worth? What's the pricing point as a result of guaranteeing that level of supply? But certainly, from our perspective, we are confident that we will not be impacted in terms of our ability to meet the industry's needs.

Tremendous. Can you talk about the level of wage inflation you're seeing across your staff base and whether you've made any significant price increases to your products?

Andy, do you want to take it?

Yes. I mean this is a very pertinent issue at the moment. So our salary review timings follow our financial year. So we will be implementing our annual salary reviews from the 1st of August. So we haven't seen any significant impact in the current year numbers. But it's a very live issue that we're trying to identify what the right solution is, how can we make sure that we look after our people, but also make sure that we are able to protect our margins. So we do have the opportunity from a pricing perspective on many of our contracts to increase pricing. We have pricing mechanisms built in. So our challenge at the moment is to make sure that we are able to look after the group margins at that sort of low 20s level that I indicated before and absorb any impact from a wage inflation perspective.

And you have partly covered this question. There was some revenue growth in the rest of the world in half 1. Was this a one-off? Or are there plans to grow beyond the U.K.? We obviously know you're going into the U.S. market. But what about Europe or any other international markets?

We are seeing interest from other markets, Australia, in particular, is -- there's a lot of crossovers of what we do with how their infrastructure works and the challenges that they face. So we'll continue to satisfy that demand pretty much on an ad hoc basis with regards to some of the countries in Australia and Southeast Asia at this point. Europe is slightly different. So we have some very clear competition in Europe. So companies that do things very similar to us. So for example, in Germany, there's a plc called [indiscernible] and in Southern Europe, there's a company called [indiscernible] and there are various others who do offer very similar products and services to ourselves. So in some of the markets, it's very difficult for us to enter as a British company because there's already an incumbent in play. So I think realistically, our growth path into Europe will be very similar to the one from the U.S., which we'll be looking for a business similar to our RailComm in size and scale, and then we'll be using that as the basis around which we then look to grow into the European market.

What are your plans for M&A in the year ahead?

[indiscernible] as hard as we can. Can you go ahead of that one Andy?

No, I was going to say we [indiscernible] on the lookout. We've got the balance sheet to support it. We're always open for business. Clearly, there is not much that we can say in terms of specifics, but we're always on the lookout for those opportunities.

And we've got the financial horsepower. And I think the thing we're seeing slightly differently now is that I think during the COVID pandemic, we didn't see many proactive approaches from companies because cash flow was not really a major issue for people during the COVID crisis because of the furlough scheme and the government support that was in play. We are definitely seeing more companies now approaching us to have a more proactive conversation around. They feel now is the right time to look to sell out and become part of a broader organization that's perhaps got a bigger appetite for risk and can tackle some of the challenges coming forward. And I guess, with the cost of living squeeze at the moment and with other challenges that just exist potentially around a future recession or whatever else might come our way, that certainly changes people's risk appetite.

And what's the landscape like for freight operators? Are there lots of different operators to sell into? Or is it a few dominant players?

If you look at the products that we sell, we think there's probably about 6 freight operators in the U.K. that are of the size and scale to need our products and services. So if you think there's 25 passenger operators probably which, I don't know, maybe 15 would buy a lot by our desktop software, but who would buy sort of the bigger, more hosted solutions. So you can see freight is not as big as the passenger space, but it's still a sizable market and sizable opportunity for us. And the core products for freight operators will be TRACS Enterprise. Now in the U.S., that is called [indiscernible] solution and what the beauty of having a track record in the U.K. will be then we'll be able to hopefully take that across to the U.S. and be able to demonstrate that as a proven freight system. And so that will also be one of our future objectives.

And that's the end of questions. Chris, do you have any closing remarks?

Just say thank you very much, everybody, for joining us today. You can see from the presentation, the Group is in a really strong position. We've got a great team of people. I think we've got some product offerings that are really well placed for the challenges ahead for the rail industry in terms of its digitalization agenda and the drive for improving customer experience and safety. So just, I guess, as a closing remark, a huge thank you to the team who are delivering an outstanding job, and we're very confident about the ongoing future performance of the Group.

Many thanks, Chris and Andy and you all for joining. You'll now be taken to a web page to give some feedback on today's presentation. If you're unable to complete it now, you'll receive a follow-up e-mail about an hour afterwards. We'd be really grateful if you could take a few minutes to complete. It's extremely helpful for the company to get this feedback. So many thanks for joining, and this is the end of the webinar.